Hello everyone! We would like to make a correction about one of the mechanics described in the video. If the recon mode timer simply runs out, the reserved time will NOT become available to you again. As you fly in recon mode, the reserved time will go down. Once it ends you will either go back to travel mode or continue staying in recon mode if you have any extra time outside of the reserved time.
WG einfachste Lösung ist minimap spotting und es nicht noch mehr zu verkomplizieren weil das was ihr macht rafft kein Mensch und diese Änderung werden zu noch mehr Frustration in der Community führen aber wenn ihr das Spiel unbedingt an die Wand fahren wollt damit viel Spaß mit dem shitstorm später und wie gesagt Mini Map spotting wie bei Radar das man als Flugzeugträger das schiff zwar schon sieht aber die Team mates es erst etwas später sehen das hat zum Beispiel mir korabley gemacht und es funktioniert da auch sehr gut also macht doch bitte das selbe system bei uns auch drauf
I have an even better idea then all this nonsense. Just simply have minimap spotting only? Just like we have in cyclones. Remove the ability for the fighter planes to spot ships entirely. Only spotter plane can spot ships. Just like the name "Spotter Plane". Buff the fighter planes ability to shoot down enemy planes. Since that's what its meant for. Fighting planes... What do you think about that? Isn't this so much simpler and less work......
Why??? That just makes it more complicated. Indirect spotting by planes as well as direct spotting from a certain distance to the nearest allied ship would be ideal for solving the problem.
Aircraft should not be able to spot for other ships. They already have this mechanic, where radar spots only for the radar ship for the first few seconds. The idea of WW2 ships firing their guns at something WW2 planes are spotting and calling in with radio is absurd.
@@aluisiousabsolutely agree removing spotting for team just a simple mechanic. CV have no risks to spot for team if squadron get damage, she bringing a new one, the other side any other ships risking own hp to spot ships for the team
@@aluisious They did that all the time. Do you not understand the concept of "artillery spotting"? Where not only do the aircraft report relative positions, but also the results of previous volleys? They have radios, compasses, navigational charts, and the farthest uninterrupted view. One of the chief jobs of British carriers was literally to spot submarines for their escorting destroyers to engage and destroy. Removing the capability for carriers to spot is moronic in the extreme.
@@squashiejoshie200000Excuse me, but...do you realise that during WW2 airplanes couldn't provide in real-time coordiantes of the enemy ships they spotted + their evolutions with a precision enough for fire-solution? They could only report to the battlegroup the rough position and course of the enemy ships. It was not like it worked as the modern targeting info exchange systems like CEC capability on AEGIS ships and carrier-based airplanes do, as E-2D Hawkeye AEW plane that provides to the ships a fire solution in the real-time.
@@fedorvaschilov I know they couldn't say "There's a ship 15,234 m at 43 degrees starboard from your bow." But an initial positional assessment, followed by adjustment guidance is how artillery observers operated for decades, and WAS well within their capability. They could accurately calculate the enemy ship's course and speed, using materials they had on board to within a few degrees. They could give an initial range estimate for the battlegroup, and an approximate bearing. And that's enough for a first shot. From there, they could give feedback of short/long ahead/behind. And with that, the friendly artillery could fire with eventual accuracy beyond line of sight. You don't need an aerial radar hooked in to a battlenet to get accurate enemy ship positions. Mk 1 eyeball and mk 2 compass work pretty well.
We've now had this version of CVs even longer than RTS CVs have been around and in all of that time, with thousands of now-deleted feedback posts on the forums, on reddit, on your Discord server (that you totally don't ignore) this is the best solution WG has come up with. Good job. Clap. Clap. Clap.
I'll be blunt, they have NO IDEA how to fix/implement Carriers now. Id honestly rather have RTS CV back with Nerfs to the plane weapon damage obviously. Torpedo Bombers doing DD levels of damage and CV Sniping where the only REAL problems with that system.
@@jaywerner8415 it more like they ego doesn't allow them to see what bad they did and what player asked is a good solution. they can only be "right" in every decision, player can't XD
Well, WG wants to nerf CVs and in the end they get a huge buff.... They are just unable or unwilling to do proper changes to their game. Anyway i don't care anymore, uninstalled the game and probably won't install it again. They had their chance with the 3rd CV Rework and yet they failed again (on purpose?)
So you're just gonna ignore the part where the planes are completely useless at high altitude, or the part where attack runs don't get their aircraft replaced so even a single shot down aircraft means a massive damage reduction. This is an overall _nerf_ to carriers.
Nah imagine a new game mode where CVS are just surface ships while planes aren't allowed and disabled imagine while being smoke while being better and stronger than a colbert
@@WorldofWarshipsOfficialChannel I received an Email to register for this public test and then I registered using my Wargaming Asia account. Is above given link different from that? If my registration is complete then what to do next, how will I receive next instructions?
If you were already registered, install an additional instance of the game client from the wargaming game launcher. Before you click install for world of warships, choose the option for public test in the top left.
"We're ready to listen to any feedback, unless it's feedback that says minimap spotting, because we hate it when the players have better and more simple ideas than we do."
I'm a bit late to comment as I've only recently come back to the game. I'm not a CV main but I dabble. I like the idea of changing plane altitude but there are too many conditional and situational things to be aware of in the first place and to then remember. Just keep it simple. Planes at low altitude have increased spotting and can make quick attacks, but receive increased AA damage and accuracy. Planes at medium altitude have standard spotting range and attack / aiming speed, and take default AA damage and accuracy. At high altitude spotting is reduced but so is AA damage and accuracy. - No AA immunity at any altitude. - Spotting works to some degree at all altitudes. - Adjust the spotting distances and AA values accordingly but don't make either useless. - Don't add timers for how long planes can fly at each altitude, it shouldn't be necessary.
This seems just to be making things needlessly more complicated than what they need to be. Similar effects could be achieved by simply tweaking what already exists by 1. Reworking AA damage among the different classes to promote cooperation between ship classes and incentivize it. (Giving Texas it's AA back would be nice too). 2. Tweaking the dmg, frequency, spotting range, effects of planes. Spotting an issue? Nerf the spotting range of the plane. Floods/fires happen too often? Nerf %/or damage. One CV can get too many attacks off too quickly? Reduce # of attacks or cooldown between attacks. Also, I thought you guys said CV players were too dumb to manage a manual DCP and planes? You now don't think that anymore? I can't wait to hop in the Graff again with manual secondaries now. That's going to be insane.
I can still remember when I and hundreds/thousands of others tried to give Wargaming useful feedback. Wargaming was, is and will never be critical of its own decisions, so feedback is unfortunately pointless. And this decision will be implemented as it is, regardless of what feedback comes in.
maybe the real solution would be to give reverse feedback ? like saying the solution is what the F WG want to make here, so they gonna do something else?
This just feels like the submarine conversation all over again in several ways 1) you have been receiving feedback for years about CVs - minimap only spotting for planes would address SO MUCH of the actual issues players have - but lets ignore that and create something way more complicated irrespective of what actual players are suggesting (other than a 'silent majority' who apparently exist and want something contrary to everyone else) 2) the submarine sunk cost fallacy Mark 2 - where you have now spent so much development time and effort on some cracked idea that it is getting implemented no matter what. I would ask that you PLEASE keep it simple, but that is apparently a very advanced concept that is difficult to execute
If they were worried about spotting. Just make a mechanic like in WoT that the radio-signal only reaches a certain range. So unless the friendly ship is within that range they don't get enemy position info from the planes.
A very complicated way to make CVs less effective. Is it really that to just make planes had minimap spotting. AA wise, i think it's good that the AA gets damage buff when getting focused down by the same planes, but i personally think that another issue with AA (and secondaries) is they tend to get destroyed easily by HE (especially UK BB's HE shells). Change it so they are the same like how primary armaments HP pool works
Did you expect anything less? At least CVs get a to actually do something with the CARRIER itself, a small victory but yeah. Can't wait for FLOOD of hate videos.
@@jaywerner8415Do with the ship? You already do if you are smart but most cv players are not. Moving a ship and firing gun can be fun but isn't a must. With the 3 modes now bad players become even more useless 😂 Will be a picnick for better players now when in CV. Same with the Bearn rework that makes the skip bombs spread out more. It only made the Bearn less playable for bad players.
@@dgray3771 making the game harder for casual/new players isnt good. it means less people will bother. it means its less fun for most people. and it means you'll deal with the uber cv players more often not less. these changes are awful for everyone involved.
