put on your thinking cap today, were talking ignition timing. Get yourself a re-curve kit for your distributor, and a timing light and go to town - ignition timing matters so much more than folks ever give it credit for - "timing is everything" This is the timing light I use which has the "advance feature": amzn.to/2SrY8lG
Hi Luke. I agree correct timing is everything. But my question is about the timing light. Could you explain the advance timing dial on the light ? What is it used for, and how do you use it. I've other people using it but they never explain why or how to use the dial. I'm old school and have never used one. An explanation would be vary helpful . Thanks.
I was hoping you could help me out I have a 1983 chevy k10 and I swapped motors the old motor had a mechanical fuel pump with one main feed line and then vent line. The new motor is an 87 350ci that was a tbi and I swapped intakes and put an edelbrock intake for my 1406 edelbrock carb. Unfortunately I found out that the 87 blocks with the tbi didnt have mechanical fuel pumps they had the fuel pump inside the tank so to remedy this I bought one of those 4-7 psi 35 GPH edelbrock inline pumps you can buy at an Auto store and plumbed it in. I plugged up the old vent hose to the tank and checked my hose clamps but still seem to lose prime i dont know if i should get a puller pump instead of this gravity feed pusher or what also when I'm driving down the road it's like its misfiring I checked my distributor and timing and am at 14 degrees initial but seem to when I'm cruising its having like a miss.
@@Hrmert The dial back light allows you to easily read your total advance. Typically what you do is raise the rpm up to the point that the timing stops advancing, ie. it is all in.You then shine the light on your timing pointer. While watching the flash you rotate the knob until the TDC mark on your balancer aligns with the timing pointer. The knob on the light is now pointing at your total advance. Alternatively you can start by turning the knob to the desired timing, say 36 degrees. Then bring the rpm up to the point the timing stops advancing, and rotate the distributor until it reads 0 on the balancer.
Unless my engine is tiny, I generally tune for efficiency rather than power, and though lighter springs will probably help both, more vacuum advance helps more with cruising efficiency. Is that usually very conservative also? Also, worn engines that compress less and burn more oil will usually run cooler and want more advanced timing, except if there is much carbon buildup. But really loud mufflers can drown out spark knock. It is possible to get both, part throttle efficiency and full throttle power. It's just a bit more complex. 2 stage carbs help, and I wish they would make more 2 stage carbs for american cars with 2 bbl manifolds.
People will be surprised how much timing an engine will really take at idle. dont be suprised if it takes like 20 degrees on certain setups and not ping at all. i hear a lot of hipo street engines like less mechanical and more initial and all in by 2000-2500 Im talking carb pump gas engines no power adders
My introduction to mechanical advance came in the form of a 1986 GMC Suburban, 350 and manual 4 speed. The mechanic that recurved that one put the lightest springs in that the kit had to offer. I always drove it dead stick, and the next time I drove it, when I backed off the throttle to change gears, it felt like someone still had their foot in it. Great information, and well presented. Thank you.
Great video as always Luke! I’m painting the car today and posting video later. Waiting for couple more parts to finish putting the motor together. I’m excited to get her on the road. It’s probably been 8yrs or so without even having a drivetrain, so I think I’m doing pretty good for 4 months lol. I’ll be needing some tuning tips soon because I can build anything fuel-injection, turbocharged, or supercharged. But definitely not familiar with carburetors.
These videos always make me think of all the vehicles ive had, that ive complained about the carb. I have no doubt the ignition was the actual culprit. No matter what i did i never got the response from the engine i was looking for. Thank you for your videos.
I also spent years cussing and even ruined an engine that I spent a lot of time building due to some of this stuff - there’s just a ton of misleading info out there.
In the old days there was a Sun distributor machine at virtually every tuneup facility. It was a good tool to set the centrifugal timing on a distributor. Used in conjunction with your road test method, you could obtain perfect timing and have a record of your advance curve.
Good video. I think most people have no idea what springs and weights they have in their distributors. You can buy kits from different manufactures which will have graphs that show how much advance is being added and at what RPM. If you are working with an unknown engine or distributor you can buy stickers with higher degrees up to 30-40 that go on your harmonic balancer. You can rev the engine up and see how much timing is being added at what RPM. Also something to keep in mind is springs do wear out over time. So that may affect your timing.
I too have a truck weighing 5500 lbs. I worked for about 6hrs changing springs, It was worth every minute. I'm a GM MAN, and still enjoy your videos. Thanks
Many many years ago I had a speed shop owner help me with this. After two trips to his shop he was able to install a advance curve in my Mallory distributor that worked well in my 302 ford. Sadly not many shops have this ability any more. With the advance in computer equipped vehicles it takes the skill of a tuner with the appropriate software and several runs of the engine to fine tune the ecm
Glad to see you actually talking about mechanical advance and centrifugal advance timing. more important than vacuum advance. Since your talking old school and carburetors how about doing a post on the Kinetic( breaker points and dwell) systems and how much that can affect timing
Been A LONG TIME since I've recurved a distributor...but to add...Dad taught me to test a tune up in high gear....flat stretch of road...let the rpms come down to idle(still in high)...and put the spurs to it. If no pinging, you were safe. If you were ambitious, it was time to twist on the distributor. Later, I learned about springs and such. Just found your channel. Awesome video.Sub'd.
What worked for me is a light spring, n a medium spring. The kit comes with light, medium, n heavy springs. I did this to both motors, a small block n big block Chevy. Timing ended up at 10° on the small block n 12° on the big block. Total advance on both is about at 36°. They both run great. Both have good pickup, passing gears kick-in strong, and both have good idle. Now, as far as the carburetor, distributor, operator, relationship, you may have to consult Dr Phil... 🤔
You are correct about the timing but its also about transmission timing especially if you have an automatic transmission. in the bottom of the distributor is a plate most have two sides to this plate and can be turned over.there is a knotch on both ends of different lengths make sure yours are correct for your transmission.
