For the record, I don’t hate Cold War zombies. I just think some of the gameplay systems aren’t up to snuff. Well and the map art design… but no game is perfect. This was all likely due to Covid restrictions on people’s jobs. Complicated time.
@JohnnyJohnnyJohnnyJohnnyJohnny I think it may have been cut from the convo but I do know that Activation Shanghai made Tag Der Toten. Raven had nothing to do with it.
Amazing pod dude! Agree with a whole lot said in this discussion, especially with how cod zombies is a survival mode first and not a grind simulator. Side quests not being unique and different from what you already can obtain via killing zombies is also something i didn't think about. Makes no sense now in cw when everything is available by points or salvage. Biggest downside for me when it comes to the switch from old zombies to CW is that previously you had to progress through the map and EARN your survival. If you waited too long to open up doors or buy a better wall weapon, you would have a hard time no matter what. Every round counted whereas now it's more efficient to just spawn camp till you have enough points to open up the whole map at once. Bowie knife, ammo crate, drops at the start. When it comes to easter eggs i enjoy the bo3/bo4 quests for different reasons but i know that's not a possibility nowadays so for a middle ground I'm hoping for something like DE's egg. CW isn't necessary a "bad" game but it does stray away from what made the original games "cod zombies". Please do more of this!!!!
Black ops 1 and 2 are where the mode really shines imo. Its about defending the space provided to you, actual "backs against the wall" survival, everything is earned. Round 100 is no easy feat. I have no faith that they will restore the features and design that made me personally enjoy the mode as I once did, its already too far gone.
Black ops 1, waw are not that good dude, no easter eggs, zero side quests, the only credit is the challenge, cold war clears in every other aspect besides difficulty
Black Ops 2 IS the best zombies theres ever been, I get tired of people constantly pointing towards Bo3, which is the second best, but Bo2 exist, mention Bo2. People complain about how its a mixed bag when it comes to maps but that doesn’t matter, the core experience and gameplay makes up for Die Rise or Tranzits downsides.
1. BO3 Level of love and development for the story and Easter eggs 2. BO4 Gunplay and movement, a LITTLE bit more realistic than bo3 but still a nice cartoony classic cod feel. 3. Cold War level of depths when it comes to mechanics and perks. 4. Anymore minor details just chalk it up to choosing between bo3 and bo2 zombies. Whether it’s we songs, gunsmith, zombie level, etc.
If its easy i wont be trying it at all. I miss me and the homies barely making it past round 20. I want a difficult game, a mode where WE ALL SUCK AGAIN! where its near impossible to survive to round 25, let alone 30, like the old days in nacht. If it isnt going to be difficult to evolve with the playerbase, then its worthless to play.
Really? Okay, maybe I will try it once and see how it goes. I feel very indifferent about it, but if that's what people want then I don't mind. I will put up a poll and see. Thank you for the suggestion.
CJ doesn't really talk about the positives of bo4, I heard it being "creative" and "different" but no actually reason as to why thats good. He did say the perk system was creative, ig in concept it was but on execution it doesn't hold up
@@j-niss thats honestly a valid complaint, but it doesnt make the gane bad, i think he doesnt like the map design either but his points about that dont really make any sense
I agree with cj about the zombies being able to hit you too quickly in bo3, but I can't see how you call all the maps similar. Shadows and zet I can kinda see, but DE rev and gorod all play differently. i'll def be watching that video
Skeptix, Absolutely loved this. So glad I came across you while watching Joltz during D4C. Love all the retrospective videos. Can't wait 4 Anchient Evil.
Craig Houston is still with 3arc! He was just in an Intel drop recently going over stuff for bo6. But overall great video and amazing points, while I don't agree with some of the points, I can still appreciate the overall Sentiment
Yep! After this video I started diving in and found his linked in and posted ab it on my Twitter. Thanks for putting it in the comments though so people can know!
Ghosts didn't start the trends with modern IW. Whilst that game did have massive maps and introduced sliding and leaning, it has possibly the lowest TTK in any COD game and most of the maps weren't the standard 3 lane layout. It was incredibly fast paced and it was only the size of the maps (which was rectified with DLC) that slowed the game down.
I don't know with the time crunch, sledgehammer dropping the ball on this and vanguard making treyarch pick up the slack and a global pandemic Treyarch did the best they could with what they had been handed from sledgehammer. In my opinion Cw was the best zombies experience hands down. Loved the art direction and the sounds the zombies made. Reusing the same zombie sounds from Bo1 was getting repetitive and boring. Hearing new zombie sounds was so good and the weapons system was great since it gave people the option to either use the loadouts they wanted or to go in and raw dog with a pistol that they choose.
