They're not being starved to death. They managed to get into the mine easily enough. They can get out just as easily. When they come out they will be fed in prison.
I don’t know whether this guy has got agendas or what, but he keeps punting this “starving them” narrative, as if the miners do not have an option of resurfacing. They are not trapped, they are down there voluntarily.
You basically said there are no bosses making millions from the Zama Zamas. Unfortunately, everyone knows that this is not true. The Zama Zamas have employers who are making huge profits while exploiting people who have “no choice”
"too expensive to extract" - because of Unions pushing for ever higher wages and because of stringent safety protocols. Zama Zamas don't have to worry about that.
The question is, will these miners work in the same condition for a mine company with a smaller pay? You have seen strikes over numeration, benefits, health issues, etc.. Mine companies are hold to health and safety regulations, working hours, health claims, working conditions, etc..
Mate, you talk as if these are South Africans, they largely illegal immigrants taking advantage of our useless government. They don't do this in mines in their own countries because they will be dealt with harshly.
Where does the gold to? Illegal miners don’t detect the selling price. Guys who enjoy gold sales are sitting in Fourways and Sandton. Senior government officials are benefiting from the operation. If intelligence of the country can’t pinpoint the culprits then we aren’t going anywhere. Most of the Zama Zamas are paid in cash and surely if we serious about solving this problem we can at least cut the money supply.
Oh, Dan Corder, I just love you man! I've probably also been clearly living 'under a rock' BUT I HAD NO IDEA just how massive this Illegal Mining Industry is! It makes perfect sense. There have to be people of different degree of understanding of the industry, some decorated but disgruntled (GREEDY) professional; big shot business man; of course someone with political affiliations as well as the community. It makes it complete! Living in crime has been personified!!
just listening to Dan, the points that stand out the most are the irresponsibility of the mining companies from the moment they open a mine and start mining and employing a work force to the point of closure. So in the Stilfontein case, the mine that was there should be brought to book by providing something along the lines of a compensation package for miners who worked for them and or in combination with government, a job and rehab program. Then to top it all seal off the mines. How to retrieve the miners. its a slow process. At least provide basic food and medical aid to give them the chance to feel secure. Then, close down all the above ground extraction units so that no gold can be processed. Monitoring all movement of possible extraction minerals that move out of the area. Once the 'above surface' establishment is closed down and the area set under surveillance by police and military, the miners will loose the incentive for their extractions
With our current laws and unions , I'm sure all retrenched miners received a good severance package. As I understand it , the mine was sealed but the ex-miners blew it open.However , mines are supposed to rehabilitate areas that they mine. I'm not sure if this was ever done properly. The miners underground can receive food and medical above ground. If they can get it below ground that means that nothing is stopping them from coming to the surface. Supply them food underground will just prolong the situation.
Zama zama mining is illegal and must be stopped but you and me Dan we understand the broader picture that many people who never lived by a mining town don't understand. It's sad labeling everyone underground a criminal not knowing how they got down there.
It's not just for money to put food on the table. There's a very big reward from R4,000-R40,000 as the news mentioned on Thursday 25. They will use any excuse to carry on with illegal mining. Will the government support those people or their families who are victims of Zama Zamas and get killed or wounded or even any life threatening disease support them? What happens to the other poor or jobless people in South Africa who stay hundreds of km from the mines be helped with illegal mining first before illegal foreigners are allowed? The best of all is the Zama Zamas who are earning between R4,000-R40,000 per day tax free , while any other workers pay tax, some working harder than others. How can the law stop the police from smoking out the Zama Zamas , covering up for them and not allowing the police to go down and recover all the heavy armaments the Zama Zamas have ? 🤔🤔🤔 How would other countries react ?
HOW CAN WE FEEL SORRY FOR ZAMA ZAMAS ON THE GROUNDS THEY HAVE TO PUT FOOD ON THE TABLE?? IS THIS THE SAME ZAMA ZAMAS THAT HAVE MINES IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES. ARE WE SOUTH AFRICANS IDIOTS OR WHAT. WHY ARE THESE HUNGRY PEOPLE NOT DOING ILLEGAL MINING IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES? WE ARE BEING ABUSED ONCE AGAIN AND WE CANNOT EVEN SEE IT.
