I have gone from being in denominational churches to nondenominational. We are tackling things in our community that the denominational churches won’t touch. They’ve even said so. We have a drug rehab program, we offer a sexual abuse/assault Recovery program, a depression recovery program and we’ve just started a ministry to single moms. I’m not seeing this done anywhere else in my area. So I’ll take the nondenominational Church who is working with people in the gutters of life. As we say, it’s all about Jesus.
This right here, Jesus didn't come for the righteous, He came for the lost, and we are to be His hands and feet here on earth. Fellow non-denom here. Our church does the same stuff, we do a LOT of outreach in our local community. We have counselors for mental health issues, we have a food bank, and we're only expanding. We house the homeless and work with them to help them get on their feet. We have a ministry to college students that's been very successful.
Interesting, I have a church who does similar things like that, its called Grace Community Church in Arlington, TX. They try to find solutions for their local community.
I've gone to non-denominational churches my whole life, and honestly most things you say are correct. While we can agree to disagree on most things, I want to point out 2 important things that I think make us make sense. You pointed this out too at 1:15 and it's that we try hard to get as many people saved as possible. We are Evangelicals after all. Because of that, being the far and above primary thing, most of these churches neglect most tradition. We are only focused on what will get atheists to stay and listen. Some to a degree that detriments the church, others to what I believe is a healthy degree. In short, I think our churches can be a little shallow because we are facing the world much more than other denominations who tend to face inward much more. The second thing is when you quoted what many of us say, "Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship with God." It's a perspective thing, when you think of religion, you think of all of the beautiful things associated with it, but when an atheist hears that word, they think of all of these mindless (I know they actually aren't, this is the atheist perspective) rituals that have to be done, and all of these rules that have to be followed perfectly or you'll go to Hell. When we say that, what we really mean is something like, "You don't have to be perfect to go to Heaven. The most important thing is getting close to God and his people, then He will change you."
I respect your position, but the way you talk about the Church makes me feel that it exists only to convert the people of the world, whereas, in my opinion, it should be a piece of the Kingdom of God here on Earth and that it is the place where we should praise our God. Furthermore, when you read the Bible, especially the Old Testament, it becomes clear that our God places a lot of emphasis on the "form" of worship. There seems to be too much focus on being a place that attracts people who don't believe in God by making them more open to the gospel than a place where people who have accepted the gospel come together to praise God. At least that was the impression I got from your comment and that I also get when I look at the worship style of these churches. Furthermore, more and more I see that young people who are more open to seeking God are precisely looking for beauty, structure and roots in tradition, something that they are not finding in the world. Imperfectly put, I believe that the right emphasis should be to bring the Kingdom and Glory of God into the World and not to bring the World into the Kingdom of God.
@@pedroguimaraes6094 no I agree, I'm not saying that it's the correct or perfect way to go about it at all, I'm just explaining the thought process. I will however say that I don't know what youth you're reaching, but where I live, I find that my church isn't too jarring for my agnostic friends when they come. Obviously I've never invited anyone to come to a church like yours, so I don't know what their reactions are, but I've never gotten any negative backlash from it at least.
yeah.. it's kinda true. i dunno bout the theology of the sacraments still though. for now i keep baptism, and i'm on the fence with spiritual presence vs. memorialism
This was an excellent video. Thank you. As a Nondenominational Christian, you helped me appreciate many Chruch aspects I haven't fully considered. I ALWAYS find a Bible-based fundamental church, so natrually many of the churches I attended were denominational.
I'm an atheist but man this channel is pure gold. I've always wondered about the many christian denominations, since i've only had contact with catholics and luterans so I always assumed there weren't that big of a difference in the denominations themselves. Keep up with the good work!
I've now commented two kinda critical takes on your videos so I kinda want to balance those out by saying I really appreciate the way you approach this channel. Your points are very well laid out, your delivery is very clear and understandable, and you speak in a way that encourages discussion and deeper thought. Even if I'm talking into the void of youtube comments, I have genuine fun thinking about the topics you bring up and thinking about my own faith and the reason that certain things make me want to respond. So thank you! Please keep making videos, even if I disagree on topics I do still like them!
So the reasons I AM Non-denom are 2 fold. The main reason is that I'm pretty new to the faith and don't know enough about theology to make an informed opinion about which denomination I think is the most correct, and I've never really been the type of person to just accept what others tell me is true. The 2nd reason is that the church I started attending is Non-denom and I love it. My pastor is awesome, the community nice and supportive, and I've made a lot of friends there. I don't really want to leave it.
@Florida Man In the end, God is most important. Like I said, that was only a secondary reason. When a time comes that I feel like I have enough knowledge to properly choose a proper denomination, I will go to the appropriate church
@floridaman318 this is an unfair question. OP is enjoying church and connecting with God. They should be able to enjoy the experience and make friends
I definitely see the need for structural real Christianity. The institutions rn are so bad especially my methodist church I grew up in. We can fix it though.
@@Thedarkbunnyrabbit Yeah I think some non denom churches are bad because stuff like prosperity gospel can go unchecked. But I've also been to a non-denom church that left a denomination.
"...whereas non-denominational 'liturgy' if you can call it that has been described as a concert and a Ted Talk." As someone who attends a non-denominational church this is freaking hilarious and pretty accurate in our case XD
"The difference between you and me is that I just believe the Bible and you just blindly follow the tradition of your denomination." That's what I used to believe while simultaneously not knowing ANYTHING about what various denominations and traditions actually believed. What a fool I was. Proverbs 18:13
I was raised non-denom, and had the same experience. Ironically, I was the one blindly following the traditions of American Christianity, whereas the mainliners I know are far more discerning and intelligent about their faith.
@@calebneff5777Such is the danger when laymen minister unto others. He is very entertaining, though, and possesses a good way of spreading the gospel.
i used to go to a hyper pentecostal megachurch and recently just made the change and i was between a Reformed interdenom church and a non denom church. ultimately chose non denom church (bc of logistic and movilization) but what i like its how non-separatist my church is. like sometimes an anglican pastor preaches, sometimes an invited pentecostal preaches, bc at the end we’re all the body of Christ and we all need to unite (this weeks sermon was all about unity and fighting for the church in these trying times)
My dad is a pastor and our church is non-denominational, but he's pastored at Baptist churches his entire life before coming to the one we're at now. When people ask me which denomination we are closest to I say Baptist for simplicity, but in reality we are just modern puritans. Incredibly traditional and pretty much one to one on puritan theology. Edit 1: (Just got to the part where he mentions the 1689 confession) We hold the 1689 confession in SUPER-high regard
Well 1689 is purely Baptist, not Puritan. Puritans believe in infant baptism and real presence in the Lord's Supper. Puritans are just Presbyterians with Congregationalist church government and simpler worship
@@redeemedzoomer6053 Thats true, we used to joke when we were younger that we were just low-church Presbyterians that dont baptize babies, which is what the earliest baptists were. We have more in common with puritans than a lot of southern baptist "mega-churches"
wooo! non-denominational representation! love it. i enjoyed this a lot. there were several thing that you said non-denominational churches often do/say/believe that i personally dont, and that i am pretty sure my church wouldnt either, but i do conform to a lot of the theological points that you ascribed to non-denominational churches.
one of the most frustrating things to me is the rejection of science within my church. and the thing is, i see this WAY more in the congregation than in the leadership. i dont think its a pastoral/leadership issue, i think its a communication/critical thinking issue
I technically attend a non-denominational church, but we don’t label ourselves as “nondenominational” we just call ourselves a Christian church, we simply follow Christ. We have our own traditions, and we still respect all denominations, only if they don’t contradict anything in the Bible of course. And while we see a personal relationship with Jesus as very important, we also see things like evangelism, and the church itself very important too.
Fellow non-denoms, who else wants to go conquer a pizza hut for the glory of God? (we will use the smoke from cooking pizza in our worship) For real, this channel has helped so much with my reversion to the Faith and to fill my desire to learn more. Keep up the good work and never stop spreading the Word!
The reason I have been non-denominational is that I have never found a denomination I have completely agreed with, and I never wanted to say that I was a part of one and then be associated with all the beliefs including the ones I don't agree with. But watching this video and hearing about the cruciality of the unity of the church and the kingdom, I think I'm gonna start trying harder to find a church and denomination that I can truly be a part of so that I can start fighting for a stronger cause both for God and His Kingdom on earth. So that instead of being an independent grain of sand on a beach, I may become a brick united with many of my own to make up a castle. (edit: one thing that I'd like to point out is that I believe that baptism is better when you are mature not because baptism isn't important, but because you have more of a choice to do so rather than just being forced, even if it's the right thing to do, it should be a matter of the person's choice.)
This is how I’ve felt about associating with “non denominational”. But I’ve been doing a lot more research lately and then this video came up and I can’t really say with confidence anymore that I can just associate with being non-denominational.
The thing is, I think non-denom is essentially pushing for the entirety of Christianity to be a united brick. What I mean by that is that naturally, people aren't gonna agree on every single minor detail. So expecting "unity" to look like everyone being expected to just agree, is not gonna work. I believe that "unity" means working together through disagreements and using those disagreements as opportunities to learn. I think non-denominationalism has the potential to be the most unified, because, if done right, it's an environment where everyone is free to share their theories and have them discussed. Denominations feel like tribalism within Christianity, or politics, where you're expected to just choose a side and then go along with whatever they say. I think as Christians it would be better to view unity as like a mosaic, where we come together while having different opinions, cultures, etc, rather than to view unity as requiring homogenization. If we need to all agree on the details to be unified, we'll never be unified.
I grew up non-denominational and I can’t agree with you more on what you said here. it’s spot on accurate and is why I no longer associate myself with that denomination
@@toweringhorse2054 Where did you even find that image? Reverse image search says it's a crop from a hentai. Bro, looking at your uploads rn. You seriously need to repent.
Indeed. I believe I got it from a cropped image, likely from some sort of hentai. Recently rediscovered my faith and making strides to get better. Most of that stuff is from 2016. But you’re right. Really need to get on the right track. Thanks for the nudge
I met Jesus at a Baptist Church when I was a young kid...I learned how to serve Him using my gifts and how to live out my faith and be an example to my peers in a (Baptist with a HAZE machine) Non Denominational Church. I participated income incredible ministries there, including playing in the Celebrate Recovery band they have!
Non-denominational churches are either baptist or charismatic (pentecostal). I think the region plays a large role. In the US, most non-denominational churches are baptist, in latin american countries like brazil they're mostly charismatic
I am a non denominational Christian but I dont have similar teachings from Baptist, But clearly I have strong influence of teaching, culture and tradition from oneness Pentecostal, Or charismatic background
Thanks @reformed zoomer videos like these are very useful for me. As I'm about to begin a theology course in order to become a local preacher in my Methodist church. Your videos are a great grounding so I was able to be confident of which demonination I was confident to commit to and also have a basic understanding which I will build on
Non-denominational churches don’t have to answer to anyone. There isn’t a higher governing body to hold a church accountable; it’s so much easier for pastors to form a cult of personality and become the much maligned “celebrity pastor”. There are much fewer Presbyterian and Lutheran celebrity pastors compared to Baptists/Non-denoms, in part because it’s easier for the former to be held accountable.
The only part that rubs me the wrong way in this video is the dig you have about non-denominational buildings and what churches look like. The Church (upper case C) is set aside as holy, sacred, beautiful, and close to God. It is a community of believers and liturgical traditions. The church (lower case C) is just an earthly building where the Church happens to hang out. Large, grand cathedrals/churches are intimidating buildings, they're imposing, they are loud (visually loud, if that makes sense). And an unsaved person can very, very easily be scared away by such a thing. As someone who is on the shy-er side, even now as a Christian I do feel a bit of trepidation walking into these large, grand, beautiful buildings on the rare occasion I do. Am I feeling the weight of the Spirit? Maybe just the weight of my own social anxiety or sins? Unsure. But if my local church, a converted movie theater had looked like one of these, I would not have been saved. I would not have joined the church because a gorgeous cathedral is NOT a welcoming building to someone who has not already felt God's love and ascribed it to Him. It is hostile and intimidating, especially if you do not know you can trust and be welcomed by those within. It is a building where you know you will be judged, where you know the people inside see themselves as different from you. This is not an attractive concept to someone who is not already a Christian. Someone unsaved does not think being judged by God is an act of love and an invitation from the Spirit to change. They do not know that while Christians are "set aside" it is not in a superior way and that they are invited to be set aside as well. How can they be taught this if modern culture has conditioned them to see the big scary building as a hostile place? I am of the opinion that if your Church meeting in an old pizza hut causes at least more person to be saved than if meeting in a grand museum-looking building, that is a far better option. Trying to make a cathedral welcoming to strangers of the faith is an uphill battle.
