Ditko...a very unique individual with strong beliefs and immense creative talent. Even though his politics aren’t my own I admire his strong convictions. A legend in the industry. Rest In Peace.
When I was 9 years old, Steve walked out on Spider-Man and never came back. I didn't understand what happened and waited for him to come back. I'd read the letters section and see what Stan said and the explanation was never enough. Spider-Man/Peter Parker spoke to me. They made my life bearable, enjoyable. The first Spider-Man comic I ever read was Annual 2. My dad told me about Spider-Man and I didn't believe him. It was always Superman, Batman, etc. But Spider-Man was it for me. TY Steve
I grew up in the sixties. I had the best of all the worlds! In music we had the Beatles, some of the greatest movies were made in the sixties and in comics we had Steve Ditko and the king, Jack Kirby! I'm so spoiled.
@therandom3591 I originally was talking about the sixties and how great it was growing up in that decade. Then you came along. Well, this is where I get off. Bye and take care.
@@janokjaran The two philosophies may have more in common than you would think, although there would also be vehement disagreements on some issues. Unlike what Alan Moore thinks, Objectivism is not Fascism but instead a kind of radical individualism that cares little about what "society" thinks. You can disagree with Ayn Rand, but characterizing her philosophy as Fascism is simply ill-informed and wrong.
I've been to a con where Stan lee was signing and the number of people who think, nay assume, that Stan Lee designed the costume and drew all the early Amazing Spider-man comics is astounding! I can see where the assumption comes from, and then when they're told he only wrote and co-created the throw the pitchforks and torches up and go on a witch hunt. Stan Lee was more out there with his self promotion, but that doesn't diminish the contributions he made to the comics industry.
Thank you Mr. Ross. You've honored Steve Ditko's right to leave his personal interview with you unexploited to the end and that right there is journalistic integrity. Fanboys can learn a lesson from you. Thanks for proving me wrong. You're alright in my book.
What people don't realize is that essentially all creative work in America was on a work-for-hire basis. The person was hired to create something and once the company paid you, you willingly gave up all "rights" to the creation. What was true for comics was also true for every other creative medium. The company doesn't care if you leave, they can even fire you, and someone else will take over your creation. Were this not the case, a lot less would have been created, because fewer companies would have bothered to take the risk.
I have no problem with Stan Lee. To me the essence of what made the character Spider-Man so great was that he was young, awkward, unpopular, and struggling with real everyday issues, is bitten by a spider, and then has to assume the great responsibility of being a superhero. These were all Stan's original ideas. In my opinion, it was these ideas that made Spider-Man so different at the time and enabled that connection with the readers. Most of my favorite moments of reading Spider-Man titles were when his everyday life and hero life would bleed over into each other. Steve Ditko was definitely talented and he certainly contributed to developing the idea, but that does not make him the creator in my opinion. People seem to have no problem crediting Steve Jobs for the creation of the iPod, iPhone, etc but certainly we all know that there were lots of other people involved with designing, creating, and producing the final devices.
Himanshu Dudi He sounds like a man of self set principles who will not compromise them. He left when he was no longer respected. It seems fairly clear cut. He wants nothing to do with the millions of dollars gained from perverting the original ideas he had.
I was nervous when they decided to knock on his door against Steve's wishes. Made for a happy ending. I'm glad Stan came out okay - You always see backlash towards him & Whitout him where would Sidey, FF erc be? Basically a force for good . Lee, Kirby, Romita sr & Ditko are 4 comic legends & all of them will best be remembered for 60's Marvel - That is all. If you want to check other wors - It's there!!!
This was really interesting. Thanks for posting. I agree; one the best, maybe THE best comic book documentary I've ever seen. Probably because the presenter has a genuine love and appreciation for the medium. The shot of him and Gaiman coming back from their encounter with Ditko, with the kind of glazed, happy, awestruck expressions I've seen on children after meting Santa, but rarely on adults says it all.
Great video! I'm a huge Steve Ditko fan. However, this video completely gives away the address to his office and evades his privacy. Spider-Man was always the best during the Ditko/Lee era. Too bad the Spider-Man movies haven't be able to capture the magic of the early Ditko Spider-Man books.
I can see Stan Lee's point - it really just depends on what you mean by "creation". Nobody disagrees that the verbal idea, "teenage student, bitten by radioactive spider, sticks to walls like an insect, called 'Spider-Man'" was dreamed up by Lee and given to Ditko, and Ditko made something wonderful out of it. Without Lee having that idea, there would have been no Spider-Man, without Ditko realizing it (and Lee putting in the words), there would have been no Spider-Man, and to that extent it's a genuine co-creation (and to counter Lee's point, it would also be a genuine co-creation if it failed); but if you have to give any priority at all, it must be to the idea that comes first. In an odd way, Ditko's insistence on his co-creation somewhat goes against Objectivist principles - with Objectivism, it's always the idea in the mind of man that's the creative spark that gets all the engines going, so Rand would probably have sided with Lee just in terms of the "who created it" thing (although of course she might not necessarily have agreed with how the money was divvied up according to relative weightings of contribution to the *final product*). I've been round the houses on whether to hate Stan Lee, but in my mellow old age, I actually cut him some slack. I think there's enough evidence to pull back a bit from Alan Moore's jaundiced view - evidence of genuine co-creation a lot of the time during Marvel's artistic glory years. And I think that's probably reflected fairly in most of the acknowledgements. Moore is right though, when he says elsewhere, that the kind of business ethos whereby the artists were peons, comes from gangster origin of the comic book industry. The music industry, having somewhat related roots (via the Prohibition) also suffered from similar problems. And on the whole, it would be better to have a more equitable arrangement. Or would it? To reflect on the other possibility here: maybe artists did produce bettter work when they weren't self-conscious as "auteurs"? When they were treated like shit? No, that last is too much to say - but I exaggerate to get the delicate psychological point across. Sometimes giving an artist free rein gets excellent results, but from the disastrous George Lucas prequels, we can also see that sometimes free rein can lead to self-indulgence and self-importance, which lead to bad art by another route, and in such cases, some guidance and bossiness might actually be beneficial - in which case, it has to be rewarded for its contribution to the final quality of the product.
+gurugeorge I wrote a much longer comment of my own on the previous part, but I TOTALLY AGREE WITH LEE. Ditko has been given so much credit by Lee; Lee falls all over himself to give him credit, but it's never enough. Reality is, Lee created the character of Parker/Spidey, and Ditko designed the costume. In later issues, Ditko did some plots, and got credit for those plots--but the original issue, the shy teen who goes on to learn that with great power comes great responsibility, Lee wrote that...and Ditko did was he was getting paid to do, design the way it looks. He was a great artist, but he's a bit off his nut--ad hom follows--as most Rand fans are.