@@hunter11220 It means that CVs will be more DMG focused. And the game will be far more lopsided due to the big difference between good and bad players. Now a bad CV players still provides spot. A okay CV players does DMG still and spot. But then any player who is weaker will not even bother spotting. Not care at all about the team. And simply be dropping on ships. It will cause serious unbalance because it's already unbalanced.
You guys are just trying to kill the game faster, First removed or RTS carriers, then Buffs to carriers, then subs, now this... Players are leaving like crazy and you do this dumb change.
@@SeeHunde man do u take a 40%wr player as a good example on how bad that class is?sub player is 90% consist of 40%-50% wr player. dont want to stats shaming but clearly there is someone btter for u to take advice than this player right?
@@fahmimike4999 okay so what you're saying is the MAJORITY (the people you'll most likely play against) are having worse win rates like i said, what's your point here??? of course there's still people with high win rates of course there's good players, but that's 10%, ONE out of TEN games you'll meet someone you're describing here, what a joke. you're just agreeing with me here blindly
MINIMAP ONLY SPOTTING!!! 3 words. Why do you guys always try to reinvent the wheel instead of trying the implement the simplest solution that the community has been saying since the original rework
@@bigdata2783 no, they dont. Minimap only spotting doesnt impact the direct damage output of the CV. It only limits what their teammates can do. Which is the entire point
Phase 1 : Carriers can no longer spot everything everywhere, but they get buffs, lots of buffs! Phase 2 : We decided to allow for 2.5 seconds of recon mode for every second in travel mode, so they can spot everything everywhere, and keep the buffs!
Dear commanders, we will implement a new system for the CV's, as we already mentioned we have carefully read your complaints and suggestions which we will ignore as we always do, the CV's will continue to be the most broken ship in the game but we don't care, and since a CV is not absurd enough currently, we have implemented that from now on the secondary guns can be used manually, enjoy it!
Not sure the game engine can take any more updates with your spaghetti coding introducing these convoluted mechanics to address issues present since your original CV rework. Feel like starting with mini-map only aircraft spotting would've given players something they actually want while freeing up resources to fix other issues plaguing the game (bugged artillery - shells still fall short while even aiming above targeted ships, getting stuck on invisible islands, radar/hydro through islands, subs, etc...)
I like the idea of carriers controlling their secondary guns fully now but they didn’t resolve the main issue of spotting, I’m a legends player so I don’t have to complain about that now since they actually did it where planes only spot on the minimap
It already just reduces the cool down between uses and nothing else. So I would imagine nothing is going to happen to it. It will still do the exact same mostly pointless thing.
Soooo, in summery you just made the Current CV system a little more Complicated, JUST to address "cv spotting". Although I will say that addition of the "attacking flight" HP is not lost on me (hopefully they actually get shot this time), and giving CV players something to do when controlling the Carrier itself is a BIG WIN for Carrier Gameplay. Although I will question WHY that wasn't the case the first-time round, kinda a no brainer. Guess you where just focused on the Plane side of things and kinda forgot about the ship (which for all purposes may as well have been a AIRSTRIP just outside the map). Welp, Ill take what little wins I can get for CV gameplay. Although I doubt anyone is gonna be overly thrilled about all of this.
they could have also let CV player control they ASW. ( also dream of a CV that has plane with support capability dropping ASW charge, but need to get back to ship to get a new charge)
@@hunter11220 You are clearly the kind of person WG is pandering too with Current CV gameplay then. Not one of those people who could handle 8 squadrons at once plus the CV itself. Not that I ever got the chance to get that far before RTS CVs got sacked. (did make it to tier 7 US Carriers though) Also its only Manual when you go back to the Carrier if I heard that correctly. So its only when you are NOT flying planes. Otherwise id imagine a AI will take over if your controlling your squadrons.
Most Aircraft Carriers do not have armor and camouflage, and some do not have main and auxiliary calibers at all (and there are even premium ones) - how are they supposed to do anything on the "front line"? They already killed Aircraft Carriers several patches, it's not them from the start of the game - but they can do something else. It's like fighting SPG in WOT. Get the class out of the way right then.
So far i'm not convinced this will make AA feel more impactful to other ship classes, with all the immunity, reduced damaged dipping etc. im very sceptical. And what about CVs like Nakimov? Aren't they disproportionatley benefitting from these changes through the damage reduction on initial attacks? Also the 15.6 Kilometer secondary Range seems absurd, compared to other secondary builds. Altough i like the idea of being able to control secondaries, that would be a cool feature for Battleships as well. Not sure if this is the answer everyone was hoping for WG, we'll see how the testing will turn out...
WE NEED THE RTS CVS BACK. They penalised solo players and rewarded team players, and you could clearly see that. In RTS mode on aircraft carriers you could clearly see that CAs and AA BBs with some teamplay did a lot and were rewarded, while yolo players in BBs etc were penalised, and that's how it should be and not this constant whining that the CVs or the BBs or whatever are too overpowered. So please remember that only we collectively as a community can force WG to fix the CVs and other issues and bugs, and if we do nothing then they will continue to do so and make us all suffer. So rise up and unite instead of fighting each other because we only have one true enemy in this situation and that is Wargaming and if Wargaming doesn't change then they shouldn't get more players for their game, they should lose the players.
i second this i never got to try RTS CV as a long time RTS enjoyer a video of RTS CV popping up on my feed was what got me to try WOWS in the first place but it turns out i was late i later ended up disappointed and became a battleship slugger instead
Why couldn't we just get mini-map spotting like when ships are in cyclone unless you were in a certain distance. Remove the ramp time to manaul AA and make it 360. Im pretty sure that would've made the community happy without adding a ridiculous amount of complexity to carriers, which was a reason RTS carriers were changed. While also srill neglecting to actually deal with the real problem you've unleashed being subs, who are faster and stealthier than dds, and almost zero methods of punishing them without running them down and hoping your depth charges land before the homing torpedo delete your hp bar.
This is going to make end match engaements where there is only a cv left on one team and a gunboat left on the other automatic wons for the gun boats Minimap spotting is the only chance that would have been needed
The design in general looks quite dumb. CVs keep having all the choices in every engagement and now they get to spend more time immune AA (or reduced damage), travel around the map faster and also get a way easier time defending themselves against gunboat DDs. Surface ships keep being NPCs, to be farmed by the angry sky gods.
The development team of NA, EU, Asia on PC is wants to be different than other teams to show off how rebellious they are. while everyone else is using minimap spotting for CV and hybrid , and this team just want to be different and develop a convoluted system. Out of all those options of CV balance, they choose the stupidest way to do it while they could choose a easy quick solution for this problem.
Make Atlanta Great Again! Some of the CLs need to go back to being supreme air denial tools. It should fall on the carrier player to recognize that a ship has amazing AA potential and is covering it's friendlies. DFAA changes seem....interesting. So I assume flak clouds are still a thing?
I like how they pretend to have had collected feedback from the community and that this "rework" is a result of collective feedback from the community. There is absolutely nothing in all of this nonsense suggested by the players. We wanted two things, we are not getting them and everything else is literally rejected by every single person.
That is adding a RIDICULOUS amount of complications none of which add to fun. I've a casual player since initial release and I like playing my CVs but..dang you may have just ended that. You'll never make the anti CV whiners happy till you get rid of CVs entirely so why not just let them opt out of games with CVs instead? there.. simple solution. Frankly I'd also like a CV vs CV game mode with escort ships and a divded map and maybe subs too. DONT make all game more complicated and less fun for the whiners.. just let them have their "Jutland 1946" battles by opting out of games with CVs...and everyones happy.. and you do a lot less work.
@@briangulley6027 fine..then I guess us CV types would mostly be fighting each other. but I imagine for the high stakes stuff.. gale league and clan battles.. the upper tier missions an promotions and of course for operations CVs players would still be around.
They could have just removed CV spotting, simple for the CV player, biggest complaint of the rest of the player base taken care of. But since they decided to make this very complicated half-arse fix instead, I think most CV players are not smart enough to understand and play with these. If they were tactially smart they'd be playing the other classes.
If you are even half smart, carriers wont be complicated to you cause similar mechanics are already in the game. And if CV spotting is such a problem play ships that have blind aircraft consumable.
