A few of problems here: Firstly, suggestions for alternative ways to earn Conclave rewards have been made a lot, and the vanishingly few Conclave players will simply outright refuse to even entertain the notion. There exists no compromise in this regard. You're going to have to simply disregard Conclave players with any change you make. Secondly, your proposal has the same issue as "let me play as the Stalker" - you're introducing a non-optional PvP aspect to PvE. Assuming player-made spectres can actually meaningfully challenge players (which they can't, more on that in a bit), you're essentially screwing over another player who never opted into PvP. Remember feedback around the Wolf of Saturn Six? Pablo Alonso thought he's made the Wolf pretty weak, and yet he was completely roadblocking regular players. I lost a friend (he quit the game) over that event since not only was the Wolf outright killing him, the Wolf minions were way too tough for him with lower-level gear, as well. This is essentially what you're proposing, and I don't think it'll be very well-received. Finally, the way Spectres work isn't really a good fit for this. Currently, they completely disregard mods, using only basic Warframe and weapon stats. This makes them effectively inert in higher-level content and - crucially - against any even halfway-decent player build. Compare this with On-call Crew, who do use player weapon stats and are absolutely DEVASTATING if given decent gear. I gave mine a pretty maxed-out Corinth Prime and she can troll Steel Path enemies. So standard Spectres are way too weak to be meaningful, but letting Spectres use mods would make them hideously oppressive for the majority of the playerbase. The kind of build a no-lifer like myself with 4000+ hours can put together would essentially prevent low-to-mid level players from engaging with the game. PvP in PvE games has to be contained within explicitly opt-in settings. I'm not opposed to a Pokemon style Spectre battle arena at all. It sounds like fun. I absolutely don't want to see that extended over random innocent players who just wanted more Orokin Cells.
What if we limit it to dark sectors? Maybe have them spawn on wave 9, 14, 19, etc. Also maybe do some sorta jerry-rigged matchmaking based on SP planet unlocks or 'if using advanced mods, can only show up on SP'. Or steel path already has a system in place for that: so just replace the current invaders with player-specter invasions.
@@sensha5470 As long as it's explicitly opt-in, you should be fine. Unfortunately, doing it this way virtually guarantees it'll be as dead as regular PvP. Dark Sectors used to be a sort of PvP by proxy of clans controlling nodes. I think we've been in armistice over that for the better part of a decade, and certainly before I started playing. The problem with PvP (especially in a PvE game) is that people just don't want to engage in it, so you're in kind of a no-win situation. The only way I can see this working is if you turn it into a literal Pokemon game mode. That is to say - you design your own Spectres from equipment you own and battle them against other people's Spectres in some kind of AI vs. AI mode. I was going to cite MyBrute or Angel Legion, but I'm not sure anyone even knows what those are, so... maybe think Raid: Shadow Legends. You throw one or more Spectres in an AI-controlled battle against another team of AI-controlled Spectres another player made. Winner gets rewards, loser gets some progress. You can do this entirely autonomously, or you can let one player "challenge" another players' Spectres with some limited degree of control. That's essentially how "PvP" in Angel Legion works. The attacking player gets to use items and "command moves" while the defending player isn't even present. Their AI is fighting on their own. That way, you could passively farm for progress. Make a powerful enough team and earn rewards for being undefeated, or go on the offensive and defeat other teams to earn rewards. That could work. Either way - I'd recommend taking this suggestion to the official forums, General Feedback. You'll get a lot of feedback there, though you may also have to deal with assholes who just want to be contrarian. Up to you.
While I still like the idea of running across specters of other players in missions it does have a lot of problems with it. What I really want is for conclave to get it's own type of arcane dissolution.
As someone who has maxed out conclave standing, the syandana blows(unrealistic amount of work to get it to glow at all times) and the only real thing of value is the skins and nothing else. there are 2 realistic ways to max it out, 1 boosting with a friend or alt and 2 using the most OP loadout and steamrolling randoms that are trying to pvp for fun as there are horribly OP weapons. It's not hard whatsoever to get max rank its just time consuming and requires patience. the main reason people dont have the rewards is because its simply not worth the effort for skins for very select weapons and the second they release alternate ways to get those skins people no longer would want them anyway as they lose all their perceived prestige so in my opinion you would be better off to just boost to max rank and get those uncommon skins rather than somehow convince DE to redesign the whole conclave system or add some nonsense to make them easier to get screwing over the poor guys that conclaved legit to get them. It's not hard whatsoever lol, conclave being dead isnt really a valid excuse if you only care about the skins. The idea behind this video is fine it's just this is a PvE game and most would rather want DE to spend time developing new cool things than rework an already reworked PvP system (it was way worse before) that only a very few select people are interested in to begin with.