I love many comic artists (too many to name) but Steve Ditko was my first and most lasting love. And as you know... you never forget your first love. I only wish I could understand his underlying motives better. What really makes him tick? And why is he such a hard-ass (written with all due respect, natch.)?
Finally, after almost a year of preparation, here it is: EVERYTHING you ever wanted to know about the creation of Spider-Man, with behind-the-scenes anecdotes of the goings-on at Marvel Comics and appearances by heavyweight comic legends Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko - - - with walk-on bits by comics creators Will Eisner, Joe Simon, Wally Wood, John Romita, John Buscema, Gil Kane, Roy Thomas, Denny O’Neil, Dick Ayers, Don Heck, Bill Everett, Joe Orlando, Eric Stanton, Carl Hubble, Stan Goldberg, Sol Brodsky, Danny Fingeroth, Mark Evanier, Alan Moore & Frank Miller ! Even pop artists Andy Warhol and Roy Lichtenstein, writer Ayn Rand & novelist Mario Puzo get into the act !! And of course we cannot forget the man that made it all possible: publisher Martin Goodman. (And the tiny role that Chief Accountant Maurice Coyne played - - btw, don’t you love it when a person’s name matches his job title, like a librarian named Bookman?) But be forewarned, it’s looooong. It’s the equivalent of 26 pages single-spaced ! I made it a bit easier to digest by breaking up the text into 12 sections: 1. Prologue 2. Amazing Fantasy 3. The Marvel Method 4. Storyteller Steve Ditko 5. Jack Kirby’s Spider-Man 6. Ditko Versus Kirby Versus Romita 7. Ditko’s Twist Ending ? 8. Ditko’s Psychology 9. Stan Lee’s Psychology 10. End Of An Era 11. You Tell Me 12. One Final Thought This is not for the faint of heart lol. But if you read to the very end, there’s a mind-blowing thought awaiting there. Oh, I also have many pics that follow the sequence of examples in the text. And be sure to check out some of the RUclips videos and links, especially Strip Panel Naked on Steve Ditko’s drawings and his great storytelling abilities in the visual medium :-) Have fun happy readers ! 1. To read the article, go to this link. www.writerscafe.org/writing/Sienzant/1954464/ 2. Pics that follow the text are on my Facebook page called Vision Angles. There are 4 series of pics, so scroll down to start at the 1st series. They follow the text, highlighting points along the way. Even if you just look at the pics & their blurbs, you may find that enlightening by themselves.
Did this video mention that Ditko returned to Marvel in 1979 and worked on and off for them for 20 years? It made it sound like Ditko shut the door on Marvel in the '60s and never returned. Sounds dramatic and all to put that air of finality on it, but it's not accurate. He even drew for Amazing Spider-Man again in a 1988 Annual, but it was a back-up story not featuring Spidey himself.
I was surprised to learn that myself. In fact, he actually did pencils on an issue of Daredevil during Frank Miller's run. Miller wasn't involved in the issue IIRC but it was drawn by Ditko
Ditko basically created the comics form adapting Lee's story treatment, with Lee also dubbing the dialogue on finished art. As far as the comics and likenesses of the comics go, Ditko definitely deserves bulk of the creative credit.
It's been a rough year for the cartoonist, but at least he has his millions of dollars to ease the pain. 86-year-old Steve Ditko has taken the No. 1 spot on People With Money’s top 10 highest-paid cartoonists for 2013 with an estimated $58 million in combined earnings. Source: Media Mass
+Korneel Snauwaert Why? Even Ditko admits the idea of a shy boy who gets bit by a spider, doesn't stop the thief who kills his uncle, etc., was Lee's. Ditko did what he was getting paid to do which was DESIGN A COSTUME. Yet Lee GOES OUT OF HIS WAY to say Ditko is the co-creator. Some of the comments on this doc are nuts. These Ditko fans are claiming more credit for him than he himself does, haha. LEE CREATED SPIDER-MAN. Ditko helped. And Lee is being REMARKABLY GENEROUS. I'd have told Ditko's crazy old ass to fuck off years ago by now.
+Amory Blaine 127 You make a good point. Maybe I'm comparing this too much with Kane/Finger. But still... Stan Lee didn't do much. He didn't make up the stories.
+Korneel Snauwaert You mean the early Spidey stories? Sure he did--at least most of them in the beginning. Like he says, eventually Ditko started giving him already plotted drawings and he just added the dialogue. But the big issue is who CREATED Spidey. And that first issue, Lee very much DID WRITE. And that's the character's creation. If Ditko wrote later ones--well, it's like a television show; the creator doesn't always write all the episodes. But the initial story, with the thief killing Ben and all, that was written by Lee. I think he's being more than fair to Ditko. Ditko's an old crank who left before the miracle happened and now regrets it.
+Amory Blaine 127 Lee really doesn't go out of his way to say that. When asked he says, "I'm willing to say so" and even Ross tells him that it's not what he asked.
+Amory Blaine 127 I think they're pretty much equally important in this case. The costume, which is always very very very important with a superhero, was created all by Ditko. That makes him a co-creator, without any doubt.
Lovely documentary and I am thankful for being able to do it. Something calls to my mind. I am strongly confident that the meeting took actually on Marvel's offices which are on the same building, instead of his own studio. Anyone have any clue on this?
Nope, Marvel is half a block east of this. I used to work in this building. The building had multiple offices per floor we all shared the one bathroom on each floor. I bumped into him washing his brushes in the bathrooom sink one day, and I struck up a conversation with him. When Ross is standing outside, I actually saw some of my old coworkers in this video lol
its pretty clear to me that stan vastly improved the books drawn by kirby and ditko, who were great visual artists but not great writers. stan was a very smooth writer who could fill in the gaps and flesh out characters with more humanity. ditkos characters on his own were way too ayn randy, ie horrifyingly repellant, and kirby's characters were weird robot monsters of action with no inner life. so, although stan is the legal controller of the copyrights, which of course is not fair, he IS the full and fair cocreator, and his writing truly did make marvel the success it was, equally with their best artists (kirby, ditko, romita, sinnott, colan, buscema (john NOT sal), bill everett, marie severin, and all the later artists.
A lot of general similarities to Kirby's earlier THE FLY----ability to walk on walls and ceilings, sort of a "6th sense" a la "spidey sense, great physical strength and a secret identity as a teenage boy....Stan had his own inner definition of "created" that allowed him to fully believe, to feel fully entitled to think of himself as the sole creator of some of his, er, creations. No offense to him or this work.