Thank you Dan for bringing a balanced report on this complex matter. The govt needs diagnose roote course and find all encompassing solutions. How are illegal migrants gaining access to country. Smuggling of weapons- where is public safety department and crime intelligence. The Big question of Unemployment and Poverty - people must eat at the end of the day,. One man who was interviewed by SABC journalist asked "which is better to steal or to risk your life and go underground to support yourself and your family". Yes they are conducting illegal activity and some terrorize community which they should be punished for but what is the govt going to do about unemployment, poverty and money which is lost through corruption.
SO WE NOW HAVE TO ADDRESS POVERTY OF NATIONALS OF OTHER COUNTRIES WHO ACTUALLY HAVE MINES THEY CAN GO DO ILLEGAL MINING IN.???? WE NEED TO ADDRESS POVERTY FOR SOUTH AFRICANS,. GOVERNMENTS OF THEIR COUNTRIES NEED TO ADDRESS THEIR POVERTY. GOVERNMENTS OF THEIR COUNTRIES NEED TO DEVELOP ARTISINAL MINING FOR THESE PEOPLE.. WE BECOMING VERY CONFUSED AS SOUTH AFRICANS ABOUT WHO OUR RESPONSIBILTY IS.
@@Tinker8531 So you want this to continue? I would prefer that this doesn't persist. But it seems you would prefer to ignore the reality of the situation.
They may be desperate and willing to make a living at great risk to their lives. But unfortunately, criminality accompanies their activities and it affects law-abiding communities and the safety of the innocent public (some sink holes have been attributed to their underground activities). If you lived in a Cape gangster ridden area and you couldn't go out at night or even kissing your children for the last time as you send them to school in the morning (standing the risk of them being shot dead during a rival gang shootout), then you'd want those thugs to be imprisoned forever. Income from their activities of drugs, theft, murder and human trafficking etc. can also be used as an excuse for their existence. "We're only trying to make a living because life dealt us a bad hand". The same can be said for the Zama Zamas. They are a drain on society and just because life dealt them a bad hand, it doesn't mean that they're entitled to break the law in many ways and make the life of law-abiding citizens a living hell. But government and their union-based allies are to blame for this, and just "smoking them out" isn't the solution. I hope that they can find a way of sorting this out... but I'm not holding my breath.
A nation’s greatness is judged by its adherence to justice and opportunity, not surrender to lawlessness. Tolerating Zama Zamas erodes the rule of law. Address poverty, but enforce laws-prosperity requires both order and enterprise.
Seeing its only 10 South Africans involved. Its Zimbabwe, Mozambique and Lesotho governments who needs to address their poverty not South Africa. They have mines there that they need to go dig up.
@@Tinker8531 greatness isn’t about boundaries; it’s about leadership. South Africa thrives when the region does. Blaming neighbors? That’s small thinking. Real power? Turning challenges into opportunities-because winners play the long game, not the blame game.
Don't appeal to our conscience to evoke sympathy emotions so that we can understand! We don't understand! It's tough for everyone but not everyone is involved in crime because we know of the consequences of crime! This is criminality! Stop decorating nonsense!
They illegal immigrants. They need to go work officially for mining companies in their countries. What is special about Zimbabwean mines that they cannot go dig up there. Why do we insist on rewarding illegal activities. no wonder foreigners have no respect for SA and do as they please. Get SANS contracts!!.
Given thay they don't subscribe to any safety standard (too expensive) and are mining out the support pillars, it's only amatter of time before they cause a catastrophic collapse and entomb all zama's in that particular mine. Unfortunately whatever town/ infrastructure's on top will also collapse in. Then, those same community members will be blaming everyone except the zama's . . .
Accurately put your title should be 'the Zama Zama consequence of the poverty and unemployment crisis'; meaning that the fault is more of all the parties in government all-round than of those who are desperate in taking extreme measures. R350.00 is only best to keep people in poverty and desperation but not to help most get themselves out of it. Triple the SASSA SRD at least to see many work themselves out of state dependence unless of course if keeping them desperate works for the political relevance narrative.
