@@tylerellis9097 not that true, you see, Microsoft directs 343, so if 343 says "it's not ready, give us some time" Microsoft already spent 'x' quantity of money for the game to be ready in 'y' amount of time, if they surpass the amount of time, that means that Microsoft probably will lose money because they have to spent more money for more time. Microsoft asks: game is playable? 343i: yeah, but we have some issues and bugs, not that much content.... Microsoft: you'll fix it later and add some later, we will release the product I'm sorry but, that's the truth behind not only game development but Software development in general. I can tell by experience
@@FORGEWORLDXBL That's the thing though. Microsoft already granted them another year to develop the game. It was supposed to come out in 2020 but came out in 2021. And now in 2022, we're STILL missing a lot of features (dedicated multiplayer maps, forge mode, theater is completely broken, custom games, campaign splitscreen which was cancelled). This is definitely 343 at fault. It's been confirmed that since launch, there's been a lack of content BECAUSE 343 has spent the past year fixing their own game instead of adding new content. The slipspace engine is absolutely terrible. It took them WEEKS to add a simple team slayer playlist because their engine for some reason doesn't allow them to simply add it on because the engine is so complicated. That's their fault. You're not wrong about publishers pushing games out and letting them fix it later, but Infinite was given 5 years before their 2020 delay (so technically 6).
Games are still play tested. The problem is that bugs are pushed aside by higher-ups with the idea that they can "just fix it later." I get this is a joke, but it sucks for the people who actually try to report these bugs and are ignored by people in positions of power, and then the QA team gets shit on for it.
I think It's more accurate to say 11 minutes of the devs being allowed to control development. Most game devs now still care, they just can't make a difference without losing their jobs
@@Bubbly_Dragon it’s crazy that in the current video game industry it’s common that the DEVELOPERS don’t play the largest role in the direction of DEVELOPMENT.
@@IndiGrey17 4 had so many red flags people just didn't wanna see it. The first 10 minutes of the game retcons the entire plot of CE-3-Reach all so an angry Forerunner can fly around like Bowser with a laser that turns Humans into robots with swords for hands.
@@junioraltamontent.7582 they retconned the entire direction of the forerunners too. Bungie had gone out of its way to ambiguously symbolize the Forerunners WERE in fact ancient humanity. It was a massively ambiguous grand twist that 343 just totally dumped to the side like their office desk trash. Then the whole Human-Forerunner war and our devolution and the receding flood, it’s all cool in wordage yeah…but completely stupid sounding when you are actually aware of the original intent of Bungie’s lore direction.
@@ViktoriousDead didn’t Cod 4 and every gears game only have two player splitscreen? I know gears 3 has a 3 player splitscreen glitch but it was very obscure back then.
Keep in mind, this is a documentary that could only be made because of Bungie's precious success. Editors and film makers have made this process feel interesting. Bad games can make for brilliant documentaries. Additionally, this period was notoriously nightmarish for the team at Bungie, the crunch culture was extremely destructive. We're getting a very slick presentation of what game dev was like for these people, and no one knew if the end product would even be successful.
I dont get how game studios can be almost 50-100x larger these days compared to mid-2000s and ship broken games, some of which never get patched enough to be fun
That’s sort of where the issue comes into play. You have a dev team of like 10 people it’s really easy to get them all on the same page. Going to 50 or 75 or 100 person dev teams keeping uniform code is almost impossible. Huge bugs are caused by this. And then with studio demand wanting the game to be pumped out as soon as possible and more thought being put into microtransactions and how to monetize every little thing rather than focus on how the game feels or plays it’s no wonder why the state of video games is just utter shit now especially compared to the golden days in gaming of 2007-2012
Scope creep is one of many reasons. Bigger studios = more potential and more investment into every avenue they pursue. It's much easier to ditch a concept 3 people worked on for 2 months than a concept 30 people worked on for 2 months. I mean, look at Halo 2. They were scrapping ideas left and right to meet launch date, something no studio today can really *afford* to do with how much money they put into each element.
Well, there’s a few things. Project management is difficult and gets more difficult with larger teams. The cycle gets larger, it takes longer for changes to propagate through the system, makes version control hard to manage
Probably because most of these huge studios now are full of urbanites doing made-up HR jobs making sure everyone does their diversity training and not actually programming
The cost of upkeep for the studio and producing the game begins to outweigh the profit if you take the time to develop it as much as devs used to, and so getting the foundations down and then finishing it after you sold 10 morbillion copies is more cost friendly than how it used to be done. Game studios don't even need a lot of staff to be very good, though. It's just too much hassle.
TAKE. ME. BACK. nowadays game devs are a hundred times larger and are somehow achieving so much less than a handful of sweaty dorks who would occasionally get in fistfights over the minor details that made these games not only fun, but *functional* we just need to round up all the business people that pushed all these guys out of the industry and feed them into a wood chipper
Sadly its out of the actual devs control. The problem is that video games have been corporated. Making video games is now a machine for Triple A companies, where devs are put on projects like an excel sheet and forced to crunch out overtime to hit the release deadline for optimized sales.
@@Kelpic This is nonsense. Games have always been "corporated". Halo is one of Microsofts biggest products...ever...always has been. The issue is game devs lack vision. Especially in 343, where the vocal minority rose to power after Bungie handed it off. Bunch of uninspired, bland people with bad ideas who are not being regulated in leadership positions. If you make the argument about Halo MP being F2P, that may be Microsofts push. But no one is making 343 add stupid cat ear and anime cosmetics.
What a concept, that last line. "If you really believe it's not ready to go out the door it won't go out the door." I'm looking at you triple A game industry post Xbox-360.
@@truesonsofmandalore Well that's just grossly untrue. The Wii was comparable to the GC in terms of power, where as the Wii U is more comparable to the Switch (and slightly ahead of the 360). The Wii U was actually Nintendo's biggest leap in hardware since the early 2000s.
“You can never test enough.” Damn that should be every developers motto. Instead today it’s hey get rid of the QA team we’ll just have day one buyers test our game.
