This piece sounds kinda like exploring ancient castle ruins. With old musical forms representing it's walls and all new elements representing beautiful flowers which grown there over time.
I'm not sure if it's the writing or if the interpretation contributes to it, but even when Ravel uses old forms and styles there's a freshness, a feeling of clean air which is absolutely modern. It's as if he obtained the modernist ideal of crystalline rationality without having to sacrifice ornament and tradition.
I love how you can see Bach's influence on Ravels Music. It has such a nostalgic and wonderful sound when Bach's ways of imitation and sequences are combined with Ravels Harmonic Language. Amazing.
Ravel is definitely using minor 2nd interval, which is a semitone, which given a sharp sound in music. Not usual in classical and impressionist music but often found in Jazz.
This is a wonderful piece. It is classical in form, but coloured beautifully with Impressionism. I prefer the piano version over the orchestral version.
Incredible that this was one of Ravel’s very first published works. And also striking to me that the whole exposition is nearly all diatonic with barely even one accidental - yet it sounds ridiculously colourful.
Thats exactly why it sounds so colourful, we got used to the harmonic shifts that became so generic, hearing unaltered harmonies, especially the minor V chords, is so refreshing. Basically he is just using the ancient modes that the "new" Western rejected
It is Ravel’s genius to make metaphysical statements in a shorter time than many more expansive composers take to clear their throats. From 3.19 to 3.33 the simple melody seems about to escape the confines of this world, only to fall back. Ravel has no back catalogue, and this is why. He leaves us always wanting more.
there's a sort of "contradiction" in the way it's written. The bass in F# leading to C# suggests a plagal IV - I cadence, but the Bmaj7 harmony suggests a minor V - I mixolydian cadence (as Alex mentioned). The effect is enhanced by the occurrence of a "proper" V-I cadence in the preceding bar, which functions as a sort of "comparison model" to it
Il y a une grace dans la musique française que l'on trouve rarement ailleurs. Chez Tchaikozsky quelquefois mais sa mère était d'origine française. Certainement pas chez les Allemands, chez l'Anglais Edouard Ellgar oui, mais pas aussi sublimé que chez Ravel, Debussy, Chabrier, Couperin.
An it was dedicated to his long time friend, Ricard Viñes, who would be the first to perform the piece for the public. At that time he would be 23 years old.
There's speculation that the extreme precision and repetitive nature in some of his later pieces (Bolero) could have been attributed to Progressive primary aphasia and corticobasal degeneration following his car accident.
Ravel usually love use to baroque or renaissences harmony. Example, He has a lot of menuet, composed fugues, Le Tombau de Couperin, this piece and etc. So, he called himself neoclassic.
The baroque menuets that come to my mind are actually much faster than this piece haha. Like these Couperin ones ruclips.net/video/CXeqaY_kI3Y/видео.html ruclips.net/video/52027P8ClqI/видео.html
In bar 22 their is a tied Db in the bass clef which changes to a D natural on beat 3. On paper makes harmonic sense but sounds odd. Why didn’t he leave beat 3 as Db I wonder?
To me it sounds like maybe it’s a leading tone to the Eb of the downbeat of the next bar. Especially since there’s also a V->i motion with the Bb 16th note run leading to the Eb. It may sound “odd” too you, but to me it makes it more “spicy” and gives that moment a little bit more momentum.
Doesn't sound odd in the least bit, as it follows functional harmony in the brief tonal center of Eb minor. It's also not a tie, but a slur. If the note changes, it's never a tie.
I have always questioned Ravel's marking "Majestueusment" for the beginning of this piece, and Lortie seems to take it with a grain of salt. A menuet is not "majestic." It's a polite dance form that should be delicate and intricate. I would to hear this played on the harpsichord.
Although Ravel titles this piece “menuet antique,” this is actually a paradoxical anachronism. Check out kennedy-center for the complete description of this piece.
Musical genre has always been fluid. The passacaglia started out as a "street walk", strummed interludes between accompanied dances and songs, and became extended epics on the organ in the late Baroque. What did Chopin do with the scherzo? Or Mahler with the Ländler? Composers such as Mozart, Beethoven, Alkan... they have been reinventing the menuet long before Ravel did.
