Found a 2015 Office of Rail and Road document which explains why Third Rail electrification will never be used to expand the network: orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/17621/dc-electrification-policy-statement.pdf
Contrary to popular belief, it isn't an outright ban on new 3rd rail, but must have very good justification and consideration of alternatives to show that 3rd rail is in effect the only viable option and that the risk is managed to be "as low as reasonably practicable".
Headbolt Lane is only a matter of a few hundred yards from Kirkby. It’s like they’re looking for any excuse not to extend the third rail. Cost is only part of a bigger picture. Chester and Ellesmere Port were electrified in 1994 so it can easily be done.
@nigelkthomas9501 On the flip side short distance = ideal for batteries, now that battery rolling stock is (in effect) mature technology. Technically feasible, and eliminates the risk of additional third rail. So why not?
Must have watched too many Geoff videos knew he'd come out of the other toilet.... David is a treasure, Geoff you need to set up a full interview and compare notes...
The black panel Geoff, will prevent drivers of trains being blinded by another unit arriving with headlights on. There is a simular arrangement at Ormskirk.
@@geofftech2 yes as well. You will also note, the station has been built, so it can be easily converted for thru running, if Merseyrail ever run to Wigan Wallgate.
Re stations with 'Road' in the name. When I was Chief Clerk in the Information Production Unit, Southampton in 1995, I suggested changing the name of Lyndhurst Road to Ashurst (New Forest). The village of Lyndhurst is the 'Capital' of the New Forest and approximately 2½ miles from the station. There is an infrequent bus service. We used to get tourists in the Summer getting off at the station, then trying to work out where the village was! I then had the job to change all the Solari flap indicators and recorded announcements at stations. I now have the old NSE Lyndhurst Road running in board on my garage wall.
You need to have a longer interview with David what an ace bloke would love to hear more about his experiences over the years and his thoughts on the modern state of BR
This is exactly why we cant lose ticket offices as the ticket machines are either out of order or are in accessable for most poeople but especially blind and partially sighted people
However, when the railway was built, there was little in the way of houses there, so it made sense to name it after the most prominent feature of the area - Old Chester Road.
The black panel is there as a kind of anti dazzle/light baffle screen/sighting screen that's been placed there between the two buffer stop/stop blocks to block out any lights beyond the stop blocks that may dazzle & distract drivers as they enter the station. They are basically there to assist drivers & traincrews with sighting purely the buffer stops & end of the line as they enter the station at Headbolt Lane, there is a similar (but smaller one) in use at Ormskirk also placed between the buffer stops there. In 1988 when the new signalling & signal box at Rufford was brought into use it was quickly noticed as part of a signal sighting committee that trains when entering the up platform were likely to be dazzled by the new station lighting & that might cause sighting problems with the new colour light signal that protected the level crossing & entry onto the single line to Midge Hall. So the station lamps on the up side at Rufford were fitted with dark screens on one side (facing Ormskirk) so that they didn't affect the sighting of the signal anymore on the approach to Rufford station.
In some situations, having two tracks that terminate facing each other may look like one continuous track if the buffer stops are obscured. An opaque fence may help avoid that, stopping drivers from hitting the end at speed.
does it really need to be that big for driver protection purpose? it feels a bit like on the tube / purple line, where TfL remove the next train from the display boards at the station entrance a few minutes before it arrives - presumably to stop the public running to catch a tube/train!
Let's not forget that Northern and Merseyrail don't like each other - for example, the Northern arrival at Hunt's Cross is the cue for the immediate departure of the Merseyrail service. Between the two platforms is a bridge - how long would it take for passengers to cross between and make a proper connection ? Nah, no holding. Whatever's going on there, the people who pay the fares are irrelevant.
Platform 3 at Wigan is used mainly to stable units in the day when things go wrong. It also used for early morning departures when starting from Wigan (not so much these days) and when there is engineering work south of Wigan, so services towards Southport and Headbolt can start from there.
Yes, Bristol falls into the "street/road" suffix trap with Stapleton Road (Easton), Parson Street (South Bedminster) and St. Andrew's Road (Severnside)
Platform 3 in Wigan Wallgate only ever sees trains when there is no service between Wigan and Hindley, letting the Headbolt Lane trains turn there, and I've occasionally seen it used for services to Southport part-cancelled from Manchester. It used to be quite frequent to see a 769 sat in there but not so much anymore.
Looking on realtimetrains, It looks like it's used serveral times a day as a place to park trains out of the way. For example a train From leeds arrives in platform 1 at 20:40 and emptys out the passengers, at 20:46 it leaves platform 1 empty coaching stock and arrives back into platform 3 at 20:55 where it sits until 21:33. Then it transfers again over to platform 2 where it arrives at 21:42 to form the 21:44 service back to leeds. There is also a train scheduled to sit in platform 3 overnight from 22:32 to 07:02. There don't seem to be any passenger arrivals or departures to/from platform 3 on a normal day though.
Fantastic, Geoff. Always good to see the northern correspondent and great to see David as well. Finally a new station with a decent station building and toilets!
Great video! A new station AND an electric train! Not seen one of those before! Really enjoyed your meeting with David. It was like an episode of Dr Who where he meets an earlier version of himself!
It's always great to see Karl in a video! I do like this station design, there is a sense of place about it that was missing from your 2022 new stations video thread!
Nice to see Karl on your videos again, Geoff. He appears almost anywhere, not just in the north! Thank you for the other night by the way Geoff. What a show 👍
Such an excellent video, and well deserved of it being #17 on trending (if that even means anything anymore?!!) Absolutely love seeing Carl and Roger, both my favourite regulars on the channel. The new station looks absolutely brilliant and the unexpected chat with David (who I vaguely remember you mentioning all the way back in 2017) really made this video a special one. And the funny bits too. legend
@@Nooticus with all the anti rail policies being pushed by this government to push passengers away, it’s rare to see initiatives being done to attract more passengers to rail.