@@Hevvvyyy Ranked playlists is actually what kept both halo 2 and 3 active for over a decade each. Almost no games in existence have pulled that off. So yes the competitive factor was HUGE. Games nowadays are too soft for it, cuz ppl whine and complain when lose, so instead of ranks have switched to “experienced” based rankings, just means play more and level up even if you’re bad. Definitely caters to the masses but is short lived when there’s no glory to be achieved.
I miss these videos from the collectors edition. You felt just felt more connected to the game knowing how the process worked and watching the story unfold behind the scenes
The DVD that came with the collectors edition of Halo 3 is what made me want to work for Bungie...even after all these years I still want to work there.
they're too embarrassed to put anything out now days...the bug testing division has been absorbed into microtransaction division...the only part of the game that matters...who cares about a bug when you can buy an emote of clarence carter strokin lol
now this is what making a game is. seeing where players have fun and where they dont. having interactive testers that play however they want and give crucial feedback. having teams upon teams that go through each crack of the game in order to figure out where and how something can and will go wrong. this is what made these games so great. having people that actually cared about the playerbase and what THEY wanted, not how much money the developers wanted to make. what do we have now? none of this.
How do you know? Have you worked for them? Just because you watch some gaming youtuber talk crap you believe it 🙄 go to the studio in person and they will gladly take you on a tour.
We still have all of this. The issue is that we still have all of this. It didn't grow proportionally to how complex the coding has gotten or how massive the teams are.
This is why Halo is perhaps the greatest all around video game experience ever created. Laborious testing and excruciating attention to detail. People who were interested in creating art, not just a game.
@@ShmoozeEvolution Halo 5? Polished? 🤣🤣 Buddy, they couldn't even host LAN tournaments without the game randomly kicking out one of the players. The SBMM is still completely broken. Halo 4 has the most unbalenced gameplay out of any other game in the franchise, you can literally spawn in with an overpowered dmr, a pocket shotgun, and the ability to see players through walls. Halo 4 and 5 are literally the Epitome of unpolished.
The tools they used to measure "fun" and "frustrating" parts of multi-player and single-player are mind boggling. I loved how those data points pulled up videos of the game play. That's beyond cool.
old bungie was so chaotic and somehow also so methodical.looking at the vidocs for halo 3 it comes as less of a surprise now that halo 3 is generally hailed as the ultimate halo experience.they busted ass on it
@@WhatIsSanity word!? I had no idea. I love the fluidity and fairness in the previous installments (Bungie days), even if I felt like I shouldn't have died In an interaction, I never was like this game is not fair etc. Now it really feels like it not fair, getting shot around corners, not lunging when you are the correct distance for a melee,shields recharging in the middle of the battle (I have the video proof lol)
@@Foernnr Halo has always been punishing when it comes to lag, what you just described is the majority of my online Halo experience since well before 343i. Your connection did have to be pretty bad though, but playing Infinite now even if you have a stellar connection it plays really badly. It's also much worse with high, jittery latency and or packet loss. EA servers on the other hand are a whole new level of shite. The smallest problem is expressed most dramatically in EA games with a secondary multiplayer component, or older games that got a server downgrade -like BF4.
@@WhatIsSanity Infinite's handling of non-ideal connections really is pretty damn bad. I have super-fast fiber now so I get almost zero issues and I assume that's the kind of connection quality they're expecting and tested around, but on my previous connection I would often get intermittent lagspikes, packet loss, etc. in everything and y'know how that affected Infinite? It would teleport me to places that I hadn't even been, off of ledges with kill planes below them, sometimes even just warping me to the lowest walkable point on the map relative to where I am. "Are you on the bridge on Recharge? No you're not, fuck you." It's ridiculous, it's like it completely loses tracks of where you are and just throws shit at a dart board while blindfolded trying to put you somewhere.
@@wilshirelive1014 What makes Bungie special is you can say they're special and even since Halo 1 THEY TOO were getting their nuts busted by Microsoft, the whole time. Very special
what an extrmeeeeely fascinating and eye-opening video. I especially loved the user testing. the fact that they MAP OUT parts where players encounter frustration or die often. That's so brilliant.
Oh no, you DO NOT want bungie in charge of anything. They ain't the same small genuine company. They did D2 dirty, and judging by what they are saying, they're far from done.
Everyone who took part in this project will remember these moments until they die. A time when everyone around you was working to create a world that was good and memorable. What a time it must have been to be on the team then.
11:04 "as long as the game doesn't set your house on fire, it's fine". Flashback to their 1998 game, Myth II: Soulblighter, which would brick your hard drive if you tried to uninstall it from the root directory, and the company lost major profits from the game due to them withdrawing every copy from the factory and stores. They could've just shipped the game anyway and publish the fix they had already developed as a patch on their website, since it was unlikely that many people would even install the game in the hard drive root directory in the first place, but Bungie decided to take the high road and ship a fixed physical copy.
I'm finishing my career as a software engineer, and now I'm basically joining the QA career path... This hits me so hard, I mean, manual testing is exhausting, automated testing is a whole thing but not going to replicate every exact human error...
@@Dennis19901 From my experience, you can try to idiot proof your work as autistically as possible, and literally the first day it’s in use someone will stumble upon a new bug or unintended thing.
I wasn't especting this but watching this made me cry a bit for the very good memories and the beauty of them wanting to give players the best experience possible in a honest way.
And to think I went through Army training (basic/AIT) while they worked on the game then later saw it while stationed in Korea being played by my battle buddy.
Just that line, “I love my job, EA you hiring?” Said as a joke brought a smile to my face. Who knows where that guy ended up but at that moment in time, he knew as challenging as it was, he was making history.
It's telling that the most replayed part of the video is at 0:27 where the melee collision detection is broken, and was deemed a significant enough bug that they devoted a segment of it to a devlog they made. And then completely squashed said bug before the game launched... Whereas 343i has still completely failed to fully fix it a year into the lifespan of a game released 14 years later.