Im really confused as to how this fixes anything. All it does is make it too complicated for qeaker players to operate a CV. Or to actually counter a CVs planes. You don't need to make it more fancy with 3 modes. What should be implemented is a max range for planes, so a carrier cannot attack all over the map. And also spotting should be a shared thing between ships in the same area. Again with a limit of maybe 30 km radius. It makes it so that ships have to be in the vicinity. Planes should have a max range "for return" meaning that your attack range gets limited. If you go out of range of your carrier your planes would ditch. And you lose them. I know this is hard to implement due to the ability to move your carrier close while your planes fly but cmon. If you can implement 3 modes with all kinds of differences than this is possible too.
I actually like this idea of limiting the carriers range, bc that's how it was in real life as well. Planes don't have infinite fuel. This would force the carrier to move into a closer position, making themselves more susceptible to being damaged, like every other class of ship. They have to risk their ship too. And it would stop them spotting the whole map I hate the fact that carriers in the current state can sit in complete safety on the other side of the map and I have absolutely nothing I can do to them until I can sail ALL the way across the map. I was in the Florida the other day, and at three quarters hp. The only ship left on the enemy team was the carrier who was on the other side of the map, and he sank me in TWO DROPS. Each of his drops took almost 20k off of me, and I had def AA running. I never had a snowballs chance in hell of getting a shot at him. If he had had to be within say, 20 km of me, I might've been able to find him and sink him.
@@Ashigaraa Realism - blind planes, loss of planes before attack? Are you talking about some of the very first planes in history that fell by themselves?
I am surprise you guys (WG) are not dumping the CV rework2 on the live server like your did with the sub updates. I wonder what you guys will break despite the closed testing.
Some Aircraft Carriers don't even have a "mention" of main and auxiliary caliber (even premium ones) - from this update their only purpose is to "stand in port"
It doesnt change the fact that CV can destroy enemy dds life, as far as I understand it as long they are in recon mode, everything stays the same. Same with the Patrol Fighters. That airplanes that die in attackmode are not replaced is a big nerf. The rework of priority sektor sounds like a bad remake. Instead that the ship has to turn a bit and use the right moment of the sector priority you just now have to press 1 button as soon the enemy planes are in your range. I mean, why no fully automate it? I dont think why you think its a good idea that the progress bar changes irreversibly. The point is that its very frustrating to get focused out not the fact that you get attacked at all. If the CV player attacks your ship, than does 10min. something else than attacks your ship again, thats totaly okey. That you have to use your defensive AA before the enemy is even in your range (so before 7km) sounds not so good, so you need to activate it when the enemy planes are still on high attitude, and on high attitude he doesnt even see you (so he will not attack you) or you are spottet from a different enemy (in this case they dont care if they loose spotting abilitys). I dont understand why you not just make the spotting like uboat spots so its only visibile on Minimap, that would fix every spotting issue. I mean with your change the spotting still is the same problem and is as annoying as it is now. The only thing changes that now the CV player can choose that he doesnt want to spot for more flightspeed.
This is just more problematic than before. All you had to do was switching to minimap spotting only and 70% of the problems would be fixed regarding CVs.
Will have to see how this plays out on the server, but initial impressions - it sooo unnecessarily complicated. You complicate the hell out of what could be simple solutiion - just change plane spotting to minimap spotting.
Just have a game mode that players can select to not play a battle with planes and subs. Give players the choice. If I wanted planes I would play WoWP.
With all the information shared so far this looks to be the great CV buff. As planes are now only vunerable to damage for 5-10s while attacking some of which is at reduced damage and still spot while being imune to damage while striking. All this update has done for surface ships is remove incidental spotting while massively improving the surviveability and therefore striking power of aircraft. and that's without talking about the busted recon mode (due to the insane recharge rate) and secondary improvements.
yo doe this mean that the graf zeppelin just go viable again i damn well hope so i miss the secondary beast days but manually firing the 150s? that shit be bussin
I am a player playing on aircraft carriers and I will soon be playing on the test client. As for the video and comments, I see that many players already see the same problem. Why do you complicate the game so much? You ruined the planes with rockets a few years ago instead of simply reducing their damage? Here I see a problem that your mechanics of changing altitude, flight and spotting will be very difficult for beginners to grasp. Players are already writing that they do less damage in battle, so I am afraid of how much this will affect Essex-class support aircraft carriers. I will agree with other commentators for now - You did not have to make such drastic changes.. could you not only reduce the damage? or maybe the spotting range of the planes? I will play battles on the test client and come back with a comment after the battles. In general, the idea of destroying the game with aircraft carriers is a very poor idea...
... I'm skeptical of this Update. It might work out, but I am going to hold off on opinions UNTIL I play the new version. As a CV player, I am worried.
I love we are getting proper manual 2ndaries. I hope that skill will become available for other surface ships to. Also manual AA would be a great addition.
Yes you could be nuked, but your own CV would protect and counter. "Just group up" actually meant something and could save you. You could build into AA and make your ship a no fly zone There was things you could do back then to protect yourself and your team. Limited planes meant they had to be smart and focus the weak points, the players thinking running off solo was a good idea, hugging the backline/map edges was a death sentence since there was no assistance to protect yourself. Island camping was less common because standing still in a non AA built ship was going to get you nuked. Nowadays, yes you wont get insta nuked, but you will be hounded by a CV and have nothing to even slightly deter them
Nice Job. guys! Are you going to send a direct refund payment to my credit card for all my premium CV or should I give you my bank details? Don't forget about inflation rate.
If you are going to change anything about CV's, just make them ships again. Make the CV's a bit more tanky, give them a large circle area that acts like a area of effect. Other ships within 5m, extend the range by another 5m outwards, and so on. Encouraging fleet movements, have the planes automated within this perimeter make attacks from spotted enemies maybe like 5-10m out? Could also have the player use an ability called helicopter navy repair teams as a buff/action on cooldown. It would be a support craft, ship, warship. This is World of Warships, and not Warplanes right?
Warplanes is much better at aircraft control mechanics than this - and there you can destroy enemy ships with impunity. Most of the games on the Aircraft Carrier now - lose one of the attacking links while the other one is leading the attack. Or just scout the enemies, getting a small amount of credits and experience. They already killed SPG in WOT like this. Aircraft Carriers, for the most part, do not have armor, camouflage, maneuverability, and some do not even have weapons - to be somewhere "near the front." They then need to either redo the entire class or take it out of the game.
No, it's not, because Graf Zeppelin always shot secondaries very accurately, even with autofire, so it's an indirect nerf to Graf Zeppelin that other CVs' secondaries are also accurate. And this patch is also a devastating nerf to Graf Zeppelin, that makes her Bombers unusable. But... She might be a little more efficient in PVE mode.
The defense of the thunderbolt is not enough against the anti-aircraft firepower of the enemy ship and often only one torpedo can be launched, can you do something about this?
controllable secondaries for CV's?! what are these guys smoking?! literally not having any other options apart from planes is what made CV's even remotely combatable
Well, that was clear as mud! I think a better and more simple solution would be to have the aircraft damaged during battle to not respawn and have that damage go on the carrier. You can play with the percentage of damage that the carrier takes and set a maximum damage the carrier takes from aircraft shot down but, it would be more of a real world situation and a lot easier to adjust. IRL, when the carrier loses all it's planes, all it has are it's guns to fight with. That would then push the carriers into the battle areas adding to the dynamic.
IRL arguments are a little vague when it comes to a game. You want the planes to be vulnerable to Ships like they were IRL? Would you also accept ships to be as vulnerable to Planes like they were IRL? You know, like, one AP Bomb to your arsenal and you're out? One well-placed bomb and your whole carrier is done for? IRL, the Carriers banned battleships from the naval war. But Wargaming has to keep the game "fair" (It will never be 100% fair for ANY side) so they have to make compromises.
Thats.... a bit harsh. Personally I wish damaged planes didn't INSTANTLY get fixed when they land on the CV. They should not COUNT as fresh planes and go into a hanger to repair (basically wait for them to respawn.)
@@beaugator I'd love to. I loved having my fighter squads out there back then with the old CV model. Felt like real CV tactics. Played my Kaga with..what was it...3?4? active fighter squadrons for Air superiority and protected my team mates from incoming bombers
@@jaywerner8415 They are not immediately repaired. You have a supply of planes + return from battle + "recovery time". This is clearly visible at the end of the battle. If you don't play yourself, watch the same broadcasts.
