I spent $132 on an 8 element bowtie antenna. After moving it from the attic to the chimney then to the peak of the roof, I just wasn't happy with the results. I contacted Mike for some advice. Turns out he lives in my vicinity. He brought over an antenna that he made and it out performed my expensive one. Take a lesson from Mike and save yourself a bunch of cash! Thanks Mike!
No it would have never happened with out Mike and others video producers.... There would Be No RUclips... Thank you Mike for all the time you have taken to produce these videos... I have built two of your antennas and they worked great... Now I'm going to build your most resent antenna and maybe try a custom antenna later this Fall...
Had to stop the video half way through just to write this comment to thank you. Already the information you have provided 4 minutes in triggered the beginning of a finally grasping the practical working knowledge that I had been missing in regards to the relationship between radio wave function and ideal antenna architecture for best reception. So thanks again.
Thanks Michael. Nice balance between your introductory theory and the practical aspects of your design. My original setup was nearly identical to yours and, like you, I found the 4-bay bow-tie outperform the "beam." Well done, my friend.
The antenna that you made worked well. Would making the elements for the VHF channels to have a double fractal bends still perform as good as the single fractal bends that you did with this antenna ??? Thanks
Thanks for posting a very informative video with links to tv towers! One question, Did you do a comparison with straight elements versus star-shaped elements like in this video?
Thank you Mike for a clear and succinct explanation of how to tune an antenna. There is a hill and forest with large trees between me and stations 55 miles away so I worry about every little detail. The designs for bow tie antennas I have seen all have 1 1/4” spacing between the transmission lines that connect the bow tie elements. I read the bow tie design is a modification to the classic folded dipole cleverly made from twin lead which has 300 ohm impedance to match the antenna and is angled 90 degrees away from the field polarization. Somewhere I read that twin lead spacing (about .3”) efficiently cancels the field at 300 ohms. Looking at the pattern of the bow ties it seems the bow on the left lines up perfectly with the one on the right which aligns the field on the other side. I wonder if the 1 1/4” spacing is simply to accommodate the minimum bend radius for larger diameter elements. If we could solve the problem of a tight radius to make the spacing the same as twin lead, would Impedance matching and therefore efficiency improve? I would really like to know where the 1 1/4” spacing came from. Thanks for an informative video!
Paul Miller On technical terms it sounds like you know more than I do. I only know what I have learned from the internet and the tests I’ve done by experiments. Thanks for your comment :)
Hello, and thank you for the great info. I'm about to reuse an older VHF/UHF combo antenna in my attic and wonder if I couldn't cut the longer VHF elements to match my local UHF frequencies. My concern is not to create any impedance or interference issues due to adding UHF elements to the rear of the original, and un-modified UHF section of the antenna. Thanks for any input.
So I made a simple dipole antenna and it doesn't have a measurement of a half or quarter wave length to any of the frequencies in SAN Diego but it picks up a ton of channels to include CBS which transmits at a very low 14.873 kw in comparison to other networks out here. The antenna is an indoor antenna and performs very well.
Hi, you should be able to pick up WXVO they used to broadcast under WKFK, I myself am about 4 straight miles from the WXVO tower near Vancleave, you should also be able to pick up wgud ch 19, also WKRG 5.3 metv. I was looking at your antenna, I was told by someone, if you build a HDTV antenna out of wood it will absorb the signal and in plain straight language give you a crappy signal. I have been using the simulated plastic wood to build hdtv antennas works very well. another problem might be signal loss from being in the attic. I believe being in the attic problem cuts your signal by 30 to 40%.
Thanks Mickey. I agree with the plastics vs. wood. I'll have to give that a try. I did some experimenting mounting the antenna outside 12 feet above my rooftop. I got all the channels you mentioned plus several others from pensacola, new orleans and hattisburg, so you are correct about it being in the attic also. I believe my biggest problem is the power lines that run in front of my house. Even though it would be nice to get a lot of other channels, safety is my biggest concern and having them in my attic gives me peice of mind that they are safe from lightning strikes. Thanks for your comment. Nice to meet someone who lives close to me. :)
Cordcutter I don't think the power lines effect them to much I have power lines on 3 sides of my house and I am still getting a lot of channels. I have intentionally put a antenna directly under power lines 8 foot off the ground and I am still getting 23 channels. if u like to contact me you can at 4271310@gmail.com and I ll send you the pics of it and screenshot of the channels on my Win-Tv program. I have been building these HDTV antenna almost 3 yrs and main problem I ever had was height.
Hello my friend I would like to say thank you. I have one question about how to build omnidirectional so I can pick all channels from defendant direction.