I thought that Cold War zombies was fun and definitely, in my opinion, a decent entry for the zombies storyline, but it wasn't as satisfying or as independent as the prior entries were since it used a lot of multiplayer inspiration, it swapped out the old way of progression (starting pistol onward), it guided players towards the easter egg (which makes it kinda fruitless), and the story just wasn't significant imo. While it wasn't bad it definitely wasn't fantastic, but then again it isn't even that bad for something released during a pandemic.
Dude, those zombie spawning problems he mentioned about BO3 are even worse in BO4! Fucking try running through the halls of the Titanic after like round 10! Zombies are constantly spawning in front of you and if you don’t have a shield fuck you! The specialist weapons were added to mitigate this!
After getting back into playing the games after stopping during Cold War I do have some ( all be it irrational ) hope that the mode will somewhat look like what it should be. Bringing back four core characters and some of the elements of bo3 I have some hope that they have a slight grasp on what they did wrong with the game. Even if the game feels like bo4 ( which after its life cycles I’ve come to enjoy fucking around on it ) I would overall be happy because Cold War felt so far removed worse than nontreyarch zombies game modes like advanced warfare or infinite warfare zombies. Overall I’m just trying to have hope for anything at this point lol
I love how wrong cj is on cold war. The aesthetic and story argument I get, but saying that cold war doesn't have depth is just wrong, especially since it has the best mechanics out of any game.
Might have good mechanics for the player, Perks. Loadouts and field upgrades. The core game play is just lackluster and boring. You need to activate the rampage inducer for fun
They made warzone there is no bo6, nowadays they only focus on warzone because of all the fucking streamers who are making the same video every day about this and that weapon is broken blabla, they don’t care about us who just want the experience we had in waw bo1 bo2 bo3
A lot of great points here and an awesome conversation. Really summed up things I've been saying for a long time about how BO4 is actually incredible and people didn't know how good they had it until Cold War came out and was just 4 bland maps with an awful story on the IW movement and gameplay engine.
Don't get me wrong, IW deserves a lot of the hate, especially for MWII but Activision is the real culprit here. They're the ones who forced the unified engine and shared universe. Most of the core issues with the current state of COD falls on them more than IW or any of the other studios
Black ops 4 is easily one of the worst call pf duty's we had seen in years. No campaign, shit multiplayer, blackout, etc. and the zombies is a joke, its like blundell wanted to fuck up his legacy on purpose before he left. Mw 2019 is one of the best games we've had in a long time. The multiplayer shits on bo4. No wacky operator bullshit. No "advanced movement" no cartoon garbage, no nikki minaj. Just a good military shooter. Are mw 1 and 2 milsims because theyre serious slower paced games? What about black ops 1 or 2? And he thinks black ops 4 is better than black ops 3. I dont even understand, is being creative and different inherently good?
I mean a lot of ppl shit on cold war but after a while they start to loving it. Same was with bo3 for me. With bo3 release i was like „haha tentacle monsters and p2w gobblegums”. I changed my mindset and i gave cold war a chance and i cant stop playing. Let them cook and i hope for some evolution for zombie mode.
I don't think cold war is "bad." I just think the mechanics and map haven't aged well because they lack depth. But I am hoping the BO6 version of these mechanics are able to be flushed out and provide more beyond the ceiling. But we will see, I only want success.
Unfortunately that isn't really the case. During COVID the gaming industry was surging because everyone was at home; this is why the industry is in free fall at the moment.
No it didn't It just brought in more multiplayer junkies that wanted to boost their weapon skins. Activitizion was glad that they ditched their old fans for new temporary multiplayer junkies.
I don't see a list of credits, it says he became Senior Lead Writer in 2022, after being the Lead Writer for 16 years at Treyarch. From what I have heard (which can mean nothing btw) it seems like none of the main Treyarch Devs works on Vanguard, but if Craig was the lead writer/transitioning to the Senior Lead Writer or whatever, he probably oversaw stuff at the very least - just to keep things canon. I know Treyarchs Lead Zombies Devs were involved with MWZ until Season 01, so I would assume they set up all the story stuff and cut scenes and then dipped. It's hard to actually know because they are so tight lipped.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis id imagine that the writing for mwz and vanguard were all treyarch, or at least incredibly heavy oversight from them. id be incredibly surprised if that wasnt the case.
Bo2 had the best mechanics. 2 of the maps are complete garbage. And buried is boring. Bo3 has 5/5 bangers. And the mechanics are fantastic. Just abit too hard for cj I guess.
Unfortunately it seems that the best we can hope for is BO6 to be "Cold War but somehow slightly better" because whether your favorite is WaW,Bo1,2,3, or 4 this game is already very clearly more like Cold War than any other. It's is not a true return to form.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis LOL love that. To be fair I don't completely disagree. IX is still awesome and holds up to this day. Same goes for ancient evil, that was actually a top tier map
@@AfterLiveAnalysis I feel that for sure man. I think a lot of discourse is just with inconsistency. Every dev has a bit of this and that with their mechanics, some great, others not so great, is what it is. Hell even I thought carrier and descent from exo's were a pretty good time which is by no means the community consensus haha. But some of the mechanics were enjoyable. PAP definitely not on that list but what can ya do LOL Hoping 6 turns out pretty decent, but am thankful bo3 workshop still comes through even though playing online with homies (which is arguably one of the best parts) isn't quite as accessible anymore.
