No, they won´t become the new meta. Why? Because the player needs to put in DOUBLE amount of effort during high difficult missions to pull the effects off in comparison of simply performing gun strikes with fencing weapons.
@eneveasi the only thing i kind of wish the block would do is keep everything the same, but instead of 3 stacks for the adrenaline surge if they lowered it to 2 stacks that would make all the difference. 2 armor back and a massive damage hit + aoe every 2 perfect blocks would be really good
Block Thunderhammer is already assault meta. The higher weapon damage on it is huge. not to mention the fact the block damage buff stack work on the aerial slam.
I was definitely in the camp of sleeping on the block combat knife, but honestly after trying it out I have to say its’s ridiculously “underrated” and overall an insanely solid option. Only downside I’d say is being unable to stagger with gun strikes from weapons that can parry, but regardless I’d recommend giving it an honest shot. Edit: Blocking weapons are also kinda a nice way to practice perfect dodges as well to get off those severely missed gun strikes.
Have fun with your perfect dodges when you are forced to fight in cramped locations instead of wide plazas. Fencing weapons and gun strikes still rule this game.
Block is interesting but it's far from aggressive. If the enemy is attacking, you pretty much have to wait it out. Only parry forces the openings with it's stagger and knockback.
Not necessarily, the parry forces openings sooner because you only need to parry to give you the knock back, which can be 1 or 2 parries. But the block forces openings after you get the 3 stacks. The aoe explosion that it does has a really wide radius. If you want to see an example of this, i have a highlight reel of me doing the adrenaline surge on lethal on my shorts. It's the one titled "block weapon explosion."
I use block with Vanguard, assault and sniper. Not many do bc it has a much higher risk v reward. Yeah it is much riskier, but if you can do it the reward is a much faster kill time. I like it personally. The melee flows better, and you don't have the risk of getting staggered/sniped mid gun strike. I do agree block will not be the new meta though. For most folks who don't have the free time to play a lot parry is much much better. It is always amusing when someone sees the block explosion and wants to know how I did it.
I use block chainsword on vangaurd in lethal ops regularly and i hardly ever have problems completing lethal missions. It takes some getting used to but once you're used to the block timing i feel its even safer than parry >gunstrike. The gunstrike animation has gotten me killled often when I'm gunstriking with multiple majoris around.
I'm still rough with Blocking weapons mainly because, of the 3 main factors, why I like Parry weapons, Stun, Push back and Survivability. Fencing weapons stun enemies, stopping combos. Say you fighting a Whip Tyranid Warrior. It ussually does a 5 strike combo, Blue Mark Combo, timed right, you block the first hit and the 2nd hit will stun the Enemy, even if it wasn't aimed at you you can go in and parry it and stop it from hurting your teammate. For a Block weapon you have to Defend against all 5 swings. When you do a Parry, Enemies are pushed back, Blocking weapons do not. Example, a normal Tyranid Warrior comes at you its one two swing, say a Second Tyranid Warrior comes at you from the side. With a Fencing, you stop the first hit, and if the 2nd TW is close enough, it also staggers and falls back, If the 2nd TW is not close enough to be stunned, you have enough timing to block the 2nd TW attack, which will extend the first TW's stun. With a Blocking weapon you will have to handle all 3 strikes and likely then sum without any straight means to retaliate. This also effects swarms, so if you have a lot of ankle biters a TW comes in, you parry to TW, the swarm will give you space, but for blocking the ankle biters will still keep biting. Which leads to survivability to me, because all that stuff cumulate together making Parry very manageable aggressive weapons, cause even if you don't take a gunstrike, it gives you enough breathing room to do what ever you like, and along with how Minoris enemies you parry will die instantly and give 1 armor point, you can form a flow that keeps you in the middle of a fight and having max armor. While Blocking, is far more passive for the most part, it struggles more in the middle of a swarm. A single Block isn't going to give you 3 stacks, a block isn't going to give you breathing room. I had to force myself to stay our of big fights especially when I tried it on tactical, because it is so hard to stay up with it, and had to play far more Passive.
@deckire i mostly agree with you except your second point. I found that the block performs the best when multiple warriors are coming in at you because it's easier to get the 3 stacks of block. Since there are more attacks to block you can get 3 stacks and then retaliate with a single attack which does insane damage to the target you hit because you have 3 stacks of melee damage buff + a stronger weapon and it does a massive aoe which stuns everything around you and gives you back 2 armor. Also, i found that if you get a 3 stack buff hit off, that hit will put whatever target you hit into execute, so now you can execute and be safe from the execution animation. In that same situation, if you parry and then gunstrike by mistake, you're in a lot of trouble because you're locked into the animation. In those situations i found that i have to keep parrying until i have an opening to gunstrike or i have to keep dodging until i have room to do the gunstrike. With block i can just attack once i have 3 stacks and it will stop everyone and give me an execute.
@@Bigborian92783 this is true, if you accidently do a gunstrike, yeah this hits hard, can't be trigger happy with parry. But on the flip side, to me it is the same thing with Blocking, If you are too aggressive thinking about Fencing weapons, on the Blocking, you can instead be hit twice. THis happened to me once by mistake, Fought three Tyranid warriors, I thought I was using my Fending Chainsword, and found out oops, it is my blocking, blocked the first strike, not the 2nd, which lead to the other two taking swings at me, there attacks were so off tempo from each other, I had no opening, to strike back, which ultimately got me pinned and knocked down. If I had my fencing weapon, I could have knocked back 2 TW, with my first parry, giving me enough time to push forward in melee, dodging the 3rd TW as I fight. If I had had accidently done my gun strike, and got hit by the 3rd, I atleast pushed back the first two TWs and had time to recover.
@deckire oh there is a little trick if you miss parry or block timing. If you hold the dodge button and then block again it resets the animation instantly so that you can parry/block a following whip or other attack.
block pretty garbage compared to fencing honestly, the only way i can see it being good is if it gave you life steal or health, the only classes that can use them safely is the vanguard or the bulwurk, just forwared + parry for bulwurk to not shield block
On vangaurd because his starting perk allows for more contested health regen from melee attacks its kind of like a pseudo "life steal". It at least restores your contested health back pretty quick especially if you're using the block weapon since it does quite a bit more damage. Also the chainsword has a perk in it that also increases contested health regen for all the heavy attacks by 100%. It won't save you from an enraged tyranid shooting the spine gun at you or a sniper shot but it will allow you to regen all your health if you're being chipped down by minoris while attacking a majoris.