Conclave is actually a super simple fix. They just need to rip Khal and whats-his-buckets from New War, give it a Corpus V Grineer paint job, and * *muah* * done.
my one experience playing conclave that i remember was getting sniped from someone i never saw the entire game about 3 years ago. i wish they'd rework the system away from direct pvp because of how inherently unbalanced it is. equal loadouts, a gungame where you're assigned a weapon and told to kill, anything other than what it is now, lol. having a stalker-inspired specter attack you in addition to the eximus spawns would be sick, esp if it had their username as a bossbar. (or maybe 'play as the enemy' like in dying light? so that things would be more telegraphed and predictable for the invaded player)
I would like to suggest a caveat: limit these specters to dark sector missions. Also, flag various points of progress (steel path planet unlocks, for example) to restrict them, and it prioritized specters on the same level as the highest in the current squad. That way an endgame player's specter can't attack someone whose barely in Jupiter.
I was one of the open beta players that used the first conclave. I played it a lot, and the dark sectors pvp fights. Was good times i have to say, after conclave rework i just farmed and let all the things get dirty on my inventory, i have all the cosmetics. But i will never touch conclave again, is garbage.
I dont think the development cycle of warframe allows for any small reworks of conclave or any other "forgoten content", the only way is a major rework of the whole thing. How about a pvp gamemode with drifter like mechanics? Striped down movement and preset weapons and skills so it wont be broken and exploited? I dont think thats something worth working on tho... Maybe add to conclave the 2d fighter xd
As someone that grinded all of them in PvP while you enjoyed PvE absolutely NO, go and earn them there's an entire discord full of people to play conclave with
@@savagesaxon9743 Most of the "toxicity" comes from PvE players coming into PvP matches with exploits and broken/bugged stuff. Because DE can't be arsed to fix their game. And it the opposite, Conclave is where you can find actual friends for your gaming life. Nothing you'll find in spamming lvl 20 fissure missions.
@rudirudirudi3263 the fact you resort to "level 20 fissure missions" tells me you are just bad at the game 🤣 conclave has always been toxic and that's why no one touches it. Once they fix it so people can't abuse spawns and do corny camping spots and not spam chat with bs people will touch it. For now it's filled with people who need to touch grass
New Loka is the reason of this vid 😂
A few of problems here:
Firstly, suggestions for alternative ways to earn Conclave rewards have been made a lot, and the vanishingly few Conclave players will simply outright refuse to even entertain the notion. There exists no compromise in this regard. You're going to have to simply disregard Conclave players with any change you make.
Secondly, your proposal has the same issue as "let me play as the Stalker" - you're introducing a non-optional PvP aspect to PvE. Assuming player-made spectres can actually meaningfully challenge players (which they can't, more on that in a bit), you're essentially screwing over another player who never opted into PvP. Remember feedback around the Wolf of Saturn Six? Pablo Alonso thought he's made the Wolf pretty weak, and yet he was completely roadblocking regular players. I lost a friend (he quit the game) over that event since not only was the Wolf outright killing him, the Wolf minions were way too tough for him with lower-level gear, as well. This is essentially what you're proposing, and I don't think it'll be very well-received.
Finally, the way Spectres work isn't really a good fit for this. Currently, they completely disregard mods, using only basic Warframe and weapon stats. This makes them effectively inert in higher-level content and - crucially - against any even halfway-decent player build. Compare this with On-call Crew, who do use player weapon stats and are absolutely DEVASTATING if given decent gear. I gave mine a pretty maxed-out Corinth Prime and she can troll Steel Path enemies. So standard Spectres are way too weak to be meaningful, but letting Spectres use mods would make them hideously oppressive for the majority of the playerbase. The kind of build a no-lifer like myself with 4000+ hours can put together would essentially prevent low-to-mid level players from engaging with the game.
PvP in PvE games has to be contained within explicitly opt-in settings. I'm not opposed to a Pokemon style Spectre battle arena at all. It sounds like fun. I absolutely don't want to see that extended over random innocent players who just wanted more Orokin Cells.
What if we limit it to dark sectors? Maybe have them spawn on wave 9, 14, 19, etc.
Also maybe do some sorta jerry-rigged matchmaking based on SP planet unlocks or 'if using advanced mods, can only show up on SP'.
Or steel path already has a system in place for that: so just replace the current invaders with player-specter invasions.
@@sensha5470 As long as it's explicitly opt-in, you should be fine. Unfortunately, doing it this way virtually guarantees it'll be as dead as regular PvP. Dark Sectors used to be a sort of PvP by proxy of clans controlling nodes. I think we've been in armistice over that for the better part of a decade, and certainly before I started playing. The problem with PvP (especially in a PvE game) is that people just don't want to engage in it, so you're in kind of a no-win situation.
The only way I can see this working is if you turn it into a literal Pokemon game mode. That is to say - you design your own Spectres from equipment you own and battle them against other people's Spectres in some kind of AI vs. AI mode. I was going to cite MyBrute or Angel Legion, but I'm not sure anyone even knows what those are, so... maybe think Raid: Shadow Legends. You throw one or more Spectres in an AI-controlled battle against another team of AI-controlled Spectres another player made. Winner gets rewards, loser gets some progress.