I don't think a pizza hut church does cause more people to be saved than a cathedral church. I've heard countless stories of people being drawn in by the beauty of traditional Christianity
@@redeemedzoomer6053 That is fair, I'm sure some people have been drawn to the fancier parts of big churches. I can only speak from my own experience, and that says that a converted local business does more to create a welcoming air to strangers than a huge, expensive, beautiful cathedral. I'm sure some people are drawn in by the beauty of traditional Christianity, but I don't think those people would have been turned off the road by a less ostentatious church building. In a culture that teaches people to be suspicious and cynical of traditional symbols of Christianity though, I think it's more important to get people in the door than to show off how much money goes in the offering bag. Let the beauty of the Church be shown through the community, not how fancy the windows are.
Non denominational churches are like the spirit halloweens of churches and that probably attributed to why I kept going and was saved there as a nonbeliever who had a traditional catholic high school experience that undermined my individuality as a traumatized teenager. The point about the music too I also disagree with. One thing I did always resonate with from those masses was the easily singable earworm hillsong music the choir performed that I always found myself singing to even as a non believer. Now I sing it loudly in worship and I think that counts for something. It really is just a matter of preference and personal experience. Even if its unapologetically kitschy it has its place in evangelism. It’s very accessible and meets those who don’t have a religious background at their level which I think is invaluable. I don’t think churches ran by humans are immune to cultural influences of the times either nor do I necessarily think they were meant to be. Sacredness is also not limited to just aesthetics
at one point i was nondenominational... who knows i still may be, i'm kinda stuck to it cuz the rest of my family is part of it. i was the kid to sit through the service and go through with the motions. i serve for the media team and play keys for the youth (teenager's) worship team; we're a bigger church in our area at least. yesterday i felt super depressed. had been for a while now, and i was bored and didn't feel like doing anything after church. i thought, maybe i'll listen to worship. this time i didn't look up hillsong or maverick city, i searched "hymnals". i found a neat playlist and listened. before i knew it, i felt a few tears. i began singing the words out in my head (it was later at night so people were sleeping). at that moment i felt i could actually worship, not like i was listening to a band play in a concert. i felt useful for once. i never felt like i had any use in the kingdom of God because i couldn't feel comfortable worshiping Him, but i felt different at that time. so what am i now? i think more baptist. i still believe in the spirit's power, but not in an emotional way like most charismatics do. i don't think anyone can just speak tongues... it's a prophetic gift. our "worship" shouldn't be about us... so why do we sing about ourselves? why do we repeat the same bland bridge with no meaningful lyrics twelve times? it's like repeatedly shoving food down a baby's throat, hoping they give in and swallow it. praise to God is through our songs of praise to Him only, our deeds unto others who are His creation, and honoring ourselves who are joined heirs with Christ. not an album called "My Story" with five 10 minute songs each singing about how happy you are cuz God solved all of your problems. worship is a celebration of the One who solved your problems, not the feeling you get from them being solved. mr. zoomer, i will say that you've done me a great deed in opening my eyes to other possibilities of the Christian faith, and because of that i feel a lot more confident in myself. i thank you for that. may God bless you. (note: i'm EmeraldCraft34 that was on the server. haven't been on in a while, but i'm going to try!)
God bless you. Never feel ashamed of feeling spiritually empty listening to offensively bad music when there is so much great sacred music written to the glory of God
I really like how you don't just say what's wrong about the different denominations, but actually say what they don't do as well. Like, your criticisms are about things that are very changeable without damaging the integrity of the different denominations.
zoomer i want to thank you for the content you make, when I found your channel God spoke through you(i wached the Gospel video) and renewed my faith in God, i'm determened to get rid of my addictions especially pornography adiccion and i haven't wached porn for a week, thank you for the content you make and evangelising you do through it! God bless!
In fairness, there are reasonable grounds to oppose denominationalism, and that is enough to distinguish nondenominational folks from baptist folks. I’ve been to baptist churches, and the occasional KJV-onlyism, membership requirements, closed communion, and/or Landmark Baptist views are annoying. There’s a general atmosphere of “we’re the only church that counts, and we don’t really want to fellowship with others” that thankfully isn’t shared by nondenominationals. At its best, nondenominationalism is the ultimate ecumenical mindset. Not saying that makes nondenominational churches better than Baptist or anyone else. Just saying that the rejection of tribalism is important to a lot of people. Edit in response to the video: I believe the sacraments are necessary and have a role in salvation, and I’m nondenominational. I’m also amillenial and I don’t believe in once saved always saved. There’s a fair amount of diversity among nondenominationals. Edit 2: Saying that nondenominationalism is contrary to unity is like saying being a political independent is contrary to unity. Rejection of tribalism isn’t necessarily rejection of unity. I agree that it would be nice to see more cooperation (but not hierarchy) among nondenominational churches, however.
@@Justin-yn5py I did join Christ’s Church. As did many of my Baptist, Catholic, Lutheran, Methodist, Presbyterian, Pentecostal, Anglican, and Orthodox brothers and sisters, among many others. I’d just as soon say those are different Churches as I’d say the church at Galatia and the church at Corinth were from different Churches. In every case, God is the head of the Church, not man. Edit: to view the New Testament teachings about the Church (singular) as a denominational label is deeply anachronistic, unless you’re supposing that denominations were already fractured during the time of the New Testament’s writing. Moreover, if you’ve studied the church fathers as much as my Catholic friends (which I assume you have - I respect your denomination’s zeal for church history), you would know the Catholic Church didn’t closely resemble itself throughout history. The era of immersion baptism, and the era of crusades/indulgences, and the modern era all have notable difference that would be denominational differences had they been contemporaneous with one another.
but if you see the sacraments as a means to salvation then you’re adding works as part of being saved and we are only saved through faith, not through our works. I think they’re important to do but not necessary in order to be saved.
Awesome video. Interesting that your first point is that you ARE concerned with the Kingdom, because when I, as a ND, bring up Kingdom theology to my more traditional friends they are usually confused by it. I find that ND churches preach the Kingdom most often of anyone, which is why it’s so easy to get them to work.
Follow up, listen to any major worship band. They aren’t from the mainlines and they all sing about the Kingdom way more than anything else, like so much more. As in they often forget to sing about the Gospel because they sing about the Kingdom so much. I won’t flame you, I think maybe you’ve made this point based on expectation rather than fact. It’s fine, hopefully this is good news.
You ask how many universities ND churches have founded, but this is applying the wrong standard to them. First, how many mainlines have any involvement in those universities? Maybe one in the last 200 years? Sure you can say that mainlines found schools, but they haven’t stepped up to the plate to tend to them over time. And to ask a similar question, how many mainlines are putting out music, movies, books, getting involved in politics (especially at the local level), or are trying to influence curriculum positively? Are there any? Sure you might say that Christian music and movies suck, but we’re trying. That’s literally my job, to help Christians get their music out into the world to spread the glory of God as much as possible (and there’s lot of good music if you get past KLOVE). NDs try, and mainlines just don’t, at least not in the living memory. People often question the longevity of evangelical churches, but realistically, mainline churches haven’t shown any longevity either. When culture pushes back on Christianity, mainlines sit back and take it, because they know how to manage existing power, they don’t know how to seize it, and evangelicals do, and that’s why ND churches are growing. It’s not the smoke and music and flashy baptisms, it’s the boldness and passion. When Methodists are afraid to say that forcing kids to get puberty blockers is wrong, non-denoms are proud to scream that pre-marital sex is sinful. We tend to operate on a whole other level of conviction, and that means that we want to take over culture at all levels, not just the highest.
@lina12lamm46I’m just responding to points as they come up. It’s not spam, it’s an attempt at a conversation. You don’t have to click on the expand button.
As a Non-denominational Christian, I agree. I believe that Protestants, Historical or Non-denominational, show adhere to the basic traditions of Protestantism. To me, a "true" Non-denominational church would be a Protestant Church, that practices more traditional aspects of Protestant Christianity, but does claim a particular denomination. Essentially, a Protestant church, with more traditional/orthodox beliefs on the Sacraments, worship music, etc. but doesn't claim to be a part of any denomination. This is why I like to call myself an Apostolic Protestant, as because I am a Non-denominational Protestant, but I have a more Catholic/Apostolic leaning theology.
I'm non-denominationalist but I get where the concerns are. In my experience, there's two kinds of non-denominationalist Christians: 1 - people who are non-denom because they just want to seek truth, and listen to any other Christians for wisdom and compare various understandings rather than just sticking to what a specific denomination believes, as to get a rounded belief where each aspect and interpretation you believe, comes from hearing all the different sides and comparing their evidence and reasoning. While being willing to be challenged by all other Christians on these beliefs, iron sharpens iron. 2 - People who are the exact opposite, and are non-denom because they just want to ignore scripture and other Christians and just do whatever they want. As for the concerns about unity, I think non-denom is pushing for Christianity to be a unified. What I mean by that is that naturally, people aren't gonna agree on every single minor detail. So expecting "unity" to look like everyone being expected to just agree, is not gonna work. I believe that "unity" means working together through disagreements and using those disagreements as opportunities to learn. I think non-denominationalism has the potential to be the most unified, because, if done right, it's an environment where everyone is free to share their theories and have them discussed. Denominations feel like tribalism within Christianity, or politics, where you're expected to just choose a side and then go along with whatever they say. I think as Christians it would be better to view unity as like a mosaic, where we come together while having different opinions, cultures, etc, rather than to view unity as requiring homogenization. If we need to all agree on the details to be unified, we'll never be unified.
I can agree with some of your theology and also agree with the issues of non-denominational because we do need to unite the churches regardless of denomination. I hesitate with your reasoning on other aspects because they were your own personal beliefs instead of being backed by something solid. I'd continue to ask Jesus for direction just like I do to because somethings you said will make me ponder. Keep advancing the kingdom
I love your videos and recommend them to many young men I'm discipling. You do a wonderful job explaining difficult topics and you're very knowledgeable (and funny!). Great job man! Now, as a non-denominational guy myself, I think it's hilarious how you make the baptist comparison. I agree with you on many points and disagree with a lot of my non-denominational mentors' views on sacraments/baptism/role of the Holy Spirit. A couple things I respectfully disagree with you on is the significance and effect of the sacraments as well as the importance of the Church as an institution. For my explanation to people on the sacraments: baptism is an external action due to the internal action of repentance and coming to faith in Christ. And, communion is the affirmation of our "communal" ;) faith in Christ. It is a memorial of Christ's sacrifice and resurrection and a time of communal prayer for the sins of the body. I would argue that by putting the emphasis on the Church and its institutional significance, we run into the very same and many dangers we see throughout the history of the Church. I respect your view of the non-denominational church as a "denomination" (lol) and agree with you on many of the points you had. I'd say it's just a slight difference of view when it comes to certain things that mainline denominations like to hang onto (tradition, liturgy, sacrament focus) and how these slight differences end up being disagreements at the end of the day.
Thanks for your kind comment! I think it's funny though, in the 2nd paragraph you said "we're not Baptist" then proceeded to confess a purely Baptist view of the sacraments and the church in the 3rd paragraph haha
@@redeemedzoomer6053 as the running joke goes: "Non-denominationals are just Baptists" hahaha there's still some differences! No conferences/conventions running the show and no external governance over the local body to name a couple of examples!
I'm non denominational, and I have to say I agree with a lot of your criticisms. Since I started watching your channel I was convinced to look into Protestant churches like Methodist (my first choice), Lutheran, Anglican etc.
Catholic churches in the Western United States (with weird exceptions like the California Missions) are often modern in the suburbs, but historic in the cities. The historic Catholic city churches could use Reconquista as well -- just commute on Sunday too, traffic is much nicer. =) Although speaking of the California Missions, a lot of them aren't operational parish churches anymore, and they would benefit from a congregation dedicated to their care and maintenance.