1:10:35 This is why CJ can sound pretty insufferable sometimes. He's calling a whole dev team "lazy" for implementing game mechanics that differ from his perception of what zombies should be. Its valid to say that a dev team missed the mark with something if you don't enjoy it, but calling them lazy is just so insulting and mean spirited. I doubt he would enjoy it if his viewers called him lazy because they didn't like one of his videos.
I have never disagreed with someone's cod opinions more then CJ. we agree on few things but his reasoning for bo4 being the best and mw2019 being "to milsim" pissed me off the most LMAO
Bo3 being mid but bo4 being the best is such a crazy statement 😭 I really have a hard time taking him seriously. It's like Rick said "your boos mean nothing, I've seen what u cheer for"
@@legendarybeatzprod.4843bo4 is not the best by far, bit bo3 is overrated. bo3 introduced the extremely far fetched multi-verse alien-like side of the story, made the zombie AI way faster and to compensate gave the player easy access to very good weapons ( the kn44 and hvk were cheap wallbuys, 80% of the guns were viable, double PAP made everything do infinite damage), such that it made the player too overpowered too early an too easily making the game too easy overall, beside gobble gums totally disrupted the gameplay loop and made the game laughably easy. Still bo3 gave us some excellent maps, but they lacked that initial anxiety inducing aesthetic cod zombies used to have and ga e the maps tons of character. Also the shadowman, dr. monty storyline was dumb af.
Luckily CW was a success and was really fun for both the casuals and a good amount of the community. I’ve been playing zombies since WaW and BO4 was what broke me off zombies for a few years and CW brought me back and I’m still playing CW. Granted I don’t think it’s perfect by any means, but the over complexity and gameplay systems of BO4 just weren’t it. BO6 can be CW 2.0 with better maps and I’m happy with that. You guys might have to retire after BO6 drops, but interesting pod.
Either way, I will engage. I don't know exactly how you define success but there is a lot riding on that word in your comment. And personally the causal stance on a game doesn't interest me. For example, if I started playing Assassins Creed casually and then got upset that the game was too "x" when I am not an avid/regular fan of the franchise (who appreciates the difficulty/intricacies of the mode) I am not going to complain when the game doesn't cater to me. So I don't accept that COD Zombies needs to extend that grace to the casual via CORE gameplay mechanics. They can do that with consumables (gums/elixirs) that is fine. If they also want to make it so that PAP is easy or character quotes are more transparent, I am not opposed to that either. Also "Cold War brought me back/I am still playing it" isn't an argument and is anecdotal. I can just say, "I still play BO4 and it brought me back into zombies" - Where does that get us? No where. I also don't accept that BO4 is to complex, unless you can demonstrate otherwise. The PAP is super easy to get on every map, WW's are all in the box, there is a loadout feature, specialist weapons on deck, baked in perks for every player. I think the quests were long and some had bad steps but that spans across all games. BOCW has good elements to it for sure, I would never disagree. But the problem is all of its systems are based on passivity and "the grind." And quite frankly that is boring. Combine that with the easy quests, useless side easter eggs, and lame map layout/art design it ended up being very mid across the board. I believe I described (unless I cut it out) the reasons in which Cold War can have its systems and satisfy the hardcore fan (and I am making a video about it to discuss the systems even further) because right now everything is based on "get points/salvage and buy thing." So I hope they find a way to ensure that these systems are more engaging/in-depth, while making cool maps that are fun to explore. Not really sure where the "you guys might have to retire after bo6 drops" comment fits in and feels super snarky - but CJ said he didn't want to quit because he loves the staying power of zombies, and I have already set up my new channel to due retrospectives on the classic content and pivot to other games. So idk, you're welcome to come on stream and debate me about these things.
We're just exploring the ideas, I have mixed feelings about Cold War mostly when it comes to maps/difficulty. I think the gameplay can be improved upon but I mostly believe it suffered because of covid.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis yeah same here I've talked to people who have similar opinions. i think bo6 will be a better cold war. i also think the gobblegum system is going to be controversial. but i really do think bo6 zombies will be best iteration of zombies since bo2.
@@Cool-gamer3179my main gripes I have come to conclusion on are that bocw didn’t have useful side eggs or good map art direction. I really hope that is fixed. I doubt difficulty will be fixed so I probably won’t get my hopes up there. Curious ab the gum system though.
