‼️ WATCH THIS Garmin InReach Users - DO NOT SWITCH to Check-Ins!!!!
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- Опубликовано: 9 фев 2025
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Garmin is trying to pull a number on inReach users by limitting the Preset message functionality. Garmin inReach users signing up after Sep 27, 2022 now have Check-in messages instead of Preset messages, which you cannot change the text on. However if you signed up for an account before Sep 27, 2022, you are grandfathered into Preset messages and can keep updating your message text. Garmin is using nag screens in their apps when you sync to fool you into clicking on convert. DO NOT convert to Check-in messages from Preset messages if you are asked.
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Garmin actually send me an email. Here's their response. Take from it what you will....
One of the primary reasons for the change was too many people were putting emergency-related information in their presets and then accidentally sending messages. For example, “Pirate attack, send help!” was a real message accidently sent from the middle of the ocean and because of that, a chain of events/resources were put in motion.
Additionally, it was actually a small percentage of users that customized their preset messages. Further, when people did customize their presets, the majority had variations on the three phrases we are using for Check-ins - “I’m checking in, everything is okay”, “I’m starting my trip” and “I’m ending my trip”
Seems that the medicine was worse than the sickness. The problems they address could be addressed in an least radical manner. There are lots of options, for example, at least add more flavors of check ins that best suits you and also avoid the 'emergency' situation, etc. Their reasons also doesn't explain why you cannot assign different recipients for every check in, now the same recipients must be for the 3 check in messages. With this level of information seems you're right in your assumptions: I'd agree on big shame of Garmin
@@alexarevalo52 Yea I'm not sure how a preset SOS is different than a quick text or freeform message SOS. It could also have been solved by filtering and not allowing some potential "SOS-triggering" words in the editor. I think it could have been handled much better by Garmin.
Garmin’s response is about the ‘why’, not about the ‘how’. If they have some valid reasons to change this, fine. But they need to inform people about the change, especially since this is about a paid subscription. You’ve agreed to a specific service when you started the contract, and Garmin appears to have changed the service. That would be a good ground for immediate end of contract and money back.
I just bought an InReach Mini 2 today, and the Presets were one of the big selling points for me. Then I take it home and find out that they are no longer available. Usually, when I buy a piece of electronic equipment, I’m thinking that the company will look to increase functionality through firmware and app updates, not significantly REDUCE functionality. Check ins are useless for me. Not happy with Garmin.
Deciding now whether or not to keep the new InReach 2. I guess I could set up a code for my wife - “If you get this check in message, it means I’m hiking such and such a trail today”, and assign a trail to each of the Check-Ins. It might be a pain, but the other option is returning the Garmin and going with a different one.
Glad you’re putting this out there. I ran into that “check-in” prompt a few weeks ago and almost made the same mistake. Classic Garmin tech nonsense.
Just purchased the inReach Mini2 last week and was peeved to find out after the fact that Garmin no longer supports customized preset texts for new customers. 😒
I’m going with a modified Morse Code, using the 3 allowed messages, in a shorthand combination. My wife and adult kids have the cipher code book for the 27 different messages we have pre-arranged. I know! I am cheap, but also I enjoy little victories over “the man”
Thanks for making this. The presets is one of the reasons I chose Garmin.
@Hikingguy I just bought an inReach mini today 11/18/23 and I can customize the preset messages...BUT...I had an existing Garmin account...BUT...it was only for an Instinct Solar watch. Thank you SO MUCH for making this video because I almost clicked the "switch to check in" button on the app.
The new check-ins are pointless to me. I use mine for diving.
I can’t spend time explaining that ‘starting my trip’ means I’m about to start a dive.
Or that ‘checking in everything ok’ means I’m on a surface interval.
I got this device as a gift but I’m disappointed that one of the key features I wanted it for means it’s not useable for me. I have to spend time tapping out messages on my connected phone.
So on point here...
I'm so glad I saw this video. Thank you! I am in the market for a SatCommunicator and Garmin just lost my custom as the customisable presets were the big drawcard for me. I'd've been super bummed if I'd found out after buying one that the preset messages were no more!
I believe this only applies to accounts that were grandfathered in.
Great tip, Chris! Dang that sucks that Garmin is downgrading (and being pretty sneaky about it).