Leonardo Torres has a lot of videos of him reacting to Hillsong and other contemporary worship songs as a non Christian and he is literally crying saying how beautiful it is.
Bruh. You could have just had the first eleven seconds of video and said "Because Non-Denominationals don''t build *this.* EDIT: OMG, your video was exactly that.
Around 22:30 you brought up a lack of severance in non denominational worship and as a non denominational I unfortunately agree some churches I've been too are almost disrespectful during service John Bevere a non denominational pastor has a really good book called the Awe of God and it talks about this problem as well.
I think you missed the fact that nondenominationals promote not just your relationship with Jesus, but encourage you to give a heart to know Him, acting on and heeding the scripture. And this is what we take with us to every institution we operate in- work, school, hospitals. Acting in alignment to our Faith and encouraging others to do so. And there are non denominational chains that have a broader impact on communities through the wide spread of their members, education opportunities, and a Christ centric focus. Mark 6:4 “A prophet is not without honor except in his own town, among his own relatives, and in his own home.”
Loved the video, I'm actually currently in highschool and studying in a school started from a non denominational church here in the Philippines (Jesus Is Lord College Foundation), still really appreciated the views and points from a Presbyterian pov. God Bless! ✝
Lol, the reason why I say I'm non denom is primarily because I don't know much about denominations. You could say I'm smooth brain on topics like this.
I’ve been wrestling with this for a while. The more I read and study, the more I find myself wanting more out of my peers in terms of biblical and traditional knowledge. I’m reading the Bible in full again (I’m in Deuteronomy as of writing) and I’m just finding myself always feeling as if no one in my congregation is interested in reading or educating themselves. For the sake of privacy I won’t say the name, but it’s a pretty high profile church. Our congregation on a theological level is pretty diverse, but most of us here are somewhere between Baptist and Reformed. I find myself agreeing with Reformed theology a lot, but I strictly reject Calvinism’s ideas of predestination. However, I’m finding myself rejecting Baptist/ND individualism and largely dispensational eschatology. Prayers needed for sure but this episode helped me feel not so crazy about my personal issues with my current church community.
Thanks for sharing your perspective. I think as a Baptist, I don't have to limit myself to just Baptist tradition. I can study and benefit from all Christian tradition.
I’m a member of a non-denominational church and I really want to try to convince my church leaders to adopt a Calvinist view of communion. Quarterly communion pains me so much.
I'm in the same position, recently my church even switched to doing communion on Sunday nights instead of monthly on Sunday mornings. I don't go on Sunday nights so that took away my opportunity for communion
@@Justin-yn5py Thank you, I do admire that about the RCC, although I believe there are other doctrinal positions that exclude the RCC from my consideration. I'm returning to college soon where I'll attend a traditional presbyterian church so I'll be good
Does it worship and glorify God? Then you're good. Just because you don't like a type of worship music doesn't make it invalid. Someone who is mute cannot sing hymns of any kind. Do we condemn their worship if it is with stringed instruments instead of with their voice? No, of course not! Well, I don't.
Non-denominational here, thanks for making this video, as well as your other denominational videos. I oftentimes didn't understand why people disagreed with non denominationalism. I can understand all of your points here. At the end of the day, I'm glad we can agree on the major parts of Christianity. God bless.
@DouglasGross6022 I don't disagree with him on any essential doctrine. Otherwise, he would consider non-denomonationals heretical. We consider each other heterodoxical, not heretics. Redeemed Zoomer is my brother in Christ, and that's that.
Spot on with a lot here. Yes, baptism should be delayed until the person can decide for themselves. Baptism has no inherent power, it doesn't save you. It is a public display of your faith in Jesus Christ. It's a fruit of your faith. If the sacraments actually do something, then either it doesn't matter in the long run because you are already saved by grace through faith (eph 2:8-9) and its for your own state of mind to feel closer to Christ, or they are what they are, symbolic actions we do in remembrance of Jesus & because it's a public declaration of our faith.
Love the work brother. I came from a non-denominational background, but I have been pulled deeper into the reformed tradition. I would say I'm a Presbyterian in every way except for infant baptism. My issue on the beauty question is that I think that the most pure worship is simple. Maybe you could make a video discussing this further.
While the “Baptist with a smoke machine” thing is a good joke I do think it’s misleading. There is one large but important difference between baptist and non-denominational that I think you’re missing. Baptists believe in the believers baptism, meaning that you MUST be baptized to join the church, whether that is by the church itself or by a previous church in a way the current one approves of. The vast majority of Non-denominational welcomes all, regardless of belief, baptism etc. The argument is typically that the gospel (being that non-denominational tend to overwhelmingly focus on the New Testament) will reach more people this way. Otherwise though you’re critique is fair, most are very similar.
When i really wanted to find a church, after finding christ, i picked Baptist. Ive still stuck with my church because they seem to be very bibicaly solid. They arent lgbtq affirming at all, and they make it a point that not only is the world a problem but so are we when we believe ourselves to be superior over others. My pastor is a very honest, down to earth guy who thinks going to church is not only important for us spiritually, but so we can support other christians. He also tries to follow up and ensure we are reading our bible. Whenever i move, im going to look for another church that isnt baptist, however.
Oh! You're quick! Lol I have no intention to look for a nondenominational church. They seem abit fruity to me. I knew even after finding Christ a year and a half ago that I didn't want a church with bizarre theology.......yet I picked baptist. Lol I did some reading up beforehand when I found my church. There's tons of churches in my small town, like 13 of them. So......alot to pick from. I definitely knew I didn't want lghdtv affirming and anything that just thought you to go with your heart over the bible and it's teachings. You know, sneaking new age garbage into into the church. For now, I feel my church is a good church home. I acknowledge that baptist pastors often do...whatever. But I really like my pastor and he's helped me a lot. It was a fantastic church to start with, but I want something more consistent and rooted in the bible after I leave here.
@@xcosminax Because, it seems like baptist churches are a mixed bag where the theology is controlled by the pastor. So, it seems like you won't know what you'll get. At least, that's the conclusion I've come to. I'm still going to do my research to come to my conclusions, but I also am going off of what people who have been in the faith longer than me say. My pastor even told me that a Baptist church can be a mixed bag, because the pastor essentially makes the theology. I have trust in my pastor because he seems to be very biblically accurate with his teachings. I haven't noticed anything weird in any sermons. Nothing that made me think "wait, that doesn't sound right."
@@MeatEatingVegan777 In some cases yes. I've visited my fair share of Baptist churches where this is the case, but I'm currently attending one now where the pastor follows Baptist theology and sounds like it is much like yours. People are imperfect, so many churches you go to there's going to be people and leaders that try and lead with their feelings and not what the Bible teaches. All denominations deal with that. I've lived in three different cities since turning 18 and in each I've found a Baptist church that is like you described. I completely respect Redeemed Zoomer's opinions on the topic of theology. I find his videos to be enlightening, and I don't think I've heard anything he claims to be fact to be untrue. I disagree that the church must be "institutional" like he says, but I agree that we must be active as Christians in the world and in our communities. Our presence should be seen. I don't think our measurer of how impactful a church is needs to be in the number of universities and hospitals a denomination has, but I understand his viewpoint. As he has said many times, he values knowledge and study and the denomination he's a part of values that.
100% understand what youre saying. Still gonna stay non demoninational but i still love your content and how you set up yourself. Maybe im in a reformed christian in a non demo disguise;)
The reason non-denominational churches will exist in places like Burger King or rented out spaces inside of a mall or even using schools on Sunday morning when no one's in the school is because of finances and the church being too big to host in their small group anymore but not having the money to erect a building. Just what I have been a part of in the past. My dad passed her to church for a long time and since we couldn't afford a building, we hosted services in our town's elementary school on Sunday morning when no one is at school. Once our church got big enough, my dad rented a space on the Town square in which we turn into a makeshift church cuz that's all we could afford to do initially. And my dad is very reverend and studies theology pretty deeply. He's got his master's in theology, reads Greek. and takes the Bible extremely seriously. I just wanted to demonstrate how the Pizza Hut or Burger King church isn't out of disrespect or trying to blend in to the world. But more of a matter of necessity out of money or church size.
Of course nondenominational churches won’t have hospitals and universities…. The other churches had a head start by hundreds and sometimes well over a thousand years. This was a silly criticism
Some Non Denominational Churches are really good. And it's good to not be stuck in flawed ridged traditions and interpretations of splintering denominations.
I have you ask you. When you imagine the kingdom on Earth, do you have an ideal vision of this? If you could EVER make a video describing what the ideal endgame kingdom, what does that look like to you? I really hope you can make a video talking about how the most ideal version of this would look and function. Thank you Edit: as I'm watching your video on why you're not a non-denominational, it looks like your Minecraft server is an idealist vision of heaven on Earth to me.
My father taught us (me and my brother) that being christian is not about the denomination of the church you frequent, but your relationship with God. He taught us that it is more important to follow what the Bible says than to follow what a church says. The reason for this is because, when someone does something just because the church tells them to do so, they don't have their own convictions and have a shallow faith. When they end up leaving the church, they start doing everything they didn't do when they were frequenting the church. After seeing the both sides of the story plus my father's opinion, I think that non-denominational churches are important to attract people to christianity by showing them what the Bible teaches without any bias, while denominational churches are very important for already converted christians who are seeking tradition and a deeper connection with God. I don't know whether to classify myself as a non-denominational or not but me and my family frequent the Seventh Day Adventist church, which we think is the church that follows the Bible the closest. Of course we cannot use the church as a crutch to our faith, we have to study the Bible for ourselves and follow it as close as we can. There is not a single statement in this text that I am 100% confident in, as I am still discovering my faith, but I hope to have contributed somehow.
@@WufflesGhosts I agree. I know everything humans do is biased, but I genuinely think the SDA Church bases its interpretations of the Bible in the Bible itself.
I think we need more ecumenical cooperation on charitable works as well as creating excellent institutions (hospitals, schools, etc.). It'd be great if instead of Presbyterian or Baptist or Catholic hospitals we just had Christian hospitals. The division doesn't paint a good picture for the secular world and not being tied to one particular denomination would safeguard against these institutions being affected by the kind of degeneration and takeover we've seen in the mainline churches. On another topic, would love to hear your thoughts on Molinism - perhaps as part of a series of a few dedicated videos on soteriological schools.
what books have you read in doing research on this? I go to a non-denominational church and I'm currently just trying to read the bible, church history, and about all denominations. Love your channel!
What I've noticed about contemporary worship music is that the message of the lyrics is more like a call to worship than actually worshiping. Rather than actually glorifying God, they are just songs about Christian themes.
One of the best theology books I have ever read was written by Chris Tomlin (yeah that guy) and it's on the seven Hebrew words of praise, And it's called Holy Roar!
I would be interested in hearing more about your views on the sacraments with more Bible references. This monologue was interesting, but you tended to reference sources other than Scripture. Love your stuff!
Say what you want about non-denominational 'smoke machine' churches, but they are filled with insane amounts of very firm believers, especially young people thanks, in part, to modern music praising God and k-pop dancing for jesus. They adapted to the culture and that is why they are on the rise. Is that good? I would say it is. For example, Golden Resurrection brought me back to christianity.
One gripe I have is saying contemporary music is subjectively bad. I mean I get it. Trust me I do, I despise Hillsong as much as the next guy but contemporary music as a term or even a group of music is so broad that just claiming it's bad strikes a chord with me since I do know about a lot of contemporary songs which are objectively good. Also all contemporary music isn't Hillsong. All that aside I do think there is room in christianity for contemporary music. I think that we can have a separation of christian songs to be sung in church and ones to be sung or listened to outside church. I've heard many gospel (the genre) songs sung or listened to by christians outside the church that are never sung inside church. My ideal view is that chants, hymns and more beautiful and traditional sounding contemporary music should be sung inside church. While more modern Hillsong like contemporary music could be listened to outside church similar to how one would listen to a secular song.