Your videos are full of in-depth knowledge, grately appreciated... Am able to apply your tips to Japanese classic Aisan carb... I would request if possible to post few video on 1980s aisan carb setups n tuning too... Cheers
This is something I did to my 69 vw, it sounds silly and I was goffed at by a few people. I have a high altitude situation as well I am trying to correct for. My 1600 dual port single carb does 80 pretty well. And given the horse power and offset loss for altitude will get to highway speeds pretty quick, quick enough it surprises people. I dont sustain 70 plus for long periods but sometimes I want to just go. Sir this video is underrated if anything for a long lost science of engine tuning that's anymore done by the cars pcm keep these vids coming
Great video Luke... you keep delving into lost art of old school engine/carburetor/ignition partnership to best utilize engine performance. Very enjoyable... Does Emily still drive the old F250? I liked that old truck.
I’m the only guys in my shop with a timing light, and I’m under 40, barely lol. I put the pertronix rebuild kit for my sbc in a 79 shortwide and used the middle springs. Really woke that engine up. Made a huge difference just when you would free rev it, it would spin up so quick.
Very well said Luke, I also use to build small block Fords back in the day. Another great way to keep track of how the timing curve is advancing (and at what rate) is to draw a graph with RPM's (every 200 RPM's) on a vertical plane and degrees of advance (every 2 degrees) on a horizontal plane. Now with a timing light you can register the advance every 200 RPM's with a dot on the graph and after 3000 or so RPM's connect the dots to get your distributor curve. This plus test driving for maximum cylinder load (no preignition) is a great "cheap way" to see what's really going on. Maybe you could do a video on it, might help alot of people out. Happy Wrenching.
Interestingly enough, I'm working on the timing for my boat motor (Mercruiser 465 HO). Timing in a marine application has many challenges and it's difficult to hear any detonation. The factory distributor has no vacuum canister nor does it have any kind of centrifugal weight system. I'm guessing it's a 'computer' controlled advance curve. I'm going to test that with the timing light soon. Another challenge with a boat is running on your muffs past idle speed can damage the impeller and/or not provide enough cooling water for the engine. Someday I'll replace all the Merc parts with MSD but the boat runs about 70 MPH now and it's pretty scary at that speed. LOL.
You dam near have to picture a timing curve in your head alongside the mixture readout. Somthing to get your head around. But like you said the throttle feel at a given cruise speed sure gives a good insite.
I wish more people knew about this. Without proper timming you get poor gas millage, and losse power. Not running manifold vac and ported vac to your vacuum advace is the another way to loose gas millage, power, and drivability. I put a timming light on my 1994 f150 and guesse what 30 degrease timming at idle. I set my Nova and K20 up this way with about the same timming. Ported vac was a crude way to produce less emitions pre-catalitic converter.
Great job on this man I appreciate it there's so many idiots out there making stupid videos it's good to have somebody out there with correct terminology.
Much appreciated - I seem to not get too much appreciation seeing as how I often buck conventional thought. I just try to put the facts out there as they are, no bs.
This is great stuff here. I live a couple hours North of Atlanta , and just South of Chattanooga TN. If you're close enough we could build us something to drive up on to add load to the drive axle , sorry not a true dinometer ( I sure wish we could) but something stationary to check ignition timing in different load to RPM's to set one up just right. I would build the deathtrap ( I mean the fabulous machine the test with if you would show me all the tricks of the trade of setting up carburetors and distributors like an old time racer world be able to😀👍 I've learned a lot from your videos. Thanks for posting what you have. But seriously I think if you had something to keep the vehicle stationary and under load with a test light on it to moneter what it's doing at said RPM then a person could adjust the springs and weights to dial it in perfect. Or am I missing something here?????
Big Ford guy here, I'm 43 and never owned anything else and never will I'm currently working on a 1994 shortbed f150 4x4 swapped efi to carb, previous owner had a mess , just old tired 302 in it although still pulls 20" of mercury or better, I replaced distributor with the ford original replacement with vacuum advance all is good except seems to bog on a hill way more than it should, also has 5 speed manual , Mazda 5 trans I believe..... been checking out your videos for a while, keep up the good work man and wondered how the lawnmower carbed maverick came out if it ever ran to where you could drive it
I live in the UK England and we have different distributors I have an old French car and it's got a carb but on my distributor it has an arm that spins an we don't have vacuum but I still found your video insightful have you worked on any set ups like mine?
I have problems with my relationship! Can’t seem to find the balance between running good but getting a backfire in the carb when I get off part or full throttle or running to lean. I’d given up but your video has inspired me to take another shot. 2.3 Ford Mustang carb turbo 1981 has the factory Weber 5200 and mechanical advance and added an AFR gauge to try and dial it in. I have had the carb rebuilt, swapped distributors, swapped ignition boxes and carefully followed carb adjustments. Would welcome suggestions on how to get rid of the turbo seal killing backfire without making it dog slow! The backfire is worse when cold.
Depends on what compression ratio ur engine has . N what rear end gear ur running .to figure out what load u have on engine n higher gears with weight off vehicle
Great info on getting it right... The Right Way for the back yard wrench turner! Also I can't find an old 71' or 72' Autolite 2100 carb! Can you help me out?? Oh! where's the ring on the left hand :)
It's a long time ago (40+ years) but I recall a really solid, nice blue 64 Fairlane I had. Stick six, that was wore out but such a good body I swapped in a 1968 302 2V auto. Had to go to a floor cable shifter (Hurst) I had gotten a factory dual exhaust system from a Ford dealer near me and had it fitted to the slightly different 302 manifolds (vs a 289) at a muffler shop. Damn near couldn't her it run! But when you Cracked the throttle? most definitely! Anyway from advice from older street racer brother I put in a Curve kit in the distributor . Man! What a difference! Car had came with a non posi 3.50 rear gear and once I got somewhat wider, taller tires on the back that car was FUN to drive and race other guys... Now not to say I didn't lose (I never worried about if I did) but I surprised a LOT of guys! Got past a few cars I probably shouldn't have! Being Lo Po 2V 302 I did the curve kit, (lightest springs) timing set to factory specs & I ran one range hotter plugs in her and usually premium gas. PS. I had ne real intention on street racing the car but I DID' really get into it....lol Just wish I would've taken the Parts guy @ the Ford dealer up on his offer and bought his posi unit for an 8" Ford !