I think we overrate the initial creation itself. If the only good issue was the first and then it was passed off to other writers and artists who bungled it, the comic would be long cancelled and the character long dead and buried. Many later fans of the character may never have read those first or early issues. While the character's origin is important, it's new stories that keep readers coming back for more, further develop the character and maintain awareness and interest. Spider-Man even had his iconic costume changed in the 1980s and it didn't reduce his popularity at all. Batman is perhaps a stronger example of a character who has changed and evolved since his initial creation. Many of his most iconic elements and villains were not invented by the character's original creator. Batman's reinventions over the years arguably define who he is today more than his original creation does. Does Bob Kane or Frank Miller have more to do with the character's current popularity? Or maybe Tim Burton or Bruce Timm? So this constant obsession with trying to identify and credit the "original creator" seems very overplayed to me. Other talent who expanded upon and developed the character over the years may deserve a comparable level of recognition.
I get what Alan Moore is saying but that version of spiderman is so diluted/evolved from back then that it has become such a mute point, does Defalco, Mcfarlane, Romita, john semper, bendis not deserve equal amount of mention for helping to cement such a vital part of the character? No one can tell me that spiderman could have lasted without additional inputs that have made him mainstream after the og ditko and lee pairing. A lot of the vital essences that make the character did not exist back in 1963 and are Independent to the co-creators. Credit should be given where it's due, but instances like this give credence to the so called marvel method.
@qqrk1372 Yeah, I've read a issue of the original Avengers comics by Kirby where Spidey does make a small appearance and needless to say Ditko drew Spiderman better and found Kirby's version of the character a bit underwhelming.
It is disappointing that he has become a recluse and while the doc felt one sided you do get to see it from a different angle another "side" one day he might come back into the spotlight.
Zac Gorenc artists like STEVE DITKO comes, performes & give their best..than they leave everything rest-to the audience(here readers)...they understand intuitively the value of time...such lovely sweet wise people artists are...Its just the talentless critics who left behind-discussing asses all day__I guess you understood whom Iam refering here
Zac Gorenc If he doesn't want to get attention, that's perfectly fine, as I see it. His work speaks for itself. However, I get the feeling that he's had some harsh experiences early on, which has radicalized him. He's clearly experienced friction because of his political views, and I think he's bitter because he feels treated unfairly. He seems a prideful man. Perhaps with enough integrity to cross over into pompousness. Unfortunately, his fiercely uncompromising, polarized and (in my opinion) delusional view on morality puts him in line with the proponents of objectivism - Ayn Rand's pseudo philosophy. After he experienced the blow of leaving Marvel, it seems his work steadily devolved into unreflective stories bordering on propaganda with little room for subtlety.
definitely he is a man of integrity. dont need glamour to prove his worth. his work speaks for himself. and only few humans had achieved that. and that puts him in state of satisfaction. he live or die as a person doesnt really matter to him (I think(--he lives by his work, which has already made him LEGEND
Jonathan Ross respects the wishes of Steve Ditko and keeps everything from their conversation to himself. However when Steve Ditko says he does not want to meet Johnathan Ross, he disrespects his wishes and goes knocking on his door anyway? So let me get this right, Steve Ditko talked to Jonathan Ross but for some reason asked Jonathan not to tell a soul what he said in their conversation and to please respect his wishes?
Look i just remember reading his Speed Ball issues as a teen and not being able to stomach them. cant even recall anything he did aside from Amazing and Doc Strange in the 60s. I saw some of his monster titles in the early 60s or late 50s--- didnt care for them either. There was a BIG book a cpl yrs ago that had his works in it.... I could not bring myslef to appreciate what i saw.... where as KIRBY and ROMITA & others I love and appreciate everything they ever drew. I
Stan Lee chased many a great comic creator off with his scene stealing blather. Wallace Wood did wonderful things with the 2nd tier character Daredevil in just a few issues (5-12 I think) and when he (Wood) had the temerity to write an issue Lee jumped in on the second half of the two-part story and made a (not so witty) comment about how Wood needed help finishing! Wallace Wood quit and started AN ENTIRE COMIC BOOK COMPANY (Tower Comics) and was the main contributor to three, monthly on-going $0.25 (Annual size books). Kirby was more invested and stayed on long after Ditko but even he (Kirby) had enough of the "Mouth that roared" and quit. It would be years before Lee would relinquish "writing" chores to others and then mercifully left the scene. Marvel under the thumb of Lee would have negated the work of the likes of Frank Miller, John Byrne and Jim Lee. They too would have fled.
PatrolOfficer161 it was also LARGELY about money. Publisher (not Stan) refused to pay top talent a fair amount so they quit for improved wages. Kirby had a family and wife didn't work...leaving was a smart thing if only because he was making more money.
Jack L, thank you for not making OK a word, cuz it's not, I hate seeing okay, for ex, people wouldn't write that this doc was on the beebeesee...same thing
Call Ditko reclusive or a Randian/Objectivist "whatever". He lived and is living his philosophy in life. He's happy with it or his decision. That's what makes him happy! People who feel sad or who ridicule him for not coming out and embrace his popularity are just guilty of psychological projection. Not everybody wants fame. And people should just him alone. That's what makes him happy. That's HAPPINESS to him. By the way, I learned that Ditko is the Highest-Paid Cartoonist in the World...
40 years...so then you should know better. Actually you and I are pretty much the same age. It's amazing then that you really have very little appreciation for the originators. And thats probably because you don't really know much but pretend to know more than you do. Ditko is an amazing artist. While Kirby was the power, Ditko was the elegance in drawing. Could Ditko have continued on doing the ongoing Marvel stable of characters? Sure. But he chose another route. Of independent artist. ass.
...they do a big documentary on the guy, finally talk to him in person, then say they shouldn't talk about it. Some will say that's wonderful and artistic and whatever. It's actually pretty stupid.
Ditko was an ok artists on a ground breaking character that was more popular when Romita took over it. For Ditko to be a reclusive bitter nut the last 40 yrs- makes him a dick for those who actually do admire his work from 50 yrs ago. If you want to be rememberd fondly - you take lessons from a class act like KIRBY.
It was an OK documentary I just wish Ross had kept some silly comments out of it - I did not find out any more about Ditko than i had known before. I am not certain who this would appeal to as general older comic book fans wouls probably KNOW the few Ditko things and newer fans probably couldnt care less. I liked Ditkos work but I personally feel Jack Kirby and even John Byrne were far better and more influential
any "documentary" which has a section they cannot show - the bit where Ross and Gaiman visit Ditko is castrated - yeah it must have been orgasmic for them as fans...but crappy for the viewers
I never understood the praise for Ditkos work. For the most part it was badly drawn. I think nostalga and fondness for Spideys early adventures is why people fuss over Ditko. Because his stint on SPEEDBALL in 1988 certainly didnt make an impression on anyone. His weird otherworldy stuff worked on Dr Strange... but Romita put Ditko to shame once he took over spidey.