@@caramelldansen2204 That would involve hundreds maybe thousands of miles of new track bed as what's not a heritage line has houses and roads built over it, if not a footpath/bridleway. The Bluebell Railway had to build a new track bed for its extension into East Grinstead Station as the old route is now a main road and a housing estate.
8:57 How considerate of Merseyside to put a sign up helping Geoff with pronunciation. Truly amazing accessible station signage. Perhaps they should install a certain round pink Nintendo character at Kirkby to remind visitors not to pronounce the second 'k'. And I think I speak for everyone when I say we would absolutely love a Choo Choo Chat with David!
Caught myself in your video their Geoff, wasn’t expecting to see you, was a surprise. Had to get on that northern train so couldn’t speak and didn’t want to disturb your filming, also at 6:25 was near David the train into head bolt lane, if only I would of known such an interesting man
The noisy bit of the class 777s is when sat above the leading bogies. Quite rumble noise. Apart from that and constant breakdowns every time i am travelling on purpose from Manchester to travel on them, all sounds good. Thank you for sharing another interesting video.
0:12 Platform 3 (the bay platform) isn't really used for any timetabled services as such, but it does see occasional use as it is sometimes used for the ad hoc stabling of stock etc. The bay platform at Wallgate used to be much longer, before being filled in & shortened in the late 1970s, with the shortened bit being subsequently filled in & turned into the garden seen here. There was talk back in the 1970s of the Merseyrail network being extended all the way to Wigan Wallgate, with it being electrified with third rail all the way from Walton Junction to Wigan Wallgate right into the bay (platform 3) where the Merseyrail service would terminate & turnback, but it all came to nought, with the electrification only being extended as far as Kirkby in 1977.
Surprised you didn't mention Geoff that there is a proposal in the future to extend Merseyrail beyond Headbolt Lane to Skelmersdale. All they would need to do is build an overbridge, lift the block separating the 2 tracks and getting rid of the northern platform.
That would need a little more than that wouldn't it? Skelmersdale doesn't appear to even have a station? Or if it's one of the Northern stations further up the line that you mean, why would there need to be a bridge added if the Northern trains already reach?
It'd be nice, but Skelmersdale has a Buslink service now, that takes you to Kirkby (Old Kirkby) from the Skelmersdale Concourse. I think really, what would be better for West Lancs is the reinstatement of the Burscough Curves
The next Merseyrail Battery section extension will be from Ellesmere Port to Helsby on the Wirral Line. The next Mains Power intermediate station will be 'Baltic' between Brunswick and Central, Northern Line.
Great video as always (and shout out especially to the swish toilet transition 😂). Definitely looks like it has more too it than some of the other new stations this year.
Reminds me of when the Glasgow North Electric line was extended by a mile from Airdrie station to the eastern side of Airdrie which they called Drumgelloch (fair enough, that's the part of town it was in) rather than "Airdrie East". The result being that as only two of the four trains an hour to Airdrie were extended to the new terminus, people for intermediate stations who always caught the Airdrie train didn't board those going to Drumgelloch. The solution? Leave the automated announcements as "The next train is for Airdrie" and have a manual announcement reminding passengers "this train also calls at Drumgelloch".
The bay platform at Wigan Wallgate would be ideal for terminating Merseyrail 777s in the future if they extend the service I believe the section separating Merseyrail and Northern at Headbolt Lane is designed specifically so it can be easily removed
Given the short distance it seems weird that they didn't just third rail it the rest of the way, instead having to spend the money to buy and maintain trains with big, heavy batteries that will degrade far faster than a third rail would.
Completely agree with you, but I believe that extending the third rail network any further isn't allowed any more on H&S grounds. Maybe someone with more precise knowledge could comment further.
@@timw.8452 Yeah, I have to assume they couldn't do it because of weird ownership or other rules or regulations. I doubt they'd *choose* to operate it like this.
There was a similar problem trying to in-fill third rail between Reading -Guildford-Redhill. GWR were going to use trimode trains but I don't think they will now.
Perhaps it's so they don't need to modify the Northern rail section in case Merseyrail wants to extend services to Wigan or somewhere else along the line.
Tower Hill is the name of the estate in Kirkby - the same as Northwood Everything in Headbolt station is yellow because MerseyTravel own the station and yellow is their brand colour👍
Hi Geoff, I live super close by to Headbolt, but sadly Im closer to Kirkby, but I love this station, im gutted I missed out on seeing you as I was around the area on that day!
Why is this video not called “Geoff Marshall meets the original Geoff Marshall”? I’d love this encounter with David to evolve into a Choo Choo Chat some time!
Hi Geoff Marshall, You should add another station to your least used stations playlist . Hourpes is the least used station in Belgium. Only 7 people use it in a year. In Belgium they speak French,German and Dutch.
There's still a giant car park next to it. Seriously, it's terrible to have these large parking lots right next to a station, as it makes them less attractive to reach on foot or by bike. People on foot or on bikes should be given priority, which in return will make the station location more attractive for small shops and cafés.
Its right next to one of the main roads out of the town. Has dedicated cycleway/storage.also has a bus terminus at the entrance and 5 minutes walk from major residential areas with more planned
@@markusstudeli2997 It really shows the priorities of the ruling class not just in Britain, but globally. They don't want us out of cars, or the automotive and fossil fuel industries will get angry, and they make more money than most companies. Typical capitalist "democracy".
