There is at least one other reference you missed regarding Makoto and Johanna than makes sense from the standpoint that the game is set in Japan and made in Japan: With Makoto often calling out "Fist of Justice" with some of her attacks, as well as her own biker aesthetic; it can be considered that there are some Kamen Rider references in her design. For those who don't know: Kamen Rider is, in short, the parallel to Power Rangers in Japan. While the Rangers (or Super Sentai as they are called in Japan) fight monsters as a team, the Kamen Rider was typically portrayed as a one-man army against evil, riding to the rescue on a motorcycle. Because Makoto, daughter of a police officer and sister to a member of the DA's office, has such a strong sense of justice, it makes sense that her appearance as a vigilante "phantom thief" would take the form similar to the vigilante heroes of television who also tend to have a strong sense of justice, while fighting for "Love and Peace."
Kamen Rider was one of the direct inspirations of Power Rangers. Shotaro Ishinomori created Super Sentai by combining elements from his aforementioned Kamen Rider, and his manga Cyborg009. The Red Ranger is a reference to 009 himself.
Johanna and Anat were women who stole positions of power from men. Makoto as Queen is clothed and armed in all the manly hobbies that are taboo for women in Japan. She has to keep her appreciation for motorcycles, action movies and shounen on the DL to retain her feminine image. Makoto and her sister are all about challenging Japanese gender roles.
You know since you're more or less a Persona Historian, have you ever considered making your own Personas? Like taking the various elements of the Personas you're starring at and making new ones. I myself am making a hypothetical Persona game with some friends that's going pretty in depth, being based around Exploration vs. Conquest. Like how the starting persona for the protagonist is Marco Polo and is represented through a flowing scarf in the wind around the Protagonist's neck before being ripped off to be summoned. I haven't exactly nailed down a particular look for Marco Polo other than a bit of a fusion between a Desert Shawl and other Desert Wear combined with a Ninja. Of course he's also of the Wind Element and the main color of the game is Green... Plot twist, also, the game takes place in the United States and you're a Japanese Foreign Exchange Student.
One thing I could think of for Motochika Chousokabe as a Persona is him being an anthro bat; as a reference to Nobunaga Oda's infamous nickname for him, either "the bat who refuses to fly away from home" or "the bat on a birdless island;" who wears a feminine-looking purple kimono. The reason why it's the more feminine one is because Motochika was nicknamed Himewako ("Little Princess") as a child either because of his feminine looks or because of his gentle demeanor; I'm not completely sure which was the actual reason. In his baggy sleeves, he hides short spears. This is in reference to him being a very good spearman even back as a child. Before Motochika proved his spear skill and bravery in his first battle, his father was very worried about him, but those fears were allayed quite handily and he earned the nickname Oniwako ("Little Demon"). He would excel in Water (From Persona 2) and physical skills, but due to being very supportive of his friends in Samurai Warriors and Sengoku Basara, might also dabble in some support skills. I'm not completely sure. Though I also had an idea for Mitsunari Ishida, though this is based more on his appearance in Samurai Warriors. A Samurai Warriors Mitsunari Ishida Persona would be a robotic anthropomorphic fox, but would have a window in his chest revealing an organic heart. The robot with an organic heart is because of Mitsunari Ishida being portrayed as rather cold and not very emotional in Samurai Warriors, but actually being quite passionate and very caring for his friends, whether or not they know how much he cares about them. The reason why he's a fox is because of his nickname at least in Samurai Warriors; "The Fox of Mount Sawa." I wonder why they call him that there when there at least doesn't appear to be any kind of historical evidence of him having such a nickname? I also don't know if his Sengoku Basara counterpart is anything like his Samurai Warriors counterpart; all I've ever known of him in Sengoku Basara is his intense wish to avenge Hideyoshi Toyotomi.
I actually thought of various Personas of little-known mythological figures. A favorite among my designs so far would be Patroclus, the often-unknown companion of Achilles. The summoning method is depicted through tearing off a strangling collar that afterwards becomes a necklace.
@@MarioGMan25 Oh whoops, I meant that the awakening happens through the collar being removed, sorta like cutting ties with toxic relationships. Summoning is really just the necklace disappearing when the Persona is called to appear. Sorry if I confused you there 😅
@@shadowstar8619 Oh no I got it. I just assumed ripping off the necklace was like ripping off the mask in P5. The Awakening procrss you just described now, cutting off toxic influences. Which I very much enjoy.