Guys. Give a toddler a bag of flour and a spoon - it will mess up the kitchen less than you are messing up this game.... There are ton of, easy to implent, easy to understand, and easy to live with comments here alone. If you implement this rework you really increase the learning curve of the game and keep new players from join/enjoying. Preferable I would rather like more of a RTS gameplay back, but understand the current concept. Please dont mess it up.
I see a lot of compaints here. Mainly because there are much easier solutions to combat the cv problems. But I actually like the sound of this. More options, more ways to play, more builds. I like the game being diverse and interesting. I'm willing to give this a go.
A lot of the complaints also seem to be getting to focused on the spotting aspect of this, and not taking a minute to realize this is Wargaming addressing a lot of the anti-CV arguments all at once. "It feels you can't mitigate the damage from CV attacks!" Okay so the attacking squad won't replace dead planes, shoot one down and you've just reduced the incoming damage. "CVs can attack you from anywhere with no risk!" Okay so we are reducing the effectiveness of CV aircraft and giving CVs the ability to use their guns, to heavily encourage CVs to move up to at least their "main gun range" so they will be closer to the front as well as be taking just as much risk as any other ship if played correctly. "DefAA feels worthless!" Okay so it's gonna increase your AA range and blind attacking squads if you activate it before they enter your AA range, giving you more interaction with the air squads. "That big mean CV keeps attacking me over and over again!" Okay well... don't be off on your own... but alright here's a passive bonus that will improve your AA if a CV attacks you a lot. Those are just what I remember from the video coming down into the comments, I'm sure there was more. The "easier solutions" don't actually address any of that. Mini-map spotting does nothing to change any of those things, and functionally wouldn't do anything. The RU server tested mini-map spotting and found it didn't work and reversed the change. So Wargaming is onto something with no doing it. As someone who enjoys CVs I'm not happy about these changes, at least not in a vacuum. If this is a sign that Wargaming is going to go through and give every class a balance pass to be more fun to play against, than I'll be quite happy, as it stands... The most average impact class is being nerfed because the highest impact classes are getting salty. Doesn't exactly seem fair to me.
Any update is good but the real problem is how inconvenient to understand any mechanics from in-game without googling since any critical info is not shown from tutorials. Info diff between vets and new players are already extremely huge and this will rip open the gap even more lmao
The Japanese CVS need a special rework especially their attack aircraft, because they suck. Love of how WG said the machine guns were to help the cv player know where they are aiming even though we already have the retical.
-The new AA feature for if you are being targeted by the CV is actually something reasonable tho i feel it should reset after awhile of not being Targeted (maybe after like 4 minutes idk) -The new DFAA is dumb tho DFAA already ruins squadrons i think the part where it blinds the planes should rather add a effect too the screen too make it difficult too see, rather than physically remove the ability too see them -The new Spotting i think battleships should stay spotted in high altitude spotting (it only makes sense) same with a cruiser firing its guns (maybe anything above 127 mm will be spotted) -The new recon mode could be interesting but i think the suggestion i made above could be something to make it a little better for everyone involved -Ability to manually control secondaries i hope it stays automatic unless i press
Well, if those DD's grow a brain they'll realise they get spotted far less themselves and might actually start spotting for you again. Seeing as.. well the friendly CV doesn't anymore. So they'll do so by accident
So, if I focus a flank with like 4 Ships which are given my team a hard time. This is considered a problem by WG ? All enemy ships will get automatic AA if they are close to each other, at around the same time. Which makes me unable to effectively help my team on that flank for the rest of the battle…. This mechanic sounds not like a good idea. Def AA will already be strong enough with 7km range on all ships.
WG did mention in the developer blog that the overlapping AA won't increase it's potency, which is.. magic i guess, because it should, if there is a bunch of ships grouped up together of course it should come at the cost of losing planes, but it seems like they already thought of people like you.
@yichenqiao8772 haha, not sure about zeppelin, as it's automatic secondary guns are most accurate already, by giving manual control probably won't be much difference in regards of accuracy, but a bit of extra range would be nice
You're gelding the CV-s with absurd changes. It makes no sense that ship classes should have the same effect on the battle, even closing the distance is masterstroke of reality denial.
![Ice On My Teeth - ATEEZ エイティーズ 에이티즈 [Music Bank] | KBS WORLD TV 241115](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/c-n92OgbbwA/mqdefault.jpg)
Hello everyone! We would like to make a correction about one of the mechanics described in the video. If the recon mode timer simply runs out, the reserved time will NOT become available to you again. As you fly in recon mode, the reserved time will go down. Once it ends you will either go back to travel mode or continue staying in recon mode if you have any extra time outside of the reserved time.
WG einfachste Lösung ist minimap spotting und es nicht noch mehr zu verkomplizieren weil das was ihr macht rafft kein Mensch und diese Änderung werden zu noch mehr Frustration in der Community führen aber wenn ihr das Spiel unbedingt an die Wand fahren wollt damit viel Spaß mit dem shitstorm später und wie gesagt Mini Map spotting wie bei Radar das man als Flugzeugträger das schiff zwar schon sieht aber die Team mates es erst etwas später sehen das hat zum Beispiel mir korabley gemacht und es funktioniert da auch sehr gut also macht doch bitte das selbe system bei uns auch drauf
I have an even better idea then all this nonsense. Just simply have minimap spotting only? Just like we have in cyclones.
Remove the ability for the fighter planes to spot ships entirely. Only spotter plane can spot ships. Just like the name "Spotter Plane".
Buff the fighter planes ability to shoot down enemy planes. Since that's what its meant for. Fighting planes...
What do you think about that? Isn't this so much simpler and less work......
Leave the game as it is a just go to hell
All you you guys had to do with just give planes mini map spotting and a problem would have been solved
I agree!
Honestly
Yeeesssss
"That would be too complicated for the playerbase to understand, so instead, here is our solution..."
Agreed
"Because players would not understand minimap only spotting"
I mean they’re not wrong, the playerbase is in fact dumb
I think this idea is even more confusing than explaining minimap spotting though
Why??? That just makes it more complicated. Indirect spotting by planes as well as direct spotting from a certain distance to the nearest allied ship would be ideal for solving the problem.
Aircraft should not be able to spot for other ships. They already have this mechanic, where radar spots only for the radar ship for the first few seconds. The idea of WW2 ships firing their guns at something WW2 planes are spotting and calling in with radio is absurd.
@@aluisiousabsolutely agree removing spotting for team just a simple mechanic. CV have no risks to spot for team if squadron get damage, she bringing a new one, the other side any other ships risking own hp to spot ships for the team
@@aluisious They did that all the time. Do you not understand the concept of "artillery spotting"? Where not only do the aircraft report relative positions, but also the results of previous volleys? They have radios, compasses, navigational charts, and the farthest uninterrupted view. One of the chief jobs of British carriers was literally to spot submarines for their escorting destroyers to engage and destroy. Removing the capability for carriers to spot is moronic in the extreme.
@@squashiejoshie200000Excuse me, but...do you realise that during WW2 airplanes couldn't provide in real-time coordiantes of the enemy ships they spotted + their evolutions with a precision enough for fire-solution? They could only report to the battlegroup the rough position and course of the enemy ships. It was not like it worked as the modern targeting info exchange systems like CEC capability on AEGIS ships and carrier-based airplanes do, as E-2D Hawkeye AEW plane that provides to the ships a fire solution in the real-time.
@@fedorvaschilov I know they couldn't say "There's a ship 15,234 m at 43 degrees starboard from your bow." But an initial positional assessment, followed by adjustment guidance is how artillery observers operated for decades, and WAS well within their capability. They could accurately calculate the enemy ship's course and speed, using materials they had on board to within a few degrees. They could give an initial range estimate for the battlegroup, and an approximate bearing. And that's enough for a first shot. From there, they could give feedback of short/long ahead/behind. And with that, the friendly artillery could fire with eventual accuracy beyond line of sight. You don't need an aerial radar hooked in to a battlenet to get accurate enemy ship positions. Mk 1 eyeball and mk 2 compass work pretty well.
As someone who olays both carriers and surface ships, this just seems hella nore confusing
We've now had this version of CVs even longer than RTS CVs have been around and in all of that time, with thousands of now-deleted feedback posts on the forums, on reddit, on your Discord server (that you totally don't ignore) this is the best solution WG has come up with.
Good job. Clap. Clap. Clap.