Stan created nothing. Receiving the finished pages and then writing in the word balloons is not creating. "I have an idea for Spider-Man" is cool but he didn't flesh him out Steve did. Stan should get the credit for the idea but not the creation. Everything that's alive about Spider-Man is Ditko. If you give an artist a full script and say "draw this for me" that's co-creation if you say lets do a story about a Spider-Man and there are no other details then you are essentially the inspiration for the creation. Stan's a fan but he's no writer and not very creative. He managed creative people who can have a terrible sense for business but stealing is never cool. It's becoming clear who created what and it's clear Stan was there and had some influence and put his markers over art that was finished. Having said that I have to add this, if I was Steve Ditko I'd be embarrassed by the Spider-Man movies;they are terrible. Terribly written, terrible visuals. They aren't alive in any way.
+Joe Scorpion and The Inspectoids You're completely misinformed. Did you pay attention during the documentary? By DITKO'S OWN ADMISSION, Lee gave him two typed pages of synopsis, and once the drawings were done Lee added the actual dialogue. Do you know how much is on two pages of typed story? The shy boy who gets bit by a radioactive spider, doesn't stop the thief, learn the most famous less in comic book history...Lee came up with all of that. Ditko designed the costume. Any plots he came up with in later issues, he got credit for. The ORIGINAL STORY was Lee's. Ditko did a hell of a job, but if he wasn't around, Lee would've still created Spidey. It wouldn't have been as good, true, but it would've gotten accomplished. Without Lee, Ditko on his own, there'd be no Spidey at all. At the end of the day, is it really the costume we love or the shy kid who became a hero? Lee's no writer? Yeah, okay. He created and wrote what is arguably the most famous comic book story ever. And his paid artist Ditko helped him, which is what his friggin' job was.
+Amory Blaine 127 You like Stan Lee and that's fine with me. The facts speak for themselves. Stan created nothing. He took ideas or had and idea like all real fans do but that is not creation. You are stretching the definition of creation a lot if you say and idea is creation. Comics are fleshed out on the page. If all the art is drawn and you go in and write the dialogue that is not co-creating anything. He stole that title and it's becoming obvious to anyone who cares to investigate. Now if you produce a script to which pictures are then drawn from that is co creation. It's very clear. You're seriously arguing that and idea deserves a credit for writing? It's laughable!
Joe Scorpion and The Inspectoids Um, so what is it Ditko would've drawn without Stan's story? EVEN DITKO admits the idea of a shy teen who gets bit by a spider, and who doesn't stop the thief, learns the valuable lesson, etc., was LEE's IDEA. By DITKO'S OWN ADMISSION, he drew from Lee's two-page treatment. Have you ever typed a story? Two typed pages would've been the entire story of the first issue. It's one thing to say that MAYBE Ditko deserves CO-credit, but your "Stan created nothing" shit is insane. Yes, the facts speak for themselves, and you willfully ignore the facts because you don't like them. Stan created Spider-Man because HE CREATED SPIDER-MAN. By your nonsense logic, if you take some famous fairytale or Bible story that everyone knows the major details of and you put it into panel form, suddenly you are the sole creator? You're a halfwit.
Ross barely gave Gaiman a chance to speak after the Ditko interview. I'll put it down to nerves, or it being his documentary, but it came off pretty rude.
Great documentary, Understand Steve don't want interview and camera. But find Ross abit of an a** at the end say 'Tough' rather not say at all or feel sorry for fans who want to see Steve.
Been reading comics for 40 yrs young hipster..... Ditko on spidey was like Sam Keith on the MAXX. its was unique for that character and intersting for its time... but Ditko was TERRIBLE on ANYTHING else he drew over the next few decades.... Doctor Strange being the exception.
The same way for Stan Lee. Witout the real creators of those characters and stories I mean Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, John Romita, Bill Everett and Arnold Drake what would we have....Striperella! Excelsior ! 😂😂😂
Ditko...a very unique individual with strong beliefs and immense creative talent. Even though his politics aren’t my own I admire his strong convictions. A legend in the industry. Rest In Peace.
"In search of steve ditko" the documentary that is seven parts long yet still answers none of the questions you had!
Got answers for himself
But the trip was great!
When I was 9 years old, Steve walked out on Spider-Man and never came back. I didn't understand what happened and waited for him to come back. I'd read the letters section and see what Stan said and the explanation was never enough.
Spider-Man/Peter Parker spoke to me. They made my life bearable, enjoyable. The first Spider-Man comic I ever read was Annual 2. My dad told me about Spider-Man and I didn't believe him. It was always Superman, Batman, etc. But Spider-Man was it for me. TY Steve
Great Documentary Mr. Ross! I learned how little I know, again.
"Neil Gaiman the Boy Wonder"
Ditkos Style was a true inspiration for me when I drew comics three years ago. And I was 13! Thank you for this great dokumentation!
I grew up in the sixties. I had the best of all the worlds! In music we had the Beatles, some of the greatest movies were made in the sixties and in comics we had Steve Ditko and the king, Jack Kirby! I'm so spoiled.
Extremely lucky! I hope you have fond memories!
+libraryquiet Not to mention the beautiful cars and great ballplayers. Lucky ducks.
@therandom3591
What's your point? All girls have bush.
@therandom3591
That's what you think.
@therandom3591
I originally was talking about the sixties and how great it was growing up in that decade. Then you came along. Well, this is where I get off. Bye and take care.
A collaboration of Alan Moore & Steve Ditko would been mind-blowing.
What will Objectivist and Anarchist make?
@@janokjaran The two philosophies may have more in common than you would think, although there would also be vehement disagreements on some issues. Unlike what Alan Moore thinks, Objectivism is not Fascism but instead a kind of radical individualism that cares little about what "society" thinks. You can disagree with Ayn Rand, but characterizing her philosophy as Fascism is simply ill-informed and wrong.
I've been to a con where Stan lee was signing and the number of people who think, nay assume, that Stan Lee designed the costume and drew all the early Amazing Spider-man comics is astounding! I can see where the assumption comes from, and then when they're told he only wrote and co-created the throw the pitchforks and torches up and go on a witch hunt. Stan Lee was more out there with his self promotion, but that doesn't diminish the contributions he made to the comics industry.
Glad that they could finally meet and speak to Ditko. Even more glad that they did not disclose what he said.
Great documentary. I'm a massive comic book reader, and I got a history lesson out of this. Great job!
Thank you Mr. Ross. You've honored Steve Ditko's right to leave his personal interview with you unexploited to the end and that right there is journalistic integrity. Fanboys can learn a lesson from you. Thanks for proving me wrong. You're alright in my book.
Thank you very much for posting this. I watched most of it with my young daughter and it made me so happy to be able to share it with her.
