Thank you Todd. I have been using the single plan swing for about 5 years now. I can't thank you enough for your video. I hope some day to attend one of your schools to learn even more about the single plan swing and the short game. I watches this video once again because I had a pretty difficult round and just could not get on track. So, I felt like I needed to go back to the basics. I was so excited after watching this video again that I went back to the driving range to hit a bucket of balls. That's a lot of swings in one day for a 67 year old. But it was worth it. Just watching this video got me back on track and striping the ball again. Thank you again for all you do to teach this great golf method.
My AH HA. THE TORSO TURNS THE SHOULDERS, THUS ARMS & THE DOWN SWING WORKS for me when my FIRST FEELING IS THE ACTIVATION of the MUSCLE ON THE INSIDE OF MY TRAIL LEG THIGH. Todd you're changing my life. Thanks ever so much. Cheers Robby
Boom. Trail foot on the ground is my A-HA moment. A real game changer. When my contact gets inconsistent, you can almost bet I am coming up on my trail foot and "spinning out" with my pelvis on the downswing. Great stuff. Thanks Todd and crew!
Your instruction is ridiculously good! Every once in a while I click on another golf instruction videos on RUclips and they don't hold a candle to your understanding of the golf swing. I can't watch more than a few minutes before exiting the video. I love the overhead camera view, that is super helpful. One thing I was doing... when I laid the club down behind the all with the proper rod from the lead arm (at address), I noticed that naturally because the clubhead is 2-3 inches into the backswing, the clubface is slightly open to the target line. At impact, it's not because it gains back those 2-3 inches with the rotation. I was trying to force it square to the target line at address and drawing/hooking everything (club was a few degrees closed at impact). Seeing your overhead view, I now realize your clubface is slightly open to the target line as well, when it's 2-3 inches behind the ball into your backswing!
I started the single plane swing 2 weeks ago. It's the way I've always wanted to play the game but wasn't sure how. I'm striking the ball so well now thanks to your great channel! A lot of work to do but so happy with this. Thanks a lot!
Watching this video again 18 months after it originally came out is much more meaningful now that I have the swing down a lot better (22 months of practice) and can really appreciate the nuances of the points covered. Thanx, Todd!
I’m trying the single pane swing, awesome so far. Straight and accurate shots with every club in the bag. I know when I don’t hit a good shot one of the positions we’re not hit. Also when I revert to my old foot work, results are definitely sub par. I am trying to figure out the feet / ball. And club positions. Just ordered the guide today. I am a work in progress with this but love it so far. Too bad we’re getting close to the end of the season in Pennsylvania. Thanks Todd. I appreciate your years of developing this.
Possibly your best video on the SP swing! These positions are the essence of the SP swing, and understanding them is what makes it work so very well! Thanks for this video!!
Last night we got 14 inches of snow here in MA. All I can do for now is watch more videos and practice the single plane swing in my living room. Winter sucks!
Grateful for finding this channel. The “limitations” in the downswing have created a lot more consistency in my ball striking- huge! Just wish I found the guide on distance from the ball before having my irons adjusted. I had to give myself more space (which feels surprisingly good/natural) but it looks like it is bringing the toe up. We will see when this weather clears up. Thanks as always Todd 👍🏻
May be the most informative, incisive video that you've done. The overhead stuff is priceless because, to me, this is the angle that I most call in to question my own positions in the swing i.e. 'am i going too far back, too little, lower body turn, etc. really educational and much appreciated.
The disassociation of torso and shoulders at setup has taken my ball striking to a new level. There is not one instructor in the world that as made that distinction. Bravo! My arms now fall and stay underneath.... once that happens the swing becomes a “blink of the eye” and the blur of fast arms. wow.
I love it, Todd. You definitely gave me an A-HA moment just now. I now know how to get more speed by having my chest catch up with my hips at impact. Now I need to WORK on it.
Great explanation! I recently saw my swing on video🤢 and realized I was over turning(left arm even collapsing)and have started working on shortening my swing. This really helped clear up what I need to work on.
Todd, this is one of the best explanations of the single plane golf swing I have seen ! Thank you for your continued teaching and insights from your perspective !
I got it! It was THIS video. The absolute kicker was the top down view. I was to far forward with the ball in my stance and the club was not aligned with my lead arm. Thanks Todd!
