Hi, i am a baker from jakarta, and i really find all your videos very insightful and amazing. Has been a baker for over 10 years now and i still learn a thing or two from your videos. Keep up the good work. 🎉
Hello! To be honest, I am impressed with the taste of this dough. I'm not a professional baker, I just like to cook. I have made this recipe twice already, hamburger buns and cherry buns. This is something unreal. With so much yeast and no eggs. The taste, texture and appearance are incredible! Thank you very much!
Havent seen any video with tangzhong and poolish method. This is amazing !!! Please make a video with sourdough starter with tangzhong and poolish method perhaps.
Happy to share with all that I tested Seraphine's masterful "Ultimate Basic Asian Bread 2.0 with Tangzhong and Poolish" recipe as a pullman loaf and confirmed that it's fantastic as Shokupan as well! I modified her recipe to fit a 13x13x13cm pullman pan by reducing her recipe by 32% - yielding a 545 g dough. Baking at 340F / 171C for 35 mins. Thanks again Seraphine for your thoughtful experimentation and guidance.
watching your videos made a great change in my little bread making world . wish i had the opportunity to bake with you in person and use your wisdom on bread making first hand
Thanks so much for this recipe. Bit of extra work and a pain to knead by hand (so sticky for some reason even though it's not that high of a hydration. Dough scraper was mandatory), but it beats anything else I've been able to make so far in terms of flavour, texture and volume. Would like to try an even longer poolish ferment or a cold ferment to see how far the flavour can be pushed. One small change I made is to dissolve the yeast for the main dough in the milk before adding it altogether. Probably less of an issue at this hydration, but I've had issues in the past where instant yeast doesn't dissolve and even after long kneading the grains are still clearly visible and there's no rise. I also bumped it by 1/4 tsp for a bit of extra insurance.
Seraphine. Thank you for all your research and hard work! I’ve made your polish-tangzhong shokupan; your recent tangzhong-20 and 35; your Asian 2.0 - and I’ve tried a hybrid of tangzhong-25 with poolish. These all worked perfectly on my first try - thanks to your research, quantities and explanations!! My last bake (poolish-tangzhong pullman loaf) lasted 4 days on the counter - with only minimal staling! What is you opinion about yoghurt? Could that add some interesting flavour/texture? Or do you think the current milk/butter/egg combination is getting complex enough? If you think yoghurt is a viable direction, would you have a suggestion for its substation or addition into shokupan? Thank You
Glad to hear about your takes on our recipes. On yoghurt, we're actually working on a video for it. It's indeed full of benefits for the bread somewhat similar to sourdough. The video will go into more detail on how to use it.
Thank you! I am also planning on making a cinnamon swirl bread loaf. Do you recommend this recipe for that or do you have another that or would you use a different recipe for that purpose? Thanks again!
I believe this one will do, although you could also use the filling from here along with our Asian milk bread/shokupan recipe: ruclips.net/video/hd-vdRnb-JI/видео.html ruclips.net/video/QuhM5qSQ7T0/видео.html
I'm turning a big fan of you always great videos😊😊 I'm doing this recipe but i just realized that tangzhong and the poolish is not like yours look like less lumpy. Should I cut the water from them or in the final do dough? Maybe the quality of bread flour
Hello Seraphine, beautiful channel. Huge huge fan here. I have a question for this recipe: if I were to use it with a 1:1 Yudane, what should I do in the following steps (should I add water to reach the 71% or should I add milk)? Thank you.
This recipe is using Tangzhong/Yudane at around a 2:3 ratio, if you were to use 1:1, you need to add the rest of the water into the final dough, water not milk. If you add milk instead, milk water replacement will be over 25%, as explained in our previous video, 25% is ideal for soft bread.
Hi new subscriber on your channel , really love your video that I learned a lot. I just want to ask you that how long can you keep poolish in the fridge for soft bread? Thanks in advance. Also thank you so much for teaching us the science of bread making 🙏🙏🙏
We usually incorporate poolish into our final dough when it has just receded from its peak. How long it will take in the fridge depends on the amount of yeast, and the storage temperature. As for how long it can last in the fridge, well, it depends on the same factors, since you want the yeast to remain in good condition for bread baking. It's better to observe the poolish condition to see if it remains risen and hasn't fully collapsed.
Semangat terus Miss Novita video penelitian baking sangat menginsipirasi. Dari beberapa jenis metode sponge starter, mengapa memilih poolish? Saya lebih nyaman pakai metode Biga, dengan 40% total tepung di tahap starter sponge, 60% sisanya di main dough. Miss Novita, apa efeknya yudane dikombinasikan dengan sponge method, bukankah itu sama bread improver alami? saya prefer roti tawar dengan yudane daripada sponge starter, tetapi pembuatan roti manis asia prefer dengan sponge starter daripada yudane, yudane pada roti manis asia menghasilkan kulit roti sedikit tekstur chewy yang kurang disukai orang sini (Yogyakarta).