With the versatile moveset, religious background and the knight mask, makoto gives me a paladin vibe. Plus in royal, kaneshiro's willseed makes her an absolute unit of an utility tank, and since we recruit her there, i think its made for her
Her dad worked for the police. Her sister works for the police She feels pushed into being the police. Hence the bike and it transforming when she figures out what she wants to do.
Interesting... I always thought Johanna being a bike was just a JoJo reference, specifically Born This Way from Jojolion, but it's interesting to see the possible inspirations for the design aside from just being cool
Something to also consider is that motorcycles are often associated with rebellion as they’re often loud attention grabbing and relatively solitary (unlike cars, motorcycles are usually made for solo rides)
I think another reason Johanna is a bike is because of makoto’s rebellion spirit which she doesn’t want to be known as a pushover or someone that just listens to orders and doesn’t think for herself while someone who rides a motorcycle is visualized as the complete opposite though, thinks for themselves, can’t be walked over, which also moves into her move set which considering how varied and powerful it is also pushes into the previous points
Headcanon time: Johanna is a bike because makoto when awakening wanted something that would help propel her forward. She was mired in authority and civil politics, thus she wanted a power that would help her escape these bindings, too assert herself as more then just the pawn of higher-ups and push forward of her own accord. Cue Johanna, A bike (biker gang motif + rebelling against society and it's social trappings of what a good girl is) that she can use too push herself forward via driving it. On its evolution it takes a more human form showing us that makoto no longer views the ability to assert her will as an external thing she needs a persona too do. It's now an intrinsic part of her.
The fact that anat is a direct transformation of johanna could also be a reference to Transformers and that there is more to makoto than meets the eye.
I’m gonna go ahead and say after you finish all of the 1st personas your gonna start on the 2nd ones and then the 3rd How is it that one of my least liked posts becomes the most liked in this comment section
I will admit the 3rd tier personas are cool looking but they do seem like a downgrade from the 2nd tier trickster gods, also the fact they're essentially a modern interpretation of the 1st persona is a bit disappointing.
something I think could be a fun reference is how the legend of Pope Joan is found out because she is pregnant, she is carrying a child, the parallel to the persona being that Makoto riding Joan. Joan then presents her rebel status by physically supporting Makoto as a motorcycle. Then when Makoto doesn't need that support the persona evolves and Joan loses the bike form.
My head cannon as to why makoto is bold and brash at time and her mix of her phantom outfit and her persona is that her mother was actually a “rebellious spirit” and her dad reigned her in and they had sae and makoto. Specifically I think her mother was some biker “delinquent”
I also heard some say that it's due to Makoto, at that point in her life, just letting life carry her instead of standing on her own two feet. Though by the time she awakens her Persona, it could then be that she's deciding to "drive" herself forward rather than relying on others to drive her life.
So I have a theory about Makoto and Johanna. Each phantom thief has a thief role in the team. With Joker being the cat thief, Ryuji being the muscle, Yusuke being the forgery guy etc. So Makoto falls into the role of getaway driver since she is always driving the Mona car in the escaping from the palaces. Only time she isnt driving is in mementos. That could then be something which added to the form of her persona being a bike.
I really like that actually. Would Ann be a sort of seductress character? I think that makes sense because whenever the thieves need info (e.g. Yusuke and Futaba) she's always the one talking directly to them Then Futaba would be the strategy person Morgana is the one who does tools and resources Haru? I don't really know tbh. She's kinda like their link into the upper echelons of society ig, which would make sense with her persona but idk how to explain why
@@uwuifyingransomware I cant remember the title that Ann is supposed to be but basically look at heist movies and you figure out. I think Ann is the distraction. Morgana is a mastermind/big boss, Futaba is the Hacker, Haru is the Inside Man. Akechi is the detective/Police Officer. I dont know where Sumire falls on this list however.
My interpretation for Johanna's bike form is that Makoto has finally awakened to not only her sense of rebellion but her self worth, and Johanna represents Makoto's ability to finally propel herself forward. Her "drive" if you will.
I think its a bike because biker gangs are used to be shown as rebellious people doing things not in a legal way but they do it for heroic reasons And that totally goes with the phantom thieves just like haru code name noir
Johanna might also be a bike because Makoto's rebellion is about rejecting her role as the goody-two-shoes school president and a delinquent is pretty much the opposite of what she is seen as. Her whole look gives off a delinquent biker vibe with all of the metal spikes and dark colours. Makoto's mask even resembles part of a motorcycle helmet.
Not so sure is it real or not, Johanna is a bike maybe due to a random topic about motorcycle between P5 characters designer and with other staff. Can someone fact check it?