Sheer genius and well presented. Todd - you have allowed me to internalize the A-HA Moment and understand the importance of Separation! I now also understand that keeping the trail foot down results in the club releasing. See page 70 of John Jacobs "Practical Golf" where he says: "This happens in EVERY good swing". With Moe it was Automatic due to the trail foot down. Pure GENIUS!!!
Great tips on separation tired but I’m 72 and it’s still rough to turn I guess the torso going all the way back enough and then creating the cub club head speed but I’m working on it Danny in toms River
Love it. There is 2 feet of snow outside and i can work on my swing. Love the lower body tips. I think about my lower body when i swing sometimes because i know it effects my swing. NOW I DON'T HAVE TO THINK ABOUT IT. Thanks Todd
I really enjoy your videos. I am sure you are really busy, Todd, but I'd love if you had a few moments to read my comment here and told me your thoughts. My two main hobbies are golf and ballroom dancing. It's amazing how many biomechanical principles are the same between the 2 sports, and your videos of shown me the connection and allowed me to draw on my dance experience in golf (and I'm a better ballroom dancer than I am a golfer, thanks to a very high level teacher who has worked with me diligently for years). One thing you must be able to do in order to dance correctly is to be able to separate and isolate the movements of your hips and legs from your torso and arms. Most important of all is the relationship between the hips and the rib cage. The ribcage must be kept in contact with the partner in high level ballroom dancing, you have to be able to maintain this contact no matter what position the rest of your body is in. You might be facing the partner in a closed position, or be open in a promenade. You may be moving in a straight line or rotating. Your feet might be flat or you might be up on your toes. You torso may be swaying left or right. You might have torso and hips in the same plane (square) or the two may be 30-45 degrees apart ("contrabody" position). I am constantly working on this in dance, and I never thought of how it might be relevant in golf. The idea that the torso must move "twice as fast" as the hips....just a question. The torso and hips are linked by the vertebral column, so unless you try to isolate the two areas, any rotation in one will tend to cause a rotation in the other. Similarly, as the club accelerates, it exerts a rotational force on the whole body, accelerating its rotation. So the torso should speed up naturally, right, it shouldn't need any conscious effort to do it? When you say the torso must move twice as fast as the hips, I assume you are not saying this is something we should be "trying" to do, trying to actively accelerate our torso 2x as much as the hips. Or maybe you are....not sure. Anyway thanks very much for making these videos.
The torso and hips are linked at vertebral column but the vertebrae are somewhat mobile (rotationally). just sit in a chair and see that you can still rotate your spine. I don't agree with pelvis acceleration - in other words, the pelvis has a much shorter ROM and it moves first in the initial movement in the downswing however, speeding the pelvis does not necessarily speed up the torso. The goal is to move the pelvis with speed through its range. Sequence is important. As far as conscious effort, do you have conscious effort when you skip a rock? You simply step, rotate and throw. This should be same as golf swing motion. What I am saying is that you "Naturally" move through twice the range of Motion therefore, it naturally moves faster.
I know you have to provide fresh content and this is going pretty deep. I’m hitting the ball so much better with the SPS. Many times I have A holy cow moment after impact. That is good enough for now. Not going too deep into why. Year two of my change. Gone from a 12 to an 8 handicap this season.
For me, limitation in the hips was huge, and hand position, even if i put those elements in a traditional swing it helps but trusting the whole system is just amazing how straight the ball goes
Mr Todd great clip.as I see moe locks lower body and pelvic move and thus cuts off second swing plain,what remains hence is single plain of upper body movement, mostly controlled by arms shoulders elbows and wrists.he effectively crosses out duality of two plains of lower and upper body through the swing
Hi - I am 82 and for many years of fighting the way I hit the ball and how I should be hitting the ball I have found what works for me.. Even with the single plane swing I have found that it all goes wrong if I do not make sure that my eyes stay watching the ball and not move it over the ball ahead of the club. If you keep the eyes behind the clubhead the shot is always perfect. I have therefore brain trained myself to keep my head still behind the ball until the club has struck the ball. Hope this works for you if you struggle.
I have trouble casting the club out, I still get the club square at impact but I have turned so far that the ball goes dead straight 50-75 yards left of my target. Fairways I play are not that wide. lol This Single Plane Swing makes since, and after I hit a few thousand balls and "get" the feel of it I know it will work for me.
Several ah ha moments in this video. Shoulder turn separates from hip turn in backswing. And shoulders and hips have the same 30 deg open angle at impact. I can work on this. Thanks Todd.