1. Biga and Poolish beda. Salah satu adalah karena hidrasi lebih tinggi, proses lebih cepat. 2. Beda Tangzhong dan Poolish. Tangzhong/yudane lebih ke proses fisika, sedang poolish lebih mengarah ke proses kimiawi. Poolish memberi protease alami, sehingga melunakkan adonan, kebalikan dari tangzhong, dan itu yang kita cari sebagai penyeimbang. Karena fermentasi lama, poolish memberi aroma dan rasa yang lebih enak. Karena penghancuran protein, poolish memberi lebih banyak amino acids untuk dipakai pada reaksi Maillard. 3. Kalau pakai yudane dan kulit roti menjadi chewy, hmm, mungkin proses pembuatannya harus diperiksa ulang, tangzhong/yudane bekerja melalui gelatinisasi, ada baik konsepnya dikuasai sebelum dipraktekin.
Dear Novita , thank you for your master classes related to T.Z. I appreciate them a lot. Please let me know if I can use this recipe to make dinner rolls shaping them in the same way you do for burger buns , but smaller ( let's say 30 or 40 grams ). Thanks and regards from Ecuador,
Hi Seraphine. Using Tangzhong and Poolish in the same dough recipe is a great thing. I have tried this with a big success. But I'm facing a little issue here. When making a small piece of dough like from 600g of flour following recommended ratios there is a little water left to make a Poolish (70g). The question is: May I use milk to make the Poolish? Thanks for the answer.
Hello.. I have a question, what if we were to reduce the total hydration since my flour is not strong enough to take the recommended hydration.. will it effect the polish and tangzong texture and thereby impact the final outcome negatively..
Hi Seraphine, thank you for sharing your knowledge. Do you have recipe for 1000gms Bread Flour? Hope you can share us with the said amount of flour. Thank you!
Thank you for this video! Instead of bread flour, would (1) white whole wheat flour also work? How about (2) organic wheat? If yes, does the water % for either have to be adjusted ... and if so, how much? Alternatively, would a combination of white whole wheat with AP, or bread flour with AP also work? Adjustment of water % as well? Apology for the many Qs. Thank you again!
Hello, If I have active dry yeast, how should I use it for this recipe since it needs to be activated in water first and then use it I am a bit confused as to how to go about it with active dry yeast
Hi Novita, i love all of you videos. one advice please, i tried to follow the process explained in this video with regard to use Tangzhong and Poolish i noticed the following ...if the main recipe is based on around a total amount of 500 gram of flour, using the stand mixer for around 12 mins is enough to give a great dough ...however, if i doubled the receipe to be based on a total of 1000 gram of flour, i found 12 mins mixer is leading to the same good quality of dough. do you think i should extend the mixing time?
thanks a lot, I just realized that i made a typo ..as |I wanted to saye ..12 mins with 1Kg of four did NOT lead the same good quality of dough ...this is why i was asking if i should consider extending the kneading time ? sorry for the confusion i made @@NovitaListyani
In that case yes, extend the mixing for another 2 minutes and check windowpane again, 12 minute mixing with stand mixer is what happens on our machine, yours could be different, one thing to remember, once a Tangzhong dough reach its optimal state it can suddenly collapse due to its lower tolerance to over kneading, check regularly.
Seraphine, is it your studied opinion that adding the butter too early would inhibit the protein strand development, while adding it after it starts developing , the strand development is enhanced?
Fat plasticizes dough, it shortens the gluten strands (hence, it’s called shortening). An increase in the level of fat in the dough usually requires a decrease in the level of water, and vice versa. So, it makes sense to let the dough develop some gluten strands before we throw in the butter. At least that’s how we deal with it, having said that, some scientists have different observation on this. From Clyde E. Stauffer, Fats and Oils in Bakery Products, “The statement has been made that the presence of fat slows down development of gluten (lengthens the required mixing time), but in experiments both in the laboratory and in the plant this thesis has not been confirmed.” Also from Stauffer, up to 5% of fat in the dough produces optimum effect on the texture of the bread, and loaf volume of bread increases as the amount of fat increase, up to about 5% (flour basis) and then remains roughly constant.
@@NovitaListyani That was very helpful Seraphine. Thank you. Knowing the 5% fat ceiling is useful. I just made a nice soft sourdough sandwich bread. The way my regular crusty artisan loaf dough transforms into a soft pillow with the addition of a little fat and honey amazes and delights me. BTW There is one thing i fear about your recipe. The temptation to eat the whole pan! It looks glorious.
Please, another question. When making the tangzhong, is it ok to mix the water and flour in a pot first and then then stirring it over the stove until the thick mixture come together? Thank you for your advice.
We used to do that a long time ago, later we found out the technique has many issues. You may want watch some of these videos to get more information on tangzhong/yudane: ruclips.net/video/DjQ7EtvzK_w/видео.html ruclips.net/video/Wz0PiKOWY1g/видео.html ruclips.net/video/_mFYeiLzLpo/видео.html
It probably won't affect the baking time too much, although it may take a little less time to fully bake. Baking time and settings usually depend more on the type of oven you use.
It we replaced the tangzhong with whole wheat flour and replaced sugar with honey, how much do we need to increase the hydration of the dough as you said in a previous video that whole wheat flour absorbs more water.
Roti sebaiknya jangan disimpan di kulkas di bagian bawah dengan suhu 4°C karena dapat mempercepat staling (terjadi proses retrogradation). Kalaupun mau di masukkan ke kulkas harus di bagian freezer, supaya beku. Nanti waktu mau makan, tinggal dipanaskan ulang dalam keadaan beku dan kalau kering bisa disemprot sedikit air supaya tetap lembut.