I only got the game a month ago, or so in my apparent naivety I only chose block weapons because I saw more damage. I can clear everything just fine and carry my team more often than not. It seems like a skill issue for people complaining. The repetitive gun strike is boring, for me killing things faster is better survivability.
Blocking version of the thunder hammer is amazing. Highly recommend using the perk that recharges jump pack when used for a perfect dodge, personally I have found this to be an excellent substitute for generating gun strikes defensively. That said not having the knock back and gun strike loop from a perfect parry can feel jarring and that can be a major pain point while learning block weapons in general. I would like to see the devs tweak how long you retain adrenaline charges as it does feel annoying to build up 3 charges before they wear off in some situations. Adapt and overcome brothers.
I personally like using it, it kind of follows the philosophy that the best defense is a great offense. If you use it right, you can destroy enemies very quickly with them, leading to near instant executions. Learning how to reliably perfect dodge helps a lot, especially with that recent dodge patch. The problem is that people are very reliant on parry for armor and gun strikes. I think many people are comfortable with that and experimenting with block usually frustrates them because they don't want/can't change their whole playstyle for block. I've been using it on Ruthless and Lethal with great success, but I don't see it becoming as popular as fencing anytime soon.
Something that I think went unmentioned in the video (or if it did I didn't catch it) is that you can parry the basic attacks of minoris enemmies to get armor back. Gaunts and Tzaangors' regular stabs can be parried, not just the telegraphed lunges, which instantly kills the minoris as well as giving you an armor segment back. That is yet another thing you lose when using block weapons. Right now the damage bonuses simply don't offset the survivability issues on most classes. My suggestion was to make it so it can block the unparriable (red) attacks instead of forcing you to dodge. It would make block a pretty strong contender against terminus enemies and things like whip/bone Warriors edit: and those stupid Tzaangor Enlightened disc attacks.
@dracses4529 in my opinion, that would be way overpowered. A lot of the orange attacks are supposed to be things that you should not reasonably be able to block. For example, should we be able to block a carnifex charging at you? Or the hive tyrant for that matter? Those are orange attacks. Also, if you can block orange attacks, the hive tyrant boss would be kind of a joke. You could just stand in front of him and just block everything he does. Also, i believe the green pulse waves that the neurothropes and hive tyrant do are also orange attacks. It would be weird to block those with a weapon as it's not really physical. It's some sort of psyker energy attack. Also, for chaos, almost all of their attacks are orange attacks, but they are supposed to be unblockable. The flaming circle thing doesn't make sense to be able to block with a weapon. The only orange attacks that might be reasonable for block weapons to block would be the whip warrior dragging you to him attack and the dual sword warriors double sword attack. But if those were the only things block could block, it would be a rather insignificant buff. Since those are not too difficult to dodge and especially in the case of the whip one, if you get dragged by it you get a basically free parry or block after since he tried to hit you with his sword immediately after.
I tried out a blocking power fist last night to try and get the strongest cannon punch I could do. The problem is two things: one, you can't parry to get a gun strike, which can regen armor even if you don't kill for some classes. And two, you have to be johnny perfect with the block to stack the damage buff. And you've got to do it thrice for it to be worth it, which is incredibly hard to do when you're being swarmed. I was blocking attacks, but wasn't stacking the damage buff - I feel like they need to change that. If I block the damage, give me the buff.
Are you referring to the artificer block version? The Relic version is the weakest. If you ever need to practice. Equip your block power fist and que to trial 2.
@warriorfire8103 That may be it also. I only have the purple power fist. I do feel like the best move is to dash or dodge into attack to get the cannon punch. You can always gun strike a minor afterward and it does decent AoE.
Currently 10hrs in. Lvl 10 on sniper and struggling a bit to keep up. I play private on substantial difficulty atm. Feels like I often times can’t really stand my ground and get overwhelmed a lot. I upgraded some gear, does this get better over time? I feel like I play melee too much and the knife is not rlly made for it. The LAS-rifle feels strong but when there are too many enemies, I tend to die. Game for sure is hard but I’m definitely down to chew through this steep learning curve. I feel like a lot boils down to knowing when to use what in different types of situations, experience is king! Anyways thx for reading, tips are always welcome.
You will steadily learn more about the game the more you play it. Just being comfortable countering certain combos goes a long way with Sniper. Just takes practice and a lot of trial and error lol!
@Raven_Sol if you like to play closer up with Sniper, i would recommend looking at CQC sniper build. I have the most success with that build, and I've carried lethal clears and have done some solo lethals with that build. I play on console, so i also struggled with getting swarmed by minoris and dying after running out of las fusil ammo. I feel like the sniper rifle builds you kind of need a mouse to make sure you're getting all headshots. Las fusil is super inefficient if you're not hitting the head. Cqc with the newly buffed bolt carbine is really strong and getting swarmed is no problem with it.
I may use Fencing/balanced more aggressively then most. The enemy AI is designed to attack more if you're attacking. So generally speaking if you want more parry/block chances, attack more.
I’m currently trying the block chain sword on vanguard, I’m really struggling with it, it seems sometimes the block animation bugs out, and I find my self getting stun locked a lot and then dying. I’m persevering with it just for the challenge but so far I think I prefer parry
The artificer version is wayyyy faster if you want to give it a try. Equipping your fav block chainsword on tactical and starting trial 1 is a great way to practice and test too
The perfect block window is slightly sooner than the parry window. You have to be in the block position when the attack hits you instead of in the parry animation. I was confused at first myself because i was used to the parry timing. So basically you have to wait just a split second before you would normally parry. Although the duelist perk on vangaurd should help out with this.
Hahaha blocking is no where near as effective as parrying. Blocking will not be meta until there is adequate way to metagate damage and control hordes. Blocking isnt fun. If ut was then it would already be part of the meta. While it may work for certain classes it really isnt ideal for any class. The data shows blocking isnt perfect in any way.