I'd certainly call this neoclassical (though not part of the school of 20th century modernist neoclassicism [e.g. middle period Stravinsky, Martinu, Hindemith])
I am praying this is sarcasm. This is a phenomenal piece of music with both colorfully gentle ideas and expressive bold ones alike. However, if this isn't sarcasm, I guess it would be ridiculous to ask someone to change their preference of music, but please let my opinion dwell in your mind before you give Menuet Antique another listen.
This piece sounds kinda like exploring ancient castle ruins. With old musical forms representing it's walls and all new elements representing beautiful flowers which grown there over time.
I adore this
It felt like a mountain castle, like Liechtenstein Castle.
never heard such an accurate analogy, this also goes for a lot of other neoclassical works
@@maxiapalucci2511 me too
There is an unsaid beauty in this piece that I cannot describe.
I'm not sure if it's the writing or if the interpretation contributes to it, but even when Ravel uses old forms and styles there's a freshness, a feeling of clean air which is absolutely modern. It's as if he obtained the modernist ideal of crystalline rationality without having to sacrifice ornament and tradition.
Renaissance cadences + Classical forms + Ravel's everything else = ♥
yes...
Precisely!
I love how you can see Bach's influence on Ravels Music. It has such a nostalgic and wonderful sound when Bach's ways of imitation and sequences are combined with Ravels Harmonic Language. Amazing.
I think this is Note influenced by Rennaisance music that by Bach.
It has some Bach in it's language, but melody wise its inspired by more "antique" keyboard masters.
BS
I love those semitones resolutions in Ravel’s compositions
can you explain it a bit more?
@@v.6297 please
Ravel is definitely using minor 2nd interval, which is a semitone, which given a sharp sound in music. Not usual in classical and impressionist music but often found in Jazz.
The transition section (3:32) including the main theme played in the left hand is one of the most beautiful musical ideas I can imagine.
Ravel's music never fails to delight. Bold, wistful, and in excellent taste.
This is a wonderful piece. It is classical in form, but coloured beautifully with Impressionism. I prefer the piano version over the orchestral version.
Incredible that this was one of Ravel’s very first published works. And also striking to me that the whole exposition is nearly all diatonic with barely even one accidental - yet it sounds ridiculously colourful.
Thats exactly why it sounds so colourful, we got used to the harmonic shifts that became so generic, hearing unaltered harmonies, especially the minor V chords, is so refreshing. Basically he is just using the ancient modes that the "new" Western rejected
Beautiful, and also charming! Ravel is the best!
such an underrated piece
It is Ravel’s genius to make metaphysical statements in a shorter time than many more expansive composers take to clear their throats. From 3.19 to 3.33 the simple melody seems about to escape the confines of this world, only to fall back. Ravel has no back catalogue, and this is why. He leaves us always wanting more.
Hmm - Bruno-Leibniz-Ravel 3 : 4 (7) 🎉
@@markhughes7927 Never heard of it! 🤣😳
2:26 god why I love so much this Bmaj7 chord voicing
seventh chords are blessed
jazzy, wouldn't expect that colour from a maj7 chord tbh :0
it has a mixolydian color, so well written
there's a sort of "contradiction" in the way it's written. The bass in F# leading to C# suggests a plagal IV - I cadence, but the Bmaj7 harmony suggests a minor V - I mixolydian cadence (as Alex mentioned). The effect is enhanced by the occurrence of a "proper" V-I cadence in the preceding bar, which functions as a sort of "comparison model" to it
I'm addicted to this piece...
Such breathtaking elegance...
Il y a une grace dans la musique française que l'on trouve rarement ailleurs. Chez Tchaikozsky quelquefois mais sa mère était d'origine française. Certainement pas chez les Allemands, chez l'Anglais Edouard Ellgar oui, mais pas aussi sublimé que chez Ravel, Debussy, Chabrier, Couperin.
I hate this piece because I repeat it in my head for days after hearing this genius piece.
3:19 is so pretty
Ravel was 20 when composing the piece.
I was 20 when I first learned this piece.
The mark of genius on both counts. It looks deceptively easy but is fraught with difficulties in execution.
