Have you tried a 12 speed AXS group on your 11 speed trainer like I have? I'd love to hear how it's working out for you. Given the amount of views on my previous video, I'd say there are plenty of us rebels out there.
@@HusoSelimovic i'm not a bike mechanic so do so at your own risk, I had no issues. only reason I swapped it over was because my BB and cassette arrived.
I've been using a Shimano Ultegra 12 speed cassette on my SRAM force axs 12 speed group set for 8 months. Once tuned in with the micro adjust,I've had no issues with shifting and have not noticed any excessive wear either. It seems to work fine Imo.
This is great. Thank you for sharing your experience. I am still miffed at SRAM for not just making AXS 11-speed compatible out of the box. It would only require a tiny software option being added, but 'screw backwards compatibility' is the new thing I suppose.
I get it. It would definitely be nice to be backwards compatible. But at the end of the day, they want to sell products and people aren’t going to be buying the newest things if they can make the new work with the old.
Glad others have been having good experiences with this. I'm really close to spending some money and getting a Shimano 12 speed cassette to see how it works out.
I recently heard somewhere the 11Spped cassette is 0.2 mm wider. Probably minimal wear to the naked eye. Got the same set up on my trainer, no issues. I run a lot of erg mode when on - Trainer Road.
Waiting for my new bike with force 12 speed and using kickr 17, found your video review and latest update. Thanks a lot! Read the comments in the previous video that you mainly use the ERG mode for training, so how about the experience when doing zwift group ride which need continuous changing gears??
Glad my videos helped out. It can be used in simulation mode. ERG is best. If you dial the b-screw in for the 11 speed cassette, it actually shifts fairly well. You will find a few cogs that skip and rub, but most run smooth. The narrow AXS chain helps in that regard.
Hi JM, thanks for your explain i’m just curious what if all of derailleur are wire mechanical like ultegra r8000 11s. but the crankset use SRAM RED AXS 12 speed. what’s chain and cassette should i use? should i use 12s Sram chain too? and how about the cassette? is it works with 11s shimano cassette or i need to use 11s sram cassette. Thanks
I’m not sure really. I think I’d probably go with 11 speed chain and cassette. Honestly 11 speed Shimano/SRAM cassettes are interchangeable so whichever brand you prefer on cassette. Never really heard of someone running an AXS crankset with an otherwise 11 speed group set. Let everyone know how it works out!
Im not an expert neither but this is my take. Wear is not noticeable at plain eyesight. You will notice during shifting, when chain skips, etc. Question, do you thing I can match a 12 Sram Red AXS crankset with an Ultegra 11 speed derailleur? I just scored the crankset for $299 brand new from official retailer. Great video. No one, not even in forums has sorted what you are showing out.
While I would say probably yes, one of the things to keep in mind is geearing. The SRAM cranksets are meant to pair with a 10T small cog in the back and a wider gear spread. Use at your own risk!
Looks good. Anyone tried new Shimano 105 R7100 cassette with Sram AXS? It is 12s so should work even better. Wondering if it's worth investing 3-4x more in Sram cassette + XDR freehub for my Kickr Core
Honestly, it hasn't even crossed my mind. Until now. When I first did this, Shimano 12 speed road wasn't announced. But now that it is, and since it fits on the 11 speed free hub, I may have to give it a go. That's a fantastic idea. It'd be much cheaper and easier to simply swap cassettes as opposed to the free hub body.
@@JMCyclingVideos I'm in the middle of purchasing a new bike with Force AXS and was looking for a work around to changing the freehub to the Sram - likely going to give the shimano a try once someone as a cassette in stock. Some google searching says that it works fine but nothing conclusive.
Yeah, I haven't heard real world experiences. I know the chain rollers will likely be a difference size, but it can't be any worse than what I'm currently using as an 11 speed cassette. The challenge, like you mention, is finding stock of one. I'll keep my eyes open. If I happen to find one and try it out, I'll make a new video!