BO6 will flop harder than Morbius and fail, if I can’t pause my game at launch or if the CW PAP system comes back or if the characters are boring, it’s over and it will be
I mean no disrespect towards CJ but I’m seriously getting tired of him talking shit about Cold War Zombies. I will defend it till the day I die. Even after I die someone will take my place. Vanguard Zombies is the biggest Joke in COD zombies history. Objectives mixed with rounds, no wall buys, no Easter eggs, the ray gun wasn’t even in the game at launch, everything is all in one place pap, perks, etc no pap camo reusing multiplayer maps. I understand that shi no numa reborn and the archon are round and fix these issues but the archon is just TMD without the objectives and just because shi no numa was fully remade doesn’t mean that Vanguard has a great Zombies experience. The map still has all the shitty mechanics. I will never understand why CJ is a Vanguard zombies lover and a Cold War hater.
So you love cold war but hate vanguard?! Vanguard is a continuation of Cold war! Vanguard has round base maps and an outbreak, your a complete joke rn. Plus you have must have been a new zombies player saying it's the best cod. There's a raygun, there's wallbuys, pap
@@timmy6402 what outbreak? There were no round base maps, wall buys, ray gun, or pap camos at launch. Why r u even defending Vanguard? It’s a garbage game regardless. Also Vanguard is a prequel to Cold War not a continuation.
@@timmy6402 yes Vanguard is pretty much Cold War but you forgot to mention that it’s ten times worse. Also, the game is 3 years old what makes you think that it’s still being developed? How many times do I have to tell you that Vanguard does not have fuckin outbreak
For the record, I don’t hate Cold War zombies. I just think some of the gameplay systems aren’t up to snuff. Well and the map art design… but no game is perfect. This was all likely due to Covid restrictions on people’s jobs.
Complicated time.
Who's gonna tell CJ Santa that Raven and Activision Shanghai made Tag Der Toten? lol
😂
@JohnnyJohnnyJohnnyJohnnyJohnny I think it may have been cut from the convo but I do know that Activation Shanghai made Tag Der Toten.
Raven had nothing to do with it.
@@CJSanta Just subbed to your channel and honestly I am a fan of how in love you are with bo4. Keep the great work, hot-taker😂
dude Cj santa actually is so valid for bo3 chronicles maps not being as good as bo1. that's crazy that's the way i always thought
Black Ops 6 having Salvage has me a bit worried
This was a fantastic time, had a blast discussing zombies!
Can't wait to do it again 👍
Definitely brother. Was a fun time. Always enjoy talking shop with the boys.
It was interesting to watch
@@Sandman2000_HotTakeshould I do this more regularly?
@@AfterLiveAnalysis yes :)
@@AfterLiveAnalysis100%
Amazing pod dude! Agree with a whole lot said in this discussion, especially with how cod zombies is a survival mode first and not a grind simulator. Side quests not being unique and different from what you already can obtain via killing zombies is also something i didn't think about. Makes no sense now in cw when everything is available by points or salvage. Biggest downside for me when it comes to the switch from old zombies to CW is that previously you had to progress through the map and EARN your survival. If you waited too long to open up doors or buy a better wall weapon, you would have a hard time no matter what. Every round counted whereas now it's more efficient to just spawn camp till you have enough points to open up the whole map at once. Bowie knife, ammo crate, drops at the start. When it comes to easter eggs i enjoy the bo3/bo4 quests for different reasons but i know that's not a possibility nowadays so for a middle ground I'm hoping for something like DE's egg. CW isn't necessary a "bad" game but it does stray away from what made the original games "cod zombies".
Please do more of this!!!!
Black ops 1 and 2 are where the mode really shines imo. Its about defending the space provided to you, actual "backs against the wall" survival, everything is earned. Round 100 is no easy feat. I have no faith that they will restore the features and design that made me personally enjoy the mode as I once did, its already too far gone.
Black ops 1, waw are not that good dude, no easter eggs, zero side quests, the only credit is the challenge, cold war clears in every other aspect besides difficulty
@@49ofemwell bo1 was the shit amazing gameplay
@@49ofemBO1 has easter eggs wtf are u on?
@@timmy6402 it doesn’t have any full length quests
CJ!!!
Amazing video, wasn't expecting this collab and I'm totally here for it!
Treyarch when they find out Zombies fans don’t care about Weaver and the new storyline:
😯😮
Why is campaign military eyepatch call of duty man in my horny german doctor moon pyramid multiverse story
Black Ops 2 IS the best zombies theres ever been, I get tired of people constantly pointing towards Bo3, which is the second best, but Bo2 exist, mention Bo2. People complain about how its a mixed bag when it comes to maps but that doesn’t matter, the core experience and gameplay makes up for Die Rise or Tranzits downsides.