I'm a CV main that also plays surface ships, and I agree. This just made everything more confusing and am happy that I'm taking a break from WoWs
I'll be blunt, they have NO IDEA how to fix/implement Carriers now. Id honestly rather have RTS CV back with Nerfs to the plane weapon damage obviously. Torpedo Bombers doing DD levels of damage and CV Sniping where the only REAL problems with that system.
I have been taking a break from WoWS for almost 5 years to see if they ever going to fix CV. Looks like this break will take longer than I thought...
@@jaywerner8415 it more like they ego doesn't allow them to see what bad they did and what player asked is a good solution. they can only be "right" in every decision, player can't XD
Why i feel like this is just even worse than before 😂🙈
Because it is. Can't imagine how it would feel to play like this on console, on a controller💀
I have a feeling that it might break something like the support consumables in clan battle
I'm sure they just hate carriers
Well, WG wants to nerf CVs and in the end they get a huge buff....
They are just unable or unwilling to do proper changes to their game.
Anyway i don't care anymore, uninstalled the game and probably won't install it again. They had their chance with the 3rd CV Rework and yet they failed again (on purpose?)
recon mode just spotting but can hit by AA? then im just spamming F7 in game instead going to recon mode lol
15km secondary CV's and literally invulnerable planes at high altitude,just what the playerbase asked for
So you're just gonna ignore the part where the planes are completely useless at high altitude, or the part where attack runs don't get their aircraft replaced so even a single shot down aircraft means a massive damage reduction.
This is an overall _nerf_ to carriers.
lol now my nakhimov is also a smolensk
And Remember Midway has a RING of 127mm cannons lining each side of the ship. Thats what 8 to 10 cannons per side.
Hakuryu --> harugumo😂
Graf zeppelin sails again
Nah imagine a new game mode where CVS are just surface ships while planes aren't allowed and disabled imagine while being smoke while being better and stronger than a colbert
How to take part in public tests of these changes?
Honestly, minimap only spotting by planes would have been better.
You can register by pressing a button in the article.
worldofwarships.eu/en/news/public-test/join-our-test-of-new-aircraft-carrier-and-aa-mechanics/
@@WorldofWarshipsOfficialChannel I received an Email to register for this public test and then I registered using my Wargaming Asia account. Is above given link different from that? If my registration is complete then what to do next, how will I receive next instructions?
If you were already registered, install an additional instance of the game client from the wargaming game launcher.
Before you click install for world of warships, choose the option for public test in the top left.
@@WorldofWarshipsOfficialChannel i want to know were is the HOOD
All this new sphagetti code instead of just making plane spotting mini map only
"We're ready to listen to any feedback, unless it's feedback that says minimap spotting, because we hate it when the players have better and more simple ideas than we do."
I'm a bit late to comment as I've only recently come back to the game. I'm not a CV main but I dabble. I like the idea of changing plane altitude but there are too many conditional and situational things to be aware of in the first place and to then remember. Just keep it simple. Planes at low altitude have increased spotting and can make quick attacks, but receive increased AA damage and accuracy. Planes at medium altitude have standard spotting range and attack / aiming speed, and take default AA damage and accuracy. At high altitude spotting is reduced but so is AA damage and accuracy.
- No AA immunity at any altitude.
- Spotting works to some degree at all altitudes.
- Adjust the spotting distances and AA values accordingly but don't make either useless.
- Don't add timers for how long planes can fly at each altitude, it shouldn't be necessary.
Feedback from the Community? LUL😂😂😂😂.
You did everything behind closed doors and published a final exam in just 2 devblogs that nobody understands.
I was going to say, who came up with this because it clearly wasn't someone actually playing CV's.
This seems just to be making things needlessly more complicated than what they need to be. Similar effects could be achieved by simply tweaking what already exists by 1. Reworking AA damage among the different classes to promote cooperation between ship classes and incentivize it. (Giving Texas it's AA back would be nice too). 2. Tweaking the dmg, frequency, spotting range, effects of planes. Spotting an issue? Nerf the spotting range of the plane. Floods/fires happen too often? Nerf %/or damage. One CV can get too many attacks off too quickly? Reduce # of attacks or cooldown between attacks.
Also, I thought you guys said CV players were too dumb to manage a manual DCP and planes? You now don't think that anymore? I can't wait to hop in the Graff again with manual secondaries now. That's going to be insane.
lmao why all the complicated mechanics? minimap spotting would go a long way...
WG has to make it convoluted as a rule
They have tested minimap spotting on 3 different versions of the game, and it has never turned out well. Just look at Legends.
@@daptrius4983 minimal spotting isn't what's hurting legends
@@daptrius4983 thye could use same mechanic as surface detection used by sub, but more frequently updated instead of single ping
I can still remember when I and hundreds/thousands of others tried to give Wargaming useful feedback. Wargaming was, is and will never be critical of its own decisions, so feedback is unfortunately pointless. And this decision will be implemented as it is, regardless of what feedback comes in.
maybe the real solution would be to give reverse feedback ? like saying the solution is what the F WG want to make here, so they gonna do something else?
@@kaollachan True, that could maybe work! 😆However, it may not be necessary.
This just feels like the submarine conversation all over again in several ways
1) you have been receiving feedback for years about CVs - minimap only spotting for planes would address SO MUCH of the actual issues players have - but lets ignore that and create something way more complicated irrespective of what actual players are suggesting (other than a 'silent majority' who apparently exist and want something contrary to everyone else)
2) the submarine sunk cost fallacy Mark 2 - where you have now spent so much development time and effort on some cracked idea that it is getting implemented no matter what.
I would ask that you PLEASE keep it simple, but that is apparently a very advanced concept that is difficult to execute
This sounds so confusing and convoluted
If they were worried about spotting. Just make a mechanic like in WoT that the radio-signal only reaches a certain range. So unless the friendly ship is within that range they don't get enemy position info from the planes.
A very complicated way to make CVs less effective. Is it really that to just make planes had minimap spotting.
AA wise, i think it's good that the AA gets damage buff when getting focused down by the same planes, but i personally think that another issue with AA (and secondaries) is they tend to get destroyed easily by HE (especially UK BB's HE shells). Change it so they are the same like how primary armaments HP pool works
yay, another demented CV rework.
Did you expect anything less? At least CVs get a to actually do something with the CARRIER itself, a small victory but yeah. Can't wait for FLOOD of hate videos.
@@jaywerner8415Do with the ship? You already do if you are smart but most cv players are not.
Moving a ship and firing gun can be fun but isn't a must.
With the 3 modes now bad players become even more useless 😂 Will be a picnick for better players now when in CV.
Same with the Bearn rework that makes the skip bombs spread out more. It only made the Bearn less playable for bad players.
@@dgray3771 making the game harder for casual/new players isnt good. it means less people will bother. it means its less fun for most people. and it means you'll deal with the uber cv players more often not less. these changes are awful for everyone involved.
@@hunter11220 It means that CVs will be more DMG focused. And the game will be far more lopsided due to the big difference between good and bad players.
Now a bad CV players still provides spot. A okay CV players does DMG still and spot. But then any player who is weaker will not even bother spotting. Not care at all about the team. And simply be dropping on ships. It will cause serious unbalance because it's already unbalanced.
You guys are just trying to kill the game faster, First removed or RTS carriers, then Buffs to carriers, then subs, now this... Players are leaving like crazy and you do this dumb change.
What do you expect from a dumb company?
buffs to subs?? lmao look at the win rates dropping like crazy on subs
@@SeeHunde man do u take a 40%wr player as a good example on how bad that class is?sub player is 90% consist of 40%-50% wr player. dont want to stats shaming but clearly there is someone btter for u to take advice than this player right?
@@fahmimike4999 okay so what you're saying is the MAJORITY (the people you'll most likely play against) are having worse win rates like i said, what's your point here??? of course there's still people with high win rates of course there's good players, but that's 10%, ONE out of TEN games you'll meet someone you're describing here, what a joke. you're just agreeing with me here blindly
MINIMAP ONLY SPOTTING!!!
3 words. Why do you guys always try to reinvent the wheel instead of trying the implement the simplest solution that the community has been saying since the original rework
This is Wargaming.
These are the same guys who refuse to do a simple act like releasing the soundtrack of their games.
Well i think if they did minimap only spotting then they would have to increase the damage of the planes to compensate.
@@bigdata2783 no, they dont.