I saw this too late! I signed up prior to the date you cited. At that point in time I thought I'd lost my inReach during my move to a new address, so I'd been using my ResQLink instead. Then I stumbled across my inReach in a box, then updated the firmware and that's when I got the message about needing to download the Messenger app. Then I went through the set-up process but it didn't give me a choice between preset or check-in, it defaulted to check-in. I do miss being able to customize, but on the other hand, I 'm not too bothered by it, I can still do a freeform....for $😅
Garmin being Garmin. I have dealt with this in the aviation market for years and they are notorious for nickel and dime charges to their customers. Fortunately there are companies less greedy giving them competition now. They are a good product but like GoPro will greed themselves out of the market. I hope.
Thanks for that info! Been trying to find this info on their website but could not find a clear answer.
Absolutely a squeeze. They see the future of smartphones being able to link up with satellites and Garmin's models will be unnecessary devices.
Hopefully, I'm waiting for a SONIM 11 to come with that or the XP10 getting an upgrade if possible.
Well shi..... I just fell for that trick! Came across you site and video too late!
Feel like I've been tricked into switching. I literally thought I would just loose my set messages and I could create new Check-In messages.
Well I just subscribed so I will not miss anything again. Been enjoying your videos / channel.
Thank you and sorry they got you. I'd contact support and say you did it by mistake, you didn't understand what it was. I've heard that they'll reverse it in that case. Worth a try
I just bought this inReach Mini and the check-ins was my number 1 reason for purchasing this. And now I find out I can't even customize them. I'm livid and want to return this. I did not see this anywhere on their site stating these are not customizable.
My mini2 now says check in on the devices menu but I am still able to go online and customize my custom three messages - tested this morning and worked fine (all is updated and in sync)
Happy trails
Nice, I think as long as you can edit them on the website you're good
Hi Chris, i'm an avid fan, i sold off my montana 750i and deactivated my inreach subscription last year after more than a couple of years.. now i got myself a new garmin 67i and signed up for a new annual plan under my existing garmin account that i used for my 750i... i can confirm that the garmin PRESET messages are still available for me... so i think the changes only apply to NEW ACCOUNT SIGNUPS..
Thanks for the update, appreciate it
I’m reactivating for a trip next month. I’ll check in after to advise.
Thanks so much for sharing...I am grandfathered in ....great info to know!
Thanks for the advice. I would definitely been caught out on this one. Deactivated at the moment. Hope the feature isn’t lost.
Thanks for the heads-up. I did not see any messages from Garmin on this at all. I hope just suspending service for a few months won't automatically trip this change.
Thank you for the infomation, I would have bitten on that message and have been screwed.
Thanks for the info. It is appreciated. Keep doing what you’re doing!
Seems like the one thing check ins has over presets is that you can customize the recipient list in the Messenger app (but not on the Inreach device). Presets have to be edited on the web, recipient list or message itself. Too bad they didn’t just let you have both functions, even if you can’t edit the message itself offline. I don’t even know if it will let you edit the recipient list offline either.
Very helpful. I'll run a check with them and see what they say.
@Hikingguy thanks for the video! I was completely baffled because I remembered in the past that I was able to configure preset messages and now I couldn't. The change for me was a change in the contract - that also automatically switched me to check in messages. The UI is horrendous, and whoever is making these product decisions at Garmin should be fired (but they're probably part time anyway).
Thanks for the vid. I just set up an SE+ and couldn’t figure out why I wasn’t able to edit the checkin messages.
After a couple of years i now stopped my 'freedom' plan due to the steep price hikes over the years on the yearly fee of keeping the 'freedom' plan and related activation costs. It doesn't happen every year i do trips in a non-cellular covered area. To be clear, the Garmin inreach is an interesting product and service but as a sporadic user their plans are refraining me up to the point to quit. I'll have a look at the upcoming cellular phones with Satellite SOS function and then make the final call.
I just activated my Inreach a week ago first time, and in my subscription I can go to standby for free, I can activate the device on a daily, weekly, weekendm monthly basis. I use the device for Tracking (incl Mapshare) and an intervall of 10 minutes (which is included in my plan) any shorter will be an extra charge. And am able to keep editable Preset Messages :) . starts from 2.95 /day+ anual fee is 49. For my type of usage I am ok with that. Activating, Standby, changes of tariffs all done via a webform 24/7. My sucbscription is done via a reseller
thanks for sharing this info, we have an in reach so good to know!
Great content! Thanks for the safety tip
Thank you, it's getting close to the time of year I re-activate so this is timely, appreciate the heads up.