0:30 no fucking way they fixed this when it was a bug in halo 3 but after 5 years of d2 you still flip a coin whether or not you'll teleport through your opponent after pressing your melee button.
The advent of always-online gaming has ruined the games industry. When Halo 3 and Reach released you could put the day one disc into an offline xbox 360 and it would work.
@Quadmachine As powerful as mods are, I agree. "Stick it in and go" should always be an option. ...I say as I dump Breath of the Wild to use a mod manager :P
They make more money when you can’t resell your used discs. In fact it’s why they want everyone to eventually just pay for subscriptions to play, not own. Kind of like how renting vs owning a house works.. The one that makes the most money dominates 😂😭
@@carsonhunt4642 They also make more money when their games launch in a playable condition. But it seems the lack of a hard deadline has killed the quality of games.
@@Noid and now it’s gay and stupid. Too bad. All the good programmers and sensible people are staying the hell away from the clown show that is making games any time after 2016
Bungie from 2001 to 2010 was the coolest and most fascinating game developing studio out there to watch and listen to. I loved their mini documentaries (or ViDocs), their podcasts, and all their blogposts. I’ve never felt more connected to a game studio than Bungie during this time period and everything they produced around this time were absolutely legendary classic video games that still hold up extremely well today. You just don’t see this kind of personality or talent matched by 343 or present day Bungie.
Bungie was a studio made up entirely of fans of their own games, meaning they wanted to make games they could have fun with themselves. That's what made them special, because they didn't want fame or money really. They were college bros wanting to have fun and chill out and they were made up of people from their own audience. The connection is there because they are their own audience, they are the people they appeal to. And that's where everything great about them came from. Also The Cup doesn't exist.
@@physical_insanity They just because such a big studio too much publisher/corporate meddling and features/modes being focused-grouped to death took out of the organic fun from their games. Current Bungie is definitely a shell of it’s former self. Most of the original devs are gone now anyway and they ended up just getting bought again by Sony after they fought to hard to earn their independence from Microsoft
I remember when h3 came out we saved up money and went to Walmart camped out bought 3 Xbox 360s and 3 h3s and went to friends house and hooked up all 3 on Lan total of 12 people on the controllers probably like 20 people total rotating with all the soda and junk food 😅 good Ole days
This is one reason why early access exists. The amount of work it takes to fully playtest a game is insane, and like the one guy said, you could have all these testers trying to climb trees and jump onto that rock, and then confirm, yup, you can't get on top of that rock, but day one of release and there's a video of someone getting onto that rock. A few dozen testers, no matter how skilled, will never really compare to having thousands of testers that can submit bug reports.
Wow bungie filming all of this content over the years was genius. It’s basically a blueprint and a formula to make a great video game. It’s such a shame that the passion for creation in this industry has been soured by corporate control.
Old Bungie really looks and sounds like a passionate frat house compared to the sterile, buzzword laden assembly line of the present AAA scene. I think somewhere along the lines we hit that point of too many cooks, and money, spoiling the pot, the passion project vs. the industrial revolution. I’d say it’s a shame, but thankfully there’s still a lot of great devs and studios out there keeping the love of meticulous passion projects alive.
"it's really a difficult thing to do, to make it ok that you die a couple times but not too many times." *FromSoft devs sees playtesters failing to make it out of the tutorial level "It needs more enemies and traps."
Now after watching that, think of Halo Infinites development cycle. Stories of really long hours to have a game bomb out at E3, resulting in a years delay. Serious issues releasing content because problems with the game engine due to technical debt, senior members of the team constantly leaving, net code with de sync being poor. Add this to the stories now that the whole game engine that they spent so long upgrading is going to move to Unreal Engine 5 for future halo games and the BR mode. Imagine who hectic the making of Halo Infinite was and still is.
There are so many more and very major issues than this too. Like how every Halo on MCC plus every 343 Halo has absolutely borked lighting. A wildly inconsistent narrative so poorly written the only thing linking the last 4 games is one sure did happen after the other, not that you could tell. And so much more.
Crazy how us the mass are now essentially the playtesters and our only compensation is the full game finally being brought to a playable state months after launch.
The reason games were tested more probably is cause back then it wasn't as easy as sending an update, not everyone had their console connected to the internet. I had a ps3 for 8 years and didn't even realise i could connect it to the internet. Nowadays it's so easy to just send an update that it's not that worth to heavily test something
For all of the playtesting that was done, to be honest I'm glad some of the bugs made it through. We ended up with a very smooth and polished experience with just the right amount of hidden jank to create some of the goofiest, belly-laugh moments. I remember the melee in multiplayer absolutely sending the body and I loved that bug.
The golden era of gaming. When devs actually play tested their games. Now we're buying games in the early development, waiting around for updates but still paying full price. I'm glad I grew up in that era.
Yep, the 360 was peak console gaming. Great games, great online atmosphere, great platform, everything was just so polished... xbox one live feels soul-less.
@@Dennis19901 I don't buy them. It's obvious to me why one should never buy them. Everyone else still does, though. What am I supposed to do about that?
@@Dennis19901 you're a dumbass if you think all gamers are just going to stop buying broken games overnight, do you even understand the amount of money that goes into mass media and hype surrounding not even triple A games but games as a whole? The only way this will stop is if governments start telling game companies "No, you can't publish a defective product." just like they've done for every other industry
the 4 seconds starting at 10:30 is a perfect microcosm of the mid 00s. A guy sitting down in the old Kirkland studios working on Halo 3 with a 4:3 monitor in the background displaying Bliss
0:15 when we ask for elites for the 3rd time in 10 years 343: nope. Let’s make the hammer suck like that with its windup time that’s what the fans want
8:50 "you wanna maximize the amount of time that the player is having fun," 343i could really learn a lot going thru videos of the good games being developed
That last line hit hard.