Tranzit and Die Rise aged like a good wine
CJ and Skeptix(the Peak Duo)
You might be on to something 👀
YESS LOL
1. BO3 Level of love and development for the story and Easter eggs
2. BO4 Gunplay and movement, a LITTLE bit more realistic than bo3 but still a nice cartoony classic cod feel.
3. Cold War level of depths when it comes to mechanics and perks.
4. Anymore minor details just chalk it up to choosing between bo3 and bo2 zombies. Whether it’s we songs, gunsmith, zombie level, etc.
If its easy i wont be trying it at all. I miss me and the homies barely making it past round 20. I want a difficult game, a mode where WE ALL SUCK AGAIN! where its near impossible to survive to round 25, let alone 30, like the old days in nacht.
If it isnt going to be difficult to evolve with the playerbase, then its worthless to play.
if you keep making these podcast style uploads id love some gameplay in the background, just some eye candy for my cooked brain, great video!
Really? Okay, maybe I will try it once and see how it goes. I feel very indifferent about it, but if that's what people want then I don't mind. I will put up a poll and see. Thank you for the suggestion.
Is this going to be a series or a podcast thing? Because I am loving this.
I am going to try it out for a little bit - see how it goes
@@AfterLiveAnalysis good luck man
Hey, both of you guys are the best, imma listen the whole thing now 👍
CJ doesn't really talk about the positives of bo4, I heard it being "creative" and "different" but no actually reason as to why thats good. He did say the perk system was creative, ig in concept it was but on execution it doesn't hold up
Also no actual reasons as to why Bo3 is bad... he was asked why it's mid and then proceeded to take 5 minutes to say "you get hit too fast"
@@j-niss thats honestly a valid complaint, but it doesnt make the gane bad, i think he doesnt like the map design either but his points about that dont really make any sense
I agree with cj about the zombies being able to hit you too quickly in bo3, but I can't see how you call all the maps similar. Shadows and zet I can kinda see, but DE rev and gorod all play differently. i'll def be watching that video
Skeptix, Absolutely loved this. So glad I came across you while watching Joltz during D4C. Love all the retrospective videos. Can't wait 4 Anchient Evil.
Haha yeah when Joltz and I had our mini podcast on his stream - that was fun.
He should be on in the coming weeks ;)
@afterlive i miss BO3 Zombies ❤❤❤😢
Black ops 4 has so much variety and replay ability compared to other zombies its unmatched.
I walk outside every day for an hour plus and this was the perfect podcast to keep me entertained the whole time, great job guys!
Craig Houston is still with 3arc! He was just in an Intel drop recently going over stuff for bo6. But overall great video and amazing points, while I don't agree with some of the points, I can still appreciate the overall Sentiment
Yep! After this video I started diving in and found his linked in and posted ab it on my Twitter. Thanks for putting it in the comments though so people can know!
Ghosts didn't start the trends with modern IW. Whilst that game did have massive maps and introduced sliding and leaning, it has possibly the lowest TTK in any COD game and most of the maps weren't the standard 3 lane layout. It was incredibly fast paced and it was only the size of the maps (which was rectified with DLC) that slowed the game down.
CJ IS TALKING MAD FAX!!! Mad respect ❤❤
I don't know with the time crunch, sledgehammer dropping the ball on this and vanguard making treyarch pick up the slack and a global pandemic Treyarch did the best they could with what they had been handed from sledgehammer. In my opinion Cw was the best zombies experience hands down. Loved the art direction and the sounds the zombies made. Reusing the same zombie sounds from Bo1 was getting repetitive and boring. Hearing new zombie sounds was so good and the weapons system was great since it gave people the option to either use the loadouts they wanted or to go in and raw dog with a pistol that they choose.
Who's gonna tell CJ Santa that Raven and Activision Shanghai made Tag Der Toten? lol
I know activision Shanghai did, but did Raven? I wasn’t aware of that… I don’t think I was at least?
@@AfterLiveAnalysis yeah. Both AO and Tag were made by both of those studios
Yeah Raven has been supporting studios for a while. Does this mean Raven worked on BOTD and the other maps before AO and Tag? I can't remember.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis not from my knowledge, but i know they've done a lot of uncredited work in that era
Good to see CJ on.
I thought that Cold War zombies was fun and definitely, in my opinion, a decent entry for the zombies storyline, but it wasn't as satisfying or as independent as the prior entries were since it used a lot of multiplayer inspiration, it swapped out the old way of progression (starting pistol onward), it guided players towards the easter egg (which makes it kinda fruitless), and the story just wasn't significant imo. While it wasn't bad it definitely wasn't fantastic, but then again it isn't even that bad for something released during a pandemic.
Another big point about B04 mechanics and hit speed compared to B03. In B04 shootinf zombies will stagger them, making them not hit you
Dude, those zombie spawning problems he mentioned about BO3 are even worse in BO4! Fucking try running through the halls of the Titanic after like round 10! Zombies are constantly spawning in front of you and if you don’t have a shield fuck you! The specialist weapons were added to mitigate this!