Thank you for the warning!!!
Wow, thanks for the information!!
Thank you for the heads up!
I upgraded to check-ins before watching your video, but I still have available preset messages after the upgrade. Interesting that some people are losing preset messages and some are not.
Yea my presets are gone and I have check-ins now - maybe Garmin is punishing me!
exactly why I chose zoleo.
still have my mini 2 as a GPS backup aside Montana 700
Thanks for the info! I probably would've changed mine 😓
Hi. Just a quick followup -- I registered Jan 7, 2023 and I can edit my preset messages (just checked).
Nice - it looks like it's spotty on that Sep date, think you were a lucky one
THANK YOU CHRIS!👍
Huge Thanks !
Thanks you for this. I was about to hit the button for an Mini 2. But I put it on hold till they reverse that bullshit. Their units and plans are expensive enough already. Their reasons for this are crap..
Those idiots activating a false alarm situation should be charged with a big fine by the government or the responding units. Big shame on Garmin for milking their customers to the last dime.
I keep it at my Etrex SE and my cell phone, for real emergency's I send one of my doves.
Yea I didn't really follow Garmin's explanation either, since you could trigger a false alarm with regular message, quick text, SOS, etc.
For real, this is an issue that should be addressed for those edge cases and users, NOT implemented for every user. As somebody who does customize the presets for different activities, I absolutely will hold onto my old inreach mini with presets as long as possible unless they change this back. Horrendous usability choice.
great video and not sure why Garmin would reduce features with new iphone GPS option
Thank you for this info : )
Garmin is not limiting themselves to just preset messages. 6months ago, garmin will no longer support the downloading of NOAA charts into the "EarthMate" app. Garmin will direct you to one of their apps called "Navionics Boating" app. yet that app will not detect my explorer+.
hello hikingguy... do you know of any forums or groups that love the Explorer+ and EarthMate app combination? you have an informative and understandable youtube site.
joe
Thank you!
I just changed to a Mini2 from the Explorer+ (pre-2022 user) and my preset messages are still intact - just FYI.
I was definitely bummed to crack open my first PLB of any kind and find out it didn’t have one of the features I was expecting. I agree that it’s annoying and frustrating when companies do things like downgrading or creating a paywall but if a text message is $0.10 it’s not like it adds up to much if you’re sending casual messages or minor updates. Let’s say you need to send 3 messages per day that would have been free before but now qualify as texts you’d still only be looking at $9.00 if you are to hike for 30 days straight. So maybe it only adds up for thru hikers doing months on the trail but for the rest of us it shouldn’t be that big of a deal. Paying $400 for a device and then returning it because you don’t want to pay a small fee feels like a waste. I’m all for doing things based on principle alone but other than this issue it seems like the in reach is an outstanding device. Just my two cents. Or should I say 10 cents….
It's not just the cost, but also the ease of sending a preset over a regular message, even with quick text.
@@Hikingguy I definitely agree with that as well.
except its not $0.10 per message, more like $0.50 for "overage" messages, its only 10 cents for location updates
Thanks for the info..i was considering purchasing one do to reviews..but now realize these reviews are from 1to 5 years ago..the presets were the main reason i was interested..now im not sure its a good purchase
Yea I still use it - just more of a hassle to do a quick text but it can still save your life
Note for future readers: I was able to obtain the preset functionality by asking the support chat, even though my account was created only 2 days ago. The whole process took less than 5 minutes.
going to give it a try, thank you - only see phone numbers on the website - you did a chat online?
I tried this today via chat with no luck. they would not do it for me. Account created in July.
i got my mini 2 in Nov 22 and the on-line chat guy was able to switch me over to pre-sets and not check-ins.
how did you get to chat? I cannot for the life of me find chat, just phone @@juskojj
Login to your Garmin Explore account. Click on your profile picture and then click on Support in the pull down menu. When the support page opens, scroll down to the bottom and click on Contact Support. At the next page, choose your device and it will bring you to the main Support page for that device. Scroll down again to the bottom and click on the Chat button. Hope that helps !!!
I just cancelled my annual plan in order to switch to month to month. I didn't get any notification prior the change.
Good job
Thanks for the info.
I am still on presets fortunately. As a matter of interest. Do the new check ins still allow you to send your GPS location with the check in ?