Maybe they must have smaller families? If you dont plan youre children you ar responsible for them. Not other taxpayers that plan and do what they have to do. This story is the same as all the others. Who must be responsible for other people,s own way to plan or choices in their own lifes? Every single day there are new reasons for normal hardworking, and let me say working mostly for themselves, as there are but few jobs for available for them? When are we going to make plans for them to?
![ROSÉ(로제) - APT. (Band VER.) (With. 이영지) [더 시즌즈-이영지의 레인보우] | KBS 241129 방송](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IW8qaemx74g/mqdefault.jpg)
They're not being starved to death.
They managed to get into the mine easily enough.
They can get out just as easily.
When they come out they will be fed in prison.
I don’t know whether this guy has got agendas or what, but he keeps punting this “starving them” narrative, as if the miners do not have an option of resurfacing. They are not trapped, they are down there voluntarily.
The second thing you’re seemingly not willing to discuss is that most Zama Zamas are illegal foreigners
Borders non existent
This
He is on the payroll of the "progressive caucus" thats why he wont mention it
He also forgot to mention what Zamas do to our girls and woman, that was the red line for me when they attacked our woman
Whom have mines in their own country, but they prefer to dig up our mines and they don't care what harm they do to their surroundings.
Go after the people buying this illegally mined (stolen) gold.
That would be friends of Putin, Xi Jinpeng, and other well connected individuals.
You basically said there are no bosses making millions from the Zama Zamas. Unfortunately, everyone knows that this is not true. The Zama Zamas have employers who are making huge profits while exploiting people who have “no choice”
'No Choice', so were they forced at gun point to cross our borders. ????
You silly for wanting to make this an acceptable thing. 😡😡😡😡😡
Crime pays in SA
Did you even watch the video? That's not what he said at all.
@TD1237 that's exactly what it's about ... being sympathetic to these zamazamas . 😡 We have no place for sympathy to criminals
you forgetting to mention ILLEGAL migrant men.
"too expensive to extract" - because of Unions pushing for ever higher wages and because of stringent safety protocols.
Zama Zamas don't have to worry about that.
The question is, will these miners work in the same condition for a mine company with a smaller pay? You have seen strikes over numeration, benefits, health issues, etc.. Mine companies are hold to health and safety regulations, working hours, health claims, working conditions, etc..
Mate, you talk as if these are South Africans, they largely illegal immigrants taking advantage of our useless government. They don't do this in mines in their own countries because they will be dealt with harshly.
Where does the gold to? Illegal miners don’t detect the selling price. Guys who enjoy gold sales are sitting in Fourways and Sandton. Senior government officials are benefiting from the operation. If intelligence of the country can’t pinpoint the culprits then we aren’t going anywhere. Most of the Zama Zamas are paid in cash and surely if we serious about solving this problem we can at least cut the money supply.
You're delusional!
eNCA should fire you for being so out of touch.
We will never ever excuse criminality
Ever. Enough is Enough
lol this is exactly why South Africa is the playground for criminals , this is exactly why … it’s insane ENCA even let this air 😂
Oh, Dan Corder, I just love you man! I've probably also been clearly living 'under a rock' BUT I HAD NO IDEA just how massive this Illegal Mining Industry is! It makes perfect sense. There have to be people of different degree of understanding of the industry, some decorated but disgruntled (GREEDY) professional; big shot business man; of course someone with political affiliations as well as the community. It makes it complete! Living in crime has been personified!!
You've been captured,he's not telling half of the truth. True pursueded media narrative
Thank you very much for this programme...it really make sense...give these people licencese to mine and pay tax
They are criminals.
It equates to treason
No tax being paid..and they are rich beyond matters..and lots of caders benefit
Like Pala Pala as well
just listening to Dan, the points that stand out the most are the irresponsibility of the mining companies from the moment they open a mine and start mining and employing a work force to the point of closure. So in the Stilfontein case, the mine that was there should be brought to book by providing something along the lines of a compensation package for miners who worked for them and or in combination with government, a job and rehab program. Then to top it all seal off the mines. How to retrieve the miners. its a slow process. At least provide basic food and medical aid to give them the chance to feel secure. Then, close down all the above ground extraction units so that no gold can be processed. Monitoring all movement of possible extraction minerals that move out of the area. Once the 'above surface' establishment is closed down and the area set under surveillance by police and military, the miners will loose the incentive for their extractions
With our current laws and unions , I'm sure all retrenched miners received a good severance package.