A bike represents freedom to so many people. So Makotos awakening making her a badass biker chick fits so well in her rebellion against her cop sister fit her so perfectly.
I have thought that Johana being a bike was a reference to the Popemobile (hence why you can see the pope inside of it.) But when the Popemobile is mixed with the rebellious spirit of the Phantom Thieves, it takes the form of a motorcycle. Absolutely love this series. Fantastic work!
An excellent video as always! I suppose that after playing the game so much, I almost forgot that it was a bike. I always enjoy when they do something new and interesting with Personas. Weekly videos are great, but don't push yourself too hard.
There is at least one other reference you missed regarding Makoto and Johanna than makes sense from the standpoint that the game is set in Japan and made in Japan: With Makoto often calling out "Fist of Justice" with some of her attacks, as well as her own biker aesthetic; it can be considered that there are some Kamen Rider references in her design.
For those who don't know: Kamen Rider is, in short, the parallel to Power Rangers in Japan. While the Rangers (or Super Sentai as they are called in Japan) fight monsters as a team, the Kamen Rider was typically portrayed as a one-man army against evil, riding to the rescue on a motorcycle. Because Makoto, daughter of a police officer and sister to a member of the DA's office, has such a strong sense of justice, it makes sense that her appearance as a vigilante "phantom thief" would take the form similar to the vigilante heroes of television who also tend to have a strong sense of justice, while fighting for "Love and Peace."
Intetesting viewpoint. I dont know much about this, but it does sound reasonable
Kamen Rider was one of the direct inspirations of Power Rangers. Shotaro Ishinomori created Super Sentai by combining elements from his aforementioned Kamen Rider, and his manga Cyborg009. The Red Ranger is a reference to 009 himself.
Love and Peace, you say?
Saa, jikken o hajimeyou ka?
Johanna and Anat were women who stole positions of power from men. Makoto as Queen is clothed and armed in all the manly hobbies that are taboo for women in Japan. She has to keep her appreciation for motorcycles, action movies and shounen on the DL to retain her feminine image. Makoto and her sister are all about challenging Japanese gender roles.
You know since you're more or less a Persona Historian, have you ever considered making your own Personas? Like taking the various elements of the Personas you're starring at and making new ones. I myself am making a hypothetical Persona game with some friends that's going pretty in depth, being based around Exploration vs. Conquest. Like how the starting persona for the protagonist is Marco Polo and is represented through a flowing scarf in the wind around the Protagonist's neck before being ripped off to be summoned.
I haven't exactly nailed down a particular look for Marco Polo other than a bit of a fusion between a Desert Shawl and other Desert Wear combined with a Ninja.
Of course he's also of the Wind Element and the main color of the game is Green...
Plot twist, also, the game takes place in the United States and you're a Japanese Foreign Exchange Student.
One thing I could think of for Motochika Chousokabe as a Persona is him being an anthro bat; as a reference to Nobunaga Oda's infamous nickname for him, either "the bat who refuses to fly away from home" or "the bat on a birdless island;" who wears a feminine-looking purple kimono. The reason why it's the more feminine one is because Motochika was nicknamed Himewako ("Little Princess") as a child either because of his feminine looks or because of his gentle demeanor; I'm not completely sure which was the actual reason.
In his baggy sleeves, he hides short spears. This is in reference to him being a very good spearman even back as a child. Before Motochika proved his spear skill and bravery in his first battle, his father was very worried about him, but those fears were allayed quite handily and he earned the nickname Oniwako ("Little Demon"). He would excel in Water (From Persona 2) and physical skills, but due to being very supportive of his friends in Samurai Warriors and Sengoku Basara, might also dabble in some support skills. I'm not completely sure.
Though I also had an idea for Mitsunari Ishida, though this is based more on his appearance in Samurai Warriors. A Samurai Warriors Mitsunari Ishida Persona would be a robotic anthropomorphic fox, but would have a window in his chest revealing an organic heart. The robot with an organic heart is because of Mitsunari Ishida being portrayed as rather cold and not very emotional in Samurai Warriors, but actually being quite passionate and very caring for his friends, whether or not they know how much he cares about them. The reason why he's a fox is because of his nickname at least in Samurai Warriors; "The Fox of Mount Sawa." I wonder why they call him that there when there at least doesn't appear to be any kind of historical evidence of him having such a nickname? I also don't know if his Sengoku Basara counterpart is anything like his Samurai Warriors counterpart; all I've ever known of him in Sengoku Basara is his intense wish to avenge Hideyoshi Toyotomi.