Fortunately yes, they do
What does your screen display look like when you’re connected to a satellite what Indicates it’s connected.thks
small up/down arrow when send/receive - www8.garmin.com/manuals/webhelp/GUID-802DEF62-EBB2-463C-8C51-C58FB29F89E3/EN-US/GUID-31C03F51-3A49-4B6E-ACF5-0EECDDC48787.html
Apparently I fell for it too; at least my GPSMap 66i only has "CheckIn messages". I have asked the German Garmin support if I can get the old system back. There they told me that they will forward my request to Garmin US. I am curious if they will help me to get my message templates back.
Yea it really sucks - they should reverse this choice - not good biz
After some back and forth with Garmin support, I was told that these 3 preset messages are now simply called "check-in messages", but have the same function and continue to be free for everyone in unlimited numbers. The update only changes the name of the function on the GPS device, but the function and the costs are the same. Well, definitely I will see when the June invoice arrives. But currently I don't see this update as a downgrade.
@@amweg When I read this I got hopeful that they reversed their decision but I think this is just the support people not being completely honest. First off, I never said the cost or function changed, just the fact that you can't cusomize the message anymore, so in that regard they are correct. But I just checked and I still cannot edit my messages, even though they are now labeled "check-in" and not "preset" - see screenshot ibb.co/J59L0Fv . It's not just a name change, you cannot customize the message anymore.
@@Hikingguy Okay... I admit that I slightly misunderstood you by assuming that the update would also make the 3 predefined check-in messages chargeable from now on. On the Explore website I can still edit my presets, only on the device itself the name has changed from "predefined messages" to "check in messages". So it is possible that my account has not been changed at all. I apologize if I have caused any additional confusion!
@@amweg No worries, and yea, the hard-coding of the presets is what this is all about. From the beginning you could customize the messages. Glad to hear that you still have the ability to do that. Hoping that Garmin reverses it's choice here.
Thanks, I will try to not make that mistake, but how long it will last, only god know 😢
I am thinking about getting an InReach because I live in Earthquake-Prone Los Angeles. Will my Cell Phone work during a Major Earthquake? If not, the InReach may be a good investment. The only problem is that I would have to pay $14.95 monthly for no use of the InReach.
I'm in SoCal too and I think if something was so major I'm not sure that anyone would be dispatched to help you until urgent tasks were completed. I think you can probably save your money.
@@Hikingguy That’s real truth. Thank you.
I’m overdue for a firmware update to my InReach Mini, not the Mini 2. I want to do whatever I can to avoid losing the valuable Presets as they are. I’ve read the firmware notes and see nothing about the Presets changing to uneditable “Check-ins”. Does the change not apply to the original InReach Mini?
As long as you don't opt in with the Messenger app, I think you're okay
I made this unfortunate mistake when I got a inReach Mini 2. Really bummed I lost functionality.
I saw where one guy called them on it and they gave presets back to him.
Just chatted with Garmin, they claimed they'll set my account back to presets by tomorrow.
Note to garmin: after long consideration because of high costs, I bought a brand new Garmin Inreach Mini2 today. One of the main selling points was to be able to use 3 CUSTOMIZABLE text messages, which can be sent for free in the basic rescue plan. Now I found out that this feature was REMOVED! What a rip off.
Please bring this feature back or I will have to return the device.
I bought mine today and just found it out this second.
Do you already have a Garmin account before? I wonder if an 'old' Garmin account is still able to get the preset feature even they bought and activate their Inreach recently. I am also considering to buy one.
@@Xi_da_butcher I have an older account (only for an Instinct solar watch) and was still able to customize my check in messages. I just got an inreach 2 today.
I feel the same. I just got Garmin for the next summer but I am waiting to see what happens. I may get now Zoleo now too since it is on sale and then wait to decide what’s better option.
Thanks for the heads-up. I still have Presets, and don't want to lose them. Haven't received a message 'inviting' me to change to Check-Ins, but am concerned that this might happen behind the scenes when I upgrade firmware (currently have software version 3.17). Do you know what will happen to Presets if I update software on my InReach Mini 2?
I've only seen it when changing devices or when pairing with the Messenger app
@@Hikingguy if I upgrade to the mini 2 (I currently have the original mini), I will get this alert and as long as I click "no" I will still have the presets since I created my account prior to the September date? The best preset message advice I ever saw (and created) was "I am OK. I pressed the SOS button to aid someone else."