Only tried blocking weapons once with green chain sword ruthless with level 15 vangaurd and died at the end by my mistake got stun locked twice for two deaths
It’s not in a bad place at the moment but it could be better. A few changes that would improve it 1) getting armour and adrenaline after 2 perfect blocks instead of 3 2) allow perfect blocks of un-telegraphed minoris attacks to kill them and restore armour just like blue pings. Ideally there would also be a slight stun around you when you get your two perfect blocks to prevent the situation where you need to block multiple attacks from multiple enemies where one mistake means punishment. This would also help with setting off the adrenaline surge effect as enemies would be briefly stunned and can’t dodge away
@BasSine_Studio i think it really only needs the first change. 2 perfect blocks gives you the adrenaline surge aoe. I'd say even keep the max at 3 but allow 2 perfect blocks to have the same adenaline surge just that the 2 stack one won't hit as hard as the 3 stack one because it doesn't have 3 stacks of buff on it.
Block will be meta for some classes, but not the ones the reditor was talking about. Tactical with a plasma incinerator and a fencing weapon has treated me well. Not looking to switch that up at all.
I would've been more okay with blocking weapons if the blocking mechanic would immediately activate upon successfully achieving three perfect blocks rather than having to figure out when to use that "adrenaline surge". Sometimes, you get robbed of being able to pop it off for a number of reasons and, it just feels like more work and doesn't it incentivize players from using it as often, so it's better to just be extremely aggressive than to block at that point. Still has a bit of reworking to do but, it's heading in the right direction I think!
The only thing i wish for block weapons is to let you do the aoe attack adrenaline surge after 2 perfect blocks instead of 3. Currently i can only get 3 on the whip tyranid warriors and the raveners and sometimes the dual sword warriors (they have an attack sequence where they do 3 attacks). A lot of the enemies in the game only do 2 attacks. The block weapons do significantly more damage which is really good but i just wish i could get the adrenaline surge burst more often. In team games i basically have to be fighting a whip warrior solo in order to get the 3 stack or be surrounded by a lot of melee warriors to get the 3 stacks when they come in at me 2 or 3 at a time. If they did nothing else to block weapons except just let the aoe burst attack go after 2 stacks vs 3 i think this would put block weapons on par or maybe even slightly edge out fencing and balance weapons. After 2 perfect blocks you get an attack that restores 2 armor and does aoe damage and massive damage to the target you hit. It would be great and not overpowered. They could even keep the 3 stacks as max but allow the minimum number of stacks to release adrenaline surge to 2 stacks.
Blocking is pretty fun, and I quite like it on assault, though I haven't got to the team gunstrike perk yet. Just got the armour for gunstrike perk, so haven't tried that one either. Yet 🙂 Vanguard was still better with fencing, by breaking combos and stunning effect of gunstrikes, against Tyranids anyways. Good point about chaos mostly doing less melee, even less when parrying I'm fairly sure, I should try the blocking chainsword next time I do a chaos op! Also, love how Ultramarines colours are 'Space Marine' colours 💙
I feel he'd have a better point it most of the block weapons didn't have great base stats. The relic block chainsword has 15 damage, ok speed and cleave for example.
@@servalkorion686he was being polite to you knuckle draggers and you still have to say "skill issue". I'm sure you're the best random in your squad on substantial tho, champ ;)
I dont play assault so take my opinion for what it is 😅. But i played a lethal fall of atreus with a friend that used assault with block thunder hammer and when a chaos group would warp in he would fly up in the air and wait for them to spawn and then smash the whole group and i consistently saw him put all the majoris that spawned in, into execute with one slam. It was pretty crazy damage.
Block Vanguard is really good. But on all the other classes Fencing is still stronger than Block, but block is still viable on the other classes, it's just not the absolute strongest.
I want to start off by saying that I love your videos and I watch them daily. You are extremely fun to watch and I am glad I found your channel! Block should go from 3 to 2. Idea for block rework was pretty solid but execution of it should have been better. Saber is making a lot of mistakes that they already made in WWZ. Prestige system that is coming is likely going to be the same as in WWZ, you reset your level for either awful new perk or a very mediocre one. They need to rework a lot of the perks to make them actually useful and provide more variety in choosing your builds. So far we have what? Gunstrike builds and/or melee focused build, depending on what you play. The exact same problem that is still present to this day in their previous game, they didn't learn despite our continuous requests and showcases with videos and explanations of what is wrong/why it is wrong and how it should change. Another thing they are really bad at is bug fixing and the speed with which they approach issues in games. They tend to be very, very slow with updates (especially bug fixes, which are very important) and when they do attempt a bug fix they usually either don't fix it or introduce several more bugs in it's place. As example, WWZ launched almost 6 years ago with invisible swarm bug (you die to nothing, before the swarm even spawns) and it is still present in the game. We have complained about it, we have showcased it with videos since the game's launch and they still didn't fix it. That is just one of the many, many bugs they didn't address in 6 whole years. The bots? If you prefer solo or have no friends to play with/match making ends in frequent disconnects then you are out of luck. You will do maps with bots that do absolutely nothing. You are soloing 3 man difficulty. Soloing is a punishment in this game instead of being an alternative way of playing, due to issues mentioned. Will they ever make bots less than straight up useless? We can hope, but it won't happen because saber is very bad at addressing issues that are supposed to make the game feel better to play which sucks.
I wished blocking gave an armor segment for each adrenaline stack. Still 3 stacks and AoE explosion apply at 3. Parrying does too much compared to nlock imo. Beyond that, block bulwark would f**k hard going full nova
Commenting before watching the whole video. The only class i still use fencing on is bulwark. Tactical, Assault, and Vangaurd i use block. Sniper i use the balance knife. I think block is in a great place
Man, I really don't get some of these people in the comments. No block probably wont become meta. But block weapons are absolutely viable and its showing that a ton of people havent given block weapons a chance. I run it on tactical and vanguard all the time. The block chainsword is insane and if you havent been relying on the fencing timing and actually paying attention its easy enough to get the hang of. I cant get thr block thunder hammer to work for me. And that is a huge bummer. The knife and chainsword variants are amazing but for some reason the thunder hammer just fucks with me.