@@NovitaListyaniterima kasih ka, aku sudah mencoba resepnya dan hasilnya lembut dan type teksture yang aku cari. Dan apakah ada saran kalau poolish yeast nya aku ganti dengan sourdogh starter ( levain) kira kira perhitungan perbandingannya berapa ya ka yang pas untuk resep yang sama.?
Hi Seraphine, I am in the process of making this bread, I used half the ingredients & i am kneaded the dough by hand. My dough is not able to form gluten even after autolyse. I cannot do stretch & fold also. Could you please suggest what might have gone wrong in my method?
Can Tagzhong be made in the microwave? Can it be made with infusion water, fruit juices, coffee or tea or is it best to just add the flavors to the bread dough and not the Tangzhong?
Good afternoon. I'm using google translate, I don't speak English. I'm Brazilian, I'm 60 years old, I want to learn how to make bread, I have difficulty with math, it was difficult but I understood that the initial weight was 240g and not 425g. As I don't have a mixer, I'm going to make the bread by kneading the dough on the table. I don't know how long to knead but it will work. Could you explain? How do I bake bread in the homemade electric oven? I'm not sure how high on the grill I should place the bread to get a good result? Thanks for sharing. I wish God bless your life, your studies and your family. A hug from Brazil
Could be completely stupid question, but if I fill these with something(cheese, cream etc) will it mess with the end result? They look so...perfect, I wouldn't want to mess them up :D
Not sure what happened with my Tangzhong made it three times once on the stove and chilled over night but the gel never got nearly as thick. Weighed ingredients and used boiled water for the two attempts and stove method for third. Bread Flour is 12.7% King Arthur Flour Brand
That happens to me as well, and I've been cooking and baking for a good while. I think, I'm the case of the stove top, that it's a case of the tangzhong not coming up to temp (65C) for long enough. And the reason I say this is because when I've made this with boiled water, here in Wisconsin, using an actual ceramic teapot to measure and pour the boiling water, I actually preheated the teapot with boiling water then threw it out when the tangzhong water was ready to be done. I did this because our kitchen has been cold (65F) since Oct 31st when it snowed! It was almost soft, but gelled enough to be cut into strips that I added to the dough in the stand mixer. Just my theory, anyway. Oh, and I'm using KA Unbleached AP flour. I'm on a really tight budget... 😢
We live in a tropical climate so we use room temperature water at 28°C Celsius, but if your climate is very cold, you may want to use warm water, as well as put the poolish in a warmer spot.
In the description box, you will find Baker's percentage at the right side of the ingredient list. You can use this percentage to scale up or scale down the recipe. Watch this short video for an example ruclips.net/user/shortsb2P9UVxCce8
Hi! May I ask what is meant by “Milk Water Replacement 24.8%”? Does it mean if I want to use water instead of milk, I should use 24.8% of water? I want to make this dairy free so will be substituting the butter with olive oil instead. Also learnt how to make fruit yeast water from your channel so I’ll be using it in the poolish instead of instant yeast and omitting the yeast in the main dough. Thank you for teaching me so much!! Can’t wait to bake this loaf (:
Milk water replacement means the amount of water replaced by milk. So, if you want to get rid of the milk, you need to add this amount of water to the dough to maintain the hydration. For more information: ruclips.net/video/qdOHmdTTs24/видео.html Also to substitute butter with olive oil, you add 3/4 the amount of butter with olive oil. Yes, you can use the poolish as your levain, but the fermentation will take a lot longer, but I guess you know the drill, that's where the flavor comes from. Additionally the texture may be significantly different.
Thank you for the reply! Yes I love the smell of the bread using the yeast water poolish. Do you think if I omit the sugar in the recipe, will it yield a hard crust like that of an artisan sourdough bread? I want a soft Asian style bread but I’ve found that even adding just 15g of sugar for a loaf bread of this size makes the bread too sweet. Not sure if it’s due to the sugars in the fruit yeast water (I’m using raisins)? So I’m hoping just adding the oil will be enough to yield a soft sandwich loaf
Getting a hard crust on the bread is less about the sugar content, than it is about the baking temperature and the hydration of the dough. If you are using fruit yeast water made of raisins, you can lower the sugar level. The 6% sugar, baker's percentage, is supposed to support the instant yeast activity for at least 3 hours, since you are not using instant yeast and raisins contain a fair bit of sugar, you can cut it down, you'll just need to be patient with the slow fermentation.
That's interesting! My usual bulk fermentation is 3hrs, and final proof is 2hours in a 20x10x10cm loaf tin at 31-32C (Singapore). Pretty used to the long fermentation times now. I'm adapting your recipe to make it dairy free, could you see if it looks ok please? Total flour: 350g (20x10x10cm loaf tin) Yudane: 70g bread flour (20%) 84g boiling water (I'm using a 1:1.2 ratio so that I can have more water in the main dough due to mixer problems) Poolish: 105g bread flour (30%: using a higher proportion since I'm not adding any more yeast into the main dough) 105g raisin/dates yeast water Main dough: 180g bread flour 6.3g salt (1.8%) 19g olive oil (5.3%: 3/4 of your 7.1% as advised) 64g water (should have been 87g based on 24.8% but since I increased the poolish to 30%, I deducted the additional water that went there) I think I probably messed up some of the % but just a rough guide. Thank you!