Boom, I got the first like!! 😀Wait 13 mins..... OK, great episode, I can't believe you met David Brewer - awesome! I don't recall ever having been on Northern Rail but I wouldn't mind a go on the new battery trains! 🙂
A long time ago, a village in Cheshire called Willaston had a train station called Hadlow Road. It was the only station to serve Willaston so lord knows why it wasn’t just called Willaston. The station is actually still there…unlike the rest of the railway.
Haven't been to Wigan in ages (from Kirkby) but the last few times I did, Platform 3 was the Kirkby line which they used a pacer train for, which terminated at Wallgate using Plat 3. When I travelled to Wigan Wallgate on that line a while later, the route no longer terminated at Wallgate and went on to Blackburn (I think), so Platform 3 wasn't used. They could still use it for services between Headbolt and Wallgate sometimes, I suppose, but I doubt they do.
I’m not from the area nor have I lived anywhere near it, so correct me if I’m wrong I’m completely baffled as to why the hell they’ve called it simply ‘Headbolt Lane’ if the area around it is well recognised as Tower Hill, especially as this is a brand new station and doesn’t have to conform to what it was named decades ago (such as the aforementioned Mauldeth Road), especially considering Headbolt Lane itself doesn’t appear to be that major of a road. Surely ‘Kirby Tower Hill’ or at least ‘Kirby Headbolt Lane’ would work perfectly, and if the reasoning against a more descriptive name was that it’d be too much of a mouthful, Then someone needs to take a look at the two Bootle stations down the road
HBL is well known by locals. It's right near Mill Dam Park, which is one of the only parks in the region. Kirkby H'bolt.. is a placeholder name just to get people used to Headbolt Lane being the terminus, not Kirkby.
I lived in Kirkby for a number of years (probably about 5 minutes walk from the new station actually) and couldn't have told you where Headbolt Lane was.
I remember Mauldeth Road station well - all the hundreds of times going throught it while travelling between Gatley and Manchester Piccadilly. And I wouldn't call the Railway Typeface "good, old-fashioned".... it's the PROPER Rail typeface. The lack of sound from the 777s on Battery power is rather reminicent of the 139s (though with slightly more of an electrical whine).
Platform 3 is rarely used, only when there's a Southport/Kirkby service starting from Wigan or vice versa. This sometimes happens when there's engineering works heading east or a train gets cancelled at Wigan.
A brief history of the line. It used to terminate at the Liverpool end at Exchange station.This station lost all it's long distance services to Lime Street as a result of the Beeching cuts. This left 3 commuter lines. Two of them (Southport and Ormskirk) were already electrified using 3rd rail. The Merseyside authorities in creating the new Merseyrail system could easily integrate the first two lines into the new underground, but the third one this line to Kirkby/Wigan was diesel which couldn't go underground. So, they electrified it initially to Kirkby fulling intending to extend it further. It's taken around 50 years to extend by one stop! One problem was the BR singled the line from Fazakerley to Rainford as a result of a single track new bridge. Very short sighted.
Funniest thing i saw on Merseyrail was Graffiti at Aintree Station on the Sign underneath Aintree it says Alight here for Aintree racecourse and someone had crossed out Alight and wrote "Get off" it made my day i couldn't stop giggling
Britain's idea of integrated town planning after WW2: designate Skelmersdale as Liverpool's biggest overspill relocation, close the station just as it begins to grow (1956), wait till 40,000 people live there trainless, then spend half a century and untold millions on studies, reviews, consultations about whether it would be better to have more buses from Skem to the Kirkby railhead or rebuild THREE WHOLE MILES of track. Not electrified, of course- Energizer Bunny DMUs only. Btw, Kirkby was also an expanding exurban center whose rail service only escaped the Beeching Axe bc it was in the Labor prime minister's constituency.
Rail in Britain is an absolute joke. The monetary power of the oil and automotive industries combined are more powerful than any country, so they get what they want, despite the fact it's literally killing us. Typical capitalist efficiency, eh? Profit over all else...
Great video Geoff. It’s great to see the use of more hybrid electric/battery charged trains. I live close to the Uckfield line in East Sussex and have often wondered if an electric/battery charged hybrid EMU would have sufficient range to be used instead of the Class 170 DMUs on this route. The line is electrified as far as Hurst Green where the East Grinstead line diverges.
On the subject of station names, there is the ridiculous "Sandwell & Dudley" (SAD), which stands between West Bromwich and Oldbury. Named Oldbury in 1852 when it opened, it acquired the silly name in May 1984 when it was rebuilt. "Sandwell", apart from being a valley in the borough, is not really a place, and the station is not near Dudley - in fact Dudley Port station is nearer, though that is between Tipton and Great Bridge.
the new merseyrail trains make for such a nicer ride. so smooth and quiet, and air conditioning too. with some nice little extra touches, like better luggage/bike/etc. storage - just a shame they are not rolled out on the line near me 😢
There are three platforms, two through platforms and one bay platform for trains departing towards Southport or Kirkby. Platforms are below street level and reached via a flight of stairs from the street level concourse which contains a ticket office and a newsagent. If you are lucky you may see a train from this station via Birmingham new street to Birmingham international. I do not know how it gets there but there is no current information to be found about this service anywhere But I have seen the train at the station a few times
As a local lad, I remember platform 3 used to be used a shuttle service on the line that you are on.... trains never used to go from Manchester to Kirkby. You used to have to change on wallgate for the "shuttle" service to Kirkby usually a pacer in its early years... worst decision ever made by local councils ( west lancs and Greater Manchester) not to allow electrification beyond Kirkby IMHO
Failing to allow electrification east of Kirkby by crazy councils is off the scale stupidity! The railway should never have been severed at Kirkby all those years ago.
I mean, it wasn't exactly the councils decision.. Kirkby was a very not cost effective station, so they ended up single tracking it, and couldn't afford to electrify it past Kirkby.