"If we really believe its not ready to go out the door, it won't go out the door"
IF ONLY 343 INDUSTRIES HAD THE SAME PHILOSOPHY
@@Knight_647 it’s not 343. It’s Microsoft.
@@lonefinch2127 it’s definitely 343 given their leadership was just purged and replaced with people who had succeeded with MCC on PC.
@@tylerellis9097 not that true, you see, Microsoft directs 343, so if 343 says "it's not ready, give us some time" Microsoft already spent 'x' quantity of money for the game to be ready in 'y' amount of time, if they surpass the amount of time, that means that Microsoft probably will lose money because they have to spent more money for more time.
Microsoft asks: game is playable?
343i: yeah, but we have some issues and bugs, not that much content....
Microsoft: you'll fix it later and add some later, we will release the product
I'm sorry but, that's the truth behind not only game development but Software development in general. I can tell by experience
@@FORGEWORLDXBL That's the thing though. Microsoft already granted them another year to develop the game. It was supposed to come out in 2020 but came out in 2021. And now in 2022, we're STILL missing a lot of features (dedicated multiplayer maps, forge mode, theater is completely broken, custom games, campaign splitscreen which was cancelled). This is definitely 343 at fault. It's been confirmed that since launch, there's been a lack of content BECAUSE 343 has spent the past year fixing their own game instead of adding new content. The slipspace engine is absolutely terrible. It took them WEEKS to add a simple team slayer playlist because their engine for some reason doesn't allow them to simply add it on because the engine is so complicated. That's their fault.
You're not wrong about publishers pushing games out and letting them fix it later, but Infinite was given 5 years before their 2020 delay (so technically 6).
Old archive footage of game devs actually testing and patching their games before launch, a practice no longer followed in the gaming community.
Ancient game development techniques, forgotten.
Games are still play tested. The problem is that bugs are pushed aside by higher-ups with the idea that they can "just fix it later." I get this is a joke, but it sucks for the people who actually try to report these bugs and are ignored by people in positions of power, and then the QA team gets shit on for it.
This was forged by the Gods
@@newnavy2211 That's the situation with Infinite in a nutshell. 343 being strangleholded by Microsoft
@@Espartanica I don’t even think it was Msoft. If they wanted to push the game out it would’ve come with the series consoles.
11 minutes of game devs actually caring.
I think It's more accurate to say 11 minutes of the devs being allowed to control development. Most game devs now still care, they just can't make a difference without losing their jobs
@@Bubbly_Dragon Big suits that know nothing about games dictating how games are made was the downfall of gaming
If they cared Bungie woulda never sold Halo
@@thwomp1542 Agreed. Look how they did Infinite
@@Bubbly_Dragon it’s crazy that in the current video game industry it’s common that the DEVELOPERS don’t play the largest role in the direction of DEVELOPMENT.
“A lot of times you’ll find that the testers know the system better than the engineers do” this kind of humility is non-existent at 343
Don't blame 343, blame Bonnie & Microsoft
@@Hxtr6d 343 is an embarrassing excuse of a company you delusional shill
@@Hxtr6d 343 killed our chief halo 4 ok halo 5 terrible halo infinite dead game with wasted potential that’s unfinished
@@IndiGrey17 4 had so many red flags people just didn't wanna see it. The first 10 minutes of the game retcons the entire plot of CE-3-Reach all so an angry Forerunner can fly around like Bowser with a laser that turns Humans into robots with swords for hands.
@@junioraltamontent.7582 they retconned the entire direction of the forerunners too. Bungie had gone out of its way to ambiguously symbolize the Forerunners WERE in fact ancient humanity. It was a massively ambiguous grand twist that 343 just totally dumped to the side like their office desk trash.
Then the whole Human-Forerunner war and our devolution and the receding flood, it’s all cool in wordage yeah…but completely stupid sounding when you are actually aware of the original intent of Bungie’s lore direction.
0:31
2007: A bug
2022: A feature
Love that one lol
Seeing that “3rd player indicator” light on the 360 controller is so nostalgic.
Rarely ever had 3 or 4 people though
I get why the got rid of it, since couch co-op is unsupported by so many titles these days, but it was so cool at the time
in a flagship title like halo it was pretty common, at least in my place, and marvel ultimate alliance, really cool games ...
@@kestrel4360 I did all the time , GOW, halo3, COD 4
@@ViktoriousDead didn’t Cod 4 and every gears game only have two player splitscreen? I know gears 3 has a 3 player splitscreen glitch but it was very obscure back then.
You can tell the difference between good and bad work very easily because it's interesting to watch good work happening
they knew the work they were doing was so great that they had to make a documentary about the process lol
Keep in mind, this is a documentary that could only be made because of Bungie's precious success. Editors and film makers have made this process feel interesting. Bad games can make for brilliant documentaries.
Additionally, this period was notoriously nightmarish for the team at Bungie, the crunch culture was extremely destructive. We're getting a very slick presentation of what game dev was like for these people, and no one knew if the end product would even be successful.
is the game already out?
@@henkdachief yeah it came out like 16 years ago
@@Lulomo i missed it
0:15 “the timing’s totally wrong from the time that you press the trigger to the time that inflicts the damage” 343 please take notes.
Take notes? They left their pen and paper back in halo 5
@@deafbyhiphop nah, they never had notes to begin with
@@julianfarnam6246 facts
Deadass thought I was going crazy because the Br feels off on infinite like there’s a millisecond delay
@@julianfarnam6246 they did Caus 4 and 5 were actually good in many ways. Infinite is shit coated in gold.
"when two people lunge at each other, they would pass through each other"
This was considered a bug. Takes notes 343
Wait 343 actually said it was a feature?
@@CarvedStones Enemy player collision isn't a thing in Infinite, you just phase right through them which is really disorienting sometimes
@@darkassassin8608 I forgot about that, such a dumb decision.
@Agothy Sadly, it actually makes sense for teammates, so it wasn't a retarded idea.
@@darkassassin8608
Did they every comment on it?