Dear thunderhead289 I am currently 32 years old and I have on a truck that has points and an old-school distributor since I was 12 years old I have not on a timing light yet although I agree with needing one I just have gotten really good at adjusting my timing over the years I love your videos however there's one part of the ignition timing that I have not seen you mention yet and that is the balest the thing that drops the voltage to the coil to around 8 volts and why it took me many years to figure that out I'm sure there's a lot of people that still do not know
Would you mind doing a video on setting initial versus total and potentially changing the number of degrees from initial to total? Uncle Tony has a much of vids where he swears more initial is the ticket, but puts some weld in there to decrease the range keeping the total safe. I’d like to hear your thoughts
I switched from ported to manifold since your last video and it would seem the 352 likes it better. The rear is currently on jacks because im swapping on a Dana 80 from the 90s so i cant exactly drive it right now. The only way i could really test if its making more power is really just by giving it some gas and seeing how much the truck shakes from the torque and it seems to be better. Thanks Mr. ThunderHead289 :)
Howdy drew, the only difference between ported and manifold is at idle ☺️ Technically if you switch to ported, to take advantage of what you are doing. You need to then advance initial mechanical timing - this effectively shifts the curve up in the rpm range giving you more timing per rpm across the board 👍
@@ThunderHead289 yeah i was able to advance the timing more when switching. I dont know exactly by how much because there are no timing marks, but i have a stable vacuum at 20 inches. Throttle response seems much smoother/crisp. The 50cc accelerator pump seemed a little big for it when it was on manifold and would bog out if you gave to much gas at once, now it doesnt bog out i just get black smoke out the exhaust which is always fun
Nice job Luke, I agree with a great explanation of 'correct' timing. My only question is are you talking about ported or manifold vacuum? It sounded to me your are referring to manifold and that will actually decrease timing as the throttle is opened. Nit picking, maybe. But I think the clarification is needed. Great information and needed by many. Thanks for sharing.
Really any vacuum advance will trip out under throttle - if vacuum drops, so does the vacuum advance if you hit the vacuum van mister threshold. I was just trying to say that I’m hard throttle you are just on mechanical timing
Hey Thunderhead, Mr. Luke Sir.. I’ve been watching learning much about carburetors and timing. I’ve got a 383 Stroker high comp engine, typically higher temps across board given this ratio. I’ve noticed it spark knocks when I hit it harder, but not hard. I’d installed a proper electric fan big 4 core radiator all this. So, the knocking has lessened after I was able to lower the temps for operation. The temperature of the engine was only getting to about 180/190 or less? Why did cooling my engine more clear-up some but not all of the knocks is my question Sir? Temps were fine? “I’ve been watching your channel and am subscribed. I’ve learned much watching, “Thank You Luke!” Hey, love the tuning aid you use, the fuel ratio Guage. I want to put a nice ratio guage in mine as it sure is the best in getting it closer for tune. Love the relationship between the carburetor and timing.. “Luke, could you set-up a distributor for a 383 Chevy Stroker in a way which would help my 1963 Chevy C10?” I know most has to be done in the vehicle, but wanted to inquire? You Rock Sir, thanks for the comprehensive videos!
This has nothing to do with the subject matter of the video, but here's a tip for those GM owners who want to replace their Quadrajet. If you don't want to swap out the intake but want to install a square bore on your old manifold, the Mr. Gasket 1932 spread bore to square bore adapter will work, but you might have to buy longer bolts or use longer studs to mount your new carb. The supplied bolts are only 1.25 inches long and you'll need longer ones, especially if you need to attach a throttle bracket. This may be true for Mopars also.
Soo what can be wrong on my 1955 ford y block. Renovated the engine and bored to a 292 from a 272. Had to go up in size on my main jets because it didn't want to respond to the gas above idle. Now it does that but over half throttle it's dead. Nothing happens more than it want to backfire at higher rpms in the pipes and the carb. But on "cruising" it works ok. It feels like timing issues.
I might add i have a 302 with a two barrel. What weight springs should i use in the distributor or weights i guess. What should i look for as far as weights and springs in this small block 302?
That is IT in a nut shell. The " RIGHT TIMING " ! But in today's RUclips Climate of Extreme and Shocking EVERYTHING. Only the Thinking , Person will pick up on what your saying. Which is ,to some of us " Nothing New" after many years of building cars ,I'm just coming around , to under standing the significance. Of free HP from " Correct Timing " This was VERY informative, this video applied to many builds , can amount to alot of free horse power with No Money Spent ! Thank You
Just rewatching junkyard dig’s livestream and the headlights flickering on your galaxie is most likely the pull out headlight switch in the dash. It was a common problem. My dad has the same issue in his 67 mustang. That could be it hoot
can you do this for a fuel injected car with a distributor with an electric advance .lets say like a pontiac fiero would have with a 2.8 v6 or a 4.3 vortec in many gm cars ?