At high levels your survivability as Assault without a parry weapon goes down heavily. Being able to parry minoris enemies is great. with that being said anything and everything can work. just gotta get gud. the initial damage on block weapons is great.
I played blocking sword on vanguard for more dmg, so yes no stacks, but I also enjoyed getting armor back from minoris using powermode and then getting more melee dmg on the fast sword mode. Just lvl 9, but will try fencing sword in order to get relic sword 😊
The damage you get from gun strikes cannot be outdone by a blocking weapon...full stop. If you disagree with that, you're not playing the "parry + gun strike" meta right. Even with the adrenaline mechanic. And if you're on a Bulwark, forget about it. Parry damage back AoEs alongside a gun strike destroys. Assault gets the 50% gun strike damage perk, which basically means you're going to 2-parry any majoris to death. Those are the only two "melee classes" in the game. They don't get a primary range. Also, armor back? More survivability means longer uptime. Longer uptime means more DPS (potentially...if you're still able to hit your target). Is it viable? Sure. I use the blocking Thunder Hammer all the time because it's fun. Is it comparable to the meta? Absolutely not.
I find it to be much more difficult without the control in the fight that parry gives. That being said, it's a welcome mechanic that is worth trying to get some more perspective on how to approach fights, if nothing else. It's markedly more difficult to control the battle field for some builds without the parry, fair enough to those that don't like it, never mind the timing changes v parry. Frankly I've been mainlining the block since the update. I got so damn bored with parry, block is fun. Remember fun, guys?
@@warriorfire8103 Both systems can force openings, with full adrenaline charges you can stagger the hive tyrant, raged nids, I would expect a helbrute but don't quote me on it. Being able to knock around anything on the screen at your behest is really sweet, but ya, it's not always easy to get the charges with the timing differences from block to parry. I particularly find the minoris to be the hardest to handle with block. I don't know what he means by the waiting. I know for me I would catch myself kind of standing around waiting for a parry to come around to open a fight. Majoris I would prefer to take out with the parry and gun strike rather than just...hitting them. The parry system kind of incentivized me to focus on that as the focal point of the combat, instead of actually wailing on nids and stuff at every chance. Both have arguments for aggressive gameplay, but with block it feels like you're block is focused around the attack rather than the other way.
@@ianhebert91 I may use Fencing more aggressively then most. The enemy AI is designed to attack more if you're attacking. So generally speaking if you want more parry/block chances, attack more.
@@warriorfire8103 I wondered about that, it felt like it. That certainly plays into the block feeling more aggressive in my case since I do attack more. Honestly if they just increased the block window size, I bet more people would dig it. Learning attack patterns from majoris and such to refine the timings is kind of try hard. Especially compared to parry.
You cant fire at the head of four majoris enemies at once while trying to block their random timed attacks from multiole directions and think you are gonna be okay
Bruh vanguards get health on majoris and above executions which is op as hell during runs and you are thr last brother standing i have saved my team so many times with that perk.
Thats why the only classes its safe to play with randoms are Bulwark and Vanguard since they can both reset their health pools, dont need stims, and can DPS forever w/o ammo (except for the god damned fliers).
Block will stay mostly unused when parry+gun strike does shit tons of free damage for zero effort. When they made parry require *some* timing, people absolutely lost their shit cause they didnt have a spammable "i win" button anymore which as about as much strategy as 80% of the player base can comprehend. I would love for parry+GunStrike to retain its AoE CC but have its damage gutted. This would give you the choice between safe, easy, effortless parries and terrible dps, or risky, difficult, effort-intensive blocks with god-tier dps. Balanced as always splits the difference, as they are a tiny bit harder to parry with, but the melee attacks hit harder. If you leave in a super effective, zero effort option thats the only thing people will use. I even still use fencing when Im not solo because it is way *way* overtuned damage wise and your personal feelings dont matter in a squad. Either you do the most effective thing you can 100% of the time or you are throwing.
Nah. Way to slow. In the middle of 1 swing you lose all health on ruthless and lethal. The speed attribute is stupid really. It's not like the size and weight change of the melee weapon
If anyone is ever looking to get really REALLY mid at SM2 I'll be sure to refer them to your channel. The only thing worse than your opinions are those awkward giggles you punctuate everything with.
![Noob To Max With DRAGON REWORK In Blox Fruits [FULL MOVIE]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/LnBMOinoOvA/mqdefault.jpg)
No, they won´t become the new meta. Why? Because the player needs to put in DOUBLE amount of effort during high difficult missions to pull the effects off in comparison of simply performing gun strikes with fencing weapons.
If perfect blocks start giving armor back then they could become the meta
@@eneveasiI like that idea
@eneveasi the only thing i kind of wish the block would do is keep everything the same, but instead of 3 stacks for the adrenaline surge if they lowered it to 2 stacks that would make all the difference. 2 armor back and a massive damage hit + aoe every 2 perfect blocks would be really good
Block Thunderhammer is already assault meta. The higher weapon damage on it is huge. not to mention the fact the block damage buff stack work on the aerial slam.
Skill issue not a weapon issue
I was definitely in the camp of sleeping on the block combat knife, but honestly after trying it out I have to say its’s ridiculously “underrated” and overall an insanely solid option. Only downside I’d say is being unable to stagger with gun strikes from weapons that can parry, but regardless I’d recommend giving it an honest shot. Edit: Blocking weapons are also kinda a nice way to practice perfect dodges as well to get off those severely missed gun strikes.
Definitely! I tried it recently as well and really enjoyed it. It takes a bit to get used to blocking but once you get enough time in you can shred!
Have fun with your perfect dodges when you are forced to fight in cramped locations instead of wide plazas. Fencing weapons and gun strikes still rule this game.
Block is interesting but it's far from aggressive.
If the enemy is attacking, you pretty much have to wait it out. Only parry forces the openings with it's stagger and knockback.