Minimap only spotting doesnt impact the direct damage output of the CV. It only limits what their teammates can do. Which is the entire point
@@KnodsilMemeMaker Yes and that's something that would need to be compensated by buffing some other aspect. Its a given and take situation.
That would mean admitting they are wrong and the player base is right. That can't happen.
Phase 1 : Carriers can no longer spot everything everywhere, but they get buffs, lots of buffs!
Phase 2 : We decided to allow for 2.5 seconds of recon mode for every second in travel mode, so they can spot everything everywhere, and keep the buffs!
Dear commanders, we will implement a new system for the CV's, as we already mentioned we have carefully read your complaints and suggestions which we will ignore as we always do, the CV's will continue to be the most broken ship in the game but we don't care, and since a CV is not absurd enough currently, we have implemented that from now on the secondary guns can be used manually, enjoy it!
Expect a lot of graf zep in games now. 😂
@@dgray3771 Zepplin already has the gun range and accuracy. Kaga, Bearn and Aquilla will benefit more.
Premium SANZANG with 0 guns is very happy about it (as are some others). Not at all about the deterioration of premiums.
Not sure the game engine can take any more updates with your spaghetti coding introducing these convoluted mechanics to address issues present since your original CV rework.
Feel like starting with mini-map only aircraft spotting would've given players something they actually want while freeing up resources to fix other issues plaguing the game (bugged artillery - shells still fall short while even aiming above targeted ships, getting stuck on invisible islands, radar/hydro through islands, subs, etc...)
I like the idea of carriers controlling their secondary guns fully now but they didn’t resolve the main issue of spotting, I’m a legends player so I don’t have to complain about that now since they actually did it where planes only spot on the minimap
how the hell are new players expected to understand all these crazy spotting mechanics? its way too complicated.
if priority sector now becomes manual AA with 360 coverage, what happens to the AA priority sector upgrade module?
They are going to have to allow a module mount / sellback, and captain skill rework for this.
It already just reduces the cool down between uses and nothing else. So I would imagine nothing is going to happen to it. It will still do the exact same mostly pointless thing.
Oh you've done lots of testing this time? Do the devs actually play the game now?
If they did, we wouldn't be here.
Soooo, in summery you just made the Current CV system a little more Complicated, JUST to address "cv spotting". Although I will say that addition of the "attacking flight" HP is not lost on me (hopefully they actually get shot this time), and giving CV players something to do when controlling the Carrier itself is a BIG WIN for Carrier Gameplay. Although I will question WHY that wasn't the case the first-time round, kinda a no brainer. Guess you where just focused on the Plane side of things and kinda forgot about the ship (which for all purposes may as well have been a AIRSTRIP just outside the map).
Welp, Ill take what little wins I can get for CV gameplay. Although I doubt anyone is gonna be overly thrilled about all of this.
adding all this to flight mechanics then adding things i need to focus on with my ship isnt an improvment. its too much to keep track of all at once
they could have also let CV player control they ASW. ( also dream of a CV that has plane with support capability dropping ASW charge, but need to get back to ship to get a new charge)
@@hunter11220 You are clearly the kind of person WG is pandering too with Current CV gameplay then. Not one of those people who could handle 8 squadrons at once plus the CV itself. Not that I ever got the chance to get that far before RTS CVs got sacked. (did make it to tier 7 US Carriers though)
Also its only Manual when you go back to the Carrier if I heard that correctly. So its only when you are NOT flying planes. Otherwise id imagine a AI will take over if your controlling your squadrons.
@@kaollachan I mean surely they could just add that as another squadron type right? A torpedo bomber squadron or Flight that drops depth charges.
Most Aircraft Carriers do not have armor and camouflage, and some do not have main and auxiliary calibers at all (and there are even premium ones) - how are they supposed to do anything on the "front line"? They already killed Aircraft Carriers several patches, it's not them from the start of the game - but they can do something else. It's like fighting SPG in WOT. Get the class out of the way right then.
So far i'm not convinced this will make AA feel more impactful to other ship classes, with all the immunity, reduced damaged dipping etc. im very sceptical. And what about CVs like Nakimov? Aren't they disproportionatley benefitting from these changes through the damage reduction on initial attacks? Also the 15.6 Kilometer secondary Range seems absurd, compared to other secondary builds. Altough i like the idea of being able to control secondaries, that would be a cool feature for Battleships as well. Not sure if this is the answer everyone was hoping for WG, we'll see how the testing will turn out...
WE NEED THE RTS CVS BACK.
They penalised solo players and rewarded team players, and you could clearly see that.
In RTS mode on aircraft carriers you could clearly see that CAs and AA BBs with some teamplay did a lot and were rewarded, while yolo players in BBs etc were penalised, and that's how it should be and not this constant whining that the CVs or the BBs or whatever are too overpowered.
So please remember that only we collectively as a community can force WG to fix the CVs and other issues and bugs, and if we do nothing then they will continue to do so and make us all suffer. So rise up and unite instead of fighting each other because we only have one true enemy in this situation and that is Wargaming and if Wargaming doesn't change then they shouldn't get more players for their game, they should lose the players.
i second this i never got to try RTS CV as a long time RTS enjoyer a video of RTS CV popping up on my feed was what got me to try WOWS in the first place but it turns out i was late i later ended up disappointed and became a battleship slugger instead
And we, Legends players, are complaining about our CVs who have now mini map spoting and fuel mechanic 😂
Why couldn't we just get mini-map spotting like when ships are in cyclone unless you were in a certain distance. Remove the ramp time to manaul AA and make it 360. Im pretty sure that would've made the community happy without adding a ridiculous amount of complexity to carriers, which was a reason RTS carriers were changed. While also srill neglecting to actually deal with the real problem you've unleashed being subs, who are faster and stealthier than dds, and almost zero methods of punishing them without running them down and hoping your depth charges land before the homing torpedo delete your hp bar.
どうしてWargamingはさらに事態を悪化させてしまうのか。
legendsのスポット能力制限と、PC版独自の粘着の弱体化以上をプレイヤーは望んでいない。
低索敵能力・低火力の空母に存在意義はなく、一方的な空母の弱体化は空母なし戦場ばかりを生み出し、相対的な潜水艦の強化が新たな問題になる未来しか見えない。
I think mini-map spotting for others and real spotting for the carrier would have been change enough, no need for other changes at the moment IMHO.
This is going to make end match engaements where there is only a cv left on one team and a gunboat left on the other automatic wons for the gun boats
Minimap spotting is the only chance that would have been needed
Love it, finally a little complexity, finally some interaction and gameplay options. ❤ Looking forward to it!
You nerfed AA and called it a buff. Put down the vodka.
The design in general looks quite dumb. CVs keep having all the choices in every engagement and now they get to spend more time immune AA (or reduced damage), travel around the map faster and also get a way easier time defending themselves against gunboat DDs. Surface ships keep being NPCs, to be farmed by the angry sky gods.
The community has literally been screaming to give us mini map only spotting for CV. And this is convoluted crap they come up with. SMH.
The development team of NA, EU, Asia on PC is wants to be different than other teams to show off how rebellious they are. while everyone else is using minimap spotting for CV and hybrid , and this team just want to be different and develop a convoluted system. Out of all those options of CV balance, they choose the stupidest way to do it while they could choose a easy quick solution for this problem.
Make Atlanta Great Again! Some of the CLs need to go back to being supreme air denial tools. It should fall on the carrier player to recognize that a ship has amazing AA potential and is covering it's friendlies. DFAA changes seem....interesting. So I assume flak clouds are still a thing?
I like how they pretend to have had collected feedback from the community and that this "rework" is a result of collective feedback from the community. There is absolutely nothing in all of this nonsense suggested by the players. We wanted two things, we are not getting them and everything else is literally rejected by every single person.
That is adding a RIDICULOUS amount of complications none of which add to fun. I've a casual player since initial release and I like playing my CVs but..dang you may have just ended that. You'll never make the anti CV whiners happy till you get rid of CVs entirely so why not just let them opt out of games with CVs instead? there.. simple solution. Frankly I'd also like a CV vs CV game mode with escort ships and a divded map and maybe subs too. DONT make all game more complicated and less fun for the whiners.. just let them have their "Jutland 1946" battles by opting out of games with CVs...and everyones happy.. and you do a lot less work.
If they let people opt out, they might as well get rid of CV's because most would opt out. I would opt of a match with CV's or sub if possible.