Tried the Manchester service from Athertonl station to Headbolt lane then on to Liverpool central. on the new class 777 train, both trains were ontime and we had a thouroughly enjoyable ride.
Only in Britain, could you introduce a new service where the Northern service arrives one minute before the Merseyrail service leaves and expect people to rush between.
Probably a direction from DfT - to ensure least numbers of passengers to support the government mantra that "no one uses rail" so we will need to build roads.
Headbolt Lane railway station in Merseyside is actually the closest railway station to Liverpool's (LFC) new training complex aka the AXA Training Centre in Kirby.
Those all depend on the circumstances that applied when the line opened. It would have made sense then, and we've just gotten used to them. Why bother changing them.
Ok, im confused. Why would the 2 lines terminate here? Why not just have a through line? I can undrrstand in ye olden days, with 2 competing companies not wanting to share track, but i dont understand why do it today.
Am still yet to visit headbolt, I still remember having to terminate at Kirby, at least the connecting path here is a lot wider making it easier to fit through crowds
Good to see another railway station open. I can't understand why the don't connect the lines. Its almost like they're different track gauges but of course they're not. I know through services might no be happening now but if they ever wish to change in the future they will need to alter the station.
The plan is for them to alter the station in the future. The walkway in the middle has been purpose built to be able to be removed. They can't connect them for safety reasons, for example if a 777 is coming and overshoots it's stop and hits the northern train.
@@actuallyneon Effective use of AWS/TPWS should minimise the chance of that to zero, and there would have to be the coincidence of another train being there. 777s also have tripcocks to stop overrun in the other direction. As it is an overshoot will guarantee the train will hit an immovable object and be severely damaged. This seems a dystopian world where common sense has left the table to Merseytravel/TOCs/NR/DfT bickering led by Treasury with the purse strings.
1. Why does the dft hate third rail expansion? It would make it easier to expand electrication (Uckfield) and wouldnt have this situation where only a few trains can serve the station) 2. Is there any possibility of reelectrifying to pantograph? I know all new 3rd rail trains are required to be panto capable. It could tie in with electrification up to Wigan. 3. Will Kirkby ever be doubled? Feeling like that pinch point could become problematic in the future with running a 15 minute service. 8tph along that one track
Nice modern railway station on the outskirts of Kirkby. Merseyrail have done a great job on reopening stations and ordering the Class 777 dual voltage trains with batteries to operate on existing lines that is impossible to electrify with DC 750v 3rd Rail. Or impossible to electrify with AC 25,000 OHL.
Look forward to ticking this off on my next visit...at last a new station that has something about it....Merseyrail for me is the best value service around
Found a 2015 Office of Rail and Road document which explains why Third Rail electrification will never be used to expand the network:
orr.gov.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0017/17621/dc-electrification-policy-statement.pdf
Contrary to popular belief, it isn't an outright ban on new 3rd rail, but must have very good justification and consideration of alternatives to show that 3rd rail is in effect the only viable option and that the risk is managed to be "as low as reasonably practicable".
Headbolt Lane is only a matter of a few hundred yards from Kirkby. It’s like they’re looking for any excuse not to extend the third rail. Cost is only part of a bigger picture. Chester and Ellesmere Port were electrified in 1994 so it can easily be done.
@nigelkthomas9501 On the flip side short distance = ideal for batteries, now that battery rolling stock is (in effect) mature technology. Technically feasible, and eliminates the risk of additional third rail. So why not?
@@ianhenderson4560 Yeah, there is that way of looking at it.
I’m shocked to see this
Seeing you with David was like you meeting a previous Doctor Who, all the stations regenerated!
omg literally
What an unassuming chap David was. A gentleman and a gentle man.
Must have watched too many Geoff videos knew he'd come out of the other toilet....
David is a treasure, Geoff you need to set up a full interview and compare notes...
Ha ha! Well predicted! When I saw the two doors side by side, I couldn’t resist …
It's not a toilet,,,,, it's actually ( looks around secretively..) a railway Tardis.
The black panel Geoff, will prevent drivers of trains being blinded by another unit arriving with headlights on. There is a simular arrangement at Ormskirk.
OK, thanks! was there a similar thing before at Kirkby though? there was the bridge, but i don't recall a panel ...
But it seems to be bigger than necessary.
@@geofftech2 yes as well. You will also note, the station has been built, so it can be easily converted for thru running, if Merseyrail ever run to Wigan Wallgate.
The panel jumped out at me when I visited on Saturday too. I assumed it was added security after the incident at Kirkby a while back...
through running was for skelmersdale@@MrAuriga67
Re stations with 'Road' in the name. When I was Chief Clerk in the Information Production Unit, Southampton in 1995, I suggested changing the name of Lyndhurst Road to Ashurst (New Forest). The village of Lyndhurst is the 'Capital' of the New Forest and approximately 2½ miles from the station. There is an infrequent bus service. We used to get tourists in the Summer getting off at the station, then trying to work out where the village was! I then had the job to change all the Solari flap indicators and recorded announcements at stations. I now have the old NSE Lyndhurst Road running in board on my garage wall.
You need to have a longer interview with David what an ace bloke would love to hear more about his experiences over the years and his thoughts on the modern state of BR
well... he did experience the latter year of the steam age, didn't he? (IIRC the steam age in UK runs up to the early 90s)
David Brewer is worthy of a whole video
This is exactly why we cant lose ticket offices as the ticket machines are either out of order or are in accessable for most poeople but especially blind and partially sighted people
Chester Road has to be the most vaguely named "road" station, as the A452 it's named after is around 100 miles long!
However, when the railway was built, there was little in the way of houses there, so it made sense to name it after the most prominent feature of the area - Old Chester Road.