Wondering why u have antenna in attic, and not on the roof, I always hear better results past the peak of the roof line. I know it can be a eyesore on the roof, I installed mine in back of the house halfway up and get all the locals in the area and some about 60 miles away.
I built a single bay antenna and was receiving 4 local channels about 30-40 miles away .So I built another antenna that was three bays using the same setup as I did on the first.I've notice most antennas are two or four bay. is there something about a three bay not right.. Thank You
Bogardrippy It may have something to do with the connection being in the center of the antenna. Of course, you might have it connected there. Does your 3 bay work ok?
How did you run your cable from the attic to the set? I'm trying to figure out a way to get it down the walls, but with all the insulation behind the wall, its next to impossible. Also - since this is VHF, did you try getting the antenna outside the house since VHF does not penetrate walls as well as UHF? Thanks.
Bud E Your right. Exterior walls are next to impossible due to insulation. I have all my TVs mounted on interior walls where there is no insulation. I used a 3/4” bit 6” long to get through both header studs but don’t run it down the same hole as the electrical as this will cause interference. My living room tv has a closet on the other side of the wall so I ran it down that way and through the wall behind the tv.
Mike -- Yeah, makes sense to keep them in the attic if possible. That way you don't have to deal with wind / weather / lighting, and I would prefer to do that as well. The one thing I worry about in my situation is I plan to run a preamp on the mast below the antenna, and I'm afraid the extreme temperatures that an attic can reach in the summer will fry anything electronic. Can reach 140 F plus up there!
Do you make certain that the array is mounted perpendicular to the azimuth the stations signal is traveling? Or just get it good enough. I'm looking into building one and some people look like they just mount which ever way is convenient. Thx
Thanks for your question Tom. This antenna works best when it faces the direction of the broadcast tower. Keep in mind that this is a UHF antenna. If you have any VHF stations in your area, I posted a video covering that topic and you might be able to pick those up as well.
Thx for the clarification. However, I thought this was a VHF antenna, as you described at 3:48. I've already been pointed to tvfool and found it very informative. Regardless, I appreciate the video and your ideas. Thx again.
Full wavelength works well for UHF. Unfortunately, the longer the elements get, the more loss it causes on the UHF side. That is, if your goal is to bring in a VHF station. In this video, I demonstrate with RF 13 only because it is the only hard-to-get station in my area. If you are trying to get a VHF station, you might find the video "VHF Add-On" useful. here's the link: ruclips.net/video/xuqHrONy0b8/видео.html note: full wavelength hurts UHF reception here as well. Thanks for your question Jeff and best of luck :)
George Reyes I have a separate antenna for each tv in my house. More than one tv causes signal loss but if your stations are real close and they come in real well, it may not matter as long as you get the stations you want.
I made bowtie antenna using some measurments i got from another video. The bowtie sections are about 5 to 6 inches apart and the "whiskers" are 8 inches long. I got a total of seven channels with the farthest being 38 miles away. The antenna was inside. The channels I was after are about 50 miles away. How do you determine the distance between elements when you change the length of them? is it important? From your formula i need about 10.25 inch whiskers. but dont see how to space them or the distance I would need at the tips. If i were to try a fractal is the whisker length the total length of the wire or the distance from the root to the tip not counting the fractal bends? Thanks
I spent $132 on an 8 element bowtie antenna. After moving it from the attic to the chimney then to the peak of the roof, I just wasn't happy with the results. I contacted Mike for some advice. Turns out he lives in my vicinity. He brought over an antenna that he made and it out performed my expensive one.
Take a lesson from Mike and save yourself a bunch of cash!
Thanks Mike!
Thanks Danny. I'm glad your happy with the antenna! Would've never happened if it weren't for RUclips!!
No it would have never happened with out Mike and others video producers.... There would Be No RUclips... Thank you Mike for all the time you have taken to produce these videos... I have built two of your antennas and they worked great... Now I'm going to build your most resent antenna and maybe try a custom antenna later this Fall...
Had to stop the video half way through just to write this comment to thank you. Already the information you have provided 4 minutes in triggered the beginning of a finally grasping the practical working knowledge that I had been missing in regards to the relationship between radio wave function and ideal antenna architecture for best reception. So thanks again.
Thanks Michael. Nice balance between your introductory theory and the practical aspects of your design. My original setup was nearly identical to yours and, like you, I found the 4-bay bow-tie outperform the "beam." Well done, my friend.
Thanks Warren for your nice comment. BTW, I have never heard of the "Beam". Is there a YT video for it?
Could you tell me if an antenna that is 1/2 wavelength vs. 1/4 wavelength have the same gain even if the size is different DIY project.