I prefer the interdenominationalist position: that different individual denominations will and should exist (among other things to limit the impact of failures like we have seen in the mainline churches, while still providing some level of accountability to individual congregations), that individuals should at any one time be affiliated I'm the mid-to-long term with a particular, spiritually healthy congregation, which ideally should be part of a denomination (to provide accountability and consistent fellowship for the individual), but that individuals should *not* be closely affiliated directly with a denomination (to minimize factionalism and to ensure that believers feel free to find what Christian fellowship is available if they move to an area where a denomination or broader tradition that they have henceforth attended is unavailable).
I would love to go to a church that looks like an old cathedral and plays old hymns (although I do like some of the contemporary music). But it seems like those churches are all either Catholic or woke (or both).
I think faith is more important than any sacrament and doing a baptism out of your own faith is much more impactful then being baptized as a baby where you didn’t get to experience making the decision for yourself as a declaration of your own faith.
“Nuance” is not an excuse for contradiction. If you believe that sacraments are necessary for salvation, then you do not believe that faith *alone* saves.
@@redeemedzoomer6053 There is only one truth. Faith alone literally means only faith saves you. If you think something other than faith also saves you, you do not believe faith alone saves you.
Lemme push back on that. There's no contradiction between saying "faith alone saves" and "Christ saves". I'm sure you already know that. There's no contradiction between saying "faith alone saves" and "being born again saves".
The thing about the church building not being holy anymore is all about the fact that we are to be holy not the building the body if christ is holy god dwells is within and among those who recognise, worship and follow him making US set apart not the building
What is your opinion on the Anglican “church for the sake of others” diocese? They have turned over 20 American nondenominational churches into Anglican churches over the last decade. They are converting the entire congregation at once.
9:10 - We Lutherans are very hyper-focused on doctrinal unity, but sometimes only on paper. The LCMS has more disunity within itself than it has with the WELS, with whom they they are not in fellowship. We’re not always that consistent in our standards for fellowship.
The thing about mainline churches (and the reason I’m non denominational) is that many of the mainline churches have order and all that and the nondenominational church may not, but the problem with order is many times it’s corrupt, power hungry, and of worldly goals, not of god.
See, I partly agree that baptism should be one's own choice, but that's coming from someone who was raised in the philosophy of "believe whatever you want to believe", as I was raised by a former Catholic now Atheist father and a Celtic Pagan mother; and the fact that I was baptised at 18 as my own choice
The problem with ritual is that it becomes common (and thus less holy) through repetition, then complacency sets in. A minister can learn the form of the liturgy without believing any of its content, and detecting his unbelief is made more difficult. The advantage to the evangelical extemporaneous style of service (I hesitate to say "the point", because not all evangelicals have thought it through equally well) is not that it is less intimidating to the culture, but that it keeps the mind fresh, forces the officiant to understand the faith in order to present it, and forces the congregation to listen if they are to have any clue what's going on.
In the explanation that 1 Peter 3:21 gives for why baptism saves, the Koine Greek word “Eperotema” is used. That is the only instance of that word in the entire NT from what I’ve heard. I’ve heard there are over 100 complete translations of the Bible, and I probably haven’t even looked through half of them, but eperotema was translated at least 15 different ways, including: question, answer, inquiry, interrogation, appeal, pledge, mark, response, demand, promise, request, testimony, examination, craving, asking. It is clearly a difficult verse to understand. It could very well be that baptism only “saves” because of the mental state that the person being baptized is proclaiming.
Small detail, but the LCMS is THE historic main line Lutheran church. Yes it’s not the largest but the largest is much younger and, at least in part, broke off from the LCMS. We shouldn’t allow this fact to be unknown or forgotten.
Jesus Culture released a new abulm on RUclips this week...I have lost count of how many "I am an atheist but there's really something different and special about this music!'' The Lord has moved in power and has shown His Glory though musicians, and people gifted in the art of lighting, AV, and mixing (as well as a host of other specialities) to use the "same methods" but with a DIFFERENT motivation and for not a temporary earthly purpose...but an ETERNAL God glorifying PURPOSE!
I try not to judge other congregations within Christianity, and I’ve always struggled with the non-denominational church because of my own experiences with some of them. I find the modern worship style to be very irreverent and unclear in terms of the messages of the readings each day. I’ve sang the same four songs and over at these churches, and it just made me cringe even as a child. It was like we were being pressured to express love for God as opposed to contemplating His Majesty and accepting Him in our hearts. It was very performative. That being said, the best church I’ve ever been to was a non-denominational biker church. Almost everyone there had struggled with some form of addiction or criminal history; including the pastors, who had to switch places with one another often because they were both personally involved in the treatment/rehabilitation of others. They treated themselves more as an inter-denominational community, likely because many of the members had left their original denominational churches when their struggles were met with judgement and pushback from the laypeople of those churches. Unlike these traditional/historical churches, the biker church saw nothing wrong with inconsistency in attendance or wavering of faith. As previously stated, almost everyone there were former or current drug addicts. It’s only natural that there might be some inconsistency for anyone there. So long as you were respectful of everyone and their journey, you were welcome to pray the rosary, engage in more traditional prayer, and discuss your beliefs with others at church outside of the actual service. If or when someone wanted to move onto another tradition they saw it as a win because they were ultimately seeking growth in Christ. A couple of notable former members still visited every once in a while after they joined another church to help with events or just to participate in Sunday worship there. To this day I know those people are much better and more devout Christians than many old mainline Christians than I could hope to be. Their faith is certainly stronger than mine. Any time I think demeaning or belittling thoughts about non-denominational or Baptist churches I try to turn my thoughts to the efforts and the people of the biker church.
I am non denominational but I do not hate you for giving your opinion, it's your opinion, so I'm not gonna hate you for it, I respect other people's lives and beliefs, as long as you do not push them onto me, cause I believe jesus said to love thy friends, family, and enemies, and even if that is a bit of a challenge for me, I still do it because I have to, I believe faith in jesus christ is the only way to get to heaven and the father alone, no good works can come close to getting into heaven, all our good works, god only sees as filthy rags, and nothing more, and yes christianity is not a religion it is a relationship, a "religion" is man made, christianity is a godly made thing, you use the word religion alot like it is the most important thing than Godly made things, and those rituals in "christian denominations" are not godly made considering the work has already done by jesus christ, like I said we can never do sooo good in this life to earn salvation, salvation is earned through faith and faith alone.
The reason why low churches believe that you should choose if you want to be baptized or not, and it can't be a decision of your church or family, is because salvation is an individual thing. Your relationship with God is personal, and so is your salvation. No one else can get saved for you, and dunking you in water won't mean anything if you're not participating in it. Furthermore, the sacraments are not a biblical requirement of salvation. Communion is good, it's good for your health, you should do it, but it's not a part of salvation and simply can't be, because if you have to constantly keep doing something to re-sanctify yourself, then the ultimate sacrifice isn't actually ultimate. Baptism, while symbolic, is also not necessary for salvation, as John the Baptist said that 'one who comes after me will baptize you in the holy spirit'. John baptized with water, but Jesus baptizes with the holy spirit, which is what happened at Pentecost. Thus, water baptism isn't required for salvation, because you are baptized with the holy spirit when you are saved. The issue with a lot of high churches is that, essentially, they want to be under the law, or under their own version of it. Instead of accepting grace and focusing on the relationship with God, they focus on tradition and physical acts, rules and regulations to prove their salvation. But we know your acts do not make you saved - Jesus said there would be many who come to him in the end and say 'I did these things for you, prophesized and drove out demons in your name' and he will say 'I never knew you'. Of course that doesn't mean we shouldn't do things like communion, or help our communities, or anything like that, but it's not a part of the requirements or tenets of salvation. As for traditionalism, the tradition is not really what's important. Jesus being the descendant of David isn't important because of tradition, it's important because he's the bloodline of King David, and because there were various other promises of importance specifically to deal with Jesus' bloodline that had to be satisfied, and therefore are necessary to make note of. There's nothing wrong with tradition, but what is more important than tradition is the reason for those traditions. Following tradition for tradition's sake is pointless. It isn't so important to feel or look holy as it is to *be* holy, and a beautiful church doesn't mean a holy one. It's all too easy to get distracted with tradition and appearances and loose the meat of what matters. And as for the thing you've said a few times about nondenominationals and their pastor - a pastor is just one resource. Though yes pentecostals and nonddenoms want you to focus most on the bible over what anyone else says, there are resources to go to - ample ones. There's all sorts of nondenom and pentecostal famous preachers and teachers and published books and studies. You have an incorrect view of this. I think because you value the church so highly you project those views on low churches. Rather than solely rely on the pastor, nondenoms and pentecostals are encouraged to find their own resources and build their own beliefs about their faith - primarily using the bible itself, but also by listening to other strong figures, according to whatever your belief is - like Smith, Lake, Osteen, Benny, or whoever.
Baptist with a smoke machine😂
Sad but true
Cool to see a oh yeah yeah brother here
@@xxrandmlinksxxbruh2419 oh yeah yeah man, we may be few in numbers but we will win
That was funny 😂
I have never been so quickly and thoroughly called out in my entire life. I looked like a child that just got caught with his hand in the cookie jar
I think the formerly-pizza-hut-church is actually kinda cute and endearing.
The person who made it has a really good sense of humour.
Don't get me wrong, I love it! The thing I criticize is the thing it's making fun of, not the pizza hut church itself
I think ive met who made it
Thought it was a McDonalds at first
Better a pizza hut become a church ,rather than a church become a pizza hut.
The idea of a pizza church is funny and adorable, I like it
@@Rich386aI saw a church turned into a pub in Oban, Scotland in 1997. They still had some of the pews lined up against the walls.
I have gone from being in denominational churches to nondenominational. We are tackling things in our community that the denominational churches won’t touch. They’ve even said so. We have a drug rehab program, we offer a sexual abuse/assault Recovery program, a depression recovery program and we’ve just started a ministry to single moms. I’m not seeing this done anywhere else in my area. So I’ll take the nondenominational Church who is working with people in the gutters of life. As we say, it’s all about Jesus.
May I ask what church you go to? My church is similar
@@Magentisy Impact Ministries in Elkton Virginia.
True, He didn't come for the righteous, He came for the sinners.
This right here, Jesus didn't come for the righteous, He came for the lost, and we are to be His hands and feet here on earth. Fellow non-denom here. Our church does the same stuff, we do a LOT of outreach in our local community. We have counselors for mental health issues, we have a food bank, and we're only expanding. We house the homeless and work with them to help them get on their feet. We have a ministry to college students that's been very successful.
Interesting, I have a church who does similar things like that, its called Grace Community Church in Arlington, TX. They try to find solutions for their local community.
I've gone to non-denominational churches my whole life, and honestly most things you say are correct. While we can agree to disagree on most things, I want to point out 2 important things that I think make us make sense. You pointed this out too at 1:15 and it's that we try hard to get as many people saved as possible. We are Evangelicals after all. Because of that, being the far and above primary thing, most of these churches neglect most tradition. We are only focused on what will get atheists to stay and listen. Some to a degree that detriments the church, others to what I believe is a healthy degree. In short, I think our churches can be a little shallow because we are facing the world much more than other denominations who tend to face inward much more. The second thing is when you quoted what many of us say, "Christianity is not a religion, it's a relationship with God." It's a perspective thing, when you think of religion, you think of all of the beautiful things associated with it, but when an atheist hears that word, they think of all of these mindless (I know they actually aren't, this is the atheist perspective) rituals that have to be done, and all of these rules that have to be followed perfectly or you'll go to Hell. When we say that, what we really mean is something like, "You don't have to be perfect to go to Heaven. The most important thing is getting close to God and his people, then He will change you."
I respect your position, but the way you talk about the Church makes me feel that it exists only to convert the people of the world, whereas, in my opinion, it should be a piece of the Kingdom of God here on Earth and that it is the place where we should praise our God. Furthermore, when you read the Bible, especially the Old Testament, it becomes clear that our God places a lot of emphasis on the "form" of worship. There seems to be too much focus on being a place that attracts people who don't believe in God by making them more open to the gospel than a place where people who have accepted the gospel come together to praise God. At least that was the impression I got from your comment and that I also get when I look at the worship style of these churches. Furthermore, more and more I see that young people who are more open to seeking God are precisely looking for beauty, structure and roots in tradition, something that they are not finding in the world.
Imperfectly put, I believe that the right emphasis should be to bring the Kingdom and Glory of God into the World and not to bring the World into the Kingdom of God.