As I understand it , the mine was sealed but the ex-miners blew it open.However , mines are supposed to rehabilitate areas that they mine. I'm not sure if this was ever done properly.
The miners underground can receive food and medical above ground. If they can get it below ground that means that nothing is stopping them from coming to the surface. Supply them food underground will just prolong the situation.
Zama zama mining is illegal and must be stopped but you and me Dan we understand the broader picture that many people who never lived by a mining town don't understand. It's sad labeling everyone underground a criminal not knowing how they got down there.
Victims, aren't we all
If they were real victims they would be digging up mines in their own countries. they see we are too soft and easily misled.
It's not just for money to put food on the table. There's a very big reward from R4,000-R40,000 as the news mentioned on Thursday 25. They will use any excuse to carry on with illegal mining. Will the government support those people or their families who are victims of Zama Zamas and get killed or wounded or even any life threatening disease support them? What happens to the other poor or jobless people in South Africa who stay hundreds of km from the mines be helped with illegal mining first before illegal foreigners are allowed? The best of all is the Zama Zamas who are earning between R4,000-R40,000 per day tax free , while any other workers pay tax, some working harder than others. How can the law stop the police from smoking out the Zama Zamas , covering up for them and not allowing the police to go down and recover all the heavy armaments the Zama Zamas have ? 🤔🤔🤔 How would other countries react ?
HOW CAN WE FEEL SORRY FOR ZAMA ZAMAS ON THE GROUNDS THEY HAVE TO PUT FOOD ON THE TABLE?? IS THIS THE SAME ZAMA ZAMAS THAT HAVE MINES IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES. ARE WE SOUTH AFRICANS IDIOTS OR WHAT. WHY ARE THESE HUNGRY PEOPLE NOT DOING ILLEGAL MINING IN THEIR OWN COUNTRIES? WE ARE BEING ABUSED ONCE AGAIN AND WE CANNOT EVEN SEE IT.
Excellent, clear presentation!
Let nature take its course wait them out.
Thank you Dan for bringing a balanced report on this complex matter. The govt needs diagnose roote course and find all encompassing solutions.
How are illegal migrants gaining access to country. Smuggling of weapons- where is public safety department and crime intelligence.
The Big question of Unemployment and Poverty - people must eat at the end of the day,.
One man who was interviewed by SABC journalist asked "which is better to steal or to risk your life and go underground to support yourself and your family". Yes they are conducting illegal activity and some terrorize community which they should be punished for but what is the govt going to do about unemployment, poverty and money which is lost through corruption.
SO WE NOW HAVE TO ADDRESS POVERTY OF NATIONALS OF OTHER COUNTRIES WHO ACTUALLY HAVE MINES THEY CAN GO DO ILLEGAL MINING IN.???? WE NEED TO ADDRESS POVERTY FOR SOUTH AFRICANS,. GOVERNMENTS OF THEIR COUNTRIES NEED TO ADDRESS THEIR POVERTY. GOVERNMENTS OF THEIR COUNTRIES NEED TO DEVELOP ARTISINAL MINING FOR THESE PEOPLE.. WE BECOMING VERY CONFUSED AS SOUTH AFRICANS ABOUT WHO OUR RESPONSIBILTY IS.
@@Tinker8531 So you want this to continue? I would prefer that this doesn't persist. But it seems you would prefer to ignore the reality of the situation.
Dan doesn't look presentable without his hats on.
Internationally known as ZamaZumas 😂..
claptrap. it is thanks to people like you that this world is in such a mess.