What a wonderful man David is. Cracking chat with him
The black panel is there as a kind of anti dazzle/light baffle screen/sighting screen that's been placed there between the two buffer stop/stop blocks to block out any lights beyond the stop blocks that may dazzle & distract drivers as they enter the station.
They are basically there to assist drivers & traincrews with sighting purely the buffer stops & end of the line as they enter the station at Headbolt Lane, there is a similar (but smaller one) in use at Ormskirk also placed between the buffer stops there.
In 1988 when the new signalling & signal box at Rufford was brought into use it was quickly noticed as part of a signal sighting committee that trains when entering the up platform were likely to be dazzled by the new station lighting & that might cause sighting problems with the new colour light signal that protected the level crossing & entry onto the single line to Midge Hall.
So the station lamps on the up side at Rufford were fitted with dark screens on one side (facing Ormskirk) so that they didn't affect the sighting of the signal anymore on the approach to Rufford station.
In some situations, having two tracks that terminate facing each other may look like one continuous track if the buffer stops are obscured. An opaque fence may help avoid that, stopping drivers from hitting the end at speed.
does it really need to be that big for driver protection purpose? it feels a bit like on the tube / purple line, where TfL remove the next train from the display boards at the station entrance a few minutes before it arrives - presumably to stop the public running to catch a tube/train!
Let's not forget that Northern and Merseyrail don't like each other - for example, the Northern arrival at Hunt's Cross is the cue for the immediate departure of the Merseyrail service. Between the two platforms is a bridge - how long would it take for passengers to cross between and make a proper connection ? Nah, no holding. Whatever's going on there, the people who pay the fares are irrelevant.
Yes; I was just thinking how this reminds me of Ormskirk station.
Platform 3 at Wigan is used mainly to stable units in the day when things go wrong.
It also used for early morning departures when starting from Wigan (not so much these days) and when there is engineering work south of Wigan, so services towards Southport and Headbolt can start from there.
Yes, Bristol falls into the "street/road" suffix trap with Stapleton Road (Easton), Parson Street (South Bedminster) and St. Andrew's Road (Severnside)
David is a lovely chap. He used to work on the station at Chorley. Always went along to have a chat about his travels and where he had been 🙂
Platform 3 in Wigan Wallgate only ever sees trains when there is no service between Wigan and Hindley, letting the Headbolt Lane trains turn there, and I've occasionally seen it used for services to Southport part-cancelled from Manchester.
It used to be quite frequent to see a 769 sat in there but not so much anymore.
Yeh a few limited Services stop on platform 3 sometimes they would stop on platform on 1
Looking on realtimetrains, It looks like it's used serveral times a day as a place to park trains out of the way. For example a train From leeds arrives in platform 1 at 20:40 and emptys out the passengers, at 20:46 it leaves platform 1 empty coaching stock and arrives back into platform 3 at 20:55 where it sits until 21:33. Then it transfers again over to platform 2 where it arrives at 21:42 to form the 21:44 service back to leeds. There is also a train scheduled to sit in platform 3 overnight from 22:32 to 07:02.
There don't seem to be any passenger arrivals or departures to/from platform 3 on a normal day though.
Fantastic, Geoff. Always good to see the northern correspondent and great to see David as well.
Finally a new station with a decent station building and toilets!
But no buffet, no cuppa does my 'ead in.
Great video! A new station AND an electric train! Not seen one of those before! Really enjoyed your meeting with David. It was like an episode of Dr Who where he meets an earlier version of himself!
You will have to visit Southern Electrics, especially in the rush hour.... you will see more electric trains that you can even imagine.
It's always great to see Karl in a video! I do like this station design, there is a sense of place about it that was missing from your 2022 new stations video thread!
And Roger…
Love seeing new stations with actual station buildings. Wonderful.
Nice to see Karl on your videos again, Geoff. He appears almost anywhere, not just in the north!
Thank you for the other night by the way Geoff. What a show 👍
Such an excellent video, and well deserved of it being #17 on trending (if that even means anything anymore?!!)
Absolutely love seeing Carl and Roger, both my favourite regulars on the channel. The new station looks absolutely brilliant and the unexpected chat with David (who I vaguely remember you mentioning all the way back in 2017) really made this video a special one. And the funny bits too. legend
Good to see more passengers being attracted back to the railways
Rare thing these days sadly
@@jeffrotino5895 what?
@@jeffrotino5895 The Jubilee disagrees during peak times
@@Nooticus with all the anti rail policies being pushed by this government to push passengers away, it’s rare to see initiatives being done to attract more passengers to rail.
That's so exciting to see that Britain is currently opening a lot of new stations ! ❤
After cancelling our high speed line because of an incompetent hard right government.
Not enough new stations. We need to undo Beeching immediately.
@@Alfie__2003stop electing right wing politicians
@@caramelldansen2204 That would involve hundreds maybe thousands of miles of new track bed as what's not a heritage line has houses and roads built over it, if not a footpath/bridleway. The Bluebell Railway had to build a new track bed for its extension into East Grinstead Station as the old route is now a main road and a housing estate.
@@Alfie__2003.......LOL, this Tory Government is more Socialist than Labour could ever aspire to be!
8:57 How considerate of Merseyside to put a sign up helping Geoff with pronunciation. Truly amazing accessible station signage. Perhaps they should install a certain round pink Nintendo character at Kirkby to remind visitors not to pronounce the second 'k'.
And I think I speak for everyone when I say we would absolutely love a Choo Choo Chat with David!
Local here, I call it Kirkby half the time for fun. 😂 also Kirkby just sounds more formal and nicer than Kir'by
OMG! You guys are such goofs! What a hoot! Love it and thank you for sharing!
Top quality cameo appearances in this video! Also Geoff doing god's work curbing misuse of the word "font".