I am curious if you've tried to play with the micro-adjustment function and what whas the result. Common sense says that it should resolve any issues. I am asking, because my bike is 11-speed drivetrain, and I've found a good deal for the set of Rival AXS shifters, calipers and RD. So, for the reasonable price I would be able to upgrade electronic shifting and hydraulic brakes. My goal is to replace the rest of the drivetrain to 12-speed (1X crankset and cassette), but because of the cost, this part of the upgrade has to wait a bit. I am not sure how long it will take me to gain some extra money for the missing parts, so I'm afraid that I could miss this deal.
I really didn’t want to mess with the micro adjust because I wanted it set for my wheelset with the 12 speed cassette. I’d have to change it back each time it came on and off the trainer. I do believe 12 speed has slightly different cog spacing so I think no matter how it’s adjusted you’ll always have some gears that just don’t line up well.
@@JMCyclingVideos Yeah, I get your point, it would be a hassle if you'd need to play with the micro-adjustment every time you change the wheel (cassette). For this purpose, user-defined micro-adjustment presets would be nice to have (imagine you could just pick a pre-defined one instead of going through every gear adjustment). As for the cog spacing - good point, I'm going to study this subject a little bit more, thanks!
Whoah this is such a coincidence. I am currently on the same situation you had. Just found a pretty sweet deal for a full set of rival etap. I really don’t wanna miss it because the price is practically the same as a new set of 105 12 speed mechanical and in a mint condition (the owner is retiring from cycling). Since my setup is 105 currently, i need to change my huh body to xdr and like you, cost is the main culprit. Would love to know the update on your situation so far. Did you proceed to buy it and run with 11 speed cog? And if you do, does it have any strain to the rd or the overall shifting performance? Thank you in advance
@@daffaabieza1938 I decided to give up on that. I've found somewhere on the internet (I don't remember where) that the micro-adjustment in SRAM is global (not per gear as I thought), so the results of matching with 11sp cassette would be unpredictable. I didn't want to risk (maybe I would have to put the shifters and derailleur into a drawer to wait for the rest of the drivetrain). The money I had were spent to upgrade of the wheels.
Yes, flattop. My bike outdoors is 100% AXS, but I wanted to avoid the pricey cassette and freed-hub on the trainer when others in the household want to use it with 11 speed.
If your whole set up is 12 speed Shimano, I would definitely recommend a Shimano chain. But if you’re only running this on a trainer set up, it will get you by. Look at my channel for another video I did showing how it worked on a 12 speed Shimano cassette. This video is for 11 speed.
JM, do you happen to still have your Rival XPLR AXS rear derailleur around? I was curious if the XPLR axs derailleurs work with an 11-34 cassette or any 11-tooth, 11 or 12-speed cassettes that are lower on the large cog side than the 36 it says it's rated for (trying to see if XPLR axs can work with an 11-34/32/etc cassette). Thanks!
I do still have it. Still waiting on my rival AXS levers that I ordered 6 months ago though. I would be hesitant to run the XPLR range on an 11 speed cassette. I say that because it’s probably not going to be as crisp on the smaller cogs as is due to the design and then running 11 instead of 12 would compound it. That’s speculation on my part though.
@@JMCyclingVideos yeah I'd be looking more so at running it on a 12-speed preferably, of course. I'm curious because I'd like to see if the XPLR derailleur would work not only with the 10-36 to 10-44 tooth cassettes but also (potentially) with an 11-34 tooth or 11-32 tooth 12 speed Powershift cassette (which should be similar to any other Shimano 12 speed 11-34/32/30 cassette). And dang, waiting 6 months for levers is rough as heck. You have your Force AXS on a different bike, I assume?
Yup. Force AXS is on my road bike. If you’re planning on running it on a 12 speed cassette, I’d wager it would probably shift acceptably. Not as good as the ideal matched cassette/RD but it wouldn’t be any worse than doing something like running a long cage Shimano RD on an 11-25 cassette. Can be done. Not ideal shifting but it would work. I’m still looking out for a 12 speed Shimano cassette to see how well it shifts with my force set up. Don’t want to drop the money on a brand new one just to experiment though so I’m keeping my eyes open for a used cassette.