The recipe looks perfect to me, around 71% hydration, you need to pay attention to the poolish because that's where all your flavors come from, bear in mind that overnight Yudane will be the only derivative ingredient that give you the natural sweetness and umami, good luck!
The windowpane test is meant to gauge the gluten development of the dough, if you're having trouble with it, it could be that the dough hasn't been kneaded/mixed for long enough or the dough could need a minute to relax before being tested.
@@NovitaListyani yes, I ended up kneading it for 15 more minutes (not sure about the speed, I'm using a bread machine, not a stand mixer) and that was what it needed, the bread turned out great :) Thank you so much!
Hey Novita! Great video as always, you're an inspiration to me as a baker myself. If it's not too much to ask, would you mind reviewing a recipe of mine that I had developed? Please don't feel obliged to do so, I just think it'd be nice to have someone knowledgeable to see it. Cheers.
Hmmm, I am not quite sure what to say, this is a recipe way beyond the limits of ingredients in what I'd make. It reminds me of a brioche but the egg content is quite low for that.
Sometimes we use eggs, sometimes we don't, there's really no reason why :) As for the size of the loaf pan to use, read the information in the description, use the baker's percentage to scale the recipe up or down to suit the loaf pan you have. Watch this short video: ruclips.net/user/shortsb2P9UVxCce8 for more information.
@@NovitaListyani FYI - I divided the final dough into three rolls and put into a 10"x5" loaf pan and baked for 35 minutes - came out perfect! Thanks for the ultimate recipe!
4 to 5 minutes, before butter, another 5 to 6 minutes after that. You can turn on subtitles or read the transcript. No dough should be kneaded with a stand mixer or by hand for 45 minutes. This bread shouldn't be that hard to make :)
Your description of ingredients is very hard to understand...using % is terribly wrong...using grams, ml, cups or tablespoon would have been perfect.. . Your recipe and demo though I'm sure is good info...thanks
Hi, i am a baker from jakarta, and i really find all your videos very insightful and amazing. Has been a baker for over 10 years now and i still learn a thing or two from your videos. Keep up the good work. 🎉
Glad you like it, thank you very much!
Ha! I'm a total noob, really just got interested making bread a few weeks ago, i'm learning a lot and finding the bread is simply awesome :)
Ok, where has this wealth of knowledge channel been my entire bread journey. I love this.
You are such a bread scientist! Thanks.
Excellent! Again, …..I am edified. 😁👍🕊🌹🕊
The quad screen was awesome. Extremely effective with me.👍
Glad you like the quad screen, we had hesitation about it when we started using it :)
Congratulations on reaching 100k. Very well deserved and thanks!
I use sourdough instead of poolish it came out good.soft and yummy
Hello! To be honest, I am impressed with the taste of this dough. I'm not a professional baker, I just like to cook. I have made this recipe twice already, hamburger buns and cherry buns. This is something unreal. With so much yeast and no eggs. The taste, texture and appearance are incredible! Thank you very much!
Thanks for sharing!
Havent seen any video with tangzhong and poolish method. This is amazing !!! Please make a video with sourdough starter with tangzhong and poolish method perhaps.
Happy to share with all that I tested Seraphine's masterful "Ultimate Basic Asian Bread 2.0 with Tangzhong and Poolish" recipe as a pullman loaf and confirmed that it's fantastic as Shokupan as well! I modified her recipe to fit a 13x13x13cm pullman pan by reducing her recipe by 32% - yielding a 545 g dough. Baking at 340F / 171C for 35 mins. Thanks again Seraphine for your thoughtful experimentation and guidance.
Thanks for sharing!
I never understood science, but I understand yours. Thank youu
watching your videos made a great change in my little bread making world . wish i had the opportunity to bake with you in person and use your wisdom on bread making first hand
Thanks!
New subscriber here. As always very well explained and great outcome.
Thanks for sharing
This croissant looks really delicious. I also think sesame is healthy. I can't cook, so I want to buy it.Have a happy weekend🥐
Thanks so much for this recipe. Bit of extra work and a pain to knead by hand (so sticky for some reason even though it's not that high of a hydration. Dough scraper was mandatory), but it beats anything else I've been able to make so far in terms of flavour, texture and volume. Would like to try an even longer poolish ferment or a cold ferment to see how far the flavour can be pushed.
One small change I made is to dissolve the yeast for the main dough in the milk before adding it altogether. Probably less of an issue at this hydration, but I've had issues in the past where instant yeast doesn't dissolve and even after long kneading the grains are still clearly visible and there's no rise. I also bumped it by 1/4 tsp for a bit of extra insurance.
Thanks so much for this receipe. May i kniw whether this receipe can be used to make shio pan bread?
Saludos desde Venezuela.😎Excelente ,,,,
Just wanna add: I knead doughs like this by hand in the same amount of time. A cool room makes the difference, like a hospital 🤭✌🏼
Can you use this dough and similar method to make steamed boazi?
You're amazing. You know so much science behind the baking. Can I use all purpose flour instead of bread flour for this recipe??
Seraphine. Thank you for all your research and hard work!