I actually thought of various Personas of little-known mythological figures. A favorite among my designs so far would be Patroclus, the often-unknown companion of Achilles. The summoning method is depicted through tearing off a strangling collar that afterwards becomes a necklace.
@@shadowstar8619 That sounds entertaining. What's the Awakening method?
@@MarioGMan25 Oh whoops, I meant that the awakening happens through the collar being removed, sorta like cutting ties with toxic relationships. Summoning is really just the necklace disappearing when the Persona is called to appear. Sorry if I confused you there 😅
@@shadowstar8619 Oh no I got it. I just assumed ripping off the necklace was like ripping off the mask in P5. The Awakening procrss you just described now, cutting off toxic influences. Which I very much enjoy.
Great analysis as always! You brought up a good point about Johana's face being hidden to represent how she would cross-dress among the clergy.
With the versatile moveset, religious background and the knight mask, makoto gives me a paladin vibe. Plus in royal, kaneshiro's willseed makes her an absolute unit of an utility tank, and since we recruit her there, i think its made for her
Your voice is so sympathetic
Day 29352 of asking for Valjean
Every second you are not running is a second that Valjean is getting closer, 3Waifu
idk I can run pretty fast ;)
@@3Waifu The only way to stop Valjean from getting to you is by making a video on him, finally putting his soul to rest
We will always wait for your videos with Joy. You're doing some awesome work here💪
I waited so long for this!!🤩 I'm glad you're back~
Her dad worked for the police.
Her sister works for the police
She feels pushed into being the police.
Hence the bike and it transforming when she figures out what she wants to do.
Answering the real questions here. Perfect, great video.
Interesting... I always thought Johanna being a bike was just a JoJo reference, specifically Born This Way from Jojolion, but it's interesting to see the possible inspirations for the design aside from just being cool
Something to also consider is that motorcycles are often associated with rebellion as they’re often loud attention grabbing and relatively solitary (unlike cars, motorcycles are usually made for solo rides)
I think another reason Johanna is a bike is because of makoto’s rebellion spirit which she doesn’t want to be known as a pushover or someone that just listens to orders and doesn’t think for herself while someone who rides a motorcycle is visualized as the complete opposite though, thinks for themselves, can’t be walked over, which also moves into her move set which considering how varied and powerful it is also pushes into the previous points
Nice job dude
Yay another video!
bet
Yusuke: a Persona?
Ryuji: No Dude That's a F*cking Bike.
Yusuke: What the F*ck?
tldr:
yusuke: “is that a persona”
ryuji: “no dude, that’s a bike”
Headcanon time:
Johanna is a bike because makoto when awakening wanted something that would help propel her forward. She was mired in authority and civil politics, thus she wanted a power that would help her escape these bindings, too assert herself as more then just the pawn of higher-ups and push forward of her own accord.
Cue Johanna, A bike (biker gang motif + rebelling against society and it's social trappings of what a good girl is) that she can use too push herself forward via driving it.
On its evolution it takes a more human form showing us that makoto no longer views the ability to assert her will as an external thing she needs a persona too do. It's now an intrinsic part of her.
The fact that anat is a direct transformation of johanna could also be a reference to Transformers and that there is more to makoto than meets the eye.
I’m gonna go ahead and say after you finish all of the 1st personas your gonna start on the 2nd ones and then the 3rd
How is it that one of my least liked posts becomes the most liked in this comment section
perhaps ;)
@Seiffa- sure why not
I will admit the 3rd tier personas are cool looking but they do seem like a downgrade from the 2nd tier trickster gods, also the fact they're essentially a modern interpretation of the 1st persona is a bit disappointing.
something I think could be a fun reference is how the legend of Pope Joan is found out because she is pregnant, she is carrying a child, the parallel to the persona being that Makoto riding Joan. Joan then presents her rebel status by physically supporting Makoto as a motorcycle. Then when Makoto doesn't need that support the persona evolves and Joan loses the bike form.
My head cannon as to why makoto is bold and brash at time and her mix of her phantom outfit and her persona is that her mother was actually a “rebellious spirit” and her dad reigned her in and they had sae and makoto. Specifically I think her mother was some biker “delinquent”
Along with everything you said I feel it also is a nod to being a cop is well and could be influenced by her father
I also heard some say that it's due to Makoto, at that point in her life, just letting life carry her instead of standing on her own two feet. Though by the time she awakens her Persona, it could then be that she's deciding to "drive" herself forward rather than relying on others to drive her life.