Platform 3 is used on the rare occasion an ex-southport service terminates there and is due to go into Wallgate Sidings. Rarely used these days
This guy should have his own show. He’s very likeable and good at presenting
It was great seeing u on my train my friend! Thank youu
The new station building at 'Eadbolt Lane is handsome and practical. One can well imagine waiting there on a cold wintry day.
The black panel I think is for sighting buffer stops and to stop drivers being distracted
plattform 3 is used as a terminus for the kirkby to wigan train, usually the last train of the day stops there overnight :)
Caught myself in your video their Geoff, wasn’t expecting to see you, was a surprise. Had to get on that northern train so couldn’t speak and didn’t want to disturb your filming, also at 6:25 was near David the train into head bolt lane, if only I would of known such an interesting man
Seemingly the double track is for expansion into Wigan in the future and hence they have futureproofed the station. Fair play to Merseyrail
The noisy bit of the class 777s is when sat above the leading bogies. Quite rumble noise. Apart from that and constant breakdowns every time i am travelling on purpose from Manchester to travel on them, all sounds good. Thank you for sharing another interesting video.
0:12 Platform 3 (the bay platform) isn't really used for any timetabled services as such, but it does see occasional use as it is sometimes used for the ad hoc stabling of stock etc.
The bay platform at Wallgate used to be much longer, before being filled in & shortened in the late 1970s, with the shortened bit being subsequently filled in & turned into the garden seen here.
There was talk back in the 1970s of the Merseyrail network being extended all the way to Wigan Wallgate, with it being electrified with third rail all the way from Walton Junction to Wigan Wallgate right into the bay (platform 3) where the Merseyrail service would terminate & turnback, but it all came to nought, with the electrification only being extended as far as Kirkby in 1977.
8:31 Now we can follow in the footsteps of Londonbeat - "commuting on a double-A" 🙂
Surprised you didn't mention Geoff that there is a proposal in the future to extend Merseyrail beyond Headbolt Lane to Skelmersdale. All they would need to do is build an overbridge, lift the block separating the 2 tracks and getting rid of the northern platform.
That would need a little more than that wouldn't it? Skelmersdale doesn't appear to even have a station?
Or if it's one of the Northern stations further up the line that you mean, why would there need to be a bridge added if the Northern trains already reach?
Because that proposal has been denied by the DFT.
As Matt Evans has said, it's been dropped by the DfT.
In July 2022 the DfT rejected the strategic outline business case for Skelmersdale Station.
It'd be nice, but Skelmersdale has a Buslink service now, that takes you to Kirkby (Old Kirkby) from the Skelmersdale Concourse. I think really, what would be better for West Lancs is the reinstatement of the Burscough Curves
The next Merseyrail Battery section extension will be from Ellesmere Port to Helsby on the Wirral Line.
The next Mains Power intermediate station will be 'Baltic' between Brunswick and Central, Northern Line.
Great video as always (and shout out especially to the swish toilet transition 😂). Definitely looks like it has more too it than some of the other new stations this year.
Reminds me of when the Glasgow North Electric line was extended by a mile from Airdrie station to the eastern side of Airdrie which they called Drumgelloch (fair enough, that's the part of town it was in) rather than "Airdrie East". The result being that as only two of the four trains an hour to Airdrie were extended to the new terminus, people for intermediate stations who always caught the Airdrie train didn't board those going to Drumgelloch. The solution? Leave the automated announcements as "The next train is for Airdrie" and have a manual announcement reminding passengers "this train also calls at Drumgelloch".
The bay platform at Wigan Wallgate would be ideal for terminating Merseyrail 777s in the future if they extend the service
I believe the section separating Merseyrail and Northern at Headbolt Lane is designed specifically so it can be easily removed
0:14 Why yes. Platform three is used for the very occasional train that goes on
The line to Wigan Pier.
I guess that would've been possible at some point by going via the Winstanley colliery railway XD
Given the short distance it seems weird that they didn't just third rail it the rest of the way, instead having to spend the money to buy and maintain trains with big, heavy batteries that will degrade far faster than a third rail would.
Completely agree with you, but I believe that extending the third rail network any further isn't allowed any more on H&S grounds. Maybe someone with more precise knowledge could comment further.
@@timw.8452 Yeah, I have to assume they couldn't do it because of weird ownership or other rules or regulations. I doubt they'd *choose* to operate it like this.
There was a similar problem trying to in-fill third rail between Reading -Guildford-Redhill. GWR were going to use trimode trains but I don't think they will now.
@@timw.8452 You are correct, nor will the DfT allow Overhead power either on cost grounds.
Perhaps it's so they don't need to modify the Northern rail section in case Merseyrail wants to extend services to Wigan or somewhere else along the line.
Thanks
Tower Hill is the name of the estate in Kirkby - the same as Northwood
Everything in Headbolt station is yellow because MerseyTravel own the station and yellow is their brand colour👍
It's ridiculous how much happiness I get from seeing Geoff 'christen' a bin
Hello, Just Wanted To Say Loving Your Videos, Keep Up The Great Work
Hi Geoff, I live super close by to Headbolt, but sadly Im closer to Kirkby, but I love this station, im gutted I missed out on seeing you as I was around the area on that day!
Thank you for the video Geoff, that was very interesting.
Why is this video not called “Geoff Marshall meets the original Geoff Marshall”? I’d love this encounter with David to evolve into a Choo Choo Chat some time!
Always love new stations, but it should really go to Skelmersdale.
As part of levelling up the plans were rejected! Well done DfT.
Hi Geoff Marshall, You should add another station to your least used stations playlist . Hourpes is the least used station in Belgium. Only 7 people use it in a year. In Belgium they speak French,German and Dutch.