@@pedroguimaraes6094 no I agree, I'm not saying that it's the correct or perfect way to go about it at all, I'm just explaining the thought process. I will however say that I don't know what youth you're reaching, but where I live, I find that my church isn't too jarring for my agnostic friends when they come. Obviously I've never invited anyone to come to a church like yours, so I don't know what their reactions are, but I've never gotten any negative backlash from it at least.
Well said
yeah.. it's kinda true. i dunno bout the theology of the sacraments still though. for now i keep baptism, and i'm on the fence with spiritual presence vs. memorialism
This was an excellent video. Thank you. As a Nondenominational Christian, you helped me appreciate many Chruch aspects I haven't fully considered. I ALWAYS find a Bible-based fundamental church, so natrually many of the churches I attended were denominational.
I'm an atheist but man this channel is pure gold.
I've always wondered about the many christian denominations, since i've only had contact with catholics and luterans so I always assumed there weren't that big of a difference in the denominations themselves.
Keep up with the good work!
Thank you, appreciate it!
Ready to harvest also has info on denominations.
Same here brotha, great channel
I've now commented two kinda critical takes on your videos so I kinda want to balance those out by saying I really appreciate the way you approach this channel. Your points are very well laid out, your delivery is very clear and understandable, and you speak in a way that encourages discussion and deeper thought. Even if I'm talking into the void of youtube comments, I have genuine fun thinking about the topics you bring up and thinking about my own faith and the reason that certain things make me want to respond. So thank you! Please keep making videos, even if I disagree on topics I do still like them!
Very well said indeed
So the reasons I AM Non-denom are 2 fold. The main reason is that I'm pretty new to the faith and don't know enough about theology to make an informed opinion about which denomination I think is the most correct, and I've never really been the type of person to just accept what others tell me is true. The 2nd reason is that the church I started attending is Non-denom and I love it. My pastor is awesome, the community nice and supportive, and I've made a lot of friends there. I don't really want to leave it.
What's more important to you? Friends, or God?
@Florida Man In the end, God is most important. Like I said, that was only a secondary reason. When a time comes that I feel like I have enough knowledge to properly choose a proper denomination, I will go to the appropriate church
@@floridaman318God wants you to make friends.
@floridaman318 this is an unfair question. OP is enjoying church and connecting with God. They should be able to enjoy the experience and make friends
As a young guy going to a non-Dom church, most of us don’t view our faith as a “get out of hell free card” lol
I definitely see the need for structural real Christianity. The institutions rn are so bad especially my methodist church I grew up in. We can fix it though.
Yeah I think non denom churches that are not kingdom centered are usually pre-mil so they don't believe in the we are the kingdom.
Unfortunately he seems to have a shaky understanding of non-doms.
@@Thedarkbunnyrabbit Yeah I think some non denom churches are bad because stuff like prosperity gospel can go unchecked. But I've also been to a non-denom church that left a denomination.
@@ThedarkbunnyrabbitI think you guys take everything he says to the full extent. The dude is pretty sarcastic and hyperbolic
"...whereas non-denominational 'liturgy' if you can call it that has been described as a concert and a Ted Talk." As someone who attends a non-denominational church this is freaking hilarious and pretty accurate in our case XD
I love how you don't agree with denominations but still let them have city's on your Minecraft server!
He is ecumenical.
"The difference between you and me is that I just believe the Bible and you just blindly follow the tradition of your denomination." That's what I used to believe while simultaneously not knowing ANYTHING about what various denominations and traditions actually believed. What a fool I was. Proverbs 18:13
I was raised non-denom, and had the same experience. Ironically, I was the one blindly following the traditions of American Christianity, whereas the mainliners I know are far more discerning and intelligent about their faith.
RZ has a pile of straw and gosh darnit he’s going to use it!
@@calebneff5777Such is the danger when laymen minister unto others. He is very entertaining, though, and possesses a good way of spreading the gospel.
worst response to a question is "well the bible doesn't teach that"
ok prove it. here's a text.
@@apalsnerg No man, the guy literally says that the sacraments are necessary for salvation. He is preaching works.
i used to go to a hyper pentecostal megachurch and recently just made the change and i was between a Reformed interdenom church and a non denom church. ultimately chose non denom church (bc of logistic and movilization) but what i like its how non-separatist my church is. like sometimes an anglican pastor preaches, sometimes an invited pentecostal preaches, bc at the end we’re all the body of Christ and we all need to unite (this weeks sermon was all about unity and fighting for the church in these trying times)
just wanted to note too that the first prebys church of my country was located next to my house but has been closed since the pandemic😭
that's pretty cool.
I misread the video title as "Why I AM a non-denominational" and I was shocked to my core for a bit.
My dad is a pastor and our church is non-denominational, but he's pastored at Baptist churches his entire life before coming to the one we're at now. When people ask me which denomination we are closest to I say Baptist for simplicity, but in reality we are just modern puritans. Incredibly traditional and pretty much one to one on puritan theology.
Edit 1: (Just got to the part where he mentions the 1689 confession) We hold the 1689 confession in SUPER-high regard
Well 1689 is purely Baptist, not Puritan. Puritans believe in infant baptism and real presence in the Lord's Supper. Puritans are just Presbyterians with Congregationalist church government and simpler worship
@@redeemedzoomer6053 Thats true, we used to joke when we were younger that we were just low-church Presbyterians that dont baptize babies, which is what the earliest baptists were. We have more in common with puritans than a lot of southern baptist "mega-churches"
@@redeemedzoomer6053 i love you
wooo! non-denominational representation! love it. i enjoyed this a lot. there were several thing that you said non-denominational churches often do/say/believe that i personally dont, and that i am pretty sure my church wouldnt either, but i do conform to a lot of the theological points that you ascribed to non-denominational churches.
one of the most frustrating things to me is the rejection of science within my church. and the thing is, i see this WAY more in the congregation than in the leadership. i dont think its a pastoral/leadership issue, i think its a communication/critical thinking issue
I technically attend a non-denominational church, but we don’t label ourselves as “nondenominational” we just call ourselves a Christian church, we simply follow Christ. We have our own traditions, and we still respect all denominations, only if they don’t contradict anything in the Bible of course.
And while we see a personal relationship with Jesus as very important, we also see things like evangelism, and the church itself very important too.
Fellow non-denoms, who else wants to go conquer a pizza hut for the glory of God? (we will use the smoke from cooking pizza in our worship)
For real, this channel has helped so much with my reversion to the Faith and to fill my desire to learn more. Keep up the good work and never stop spreading the Word!
The reason I have been non-denominational is that I have never found a denomination I have completely agreed with, and I never wanted to say that I was a part of one and then be associated with all the beliefs including the ones I don't agree with.
But watching this video and hearing about the cruciality of the unity of the church and the kingdom, I think I'm gonna start trying harder to find a church and denomination that I can truly be a part of so that I can start fighting for a stronger cause both for God and His Kingdom on earth. So that instead of being an independent grain of sand on a beach, I may become a brick united with many of my own to make up a castle.
(edit: one thing that I'd like to point out is that I believe that baptism is better when you are mature not because baptism isn't important, but because you have more of a choice to do so rather than just being forced, even if it's the right thing to do, it should be a matter of the person's choice.)
This is how I’ve felt about associating with “non denominational”. But I’ve been doing a lot more research lately and then this video came up and I can’t really say with confidence anymore that I can just associate with being non-denominational.
I honestly think non-denominational is the right way, however we do need to unite the churches
The thing is, I think non-denom is essentially pushing for the entirety of Christianity to be a united brick.
What I mean by that is that naturally, people aren't gonna agree on every single minor detail. So expecting "unity" to look like everyone being expected to just agree, is not gonna work.
I believe that "unity" means working together through disagreements and using those disagreements as opportunities to learn. I think non-denominationalism has the potential to be the most unified, because, if done right, it's an environment where everyone is free to share their theories and have them discussed.
Denominations feel like tribalism within Christianity, or politics, where you're expected to just choose a side and then go along with whatever they say. I think as Christians it would be better to view unity as like a mosaic, where we come together while having different opinions, cultures, etc, rather than to view unity as requiring homogenization.
If we need to all agree on the details to be unified, we'll never be unified.
I'm going to ask ChatGPT to write a persuasive essay on why Redeemed Zoomer is one week away from being Lutheran
Can you copy and paste the results here
hes one step away from being orthodox 🙏☦️
@@reigenlucilfer6154nah, he will definetly, totally become a Jonh McArthur clone somehow.
Lol
@@reigenlucilfer6154no, he’s one week away from Catholicism 💪💪💪🦅🦅🦅🦅🇻🇦🇻🇦🇻🇦🇵🇭🇻🇦🇻🇦🇻🇦🇻🇦
It's amazing how much respect you have for other denomination, it's truly how we should treat each other!
I grew up non-denominational and I can’t agree with you more on what you said here. it’s spot on accurate and is why I no longer associate myself with that denomination
My Brotha
Pls change your pfp
I'm gonna have to second wild_burn; you ought to reconsider that pfp.
Yeah might finally be time
@@toweringhorse2054 Where did you even find that image? Reverse image search says it's a crop from a hentai.
Bro, looking at your uploads rn. You seriously need to repent.
Indeed. I believe I got it from a cropped image, likely from some sort of hentai.
Recently rediscovered my faith and making strides to get better. Most of that stuff is from 2016.
But you’re right. Really need to get on the right track. Thanks for the nudge
I met Jesus at a Baptist Church when I was a young kid...I learned how to serve Him using my gifts and how to live out my faith and be an example to my peers in a (Baptist with a HAZE machine) Non Denominational Church. I participated income incredible ministries there, including playing in the Celebrate Recovery band they have!
Non-denominational churches are either baptist or charismatic (pentecostal). I think the region plays a large role. In the US, most non-denominational churches are baptist, in latin american countries like brazil they're mostly charismatic
I am a non denominational Christian but I dont have similar teachings from Baptist, But clearly I have strong influence of teaching, culture and tradition from oneness Pentecostal, Or charismatic background
Thanks @reformed zoomer videos like these are very useful for me. As I'm about to begin a theology course in order to become a local preacher in my Methodist church. Your videos are a great grounding so I was able to be confident of which demonination I was confident to commit to and also have a basic understanding which I will build on
Non-denominational churches don’t have to answer to anyone. There isn’t a higher governing body to hold a church accountable; it’s so much easier for pastors to form a cult of personality and become the much maligned “celebrity pastor”. There are much fewer Presbyterian and Lutheran celebrity pastors compared to Baptists/Non-denoms, in part because it’s easier for the former to be held accountable.
That's what elders, deacons and a church board are for. The pastor ought to be held accountable by the aforementioned.
@@User_Happy35 Absolutely and they are held accountable according to the scriptures
The only part that rubs me the wrong way in this video is the dig you have about non-denominational buildings and what churches look like.
The Church (upper case C) is set aside as holy, sacred, beautiful, and close to God. It is a community of believers and liturgical traditions. The church (lower case C) is just an earthly building where the Church happens to hang out. Large, grand cathedrals/churches are intimidating buildings, they're imposing, they are loud (visually loud, if that makes sense). And an unsaved person can very, very easily be scared away by such a thing.
As someone who is on the shy-er side, even now as a Christian I do feel a bit of trepidation walking into these large, grand, beautiful buildings on the rare occasion I do. Am I feeling the weight of the Spirit? Maybe just the weight of my own social anxiety or sins? Unsure. But if my local church, a converted movie theater had looked like one of these, I would not have been saved. I would not have joined the church because a gorgeous cathedral is NOT a welcoming building to someone who has not already felt God's love and ascribed it to Him. It is hostile and intimidating, especially if you do not know you can trust and be welcomed by those within. It is a building where you know you will be judged, where you know the people inside see themselves as different from you. This is not an attractive concept to someone who is not already a Christian. Someone unsaved does not think being judged by God is an act of love and an invitation from the Spirit to change. They do not know that while Christians are "set aside" it is not in a superior way and that they are invited to be set aside as well. How can they be taught this if modern culture has conditioned them to see the big scary building as a hostile place?