I get a lot of loud noise like a missing spark plug but no intake backfire but hear it in the exhaust. I bought a new distributor and i can shake it and hear the weights slopping inside. How does this effect the firing. It runs at low idle but seems looping and no back fire in exhaust. I have about 90 to 130 psi which is low but should not make a backfire in the exhaust i think. Timing is set in order. Plugs are new. Wires are firing. Cap is in good shape, points are set well. HIgh rpm is when i get the cracking pooping noise in the exhaust.
an early bronco, fresh stock built 302, 350 gears 3:03 rat tranny, gm hei distributer, 2500 rpm 55 mph and bucking, what causes it? stumbles a little from idle to acceleration then bucks or surges going down the road but accelerates great. springs seem the be strong. thks
I have a 300 i6 that detonates when I have the timing advanced enough to run smooth, and the advance hooked up. I have been running with no advance because of it, do I need to recurve my distributor?
sort of related but I cant find a solution anywhere. have a 86 f150 it was super neglected im the 3rd to 4th owner. had to replace the timimg chain, distributor cap, rotary button, fix the radiator, replace the starter solenoid, spark plugs and wires, ignition coil, transmission filter, exhaust manifold and a few more things. so going down the road it does okay until it warms up and then it jerks a bit and eventually pressing gas results in no power or feeling of delivery and it jerks and it will struggle to stay going. about 2 to 5 secound intervals between jerking and no power. it will then work if it i allow it to come down on speed. about 30 mph is the sweet spot to where it will go without jerking. doesnt feel like its the transmission its kinda like a backfire like if you run a vacuum cleaner and turn it off and on repeatedly thats about the sound it makes when jerking. cut the exhaust right before the catalytic converter to see if it was clogged but it actually made it worse. any ideas?
Say Thunderhead, any good advice about using NO vacuum advance? See, I can't get the right can for my distributor. The arm linkage on all the ones I seen to order online point and angle the wrong way. So I'm pretty much stuck without a new one... Ya I guess I can order one I know is correct from eBay, but they want a chunk loada cash for it.
Been watching your videos for alittle bit, you give a lot of needed info! Can you tell me if I adjust my timing would that stop my motor from dieseling?
Hi, wonder if you could offer any advice on timing for 74' 440 with "RV" cam, Edlebrock 650 AVS2, performer IM, Pertronix billet diz in a 14K lb motorhome? Book says 7.5 initial on metered port but no idea where to go from there. Haven't changed the springs in the Pertronix yet or adjusted the vac can, vehicle runs fine but can't tell if it's pinging or not because the engine is in the rear lol. Any ideas on safe total timing? And, since it's heavy... do I want my timing to come on faster or slower than a light car? Kind of at a loss and Pertronix tech was no help. Thanks
I have a question which I hope you can take the time out of your day to give your opinion on I'm in the process of finishing my LS swap and I've come to the conclusion of it being overrated sure its fast and whatever but my next project is already on my drawing board and I was leaning towards an old school carburated and distributor powered v8 of course young cats like me allways talk shit about carbs but im really interested in owning one and ppl are biased towards the newer stuff but I'm itching for some of that old school tech for some reason I can build either one but seeing as I'm going for something different this time I wanted to know which route youd take the goal is to have a car that has all the luxury of a daily but can still drop a gear and go 400hp at the least hell I'll be happy with 300 what's it like to daily carb cars thank you
Are you still running that Summit Racing M2008 Series Carb? I was thinking about putting one on my 390fe with a 4v manifold that has a 2bbl carb right now.
I'm about to obtain my Father-in-law's 1983 Ford F250 (460ci with a 3-Speed with Granny Low). I would like to fix the "Steering Wobble" and Upgrade to FULL Disc Brakes. Any suggestions? I thank "Junkyard Digs" for recommending your Channel. -🤘😎👍
Been chasing timing and carburetor settings on my 81 toyota 22r with a Weber. Now it drives better but sometimes idles perfect and sometimes idles way too high. Anyway thanks for the video
put on your thinking cap today, were talking ignition timing.
Get yourself a re-curve kit for your distributor, and a timing light and go to town - ignition timing matters so much more than folks ever give it credit for - "timing is everything"
This is the timing light I use which has the "advance feature": amzn.to/2SrY8lG
Hi Luke. I agree correct timing is everything. But my question is about the timing light. Could you explain the advance timing dial on the light ? What is it used for, and how do you use it. I've other people using it but they never explain why or how to use the dial. I'm old school and have never used one. An explanation would be vary helpful . Thanks.
I was hoping you could help me out I have a 1983 chevy k10 and I swapped motors the old motor had a mechanical fuel pump with one main feed line and then vent line. The new motor is an 87 350ci that was a tbi and I swapped intakes and put an edelbrock intake for my 1406 edelbrock carb. Unfortunately I found out that the 87 blocks with the tbi didnt have mechanical fuel pumps they had the fuel pump inside the tank so to remedy this I bought one of those 4-7 psi 35 GPH edelbrock inline pumps you can buy at an Auto store and plumbed it in. I plugged up the old vent hose to the tank and checked my hose clamps but still seem to lose prime i dont know if i should get a puller pump instead of this gravity feed pusher or what also when I'm driving down the road it's like its misfiring I checked my distributor and timing and am at 14 degrees initial but seem to when I'm cruising its having like a miss.
@@Hrmert The dial back light allows you to easily read your total advance. Typically what you do is raise the rpm up to the point that the timing stops advancing, ie. it is all in.You then shine the light on your timing pointer. While watching the flash you rotate the knob until the TDC mark on your balancer aligns with the timing pointer. The knob on the light is now pointing at your total advance. Alternatively you can start by turning the knob to the desired timing, say 36 degrees. Then bring the rpm up to the point the timing stops advancing, and rotate the distributor until it reads 0 on the balancer.
Unless my engine is tiny, I generally tune for efficiency rather than power, and though lighter springs will probably help both, more vacuum advance helps more with cruising efficiency. Is that usually very conservative also? Also, worn engines that compress less and burn more oil will usually run cooler and want more advanced timing, except if there is much carbon buildup. But really loud mufflers can drown out spark knock.