@@JMCyclingVideos What options do you have for 12 speed shimano or alternative cassettes anyhow? Ultegra and Dura-Ace and that's it? 105 is still 11-speed only, if I recall?
@@JMCyclingVideos I believe there's a few Aliexpress options out there (not that I expect them to be that durable at all) for some 12 speed 11-32/11-34t cassettes. Sunshine seems to be the copy brand for these.
@@JMCyclingVideos I have been facing trouble to set the axs derailleur on 11spd cassette. if you dont mind, can you please let me know how to set in detail?
Well, it’s never going to be ideal. You will have cogs that make some noise and skip a bit. On my trainer, I have not needed to adjust the limit screws or micro adjust with the shifters. I only adjust the b-screw with the tool from SRAM to ensure the gap is correct for my 28T trainer cassette.
Curious is you, or if anyone knows the answer to this. I'm building a new bike using Red eTap AXS 12 Speed. I bought the groupset already (Shifters, derailleurs, brake calipers and the AXS 12 Speed flattop chain) I stopped at the crank because I Do Not like the AXS Crankset, now that it has no chainrings, and just doesn't look good. Question: Why can't I use the older 11 speed Red eTap crank with the rest of the AXS (12 Speed) Groupset? Is the chain, like not compatible or something because it's narrower? Will it cause premature wear on the chainrings? I guess I can't figure out in my head why it wouldn't work? Do I sound stupid?
So a lot of people have used 11 speed crank sets without issue utilizing the rest of the AXS group set. There is a different in that the rollers on the AXS chain are a little bigger in diameter. But I didn’t find this to be an issue, personally. Others will swear that you’re going to destroy your drivetrain by mixing and matching though so take that how you wish.
@@JMCyclingVideos Thanks! Still deciding if I want to take the risk. Red AXS components aren't cheap, and since I'm not sponsored, prematurely wearing them out would be pretty painful.
Unfortunately, this is not a combo I have any experience with so I'm not comfortable giving any feedback. If you try it out and it works, do report back though!
Hi jm, this video really make me realise potential savings 😄. So I am on axs 12-30. On my trainer is shimano 11 32 and I have another shimano cassette 11 28. Which would you think more suitable to run on trainer for my axs?
I would personally go with 11-28 so you don’t have to adjust your B-screw down. If your b-screw is set for 30, then you might have to adjust it out a bit to clear a 32. Good luck with it!
Have you tried a 12 speed AXS group on your 11 speed trainer like I have? I'd love to hear how it's working out for you. Given the amount of views on my previous video, I'd say there are plenty of us rebels out there.
popped a ultegra 12 spd cassette on and it worked fine
@@gezdef does it? I’m thinking about doing this too
@@HusoSelimovic i'm not a bike mechanic so do so at your own risk, I had no issues. only reason I swapped it over was because my BB and cassette arrived.
I've been using a Shimano Ultegra 12 speed cassette on my SRAM force axs 12 speed group set for 8 months. Once tuned in with the micro adjust,I've had no issues with shifting and have not noticed any excessive wear either. It seems to work fine Imo.
This is great. Thank you for sharing your experience. I am still miffed at SRAM for not just making AXS 11-speed compatible out of the box. It would only require a tiny software option being added, but 'screw backwards compatibility' is the new thing I suppose.
I get it. It would definitely be nice to be backwards compatible. But at the end of the day, they want to sell products and people aren’t going to be buying the newest things if they can make the new work with the old.
I have been doing the same thing for about a year. The chain jumps a little on one cog. Other than that no issues. works fine so far.
Glad others have been having good experiences with this. I'm really close to spending some money and getting a Shimano 12 speed cassette to see how it works out.