I dont get how game studios can be almost 50-100x larger these days compared to mid-2000s and ship broken games, some of which never get patched enough to be fun
That’s sort of where the issue comes into play. You have a dev team of like 10 people it’s really easy to get them all on the same page. Going to 50 or 75 or 100 person dev teams keeping uniform code is almost impossible. Huge bugs are caused by this. And then with studio demand wanting the game to be pumped out as soon as possible and more thought being put into microtransactions and how to monetize every little thing rather than focus on how the game feels or plays it’s no wonder why the state of video games is just utter shit now especially compared to the golden days in gaming of 2007-2012
Scope creep is one of many reasons. Bigger studios = more potential and more investment into every avenue they pursue. It's much easier to ditch a concept 3 people worked on for 2 months than a concept 30 people worked on for 2 months.
I mean, look at Halo 2. They were scrapping ideas left and right to meet launch date, something no studio today can really *afford* to do with how much money they put into each element.
Well, there’s a few things. Project management is difficult and gets more difficult with larger teams. The cycle gets larger, it takes longer for changes to propagate through the system, makes version control hard to manage
Probably because most of these huge studios now are full of urbanites doing made-up HR jobs making sure everyone does their diversity training and not actually programming
The cost of upkeep for the studio and producing the game begins to outweigh the profit if you take the time to develop it as much as devs used to, and so getting the foundations down and then finishing it after you sold 10 morbillion copies is more cost friendly than how it used to be done.
Game studios don't even need a lot of staff to be very good, though. It's just too much hassle.
0:23 was a bug in 2007 that was patched out, and is now a bug in 2022 that occurs to me almost every time I die in Infinite 😂
TAKE. ME. BACK.
nowadays game devs are a hundred times larger and are somehow achieving so much less than a handful of sweaty dorks who would occasionally get in fistfights over the minor details that made these games not only fun, but *functional*
we just need to round up all the business people that pushed all these guys out of the industry and feed them into a wood chipper
Sadly its out of the actual devs control. The problem is that video games have been corporated. Making video games is now a machine for Triple A companies, where devs are put on projects like an excel sheet and forced to crunch out overtime to hit the release deadline for optimized sales.
@@Kelpic This is nonsense. Games have always been "corporated". Halo is one of Microsofts biggest products...ever...always has been. The issue is game devs lack vision. Especially in 343, where the vocal minority rose to power after Bungie handed it off. Bunch of uninspired, bland people with bad ideas who are not being regulated in leadership positions.
If you make the argument about Halo MP being F2P, that may be Microsofts push. But no one is making 343 add stupid cat ear and anime cosmetics.
Why hire developers based on skill and experience when you can hire based on sex and race?
@@Horgler Do you honestly believe all the baloney that came out on YT for the last 6 years or so?
@@ArcturusOTE Considering the state of the entertainment industry as a whole, absofuckinlutely.
What a concept, that last line. "If you really believe it's not ready to go out the door it won't go out the door." I'm looking at you triple A game industry post Xbox-360.
Ok but the wii U was pretty good
@@why3994 I wouldn't know, I never got it but it just seemed like a barely modified wii with a tablet.
Yeah after that, the first thing I thought was, "Someone decided fallout 76 was fine."
unfortunately, the Xbox-360 itself wasn't ready to go out the door when it went out the door, and most of them melted by now.
@@truesonsofmandalore Well that's just grossly untrue. The Wii was comparable to the GC in terms of power, where as the Wii U is more comparable to the Switch (and slightly ahead of the 360). The Wii U was actually Nintendo's biggest leap in hardware since the early 2000s.
This deserves a full blown movie on netflix
“You can never test enough.” Damn that should be every developers motto. Instead today it’s hey get rid of the QA team we’ll just have day one buyers test our game.
At my company it's "hey, good devs test their own code so why do we need a test team?"
yeah. Here have a discount on a limited amount of early acces entries!! Do fill out our surveys though. We care about your opinion.
8:50 "We really wanna maximize the amount of time the player's having fun."
But yeah Halo has always been about competitive atmosphere first lmao
Highly competitive DNA
@@Tibblock More like: highly customizable DNA
Meanwhile in 2022: “We really wanna minimize the amount of time the player’s having fun.”
I guess the COMPETITIVE EXPERIENCE is more important to them lol
@@Hevvvyyy
Ranked playlists is actually what kept both halo 2 and 3 active for over a decade each. Almost no games in existence have pulled that off. So yes the competitive factor was HUGE.
Games nowadays are too soft for it, cuz ppl whine and complain when lose, so instead of ranks have switched to “experienced” based rankings, just means play more and level up even if you’re bad. Definitely caters to the masses but is short lived when there’s no glory to be achieved.
I miss these videos from the collectors edition.
You felt just felt more connected to the game knowing how the process worked and watching the story unfold behind the scenes
The DVD that came with the collectors edition of Halo 3 is what made me want to work for Bungie...even after all these years I still want to work there.
Yeah, the Halo 2 collector's edition DVDs are an unforgettable memory for me.
@@TheGh0stBullet you mean Activision 2.0, old bungie is looooong gone
they're too embarrassed to put anything out now days...the bug testing division has been absorbed into microtransaction division...the only part of the game that matters...who cares about a bug when you can buy an emote of clarence carter strokin lol
i love how at the start they were showing off all the bugs they left in halo infinite
@@Lofi.z34 343 dumbass
@@Lofi.z34 yes but all the bugs bungie was showing at the start are still in halo infinite
@@Lofi.z34 You really need to clarify why you're so fucking gay.
now this is what making a game is. seeing where players have fun and where they dont. having interactive testers that play however they want and give crucial feedback. having teams upon teams that go through each crack of the game in order to figure out where and how something can and will go wrong. this is what made these games so great. having people that actually cared about the playerbase and what THEY wanted, not how much money the developers wanted to make.
what do we have now?
none of this.
Yeah well get used to it or get out while you can because it’s not going to change unfortunately
How do you know? Have you worked for them? Just because you watch some gaming youtuber talk crap you believe it 🙄 go to the studio in person and they will gladly take you on a tour.