This is fascinating as I always wondered was my takeaway too short before I added leverage. But if most of the rotation occurs in that first two feet of takeaway I know I'm there or thereabouts and I'm okay to then add the leverage and not force the issue by insisting on an unnecessarily long takeaway (where all elements move together)
Todd,Excellent video.Upper body can turn 90 degrees.Lower body only 45 degrees.Once you get them so one is not ahead or behind the other at impact ,good things start happening.
Wow you really coming out of the closet with this one, reckon this will piss off a lot of golf instructors, again thanks for the hard work and dedication through honesty . . love it!
hi Todd great information! at address i understand that shoulders should be closed relative to target line, and torso open, that means that the hips are also open to the target line. is this correct or you don’t pay attention to your hips at address?
Thanks Todd, I've gotten away from the idea of keeping the back foot down during the downswing and as soon as our snow melts here on Cape Cod, I'll be putting it back into my swing. Question, what is that on the bottom of your grip? A reminder of some sort?
Working on the separation of the torso.did not réalisé how we had to separate the arms and shoulders, taking that too the range.piece by piece to put this together.and then work on the lower body after...thanks Todd
Good stuff T. I’ve heard you say when practicing this go slow. Is there a realistic slowed down swing drill or half swing to really ingrain the lower body limitations? Thank you for excellent instruction pro.
Todd, you’ve probably had several of these moments over the years. Did you find yourself having some of these before you met Moe when you were doing your early VHS work comparing and trying to match with him, during the time you got to actually work in person with him or...have you found the most meaningful of these discovery moments coming in these more current stages of your career as you found yourself really having the resources to study every detail of the SPS? I find it interesting to know where guys like me should start really having a genuine moment that’s a real sign of progress. Of course it’s a “cheat” for me to be able to ask you these questions when you’ve already navigated these waters.
Good question. When I met Moe and started modeling his swing, I used video to understand his motion. There were A-HA moments there because I would finally understand what HE was feeling. When I started measuring and researching the swing, my A-HA moments came from understanding WHY he did what he did in his swing.
As always Todd great instruction, my ha ha moment was the vertical drop in all you instruction and teaching this is not emphasized enough and only now discovered after 2 years that that drop is so crucial to stay in the plan so true that right knee plays a huge and crucial part with out the sequences it’s not happening When Moe demonstrates the vertical drop and horizontal movement it looks like his upper body is moving a lot but that what he feels from what I see with his head still,because this happens so fast in my mind I need to really exaggerate to make that happen When this is done that lag you produce is crazy good and even if you swing at 60% the distances are great with so little effort less is more Please challenge me and build on what I be said and need correction
Just to add its How you start the vertical drop thats important it’s a very different feeling and when you get it you say what have I been doing all this time
Good analysis. I have always wondered if Moe played a closed or opened stance at address. I need to try opening the torso and closing the shoulders at address. Not sure how that will play out though
At 12:30 you goofed on the math. At position 2, your pelvis is at -40 degrees and your shoulders at -80. At position 4, they've moved to +30 for both. That's 70 degrees for the pelvis and 110 degrees for the shoulders. That's about a 1.6x turn of shoulders relative to pelvis. You said "twice as fast." Oops. The basic idea was correct.
Well my range of torso movement at the top is average of 80. I accept -85 degrees too. My average range of torso is +30. But 25 is good too. So No matter how particular you want to get on what I say, it still shows separation and how the torso must move faster.
So, are we saying this is not an arm driven swing? The arms do swing but driven by body position through the ball? The whole instruction of Natural Golf emphasized arm driven swing with body following the arm swing. Or, is this body movement anticipatory to the arm swing and not something we actually have to do?
Explain “Arm Driven” with biomechanics (what the body is doing) and you will answer this question. Arm Driven means nothing - really. Yes the arms move but the body must move as well. Positions matter too. This video describes what his body is doing to support arm movement - so you can produce speed.
@@ToddGravesGolf Excuse me, the term used in the Natural Golf videos is "arm generated" swing. I disagree with "position learning golf". It's a motion, not a bunch of positions. The positions happen, they are not something you consciously do successfully . As Moe described Manuel de la Torre as the greatest instructor in the world for all time, I agree whole heartedly. I'm sure you have read his book Understanding the Golf Swing and the view on "positions". I have used Moe's swing for years with great success over the previous years. My videos show all the "positions" during the swing, but they're nothing I'm thinking about. My humble suggestion,is to use de la Torre's swing the club back using the hands, swing the club forward using the arms, but use the single plane set up, grip, stance, ball and club head position, etc and that's it.