An it was dedicated to his long time friend, Ricard Viñes, who would be the first to perform the piece for the public. At that time he would be 23 years old.
Young Ravel...cool
Exquisite!
C'est exquis Ravel....
That 3:19 part feels like recovering from depression
There's speculation that the extreme precision and repetitive nature in some of his later pieces (Bolero) could have been attributed to Progressive primary aphasia and corticobasal degeneration following his car accident.
Amazing piece of music, where did he get the idea from I wonder?
Ravel usually love use to baroque or renaissences harmony. Example, He has a lot of menuet, composed fugues, Le Tombau de Couperin, this piece and etc. So, he called himself neoclassic.
👏
I wonder if it would be possible to dance the 18th century minuet to this -- would it be too fast? Any baroque dancers out there to answer this?
The baroque menuets that come to my mind are actually much faster than this piece haha. Like these Couperin ones ruclips.net/video/CXeqaY_kI3Y/видео.html ruclips.net/video/52027P8ClqI/видео.html
In bar 22 their is a tied Db in the bass clef which changes to a D natural on beat 3. On paper makes harmonic sense but sounds odd. Why didn’t he leave beat 3 as Db I wonder?
To me it sounds like maybe it’s a leading tone to the Eb of the downbeat of the next bar. Especially since there’s also a V->i motion with the Bb 16th note run leading to the Eb. It may sound “odd” too you, but to me it makes it more “spicy” and gives that moment a little bit more momentum.
Doesn't sound odd in the least bit, as it follows functional harmony in the brief tonal center of Eb minor. It's also not a tie, but a slur. If the note changes, it's never a tie.
この演奏が1番好き。
Those rhythms scare me
*Laughs in Sorabji*
if you'd listen to sacre you'd probably die instantly
Yeah. Not sure why but Ravel sacrificed the readability of the piece for aesthetic phrasing.
Jacob Bass Because it is wonderful, and don’t lie to me it is
Talk of the music's forbears in the comments. Chabrier is the main influence.
0:07 Circle of Fifths Progression
4:43
2:19 chariots of fire?
minuet
3:24 (p.513)
この曲ラヴェルやったんか!!!!
I have always questioned Ravel's marking "Majestueusment" for the beginning of this piece, and Lortie seems to take it with a grain of salt. A menuet is not "majestic." It's a polite dance form that should be delicate and intricate. I would to hear this played on the harpsichord.
Although Ravel titles this piece “menuet antique,” this is actually a paradoxical anachronism. Check out kennedy-center for the complete description of this piece.
Musical genre has always been fluid. The passacaglia started out as a "street walk", strummed interludes between accompanied dances and songs, and became extended epics on the organ in the late Baroque. What did Chopin do with the scherzo? Or Mahler with the Ländler? Composers such as Mozart, Beethoven, Alkan... they have been reinventing the menuet long before Ravel did.
@@TheWanderingNightsuch an informed comment!
Am I wrong or does this sound like Sibelius ar some points?
Sure, but Ravel is a LOT more harmonically gutsy, etc. than Sibelius...
Eu até gosto da música, mas não tem como não se irritar um pouco com a dissonância do começo, como se ao degustar uma pimenta e sentir seu ardor.
Nem ouça Scarbo então
Is this considered Neo classicism?
No, most musicologists agree that Ravel's works from 1890-1900 are NOBODY GIVES A SHIT NIGGAH. LMFAO
I'd certainly call this neoclassical (though not part of the school of 20th century modernist neoclassicism [e.g. middle period Stravinsky, Martinu, Hindemith])
This is impressionism... Neo-classicism is not as pretty sounding... 😁😑😁
Absolutely!
@@vaclavmiller8032 do you down a piano composer who had neoclassical style except Ravel?
リピート記号直前のミのシャープが抜けてる
I think this is much too heavy, no restraint.
I am praying this is sarcasm. This is a phenomenal piece of music with both colorfully gentle ideas and expressive bold ones alike. However, if this isn't sarcasm, I guess it would be ridiculous to ask someone to change their preference of music, but please let my opinion dwell in your mind before you give Menuet Antique another listen.
Speak for yourself
2:20