Not necessarily, the parry forces openings sooner because you only need to parry to give you the knock back, which can be 1 or 2 parries. But the block forces openings after you get the 3 stacks. The aoe explosion that it does has a really wide radius.
If you want to see an example of this, i have a highlight reel of me doing the adrenaline surge on lethal on my shorts. It's the one titled "block weapon explosion."
@@warriorfire8103 oh Nappa lol you're in the same discord as me
@@Bigborian92783 most likely proclaiming my love of power fist
@warriorfire8103 yea i just asked you about your powerfist stuff 🤣
nope and in operations no one uses them in reality they don't make sense the reduced survivability is too much of a penalty
exactly. Viable? Yes or Maybe? Optimal? Nowhere near optimal so that I would even consider it as an alternative
It’s a skill gap not mindless parry spamming
I use block with Vanguard, assault and sniper. Not many do bc it has a much higher risk v reward. Yeah it is much riskier, but if you can do it the reward is a much faster kill time. I like it personally. The melee flows better, and you don't have the risk of getting staggered/sniped mid gun strike.
I do agree block will not be the new meta though. For most folks who don't have the free time to play a lot parry is much much better. It is always amusing when someone sees the block explosion and wants to know how I did it.
Block is all I use.
I use block chainsword on vangaurd in lethal ops regularly and i hardly ever have problems completing lethal missions. It takes some getting used to but once you're used to the block timing i feel its even safer than parry >gunstrike. The gunstrike animation has gotten me killled often when I'm gunstriking with multiple majoris around.
Vanguard with the 10% health regen after every major kill. And the 50 perfect block increase. And the melee damage increase can substain lethal well
I'm still rough with Blocking weapons mainly because, of the 3 main factors, why I like Parry weapons, Stun, Push back and Survivability.
Fencing weapons stun enemies, stopping combos. Say you fighting a Whip Tyranid Warrior. It ussually does a 5 strike combo, Blue Mark Combo, timed right, you block the first hit and the 2nd hit will stun the Enemy, even if it wasn't aimed at you you can go in and parry it and stop it from hurting your teammate. For a Block weapon you have to Defend against all 5 swings.
When you do a Parry, Enemies are pushed back, Blocking weapons do not. Example, a normal Tyranid Warrior comes at you its one two swing, say a Second Tyranid Warrior comes at you from the side. With a Fencing, you stop the first hit, and if the 2nd TW is close enough, it also staggers and falls back, If the 2nd TW is not close enough to be stunned, you have enough timing to block the 2nd TW attack, which will extend the first TW's stun. With a Blocking weapon you will have to handle all 3 strikes and likely then sum without any straight means to retaliate. This also effects swarms, so if you have a lot of ankle biters a TW comes in, you parry to TW, the swarm will give you space, but for blocking the ankle biters will still keep biting.
Which leads to survivability to me, because all that stuff cumulate together making Parry very manageable aggressive weapons, cause even if you don't take a gunstrike, it gives you enough breathing room to do what ever you like, and along with how Minoris enemies you parry will die instantly and give 1 armor point, you can form a flow that keeps you in the middle of a fight and having max armor. While Blocking, is far more passive for the most part, it struggles more in the middle of a swarm. A single Block isn't going to give you 3 stacks, a block isn't going to give you breathing room. I had to force myself to stay our of big fights especially when I tried it on tactical, because it is so hard to stay up with it, and had to play far more Passive.
@deckire i mostly agree with you except your second point. I found that the block performs the best when multiple warriors are coming in at you because it's easier to get the 3 stacks of block. Since there are more attacks to block you can get 3 stacks and then retaliate with a single attack which does insane damage to the target you hit because you have 3 stacks of melee damage buff + a stronger weapon and it does a massive aoe which stuns everything around you and gives you back 2 armor.
Also, i found that if you get a 3 stack buff hit off, that hit will put whatever target you hit into execute, so now you can execute and be safe from the execution animation.
In that same situation, if you parry and then gunstrike by mistake, you're in a lot of trouble because you're locked into the animation. In those situations i found that i have to keep parrying until i have an opening to gunstrike or i have to keep dodging until i have room to do the gunstrike. With block i can just attack once i have 3 stacks and it will stop everyone and give me an execute.
@@Bigborian92783 this is true, if you accidently do a gunstrike, yeah this hits hard, can't be trigger happy with parry.
But on the flip side, to me it is the same thing with Blocking, If you are too aggressive thinking about Fencing weapons, on the Blocking, you can instead be hit twice.
THis happened to me once by mistake, Fought three Tyranid warriors, I thought I was using my Fending Chainsword, and found out oops, it is my blocking, blocked the first strike, not the 2nd, which lead to the other two taking swings at me, there attacks were so off tempo from each other, I had no opening, to strike back, which ultimately got me pinned and knocked down.
If I had my fencing weapon, I could have knocked back 2 TW, with my first parry, giving me enough time to push forward in melee, dodging the 3rd TW as I fight. If I had had accidently done my gun strike, and got hit by the 3rd, I atleast pushed back the first two TWs and had time to recover.
@deckire oh there is a little trick if you miss parry or block timing. If you hold the dodge button and then block again it resets the animation instantly so that you can parry/block a following whip or other attack.
block pretty garbage compared to fencing honestly, the only way i can see it being good is if it gave you life steal or health, the only classes that can use them safely is the vanguard or the bulwurk, just forwared + parry for bulwurk to not shield block
On vangaurd because his starting perk allows for more contested health regen from melee attacks its kind of like a pseudo "life steal". It at least restores your contested health back pretty quick especially if you're using the block weapon since it does quite a bit more damage. Also the chainsword has a perk in it that also increases contested health regen for all the heavy attacks by 100%.
It won't save you from an enraged tyranid shooting the spine gun at you or a sniper shot but it will allow you to regen all your health if you're being chipped down by minoris while attacking a majoris.
I only got the game a month ago, or so in my apparent naivety I only chose block weapons because I saw more damage. I can clear everything just fine and carry my team more often than not. It seems like a skill issue for people complaining. The repetitive gun strike is boring, for me killing things faster is better survivability.