It’s so nice with a new station that isn’t connected to a car park or is located in the middle of a field
There's still a giant car park next to it. Seriously, it's terrible to have these large parking lots right next to a station, as it makes them less attractive to reach on foot or by bike. People on foot or on bikes should be given priority, which in return will make the station location more attractive for small shops and cafés.
Its right next to one of the main roads out of the town. Has dedicated cycleway/storage.also has a bus terminus at the entrance and 5 minutes walk from major residential areas with more planned
@@markusstudeli2997 It really shows the priorities of the ruling class not just in Britain, but globally. They don't want us out of cars, or the automotive and fossil fuel industries will get angry, and they make more money than most companies.
Typical capitalist "democracy".
Boom, I got the first like!! 😀Wait 13 mins..... OK, great episode, I can't believe you met David Brewer - awesome! I don't recall ever having been on Northern Rail but I wouldn't mind a go on the new battery trains! 🙂
Hi Geoff, platform 3 at Wigan can be used to store unities however its primary function is to hold Sunday services from Wigan to headbolt lane
A long time ago, a village in Cheshire called Willaston had a train station called Hadlow Road. It was the only station to serve Willaston so lord knows why it wasn’t just called Willaston. The station is actually still there…unlike the rest of the railway.
Platform 3 used to be for shuttle trains between Kirkby and Wallgate but was a very long time since that was common on the timetable
I think it’s time to experience all your stations once again, but this time in a Wheelchair (Electric possibly).
Haven't been to Wigan in ages (from Kirkby) but the last few times I did, Platform 3 was the Kirkby line which they used a pacer train for, which terminated at Wallgate using Plat 3.
When I travelled to Wigan Wallgate on that line a while later, the route no longer terminated at Wallgate and went on to Blackburn (I think), so Platform 3 wasn't used. They could still use it for services between Headbolt and Wallgate sometimes, I suppose, but I doubt they do.
I’m not from the area nor have I lived anywhere near it, so correct me if I’m wrong
I’m completely baffled as to why the hell they’ve called it simply ‘Headbolt Lane’ if the area around it is well recognised as Tower Hill, especially as this is a brand new station and doesn’t have to conform to what it was named decades ago (such as the aforementioned Mauldeth Road), especially considering Headbolt Lane itself doesn’t appear to be that major of a road.
Surely ‘Kirby Tower Hill’ or at least ‘Kirby Headbolt Lane’ would work perfectly, and if the reasoning against a more descriptive name was that it’d be too much of a mouthful, Then someone needs to take a look at the two Bootle stations down the road
HBL is well known by locals. It's right near Mill Dam Park, which is one of the only parks in the region.
Kirkby H'bolt.. is a placeholder name just to get people used to Headbolt Lane being the terminus, not Kirkby.
I lived in Kirkby for a number of years (probably about 5 minutes walk from the new station actually) and couldn't have told you where Headbolt Lane was.
@@davidemmott6225I had to Google where the new station was going to be and I live in Northwood
Textbook Lancashire accent on David - one of our few Northern accents with rhotic Rs!
Good to see the Northern Correspondent back.
I remember Mauldeth Road station well - all the hundreds of times going throught it while travelling between Gatley and Manchester Piccadilly.
And I wouldn't call the Railway Typeface "good, old-fashioned".... it's the PROPER Rail typeface.
The lack of sound from the 777s on Battery power is rather reminicent of the 139s (though with slightly more of an electrical whine).
Platform 3 is rarely used, only when there's a Southport/Kirkby service starting from Wigan or vice versa. This sometimes happens when there's engineering works heading east or a train gets cancelled at Wigan.
A brief history of the line. It used to terminate at the Liverpool end at Exchange station.This station lost all it's long distance services to Lime Street as a result of the Beeching cuts. This left 3 commuter lines. Two of them (Southport and Ormskirk) were already electrified using 3rd rail. The Merseyside authorities in creating the new Merseyrail system could easily integrate the first two lines into the new underground, but the third one this line to Kirkby/Wigan was diesel which couldn't go underground. So, they electrified it initially to Kirkby fulling intending to extend it further. It's taken around 50 years to extend by one stop! One problem was the BR singled the line from Fazakerley to Rainford as a result of a single track new bridge. Very short sighted.
Funniest thing i saw on Merseyrail was Graffiti at Aintree Station on the Sign underneath Aintree it says Alight here for Aintree racecourse and someone had crossed out Alight and wrote "Get off" it made my day i couldn't stop giggling
Britain's idea of integrated town planning after WW2: designate Skelmersdale as Liverpool's biggest overspill relocation, close the station just as it begins to grow (1956), wait till 40,000 people live there trainless, then spend half a century and untold millions on studies, reviews, consultations about whether it would be better to have more buses from Skem to the Kirkby railhead or rebuild THREE WHOLE MILES of track. Not electrified, of course- Energizer Bunny DMUs only.
Btw, Kirkby was also an expanding exurban center whose rail service only escaped the Beeching Axe bc it was in the Labor prime minister's constituency.
Rail in Britain is an absolute joke. The monetary power of the oil and automotive industries combined are more powerful than any country, so they get what they want, despite the fact it's literally killing us. Typical capitalist efficiency, eh? Profit over all else...
Great video Geoff. It’s great to see the use of more hybrid electric/battery charged trains. I live close to the Uckfield line in East Sussex and have often wondered if an electric/battery charged hybrid EMU would have sufficient range to be used instead of the Class 170 DMUs on this route. The line is electrified as far as Hurst Green where the East Grinstead line diverges.
New lines need to be built to network rail standards.
Good to meet you on Saturday afternoon!
Shame we didnt make the final cut 😅
From the two locals - Tom & Jo 👍🏻
@@geofftech2 not too worry!