@@Steven-tl8fs valve.
We still have all of this. The issue is that we still have all of this. It didn't grow proportionally to how complex the coding has gotten or how massive the teams are.
@@LeWubWub the games industry has died TWICE before. Running up on a third time.
Two playable elites slapping each other.
*TAKE ME BACK*
@GH0STST4RSCR34M i played burnout paradise on my 360 a bunch so this song is burned into my head
This is why Halo is perhaps the greatest all around video game experience ever created. Laborious testing and excruciating attention to detail. People who were interested in creating art, not just a game.
Don't ask about the horrid crunch though.
Halo 3*
Deep Rock Galactic.
Watching this while playing infinite.
You can see the disparity of attention.
Same can be said for all of 343's titles tbh. There's a significant lack of care or lack of a better word. Polish.
@@BurningSnoMan the thing is is that halo 4 and 5 were solid polished games. Like wtf happened with infinite??
@@ShmoozeEvolution I played a ton of 4 and 5, they had ISSUES but at least the community was there.
Hell, you can practically smell it
@@ShmoozeEvolution Halo 5? Polished? 🤣🤣 Buddy, they couldn't even host LAN tournaments without the game randomly kicking out one of the players. The SBMM is still completely broken. Halo 4 has the most unbalenced gameplay out of any other game in the franchise, you can literally spawn in with an overpowered dmr, a pocket shotgun, and the ability to see players through walls.
Halo 4 and 5 are literally the Epitome of unpolished.
i love how marty actually worked on a test reel piece that sounds like halo bloopers music lol
Someone actually doing music
@@orctrihar huh?
@@berziimusic
I mean they don't try to actually do original work, it's just copypasta of music
Does that track have a name?
@@Calvin_Coolage not sure tbh, I’m sure there’s a video of it somewhere tho
0:31
Bungie: “That’s stupid, let’s fix that before releasing”
343: “SHIP IT”
The tools they used to measure "fun" and "frustrating" parts of multi-player and single-player are mind boggling. I loved how those data points pulled up videos of the game play. That's beyond cool.
*"Turn right...Please turn right, now"*
Is the most relateable thing I heard
I still have the Halo 3 Legendary discs these clips came on. I get a dopamine hit from watching them to this day. Gold era of gaming for sure.
Very much so, laziness and complacency has seeped into the industry
Damn that camera guy from mega mind worked on halo 3
I was thinking the same thing. Hal seems to be doing good all things considered.
Don’t diss my boy Jamie like that
old bungie was so chaotic and somehow also so methodical.looking at the vidocs for halo 3 it comes as less of a surprise now that halo 3 is generally hailed as the ultimate halo experience.they busted ass on it
I know what you mean and agree with the sentiment, but penultimate means second last.
@@JustinDickins ah,my mistake. Thanks for the clarification
2007 was beautiful.
3:10
343: ewww individual colours? No thanks nobody would buy those
Here we see the recently extinct species, the play tester.
I love how they explained the D’Sync issue and how they work so hard to make it not happen, years later it is sooooo common on online play.
EA multiplayer servers have the worst desync I've ever experienced.
@@WhatIsSanity word!? I had no idea. I love the fluidity and fairness in the previous installments (Bungie days), even if I felt like I shouldn't have died In an interaction, I never was like this game is not fair etc. Now it really feels like it not fair, getting shot around corners, not lunging when you are the correct distance for a melee,shields recharging in the middle of the battle (I have the video proof lol)
@@Foernnr
Halo has always been punishing when it comes to lag, what you just described is the majority of my online Halo experience since well before 343i.
Your connection did have to be pretty bad though, but playing Infinite now even if you have a stellar connection it plays really badly. It's also much worse with high, jittery latency and or packet loss.
EA servers on the other hand are a whole new level of shite. The smallest problem is expressed most dramatically in EA games with a secondary multiplayer component, or older games that got a server downgrade -like BF4.
Rest of the world: desync 🙂
France: D'Sync 🧐
@@WhatIsSanity Infinite's handling of non-ideal connections really is pretty damn bad. I have super-fast fiber now so I get almost zero issues and I assume that's the kind of connection quality they're expecting and tested around, but on my previous connection I would often get intermittent lagspikes, packet loss, etc. in everything and y'know how that affected Infinite? It would teleport me to places that I hadn't even been, off of ledges with kill planes below them, sometimes even just warping me to the lowest walkable point on the map relative to where I am. "Are you on the bridge on Recharge? No you're not, fuck you." It's ridiculous, it's like it completely loses tracks of where you are and just throws shit at a dart board while blindfolded trying to put you somewhere.
Ah yes what the new developers don't do : have fun with their game
This makes me sad. Halo is dead. Bungie was special
@@wilshirelive1014 What makes Bungie special is you can say they're special and even since Halo 1 THEY TOO were getting their nuts busted by Microsoft, the whole time. Very special
@@wilshirelive1014 Halo 4 was the death of halo
"Games are made to be fun? Thought they were made to make money?" -Asshole Majority Shareholder
@CobraSniper117 Stakeholder*
Shareholders have investment in capitalist success, stakeholders get to be paid for being dark and female.
what an extrmeeeeely fascinating and eye-opening video. I especially loved the user testing. the fact that they MAP OUT parts where players encounter frustration or die often. That's so brilliant.
I think we all would take Bungie back in a heartbeat
Yeah but Bungie's now at Sony
Oh no, you DO NOT want bungie in charge of anything. They ain't the same small genuine company. They did D2 dirty, and judging by what they are saying, they're far from done.
@@matt6231 Destiny 2 is amazing, what are you on about?
You want the old bungie back.
@@Krovos_ 5 years later maybe but at launch absolutely not and forget about being a PVP fan In d2
Everyone who took part in this project will remember these moments until they die. A time when everyone around you was working to create a world that was good and memorable. What a time it must have been to be on the team then.