Blocking version of the thunder hammer is amazing. Highly recommend using the perk that recharges jump pack when used for a perfect dodge, personally I have found this to be an excellent substitute for generating gun strikes defensively. That said not having the knock back and gun strike loop from a perfect parry can feel jarring and that can be a major pain point while learning block weapons in general. I would like to see the devs tweak how long you retain adrenaline charges as it does feel annoying to build up 3 charges before they wear off in some situations. Adapt and overcome brothers.
I thought you only could use the jetpack in a dash too dodge with that perk.
@ negative. You can use the jump pack for dodge/dash and to jump regardless of perk choices.
So for hell of it I'm going to equip Block Power Sword, que up Trial 3 for about 10 minutes and see how far I can push it. Edit: didn't work out
I personally like using it, it kind of follows the philosophy that the best defense is a great offense. If you use it right, you can destroy enemies very quickly with them, leading to near instant executions. Learning how to reliably perfect dodge helps a lot, especially with that recent dodge patch.
The problem is that people are very reliant on parry for armor and gun strikes. I think many people are comfortable with that and experimenting with block usually frustrates them because they don't want/can't change their whole playstyle for block.
I've been using it on Ruthless and Lethal with great success, but I don't see it becoming as popular as fencing anytime soon.
Something that I think went unmentioned in the video (or if it did I didn't catch it) is that you can parry the basic attacks of minoris enemmies to get armor back. Gaunts and Tzaangors' regular stabs can be parried, not just the telegraphed lunges, which instantly kills the minoris as well as giving you an armor segment back. That is yet another thing you lose when using block weapons. Right now the damage bonuses simply don't offset the survivability issues on most classes.
My suggestion was to make it so it can block the unparriable (red) attacks instead of forcing you to dodge. It would make block a pretty strong contender against terminus enemies and things like whip/bone Warriors edit: and those stupid Tzaangor Enlightened disc attacks.
@dracses4529 in my opinion, that would be way overpowered. A lot of the orange attacks are supposed to be things that you should not reasonably be able to block. For example, should we be able to block a carnifex charging at you? Or the hive tyrant for that matter? Those are orange attacks. Also, if you can block orange attacks, the hive tyrant boss would be kind of a joke. You could just stand in front of him and just block everything he does.
Also, i believe the green pulse waves that the neurothropes and hive tyrant do are also orange attacks. It would be weird to block those with a weapon as it's not really physical. It's some sort of psyker energy attack.
Also, for chaos, almost all of their attacks are orange attacks, but they are supposed to be unblockable. The flaming circle thing doesn't make sense to be able to block with a weapon.
The only orange attacks that might be reasonable for block weapons to block would be the whip warrior dragging you to him attack and the dual sword warriors double sword attack. But if those were the only things block could block, it would be a rather insignificant buff. Since those are not too difficult to dodge and especially in the case of the whip one, if you get dragged by it you get a basically free parry or block after since he tried to hit you with his sword immediately after.
Blocking is already good in PvP. There's a lot more sword fights then game reviewers originally expected
I tried out a blocking power fist last night to try and get the strongest cannon punch I could do. The problem is two things: one, you can't parry to get a gun strike, which can regen armor even if you don't kill for some classes. And two, you have to be johnny perfect with the block to stack the damage buff. And you've got to do it thrice for it to be worth it, which is incredibly hard to do when you're being swarmed. I was blocking attacks, but wasn't stacking the damage buff - I feel like they need to change that. If I block the damage, give me the buff.
Are you referring to the artificer block version? The Relic version is the weakest.
If you ever need to practice. Equip your block power fist and que to trial 2.
@@warriorfire8103 nice insight, Nappa: Pokemon master.
@warriorfire8103 That may be it also. I only have the purple power fist.
I do feel like the best move is to dash or dodge into attack to get the cannon punch. You can always gun strike a minor afterward and it does decent AoE.
It has to be a perfect block for the adrenaline surge stack. A normal block doesn't give you the buff.
@@Bigborian92783 Right. That's lame.
Currently 10hrs in. Lvl 10 on sniper and struggling a bit to keep up. I play private on substantial difficulty atm. Feels like I often times can’t really stand my ground and get overwhelmed a lot. I upgraded some gear, does this get better over time? I feel like I play melee too much and the knife is not rlly made for it. The LAS-rifle feels strong but when there are too many enemies, I tend to die. Game for sure is hard but I’m definitely down to chew through this steep learning curve. I feel like a lot boils down to knowing when to use what in different types of situations, experience is king! Anyways thx for reading, tips are always welcome.
You will steadily learn more about the game the more you play it. Just being comfortable countering certain combos goes a long way with Sniper. Just takes practice and a lot of trial and error lol!
You shouldn’t really be playing substantial yet imho. Drop down to average until you have a full set of purple gear and are around level 15
@Raven_Sol if you like to play closer up with Sniper, i would recommend looking at CQC sniper build. I have the most success with that build, and I've carried lethal clears and have done some solo lethals with that build. I play on console, so i also struggled with getting swarmed by minoris and dying after running out of las fusil ammo.
I feel like the sniper rifle builds you kind of need a mouse to make sure you're getting all headshots. Las fusil is super inefficient if you're not hitting the head.
Cqc with the newly buffed bolt carbine is really strong and getting swarmed is no problem with it.
I may use Fencing/balanced more aggressively then most. The enemy AI is designed to attack more if you're attacking. So generally speaking if you want more parry/block chances, attack more.
I’m currently trying the block chain sword on vanguard, I’m really struggling with it, it seems sometimes the block animation bugs out, and I find my self getting stun locked a lot and then dying. I’m persevering with it just for the challenge but so far I think I prefer parry
The artificer version is wayyyy faster if you want to give it a try.
Equipping your fav block chainsword on tactical and starting trial 1 is a great way to practice and test too
The perfect block window is slightly sooner than the parry window. You have to be in the block position when the attack hits you instead of in the parry animation.
I was confused at first myself because i was used to the parry timing. So basically you have to wait just a split second before you would normally parry. Although the duelist perk on vangaurd should help out with this.
Hahaha blocking is no where near as effective as parrying. Blocking will not be meta until there is adequate way to metagate damage and control hordes. Blocking isnt fun. If ut was then it would already be part of the meta. While it may work for certain classes it really isnt ideal for any class. The data shows blocking isnt perfect in any way.