It is possible to get both, part throttle efficiency and full throttle power. It's just a bit more complex. 2 stage carbs help, and I wish they would make more 2 stage carbs for american cars with 2 bbl manifolds.
People will be surprised how much timing an engine will really take at idle. dont be suprised if it takes like 20 degrees on certain setups and not ping at all.
i hear a lot of hipo street engines like less mechanical and more initial and all in by 2000-2500
Im talking carb pump gas engines no power adders
"It's not about more timing...it's about correct timing." Brilliant!
Back in the day before EFI was even a dream, there was a saying, "99% of carb problems are electrical".
Such concise and essential information in your videos which you make so easy to understand.... thanks for doing what you do 👌
You always explain things in a way anyone should be able to understand. Thank you
My introduction to mechanical advance came in the form of a 1986 GMC Suburban, 350 and manual 4 speed. The mechanic that recurved that one put the lightest springs in that the kit had to offer. I always drove it dead stick, and the next time I drove it, when I backed off the throttle to change gears, it felt like someone still had their foot in it. Great information, and well presented. Thank you.
SO much to learn, so little time! Thanks for the timing lesson.
Thank you Luke!!! Hope you are staying safe!!
Thank you Luke. The Mrs and I really enjoy your videos and the lessons you have
Love how the video starts with him casually holding a distributor sitting in side his truck 🤣😂
Make a video to show people how to properly use a timing gun. Keep up the great videos.
Great video as always Luke! I’m painting the car today and posting video later. Waiting for couple more parts to finish putting the motor together. I’m excited to get her on the road. It’s probably been 8yrs or so without even having a drivetrain, so I think I’m doing pretty good for 4 months lol. I’ll be needing some tuning tips soon because I can build anything fuel-injection, turbocharged, or supercharged. But definitely not familiar with carburetors.
These videos always make me think of all the vehicles ive had, that ive complained about the carb. I have no doubt the ignition was the actual culprit. No matter what i did i never got the response from the engine i was looking for. Thank you for your videos.
I also spent years cussing and even ruined an engine that I spent a lot of time building due to some of this stuff - there’s just a ton of misleading info out there.
Me too. After i started tuning the distributor, my life changed. Im a New Man kkk. Here from braszil!! 👍👊
In the old days there was a Sun distributor machine at virtually every tuneup facility. It was a good tool to set the centrifugal timing on a distributor. Used in conjunction with your road test method, you could obtain perfect timing and have a record of your advance curve.
Good video. I think most people have no idea what springs and weights they have in their distributors. You can buy kits from different manufactures which will have graphs that show how much advance is being added and at what RPM. If you are working with an unknown engine or distributor you can buy stickers with higher degrees up to 30-40 that go on your harmonic balancer. You can rev the engine up and see how much timing is being added at what RPM. Also something to keep in mind is springs do wear out over time. So that may affect your timing.
I too have a truck weighing 5500 lbs. I worked for about 6hrs changing springs, It was worth every minute. I'm a GM MAN, and still enjoy your videos. Thanks
Good deal and thanks for listening - it makes a massive difference and is so underappreicated
i have a very heavy vehicle too 350 sbc what is better faster or slower advancement on a heavy vehicle
I have a 390 in my 68 ford truck. Switched to Pertronix in my stock dist. , smartest thing I ever did
Thank you very much. You put this in easy to understand and the reason why it works .
Just swapped my intake manifold on my 315M Ford Bronco(edelbrock 4brl)..runs great the timing improvement was more noticeable.
Mclovin knows about timing
Many many years ago I had a speed shop owner help me with this. After two trips to his shop he was able to install a advance curve in my Mallory distributor that worked well in my 302 ford. Sadly not many shops have this ability any more. With the advance in computer equipped vehicles it takes the skill of a tuner with the appropriate software and several runs of the engine to fine tune the ecm
Glad to see you actually talking about mechanical advance and centrifugal advance timing. more important than vacuum advance.
Since your talking old school and carburetors how about doing a post on the Kinetic( breaker points and dwell) systems and how much that can affect timing
Been A LONG TIME since I've recurved a distributor...but to add...Dad taught me to test a tune up in high gear....flat stretch of road...let the rpms come down to idle(still in high)...and put the spurs to it. If no pinging, you were safe. If you were ambitious, it was time to twist on the distributor. Later, I learned about springs and such. Just found your channel. Awesome video.Sub'd.
What worked for me is a light spring, n a medium spring. The kit comes with light, medium, n heavy springs. I did this to both
motors, a small block n big block Chevy.
Timing ended up at 10° on the small block n 12° on the big block. Total advance on both is about at 36°. They both run great. Both have good pickup, passing gears kick-in strong, and both have good idle. Now, as far as the carburetor, distributor, operator, relationship, you may have to consult Dr Phil... 🤔
I really enjoy these informational videos. Keep up the good work.
Thanks so much, I’m glad that you do 🤝
You are correct about the timing but its also about transmission timing especially if you have an automatic transmission. in the bottom of the distributor is a plate most have two sides to this plate and can be turned over.there is a knotch on both ends of different lengths make sure yours are correct for your transmission.
Your videos are full of in-depth knowledge, grately appreciated... Am able to apply your tips to Japanese classic Aisan carb... I would request if possible to post few video on 1980s aisan carb setups n tuning too... Cheers
This is something I did to my 69 vw, it sounds silly and I was goffed at by a few people. I have a high altitude situation as well I am trying to correct for. My 1600 dual port single carb does 80 pretty well. And given the horse power and offset loss for altitude will get to highway speeds pretty quick, quick enough it surprises people. I dont sustain 70 plus for long periods but sometimes I want to just go. Sir this video is underrated if anything for a long lost science of engine tuning that's anymore done by the cars pcm keep these vids coming
Great video Luke... you keep delving into lost art of old school engine/carburetor/ignition partnership to best utilize engine performance. Very enjoyable... Does Emily still drive the old F250? I liked that old truck.