I’ve made your polish-tangzhong shokupan; your recent tangzhong-20 and 35; your Asian 2.0 - and I’ve tried a hybrid of tangzhong-25 with poolish. These all worked perfectly on my first try - thanks to your research, quantities and explanations!!
My last bake (poolish-tangzhong pullman loaf) lasted 4 days on the counter - with only minimal staling!
What is you opinion about yoghurt? Could that add some interesting flavour/texture? Or do you think the current milk/butter/egg combination is getting complex enough?
If you think yoghurt is a viable direction, would you have a suggestion for its substation or addition into shokupan?
Thank You
Glad to hear about your takes on our recipes. On yoghurt, we're actually working on a video for it. It's indeed full of benefits for the bread somewhat similar to sourdough. The video will go into more detail on how to use it.
These look amazing! I can't wait to try them. Could they be cold proofed in the fridge overnight before baking?
Yes you can!
Thank you! I am also planning on making a cinnamon swirl bread loaf. Do you recommend this recipe for that or do you have another that or would you use a different recipe for that purpose? Thanks again!
I believe this one will do, although you could also use the filling from here along with our Asian milk bread/shokupan recipe: ruclips.net/video/hd-vdRnb-JI/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/QuhM5qSQ7T0/видео.html
I'm turning a big fan of you always great videos😊😊 I'm doing this recipe but i just realized that tangzhong and the poolish is not like yours look like less lumpy. Should I cut the water from them or in the final do dough? Maybe the quality of bread flour
Most likely the water is not hot enough, to make Tangzhong/Yudane we use boiling water (100°C /212°F).
Just found your channel❤❤❤
Hello Seraphine, beautiful channel. Huge huge fan here.
I have a question for this recipe: if I were to use it with a 1:1 Yudane, what should I do in the following steps (should I add water to reach the 71% or should I add milk)? Thank you.
This recipe is using Tangzhong/Yudane at around a 2:3 ratio, if you were to use 1:1, you need to add the rest of the water into the final dough, water not milk. If you add milk instead, milk water replacement will be over 25%, as explained in our previous video, 25% is ideal for soft bread.
Thanks again...another outstanding video!
Any thoughts on how your poolish recipe might do as a shokupan-type pullman loaf?
I think it should be fine as a Shokupan
I divide the dough into three rolls and place into a 10"x5" pan - dough will fill pan, despite first appearances! - and it comes out great.
Can you spill the bowl that use for poolish dough?
Thanks. Your video are great I've learnt a lot
Thanks. The poolish bowl we used in this video is a 14-cm Clear Bowl.
Hi new subscriber on your channel , really love your video that I learned a lot. I just want to ask you that how long can you keep poolish in the fridge for soft bread? Thanks in advance. Also thank you so much for teaching us the science of bread making 🙏🙏🙏
We usually incorporate poolish into our final dough when it has just receded from its peak. How long it will take in the fridge depends on the amount of yeast, and the storage temperature. As for how long it can last in the fridge, well, it depends on the same factors, since you want the yeast to remain in good condition for bread baking. It's better to observe the poolish condition to see if it remains risen and hasn't fully collapsed.
@@NovitaListyani thank you so much for answering my question 🙏❤️
Semangat terus Miss Novita video penelitian baking sangat menginsipirasi.
Dari beberapa jenis metode sponge starter, mengapa memilih poolish? Saya lebih nyaman pakai metode Biga, dengan 40% total tepung di tahap starter sponge, 60% sisanya di main dough.
Miss Novita, apa efeknya yudane dikombinasikan dengan sponge method, bukankah itu sama bread improver alami?
saya prefer roti tawar dengan yudane daripada sponge starter, tetapi pembuatan roti manis asia prefer dengan sponge starter daripada yudane, yudane pada roti manis asia menghasilkan kulit roti sedikit tekstur chewy yang kurang disukai orang sini (Yogyakarta).
1. Biga and Poolish beda. Salah satu adalah karena hidrasi lebih tinggi, proses lebih cepat.
2. Beda Tangzhong dan Poolish. Tangzhong/yudane lebih ke proses fisika, sedang poolish lebih mengarah ke proses kimiawi. Poolish memberi protease alami, sehingga melunakkan adonan, kebalikan dari tangzhong, dan itu yang kita cari sebagai penyeimbang. Karena fermentasi lama, poolish memberi aroma dan rasa yang lebih enak. Karena penghancuran protein, poolish memberi lebih banyak amino acids untuk dipakai pada reaksi Maillard.
3. Kalau pakai yudane dan kulit roti menjadi chewy, hmm, mungkin proses pembuatannya harus diperiksa ulang, tangzhong/yudane bekerja melalui gelatinisasi, ada baik konsepnya dikuasai sebelum dipraktekin.
I'm using flour strengthener enzyme in my recipe, should I use it in Tangzhong and Poolish ?
Young lady, you are so impressive. I say part physicist and part baker? Enjoy your videos.
hi serephine ....i m rozells a baker ..can i used this recipe ans incorperate straight dough method meanig shaping after mix
Hi. Can i use this method for cinnamon rolls and ensaymadas? 😊
What type of oven did you use? I tried the recipe and it's very delicious but doesn't look the same as yours. Thanks for the video 🥰
It's a very simple oven, with top, bottom heat, max temp. 250°C, without fan etc
Dear Novita , thank you for your master classes related to T.Z. I appreciate them a lot. Please let me know if I can use this recipe to make dinner rolls shaping them in the same way you do for burger buns , but smaller ( let's say 30 or 40 grams ). Thanks and regards from Ecuador,
Yes, of course you can do that.