Awesome program! Steve Ditko is unequalled in his craft! Thanks for posting!
Thank you for presenting this in it's entirety. It was excellent.
What people don't realize is that essentially all creative work in America was on a work-for-hire basis. The person was hired to create something and once the company paid you, you willingly gave up all "rights" to the creation. What was true for comics was also true for every other creative medium. The company doesn't care if you leave, they can even fire you, and someone else will take over your creation. Were this not the case, a lot less would have been created, because fewer companies would have bothered to take the risk.
I have no problem with Stan Lee. To me the essence of what made the character Spider-Man so great was that he was young, awkward, unpopular, and struggling with real everyday issues, is bitten by a spider, and then has to assume the great responsibility of being a superhero. These were all Stan's original ideas. In my opinion, it was these ideas that made Spider-Man so different at the time and enabled that connection with the readers. Most of my favorite moments of reading Spider-Man titles were when his everyday life and hero life would bleed over into each other. Steve Ditko was definitely talented and he certainly contributed to developing the idea, but that does not make him the creator in my opinion. People seem to have no problem crediting Steve Jobs for the creation of the iPod, iPhone, etc but certainly we all know that there were lots of other people involved with designing, creating, and producing the final devices.
Without the design of Spider-Man you probably would not have even read that story.
You're welcome. 😉
An absolutely phenomenal docu. Thanks. Brought me back to an old love and past life.
Excellent Mr Ross & Co. Thanks for sharing This SteveDitko.
Never seen this before loved it
with the kind of smile they returned back, I understood STEVE DITKO is very sweet & shy in rea.. and not harsh-or-reclusive as it seems
Himanshu Dudi He sounds like a man of self set principles who will not compromise them. He left when he was no longer respected. It seems fairly clear cut. He wants nothing to do with the millions of dollars gained from perverting the original ideas he had.
agree....he is truely the man of integrity
Adrimable....
Lovely to see Wossy en Neil himself giggling like little school girls after meeting the man :)
simply awsome and a great treat. thank you for posting this hopefully u can post more similar work like this
I was nervous when they decided to knock on his door against Steve's wishes. Made for a happy ending. I'm glad Stan came out okay - You always see backlash towards him & Whitout him where would Sidey, FF erc be? Basically a force for good . Lee, Kirby, Romita sr & Ditko are 4 comic legends & all of them will best be remembered for 60's Marvel - That is all. If you want to check other wors - It's there!!!
fantastic. Thanks so much for uploading this!!!
This was really interesting. Thanks for posting. I agree; one the best, maybe THE best comic book documentary I've ever seen. Probably because the presenter has a genuine love and appreciation for the medium. The shot of him and Gaiman coming back from their encounter with Ditko, with the kind of glazed, happy, awestruck expressions I've seen on children after meting Santa, but rarely on adults says it all.
Very good doc. Very well done.
Great doc, thanks for posting! Would have loved to have heard Steve's side of the story though... but hey, great doc none the less.
This was a great documentary!! Thank you!
Thank you for this!!
Great video! I'm a huge Steve Ditko fan. However, this video completely gives away the address to his office and evades his privacy. Spider-Man was always the best during the Ditko/Lee era. Too bad the Spider-Man movies haven't be able to capture the magic of the early Ditko Spider-Man books.
RIP Steve Ditko
Thanks for this great documentary.
I can see Stan Lee's point - it really just depends on what you mean by "creation". Nobody disagrees that the verbal idea, "teenage student, bitten by radioactive spider, sticks to walls like an insect, called 'Spider-Man'" was dreamed up by Lee and given to Ditko, and Ditko made something wonderful out of it.
Without Lee having that idea, there would have been no Spider-Man, without Ditko realizing it (and Lee putting in the words), there would have been no Spider-Man, and to that extent it's a genuine co-creation (and to counter Lee's point, it would also be a genuine co-creation if it failed); but if you have to give any priority at all, it must be to the idea that comes first.
In an odd way, Ditko's insistence on his co-creation somewhat goes against Objectivist principles - with Objectivism, it's always the idea in the mind of man that's the creative spark that gets all the engines going, so Rand would probably have sided with Lee just in terms of the "who created it" thing (although of course she might not necessarily have agreed with how the money was divvied up according to relative weightings of contribution to the *final product*).
I've been round the houses on whether to hate Stan Lee, but in my mellow old age, I actually cut him some slack. I think there's enough evidence to pull back a bit from Alan Moore's jaundiced view - evidence of genuine co-creation a lot of the time during Marvel's artistic glory years. And I think that's probably reflected fairly in most of the acknowledgements.
Moore is right though, when he says elsewhere, that the kind of business ethos whereby the artists were peons, comes from gangster origin of the comic book industry. The music industry, having somewhat related roots (via the Prohibition) also suffered from similar problems. And on the whole, it would be better to have a more equitable arrangement.
Or would it? To reflect on the other possibility here: maybe artists did produce bettter work when they weren't self-conscious as "auteurs"? When they were treated like shit? No, that last is too much to say - but I exaggerate to get the delicate psychological point across. Sometimes giving an artist free rein gets excellent results, but from the disastrous George Lucas prequels, we can also see that sometimes free rein can lead to self-indulgence and self-importance, which lead to bad art by another route, and in such cases, some guidance and bossiness might actually be beneficial - in which case, it has to be rewarded for its contribution to the final quality of the product.
+gurugeorge I wrote a much longer comment of my own on the previous part, but I TOTALLY AGREE WITH LEE. Ditko has been given so much credit by Lee; Lee falls all over himself to give him credit, but it's never enough. Reality is, Lee created the character of Parker/Spidey, and Ditko designed the costume. In later issues, Ditko did some plots, and got credit for those plots--but the original issue, the shy teen who goes on to learn that with great power comes great responsibility, Lee wrote that...and Ditko did was he was getting paid to do, design the way it looks. He was a great artist, but he's a bit off his nut--ad hom follows--as most Rand fans are.
Amory Blaine 127 i agree with you! Well said!
That Spider-man #33 splash page is one of the grails that I would love to own.
Ditko seems an odd bird, but turned out to be able to adapt to the circumstances.
Ditko is as much a creator as Stan. I'm not sure why there is a debate.
did anyone else get a bit emotional at 2:00 ? fantastic. thanks Dikto :)
Thanks for posting. Loved it!
I love many comic artists (too many to name) but Steve Ditko was my first and most lasting love. And as you know... you never forget your first love. I only wish I could understand his underlying motives better. What really makes him tick? And why is he such a hard-ass (written with all due respect, natch.)?