Now this is a very well done video!
Awesome just got back from the farm... Can wait to watch
I’m the only guys in my shop with a timing light, and I’m under 40, barely lol. I put the pertronix rebuild kit for my sbc in a 79 shortwide and used the middle springs. Really woke that engine up. Made a huge difference just when you would free rev it, it would spin up so quick.
You’re smarter and understand more than most level three techs!!!👍😸
Thanks Luke for sharing your knowledge good information an good video 👍
Very well said Luke, I also use to build small block Fords back in the day. Another great way to keep track of how the timing curve is advancing (and at what rate) is to draw a graph with RPM's (every 200 RPM's) on a vertical plane and degrees of advance (every 2 degrees) on a horizontal plane. Now with a timing light you can register the advance every 200 RPM's with a dot on the graph and after 3000 or so RPM's connect the dots to get your distributor curve. This plus test driving for maximum cylinder load (no preignition) is a great "cheap way" to see what's really going on. Maybe you could do a video on it, might help alot of people out. Happy Wrenching.
How do you measure the timing? The number of pulses in a minute vs rpm?
@@leeknivek with a timing light every 200 rpm, then mark on graph to get the curve of advance
Thank you. This is once again a great video!
You are welcome, and thanks so much!
As In life in general. Timing is everything”.
You make Very good and informative videos!
Thanks so much! 🤝
Interestingly enough, I'm working on the timing for my boat motor (Mercruiser 465 HO). Timing in a marine application has many challenges and it's difficult to hear any detonation. The factory distributor has no vacuum canister nor does it have any kind of centrifugal weight system. I'm guessing it's a 'computer' controlled advance curve. I'm going to test that with the timing light soon. Another challenge with a boat is running on your muffs past idle speed can damage the impeller and/or not provide enough cooling water for the engine. Someday I'll replace all the Merc parts with MSD but the boat runs about 70 MPH now and it's pretty scary at that speed. LOL.
Hell yeah man! Great tips thanks
You dam near have to picture a timing curve in your head alongside the mixture readout. Somthing to get your head around. But like you said the throttle feel at a given cruise speed sure gives a good insite.
Excellent 👍🏼👍🏼. So many people do it wrong. Nothing like a 36° LOCKED distributor on a boosted engine 😂.
keep up the great work!!!
Hey Luke thanks for the tips you share.
No problem my friend - I just try to put out there what I wish I would have had ten years ago!
That is an absolute beautiful 2300. Looks like its loved or just spanked baby new.
I wish more people knew about this. Without proper timming you get poor gas millage, and losse power. Not running manifold vac and ported vac to your vacuum advace is the another way to loose gas millage, power, and drivability. I put a timming light on my 1994 f150 and guesse what 30 degrease timming at idle. I set my Nova and K20 up this way with about the same timming. Ported vac was a crude way to produce less emitions pre-catalitic converter.
Great job on this man I appreciate it there's so many idiots out there making stupid videos it's good to have somebody out there with correct terminology.
Much appreciated - I seem to not get too much appreciation seeing as how I often buck conventional thought.
I just try to put the facts out there as they are, no bs.
Great video!! Liked and subscribed
This is great stuff here. I live a couple hours North of Atlanta , and just South of Chattanooga TN. If you're close enough we could build us something to drive up on to add load to the drive axle , sorry not a true dinometer ( I sure wish we could) but something stationary to check ignition timing in different load to RPM's to set one up just right. I would build the deathtrap ( I mean the fabulous machine the test with if you would show me all the tricks of the trade of setting up carburetors and distributors like an old time racer world be able to😀👍
I've learned a lot from your videos. Thanks for posting what you have. But seriously I think if you had something to keep the vehicle stationary and under load with a test light on it to moneter what it's doing at said RPM then a person could adjust the springs and weights to dial it in perfect. Or am I missing something here?????
Big Ford guy here, I'm 43 and never owned anything else and never will I'm currently working on a 1994 shortbed f150 4x4 swapped efi to carb, previous owner had a mess , just old tired 302 in it although still pulls 20" of mercury or better, I replaced distributor with the ford original replacement with vacuum advance all is good except seems to bog on a hill way more than it should, also has 5 speed manual , Mazda 5 trans I believe..... been checking out your videos for a while, keep up the good work man and wondered how the lawnmower carbed maverick came out if it ever ran to where you could drive it
There is numerous videos of me driving the mower carb including 1000 miles on power tour
Great video
I live in the UK England and we have different distributors I have an old French car and it's got a carb but on my distributor it has an arm that spins an we don't have vacuum but I still found your video insightful have you worked on any set ups like mine?
Some good information Thanks
Great information
Man luke I wish I lived closer to me! i could use your expertise when dialing in my 68 f100 360
Get a vacuum gauge, a timing light will get you close, but a vacuum gauge will get you spot on
Young Luke , using the force.
you just Discovered this... Wow is Humanity going backwards.. My Grandfather was doing this in the 60s
I have problems with my relationship! Can’t seem to find the balance between running good but getting a backfire in the carb when I get off part or full throttle or running to lean. I’d given up but your video has inspired me to take another shot. 2.3 Ford Mustang carb turbo 1981 has the factory Weber 5200 and mechanical advance and added an AFR gauge to try and dial it in. I have had the carb rebuilt, swapped distributors, swapped ignition boxes and carefully followed carb adjustments. Would welcome suggestions on how to get rid of the turbo seal killing backfire without making it dog slow! The backfire is worse when cold.
Depends on what compression ratio ur engine has . N what rear end gear ur running .to figure out what load u have on engine n higher gears with weight off vehicle
Thanks for the great info.