@@Hacker-xe8yv The term used was actually "Arm Generated Body Motion". Positions happen? I would suggest that there is a domino effect of positions. For example if you place your hands incorrectly on the club, you will rotate your forearms. Yes, the rotation happened but it was unnecessary but a cause of incorrectly placing your hands. So, yes in this instance, you hand "Positions" matter and Yes the hand position at address was learned - it didn't just happen. This goes for the body's position at address including tilt, forward bend, foot positions, hand positions, arm position etc. So no, I don't believe that positions just happen. As far as Manuel de La Torre, I'm sure he was a great instructor but there are a lot of really quality instructors. Moe said the same thing about Craig Shankland and eventually mentioned me as "The only on who really knew his golf swing". Take that for what it's worth.
Actually, the only way. you can move your torso is to move your hips or your shoulders. That is because to move the torso ( chest) you must move the spine. And the spine can only move if either the hips move or the back muscles move . And when the back muscles move, the shoulders move. Try this: stand up and fold your arms in front of your chest. Now try to move your torso without moving your shoulders or hips. You cannot do it. So if your torso is open either your hips are open or your shoulders are open.
I like your videos. I purchased one length irons partly because of your videos. But this one left me scratching my head. In your video of Moe. His shoulders are open at address not closed. And I think your estimations of degrees are off. And I think you need to explain a little more how the torso is different from the hips. I think if you stood over a circle with degrees marked off painted on the ground. And had sticks strapped to your body. Or have someone hold sticks against your body. You may find that you are not doing what you think you are doing. Which is almost the rule . Not the exception..what we feel isn't necessarily what we are doing. I enjoyed the previous video of keeping the right heal down to stop hips and then shoulders. At times one of brothers keys were to stop the shoulders when square . I sent the link to him
I have measured the Torso position with the most sophisticated equipment available. So the angles are extremely accurate. Regarding the video angles, they may be a bit off due to trying to draw 3D lines on a Two dimensional video. Sticks strapped to the body don't work by the way. You must have sensors that measure the 3D metrics of every Axis.
Thank you Todd. I have been using the single plan swing for about 5 years now. I can't thank you enough for your video. I hope some day to attend one of your schools to learn even more about the single plan swing and the short game. I watches this video once again because I had a pretty difficult round and just could not get on track. So, I felt like I needed to go back to the basics. I was so excited after watching this video again that I went back to the driving range to hit a bucket of balls. That's a lot of swings in one day for a 67 year old. But it was worth it. Just watching this video got me back on track and striping the ball again. Thank you again for all you do to teach this great golf method.
My AH HA. THE TORSO TURNS THE SHOULDERS, THUS ARMS & THE DOWN SWING WORKS for me when my FIRST FEELING IS THE ACTIVATION of the MUSCLE ON THE INSIDE OF MY TRAIL LEG THIGH. Todd you're changing my life. Thanks ever so much. Cheers Robby
Boom. Trail foot on the ground is my A-HA moment. A real game changer. When my contact gets inconsistent, you can almost bet I am coming up on my trail foot and "spinning out" with my pelvis on the downswing. Great stuff. Thanks Todd and crew!
Your instruction is ridiculously good!
Every once in a while I click on another golf instruction videos on RUclips and they don't hold a candle to your understanding of the golf swing. I can't watch more than a few minutes before exiting the video.
I love the overhead camera view, that is super helpful. One thing I was doing... when I laid the club down behind the all with the proper rod from the lead arm (at address), I noticed that naturally because the clubhead is 2-3 inches into the backswing, the clubface is slightly open to the target line. At impact, it's not because it gains back those 2-3 inches with the rotation. I was trying to force it square to the target line at address and drawing/hooking everything (club was a few degrees closed at impact). Seeing your overhead view, I now realize your clubface is slightly open to the target line as well, when it's 2-3 inches behind the ball into your backswing!
Yes. I always favor a bit "open" on the face behind the ball.
I started the single plane swing 2 weeks ago. It's the way I've always wanted to play the game but wasn't sure how. I'm striking the ball so well now thanks to your great channel! A lot of work to do but so happy with this. Thanks a lot!
Watching this video again 18 months after it originally came out is much more meaningful now that I have the swing down a lot better (22 months of practice) and can really appreciate the nuances of the points covered. Thanx, Todd!