I am of the opinion that if your Church meeting in an old pizza hut causes at least more person to be saved than if meeting in a grand museum-looking building, that is a far better option. Trying to make a cathedral welcoming to strangers of the faith is an uphill battle.
I don't think a pizza hut church does cause more people to be saved than a cathedral church. I've heard countless stories of people being drawn in by the beauty of traditional Christianity
@@redeemedzoomer6053 That is fair, I'm sure some people have been drawn to the fancier parts of big churches. I can only speak from my own experience, and that says that a converted local business does more to create a welcoming air to strangers than a huge, expensive, beautiful cathedral.
I'm sure some people are drawn in by the beauty of traditional Christianity, but I don't think those people would have been turned off the road by a less ostentatious church building. In a culture that teaches people to be suspicious and cynical of traditional symbols of Christianity though, I think it's more important to get people in the door than to show off how much money goes in the offering bag. Let the beauty of the Church be shown through the community, not how fancy the windows are.
Non denominational churches are like the spirit halloweens of churches and that probably attributed to why I kept going and was saved there as a nonbeliever who had a traditional catholic high school experience that undermined my individuality as a traumatized teenager. The point about the music too I also disagree with. One thing I did always resonate with from those masses was the easily singable earworm hillsong music the choir performed that I always found myself singing to even as a non believer. Now I sing it loudly in worship and I think that counts for something. It really is just a matter of preference and personal experience. Even if its unapologetically kitschy it has its place in evangelism. It’s very accessible and meets those who don’t have a religious background at their level which I think is invaluable. I don’t think churches ran by humans are immune to cultural influences of the times either nor do I necessarily think they were meant to be. Sacredness is also not limited to just aesthetics
It's awesome to hear such a young man laying out such well thought out ideas. Kudos, RZ!
at one point i was nondenominational... who knows i still may be, i'm kinda stuck to it cuz the rest of my family is part of it. i was the kid to sit through the service and go through with the motions. i serve for the media team and play keys for the youth (teenager's) worship team; we're a bigger church in our area at least.
yesterday i felt super depressed. had been for a while now, and i was bored and didn't feel like doing anything after church. i thought, maybe i'll listen to worship. this time i didn't look up hillsong or maverick city, i searched "hymnals". i found a neat playlist and listened. before i knew it, i felt a few tears. i began singing the words out in my head (it was later at night so people were sleeping). at that moment i felt i could actually worship, not like i was listening to a band play in a concert. i felt useful for once. i never felt like i had any use in the kingdom of God because i couldn't feel comfortable worshiping Him, but i felt different at that time.
so what am i now? i think more baptist. i still believe in the spirit's power, but not in an emotional way like most charismatics do. i don't think anyone can just speak tongues... it's a prophetic gift. our "worship" shouldn't be about us... so why do we sing about ourselves? why do we repeat the same bland bridge with no meaningful lyrics twelve times? it's like repeatedly shoving food down a baby's throat, hoping they give in and swallow it. praise to God is through our songs of praise to Him only, our deeds unto others who are His creation, and honoring ourselves who are joined heirs with Christ. not an album called "My Story" with five 10 minute songs each singing about how happy you are cuz God solved all of your problems. worship is a celebration of the One who solved your problems, not the feeling you get from them being solved.
mr. zoomer, i will say that you've done me a great deed in opening my eyes to other possibilities of the Christian faith, and because of that i feel a lot more confident in myself. i thank you for that. may God bless you.
(note: i'm EmeraldCraft34 that was on the server. haven't been on in a while, but i'm going to try!)
God bless you. Never feel ashamed of feeling spiritually empty listening to offensively bad music when there is so much great sacred music written to the glory of God
I really like how you don't just say what's wrong about the different denominations, but actually say what they don't do as well. Like, your criticisms are about things that are very changeable without damaging the integrity of the different denominations.
That little rant at the end about flat eathers was hilarious 😂
zoomer i want to thank you for the content you make, when I found your channel God spoke through you(i wached the Gospel video) and renewed my faith in God, i'm determened to get rid of my addictions especially pornography adiccion and i haven't wached porn for a week, thank you for the content you make and evangelising you do through it! God bless!
not like "spoke through you" as a vision but as a metaphore for my renewed faith because it has gone numb for a few months
God bless! Even if you sin, you can always come to Jesus the savior every time
@@redeemedzoomer6053 amen brother!
In fairness, there are reasonable grounds to oppose denominationalism, and that is enough to distinguish nondenominational folks from baptist folks. I’ve been to baptist churches, and the occasional KJV-onlyism, membership requirements, closed communion, and/or Landmark Baptist views are annoying. There’s a general atmosphere of “we’re the only church that counts, and we don’t really want to fellowship with others” that thankfully isn’t shared by nondenominationals. At its best, nondenominationalism is the ultimate ecumenical mindset.
Not saying that makes nondenominational churches better than Baptist or anyone else. Just saying that the rejection of tribalism is important to a lot of people.
Edit in response to the video: I believe the sacraments are necessary and have a role in salvation, and I’m nondenominational. I’m also amillenial and I don’t believe in once saved always saved. There’s a fair amount of diversity among nondenominationals.
Edit 2: Saying that nondenominationalism is contrary to unity is like saying being a political independent is contrary to unity. Rejection of tribalism isn’t necessarily rejection of unity. I agree that it would be nice to see more cooperation (but not hierarchy) among nondenominational churches, however.
You are on point, my man
Yes you should oppose denominationalism and join the one Church Christ established
@@Justin-yn5py I did join Christ’s Church. As did many of my Baptist, Catholic, Lutheran, Methodist, Presbyterian, Pentecostal, Anglican, and Orthodox brothers and sisters, among many others. I’d just as soon say those are different Churches as I’d say the church at Galatia and the church at Corinth were from different Churches. In every case, God is the head of the Church, not man.
Edit: to view the New Testament teachings about the Church (singular) as a denominational label is deeply anachronistic, unless you’re supposing that denominations were already fractured during the time of the New Testament’s writing. Moreover, if you’ve studied the church fathers as much as my Catholic friends (which I assume you have - I respect your denomination’s zeal for church history), you would know the Catholic Church didn’t closely resemble itself throughout history. The era of immersion baptism, and the era of crusades/indulgences, and the modern era all have notable difference that would be denominational differences had they been contemporaneous with one another.
Spot on! I also hate the aspect of tribalism in denominations we are all in the body of Christ as the Bible says a house divided cannot stand
but if you see the sacraments as a means to salvation then you’re adding works as part of being saved and we are only saved through faith, not through our works. I think they’re important to do but not necessary in order to be saved.
Awesome video. Interesting that your first point is that you ARE concerned with the Kingdom, because when I, as a ND, bring up Kingdom theology to my more traditional friends they are usually confused by it. I find that ND churches preach the Kingdom most often of anyone, which is why it’s so easy to get them to work.
Follow up, listen to any major worship band. They aren’t from the mainlines and they all sing about the Kingdom way more than anything else, like so much more. As in they often forget to sing about the Gospel because they sing about the Kingdom so much. I won’t flame you, I think maybe you’ve made this point based on expectation rather than fact. It’s fine, hopefully this is good news.
You ask how many universities ND churches have founded, but this is applying the wrong standard to them. First, how many mainlines have any involvement in those universities? Maybe one in the last 200 years? Sure you can say that mainlines found schools, but they haven’t stepped up to the plate to tend to them over time. And to ask a similar question, how many mainlines are putting out music, movies, books, getting involved in politics (especially at the local level), or are trying to influence curriculum positively? Are there any? Sure you might say that Christian music and movies suck, but we’re trying. That’s literally my job, to help Christians get their music out into the world to spread the glory of God as much as possible (and there’s lot of good music if you get past KLOVE). NDs try, and mainlines just don’t, at least not in the living memory. People often question the longevity of evangelical churches, but realistically, mainline churches haven’t shown any longevity either. When culture pushes back on Christianity, mainlines sit back and take it, because they know how to manage existing power, they don’t know how to seize it, and evangelicals do, and that’s why ND churches are growing. It’s not the smoke and music and flashy baptisms, it’s the boldness and passion. When Methodists are afraid to say that forcing kids to get puberty blockers is wrong, non-denoms are proud to scream that pre-marital sex is sinful. We tend to operate on a whole other level of conviction, and that means that we want to take over culture at all levels, not just the highest.
@lina12lamm46I’m just responding to points as they come up. It’s not spam, it’s an attempt at a conversation. You don’t have to click on the expand button.
I have always questioned the sacraments and traditions. Thank you for opening up my mind to take them more seriously.
As a Non-denominational Christian, I agree. I believe that Protestants, Historical or Non-denominational, show adhere to the basic traditions of Protestantism. To me, a "true" Non-denominational church would be a Protestant Church, that practices more traditional aspects of Protestant Christianity, but does claim a particular denomination. Essentially, a Protestant church, with more traditional/orthodox beliefs on the Sacraments, worship music, etc. but doesn't claim to be a part of any denomination. This is why I like to call myself an Apostolic Protestant, as because I am a Non-denominational Protestant, but I have a more Catholic/Apostolic leaning theology.
I'm non-denominationalist but I get where the concerns are. In my experience, there's two kinds of non-denominationalist Christians:
1 - people who are non-denom because they just want to seek truth, and listen to any other Christians for wisdom and compare various understandings rather than just sticking to what a specific denomination believes, as to get a rounded belief where each aspect and interpretation you believe, comes from hearing all the different sides and comparing their evidence and reasoning. While being willing to be challenged by all other Christians on these beliefs, iron sharpens iron.
2 - People who are the exact opposite, and are non-denom because they just want to ignore scripture and other Christians and just do whatever they want.
As for the concerns about unity, I think non-denom is pushing for Christianity to be a unified.
What I mean by that is that naturally, people aren't gonna agree on every single minor detail. So expecting "unity" to look like everyone being expected to just agree, is not gonna work.
I believe that "unity" means working together through disagreements and using those disagreements as opportunities to learn. I think non-denominationalism has the potential to be the most unified, because, if done right, it's an environment where everyone is free to share their theories and have them discussed.
Denominations feel like tribalism within Christianity, or politics, where you're expected to just choose a side and then go along with whatever they say. I think as Christians it would be better to view unity as like a mosaic, where we come together while having different opinions, cultures, etc, rather than to view unity as requiring homogenization.
If we need to all agree on the details to be unified, we'll never be unified.
I can agree with some of your theology and also agree with the issues of non-denominational because we do need to unite the churches regardless of denomination. I hesitate with your reasoning on other aspects because they were your own personal beliefs instead of being backed by something solid. I'd continue to ask Jesus for direction just like I do to because somethings you said will make me ponder. Keep advancing the kingdom
I love your videos and recommend them to many young men I'm discipling. You do a wonderful job explaining difficult topics and you're very knowledgeable (and funny!). Great job man!
Now, as a non-denominational guy myself, I think it's hilarious how you make the baptist comparison. I agree with you on many points and disagree with a lot of my non-denominational mentors' views on sacraments/baptism/role of the Holy Spirit.
A couple things I respectfully disagree with you on is the significance and effect of the sacraments as well as the importance of the Church as an institution. For my explanation to people on the sacraments: baptism is an external action due to the internal action of repentance and coming to faith in Christ. And, communion is the affirmation of our "communal" ;) faith in Christ. It is a memorial of Christ's sacrifice and resurrection and a time of communal prayer for the sins of the body.
I would argue that by putting the emphasis on the Church and its institutional significance, we run into the very same and many dangers we see throughout the history of the Church.
I respect your view of the non-denominational church as a "denomination" (lol) and agree with you on many of the points you had. I'd say it's just a slight difference of view when it comes to certain things that mainline denominations like to hang onto (tradition, liturgy, sacrament focus) and how these slight differences end up being disagreements at the end of the day.
Thanks for your kind comment! I think it's funny though, in the 2nd paragraph you said "we're not Baptist" then proceeded to confess a purely Baptist view of the sacraments and the church in the 3rd paragraph haha
@@redeemedzoomer6053 as the running joke goes: "Non-denominationals are just Baptists" hahaha
there's still some differences! No conferences/conventions running the show and no external governance over the local body to name a couple of examples!