Hi Seraphine. Using Tangzhong and Poolish in the same dough recipe is a great thing. I have tried this with a big success. But I'm facing a little issue here. When making a small piece of dough like from 600g of flour following recommended ratios there is a little water left to make a Poolish (70g). The question is: May I use milk to make the Poolish? Thanks for the answer.
Hello.. I have a question, what if we were to reduce the total hydration since my flour is not strong enough to take the recommended hydration.. will it effect the polish and tangzong texture and thereby impact the final outcome negatively..
Hi Seraphine, thank you for sharing your knowledge. Do you have recipe for 1000gms Bread Flour? Hope you can share us with the said amount of flour. Thank you!
You can use the baker's percentage to scale up.
for this recipe, how much protein content is in the flour?
Thank you for this video!
Instead of bread flour, would (1) white whole wheat flour also work? How about (2) organic wheat? If yes, does the water % for either have to be adjusted ... and if so, how much?
Alternatively, would a combination of white whole wheat with AP, or bread flour with AP also work? Adjustment of water % as well?
Apology for the many Qs. Thank you again!
Hello,
If I have active dry yeast, how should I use it for this recipe since it needs to be activated in water first and then use it
I am a bit confused as to how to go about it with active dry yeast
Use a little bit of milk from the final dough to activate the yeast, and add it all in once they are active.
Hi Novita, i love all of you videos. one advice please, i tried to follow the process explained in this video with regard to use Tangzhong and Poolish i noticed the following ...if the main recipe is based on around a total amount of 500 gram of flour, using the stand mixer for around 12 mins is enough to give a great dough ...however, if i doubled the receipe to be based on a total of 1000 gram of flour, i found 12 mins mixer is leading to the same good quality of dough. do you think i should extend the mixing time?
No, instead take a small sample and do a windowpane test, if the dough passes the test, it's done kneading.
thanks a lot, I just realized that i made a typo ..as |I wanted to saye ..12 mins with 1Kg of four did NOT lead the same good quality of dough ...this is why i was asking if i should consider extending the kneading time ? sorry for the confusion i made
@@NovitaListyani
In that case yes, extend the mixing for another 2 minutes and check windowpane again, 12 minute mixing with stand mixer is what happens on our machine, yours could be different, one thing to remember, once a Tangzhong dough reach its optimal state it can suddenly collapse due to its lower tolerance to over kneading, check regularly.
Seraphine, is it your studied opinion that adding the butter too early would inhibit the protein strand development, while adding it after it starts developing , the strand development is enhanced?
Fat plasticizes dough, it shortens the gluten strands (hence, it’s called shortening). An increase in the level of fat in the dough usually requires a decrease in the level of water, and vice versa. So, it makes sense to let the dough develop some gluten strands before we throw in the butter. At least that’s how we deal with it, having said that, some scientists have different observation on this. From Clyde E. Stauffer, Fats and Oils in Bakery Products, “The statement has been made that the presence of fat slows down development of gluten (lengthens the required mixing time), but in experiments both in the laboratory and in the plant this thesis has not been confirmed.” Also from Stauffer, up to 5% of fat in the dough produces optimum effect on the texture of the bread, and loaf volume of bread increases as the amount of fat increase, up to about 5% (flour basis) and then remains roughly constant.
@@NovitaListyani
That was very helpful Seraphine. Thank you.
Knowing the 5% fat ceiling is useful.
I just made a nice soft sourdough sandwich bread. The way my regular crusty artisan loaf dough transforms into a soft pillow with the addition of a little fat and honey amazes and delights me.
BTW There is one thing i fear about your recipe. The temptation to eat the whole pan! It looks glorious.
is it okay to use milk instead of water for poolish and tangzhong?
Please, another question.
When making the tangzhong, is it ok to mix the water and flour in a pot first and then then stirring it over the stove until the thick mixture come together?
Thank you for your advice.
We used to do that a long time ago, later we found out the technique has many issues. You may want watch some of these videos to get more information on tangzhong/yudane:
ruclips.net/video/DjQ7EtvzK_w/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/Wz0PiKOWY1g/видео.html
ruclips.net/video/_mFYeiLzLpo/видео.html
Hi Novita can i use your bakers percentage for any recipe?
Hi!. For the poolish, are you using warm water or room-temperature water? Thanks
No need. Use warm water only if your room temperature is very cold, ours is 28°C at the moment:)
Also only have light aluminium pans with me.
How should i adjust my baking time if I am using the light aluminium pans
It probably won't affect the baking time too much, although it may take a little less time to fully bake. Baking time and settings usually depend more on the type of oven you use.
Hi.. can I skip the yeast om the final dough?
If your poolish is at its peak, you may skip the last yeast, but that may slow down the fermentation.
For poolish, is water at room temp? Thank you.
Yes
It we replaced the tangzhong with whole wheat flour and replaced sugar with honey, how much do we need to increase the hydration of the dough as you said in a previous video that whole wheat flour absorbs more water.