Blocking is for higher skilled players who can consistantly get perfect timing. Otherwise, parrying is the safest option.
Blocking is for greedy players who want more damage but instead will only find an early grave.
The only class they don't work for is the heavy class...
People were mad about the blocking update because they nerfed fencing weapons at the same time.
Only tried blocking weapons once with green chain sword ruthless with level 15 vangaurd and died at the end by my mistake got stun locked twice for two deaths
It’s not in a bad place at the moment but it could be better.
A few changes that would improve it
1) getting armour and adrenaline after 2 perfect blocks instead of 3
2) allow perfect blocks of un-telegraphed minoris attacks to kill them and restore armour just like blue pings.
Ideally there would also be a slight stun around you when you get your two perfect blocks to prevent the situation where you need to block multiple attacks from multiple enemies where one mistake means punishment. This would also help with setting off the adrenaline surge effect as enemies would be briefly stunned and can’t dodge away
@BasSine_Studio i think it really only needs the first change. 2 perfect blocks gives you the adrenaline surge aoe. I'd say even keep the max at 3 but allow 2 perfect blocks to have the same adenaline surge just that the 2 stack one won't hit as hard as the 3 stack one because it doesn't have 3 stacks of buff on it.
Block will be meta for some classes, but not the ones the reditor was talking about. Tactical with a plasma incinerator and a fencing weapon has treated me well. Not looking to switch that up at all.
LOL!! “Yeertski SMASH!” I lost it!
What music is playing in the backround?? Tge ambience sounds really cool
1:50 If you're on Ps5 you can parry as bulwark if you double tap the button.
I would've been more okay with blocking weapons if the blocking mechanic would immediately activate upon successfully achieving three perfect blocks rather than having to figure out when to use that "adrenaline surge". Sometimes, you get robbed of being able to pop it off for a number of reasons and, it just feels like more work and doesn't it incentivize players from using it as often, so it's better to just be extremely aggressive than to block at that point. Still has a bit of reworking to do but, it's heading in the right direction I think!
The only thing i wish for block weapons is to let you do the aoe attack adrenaline surge after 2 perfect blocks instead of 3. Currently i can only get 3 on the whip tyranid warriors and the raveners and sometimes the dual sword warriors (they have an attack sequence where they do 3 attacks). A lot of the enemies in the game only do 2 attacks. The block weapons do significantly more damage which is really good but i just wish i could get the adrenaline surge burst more often.
In team games i basically have to be fighting a whip warrior solo in order to get the 3 stack or be surrounded by a lot of melee warriors to get the 3 stacks when they come in at me 2 or 3 at a time.
If they did nothing else to block weapons except just let the aoe burst attack go after 2 stacks vs 3 i think this would put block weapons on par or maybe even slightly edge out fencing and balance weapons. After 2 perfect blocks you get an attack that restores 2 armor and does aoe damage and massive damage to the target you hit. It would be great and not overpowered.
They could even keep the 3 stacks as max but allow the minimum number of stacks to release adrenaline surge to 2 stacks.
Blocking is pretty fun, and I quite like it on assault, though I haven't got to the team gunstrike perk yet. Just got the armour for gunstrike perk, so haven't tried that one either. Yet 🙂
Vanguard was still better with fencing, by breaking combos and stunning effect of gunstrikes, against Tyranids anyways. Good point about chaos mostly doing less melee, even less when parrying I'm fairly sure, I should try the blocking chainsword next time I do a chaos op!
Also, love how Ultramarines colours are 'Space Marine' colours 💙
I feel he'd have a better point it most of the block weapons didn't have great base stats. The relic block chainsword has 15 damage, ok speed and cleave for example.
Instead of having to get max stacks for 2 armor bars, why not just give a 1/3 of the armor on each stack? Still only do the explosion at max stacks.
Also only difficultty on solo is when two lictors and or the tunnel guys stun lock you or maybe other majoris stun lock.
I think Block weapons suck. Sorry I disagree so heavily, but I can Fence a crowd of Majoris and thrive with a knife, using block gets me killed.
Skill issue
try block combat knife on Vanguard
@@servalkorion686he was being polite to you knuckle draggers and you still have to say "skill issue". I'm sure you're the best random in your squad on substantial tho, champ ;)
I dont play assault so take my opinion for what it is 😅. But i played a lethal fall of atreus with a friend that used assault with block thunder hammer and when a chaos group would warp in he would fly up in the air and wait for them to spawn and then smash the whole group and i consistently saw him put all the majoris that spawned in, into execute with one slam. It was pretty crazy damage.
Block Vanguard is really good.
But on all the other classes Fencing is still stronger than Block, but block is still viable on the other classes, it's just not the absolute strongest.
I want to start off by saying that I love your videos and I watch them daily. You are extremely fun to watch and I am glad I found your channel!
Block should go from 3 to 2. Idea for block rework was pretty solid but execution of it should have been better. Saber is making a lot of mistakes that they already made in WWZ. Prestige system that is coming is likely going to be the same as in WWZ, you reset your level for either awful new perk or a very mediocre one. They need to rework a lot of the perks to make them actually useful and provide more variety in choosing your builds. So far we have what? Gunstrike builds and/or melee focused build, depending on what you play. The exact same problem that is still present to this day in their previous game, they didn't learn despite our continuous requests and showcases with videos and explanations of what is wrong/why it is wrong and how it should change.
Another thing they are really bad at is bug fixing and the speed with which they approach issues in games. They tend to be very, very slow with updates (especially bug fixes, which are very important) and when they do attempt a bug fix they usually either don't fix it or introduce several more bugs in it's place.
As example, WWZ launched almost 6 years ago with invisible swarm bug (you die to nothing, before the swarm even spawns) and it is still present in the game. We have complained about it, we have showcased it with videos since the game's launch and they still didn't fix it. That is just one of the many, many bugs they didn't address in 6 whole years.