I’m trying the single pane swing, awesome so far. Straight and accurate shots with every club in the bag. I know when I don’t hit a good shot one of the positions we’re not hit. Also when I revert to my old foot work, results are definitely sub par. I am trying to figure out the feet / ball. And club positions. Just ordered the guide today. I am a work in progress with this but love it so far. Too bad we’re getting close to the end of the season in Pennsylvania. Thanks Todd. I appreciate your years of developing this.
Possibly your best video on the SP swing! These positions are the essence of the SP swing, and understanding them is what makes it work so very well! Thanks for this video!!
Glad it was helpful!
Last night we got 14 inches of snow here in MA. All I can do for now is watch more videos and practice the single plane swing in my living room. Winter sucks!
Agree. Cant wait for warm weather.
The "A-HA" moment was finding your channel, thank you Todd for all your teachings & wisdom and letting us all experience it 👍
Thanks.!
Grateful for finding this channel. The “limitations” in the downswing have created a lot more consistency in my ball striking- huge! Just wish I found the guide on distance from the ball before having my irons adjusted. I had to give myself more space (which feels surprisingly good/natural) but it looks like it is bringing the toe up. We will see when this weather clears up. Thanks as always Todd 👍🏻
Absolutely
May be the most informative, incisive video that you've done. The overhead stuff is priceless because, to me, this is the angle that I most call in to question my own positions in the swing i.e. 'am i going too far back, too little, lower body turn, etc. really educational and much appreciated.
You're welcome.
Loving the details that you went into explaining the golf swing. Thanks!
Thanks.
maybe the best golf video out there.
The disassociation of torso and shoulders at setup has taken my ball striking to a new level. There is not one instructor in the world that as made that distinction. Bravo! My arms now fall and stay underneath.... once that happens the swing becomes a “blink of the eye” and the blur of fast arms. wow.
Few instructors understand what is "really" going on. Thanks for the comments.
I love how you break down Moe’s golf swing I hope in the near future I can get a in person lesson
I love it, Todd. You definitely gave me an A-HA moment just now. I now know how to get more speed by having my chest catch up with my hips at impact. Now I need to WORK on it.
Great explanation! I recently saw my swing on video🤢 and realized I was over turning(left arm even collapsing)and have started working on shortening my swing. This really helped clear up what I need to work on.
Glad it helped!
Todd, this is one of the best explanations of the single plane golf swing I have seen ! Thank you for your continued teaching and insights from your perspective !
I got it! It was THIS video. The absolute kicker was the top down view. I was to far forward with the ball in my stance and the club was not aligned with my lead arm. Thanks Todd!
You’re welcome
Finding your channel has made me love golf again and play so much better. Thanks to you and Tim!
Glad to hear it!.
I really appreciate those overhead shots of Moe's swing. I have never seen that angle before and it gave me a new perspective. Thanks!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Still one of the best instructional videos!
Sheer genius and well presented. Todd - you have allowed me to internalize the A-HA Moment and understand the importance of Separation! I now also understand that keeping the trail foot down results in the club releasing. See page 70 of John Jacobs "Practical Golf" where he says: "This happens in EVERY good swing". With Moe it was Automatic due to the trail foot down. Pure GENIUS!!!
Thanks!
Great video. Makes many things click into place. Thx.
Great tips on separation tired but I’m 72 and it’s still rough to turn I guess the torso going all the way back enough and then creating the cub club head speed but I’m working on it Danny in toms River
Love it. There is 2 feet of snow outside and i can work on my swing. Love the lower body tips. I think about my lower body when i swing sometimes because i know it effects my swing. NOW I DON'T HAVE TO THINK ABOUT IT. Thanks Todd
You think that's bad, only got up to 14 degrees today in Orlando! That's barely 57 degrees Fahrenheit!
YOu're welcome.
The vertical drop is the feeling of greatness. I get it alot with the wedges and up to my 3 iron. I do not get it as often with the woods and driver.
I really enjoy your videos. I am sure you are really busy, Todd, but I'd love if you had a few moments to read my comment here and told me your thoughts. My two main hobbies are golf and ballroom dancing. It's amazing how many biomechanical principles are the same between the 2 sports, and your videos of shown me the connection and allowed me to draw on my dance experience in golf (and I'm a better ballroom dancer than I am a golfer, thanks to a very high level teacher who has worked with me diligently for years).