11:04 "as long as the game doesn't set your house on fire, it's fine". Flashback to their 1998 game, Myth II: Soulblighter, which would brick your hard drive if you tried to uninstall it from the root directory, and the company lost major profits from the game due to them withdrawing every copy from the factory and stores.
They could've just shipped the game anyway and publish the fix they had already developed as a patch on their website, since it was unlikely that many people would even install the game in the hard drive root directory in the first place, but Bungie decided to take the high road and ship a fixed physical copy.
I miss this bungie so much. Back when fun was the focus of halo
NO! HALO IS COMPETITIVE AT HEART AND THE GAME HAS TO BE BALANCED THAT WAY!!!1!! THINK OF THR ESPORTS COMMUNITY!!
@@BehindYouSir no. Bungies goal was having fun with friends.
@@BehindYouSir fuck esports. We’re meant to have fun not be sweaty tryhards
@@BehindYouSir just realised that your doing that unironically. Fuck
This feels like forbidden knowledge now
Wow exactly! Like learning about illuminati
I'm finishing my career as a software engineer, and now I'm basically joining the QA career path... This hits me so hard, I mean, manual testing is exhausting, automated testing is a whole thing but not going to replicate every exact human error...
It's very possibke to automatically test business software in It's entirety.
But automatic testing barely happens in the first place
@@Dennis19901
From my experience, you can try to idiot proof your work as autistically as possible, and literally the first day it’s in use someone will stumble upon a new bug or unintended thing.
@A channel You don't need AI for that.... we already have this now.
Sad to see most of this process no longer exists
Old Bungie videos hit the editing sweet spot between production value and raw interview footage.
I wasn't especting this but watching this made me cry a bit for the very good memories and the beauty of them wanting to give players the best experience possible in a honest way.
And to think I went through Army training (basic/AIT) while they worked on the game then later saw it while stationed in Korea being played by my battle buddy.
What a time to be alive then. That's nuts
Just that line, “I love my job, EA you hiring?” Said as a joke brought a smile to my face. Who knows where that guy ended up but at that moment in time, he knew as challenging as it was, he was making history.
I like how all the problems in this video became a real thing in halo infinite.
This game brought so many good memories to my early teenage years. I met friends on Halo 3 when I was 13 that I still talk to now, at 27
It's telling that the most replayed part of the video is at 0:27 where the melee collision detection is broken, and was deemed a significant enough bug that they devoted a segment of it to a devlog they made. And then completely squashed said bug before the game launched... Whereas 343i has still completely failed to fully fix it a year into the lifespan of a game released 14 years later.
Bungie: The timing on this gravity hammer needs to be fixed.
343i: it looks fine to me.
1:07 did he just say "Based" in the early 2000's loool
I think he said something like "face". It didn't sound like "based" to me.
0:30 no fucking way they fixed this when it was a bug in halo 3 but after 5 years of d2 you still flip a coin whether or not you'll teleport through your opponent after pressing your melee button.
1:01 I love how this chieftain runs it’s so intimidating how it moves. Looks like an animal about to tear your sh*t up. Halo 3 is so goated
The advent of always-online gaming has ruined the games industry. When Halo 3 and Reach released you could put the day one disc into an offline xbox 360 and it would work.
Thats how all games should be all the time forever, fuck putting extra steps between insterting disc and gameplay
@Quadmachine As powerful as mods are, I agree. "Stick it in and go" should always be an option.
...I say as I dump Breath of the Wild to use a mod manager :P
They make more money when you can’t resell your used discs. In fact it’s why they want everyone to eventually just pay for subscriptions to play, not own.
Kind of like how renting vs owning a house works..
The one that makes the most money dominates 😂😭
@@carsonhunt4642 They also make more money when their games launch in a playable condition. But it seems the lack of a hard deadline has killed the quality of games.
This has got me thinking “what companies actually do this anymore?” To this degree, I mean.
2000s game developers rocked
Then it was like the industry just couldn’t be stopped. They were on top of making groundbreaking games that revolutionized the genre EVERY YEAR.
@@Noid and now it’s gay and stupid. Too bad. All the good programmers and sensible people are staying the hell away from the clown show that is making games any time after 2016
Bungie from 2001 to 2010 was the coolest and most fascinating game developing studio out there to watch and listen to. I loved their mini documentaries (or ViDocs), their podcasts, and all their blogposts.
I’ve never felt more connected to a game studio than Bungie during this time period and everything they produced around this time were absolutely legendary classic video games that still hold up extremely well today.
You just don’t see this kind of personality or talent matched by 343 or present day Bungie.
Bungie was a studio made up entirely of fans of their own games, meaning they wanted to make games they could have fun with themselves. That's what made them special, because they didn't want fame or money really. They were college bros wanting to have fun and chill out and they were made up of people from their own audience. The connection is there because they are their own audience, they are the people they appeal to. And that's where everything great about them came from.
Also The Cup doesn't exist.
Modern day Bungie: nerfs fun
@@physical_insanity They just because such a big studio too much publisher/corporate meddling and features/modes being focused-grouped to death took out of the organic fun from their games.
Current Bungie is definitely a shell of it’s former self. Most of the original devs are gone now anyway and they ended up just getting bought again by Sony after they fought to hard to earn their independence from Microsoft
@@solidsnakeshugecake Pretty much 😢
This is why i loved Bungie. They always had a passion for games and had a goal to make the best gaming experience.
What a world we'd live in if this is how games were still made today. Really sad to see other games developers not treating their games like this.
The sword glitch mentioned early on is still possible in MCC
Just talented, hard working, devs taking pride in their work and having a good time.
I remember when h3 came out we saved up money and went to Walmart camped out bought 3 Xbox 360s and 3 h3s and went to friends house and hooked up all 3 on Lan total of 12 people on the controllers probably like 20 people total rotating with all the soda and junk food 😅 good Ole days
Back when Bungie had a soul.
343i: “Halo is competitive at its core!”