No problem 😇
Great info on getting it right... The Right Way for the back yard wrench turner! Also I can't find an old 71' or 72' Autolite 2100 carb! Can you help me out?? Oh! where's the ring on the left hand :)
Very Informative..
Thanks!
Also you can take one of the springs out as well and if Chevy with heavy cam I advance it 16 to 18 with one spring
It's a long time ago (40+ years) but I recall a really solid, nice blue 64 Fairlane I had. Stick six, that was wore out but such a good body I swapped in a 1968 302 2V auto. Had to go to a floor cable shifter (Hurst) I had gotten a factory dual exhaust system from a Ford dealer near me and had it fitted to the slightly different 302 manifolds (vs a 289) at a muffler shop. Damn near couldn't her it run! But when you Cracked the throttle? most definitely! Anyway from advice from older street racer brother I put in a Curve kit in the distributor . Man! What a difference! Car had came with a non posi 3.50 rear gear and once I got somewhat wider, taller tires on the back that car was FUN to drive and race other guys... Now not to say I didn't lose (I never worried about if I did) but I surprised a LOT of guys! Got past a few cars I probably shouldn't have! Being Lo Po 2V 302 I did the curve kit, (lightest springs) timing set to factory specs & I ran one range hotter plugs in her and usually premium gas. PS. I had ne real intention on street racing the car but I DID' really get into it....lol Just wish I would've taken the Parts guy @ the Ford dealer up on his offer and bought his posi unit for an 8" Ford !
I love reading stuff like this
dude, you could prob make a solid living traveling the country sorting out guys rigs, id pay ya to sort mine out, and nice bottle opener ring,
Thank you for sharing. What’s going to be a good starting timing curve for a Ford 429 ci 10.25 CR and stock cam?
Dear thunderhead289 I am currently 32 years old and I have on a truck that has points and an old-school distributor since I was 12 years old I have not on a timing light yet although I agree with needing one I just have gotten really good at adjusting my timing over the years I love your videos however there's one part of the ignition timing that I have not seen you mention yet and that is the balest the thing that drops the voltage to the coil to around 8 volts and why it took me many years to figure that out I'm sure there's a lot of people that still do not know
Would you mind doing a video on setting initial versus total and potentially changing the number of degrees from initial to total? Uncle Tony has a much of vids where he swears more initial is the ticket, but puts some weld in there to decrease the range keeping the total safe. I’d like to hear your thoughts
I switched from ported to manifold since your last video and it would seem the 352 likes it better. The rear is currently on jacks because im swapping on a Dana 80 from the 90s so i cant exactly drive it right now. The only way i could really test if its making more power is really just by giving it some gas and seeing how much the truck shakes from the torque and it seems to be better. Thanks Mr. ThunderHead289 :)
Howdy drew, the only difference between ported and manifold is at idle ☺️
Technically if you switch to ported, to take advantage of what you are doing. You need to then advance initial mechanical timing - this effectively shifts the curve up in the rpm range giving you more timing per rpm across the board 👍
@@ThunderHead289 yeah i was able to advance the timing more when switching. I dont know exactly by how much because there are no timing marks, but i have a stable vacuum at 20 inches. Throttle response seems much smoother/crisp. The 50cc accelerator pump seemed a little big for it when it was on manifold and would bog out if you gave to much gas at once, now it doesnt bog out i just get black smoke out the exhaust which is always fun
Nice job Luke,
I agree with a great explanation of 'correct' timing. My only question is are you talking about ported or manifold vacuum? It sounded to me your are referring to manifold and that will actually decrease timing as the throttle is opened. Nit picking, maybe. But I think the clarification is needed.
Great information and needed by many.
Thanks for sharing.
Really any vacuum advance will trip out under throttle - if vacuum drops, so does the vacuum advance if you hit the vacuum van mister threshold. I was just trying to say that I’m hard throttle you are just on mechanical timing
Hey Thunderhead, Mr. Luke Sir.. I’ve been watching learning much about carburetors and timing. I’ve got a 383 Stroker high comp engine, typically higher temps across board given this ratio. I’ve noticed it spark knocks when I hit it harder, but not hard. I’d installed a proper electric fan big 4 core radiator all this. So, the knocking has lessened after I was able to lower the temps for operation. The temperature of the engine was only getting to about 180/190 or less? Why did cooling my engine more clear-up some but not all of the knocks is my question Sir? Temps were fine?
“I’ve been watching your channel and am subscribed. I’ve learned much watching, “Thank You Luke!”
Hey, love the tuning aid you use, the fuel ratio Guage. I want to put a nice ratio guage in mine as it sure is the best in getting it closer for tune.
Love the relationship between the carburetor and timing..
“Luke, could you set-up a distributor for a 383 Chevy Stroker in a way which would help my 1963 Chevy C10?”
I know most has to be done in the vehicle, but wanted to inquire?
You Rock Sir, thanks for the comprehensive videos!
This has nothing to do with the subject matter of the video, but here's a tip for those GM owners who want to replace their Quadrajet. If you don't want to swap out the intake but want to install a square bore on your old manifold, the Mr. Gasket 1932 spread bore to square bore adapter will work, but you might have to buy longer bolts or use longer studs to mount your new carb. The supplied bolts are only 1.25 inches long and you'll need longer ones, especially if you need to attach a throttle bracket. This may be true for Mopars also.
Yup just about testing from cruise I use 3 gear tho to dial it in
Soo what can be wrong on my 1955 ford y block. Renovated the engine and bored to a 292 from a 272. Had to go up in size on my main jets because it didn't want to respond to the gas above idle. Now it does that but over half throttle it's dead. Nothing happens more than it want to backfire at higher rpms in the pipes and the carb. But on "cruising" it works ok. It feels like timing issues.