So I have a theory about Makoto and Johanna. Each phantom thief has a thief role in the team. With Joker being the cat thief, Ryuji being the muscle, Yusuke being the forgery guy etc. So Makoto falls into the role of getaway driver since she is always driving the Mona car in the escaping from the palaces. Only time she isnt driving is in mementos. That could then be something which added to the form of her persona being a bike.
I really like that actually.
Would Ann be a sort of seductress character? I think that makes sense because whenever the thieves need info (e.g. Yusuke and Futaba) she's always the one talking directly to them
Then Futaba would be the strategy person
Morgana is the one who does tools and resources
Haru? I don't really know tbh. She's kinda like their link into the upper echelons of society ig, which would make sense with her persona but idk how to explain why
@@uwuifyingransomware I cant remember the title that Ann is supposed to be but basically look at heist movies and you figure out. I think Ann is the distraction. Morgana is a mastermind/big boss, Futaba is the Hacker, Haru is the Inside Man. Akechi is the detective/Police Officer. I dont know where Sumire falls on this list however.
I thought it was a motorcycle because they thought the shit was cool.
My interpretation for Johanna's bike form is that Makoto has finally awakened to not only her sense of rebellion but her self worth, and Johanna represents Makoto's ability to finally propel herself forward. Her "drive" if you will.
Puns
I remember in the artbook Soejima noted that he got the idea from a co-worker saying what if Johanna is a motorcycle
This isn't really related but why does Makoto get the best gun out of any party member including Joker? +10 to all stats, like why!?
I think its a bike because biker gangs are used to be shown as rebellious people doing things not in a legal way but they do it for heroic reasons
And that totally goes with the phantom thieves just like haru code name noir
I'm going to go with "Johanna is a bike because bikers are strongly associated with rebellion against conformity".
Tatsuya would be proud
Also, Makoto best girl don't fight me because I respect your opinion and I understand why you would romance someone else
Yup
@@dig1taltoaster Ann is best girl fzrtdcjvjfyyff
Tatsuya did an impression of a 🏍️
@@dig1taltoaster in my opinion, futaba is the best written female character, but makoto is best girl
The...
The pope gave birth...
...and they were mad?
my name is johanna! :P i always felt very close to makoto. thank u for this analysis! all ur videos are so interesting
Johanna remind me of Born This Way from Jojo
:)
Honestly my favorite Persona in the entire series, great video and interesting speculation
This comment is just for the algorithm
pd: i rlly like yours videos, keep the good job
Great video 👍🏻
(Hopefully this helps the algorithm ✌🏻)
Thank you in fact it does, a shocking amount more than you would expect!
@@3Waifu That’s great
Johanna might also be a bike because Makoto's rebellion is about rejecting her role as the goody-two-shoes school president and a delinquent is pretty much the opposite of what she is seen as. Her whole look gives off a delinquent biker vibe with all of the metal spikes and dark colours. Makoto's mask even resembles part of a motorcycle helmet.
Ah yes, I've been waiting for this
Coming to your own conclusions huh? I guess it is pretty fun to come up with your own ideas when it comes to characters you like so much.
Another great and really insightful video!
Love these videos, very well written and edited they need more attention.
Not so sure is it real or not, Johanna is a bike maybe due to a random topic about motorcycle between P5 characters designer and with other staff.
Can someone fact check it?
A bike represents freedom to so many people. So Makotos awakening making her a badass biker chick fits so well in her rebellion against her cop sister fit her so perfectly.
Well have you thought about doing the personas from 3 and 4?
Btw I love this vid!!
Definitely something I've got plans for!
3Waifu I can’t wait 🤗🤗
If anat is essentially a transformed johanna I cannot help but wonder what agnes would like if it had a robot mode.
I really do enjoy your content and hope you keep making more!
this has absolutely nothing to do with anything but i just noticed the red pieces on arsene kinda look like the mantle archer has from fate stay night
huh you're right actually, good observation!
Johanna is one of my personal favorite Personas in the series. The persona is a living nuclear reactor and Makoto was great too.
I have thought that Johana being a bike was a reference to the Popemobile (hence why you can see the pope inside of it.) But when the Popemobile is mixed with the rebellious spirit of the Phantom Thieves, it takes the form of a motorcycle.
Absolutely love this series. Fantastic work!
Dude, it's a bike
agreed.
pope mobile
Amazing work as always :)
An excellent video as always! I suppose that after playing the game so much, I almost forgot that it was a bike. I always enjoy when they do something new and interesting with Personas. Weekly videos are great, but don't push yourself too hard.