We're better suited to being behind the camera 👍🏻
Hilarious! Well done, this is very informative & funny too. Appreciate the posting, thanks for this 🚉 🚄 👏🏾 👏🏼😆 xXx
On the subject of station names, there is the ridiculous "Sandwell & Dudley" (SAD), which stands between West Bromwich and Oldbury. Named Oldbury in 1852 when it opened, it acquired the silly name in May 1984 when it was rebuilt. "Sandwell", apart from being a valley in the borough, is not really a place, and the station is not near Dudley - in fact Dudley Port station is nearer, though that is between Tipton and Great Bridge.
the new merseyrail trains make for such a nicer ride. so smooth and quiet, and air conditioning too. with some nice little extra touches, like better luggage/bike/etc. storage - just a shame they are not rolled out on the line near me 😢
There are three platforms, two through platforms and one bay platform for trains departing towards Southport or Kirkby. Platforms are below street level and reached via a flight of stairs from the street level concourse which contains a ticket office and a newsagent.
If you are lucky you may see a train from this station via Birmingham new street to Birmingham international.
I do not know how it gets there but there is no current information to be found about this service anywhere
But I have seen the train at the station a few times
The Class 777 has provision for a pantograph so can go beyond Headbolt using batteries or overhead line equipment.
8:57 Very nice Geoff, very nice ;)
As a local lad, I remember platform 3 used to be used a shuttle service on the line that you are on.... trains never used to go from Manchester to Kirkby. You used to have to change on wallgate for the "shuttle" service to Kirkby usually a pacer in its early years... worst decision ever made by local councils ( west lancs and Greater Manchester) not to allow electrification beyond Kirkby IMHO
Failing to allow electrification east of Kirkby by crazy councils is off the scale stupidity! The railway should never have been severed at Kirkby all those years ago.
I mean, it wasn't exactly the councils decision.. Kirkby was a very not cost effective station, so they ended up single tracking it, and couldn't afford to electrify it past Kirkby.
@@actuallyneon cost was undoubtedly a factor, but aren't 3rd rail extensions frowned upon nowadays anyway?
Hopefully they’ll eventually be able to run through to Wallgate P3 on battery power.
A station with unconnected lines.
Hmmm... That's helpful.
Headbolt Lane is a really cool station, nice meeting you there on Saturday! 😅
Tried the Manchester service from Athertonl station to Headbolt lane then on to Liverpool central. on the new class 777 train, both trains were ontime and we had a thouroughly enjoyable ride.
We delivered the platform edges about 5 months ago to that new train station. 18 trucks delivered them .
Only in Britain, could you introduce a new service where the Northern service arrives one minute before the Merseyrail service leaves and expect people to rush between.
Probably a direction from DfT - to ensure least numbers of passengers to support the government mantra that "no one uses rail" so we will need to build roads.
Theres a new station being built on the Great Eastern Mainline called Beaulieu Park,make sure to visit it in the future
Headbolt Lane railway station in Merseyside is actually the closest railway station to Liverpool's (LFC) new training complex aka the AXA Training Centre in Kirby.
New Lane, Bescar Lane, Hall Road - just a few for your Northern correspondent
Thank you! Good examples! 👍
Those all depend on the circumstances that applied when the line opened. It would have made sense then, and we've just gotten used to them. Why bother changing them.
I was literally reading about this station an hour ago!!
Ok, im confused. Why would the 2 lines terminate here? Why not just have a through line? I can undrrstand in ye olden days, with 2 competing companies not wanting to share track, but i dont understand why do it today.
Am still yet to visit headbolt, I still remember having to terminate at Kirby, at least the connecting path here is a lot wider making it easier to fit through crowds
We have the similarly named Headstone Lane station down here, but at least the area has grown around it.
Good to see another railway station open. I can't understand why the don't connect the lines. Its almost like they're different track gauges but of course they're not. I know through services might no be happening now but if they ever wish to change in the future they will need to alter the station.
The plan is for them to alter the station in the future. The walkway in the middle has been purpose built to be able to be removed.
They can't connect them for safety reasons, for example if a 777 is coming and overshoots it's stop and hits the northern train.
@@actuallyneon Effective use of AWS/TPWS should minimise the chance of that to zero, and there would have to be the coincidence of another train being there. 777s also have tripcocks to stop overrun in the other direction. As it is an overshoot will guarantee the train will hit an immovable object and be severely damaged.
This seems a dystopian world where common sense has left the table to Merseytravel/TOCs/NR/DfT bickering led by Treasury with the purse strings.
1. Why does the dft hate third rail expansion? It would make it easier to expand electrication (Uckfield) and wouldnt have this situation where only a few trains can serve the station)
2. Is there any possibility of reelectrifying to pantograph? I know all new 3rd rail trains are required to be panto capable. It could tie in with electrification up to Wigan.
3. Will Kirkby ever be doubled? Feeling like that pinch point could become problematic in the future with running a 15 minute service. 8tph along that one track
here, there's a great document from the ORR that explains it in detail www.orr.gov.uk/media/10702
Nice modern railway station on the outskirts of Kirkby. Merseyrail have done a great job on reopening stations and ordering the Class 777 dual voltage trains with batteries to operate on existing lines that is impossible to electrify with DC 750v 3rd Rail. Or impossible to electrify with AC 25,000 OHL.
Look forward to ticking this off on my next visit...at last a new station that has something about it....Merseyrail for me is the best value service around
Love the greeting 😄
David was great ! Longer interview next time please !
Platform 3 is use for limited off peak and final Service to Southport.
Somtimes they would stop of platform 1 if the line is clear.
6:32 This is wonderful!!!
Good Video 👍
I love the joke that it's spelt "Head", pronounced "Ead", but on the train the abbreviation uses only "H" - the letter that's not pronounced!