Finally, after almost a year of preparation, here it is:
EVERYTHING you ever wanted to know about the creation of Spider-Man, with behind-the-scenes anecdotes of the goings-on at Marvel Comics and appearances by heavyweight comic legends Stan Lee, Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko - - - with walk-on bits by comics creators Will Eisner, Joe Simon, Wally Wood, John Romita, John Buscema, Gil Kane, Roy Thomas, Denny O’Neil, Dick Ayers, Don Heck, Bill Everett, Joe Orlando, Eric Stanton, Carl Hubble, Stan Goldberg, Sol Brodsky, Danny Fingeroth, Mark Evanier, Alan Moore & Frank Miller !
Even pop artists Andy Warhol and Roy Lichtenstein, writer Ayn Rand & novelist Mario Puzo get into the act !!
And of course we cannot forget the man that made it all possible: publisher Martin Goodman. (And the tiny role that Chief Accountant Maurice Coyne played - - btw, don’t you love it when a person’s name matches his job title, like a librarian named Bookman?)
But be forewarned, it’s looooong. It’s the equivalent of 26 pages single-spaced !
I made it a bit easier to digest by breaking up the text into 12 sections:
1. Prologue
2. Amazing Fantasy
3. The Marvel Method
4. Storyteller Steve Ditko
5. Jack Kirby’s Spider-Man
6. Ditko Versus Kirby Versus Romita
7. Ditko’s Twist Ending ?
8. Ditko’s Psychology
9. Stan Lee’s Psychology
10. End Of An Era
11. You Tell Me
12. One Final Thought
This is not for the faint of heart lol. But if you read to the very end, there’s a mind-blowing thought awaiting there.
Oh, I also have many pics that follow the sequence of examples in the text. And be sure to check out some of the RUclips videos and links, especially Strip Panel Naked on Steve Ditko’s drawings and his great storytelling abilities in the visual medium :-)
Have fun happy readers !
1. To read the article, go to this link.
www.writerscafe.org/writing/Sienzant/1954464/
2. Pics that follow the text are on my Facebook page called Vision Angles.
There are 4 series of pics, so scroll down to start at the 1st series. They follow the text, highlighting points along the way. Even if you just look at the pics & their blurbs, you may find that enlightening by themselves.
Going to read comics all summer.
great show! good on ya Steve!!
Did this video mention that Ditko returned to Marvel in 1979 and worked on and off for them for 20 years? It made it sound like Ditko shut the door on Marvel in the '60s and never returned. Sounds dramatic and all to put that air of finality on it, but it's not accurate. He even drew for Amazing Spider-Man again in a 1988 Annual, but it was a back-up story not featuring Spidey himself.
I was surprised to learn that myself. In fact, he actually did pencils on an issue of Daredevil during Frank Miller's run. Miller wasn't involved in the issue IIRC but it was drawn by Ditko
dont forget he also Co-Creater the Invincible Squirrel Girl
Sure I remember him on Rom.
Ditko basically created the comics form adapting Lee's story treatment, with Lee also dubbing the dialogue on finished art. As far as the comics and likenesses of the comics go, Ditko definitely deserves bulk of the creative credit.
Indebted to you for posting this!
This documentary is pretty darn good, though I do agree with Stan.
only in britain can you insult the audience. this is why i love british documentaries, they hold nothing back and make it more fun.
It's been a rough year for the cartoonist, but at least he has his millions of dollars to ease the pain. 86-year-old Steve Ditko has taken the No. 1 spot on People With Money’s top 10 highest-paid cartoonists for 2013 with an estimated $58 million in combined earnings.
Source: Media Mass
That is from a hoax site.
My feeling about Stan Lee are so mixed right now.
+Korneel Snauwaert Why? Even Ditko admits the idea of a shy boy who gets bit by a spider, doesn't stop the thief who kills his uncle, etc., was Lee's. Ditko did what he was getting paid to do which was DESIGN A COSTUME. Yet Lee GOES OUT OF HIS WAY to say Ditko is the co-creator. Some of the comments on this doc are nuts. These Ditko fans are claiming more credit for him than he himself does, haha. LEE CREATED SPIDER-MAN. Ditko helped. And Lee is being REMARKABLY GENEROUS. I'd have told Ditko's crazy old ass to fuck off years ago by now.
+Amory Blaine 127 You make a good point. Maybe I'm comparing this too much with Kane/Finger. But still... Stan Lee didn't do much. He didn't make up the stories.
+Korneel Snauwaert You mean the early Spidey stories? Sure he did--at least most of them in the beginning. Like he says, eventually Ditko started giving him already plotted drawings and he just added the dialogue. But the big issue is who CREATED Spidey. And that first issue, Lee very much DID WRITE. And that's the character's creation. If Ditko wrote later ones--well, it's like a television show; the creator doesn't always write all the episodes. But the initial story, with the thief killing Ben and all, that was written by Lee. I think he's being more than fair to Ditko. Ditko's an old crank who left before the miracle happened and now regrets it.
+Amory Blaine 127 Lee really doesn't go out of his way to say that. When asked he says, "I'm willing to say so" and even Ross tells him that it's not what he asked.
+Amory Blaine 127 I think they're pretty much equally important in this case. The costume, which is always very very very important with a superhero, was created all by Ditko. That makes him a co-creator, without any doubt.
Lovely documentary and I am thankful for being able to do it. Something calls to my mind. I am strongly confident that the meeting took actually on Marvel's offices which are on the same building, instead of his own studio. Anyone have any clue on this?
Nope, Marvel is half a block east of this. I used to work in this building. The building had multiple offices per floor we all shared the one bathroom on each floor. I bumped into him washing his brushes in the bathrooom sink one day, and I struck up a conversation with him. When Ross is standing outside, I actually saw some of my old coworkers in this video lol
He reminds me of the creator of Calvin and Hobbes. Very private.
"Etta Candy to his Wonder Woman"
DAT SEMI-OBSCURE REFERENCE
"Neil Gaiman, the Boy Wonder"
its pretty clear to me that stan vastly improved the books drawn by kirby and ditko, who were great visual artists but not great writers. stan was a very smooth writer who could fill in the gaps and flesh out characters with more humanity. ditkos characters on his own were way too ayn randy, ie horrifyingly repellant, and kirby's characters were weird robot monsters of action with no inner life. so, although stan is the legal controller of the copyrights, which of course is not fair, he IS the full and fair cocreator, and his writing truly did make marvel the success it was, equally with their best artists (kirby, ditko, romita, sinnott, colan, buscema (john NOT sal), bill everett, marie severin, and all the later artists.
As if Steve Ditko wanted Spider-Man all credited to himself or first credited other than Jack Kirby.