I'm non denominational, and I have to say I agree with a lot of your criticisms. Since I started watching your channel I was convinced to look into Protestant churches like Methodist (my first choice), Lutheran, Anglican etc.
i love kingdomcraft, but the drawing video's are so much easier to follow
yeah, the drawing videos are more cut to the point
what drawing videos?
You can just listen to the video
@@em.the.awful.waffle yeah true, but the pictures with bulletpoints makes it a little bit easier
Can't wait for the "Why I'm not Eastern Orthodox" video!
He did that already.
@@FromElsewhear I know, but he said the one he did a while ago was poorly researched and that he is remaking it.
cant wait to read the comments 🥳
Catholic churches in the Western United States (with weird exceptions like the California Missions) are often modern in the suburbs, but historic in the cities. The historic Catholic city churches could use Reconquista as well -- just commute on Sunday too, traffic is much nicer. =)
Although speaking of the California Missions, a lot of them aren't operational parish churches anymore, and they would benefit from a congregation dedicated to their care and maintenance.
Leonardo Torres has a lot of videos of him reacting to Hillsong and other contemporary worship songs as a non Christian and he is literally crying saying how beautiful it is.
Bruh. You could have just had the first eleven seconds of video and said "Because Non-Denominationals don''t build *this.*
EDIT: OMG, your video was exactly that.
HAHAHA more than that, but also that
This is so helpful, thank you! It helps put into words the sense I’ve had about why church (non denom) doesn’t feel necessary, and why.
Around 22:30 you brought up a lack of severance in non denominational worship and as a non denominational I unfortunately agree some churches I've been too are almost disrespectful during service John Bevere a non denominational pastor has a really good book called the Awe of God and it talks about this problem as well.
The KingdomCraft movie has finally dropped
I think you missed the fact that nondenominationals promote not just your relationship with Jesus, but encourage you to give a heart to know Him, acting on and heeding the scripture. And this is what we take with us to every institution we operate in- work, school, hospitals. Acting in alignment to our Faith and encouraging others to do so. And there are non denominational chains that have a broader impact on communities through the wide spread of their members, education opportunities, and a Christ centric focus. Mark 6:4 “A prophet is not without honor except in his own town, among his own relatives, and in his own home.”
Someone on the Minecraft server guessed this. Props to them
Can we appreciate and love how many different Christian religions are subscribed to Redeemed Zoomer 😂❤
Loved the video, I'm actually currently in highschool and studying in a school started from a non denominational church here in the Philippines (Jesus Is Lord College Foundation), still really appreciated the views and points from a Presbyterian pov. God Bless! ✝
Lol, the reason why I say I'm non denom is primarily because I don't know much about denominations. You could say I'm smooth brain on topics like this.
I’ve been wrestling with this for a while. The more I read and study, the more I find myself wanting more out of my peers in terms of biblical and traditional knowledge. I’m reading the Bible in full again (I’m in Deuteronomy as of writing) and I’m just finding myself always feeling as if no one in my congregation is interested in reading or educating themselves. For the sake of privacy I won’t say the name, but it’s a pretty high profile church.
Our congregation on a theological level is pretty diverse, but most of us here are somewhere between Baptist and Reformed. I find myself agreeing with Reformed theology a lot, but I strictly reject Calvinism’s ideas of predestination.
However, I’m finding myself rejecting Baptist/ND individualism and largely dispensational eschatology.
Prayers needed for sure but this episode helped me feel not so crazy about my personal issues with my current church community.
Thanks for sharing your perspective. I think as a Baptist, I don't have to limit myself to just Baptist tradition. I can study and benefit from all Christian tradition.
Same as a Non Dem.
Not using a stone cutter to make those bricks hurts
Ikr
I’m a member of a non-denominational church and I really want to try to convince my church leaders to adopt a Calvinist view of communion. Quarterly communion pains me so much.
I’m thankful that we do monthly communion at our church.
@@CCS-EO it should be done every Sunday if not everyday
I'm in the same position, recently my church even switched to doing communion on Sunday nights instead of monthly on Sunday mornings. I don't go on Sunday nights so that took away my opportunity for communion
@@adamlove592 in the Catholic Church you can receive the body of Christ every single day
@@Justin-yn5py Thank you, I do admire that about the RCC, although I believe there are other doctrinal positions that exclude the RCC from my consideration. I'm returning to college soon where I'll attend a traditional presbyterian church so I'll be good
You know I’d love to see you debunk a few of those Atheist RUclips channels talking points, Darkmatter2525 in particular
I’m commenting so the algorithm shows this to more people - as a non denominational person who loves theology
Same 🙌
Bethel and Hillsong have loads of calm and contemplative worship!
Does it worship and glorify God? Then you're good. Just because you don't like a type of worship music doesn't make it invalid. Someone who is mute cannot sing hymns of any kind. Do we condemn their worship if it is with stringed instruments instead of with their voice? No, of course not! Well, I don't.
Non-denominational here, thanks for making this video, as well as your other denominational videos. I oftentimes didn't understand why people disagreed with non denominationalism. I can understand all of your points here. At the end of the day, I'm glad we can agree on the major parts of Christianity. God bless.
There are essential doctrine, not just major parts. Did you miss that?
@DouglasGross6022 I don't disagree with him on any essential doctrine. Otherwise, he would consider non-denomonationals heretical. We consider each other heterodoxical, not heretics. Redeemed Zoomer is my brother in Christ, and that's that.
Love this video!! Thanks for taking the time to explain! May the Lord our God continue to be with you brother❤️
Spot on with a lot here. Yes, baptism should be delayed until the person can decide for themselves. Baptism has no inherent power, it doesn't save you. It is a public display of your faith in Jesus Christ. It's a fruit of your faith. If the sacraments actually do something, then either it doesn't matter in the long run because you are already saved by grace through faith (eph 2:8-9) and its for your own state of mind to feel closer to Christ, or they are what they are, symbolic actions we do in remembrance of Jesus & because it's a public declaration of our faith.
Love the work brother. I came from a non-denominational background, but I have been pulled deeper into the reformed tradition. I would say I'm a Presbyterian in every way except for infant baptism.
My issue on the beauty question is that I think that the most pure worship is simple. Maybe you could make a video discussing this further.
While the “Baptist with a smoke machine” thing is a good joke I do think it’s misleading. There is one large but important difference between baptist and non-denominational that I think you’re missing.
Baptists believe in the believers baptism, meaning that you MUST be baptized to join the church, whether that is by the church itself or by a previous church in a way the current one approves of. The vast majority of Non-denominational welcomes all, regardless of belief, baptism etc. The argument is typically that the gospel (being that non-denominational tend to overwhelmingly focus on the New Testament) will reach more people this way.
Otherwise though you’re critique is fair, most are very similar.
When i really wanted to find a church, after finding christ, i picked Baptist. Ive still stuck with my church because they seem to be very bibicaly solid. They arent lgbtq affirming at all, and they make it a point that not only is the world a problem but so are we when we believe ourselves to be superior over others. My pastor is a very honest, down to earth guy who thinks going to church is not only important for us spiritually, but so we can support other christians. He also tries to follow up and ensure we are reading our bible.
Whenever i move, im going to look for another church that isnt baptist, however.
If you're avoiding Baptist, know that non-denominational is the same theology as Baptist lol
Oh! You're quick! Lol
I have no intention to look for a nondenominational church. They seem abit fruity to me. I knew even after finding Christ a year and a half ago that I didn't want a church with bizarre theology.......yet I picked baptist. Lol
I did some reading up beforehand when I found my church. There's tons of churches in my small town, like 13 of them. So......alot to pick from. I definitely knew I didn't want lghdtv affirming and anything that just thought you to go with your heart over the bible and it's teachings. You know, sneaking new age garbage into into the church.
For now, I feel my church is a good church home. I acknowledge that baptist pastors often do...whatever. But I really like my pastor and he's helped me a lot. It was a fantastic church to start with, but I want something more consistent and rooted in the bible after I leave here.
Curious, why you would want to not go to a Baptist church if your experience is so positive and you agree with your pastors teaching and leadership?
@@xcosminax Because, it seems like baptist churches are a mixed bag where the theology is controlled by the pastor. So, it seems like you won't know what you'll get.
At least, that's the conclusion I've come to.
I'm still going to do my research to come to my conclusions, but I also am going off of what people who have been in the faith longer than me say. My pastor even told me that a Baptist church can be a mixed bag, because the pastor essentially makes the theology.
I have trust in my pastor because he seems to be very biblically accurate with his teachings. I haven't noticed anything weird in any sermons. Nothing that made me think "wait, that doesn't sound right."
@@MeatEatingVegan777 In some cases yes. I've visited my fair share of Baptist churches where this is the case, but I'm currently attending one now where the pastor follows Baptist theology and sounds like it is much like yours. People are imperfect, so many churches you go to there's going to be people and leaders that try and lead with their feelings and not what the Bible teaches. All denominations deal with that. I've lived in three different cities since turning 18 and in each I've found a Baptist church that is like you described.
I completely respect Redeemed Zoomer's opinions on the topic of theology. I find his videos to be enlightening, and I don't think I've heard anything he claims to be fact to be untrue. I disagree that the church must be "institutional" like he says, but I agree that we must be active as Christians in the world and in our communities. Our presence should be seen. I don't think our measurer of how impactful a church is needs to be in the number of universities and hospitals a denomination has, but I understand his viewpoint. As he has said many times, he values knowledge and study and the denomination he's a part of values that.
100% understand what youre saying. Still gonna stay non demoninational but i still love your content and how you set up yourself. Maybe im in a reformed christian in a non demo disguise;)
The reason non-denominational churches will exist in places like Burger King or rented out spaces inside of a mall or even using schools on Sunday morning when no one's in the school is because of finances and the church being too big to host in their small group anymore but not having the money to erect a building. Just what I have been a part of in the past. My dad passed her to church for a long time and since we couldn't afford a building, we hosted services in our town's elementary school on Sunday morning when no one is at school. Once our church got big enough, my dad rented a space on the Town square in which we turn into a makeshift church cuz that's all we could afford to do initially. And my dad is very reverend and studies theology pretty deeply. He's got his master's in theology, reads Greek. and takes the Bible extremely seriously. I just wanted to demonstrate how the Pizza Hut or Burger King church isn't out of disrespect or trying to blend in to the world. But more of a matter of necessity out of money or church size.
Right, but part of my criticism of non-denominational churches is that not being part of an old denomination means lacking resources
Of course nondenominational churches won’t have hospitals and universities…. The other churches had a head start by hundreds and sometimes well over a thousand years. This was a silly criticism
There are hundreds of Christians who go to non denominational churches glorifying God by working in hospitals and universities!
@@hiptoalieu They’re not talking about people who WORK in those places lol.
I would be interested in a video about Mary, confessing sins to priests, and other Catholics beliefs and where Presbyterians differ.
Unless of course you already made videos on that subject 😅
Some Non Denominational Churches are really good. And it's good to not be stuck in flawed ridged traditions and interpretations of splintering denominations.
I have you ask you. When you imagine the kingdom on Earth, do you have an ideal vision of this? If you could EVER make a video describing what the ideal endgame kingdom, what does that look like to you? I really hope you can make a video talking about how the most ideal version of this would look and function. Thank you
Edit: as I'm watching your video on why you're not a non-denominational, it looks like your Minecraft server is an idealist vision of heaven on Earth to me.
My father taught us (me and my brother) that being christian is not about the denomination of the church you frequent, but your relationship with God. He taught us that it is more important to follow what the Bible says than to follow what a church says. The reason for this is because, when someone does something just because the church tells them to do so, they don't have their own convictions and have a shallow faith. When they end up leaving the church, they start doing everything they didn't do when they were frequenting the church. After seeing the both sides of the story plus my father's opinion, I think that non-denominational churches are important to attract people to christianity by showing them what the Bible teaches without any bias, while denominational churches are very important for already converted christians who are seeking tradition and a deeper connection with God. I don't know whether to classify myself as a non-denominational or not but me and my family frequent the Seventh Day Adventist church, which we think is the church that follows the Bible the closest. Of course we cannot use the church as a crutch to our faith, we have to study the Bible for ourselves and follow it as close as we can. There is not a single statement in this text that I am 100% confident in, as I am still discovering my faith, but I hope to have contributed somehow.
Same grew up 7th Day Adventist and was told the same by my aunt and grandmother.