I might add i have a 302 with a two barrel. What weight springs should i use in the distributor or weights i guess. What should i look for as far as weights and springs in this small block 302?
That is IT in a nut shell. The " RIGHT TIMING " ! But in today's RUclips Climate of Extreme and Shocking EVERYTHING.
Only the Thinking , Person will pick up on what your saying.
Which is ,to some of us " Nothing New" after many years of building cars ,I'm just coming around , to under standing the significance. Of free HP from " Correct Timing " This was VERY informative, this video applied to many builds , can amount to alot of free horse power with No Money Spent ! Thank You
I'm trying to get my 1972 F-250 running with original parts! And need a good carb for my 72' 390... and Yes it's an F25 H code Camper Special!
I'm the second owner, bought the truck from an elderly man who used it for camping and hunting. Only has 89k on it 😎
Just rewatching junkyard dig’s livestream and the headlights flickering on your galaxie is most likely the pull out headlight switch in the dash. It was a common problem. My dad has the same issue in his 67 mustang. That could be it hoot
Nice f-150 I’m looking at a 94 currently
can you do this for a fuel injected car with a distributor with an electric advance .lets say like a pontiac fiero would have with a 2.8 v6 or a 4.3 vortec in many gm cars ?
Comment to congratulate You on the wedding :-)
Where can I get advance springs for a stock autolite distributor?
I get a lot of loud noise like a missing spark plug but no intake backfire but hear it in the exhaust. I bought a new distributor and i can shake it and hear the weights slopping inside. How does this effect the firing. It runs at low idle but seems looping and no back fire in exhaust. I have about 90 to 130 psi which is low but should not make a backfire in the exhaust i think. Timing is set in order. Plugs are new. Wires are firing. Cap is in good shape, points are set well. HIgh rpm is when i get the cracking pooping noise in the exhaust.
nice info
an early bronco, fresh stock built 302, 350 gears 3:03 rat tranny, gm hei distributer, 2500 rpm 55 mph and bucking, what causes it? stumbles a little from idle to acceleration then bucks or surges going down the road but accelerates great. springs seem the be strong. thks
I have a 300 i6 that detonates when I have the timing advanced enough to run smooth, and the advance hooked up. I have been running with no advance because of it, do I need to recurve my distributor?
If you set a square xfer slot on your carb, where does air come from at idle? My edelbrock (brand new) is completely closed at that point.
sort of related but I cant find a solution anywhere. have a 86 f150 it was super neglected im the 3rd to 4th owner. had to replace the timimg chain, distributor cap, rotary button, fix the radiator, replace the starter solenoid, spark plugs and wires, ignition coil, transmission filter, exhaust manifold and a few more things. so going down the road it does okay until it warms up and then it jerks a bit and eventually pressing gas results in no power or feeling of delivery and it jerks and it will struggle to stay going. about 2 to 5 secound intervals between jerking and no power. it will then work if it i allow it to come down on speed. about 30 mph is the sweet spot to where it will go without jerking. doesnt feel like its the transmission its kinda like a backfire like if you run a vacuum cleaner and turn it off and on repeatedly thats about the sound it makes when jerking. cut the exhaust right before the catalytic converter to see if it was clogged but it actually made it worse. any ideas?
Say Thunderhead, any good advice about using NO vacuum advance? See, I can't get the right can for my distributor. The arm linkage on all the ones I seen to order online point and angle the wrong way. So I'm pretty much stuck without a new one... Ya I guess I can order one I know is correct from eBay, but they want a chunk loada cash for it.
Been watching your videos for alittle bit, you give a lot of needed info! Can you tell me if I adjust my timing would that stop my motor from dieseling?
Dieseling is caused by too much air getting into the engine as it winds down, usually due to too much idle throttle or a vacuum leak
does your a/fr gauge have sensors in both headers or just one? would luv to put one in my car
Hi, wonder if you could offer any advice on timing for 74' 440 with "RV" cam, Edlebrock 650 AVS2, performer IM, Pertronix billet diz in a 14K lb motorhome? Book says 7.5 initial on metered port but no idea where to go from there. Haven't changed the springs in the Pertronix yet or adjusted the vac can, vehicle runs fine but can't tell if it's pinging or not because the engine is in the rear lol. Any ideas on safe total timing? And, since it's heavy... do I want my timing to come on faster or slower than a light car? Kind of at a loss and Pertronix tech was no help. Thanks
Smart fella
I have a question which I hope you can take the time out of your day to give your opinion on I'm in the process of finishing my LS swap and I've come to the conclusion of it being overrated sure its fast and whatever but my next project is already on my drawing board and I was leaning towards an old school carburated and distributor powered v8 of course young cats like me allways talk shit about carbs but im really interested in owning one and ppl are biased towards the newer stuff but I'm itching for some of that old school tech for some reason I can build either one but seeing as I'm going for something different this time I wanted to know which route youd take the goal is to have a car that has all the luxury of a daily but can still drop a gear and go 400hp at the least hell I'll be happy with 300 what's it like to daily carb cars thank you
How do I set timing on a sbc with a locked msd distributor? Timing light nothing fancy just a light .
Are you still running that Summit Racing M2008 Series Carb? I was thinking about putting one on my 390fe with a 4v manifold that has a 2bbl carb right now.
I'm about to obtain my Father-in-law's 1983 Ford F250 (460ci with a 3-Speed with Granny Low).
I would like to fix the "Steering Wobble" and Upgrade to FULL Disc Brakes.
Any suggestions?
I thank "Junkyard Digs" for recommending your Channel.
-🤘😎👍
thanks frnend
When are you gonna replace the bulb on your blinky flashlight?
Been chasing timing and carburetor settings on my 81 toyota 22r with a Weber. Now it drives better but sometimes idles perfect and sometimes idles way too high. Anyway thanks for the video