A lot of general similarities to Kirby's earlier THE FLY----ability to walk on walls and ceilings, sort of a "6th sense" a la "spidey sense, great physical strength and a secret identity as a teenage boy....Stan had his own inner definition of "created" that allowed him to fully believe, to feel fully entitled to think of himself as the sole creator of some of his, er, creations. No offense to him or this work.
I think we overrate the initial creation itself. If the only good issue was the first and then it was passed off to other writers and artists who bungled it, the comic would be long cancelled and the character long dead and buried. Many later fans of the character may never have read those first or early issues. While the character's origin is important, it's new stories that keep readers coming back for more, further develop the character and maintain awareness and interest. Spider-Man even had his iconic costume changed in the 1980s and it didn't reduce his popularity at all. Batman is perhaps a stronger example of a character who has changed and evolved since his initial creation. Many of his most iconic elements and villains were not invented by the character's original creator. Batman's reinventions over the years arguably define who he is today more than his original creation does. Does Bob Kane or Frank Miller have more to do with the character's current popularity? Or maybe Tim Burton or Bruce Timm? So this constant obsession with trying to identify and credit the "original creator" seems very overplayed to me. Other talent who expanded upon and developed the character over the years may deserve a comparable level of recognition.
Thanks.
Ross is a master documentarian.
"So it was all worthwhile?"
"Yes, Steve, it was all worthwhile."
I just fucking wept.
@JETemplar yes, that was definitely the best part. That was a perfect bowtie on this documentary.
cheers for that
Thanks a lot, for this documantary! It was realy great! But I dont believe, that Jonathan and Neil , they meet Mr Ditko! ;-) from Malta
@spidey513 I totally agree with you. It was a joint work so he should get that partial credit.
awww i wanted to see him im doing him for the night of the night of the notables
@MiHiVidz Anywhere. I think he can draw pretty damn good, and fast.
R.I.P.
Ditko we just need of an image of you, please, i Don't want to see your photo just when you gone :(
I get what Alan Moore is saying but that version of spiderman is so diluted/evolved from back then that it has become such a mute point, does Defalco, Mcfarlane, Romita, john semper, bendis not deserve equal amount of mention for helping to cement such a vital part of the character? No one can tell me that spiderman could have lasted without additional inputs that have made him mainstream after the og ditko and lee pairing. A lot of the vital essences that make the character did not exist back in 1963 and are Independent to the co-creators. Credit should be given where it's due, but instances like this give credence to the so called marvel method.
Will movie goers have to take a hit of mescaline, before seeing it? Maybe take it with some popcorn and a diet soda?
The movie doesn't seem to be capturing the essence of Ditko's visuals at all and instead seems to be ripping off Inception.
RIP. :(
Neil Gaiman the boy wonder xD
@qqrk1372 Yeah, I've read a issue of the original Avengers comics by Kirby where Spidey does make a small appearance and needless to say Ditko drew Spiderman better and found Kirby's version of the character a bit underwhelming.
I wish I knew what did they talk about with Mr Ditko
It is disappointing that he has become a recluse and while the doc felt one sided you do get to see it from a different angle another "side" one day he might come back into the spotlight.
Zac Gorenc artists like STEVE DITKO comes, performes & give their best..than they leave everything rest-to the audience(here readers)...they understand intuitively the value of time...such lovely sweet wise people artists are...Its just the talentless critics who left behind-discussing asses all day__I guess you understood whom Iam refering here
Zac Gorenc If he doesn't want to get attention, that's perfectly fine, as I see it. His work speaks for itself. However, I get the feeling that he's had some harsh experiences early on, which has radicalized him. He's clearly experienced friction because of his political views, and I think he's bitter because he feels treated unfairly. He seems a prideful man. Perhaps with enough integrity to cross over into pompousness.
Unfortunately, his fiercely uncompromising, polarized and (in my opinion) delusional view on morality puts him in line with the proponents of objectivism - Ayn Rand's pseudo philosophy. After he experienced the blow of leaving Marvel, it seems his work steadily devolved into unreflective stories bordering on propaganda with little room for subtlety.
definitely he is a man of integrity.
dont need glamour to prove his worth.
his work speaks for himself.
and only few humans had achieved that.
and that puts him in state of satisfaction.
he live or die as a person doesnt really matter to him (I think(--he lives by his work, which has already made him LEGEND
Jonathan Ross respects the wishes of Steve Ditko and keeps everything from their conversation to himself. However when Steve Ditko says he does not want to meet Johnathan Ross, he disrespects his wishes and goes knocking on his door anyway? So let me get this right, Steve Ditko talked to Jonathan Ross but for some reason asked Jonathan not to tell a soul what he said in their conversation and to please respect his wishes?
@TheSteveDitko Unlike Lee?
IAM A FAN OF STEVE DITKO
+Himanshu Dudi Yes you are. And, if your comments on the previous part are not meant as sarcasm, you are also quite insane.
You came on too strong Jonathan
Look i just remember reading his Speed Ball issues as a teen and not being able to stomach them. cant even recall anything he did aside from Amazing and Doc Strange in the 60s. I saw some of his monster titles in the early 60s or late 50s--- didnt care for them either. There was a BIG book a cpl yrs ago that had his works in it.... I could not bring myslef to appreciate what i saw.... where as KIRBY and ROMITA & others I love and appreciate everything they ever drew.
I
Stan Lee has and always will be great
Stan Lee chased many a great comic creator off with his scene stealing blather. Wallace Wood did wonderful things with the 2nd tier character Daredevil in just a few issues (5-12 I think) and when he (Wood) had the temerity to write an issue Lee jumped in on the second half of the two-part story and made a (not so witty) comment about how Wood needed help finishing! Wallace Wood quit and started AN ENTIRE COMIC BOOK COMPANY (Tower Comics) and was the main contributor to three, monthly on-going $0.25 (Annual size books). Kirby was more invested and stayed on long after Ditko but even he (Kirby) had enough of the "Mouth that roared" and quit. It would be years before Lee would relinquish "writing" chores to others and then mercifully left the scene. Marvel under the thumb of Lee would have negated the work of the likes of Frank Miller, John Byrne and Jim Lee. They too would have fled.
And they did
PatrolOfficer161 it was also LARGELY about money. Publisher (not Stan) refused to pay top talent a fair amount so they quit for improved wages. Kirby had a family and wife didn't work...leaving was a smart thing if only because he was making more money.
come on really Steve ? do an interview already think of all the people that would make really happy.
His work did the speaking for him. That is what he has said, and that is the way it is. It is a black and white issue.
Jack L, thank you for not making OK a word, cuz it's not, I hate seeing okay, for ex, people wouldn't write that this doc was on the beebeesee...same thing
Call Ditko reclusive or a Randian/Objectivist "whatever". He lived and is living his philosophy in life. He's happy with it or his decision. That's what makes him happy! People who feel sad or who ridicule him for not coming out and embrace his popularity are just guilty of psychological projection. Not everybody wants fame. And people should just him alone. That's what makes him happy. That's HAPPINESS to him.