@@337WHITE yes, when you pair, just click "no" when prompted to update to check-ins and you'll be able to keep your presets
Question. Say I have the annual basic plan. synched with the app on my phone. Then say my wife is going out w out me, can she download the app and use it in the same manner, meaning using the text messages, not the SOS, or would she also have to have my phone?
I'm going with they're milking their customers for every penny they can get. Garmin seems to being doing the bare minimum in adding features to new products to save features for other products down the line. I am eagerly waiting to see what Samsung will be doing with satellite connectivity down the line. Motorola's Defy satellite hotspot looks interesting as well especially since it doesn't require a new phone and it looks cheaper than InReach plans. The device itself is fairly affordable as well compared to Garmin's offerings and uses the same Iridium satellites.
100%. Instead of joining the 21st century service/software model of delighting customers by passing beneficial updates down the line, Garmin seems to be shifting to an pure HW model of 'you bought it already what do you want from me. Buy a new one'. This is not good, particularly for a product family where they GET ongoing revenue from us.
Yea I'm excited to test the Motorola out. I'm hoping the satellite communicator space blows up soon so that Garmin is forced to compete.
Yea, inReach was a major boon to the company and put the Outdoors section above the other divisions like aviation, marine, etc. It seems like they're just milking it until it dies instead of pushing it forward.
I have the Garmin 67i and continually get all smart phone notifications (security cameras, phone texts, etc) on my device when using it. Is there a way to stop those notifications so that i only get texts that are sent directly to my device?
www8.garmin.com/manuals/webhelp/GUID-5724F4C0-7557-4C51-BF07-54A567FA4600/EN-US/GUID-19E0D47D-4926-4CB6-9F8F-D27F76F8101B.html
Hmmm! How odd? I had a similar situation with my cell phone carrier. They "upgraded" me to get unlimited data but ooops! It was plenty of more $$$ per month but I figured it was worth it. NOPE! They neglected to mention not all cell towers are configured to provide unlimited data. At least that's the cover story. Once I realized the cell towers in an area I frequent (an urban area, NOT a wilderness area) didn't support the unlimited data feature I call and tried to go back to the old plan. Oh gosh, they acted like the "old plan" belongs in a museum and was no longer available. Summary: They got the extra monthly fee and I got nothing for the extra $$$. Seems to be a trend in our world.
Ive had stand alone GPS unit in the past but I'm definitely in the smartphone corner. Have a Nokia XR20 that is pretty rugged and has a good IP rating nice display and to top it off the maps are good value (UK OS 50K). How much longer do you think stand alone unit have?
There's always a use for the standalone since the touchscreens kind of fall apart when wet and in bad conditions. I think they'll just become more niche over time. UNLESS Garmin wises up and creates an Android based / rugged smartphone with buttons + touchscreen + nav, then they may have a fighting chance.
Do you ever pair your Garmin with the Earthmate App? I've found its way easier to use as far as texting and launching the tracker function.
Yes, Earthmate works with the older models and Explore / Messenger with the new - all are way easier to type on for sure, but not so great when the conditions are wet/bad
If I turn tracking off on my 66i can I still see my track on base camp
You can see the internally recorded track, not the track sent to the satellite.
The reason they give is total bs. And I find it exasperating that I can't even use my own language for check in but must communicate with my family in English
I agree on principle, you should be allowed to customize your presets. But in practice it doesn’t really matter; I’m in a similar situation where my family doesn’t speak English so I’ve taught them the three presets and told them to look out for them. Not ideal, especially when we used to be able to customize, but not the end of the world.
Have to admit I was wrong about the language. They have translated the check in messages. Still, their reasons are bs. However, it's a very good device when mobile phones or vhf can't be used. With a heavy price tag but still much cheaper than a satellite phone.
That is a bad Garmin. Garmin is now banned from my future shopping list.
Yes, Mine also. Freaking thieves!
I may return mine and go with a different company. Garmin looks like a company that I don’t care to do business with.
Anyone else run into this? On my InReach Mini2 I no longer have presets, only checkins. But the Checkins are the customized presets I've created on the Explore website. I'm also no longer able to send presets or checkins from my phone. I used to be able to do it from the Explore app but now it opens up the Messenger app which has neither Presets nor Checkins as an option. Anyone one know how to send pre-determined messages from the Messenger app?
Disgusting policy!
I was about to buy the new 67i but being able to define preset messages is a requirement so I can keep my family informed.