I recently heard somewhere the 11Spped cassette is 0.2 mm wider. Probably minimal wear to the naked eye. Got the same set up on my trainer, no issues. I run a lot of erg mode when on - Trainer Road.
Glad to know I'm not the only one running this set up! I'd like to try out a Shimano 12 speed cassette and see how it shifts too.
Just had this exact question, thank you.
Glad it was helpful!
Waiting for my new bike with force 12 speed and using kickr 17, found your video review and latest update. Thanks a lot! Read the comments in the previous video that you mainly use the ERG mode for training, so how about the experience when doing zwift group ride which need continuous changing gears??
Glad my videos helped out. It can be used in simulation mode. ERG is best. If you dial the b-screw in for the 11 speed cassette, it actually shifts fairly well. You will find a few cogs that skip and rub, but most run smooth. The narrow AXS chain helps in that regard.
Hi JM, thanks for your explain
i’m just curious what if all of derailleur are wire mechanical like ultegra r8000 11s. but the crankset use SRAM RED AXS 12 speed. what’s chain and cassette should i use? should i use 12s Sram chain too? and how about the cassette? is it works with 11s shimano cassette or i need to use 11s sram cassette.
Thanks
I’m not sure really. I think I’d probably go with 11 speed chain and cassette. Honestly 11 speed Shimano/SRAM cassettes are interchangeable so whichever brand you prefer on cassette. Never really heard of someone running an AXS crankset with an otherwise 11 speed group set. Let everyone know how it works out!
Im not an expert neither but this is my take. Wear is not noticeable at plain eyesight. You will notice during shifting, when chain skips, etc.
Question, do you thing I can match a 12 Sram Red AXS crankset with an Ultegra 11 speed derailleur? I just scored the crankset for $299 brand new from official retailer.
Great video. No one, not even in forums has sorted what you are showing out.
While I would say probably yes, one of the things to keep in mind is geearing. The SRAM cranksets are meant to pair with a 10T small cog in the back and a wider gear spread. Use at your own risk!
Looks good. Anyone tried new Shimano 105 R7100 cassette with Sram AXS? It is 12s so should work even better. Wondering if it's worth investing 3-4x more in Sram cassette + XDR freehub for my Kickr Core
I got you covered. Not R7100, but I did use an R8100 Ultegra 12 speed cassette. Video here: ruclips.net/video/jZpxMRny7JI/видео.html
@@JMCyclingVideosthank yoU!
Just wondering if you have thought about trying a 12 speed Shimano cassette with the 12 speed AXS group?
Honestly, it hasn't even crossed my mind. Until now. When I first did this, Shimano 12 speed road wasn't announced. But now that it is, and since it fits on the 11 speed free hub, I may have to give it a go. That's a fantastic idea. It'd be much cheaper and easier to simply swap cassettes as opposed to the free hub body.
@@JMCyclingVideos I'm in the middle of purchasing a new bike with Force AXS and was looking for a work around to changing the freehub to the Sram - likely going to give the shimano a try once someone as a cassette in stock. Some google searching says that it works fine but nothing conclusive.
Yeah, I haven't heard real world experiences. I know the chain rollers will likely be a difference size, but it can't be any worse than what I'm currently using as an 11 speed cassette. The challenge, like you mention, is finding stock of one. I'll keep my eyes open. If I happen to find one and try it out, I'll make a new video!
Anyone have an update on using it on a shimano 12 speed?
@@GianniChng I haven't seen anyone using a Shimano 12 speed cassette yet. I do have my eyes open for a cheap used 12 speed cassette to experiment.
I am curious if you've tried to play with the micro-adjustment function and what whas the result. Common sense says that it should resolve any issues. I am asking, because my bike is 11-speed drivetrain, and I've found a good deal for the set of Rival AXS shifters, calipers and RD. So, for the reasonable price I would be able to upgrade electronic shifting and hydraulic brakes. My goal is to replace the rest of the drivetrain to 12-speed (1X crankset and cassette), but because of the cost, this part of the upgrade has to wait a bit. I am not sure how long it will take me to gain some extra money for the missing parts, so I'm afraid that I could miss this deal.