Bungie:
"when two people lunge at one another at the same time theres a possibility for them to pass through eachother"
-god
343 Industries, watch and learn. This is how a real Halo game is made. Thank you so much Bungie for my childhood of playing Halo.
This is one reason why early access exists. The amount of work it takes to fully playtest a game is insane, and like the one guy said, you could have all these testers trying to climb trees and jump onto that rock, and then confirm, yup, you can't get on top of that rock, but day one of release and there's a video of someone getting onto that rock. A few dozen testers, no matter how skilled, will never really compare to having thousands of testers that can submit bug reports.
Wow bungie filming all of this content over the years was genius. It’s basically a blueprint and a formula to make a great video game. It’s such a shame that the passion for creation in this industry has been soured by corporate control.
Noticing anything about all of the devs? Take me back
Each of these heroes deserves a medal , a forgotten golden age of gaming
I remember play testing multiplayer! Good times lotsa laughs alot of funny bugs
Something about footage from 2007 that feels so warm. 2004-2007 were the best years ever.
Old Bungie really looks and sounds like a passionate frat house compared to the sterile, buzzword laden assembly line of the present AAA scene. I think somewhere along the lines we hit that point of too many cooks, and money, spoiling the pot, the passion project vs. the industrial revolution. I’d say it’s a shame, but thankfully there’s still a lot of great devs and studios out there keeping the love of meticulous passion projects alive.
Modern AAA games are soul-less money machines. Games made with passion still exist, just need to look in the indie section.
@@Teh_Random_Canadian indie games r boooooring 80.5953% of the time
Damn, remember when games used to be playtested before release? Now we pay full price to playtest AAA games for them.
Bungie: The hammer really isn't doing what it's meant to.
343i: The hammer is working perfect imo.
*ALTERNATIVE TITLE:* "11 minutes of bungie doing what no game developer is doing anymore these days..."
0:30 early feature explored 14 years later in Infinite
"it's really a difficult thing to do, to make it ok that you die a couple times but not too many times."
*FromSoft devs sees playtesters failing to make it out of the tutorial level
"It needs more enemies and traps."
A rare footage of the gods making the best game ever
back when bungie had proper devs and executives
Now after watching that, think of Halo Infinites development cycle. Stories of really long hours to have a game bomb out at E3, resulting in a years delay. Serious issues releasing content because problems with the game engine due to technical debt, senior members of the team constantly leaving, net code with de sync being poor. Add this to the stories now that the whole game engine that they spent so long upgrading is going to move to Unreal Engine 5 for future halo games and the BR mode. Imagine who hectic the making of Halo Infinite was and still is.
There are so many more and very major issues than this too. Like how every Halo on MCC plus every 343 Halo has absolutely borked lighting. A wildly inconsistent narrative so poorly written the only thing linking the last 4 games is one sure did happen after the other, not that you could tell. And so much more.
Halo: 8:54
Dark Souls: hold my beer
I love the silly rendition of Peril playing in the first 40 seconds. Makes me think of a slapstick Halo cartoon.
I wanna be sad about how the games just are not always this quality. but instead am GLAD I was in the golden days of gaming. bless halo!
Crazy how us the mass are now essentially the playtesters and our only compensation is the full game finally being brought to a playable state months after launch.
Man it's like ancient times back then. Nowadays games come out half baked and literally play like not a single tester tested the game before launch.
I love how it's buggy and doesn't always work as intended yet it still looks like more fun than infinite
The reason games were tested more probably is cause back then it wasn't as easy as sending an update, not everyone had their console connected to the internet. I had a ps3 for 8 years and didn't even realise i could connect it to the internet. Nowadays it's so easy to just send an update that it's not that worth to heavily test something
>heads getting stuck in ceilings
>Weapons not firing or working as intended
Dang how'd they get a hold of Halo Infinite back in 2008
the ancient and lost art of finishing a game before releasing it
For all of the playtesting that was done, to be honest I'm glad some of the bugs made it through. We ended up with a very smooth and polished experience with just the right amount of hidden jank to create some of the goofiest, belly-laugh moments. I remember the melee in multiplayer absolutely sending the body and I loved that bug.
I’m honestly impressed by the whole ”saving clips of players and their frustrations” on a map. I mean that must have took some time to setup.
The golden era of gaming. When devs actually play tested their games. Now we're buying games in the early development, waiting around for updates but still paying full price. I'm glad I grew up in that era.
Yep, the 360 was peak console gaming. Great games, great online atmosphere, great platform, everything was just so polished... xbox one live feels soul-less.
Stop buying them.
You as the consumer are keeping this problem alove.
@@Dennis19901 I don't buy them. It's obvious to me why one should never buy them. Everyone else still does, though. What am I supposed to do about that?
@@MuffinTastic Not care. Just don't buy broken products from bad companies and draw the line there.
@@Dennis19901 you're a dumbass if you think all gamers are just going to stop buying broken games overnight, do you even understand the amount of money that goes into mass media and hype surrounding not even triple A games but games as a whole? The only way this will stop is if governments start telling game companies "No, you can't publish a defective product." just like they've done for every other industry
The reason I play this like it dropped yesterday
Imagine a game developer studio not shipping a game if it's not ready, and a publisher letting them do that... That's a fuckin' wild concept.
I won't be surprised if this hits half a million views. OG Bungie is the best Bungie
(Found this at 10,200)
its just over 10x that amount of views currently
Well, you’re almost halfway there on that prediction!
246k now oct 23 2022
345k now Oct 28
420k (fr) almost there : )
the 4 seconds starting at 10:30 is a perfect microcosm of the mid 00s. A guy sitting down in the old Kirkland studios working on Halo 3 with a 4:3 monitor in the background displaying Bliss
0:15 when we ask for elites for the 3rd time in 10 years
343: nope. Let’s make the hammer suck like that with its windup time that’s what the fans want
This is amazing. They really had a heart for this game. The results showed it too.
8:50 "you wanna maximize the amount of time that the player is having fun," 343i could really learn a lot going thru videos of the good games being developed