Also is your milk cold, warm, or room temperature
ruclips.net/video/FVE0zv6nam4/видео.html
Hai ka , apakah basic roti ini tahan atau tetap lembut kalau penyimpanan di kulkas ?
Roti sebaiknya jangan disimpan di kulkas di bagian bawah dengan suhu 4°C karena dapat mempercepat staling (terjadi proses retrogradation).
Kalaupun mau di masukkan ke kulkas harus di bagian freezer, supaya beku.
Nanti waktu mau makan, tinggal dipanaskan ulang dalam keadaan beku dan kalau kering bisa disemprot sedikit air supaya tetap lembut.
@@NovitaListyaniterima kasih ka, aku sudah mencoba resepnya dan hasilnya lembut dan type teksture yang aku cari. Dan apakah ada saran kalau poolish yeast nya aku ganti dengan sourdogh starter ( levain) kira kira perhitungan perbandingannya berapa ya ka yang pas untuk resep yang sama.?
Is this bread chewy? I love chewy bread.
Hi Seraphine,
I am in the process of making this bread,
I used half the ingredients & i am kneaded the dough by hand.
My dough is not able to form gluten even after autolyse. I cannot do stretch & fold also.
Could you please suggest what might have gone wrong in my method?
You're my favorite....❤
thanks!
Can Tagzhong be made in the microwave? Can it be made with infusion water, fruit juices, coffee or tea or is it best to just add the flavors to the bread dough and not the Tangzhong?
Good afternoon.
I'm using google translate, I don't speak English.
I'm Brazilian, I'm 60 years old, I want to learn how to make bread, I have difficulty with math, it was difficult but I understood that the initial weight was 240g and not 425g.
As I don't have a mixer, I'm going to make the bread by kneading the dough on the table.
I don't know how long to knead but it will work.
Could you explain? How do I bake bread in the homemade electric oven?
I'm not sure how high on the grill I should place the bread to get a good result?
Thanks for sharing.
I wish God bless your life, your studies and your family.
A hug from Brazil
To know the kneading is done, test it with a simple windowpane test. Baking information for this bread can be found here 21:51
@@NovitaListyani thanks
Pls can u share cup measurements
Could be completely stupid question, but if I fill these with something(cheese, cream etc) will it mess with the end result? They look so...perfect, I wouldn't want to mess them up :D
Additional ingredients should be added at the final shaping to avoid excessive interference with the gluten development.
@@NovitaListyani thank you!
Will it be ok if I half the whole recipe including the tang zhong and poolish
Yes, you can do that
Not sure what happened with my Tangzhong made it three times once on the stove and chilled over night but the gel never got nearly as thick. Weighed ingredients and used boiled water for the two attempts and stove method for third. Bread Flour is 12.7% King Arthur Flour Brand
That happens to me as well, and I've been cooking and baking for a good while.
I think, I'm the case of the stove top, that it's a case of the tangzhong not coming up to temp (65C) for long enough. And the reason I say this is because when I've made this with boiled water, here in Wisconsin, using an actual ceramic teapot to measure and pour the boiling water, I actually preheated the teapot with boiling water then threw it out when the tangzhong water was ready to be done. I did this because our kitchen has been cold (65F) since Oct 31st when it snowed! It was almost soft, but gelled enough to be cut into strips that I added to the dough in the stand mixer.
Just my theory, anyway.
Oh, and I'm using KA Unbleached AP flour. I'm on a really tight budget... 😢
Hi what water temperature when making Poolish (cold or warm)?
We live in a tropical climate so we use room temperature water at 28°C Celsius, but if your climate is very cold, you may want to use warm water, as well as put the poolish in a warmer spot.
@@NovitaListyani Thanks, I live in Tasmania. very cold now.
It's me too. I have a question. What are the proportions of all ingredients when the total weight is increased by 2 or 3 times?
In the description box, you will find Baker's percentage at the right side of the ingredient list. You can use this percentage to scale up or scale down the recipe. Watch this short video for an example ruclips.net/user/shortsb2P9UVxCce8
It's not rising. What did I do wrong?
Try but failed. Don’t know why didn’t raise up to double in size. I used hand kneading. Thanks 🙏
Hi! May I ask what is meant by “Milk Water Replacement 24.8%”? Does it mean if I want to use water instead of milk, I should use 24.8% of water? I want to make this dairy free so will be substituting the butter with olive oil instead. Also learnt how to make fruit yeast water from your channel so I’ll be using it in the poolish instead of instant yeast and omitting the yeast in the main dough. Thank you for teaching me so much!! Can’t wait to bake this loaf (:
Milk water replacement means the amount of water replaced by milk. So, if you want to get rid of the milk, you need to add this amount of water to the dough to maintain the hydration. For more information: ruclips.net/video/qdOHmdTTs24/видео.html
Also to substitute butter with olive oil, you add 3/4 the amount of butter with olive oil.
Yes, you can use the poolish as your levain, but the fermentation will take a lot longer, but I guess you know the drill, that's where the flavor comes from. Additionally the texture may be significantly different.