I love origins - best map of all time . CW is single-handedly the downfall of zombies, BO4 was the kick off the cliff
nah
Bo4 had the most aggressive zombies in the whole series wtf?!! 😂😂
After getting back into playing the games after stopping during Cold War I do have some ( all be it irrational ) hope that the mode will somewhat look like what it should be. Bringing back four core characters and some of the elements of bo3 I have some hope that they have a slight grasp on what they did wrong with the game. Even if the game feels like bo4 ( which after its life cycles I’ve come to enjoy fucking around on it ) I would overall be happy because Cold War felt so far removed worse than nontreyarch zombies game modes like advanced warfare or infinite warfare zombies. Overall I’m just trying to have hope for anything at this point lol
I’m very open to change but I just really want great maps, mystery, and fun Easter eggs.
@@AfterLiveAnalysisvery true maps need to be fun AND repayable, besides good Easter eggs and mystery having a good amount of weapons would be nice
I love how wrong cj is on cold war. The aesthetic and story argument I get, but saying that cold war doesn't have depth is just wrong, especially since it has the best mechanics out of any game.
Gives no examples*
Might have good mechanics for the player, Perks. Loadouts and field upgrades. The core game play is just lackluster and boring. You need to activate the rampage inducer for fun
Your right John Guy, I really loved collecting purple crystals so the perks can work at max efficiency. What a great mechanic that is
It's only fun if you're a noob
Bo6 just cant be like CW. CW was disgusting warzonised system and it was awful.
Buckle up buddy cause salvage and loadouts already confirmed 🤦♂️ I agree with you though
@@celtic19 And plates are back, this zombies is going to be TRASH..... Cod sucks
They made warzone there is no bo6, nowadays they only focus on warzone because of all the fucking streamers who are making the same video every day about this and that weapon is broken blabla, they don’t care about us who just want the experience we had in waw bo1 bo2 bo3
Cj is a different one in the community for sure but I respect it
I have a lot of fun in MWIII playing small map moshpit, but I really don’t care for any other game mode
Holy Shiz!!! CJ in the F’n house!!
W vid. Keep up the amazing content.
Coldwar devastate the community of black ops zombies by changing alot of things such as recycling maps from multiplayer to zombies and puzzle.
A lot of great points here and an awesome conversation. Really summed up things I've been saying for a long time about how BO4 is actually incredible and people didn't know how good they had it until Cold War came out and was just 4 bland maps with an awful story on the IW movement and gameplay engine.
That was fun to listen to , be lush if you did more :)
Lol. I lost like 30 subs because of this
Don't get me wrong, IW deserves a lot of the hate, especially for MWII but Activision is the real culprit here. They're the ones who forced the unified engine and shared universe. Most of the core issues with the current state of COD falls on them more than IW or any of the other studios
For me kinda if classic point system doesn't return well say it all for me future of zombies let alone mini map again
I am torn on the point system, I genuinely see value in both but it all depends on in game/core mechanics
I like the classic and bo4
Black ops 4 is easily one of the worst call pf duty's we had seen in years. No campaign, shit multiplayer, blackout, etc. and the zombies is a joke, its like blundell wanted to fuck up his legacy on purpose before he left. Mw 2019 is one of the best games we've had in a long time. The multiplayer shits on bo4. No wacky operator bullshit. No "advanced movement" no cartoon garbage, no nikki minaj. Just a good military shooter. Are mw 1 and 2 milsims because theyre serious slower paced games? What about black ops 1 or 2? And he thinks black ops 4 is better than black ops 3. I dont even understand, is being creative and different inherently good?
I mean a lot of ppl shit on cold war but after a while they start to loving it. Same was with bo3 for me. With bo3 release i was like „haha tentacle monsters and p2w gobblegums”. I changed my mindset and i gave cold war a chance and i cant stop playing. Let them cook and i hope for some evolution for zombie mode.
I don't think cold war is "bad." I just think the mechanics and map haven't aged well because they lack depth. But I am hoping the BO6 version of these mechanics are able to be flushed out and provide more beyond the ceiling. But we will see, I only want success.
@AfterLiveAnalysis dont help that they reskin campaign levels 😂
I don’t think thats true, I think alotta people enjoyed Cold War but they started to like it LESS over time
It actually did the opposite it brought Zombies back under Covid at that …
Unfortunately that isn't really the case. During COVID the gaming industry was surging because everyone was at home; this is why the industry is in free fall at the moment.
No it didn't
It just brought in more multiplayer junkies that wanted to boost their weapon skins.
Activitizion was glad that they ditched their old fans for new temporary multiplayer junkies.
Ngl I loved Cold War and completely fine if bo6 is like it
didnt craig hueston appear in the trailers for vanguard?
Nope
He did not! But I just looked up on his linked in and he is the Senior Lead Writer at Treyarch thankfully!