@@briangulley6027 fine..then I guess us CV types would mostly be fighting each other. but I imagine for the high stakes stuff.. gale league and clan battles.. the upper tier missions an promotions and of course for operations CVs players would still be around.
How hilarious, they've destroyed and continue to destroy the game for one ship class that is played by two players every game.
Playing Graf Zepplin will be fun in operation especially with manual secondary and secondary build, i cant wait for it
well for me it still already fun the way it is, , but yeah maybe more now XD
I hope Kaga will get a gun range boost. Zepplin already has the gun range and accuracy. Kaga, Bearn and Aquilla will benefit more.
They could have just removed CV spotting, simple for the CV player, biggest complaint of the rest of the player base taken care of. But since they decided to make this very complicated half-arse fix instead, I think most CV players are not smart enough to understand and play with these. If they were tactially smart they'd be playing the other classes.
If you are even half smart, carriers wont be complicated to you cause similar mechanics are already in the game. And if CV spotting is such a problem play ships that have blind aircraft consumable.
"Smart" cannot press the air defense button and fighter button. Really great intelligence.
Im really confused as to how this fixes anything. All it does is make it too complicated for qeaker players to operate a CV. Or to actually counter a CVs planes.
You don't need to make it more fancy with 3 modes.
What should be implemented is a max range for planes, so a carrier cannot attack all over the map. And also spotting should be a shared thing between ships in the same area. Again with a limit of maybe 30 km radius. It makes it so that ships have to be in the vicinity.
Planes should have a max range "for return" meaning that your attack range gets limited. If you go out of range of your carrier your planes would ditch. And you lose them.
I know this is hard to implement due to the ability to move your carrier close while your planes fly but cmon. If you can implement 3 modes with all kinds of differences than this is possible too.
I actually like this idea of limiting the carriers range, bc that's how it was in real life as well. Planes don't have infinite fuel. This would force the carrier to move into a closer position, making themselves more susceptible to being damaged, like every other class of ship. They have to risk their ship too. And it would stop them spotting the whole map
I hate the fact that carriers in the current state can sit in complete safety on the other side of the map and I have absolutely nothing I can do to them until I can sail ALL the way across the map. I was in the Florida the other day, and at three quarters hp. The only ship left on the enemy team was the carrier who was on the other side of the map, and he sank me in TWO DROPS. Each of his drops took almost 20k off of me, and I had def AA running. I never had a snowballs chance in hell of getting a shot at him. If he had had to be within say, 20 km of me, I might've been able to find him and sink him.
@@Ashigaraa no one here is a ship expert
@@hunter11220 and certainly not WG
@@Ashigaraa Realism - blind planes, loss of planes before attack? Are you talking about some of the very first planes in history that fell by themselves?
I am surprise you guys (WG) are not dumping the CV rework2 on the live server like your did with the sub updates. I wonder what you guys will break despite the closed testing.
cool, now waiting yuro guide & exploit about new cv rework
I forsee issues with that progress bar, in that it will be more effective the longer a ships aa range is, since aa will be active for longer.
Don't forget that secondaries and AA Guns are fragile and get destroyed easily from HE. Dps drops significantly.
Some Aircraft Carriers don't even have a "mention" of main and auxiliary caliber (even premium ones) - from this update their only purpose is to "stand in port"
It doesnt change the fact that CV can destroy enemy dds life, as far as I understand it as long they are in recon mode, everything stays the same. Same with the Patrol Fighters.
That airplanes that die in attackmode are not replaced is a big nerf.
The rework of priority sektor sounds like a bad remake. Instead that the ship has to turn a bit and use the right moment of the sector priority you just now have to press 1 button as soon the enemy planes are in your range. I mean, why no fully automate it?
I dont think why you think its a good idea that the progress bar changes irreversibly. The point is that its very frustrating to get focused out not the fact that you get attacked at all. If the CV player attacks your ship, than does 10min. something else than attacks your ship again, thats totaly okey.
That you have to use your defensive AA before the enemy is even in your range (so before 7km) sounds not so good, so you need to activate it when the enemy planes are still on high attitude, and on high attitude he doesnt even see you (so he will not attack you) or you are spottet from a different enemy (in this case they dont care if they loose spotting abilitys).
I dont understand why you not just make the spotting like uboat spots so its only visibile on Minimap, that would fix every spotting issue. I mean with your change the spotting still is the same problem and is as annoying as it is now. The only thing changes that now the CV player can choose that he doesnt want to spot for more flightspeed.
This is just more problematic than before. All you had to do was switching to minimap spotting only and 70% of the problems would be fixed regarding CVs.
Manual guns on CVs are a great idea. As for the spotting....why not just minimap only....?
Sooo making it more complex and confusing will sure increase the player numbers in CV s, or even in general game.
Will have to see how this plays out on the server, but initial impressions - it sooo unnecessarily complicated. You complicate the hell out of what could be simple solutiion - just change plane spotting to minimap spotting.
Just have a game mode that players can select to not play a battle with planes and subs. Give players the choice. If I wanted planes I would play WoWP.
With all the information shared so far this looks to be the great CV buff. As planes are now only vunerable to damage for 5-10s while attacking some of which is at reduced damage and still spot while being imune to damage while striking. All this update has done for surface ships is remove incidental spotting while massively improving the surviveability and therefore striking power of aircraft. and that's without talking about the busted recon mode (due to the insane recharge rate) and secondary improvements.
yo doe this mean that the graf zeppelin just go viable again i damn well hope so i miss the secondary beast days but manually firing the 150s? that shit be bussin
I am a player playing on aircraft carriers and I will soon be playing on the test client. As for the video and comments, I see that many players already see the same problem. Why do you complicate the game so much? You ruined the planes with rockets a few years ago instead of simply reducing their damage? Here I see a problem that your mechanics of changing altitude, flight and spotting will be very difficult for beginners to grasp. Players are already writing that they do less damage in battle, so I am afraid of how much this will affect Essex-class support aircraft carriers. I will agree with other commentators for now - You did not have to make such drastic changes.. could you not only reduce the damage? or maybe the spotting range of the planes? I will play battles on the test client and come back with a comment after the battles. In general, the idea of destroying the game with aircraft carriers is a very poor idea...
... I'm skeptical of this Update. It might work out, but I am going to hold off on opinions UNTIL I play the new version. As a CV player, I am worried.
Cv just got way stronger on attack. FDR is unstoppable now. Only downside is all spotting is effectively gone.
The new update is so inclusive, you will use every key on your keyboard to play a carrier . Wg is so progressive.❤
My take on it?... eh... cool idea, but probably not in practice. Though i LOVE the fact we can use the CVs guns now, thats a massive W.
I love we are getting proper manual 2ndaries. I hope that skill will become available for other surface ships to. Also manual AA would be a great addition.
I miss the RTS approach. There you at least had the feeling of commanding multiple aircraft squadrons and the aircraft carriers weren't factories.
Should just bring back RTS CVs.
Bring back classic carrier play!
Hell no. Could hardly defend yourself as a ship, guaranteed death with that bullshit cross torpedo maneuver.
Yes you could be nuked, but your own CV would protect and counter. "Just group up" actually meant something and could save you.
You could build into AA and make your ship a no fly zone
There was things you could do back then to protect yourself and your team.
Limited planes meant they had to be smart and focus the weak points, the players thinking running off solo was a good idea, hugging the backline/map edges was a death sentence since there was no assistance to protect yourself.
Island camping was less common because standing still in a non AA built ship was going to get you nuked.
Nowadays, yes you wont get insta nuked, but you will be hounded by a CV and have nothing to even slightly deter them
Bring back DASHA, ASYMETRIC BATTLES
Nice Job. guys! Are you going to send a direct refund payment to my credit card for all my premium CV or should I give you my bank details? Don't forget about inflation rate.
If you are going to change anything about CV's, just make them ships again. Make the CV's a bit more tanky, give them a large circle area that acts like a area of effect. Other ships within 5m, extend the range by another 5m outwards, and so on. Encouraging fleet movements, have the planes automated within this perimeter make attacks from spotted enemies maybe like 5-10m out? Could also have the player use an ability called helicopter navy repair teams as a buff/action on cooldown. It would be a support craft, ship, warship. This is World of Warships, and not Warplanes right?
Warplanes is much better at aircraft control mechanics than this - and there you can destroy enemy ships with impunity. Most of the games on the Aircraft Carrier now - lose one of the attacking links while the other one is leading the attack. Or just scout the enemies, getting a small amount of credits and experience. They already killed SPG in WOT like this.