Thank you for the reply! Yes I love the smell of the bread using the yeast water poolish. Do you think if I omit the sugar in the recipe, will it yield a hard crust like that of an artisan sourdough bread? I want a soft Asian style bread but I’ve found that even adding just 15g of sugar for a loaf bread of this size makes the bread too sweet. Not sure if it’s due to the sugars in the fruit yeast water (I’m using raisins)? So I’m hoping just adding the oil will be enough to yield a soft sandwich loaf
Getting a hard crust on the bread is less about the sugar content, than it is about the baking temperature and the hydration of the dough. If you are using fruit yeast water made of raisins, you can lower the sugar level. The 6% sugar, baker's percentage, is supposed to support the instant yeast activity for at least 3 hours, since you are not using instant yeast and raisins contain a fair bit of sugar, you can cut it down, you'll just need to be patient with the slow fermentation.
That's interesting! My usual bulk fermentation is 3hrs, and final proof is 2hours in a 20x10x10cm loaf tin at 31-32C (Singapore). Pretty used to the long fermentation times now. I'm adapting your recipe to make it dairy free, could you see if it looks ok please?
Total flour: 350g (20x10x10cm loaf tin)
Yudane:
70g bread flour (20%)
84g boiling water (I'm using a 1:1.2 ratio so that I can have more water in the main dough due to mixer problems)
Poolish:
105g bread flour (30%: using a higher proportion since I'm not adding any more yeast into the main dough)
105g raisin/dates yeast water
Main dough:
180g bread flour
6.3g salt (1.8%)
19g olive oil (5.3%: 3/4 of your 7.1% as advised)
64g water (should have been 87g based on 24.8% but since I increased the poolish to 30%, I deducted the additional water that went there)
I think I probably messed up some of the % but just a rough guide. Thank you!
The recipe looks perfect to me, around 71% hydration, you need to pay attention to the poolish because that's where all your flavors come from, bear in mind that overnight Yudane will be the only derivative ingredient that give you the natural sweetness and umami, good luck!
How important is the windowpane test? I dont want to overwork the dough, but i dont think ive ever made a bread that passed it 😅
The windowpane test is meant to gauge the gluten development of the dough, if you're having trouble with it, it could be that the dough hasn't been kneaded/mixed for long enough or the dough could need a minute to relax before being tested.
@@NovitaListyani yes, I ended up kneading it for 15 more minutes (not sure about the speed, I'm using a bread machine, not a stand mixer) and that was what it needed, the bread turned out great :) Thank you so much!
What happened to the egg?
Hey Novita! Great video as always, you're an inspiration to me as a baker myself.
If it's not too much to ask, would you mind reviewing a recipe of mine that I had developed? Please don't feel obliged to do so, I just think it'd be nice to have someone knowledgeable to see it.
Cheers.
Hmm I am not sure I understand what recipe that you are talking about. Maybe if you post it here I can have a look.
@@NovitaListyani Oh in that case, here it is!
Yudane:
Flour [20% of total flour] : [216g]
Water [40% of total water] : [173g]
Milk [40% of total milk]: [43g]
Total dough:
Flour 100%: 1080g
Water 40%: 432g
Milk 10%: 108g
Milk powder 5%: 54g
Eggs 15%: 162g
Sugar 20.4%: 220g
Instant yeast 2%: 22g
Butter 30.6%: 330g
Final Dough:
Flour: [865g]
Water: [259g]
Milk: [65g]
Milk Powder : [54g]
Eggs: [162g]
Sugar : [220g]
Instant Yeast : [22g]
Butter: [330g]
Hmmm, I am not quite sure what to say, this is a recipe way beyond the limits of ingredients in what I'd make. It reminds me of a brioche but the egg content is quite low for that.
@@NovitaListyani yes! A brioche is what I had in mind, but I find it to be a little bit too rich for our liking.
Why no egg? What size loaf pan would this require if baking into a sigle loaf?
Sometimes we use eggs, sometimes we don't, there's really no reason why :) As for the size of the loaf pan to use, read the information in the description, use the baker's percentage to scale the recipe up or down to suit the loaf pan you have. Watch this short video: ruclips.net/user/shortsb2P9UVxCce8 for more information.
@@NovitaListyani FYI - I divided the final dough into three rolls and put into a 10"x5" loaf pan and baked for 35 minutes - came out perfect! Thanks for the ultimate recipe!
Hey ma’am, this isn’t a beginner bread, is it?? Did you say 45 minutes in a mixer?
4 to 5 minutes, before butter, another 5 to 6 minutes after that. You can turn on subtitles or read the transcript. No dough should be kneaded with a stand mixer or by hand for 45 minutes. This bread shouldn't be that hard to make :)
Español por favor
Puedes usar el botón CC para traducir automáticamente al español.
Why is there no Hebrew translation for your videos?
will learn Hebrew someday, not so sure we can trust the google translator for the subs.
Your description of ingredients is very hard to understand...using % is terribly wrong...using grams, ml, cups or tablespoon would have been perfect..
. Your recipe and demo though I'm sure is good info...thanks
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baker_percentage
That's yudane, not tangzhong
ruclips.net/video/_mFYeiLzLpo/видео.html
45 MINUTES IN A MIXER?????
4 to 5 minutes before butter, 5-6 minutes after that.
your eyes look swollen, please rest well so you can make more great educational videos!
Haha, at the time, I liked to stay up late researching and would sacrifice sleep. I have a better rest schedule now, so don't worry ;)