I will be a brand new user with inReach
Does anyone know if Garmin brought this feature back?
Thank you!
nope they didn't
Thank you! That's very disappointing to hear..@@Hikingguy 🤨
Grrrr. Bad Garmin! Losing functionality = bad. Offering a feature downgrade without explaining it = More bad. Yes shame on Garmin. Adds to the annoyance that they released the messenger app last year promising to support several then-current devices like the 66i in the 'near future'. Instead, they release slightly upgraded hardware (mini 2, 67i) as compatible and leave those of us who might have purchased the then-current but now older devices in the dust with the crappy old app. I've bought a lot of Garmin devices over the years, but their customer attitude is driving me away. I already swapped my bike computer for another brand.
Thanks for bringing this to our attention.
One edge case I can share: I converted from month-to-month to annual plan in November 2022 and this seems not to have triggered the change then or now. I still see the option for custom preset messages.
Glad you still have the presets - I'm seeing from the comments that it's a mixed bag 50/50 - you fell on the good side of that. And yea, I have a bike computer too and the hoops I go to in order to get it to sync (BT on/off, WiFi on/off, restart, etc.) are mind numbing. When I had a Wahoo (stolen) it always worked.
Yep. $$$...
Does Garmin even try to ‘sell you’ on any reasons to give up Presets in favor of Check-in Messages?
nope, just asks if you'd like to convert
Cellphones with satellite communication features (like Iphone 14 and the new Huawei phone released in 2022) will obliterate Garmin in the near future, once the new technology matures.
Yea it's about to open wide up
I have a samsung android phone. Do you know if androids satellite is in the near future as well?
Always the bottom line. Corporate greed is the root of all evil.
I currently am able to customize my preset messages. Will that change if I move to an upgraded plan? Thanks for the warning.
I think it only changes if you opt-in when the nag message appears - otherwise you should be okay but not 100% sure of all scenarios.
Good advice!
The iphone will put them in a tight spot now, once they start supporting messaging.
Shame on Garmin indeed. Seems like they are following the "gotcha" model so many corporations are implementing these days.
Sneaky little devils…unfortunately they pretty much have a monopoly and subsequently feel at liberty to behave accordingly
try using factory reset.
Well I made the "mistake" and switched. I sent an OK and what came to my recipients was a strange phone (nobody's who it is) and a message "I'm checking in. Everything is okay." Question is WHO SENT THE MESSAGE??? You can't edit it to include your name....the phone number is something unknow....This essentially makes "CHECK-INS" worthless. Well done Garmin. I'm sending the Messenger device back. And I want my old setup back.
I switched to ham radio.... free...
Wow I just now found this. All I can say increase you income , invest in dividends
Greed. Always greed.
It's all about the $$'s.
I have a question. If I purchase the Inreach and sign up for the "Freedom Plan" for $14.95/month and then suspend the plan after 30 days, would I still be able to send a message in an emergency?
Unfortunately not
@@Hikingguy Thanks for the reply.
I am thinking about getting an InReach because I live in Earthquake-Prone Los Angeles. Will my Cell Phone work during a Major Earthquake? If not, the InReach may be a good investment. The only problem is that I would have to pay $14.95 monthly for no use of the InReach.
Honestly I no longer want an inreach because of this
I have the basic plan... Quick text messages are like a dime each? Gee, if I use 35 of them, I could have bought another gallon of gas! Folks, there is a lot of opportunities for being angry about inflation... IMHO, this is NOT one... Just sayin' 😎
I don't think people are angry about the text charge, it's the changing of the functionality without warning users or explaining the implications. And FYI the presets are much easier to use than quick text.
This is why Garmin doesn’t send you free stuff 😂 Video title should be: ‼️💯 GARMIN MADE MESSAGING EVEN EASIER! NO MORE NEED TO WRITE YOUR OWN PRE-SET MESSAGES! THANK YOU GARMIN ❤️❤️❤️
Ha yea, I've totally given up on working with Garmin. It's a shame because things could be much better across the board with their products, support, etc. If they simplified their model line and just did less better, I think it would be much different
garmin is good at finding ways to screw you
not buying one now, i’ll go with the Motorola Defy instead
Garmin needs to take care of their customers instead of squeezing more out of them. I just bought the Zumo XT and the Inreach Mini 2 this week. Not cheap. Would be nice knowing your getting more and not less for your money‼