@@WufflesGhosts I agree. I know everything humans do is biased, but I genuinely think the SDA Church bases its interpretations of the Bible in the Bible itself.
I think we need more ecumenical cooperation on charitable works as well as creating excellent institutions (hospitals, schools, etc.). It'd be great if instead of Presbyterian or Baptist or Catholic hospitals we just had Christian hospitals. The division doesn't paint a good picture for the secular world and not being tied to one particular denomination would safeguard against these institutions being affected by the kind of degeneration and takeover we've seen in the mainline churches.
On another topic, would love to hear your thoughts on Molinism - perhaps as part of a series of a few dedicated videos on soteriological schools.
what books have you read in doing research on this? I go to a non-denominational church and I'm currently just trying to read the bible, church history, and about all denominations. Love your channel!
lol nvm you listed a book but anything else helps
FYI, you can use a StoneCutter to make stone bricks 1:1. Might be easier than crafting them.
What I've noticed about contemporary worship music is that the message of the lyrics is more like a call to worship than actually worshiping. Rather than actually glorifying God, they are just songs about Christian themes.
One of the best theology books I have ever read was written by Chris Tomlin (yeah that guy) and it's on the seven Hebrew words of praise, And it's called Holy Roar!
I would be interested in hearing more about your views on the sacraments with more Bible references. This monologue was interesting, but you tended to reference sources other than Scripture. Love your stuff!
Say what you want about non-denominational 'smoke machine' churches, but they are filled with insane amounts of very firm believers, especially young people thanks, in part, to modern music praising God and k-pop dancing for jesus. They adapted to the culture and that is why they are on the rise. Is that good? I would say it is. For example, Golden Resurrection brought me back to christianity.
One gripe I have is saying contemporary music is subjectively bad. I mean I get it. Trust me I do, I despise Hillsong as much as the next guy but contemporary music as a term or even a group of music is so broad that just claiming it's bad strikes a chord with me since I do know about a lot of contemporary songs which are objectively good. Also all contemporary music isn't Hillsong.
All that aside I do think there is room in christianity for contemporary music. I think that we can have a separation of christian songs to be sung in church and ones to be sung or listened to outside church. I've heard many gospel (the genre) songs sung or listened to by christians outside the church that are never sung inside church.
My ideal view is that chants, hymns and more beautiful and traditional sounding contemporary music should be sung inside church. While more modern Hillsong like contemporary music could be listened to outside church similar to how one would listen to a secular song.
I prefer the interdenominationalist position: that different individual denominations will and should exist (among other things to limit the impact of failures like we have seen in the mainline churches, while still providing some level of accountability to individual congregations), that individuals should at any one time be affiliated I'm the mid-to-long term with a particular, spiritually healthy congregation, which ideally should be part of a denomination (to provide accountability and consistent fellowship for the individual), but that individuals should *not* be closely affiliated directly with a denomination (to minimize factionalism and to ensure that believers feel free to find what Christian fellowship is available if they move to an area where a denomination or broader tradition that they have henceforth attended is unavailable).
I would love to go to a church that looks like an old cathedral and plays old hymns (although I do like some of the contemporary music). But it seems like those churches are all either Catholic or woke (or both).
I have a map is there description of beautiful old Protestant churches
I think faith is more important than any sacrament and doing a baptism out of your own faith is much more impactful then being baptized as a baby where you didn’t get to experience making the decision for yourself as a declaration of your own faith.
“Nuance” is not an excuse for contradiction. If you believe that sacraments are necessary for salvation, then you do not believe that faith *alone* saves.
Martin Luther believed sacraments are necessary for salvation. Are you saying the guy who coined the term "faith alone" didn't believe in faith alone?
@@redeemedzoomer6053 If he thought they did, then logically yes, even if you revere him and think him to be an outstanding theologian.
@@rafdaguy6103 You don't think it's POSSIBLE that the two can be compatible? Saying Baptism saves and salvation is by faith alone?
@@redeemedzoomer6053 There is only one truth. Faith alone literally means only faith saves you. If you think something other than faith also saves you, you do not believe faith alone saves you.
Lemme push back on that. There's no contradiction between saying "faith alone saves" and "Christ saves". I'm sure you already know that. There's no contradiction between saying "faith alone saves" and "being born again saves".
The thing about the church building not being holy anymore is all about the fact that we are to be holy not the building the body if christ is holy god dwells is within and among those who recognise, worship and follow him making US set apart not the building
What is your opinion on the Anglican “church for the sake of others” diocese? They have turned over 20 American nondenominational churches into Anglican churches over the last decade. They are converting the entire congregation at once.
9:10 - We Lutherans are very hyper-focused on doctrinal unity, but sometimes only on paper. The LCMS has more disunity within itself than it has with the WELS, with whom they they are not in fellowship. We’re not always that consistent in our standards for fellowship.
The thing about mainline churches (and the reason I’m non denominational) is that many of the mainline churches have order and all that and the nondenominational church may not, but the problem with order is many times it’s corrupt, power hungry, and of worldly goals, not of god.
how do you know that order is more corrupt than chaos?
@@redeemedzoomer6053do you dislike baptist?
See, I partly agree that baptism should be one's own choice, but that's coming from someone who was raised in the philosophy of "believe whatever you want to believe", as I was raised by a former Catholic now Atheist father and a Celtic Pagan mother; and the fact that I was baptised at 18 as my own choice
The problem with ritual is that it becomes common (and thus less holy) through repetition, then complacency sets in. A minister can learn the form of the liturgy without believing any of its content, and detecting his unbelief is made more difficult.
The advantage to the evangelical extemporaneous style of service (I hesitate to say "the point", because not all evangelicals have thought it through equally well) is not that it is less intimidating to the culture, but that it keeps the mind fresh, forces the officiant to understand the faith in order to present it, and forces the congregation to listen if they are to have any clue what's going on.
In the explanation that 1 Peter 3:21 gives for why baptism saves, the Koine Greek word “Eperotema” is used. That is the only instance of that word in the entire NT from what I’ve heard. I’ve heard there are over 100 complete translations of the Bible, and I probably haven’t even looked through half of them, but eperotema was translated at least 15 different ways, including: question, answer, inquiry, interrogation, appeal, pledge, mark, response, demand, promise, request, testimony, examination, craving, asking.
It is clearly a difficult verse to understand. It could very well be that baptism only “saves” because of the mental state that the person being baptized is proclaiming.
Small detail, but the LCMS is THE historic main line Lutheran church. Yes it’s not the largest but the largest is much younger and, at least in part, broke off from the LCMS. We shouldn’t allow this fact to be unknown or forgotten.
I’ve been to a non denominational church and a strictly baptist church. The baptist church most definitely felt and was more sacred.
The extent to which a church is denominationless is directly proportional to the number of walls and ceilings without drywall
Why does this comment not have more likes!! Hilarious 😂😂😂
Jesus Culture released a new abulm on RUclips this week...I have lost count of how many "I am an atheist but there's really something different and special about this music!''
The Lord has moved in power and has shown His Glory though musicians, and people gifted in the art of lighting, AV, and mixing (as well as a host of other specialities) to use the "same methods" but with a DIFFERENT motivation and for not a temporary earthly purpose...but an ETERNAL God glorifying PURPOSE!
The thing you said about traditional music is very true. Even Muslims enjoy the Psalms in Arabic.
I try not to judge other congregations within Christianity, and I’ve always struggled with the non-denominational church because of my own experiences with some of them. I find the modern worship style to be very irreverent and unclear in terms of the messages of the readings each day. I’ve sang the same four songs and over at these churches, and it just made me cringe even as a child. It was like we were being pressured to express love for God as opposed to contemplating His Majesty and accepting Him in our hearts. It was very performative.
That being said, the best church I’ve ever been to was a non-denominational biker church. Almost everyone there had struggled with some form of addiction or criminal history; including the pastors, who had to switch places with one another often because they were both personally involved in the treatment/rehabilitation of others. They treated themselves more as an inter-denominational community, likely because many of the members had left their original denominational churches when their struggles were met with judgement and pushback from the laypeople of those churches. Unlike these traditional/historical churches, the biker church saw nothing wrong with inconsistency in attendance or wavering of faith. As previously stated, almost everyone there were former or current drug addicts. It’s only natural that there might be some inconsistency for anyone there. So long as you were respectful of everyone and their journey, you were welcome to pray the rosary, engage in more traditional prayer, and discuss your beliefs with others at church outside of the actual service. If or when someone wanted to move onto another tradition they saw it as a win because they were ultimately seeking growth in Christ. A couple of notable former members still visited every once in a while after they joined another church to help with events or just to participate in Sunday worship there.
To this day I know those people are much better and more devout Christians than many old mainline Christians than I could hope to be. Their faith is certainly stronger than mine. Any time I think demeaning or belittling thoughts about non-denominational or Baptist churches I try to turn my thoughts to the efforts and the people of the biker church.
Your story made me cry tears of joy. We truly have an awesome savior. Those among us who need it most are being served by God's people.
Sounds like the church I attend now.
I am non denominational but I do not hate you for giving your opinion, it's your opinion, so I'm not gonna hate you for it, I respect other people's lives and beliefs, as long as you do not push them onto me, cause I believe jesus said to love thy friends, family, and enemies, and even if that is a bit of a challenge for me, I still do it because I have to, I believe faith in jesus christ is the only way to get to heaven and the father alone, no good works can come close to getting into heaven, all our good works, god only sees as filthy rags, and nothing more, and yes christianity is not a religion it is a relationship, a "religion" is man made, christianity is a godly made thing, you use the word religion alot like it is the most important thing than Godly made things, and those rituals in "christian denominations" are not godly made considering the work has already done by jesus christ, like I said we can never do sooo good in this life to earn salvation, salvation is earned through faith and faith alone.
The reason why low churches believe that you should choose if you want to be baptized or not, and it can't be a decision of your church or family, is because salvation is an individual thing. Your relationship with God is personal, and so is your salvation. No one else can get saved for you, and dunking you in water won't mean anything if you're not participating in it. Furthermore, the sacraments are not a biblical requirement of salvation. Communion is good, it's good for your health, you should do it, but it's not a part of salvation and simply can't be, because if you have to constantly keep doing something to re-sanctify yourself, then the ultimate sacrifice isn't actually ultimate. Baptism, while symbolic, is also not necessary for salvation, as John the Baptist said that 'one who comes after me will baptize you in the holy spirit'. John baptized with water, but Jesus baptizes with the holy spirit, which is what happened at Pentecost. Thus, water baptism isn't required for salvation, because you are baptized with the holy spirit when you are saved. The issue with a lot of high churches is that, essentially, they want to be under the law, or under their own version of it. Instead of accepting grace and focusing on the relationship with God, they focus on tradition and physical acts, rules and regulations to prove their salvation. But we know your acts do not make you saved - Jesus said there would be many who come to him in the end and say 'I did these things for you, prophesized and drove out demons in your name' and he will say 'I never knew you'. Of course that doesn't mean we shouldn't do things like communion, or help our communities, or anything like that, but it's not a part of the requirements or tenets of salvation.
As for traditionalism, the tradition is not really what's important. Jesus being the descendant of David isn't important because of tradition, it's important because he's the bloodline of King David, and because there were various other promises of importance specifically to deal with Jesus' bloodline that had to be satisfied, and therefore are necessary to make note of. There's nothing wrong with tradition, but what is more important than tradition is the reason for those traditions. Following tradition for tradition's sake is pointless. It isn't so important to feel or look holy as it is to *be* holy, and a beautiful church doesn't mean a holy one. It's all too easy to get distracted with tradition and appearances and loose the meat of what matters.
And as for the thing you've said a few times about nondenominationals and their pastor - a pastor is just one resource. Though yes pentecostals and nonddenoms want you to focus most on the bible over what anyone else says, there are resources to go to - ample ones. There's all sorts of nondenom and pentecostal famous preachers and teachers and published books and studies. You have an incorrect view of this. I think because you value the church so highly you project those views on low churches. Rather than solely rely on the pastor, nondenoms and pentecostals are encouraged to find their own resources and build their own beliefs about their faith - primarily using the bible itself, but also by listening to other strong figures, according to whatever your belief is - like Smith, Lake, Osteen, Benny, or whoever.