They may be desperate and willing to make a living at great risk to their lives. But unfortunately, criminality accompanies their activities and it affects law-abiding communities and the safety of the innocent public (some sink holes have been attributed to their underground activities). If you lived in a Cape gangster ridden area and you couldn't go out at night or even kissing your children for the last time as you send them to school in the morning (standing the risk of them being shot dead during a rival gang shootout), then you'd want those thugs to be imprisoned forever. Income from their activities of drugs, theft, murder and human trafficking etc. can also be used as an excuse for their existence. "We're only trying to make a living because life dealt us a bad hand". The same can be said for the Zama Zamas. They are a drain on society and just because life dealt them a bad hand, it doesn't mean that they're entitled to break the law in many ways and make the life of law-abiding citizens a living hell. But government and their union-based allies are to blame for this, and just "smoking them out" isn't the solution. I hope that they can find a way of sorting this out... but I'm not holding my breath.
Dan Your a Genius! You carefully and nicely unpacked it! Very considerate!
Keep it up!!
To me it was over ten minutes of stating the obvious without talking about those who make the real money.
Sounds like organized crime.
A nation’s greatness is judged by its adherence to justice and opportunity, not surrender to lawlessness. Tolerating Zama Zamas erodes the rule of law. Address poverty, but enforce laws-prosperity requires both order and enterprise.
Seeing its only 10 South Africans involved. Its Zimbabwe, Mozambique and Lesotho governments who needs to address their poverty not South Africa. They have mines there that they need to go dig up.
@@Tinker8531 greatness isn’t about boundaries; it’s about leadership. South Africa thrives when the region does. Blaming neighbors? That’s small thinking. Real power? Turning challenges into opportunities-because winners play the long game, not the blame game.
Who are the buyers?
Don't appeal to our conscience to evoke sympathy emotions so that we can understand! We don't understand! It's tough for everyone but not everyone is involved in crime because we know of the consequences of crime! This is criminality! Stop decorating nonsense!
If they so poor why not do illegal mining in their own countries. Zimbabwe has huge mines they can go dig up.
Yes you are doing great job expose them they must live something behind for community.... thanks for your Ubuntu
Let them work officially for the mining companies as contractors.
They illegal immigrants. They need to go work officially for mining companies in their countries. What is special about Zimbabwean mines that they cannot go dig up there. Why do we insist on rewarding illegal activities. no wonder foreigners have no respect for SA and do as they please. Get SANS contracts!!.
Thank you for a detailed explanation. Now i understand why God always blesses white people.
Why don't they come up if they are living in these conditions?
Given thay they don't subscribe to any safety standard (too expensive) and are mining out the support pillars, it's only amatter of time before they cause a catastrophic collapse and entomb all zama's in that particular mine. Unfortunately whatever town/ infrastructure's on top will also collapse in. Then, those same community members will be blaming everyone except the zama's . . .
Fkn leave them there🤷🤷🤷🤷🤷🤷 why should we waste our time with them and put the rescuersat risk
Accurately put your title should be 'the Zama Zama consequence of the poverty and unemployment crisis'; meaning that the fault is more of all the parties in government all-round than of those who are desperate in taking extreme measures. R350.00 is only best to keep people in poverty and desperation but not to help most get themselves out of it. Triple the SASSA SRD at least to see many work themselves out of state dependence unless of course if keeping them desperate works for the political relevance narrative.
Maybe they must have smaller families? If you dont plan youre children you ar responsible for them. Not other taxpayers that plan and do what they have to do. This story is the same as all the others. Who must be responsible for other people,s own way to plan or choices in their own lifes? Every single day there are new reasons for normal hardworking, and let me say working mostly for themselves, as there are but few jobs for available for them? When are we going to make plans for them to?
Zama Zama goes beyond illegal mining. It's more like high-risk hustling but could also include legal hustling. Ho phanda
so we are feed criminal now???
How does Dan look himself in the mirror?
It will be better if was as South African only... but now they left they Country to do criam in our Country
Totaly out of touch
U are the buyer
I cant listen to this chop. Sorry @enca youve lost the plot.
So according to your logic we must also have empathy for drug sellers, prostitutes, poachers, hijacker etc cos they can't get real jobs
Bye
Dan your show is good. I like it.
All the zama zamas must be made ANC/ EFF/MK members of parlement .
Maybe they are already MP's..