The antenna that you made worked well. Would making the elements for the VHF channels to have a double fractal bends still perform as good as the single fractal bends that you did with this antenna ??? Thanks
Thanks for posting a very informative video with links to tv towers! One question, Did you do a comparison with straight elements versus star-shaped elements like in this video?
Thank you Mike for a clear and succinct explanation of how to tune an antenna. There is a hill and forest with large trees between me and stations 55 miles away so I worry about every little detail.
The designs for bow tie antennas I have seen all have 1 1/4” spacing between the transmission lines that connect the bow tie elements. I read the bow tie design is a modification to the classic folded dipole cleverly made from twin lead which has 300 ohm impedance to match the antenna and is angled 90 degrees away from the field polarization. Somewhere I read that twin lead spacing (about .3”) efficiently cancels the field at 300 ohms.
Looking at the pattern of the bow ties it seems the bow on the left lines up perfectly with the one on the right which aligns the field on the other side. I wonder if the 1 1/4” spacing is simply to accommodate the minimum bend radius for larger diameter elements. If we could solve the problem of a tight radius to make the spacing the same as twin lead, would Impedance matching and therefore efficiency improve?
I would really like to know where the 1 1/4” spacing came from.
Thanks for an informative video!
Paul Miller
On technical terms it sounds like you know more than I do. I only know what I have learned from the internet and the tests I’ve done by experiments.
Thanks for your comment :)
Good information Mike Very useful for me to understand
Hello, and thank you for the great info. I'm about to reuse an older VHF/UHF combo antenna in my attic and wonder if I couldn't cut the longer VHF elements to match my local UHF frequencies. My concern is not to create any impedance or interference issues due to adding UHF elements to the rear of the original, and un-modified UHF section of the antenna.
Thanks for any input.
So I made a simple dipole antenna and it doesn't have a measurement of a half or quarter wave length to any of the frequencies in SAN Diego but it picks up a ton of channels to include CBS which transmits at a very low 14.873 kw in comparison to other networks out here. The antenna is an indoor antenna and performs very well.
Awesome Jorge! Wether the antenna works or not is what really matters! :)
Very good presentation, thank you!
Hi, you should be able to pick up WXVO they used to broadcast under WKFK, I myself am about 4 straight miles from the WXVO tower near Vancleave, you should also be able to pick up wgud ch 19, also WKRG 5.3 metv. I was looking at your antenna, I was told by someone, if you build a HDTV antenna out of wood it will absorb the signal and in plain straight language give you a crappy signal. I have been using the simulated plastic wood to build hdtv antennas works very well. another problem might be signal loss from being in the attic. I believe being in the attic problem cuts your signal by 30 to 40%.
Thanks Mickey. I agree with the plastics vs. wood. I'll have to give that a try. I did some experimenting mounting the antenna outside 12 feet above my rooftop. I got all the channels you mentioned plus several others from pensacola, new orleans and hattisburg, so you are correct about it being in the attic also. I believe my biggest problem is the power lines that run in front of my house. Even though it would be nice to get a lot of other channels, safety is my biggest concern and having them in my attic gives me peice of mind that they are safe from lightning strikes. Thanks for your comment. Nice to meet someone who lives close to me. :)
Cordcutter I don't think the power lines effect them to much I have power lines on 3 sides of my house and I am still getting a lot of channels. I have intentionally put a antenna directly under power lines 8 foot off the ground and I am still getting 23 channels. if u like to contact me you can at 4271310@gmail.com and I ll send you the pics of it and screenshot of the channels on my Win-Tv program. I have been building these HDTV antenna almost 3 yrs and main problem I ever had was height.
Would love to see them. Look for email address mburkacoustic@gmail
Hello my friend
I would like to say thank you.
I have one question about how to build omnidirectional so I can pick all channels from defendant direction.
Wondering why u have antenna in attic, and not on the roof, I always hear better results past the peak of the roof line. I know it can be a eyesore on the roof, I installed mine in back of the house halfway up and get all the locals in the area and some about 60 miles away.
Is there a tool that can help me aim the antenna?
THANKS!
5:15 Why are the elements bent into an M shape?
Fantastic video! Very informative. Thanks for sharing!
Thanks for the comment! Glad to know I can be of help. :)
you live in south Mississippi
You guys realize there is no "HD" antenna, right. any antenna will pickup "HD" stations...
Someone has said it at last.
which makes it a HD antenna. A rose by any other name...
@@ralphmarlow6627 It's misleading...
I built a single bay antenna and was receiving 4 local channels about 30-40 miles away .So I built another antenna that was three bays using the same setup as I did on the first.I've notice most antennas are two or four bay. is there something about a three bay not right.. Thank You
Bogardrippy
It may have something to do with the connection being in the center of the antenna. Of course, you might have it connected there. Does your 3 bay work ok?