@@AfterLiveAnalysis is there a list of credits he has? cus id imagine with that title he did work on vanguard and mwz
I don't see a list of credits, it says he became Senior Lead Writer in 2022, after being the Lead Writer for 16 years at Treyarch.
From what I have heard (which can mean nothing btw) it seems like none of the main Treyarch Devs works on Vanguard, but if Craig was the lead writer/transitioning to the Senior Lead Writer or whatever, he probably oversaw stuff at the very least - just to keep things canon.
I know Treyarchs Lead Zombies Devs were involved with MWZ until Season 01, so I would assume they set up all the story stuff and cut scenes and then dipped.
It's hard to actually know because they are so tight lipped.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis id imagine that the writing for mwz and vanguard were all treyarch, or at least incredibly heavy oversight from them. id be incredibly surprised if that wasnt the case.
Lets go!
Is this the n°1 tag der toten top 3 zetsubou guy that struggles training? Lmaooo
I am not 100% certain of all of CJ's positions, but I know he loves Tag
Bo4 kinda my favorite rn too
Yooo skeptix
So basically bo3 is mid cause hard, bo4 is best cause easy? Gonna call sus on that one. (Coming from someone who loves Bo4 btw)
Bo2 had the best mechanics. 2 of the maps are complete garbage. And buried is boring.
Bo3 has 5/5 bangers. And the mechanics are fantastic. Just abit too hard for cj I guess.
CJ BASED???
Infinity Ward’s last W was MW2 (the original.) After that it was all over.
Agreed
COD as a whole has been in a steady decline since Black Ops 3 and Warzone basically pushed it off the cliff
Unfortunately it seems that the best we can hope for is BO6 to be "Cold War but somehow slightly better" because whether your favorite is WaW,Bo1,2,3, or 4 this game is already very clearly more like Cold War than any other. It's is not a true return to form.
??????
did this guy play black ops 4 or
I play it all the time :)
@@AfterLiveAnalysis LOL love that. To be fair I don't completely disagree. IX is still awesome and holds up to this day. Same goes for ancient evil, that was actually a top tier map
@@whosrobertseed Zombies is a wild mode - it's crazy how much discourse there is around it
@@AfterLiveAnalysis I feel that for sure man. I think a lot of discourse is just with inconsistency. Every dev has a bit of this and that with their mechanics, some great, others not so great, is what it is. Hell even I thought carrier and descent from exo's were a pretty good time which is by no means the community consensus haha. But some of the mechanics were enjoyable. PAP definitely not on that list but what can ya do LOL
Hoping 6 turns out pretty decent, but am thankful bo3 workshop still comes through even though playing online with homies (which is arguably one of the best parts) isn't quite as accessible anymore.
1:10:35 This is why CJ can sound pretty insufferable sometimes. He's calling a whole dev team "lazy" for implementing game mechanics that differ from his perception of what zombies should be. Its valid to say that a dev team missed the mark with something if you don't enjoy it, but calling them lazy is just so insulting and mean spirited. I doubt he would enjoy it if his viewers called him lazy because they didn't like one of his videos.
❤
I have never disagreed with someone's cod opinions more then CJ. we agree on few things but his reasoning for bo4 being the best and mw2019 being "to milsim" pissed me off the most LMAO
Bo3 being mid but bo4 being the best is such a crazy statement 😭 I really have a hard time taking him seriously. It's like Rick said "your boos mean nothing, I've seen what u cheer for"
Hahah i love it
@@legendarybeatzprod.4843bo4 is not the best by far, bit bo3 is overrated. bo3 introduced the extremely far fetched multi-verse alien-like side of the story, made the zombie AI way faster and to compensate gave the player easy access to very good weapons ( the kn44 and hvk were cheap wallbuys, 80% of the guns were viable, double PAP made everything do infinite damage), such that it made the player too overpowered too early an too easily making the game too easy overall, beside gobble gums totally disrupted the gameplay loop and made the game laughably easy. Still bo3 gave us some excellent maps, but they lacked that initial anxiety inducing aesthetic cod zombies used to have and ga e the maps tons of character. Also the shadowman, dr. monty storyline was dumb af.
@@cakes9962 and this why people have opinions, so you can have terrible opinions and so I can have good ones
And dude said "far fetched" story in a zombie game. LOL.
Luckily CW was a success and was really fun for both the casuals and a good amount of the community. I’ve been playing zombies since WaW and BO4 was what broke me off zombies for a few years and CW brought me back and I’m still playing CW. Granted I don’t think it’s perfect by any means, but the over complexity and gameplay systems of BO4 just weren’t it. BO6 can be CW 2.0 with better maps and I’m happy with that. You guys might have to retire after BO6 drops, but interesting pod.
This feels hostile. But I am unsure bc most of the time you're cool.
Either way, I will engage.