You can do this entirely autonomously, or you can let one player "challenge" another players' Spectres with some limited degree of control. That's essentially how "PvP" in Angel Legion works. The attacking player gets to use items and "command moves" while the defending player isn't even present. Their AI is fighting on their own. That way, you could passively farm for progress. Make a powerful enough team and earn rewards for being undefeated, or go on the offensive and defeat other teams to earn rewards. That could work.
Either way - I'd recommend taking this suggestion to the official forums, General Feedback. You'll get a lot of feedback there, though you may also have to deal with assholes who just want to be contrarian. Up to you.
While I still like the idea of running across specters of other players in missions it does have a lot of problems with it. What I really want is for conclave to get it's own type of arcane dissolution.
As someone who has maxed out conclave standing, the syandana blows(unrealistic amount of work to get it to glow at all times) and the only real thing of value is the skins and nothing else. there are 2 realistic ways to max it out, 1 boosting with a friend or alt and 2 using the most OP loadout and steamrolling randoms that are trying to pvp for fun as there are horribly OP weapons. It's not hard whatsoever to get max rank its just time consuming and requires patience. the main reason people dont have the rewards is because its simply not worth the effort for skins for very select weapons and the second they release alternate ways to get those skins people no longer would want them anyway as they lose all their perceived prestige so in my opinion you would be better off to just boost to max rank and get those uncommon skins rather than somehow convince DE to redesign the whole conclave system or add some nonsense to make them easier to get screwing over the poor guys that conclaved legit to get them. It's not hard whatsoever lol, conclave being dead isnt really a valid excuse if you only care about the skins. The idea behind this video is fine it's just this is a PvE game and most would rather want DE to spend time developing new cool things than rework an already reworked PvP system (it was way worse before) that only a very few select people are interested in to begin with.
Conclave is actually a super simple fix. They just need to rip Khal and whats-his-buckets from New War, give it a Corpus V Grineer paint job, and * *muah* * done.
my one experience playing conclave that i remember was getting sniped from someone i never saw the entire game about 3 years ago. i wish they'd rework the system away from direct pvp because of how inherently unbalanced it is. equal loadouts, a gungame where you're assigned a weapon and told to kill, anything other than what it is now, lol.
having a stalker-inspired specter attack you in addition to the eximus spawns would be sick, esp if it had their username as a bossbar. (or maybe 'play as the enemy' like in dying light? so that things would be more telegraphed and predictable for the invaded player)
I would like to suggest a caveat: limit these specters to dark sector missions.
Also, flag various points of progress (steel path planet unlocks, for example) to restrict them, and it prioritized specters on the same level as the highest in the current squad.
That way an endgame player's specter can't attack someone whose barely in Jupiter.
as a conclave player I like this idea as a plus mode but there is no chance that it could replace pvp because an AI will never move like a player
I see you're a man of culture aswell.
I think this is awesome idea ! I had a similar idea too.
I was one of the open beta players that used the first conclave. I played it a lot, and the dark sectors pvp fights. Was good times i have to say, after conclave rework i just farmed and let all the things get dirty on my inventory, i have all the cosmetics. But i will never touch conclave again, is garbage.
I have not touched conclave in so many years, I played it back in 2013 got crapped on didn't play again.
i saw someone with the conclave syandana the other day. asked how he got it and he never responded :/
not gonna happen, because that one person will say this is disrespectful to those who did it.
Give them an exact copy of it but add something else to it. Like an emblem or give it even more flare than the normal one
@@omenemo168 i wish
ye i woulnt mind getting alternate way for pvp :|
I dont think the development cycle of warframe allows for any small reworks of conclave or any other "forgoten content", the only way is a major rework of the whole thing. How about a pvp gamemode with drifter like mechanics? Striped down movement and preset weapons and skills so it wont be broken and exploited? I dont think thats something worth working on tho... Maybe add to conclave the 2d fighter xd
Clickbait bs . I seriously thought this was an actual thing and not some ideas.
As someone that grinded all of them in PvP while you enjoyed PvE absolutely NO, go and earn them there's an entire discord full of people to play conclave with
Lmfao this is why no one plays conclave the small player base it does have is toxic as hell 😂 it is the cess pool of warframe and everybody knows it
@@savagesaxon9743 Most of the "toxicity" comes from PvE players coming into PvP matches with exploits and broken/bugged stuff.
Because DE can't be arsed to fix their game.
And it the opposite, Conclave is where you can find actual friends for your gaming life.
Nothing you'll find in spamming lvl 20 fissure missions.
@@rudirudirudi3263 preach brother
@rudirudirudi3263 the fact you resort to "level 20 fissure missions" tells me you are just bad at the game 🤣 conclave has always been toxic and that's why no one touches it. Once they fix it so people can't abuse spawns and do corny camping spots and not spam chat with bs people will touch it. For now it's filled with people who need to touch grass
@@savagesaxon9743 or you know? You can always chill a little