How did you run your cable from the attic to the set? I'm trying to figure out a way to get it down the walls, but with all the insulation behind the wall, its next to impossible.
Also - since this is VHF, did you try getting the antenna outside the house since VHF does not penetrate walls as well as UHF?
Thanks.
Bud E
Your right. Exterior walls are next to impossible due to insulation. I have all my TVs mounted on interior walls where there is no insulation. I used a 3/4” bit 6” long to get through both header studs but don’t run it down the same hole as the electrical as this will cause interference.
My living room tv has a closet on the other side of the wall so I ran it down that way and through the wall behind the tv.
Bud E
I keep my antennas in my attic to protect them from lightning.
Bud E
My vhf channel is close enough to me that I don’t have to go outside with it.
Mike -- Yeah, makes sense to keep them in the attic if possible. That way you don't have to deal with wind / weather / lighting, and I would prefer to do that as well. The one thing I worry about in my situation is I plan to run a preamp on the mast below the antenna, and I'm afraid the extreme temperatures that an attic can reach in the summer will fry anything electronic. Can reach 140 F plus up there!
Bud E
Are you planning to connect more than one tv to the antenna?
What measurement do I actually make 28 1/8"? each element? or the overall width?
Each element
or just 6000/Wavelength = The Half freq length in inches...
Using your example 28 1/8 . Is that per side ? Or total left to right.
bunny what channel are you trying to get? I’m guessing vhf?
If so, might I suggest the tuxedo with vhf integration. It works a lot better. It’s on my channel.
Bent in half. Ok. Thank you for your help. Awesome.
bunny you might refer to my first video “
I sent you some suggestions but you seem to be on the ball, thanks
Do you make certain that the array is mounted perpendicular to the azimuth the stations signal is traveling? Or just get it good enough. I'm looking into building one and some people look like they just mount which ever way is convenient. Thx
Thanks for your question Tom. This antenna works best when it faces the direction of the broadcast tower. Keep in mind that this is a UHF antenna. If you have any VHF stations in your area, I posted a video covering that topic and you might be able to pick those up as well.
Thx for the clarification. However, I thought this was a VHF antenna, as you described at 3:48. I've already been pointed to tvfool and found it very informative. Regardless, I appreciate the video and your ideas. Thx again.
Thanks Tom. To put it humbly, I'm learning as I go and posting what I know. Good luck with your antenna. Let me know how it works out. :)
Michael sweetie just to let you know you cannot get HD from an over the air antenna!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If space is not an issue Would you choose to make the elements at one full wavelength? Might that improve reception ?
Full wavelength works well for UHF. Unfortunately, the longer the elements get, the more loss it causes on the UHF side. That is, if your goal is to bring in a VHF station. In this video, I demonstrate with RF 13 only because it is the only hard-to-get station in my area. If you are trying to get a VHF station, you might find the video "VHF Add-On" useful. here's the link: ruclips.net/video/xuqHrONy0b8/видео.html
note: full wavelength hurts UHF reception here as well.
Thanks for your question Jeff and best of luck :)
Im in east vancouver canada trying to get kvos from Washington state
Do these type of antennas work for 2 or more Tv's?
George Reyes I have a separate antenna for each tv in my house. More than one tv causes signal loss but if your stations are real close and they come in real well, it may not matter as long as you get the stations you want.
Can feed multiple TVs, may require a distribution amplifier but easy to add one.
They are 470 mhz so i figure 12.625 inches per side.
So 28 and an eighth. How wide is the antenna ?
bunny
The width depends on the frequency you’re building it for. What channel are you trying to get?
Im trying for uhf 470mhz .
bunny
These 28” elements will be bent in half so the entire width will be less than 28”. Hope this helps. :)
didn't show how to build it,
Click the "i" icon on the top right for the tutorial video :)
I made bowtie antenna using some measurments i got from another video. The bowtie sections are about 5 to 6 inches apart and the "whiskers" are 8 inches long. I got a total of seven channels with the farthest being 38 miles away. The antenna was inside. The channels I was after are about 50 miles away. How do you determine the distance between elements when you change the length of them? is it important? From your formula i need about 10.25 inch whiskers. but dont see how to space them or the distance I would need at the tips. If i were to try a fractal is the whisker length the total length of the wire or the distance from the root to the tip not counting the fractal bends? Thanks
Great job bro.too much a phyics for me.u should have demo.it
At 3:26 you are showing 1/2 λ but you are saying "at quarter length". What gives Mike?!