I really didn’t want to mess with the micro adjust because I wanted it set for my wheelset with the 12 speed cassette. I’d have to change it back each time it came on and off the trainer. I do believe 12 speed has slightly different cog spacing so I think no matter how it’s adjusted you’ll always have some gears that just don’t line up well.
@@JMCyclingVideos Yeah, I get your point, it would be a hassle if you'd need to play with the micro-adjustment every time you change the wheel (cassette). For this purpose, user-defined micro-adjustment presets would be nice to have (imagine you could just pick a pre-defined one instead of going through every gear adjustment).
As for the cog spacing - good point, I'm going to study this subject a little bit more, thanks!
Whoah this is such a coincidence.
I am currently on the same situation you had.
Just found a pretty sweet deal for a full set of rival etap. I really don’t wanna miss it because the price is practically the same as a new set of 105 12 speed mechanical and in a mint condition (the owner is retiring from cycling). Since my setup is 105 currently, i need to change my huh body to xdr and like you, cost is the main culprit.
Would love to know the update on your situation so far. Did you proceed to buy it and run with 11 speed cog? And if you do, does it have any strain to the rd or the overall shifting performance?
Thank you in advance
@@daffaabieza1938 I decided to give up on that. I've found somewhere on the internet (I don't remember where) that the micro-adjustment in SRAM is global (not per gear as I thought), so the results of matching with 11sp cassette would be unpredictable. I didn't want to risk (maybe I would have to put the shifters and derailleur into a drawer to wait for the rest of the drivetrain). The money I had were spent to upgrade of the wheels.
Did anyone using 12 speed axs crankset on 11 speed sram groupset? What do you guys think? Should it works?
I would guess that it would work just fine. But hopefully someone else has done just this and can give you better information.
Thank you for the answer, that's very helpful, but the next question is the power meter will also work too?
The power meter measures torque. Unless the chain is skipping on the teeth, it’ll work just fine.
Hoo I see thank you for the answer 🙏🏻🙏🏻
11Speed cassette is wider. Did you change chain to 11s or using original AXS 12speed chain ?
AXS 12 speed chain is what I use.
One more question, are you using a 12 or 11 speed chain. Is it the flat top?
Yes, flattop. My bike outdoors is 100% AXS, but I wanted to avoid the pricey cassette and freed-hub on the trainer when others in the household want to use it with 11 speed.
How works flattop chain on 12sp shimano cassette... pls
If your whole set up is 12 speed Shimano, I would definitely recommend a Shimano chain. But if you’re only running this on a trainer set up, it will get you by. Look at my channel for another video I did showing how it worked on a 12 speed Shimano cassette. This video is for 11 speed.
JM, do you happen to still have your Rival XPLR AXS rear derailleur around? I was curious if the XPLR axs derailleurs work with an 11-34 cassette or any 11-tooth, 11 or 12-speed cassettes that are lower on the large cog side than the 36 it says it's rated for (trying to see if XPLR axs can work with an 11-34/32/etc cassette). Thanks!
I do still have it. Still waiting on my rival AXS levers that I ordered 6 months ago though. I would be hesitant to run the XPLR range on an 11 speed cassette. I say that because it’s probably not going to be as crisp on the smaller cogs as is due to the design and then running 11 instead of 12 would compound it. That’s speculation on my part though.
@@JMCyclingVideos yeah I'd be looking more so at running it on a 12-speed preferably, of course. I'm curious because I'd like to see if the XPLR derailleur would work not only with the 10-36 to 10-44 tooth cassettes but also (potentially) with an 11-34 tooth or 11-32 tooth 12 speed Powershift cassette (which should be similar to any other Shimano 12 speed 11-34/32/30 cassette). And dang, waiting 6 months for levers is rough as heck. You have your Force AXS on a different bike, I assume?