Aircraft Carriers, for the most part, do not have armor, camouflage, maneuverability, and some do not even have weapons - to be somewhere "near the front." They then need to either redo the entire class or take it out of the game.
This is why I only play in Operations and against bots.
Can I said that the Graf zeppelin get the most benefits of buff?😂
Sure but Nachimov is a literal Moleskin. Not to underestimate as well
No, it's not, because Graf Zeppelin always shot secondaries very accurately, even with autofire, so it's an indirect nerf to Graf Zeppelin that other CVs' secondaries are also accurate.
And this patch is also a devastating nerf to Graf Zeppelin, that makes her Bombers unusable.
But... She might be a little more efficient in PVE mode.
The defense of the thunderbolt is not enough against the anti-aircraft firepower of the enemy ship and often only one torpedo can be launched, can you do something about this?
Increase all ships AA damage and range and decrease plane spotting range and time, problem solved.
controllable secondaries for CV's?! what are these guys smoking?! literally not having any other options apart from planes is what made CV's even remotely combatable
Well, that was clear as mud! I think a better and more simple solution would be to have the aircraft damaged during battle to not respawn and have that damage go on the carrier. You can play with the percentage of damage that the carrier takes and set a maximum damage the carrier takes from aircraft shot down but, it would be more of a real world situation and a lot easier to adjust. IRL, when the carrier loses all it's planes, all it has are it's guns to fight with. That would then push the carriers into the battle areas adding to the dynamic.
IRL arguments are a little vague when it comes to a game.
You want the planes to be vulnerable to Ships like they were IRL? Would you also accept ships to be as vulnerable to Planes like they were IRL?
You know, like, one AP Bomb to your arsenal and you're out? One well-placed bomb and your whole carrier is done for?
IRL, the Carriers banned battleships from the naval war. But Wargaming has to keep the game "fair" (It will never be 100% fair for ANY side) so they have to make compromises.
@@baghira2761 Give me an effective fighter umbrella and that would be fine.
Thats.... a bit harsh. Personally I wish damaged planes didn't INSTANTLY get fixed when they land on the CV. They should not COUNT as fresh planes and go into a hanger to repair (basically wait for them to respawn.)
@@beaugator I'd love to. I loved having my fighter squads out there back then with the old CV model. Felt like real CV tactics. Played my Kaga with..what was it...3?4? active fighter squadrons for Air superiority and protected my team mates from incoming bombers
@@jaywerner8415 They are not immediately repaired. You have a supply of planes + return from battle + "recovery time". This is clearly visible at the end of the battle. If you don't play yourself, watch the same broadcasts.
Wow so convoluted
"brilliant" idea cuz minimap spotting is too simple, already developed and proven mechanic🤦♂
Guys. Give a toddler a bag of flour and a spoon - it will mess up the kitchen less than you are messing up this game....
There are ton of, easy to implent, easy to understand, and easy to live with comments here alone.
If you implement this rework you really increase the learning curve of the game and keep new players from join/enjoying.
Preferable I would rather like more of a RTS gameplay back, but understand the current concept. Please dont mess it up.
I see a lot of compaints here. Mainly because there are much easier solutions to combat the cv problems. But I actually like the sound of this. More options, more ways to play, more builds. I like the game being diverse and interesting. I'm willing to give this a go.
A lot of the complaints also seem to be getting to focused on the spotting aspect of this, and not taking a minute to realize this is Wargaming addressing a lot of the anti-CV arguments all at once.
"It feels you can't mitigate the damage from CV attacks!" Okay so the attacking squad won't replace dead planes, shoot one down and you've just reduced the incoming damage.
"CVs can attack you from anywhere with no risk!" Okay so we are reducing the effectiveness of CV aircraft and giving CVs the ability to use their guns, to heavily encourage CVs to move up to at least their "main gun range" so they will be closer to the front as well as be taking just as much risk as any other ship if played correctly.
"DefAA feels worthless!" Okay so it's gonna increase your AA range and blind attacking squads if you activate it before they enter your AA range, giving you more interaction with the air squads.
"That big mean CV keeps attacking me over and over again!" Okay well... don't be off on your own... but alright here's a passive bonus that will improve your AA if a CV attacks you a lot.
Those are just what I remember from the video coming down into the comments, I'm sure there was more. The "easier solutions" don't actually address any of that. Mini-map spotting does nothing to change any of those things, and functionally wouldn't do anything. The RU server tested mini-map spotting and found it didn't work and reversed the change. So Wargaming is onto something with no doing it. As someone who enjoys CVs I'm not happy about these changes, at least not in a vacuum. If this is a sign that Wargaming is going to go through and give every class a balance pass to be more fun to play against, than I'll be quite happy, as it stands... The most average impact class is being nerfed because the highest impact classes are getting salty. Doesn't exactly seem fair to me.
I agree.
To many knee jerk reaction comments. As a CV player, I'm eager to try this out!
I'm sure you'll address destroyer armor vs carrier weapons.
Or spotting them on calm oceans
You need feedback? Ok. As before, early followers will awe to those changes, late majority will reject them.
Any update is good but the real problem is how inconvenient to understand any mechanics from in-game without googling since any critical info is not shown from tutorials. Info diff between vets and new players are already extremely huge and this will rip open the gap even more lmao
Will be interesting to explore these changes. Manual damage control is the most important change for me personally.
The Japanese CVS need a special rework especially their attack aircraft, because they suck. Love of how WG said the machine guns were to help the cv player know where they are aiming even though we already have the retical.
Can we just go back to RTS CV ?
-The new AA feature for if you are being targeted by the CV is actually something reasonable tho i feel it should reset after awhile of not being Targeted (maybe after like 4 minutes idk)
-The new DFAA is dumb tho DFAA already ruins squadrons i think the part where it blinds the planes should rather add a effect too the screen too make it difficult too see, rather than physically remove the ability too see them
-The new Spotting i think battleships should stay spotted in high altitude spotting (it only makes sense) same with a cruiser firing its guns (maybe anything above 127 mm will be spotted)
-The new recon mode could be interesting but i think the suggestion i made above could be something to make it a little better for everyone involved
-Ability to manually control secondaries i hope it stays automatic unless i press
Can you please make the game easier and not more complicated? Just bring the old Carrier Gameplay back, which we had 2015 and we're all be fine.
The problem could be fixed by increasing the AA damage, but they chose the most complicated way to do it.
This will ruin a battle when there are multiple DDs that REFUSE to spot and go wide and playing selfishly, ie shimas.
Well, if those DD's grow a brain they'll realise they get spotted far less themselves and might actually start spotting for you again. Seeing as.. well the friendly CV doesn't anymore. So they'll do so by accident
@@tizdale1007 doubt it cause I have more games then not where there's no CV and DDs just don't spot.
So, if I focus a flank with like 4 Ships which are given my team a hard time. This is considered a problem by WG ? All enemy ships will get automatic AA if they are close to each other, at around the same time. Which makes me unable to effectively help my team on that flank for the rest of the battle…. This mechanic sounds not like a good idea.
Def AA will already be strong enough with 7km range on all ships.
italian ship crying in they AA corner XD
WG did mention in the developer blog that the overlapping AA won't increase it's potency, which is.. magic i guess, because it should, if there is a bunch of ships grouped up together of course it should come at the cost of losing planes, but it seems like they already thought of people like you.
Overlap AA nerf...
Improving or wrecking?
Cv like nahimov can rereally benefit from this, when you have 16 guns on one side why need planes😅
Zep,Rich, Max: +1
@yichenqiao8772 haha, not sure about zeppelin, as it's automatic secondary guns are most accurate already, by giving manual control probably won't be much difference in regards of accuracy, but a bit of extra range would be nice
Nakhimov now is also two smolensks with 15.6km range, 70.000hp and a 90mm deck.
@@glennv3176 yes, nakhi not only benefit for secondary, but also hit and run much,much more efficent
You're gelding the CV-s with absurd changes. It makes no sense that ship classes should have the same effect on the battle, even closing the distance is masterstroke of reality denial.
Balance is more important than "reality" chief
3:50 broooo not the pocket sand 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭
Pocket sand meme 😂
and now , a rework that nobody ask
I like the manual use of secondary guns
Since I was used to it in Blitz
Well the 6-7 years have been fun. With Changes like this going in with my favorite class I am finally walking away from this game.