I don't know exactly how you define success but there is a lot riding on that word in your comment. And personally the causal stance on a game doesn't interest me. For example, if I started playing Assassins Creed casually and then got upset that the game was too "x" when I am not an avid/regular fan of the franchise (who appreciates the difficulty/intricacies of the mode) I am not going to complain when the game doesn't cater to me. So I don't accept that COD Zombies needs to extend that grace to the casual via CORE gameplay mechanics. They can do that with consumables (gums/elixirs) that is fine. If they also want to make it so that PAP is easy or character quotes are more transparent, I am not opposed to that either.
Also "Cold War brought me back/I am still playing it" isn't an argument and is anecdotal. I can just say, "I still play BO4 and it brought me back into zombies" - Where does that get us? No where.
I also don't accept that BO4 is to complex, unless you can demonstrate otherwise. The PAP is super easy to get on every map, WW's are all in the box, there is a loadout feature, specialist weapons on deck, baked in perks for every player. I think the quests were long and some had bad steps but that spans across all games.
BOCW has good elements to it for sure, I would never disagree. But the problem is all of its systems are based on passivity and "the grind." And quite frankly that is boring. Combine that with the easy quests, useless side easter eggs, and lame map layout/art design it ended up being very mid across the board.
I believe I described (unless I cut it out) the reasons in which Cold War can have its systems and satisfy the hardcore fan (and I am making a video about it to discuss the systems even further) because right now everything is based on "get points/salvage and buy thing." So I hope they find a way to ensure that these systems are more engaging/in-depth, while making cool maps that are fun to explore.
Not really sure where the "you guys might have to retire after bo6 drops" comment fits in and feels super snarky - but CJ said he didn't want to quit because he loves the staying power of zombies, and I have already set up my new channel to due retrospectives on the classic content and pivot to other games. So idk, you're welcome to come on stream and debate me about these things.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis you're good, that guys comment was just hostile for no reason, not the first comment i've seen from that account
@@AfterLiveAnalysisHe doesn’t like when someone criticizes modern zombies, he’s always been like this.
@@D3AL1O He's usually really cool with me, so this was just confusing.
I agree that BO3 is mid, honestly I don’t think it would be the top on everyone’s list without customs on pc
I love bo3 but I actually think it has aged quite poorly but that's a different conversation 🤔
Bo3 is king and I’ve never played customs
@@TFREAPERRspelled BO1 wrong
I have news flash for you. It is Cold War 2.0 but it is better
We're just exploring the ideas, I have mixed feelings about Cold War mostly when it comes to maps/difficulty. I think the gameplay can be improved upon but I mostly believe it suffered because of covid.
@@AfterLiveAnalysis yeah same here I've talked to people who have similar opinions. i think bo6 will be a better cold war. i also think the gobblegum system is going to be controversial. but i really do think bo6 zombies will be best iteration of zombies since bo2.
@@Cool-gamer3179my main gripes I have come to conclusion on are that bocw didn’t have useful side eggs or good map art direction.
I really hope that is fixed. I doubt difficulty will be fixed so I probably won’t get my hopes up there.
Curious ab the gum system though.
BO6 will flop harder than Morbius and fail, if I can’t pause my game at launch or if the CW PAP system comes back or if the characters are boring, it’s over and it will be
I mean no disrespect towards CJ but I’m seriously getting tired of him talking shit about Cold War Zombies. I will defend it till the day I die. Even after I die someone will take my place. Vanguard Zombies is the biggest Joke in COD zombies history. Objectives mixed with rounds, no wall buys, no Easter eggs, the ray gun wasn’t even in the game at launch, everything is all in one place pap, perks, etc no pap camo reusing multiplayer maps. I understand that shi no numa reborn and the archon are round and fix these issues but the archon is just TMD without the objectives and just because shi no numa was fully remade doesn’t mean that Vanguard has a great Zombies experience. The map still has all the shitty mechanics. I will never understand why CJ is a Vanguard zombies lover and a Cold War hater.
So you love cold war but hate vanguard?! Vanguard is a continuation of Cold war! Vanguard has round base maps and an outbreak, your a complete joke rn. Plus you have must have been a new zombies player saying it's the best cod. There's a raygun, there's wallbuys, pap
@@timmy6402 what outbreak? There were no round base maps, wall buys, ray gun, or pap camos at launch. Why r u even defending Vanguard? It’s a garbage game regardless. Also Vanguard is a prequel to Cold War not a continuation.
@@shipwreck_shark why are you comparing the game when it's first launched? ITS STILL BEING DEVELOPED FOR HELLA SAKES.
@shipwreck_shark Vanguard is pretty much cold war brotha.. They have round base maps, Outbreak, The same mechanics
@@timmy6402 yes Vanguard is pretty much Cold War but you forgot to mention that it’s ten times worse. Also, the game is 3 years old what makes you think that it’s still being developed? How many times do I have to tell you that Vanguard does not have fuckin outbreak