Yup. Force AXS is on my road bike. If you’re planning on running it on a 12 speed cassette, I’d wager it would probably shift acceptably. Not as good as the ideal matched cassette/RD but it wouldn’t be any worse than doing something like running a long cage Shimano RD on an 11-25 cassette. Can be done. Not ideal shifting but it would work. I’m still looking out for a 12 speed Shimano cassette to see how well it shifts with my force set up. Don’t want to drop the money on a brand new one just to experiment though so I’m keeping my eyes open for a used cassette.
@@JMCyclingVideos What options do you have for 12 speed shimano or alternative cassettes anyhow? Ultegra and Dura-Ace and that's it? 105 is still 11-speed only, if I recall?
@@JMCyclingVideos I believe there's a few Aliexpress options out there (not that I expect them to be that durable at all) for some 12 speed 11-32/11-34t cassettes. Sunshine seems to be the copy brand for these.
i bought force axs rim version and i am wondering how you set rear derailleur on 11 speed cassette.
I don't make any adjustments to it aside from ensuring the B-screw is adjusted for the largest cog.
@@JMCyclingVideos I have been facing trouble to set the axs derailleur on 11spd cassette. if you dont mind, can you please let me know how to set in detail?
Well, it’s never going to be ideal. You will have cogs that make some noise and skip a bit. On my trainer, I have not needed to adjust the limit screws or micro adjust with the shifters. I only adjust the b-screw with the tool from SRAM to ensure the gap is correct for my 28T trainer cassette.
Curious is you, or if anyone knows the answer to this. I'm building a new bike using Red eTap AXS 12 Speed. I bought the groupset already (Shifters, derailleurs, brake calipers and the AXS 12 Speed flattop chain) I stopped at the crank because I Do Not like the AXS Crankset, now that it has no chainrings, and just doesn't look good.
Question: Why can't I use the older 11 speed Red eTap crank with the rest of the AXS (12 Speed) Groupset?
Is the chain, like not compatible or something because it's narrower? Will it cause premature wear on the chainrings? I guess I can't figure out in my head why it wouldn't work? Do I sound stupid?
So a lot of people have used 11 speed crank sets without issue utilizing the rest of the AXS group set. There is a different in that the rollers on the AXS chain are a little bigger in diameter. But I didn’t find this to be an issue, personally. Others will swear that you’re going to destroy your drivetrain by mixing and matching though so take that how you wish.
@@JMCyclingVideos Thanks! Still deciding if I want to take the risk. Red AXS components aren't cheap, and since I'm not sponsored, prematurely wearing them out would be pretty painful.
I have a sweet Garburuk 50t 11sp cassette and l want to upgrade to GX axs. Would that work?
Unfortunately, this is not a combo I have any experience with so I'm not comfortable giving any feedback. If you try it out and it works, do report back though!
Just to be clear. You are using a 11 s Shimano. Right?
Shimano 11 speed. 11-28T Ultegra CS-R8000 to be exact
Hi jm, this video really make me realise potential savings 😄. So I am on axs 12-30.
On my trainer is shimano 11 32 and I have another shimano cassette 11 28. Which would you think more suitable to run on trainer for my axs?
I would personally go with 11-28 so you don’t have to adjust your B-screw down. If your b-screw is set for 30, then you might have to adjust it out a bit to clear a 32. Good luck with it!
@JM Cycling Videos thanks JM. Ok will use the 28 but if I use the 32, and I don't shift to 32 should be alright ?
@@raymondl1182 You can use the 32 even shifting into it. You just may have to adjust your b-screw. Simple adjustment.
Could you use a AXS rd with an 11spd chain/cassette? As 11speed etap rd are expensive new??
I wouldn't recommend it. Shift spacing is too different to make it usable full time.
Works with 52x36? Thanks!
I’ve heard reports of the AXS front derailleur working just fine with standard chainrings, but I personally use AXS 48/35 chainrings.
work or not ?
It works. Not ideal in all of the gears and I wouldn’t use this combo outdoors. But on the trainer it’s acceptable