The bots? If you prefer solo or have no friends to play with/match making ends in frequent disconnects then you are out of luck. You will do maps with bots that do absolutely nothing. You are soloing 3 man difficulty. Soloing is a punishment in this game instead of being an alternative way of playing, due to issues mentioned. Will they ever make bots less than straight up useless? We can hope, but it won't happen because saber is very bad at addressing issues that are supposed to make the game feel better to play which sucks.
I wished blocking gave an armor segment for each adrenaline stack. Still 3 stacks and AoE explosion apply at 3. Parrying does too much compared to nlock imo.
Beyond that, block bulwark would f**k hard going full nova
Assault with Block weapons is kinda a skill gap but so is Block in general. That’s why people don’t like them, it’s just a skill gap
If you ADS you won't trigger the gunstrike and save it for a second or two
Edit - I'm on PS5
Commenting before watching the whole video. The only class i still use fencing on is bulwark. Tactical, Assault, and Vangaurd i use block. Sniper i use the balance knife. I think block is in a great place
Man, I really don't get some of these people in the comments. No block probably wont become meta. But block weapons are absolutely viable and its showing that a ton of people havent given block weapons a chance. I run it on tactical and vanguard all the time. The block chainsword is insane and if you havent been relying on the fencing timing and actually paying attention its easy enough to get the hang of. I cant get thr block thunder hammer to work for me. And that is a huge bummer. The knife and chainsword variants are amazing but for some reason the thunder hammer just fucks with me.
At high levels your survivability as Assault without a parry weapon goes down heavily. Being able to parry minoris enemies is great. with that being said anything and everything can work. just gotta get gud. the initial damage on block weapons is great.
I played blocking sword on vanguard for more dmg, so yes no stacks, but I also enjoyed getting armor back from minoris using powermode and then getting more melee dmg on the fast sword mode.
Just lvl 9, but will try fencing sword in order to get relic sword 😊
The damage you get from gun strikes cannot be outdone by a blocking weapon...full stop. If you disagree with that, you're not playing the "parry + gun strike" meta right. Even with the adrenaline mechanic. And if you're on a Bulwark, forget about it. Parry damage back AoEs alongside a gun strike destroys.
Assault gets the 50% gun strike damage perk, which basically means you're going to 2-parry any majoris to death.
Those are the only two "melee classes" in the game. They don't get a primary range.
Also, armor back? More survivability means longer uptime. Longer uptime means more DPS (potentially...if you're still able to hit your target).
Is it viable? Sure. I use the blocking Thunder Hammer all the time because it's fun. Is it comparable to the meta? Absolutely not.
I find it to be much more difficult without the control in the fight that parry gives. That being said, it's a welcome mechanic that is worth trying to get some more perspective on how to approach fights, if nothing else. It's markedly more difficult to control the battle field for some builds without the parry, fair enough to those that don't like it, never mind the timing changes v parry.
Frankly I've been mainlining the block since the update. I got so damn bored with parry, block is fun. Remember fun, guys?
This is why I'm confused by him stating you have to wait with fencing. Why? Fencing forces the openings so you can keep bring aggressive
@@warriorfire8103 Both systems can force openings, with full adrenaline charges you can stagger the hive tyrant, raged nids, I would expect a helbrute but don't quote me on it. Being able to knock around anything on the screen at your behest is really sweet, but ya, it's not always easy to get the charges with the timing differences from block to parry. I particularly find the minoris to be the hardest to handle with block.
I don't know what he means by the waiting. I know for me I would catch myself kind of standing around waiting for a parry to come around to open a fight. Majoris I would prefer to take out with the parry and gun strike rather than just...hitting them. The parry system kind of incentivized me to focus on that as the focal point of the combat, instead of actually wailing on nids and stuff at every chance. Both have arguments for aggressive gameplay, but with block it feels like you're block is focused around the attack rather than the other way.
@@ianhebert91 I may use Fencing more aggressively then most. The enemy AI is designed to attack more if you're attacking. So generally speaking if you want more parry/block chances, attack more.
@@warriorfire8103 I wondered about that, it felt like it. That certainly plays into the block feeling more aggressive in my case since I do attack more.
Honestly if they just increased the block window size, I bet more people would dig it. Learning attack patterns from majoris and such to refine the timings is kind of try hard. Especially compared to parry.
You cant fire at the head of four majoris enemies at once while trying to block their random timed attacks from multiole directions and think you are gonna be okay
Assault loves block weapons
Bruh vanguards get health on majoris and above executions which is op as hell during runs and you are thr last brother standing i have saved my team so many times with that perk.
Thats why the only classes its safe to play with randoms are Bulwark and Vanguard since they can both reset their health pools, dont need stims, and can DPS forever w/o ammo (except for the god damned fliers).
Block will stay mostly unused when parry+gun strike does shit tons of free damage for zero effort. When they made parry require *some* timing, people absolutely lost their shit cause they didnt have a spammable "i win" button anymore which as about as much strategy as 80% of the player base can comprehend. I would love for parry+GunStrike to retain its AoE CC but have its damage gutted. This would give you the choice between safe, easy, effortless parries and terrible dps, or risky, difficult, effort-intensive blocks with god-tier dps. Balanced as always splits the difference, as they are a tiny bit harder to parry with, but the melee attacks hit harder. If you leave in a super effective, zero effort option thats the only thing people will use. I even still use fencing when Im not solo because it is way *way* overtuned damage wise and your personal feelings dont matter in a squad. Either you do the most effective thing you can 100% of the time or you are throwing.
Why Play Meta when you Just can Play for Fun?🤔😉🤣🤣🤣
Games? FOR FUN?!@!???!~@ REEEEEEEEEEEEE-
Because dying every 3 seconds since you dont get gunstrike is no fun?
@@seejur This. Pick a blocking weapon and do Lethal missions. The whole squad will be DOA.
Nah. Way to slow. In the middle of 1 swing you lose all health on ruthless and lethal. The speed attribute is stupid really. It's not like the size and weight change of the melee weapon
Block sucks
If anyone is ever looking to get really REALLY mid at SM2 I'll be sure to refer them to your channel. The only thing worse than your opinions are those awkward giggles you punctuate everything with.
Anyone else getting real tired of playing the exact same operations day after day?