By the way, I learned that Ditko is the Highest-Paid Cartoonist in the World...
40 years...so then you should know better.
Actually you and I are pretty much the same age. It's amazing then that you really have very little appreciation for the originators. And thats probably because you don't really know much but pretend to know more than you do.
Ditko is an amazing artist. While Kirby was the power, Ditko was the elegance in drawing. Could Ditko have continued on doing the ongoing Marvel stable of characters? Sure.
But he chose another route. Of independent artist.
ass.
...they do a big documentary on the guy, finally talk to him in person, then say they shouldn't talk about it. Some will say that's wonderful and artistic and whatever. It's actually pretty stupid.
@MiHiVidz I don't see why you people hate on Liefeld's drawings. They are amazing. You tell me what the problem is with them.
Ditko was an ok artists on a ground breaking character that was more popular when Romita took over it. For Ditko to be a reclusive bitter nut the last 40 yrs- makes him a dick for those who actually do admire his work from 50 yrs ago.
If you want to be rememberd fondly - you take lessons from a class act like KIRBY.
It was an OK documentary I just wish Ross had kept some silly comments out of it - I did not find out any more about Ditko than i had known before. I am not certain who this would appeal to as general older comic book fans wouls probably KNOW the few Ditko things and newer fans probably couldnt care less. I liked Ditkos work but I personally feel Jack Kirby and even John Byrne were far better and more influential
John Byrne is dogshit compared to Ditko.
any "documentary" which has a section they cannot show - the bit where Ross and Gaiman visit Ditko is castrated - yeah it must have been orgasmic for them as fans...but crappy for the viewers
derpdaderp1234 STAN makes money taking advantage of artists hard work....cleaver street-smart pathetic shit he is all
+Jack Luminous I like Jim Steranko.
+Himanshu Dudi i dont like Stan lee but give credit where its due Lee churned out lots of stories
I never understood the praise for Ditkos work. For the most part it was badly drawn. I think nostalga and fondness for Spideys early adventures is why people fuss over Ditko.
Because his stint on SPEEDBALL in 1988 certainly didnt make an impression on anyone.
His weird otherworldy stuff worked on Dr Strange... but Romita put Ditko to shame once he took over spidey.
Stan created nothing. Receiving the finished pages and then writing in the word balloons is not creating. "I have an idea for Spider-Man" is cool but he didn't flesh him out Steve did. Stan should get the credit for the idea but not the creation. Everything that's alive about Spider-Man is Ditko. If you give an artist a full script and say "draw this for me" that's co-creation if you say lets do a story about a Spider-Man and there are no other details then you are essentially the inspiration for the creation. Stan's a fan but he's no writer and not very creative. He managed creative people who can have a terrible sense for business but stealing is never cool. It's becoming clear who created what and it's clear Stan was there and had some influence and put his markers over art that was finished. Having said that I have to add this, if I was Steve Ditko I'd be embarrassed by the Spider-Man movies;they are terrible. Terribly written, terrible visuals. They aren't alive in any way.
Joe Scorpion and The Inspectoids spidy is lifting the tank-is so amazing to see.....but STAN's dumb ass dialogue ruins it all....
+Joe Scorpion and The Inspectoids You're completely misinformed. Did you pay attention during the documentary? By DITKO'S OWN ADMISSION, Lee gave him two typed pages of synopsis, and once the drawings were done Lee added the actual dialogue. Do you know how much is on two pages of typed story? The shy boy who gets bit by a radioactive spider, doesn't stop the thief, learn the most famous less in comic book history...Lee came up with all of that. Ditko designed the costume. Any plots he came up with in later issues, he got credit for. The ORIGINAL STORY was Lee's. Ditko did a hell of a job, but if he wasn't around, Lee would've still created Spidey. It wouldn't have been as good, true, but it would've gotten accomplished. Without Lee, Ditko on his own, there'd be no Spidey at all. At the end of the day, is it really the costume we love or the shy kid who became a hero? Lee's no writer? Yeah, okay. He created and wrote what is arguably the most famous comic book story ever. And his paid artist Ditko helped him, which is what his friggin' job was.
+Amory Blaine 127 You like Stan Lee and that's fine with me. The facts speak for themselves. Stan created nothing. He took ideas or had and idea like all real fans do but that is not creation. You are stretching the definition of creation a lot if you say and idea is creation. Comics are fleshed out on the page. If all the art is drawn and you go in and write the dialogue that is not co-creating anything. He stole that title and it's becoming obvious to anyone who cares to investigate. Now if you produce a script to which pictures are then drawn from that is co creation. It's very clear. You're seriously arguing that and idea deserves a credit for writing? It's laughable!
Joe Scorpion and The Inspectoids
Um, so what is it Ditko would've drawn without Stan's story? EVEN DITKO admits the idea of a shy teen who gets bit by a spider, and who doesn't stop the thief, learns the valuable lesson, etc., was LEE's IDEA. By DITKO'S OWN ADMISSION, he drew from Lee's two-page treatment. Have you ever typed a story? Two typed pages would've been the entire story of the first issue. It's one thing to say that MAYBE Ditko deserves CO-credit, but your "Stan created nothing" shit is insane. Yes, the facts speak for themselves, and you willfully ignore the facts because you don't like them. Stan created Spider-Man because HE CREATED SPIDER-MAN. By your nonsense logic, if you take some famous fairytale or Bible story that everyone knows the major details of and you put it into panel form, suddenly you are the sole creator? You're a halfwit.
this is an interesting doc but incredibly one sided.
+hollowhostile01 How so? It clearly has an agenda, yes, but Stan Lee was given a voice and the freedom to state his case.
KInd of sucks that people are making millions off of Spider-Man and Steve is not.
Ross barely gave Gaiman a chance to speak after the Ditko interview. I'll put it down to nerves, or it being his documentary, but it came off pretty rude.
Oh bullshit.
Sniffle.
Great documentary, Understand Steve don't want interview and camera. But find Ross abit of an a** at the end say 'Tough' rather not say at all or feel sorry for fans who want to see Steve.
What a misanthrope.
Been reading comics for 40 yrs young hipster..... Ditko on spidey was like Sam Keith on the MAXX. its was unique for that character and intersting for its time... but Ditko was TERRIBLE on ANYTHING else he drew over the next few decades.... Doctor Strange being the exception.
The same way for Stan Lee.
Witout the real creators of those characters and stories I mean Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, John Romita, Bill Everett and Arnold Drake what would we have....Striperella!
Excelsior ! 😂😂😂
i like stan much better, and for modern standars he isn't extraordinary he's ok