One thing you must be able to do in order to dance correctly is to be able to separate and isolate the movements of your hips and legs from your torso and arms. Most important of all is the relationship between the hips and the rib cage. The ribcage must be kept in contact with the partner in high level ballroom dancing, you have to be able to maintain this contact no matter what position the rest of your body is in. You might be facing the partner in a closed position, or be open in a promenade. You may be moving in a straight line or rotating. Your feet might be flat or you might be up on your toes. You torso may be swaying left or right. You might have torso and hips in the same plane (square) or the two may be 30-45 degrees apart ("contrabody" position).
I am constantly working on this in dance, and I never thought of how it might be relevant in golf.
The idea that the torso must move "twice as fast" as the hips....just a question. The torso and hips are linked by the vertebral column, so unless you try to isolate the two areas, any rotation in one will tend to cause a rotation in the other. Similarly, as the club accelerates, it exerts a rotational force on the whole body, accelerating its rotation. So the torso should speed up naturally, right, it shouldn't need any conscious effort to do it? When you say the torso must move twice as fast as the hips, I assume you are not saying this is something we should be "trying" to do, trying to actively accelerate our torso 2x as much as the hips. Or maybe you are....not sure.
Anyway thanks very much for making these videos.
The torso and hips are linked at vertebral column but the vertebrae are somewhat mobile (rotationally). just sit in a chair and see that you can still rotate your spine. I don't agree with pelvis acceleration - in other words, the pelvis has a much shorter ROM and it moves first in the initial movement in the downswing however, speeding the pelvis does not necessarily speed up the torso. The goal is to move the pelvis with speed through its range. Sequence is important. As far as conscious effort, do you have conscious effort when you skip a rock? You simply step, rotate and throw. This should be same as golf swing motion. What I am saying is that you "Naturally" move through twice the range of Motion therefore, it naturally moves faster.
Beauty. Thanks as always Todd.
My pleasure!
When lining up at address with the club behind the ball, are your eyes on the ball prior to starting your backswing or on the face of your club?
I think I've watched this five times in the last hour lol. Ty sir Todd
You're welcome.
A-HA - Thank you Todd!!!
Sure.
I know you have to provide fresh content and this is going pretty deep. I’m hitting the ball so much better with the SPS. Many times I have A holy cow moment after impact. That is good enough for now. Not going too deep into why. Year two of my change. Gone from a 12 to an 8 handicap this season.
For me, limitation in the hips was huge, and hand position, even if i put those elements in a traditional swing it helps but trusting the whole system is just amazing how straight the ball goes
Excellent teacher !!
Mr Todd great clip.as I see moe locks lower body and pelvic move and thus cuts off second swing plain,what remains hence is single plain of upper body movement, mostly controlled by arms shoulders elbows and wrists.he effectively crosses out duality of two plains of lower and upper body through the swing
Hi Todd, always a great teaching, hurry to become a on plane swing golf instructor in France 😉
Excellent!
Hi - I am 82 and for many years of fighting the way I hit the ball and how I should be hitting the ball I have found what works for me.. Even with the single plane swing I have found that it all goes wrong if I do not make sure that my eyes stay watching the ball and not move it over the ball ahead of the club. If you keep the eyes behind the clubhead the shot is always perfect. I have therefore brain trained myself to keep my head still behind the ball until the club has struck the ball. Hope this works for you if you struggle.
Interesting analysis, Todd. What is the “check point” to look for with proper torso or shoulder rotation at address from a down the live view?
one check is to make sure you can see the lead arm above the trail arm BUT no gap between the arms.
I have trouble casting the club out, I still get the club square at impact but I have turned so far that the ball goes dead straight 50-75 yards left of my target. Fairways I play are not that wide. lol This Single Plane Swing makes since, and after I hit a few thousand balls and "get" the feel of it I know it will work for me.
Several ah ha moments in this video. Shoulder turn separates from hip turn in backswing. And shoulders and hips have the same 30 deg open angle at impact. I can work on this. Thanks Todd.
Yes, exactly
This is fascinating as I always wondered was my takeaway too short before I added leverage. But if most of the rotation occurs in that first two feet of takeaway I know I'm there or thereabouts and I'm okay to then add the leverage and not force the issue by insisting on an unnecessarily long takeaway (where all elements move together)
Thanks mate best tips ever. I’m flushing it now with no back pains..
Todd,Excellent video.Upper body can turn 90 degrees.Lower body only 45 degrees.Once you get them so one is not ahead or behind the other at impact ,good things start happening.
Nice.
What about Ball position for all clubs with the Single Plane Swing? Love your Videos!
Wow you really coming out of the closet with this one, reckon this will piss off a lot of golf instructors, again thanks for the hard work and dedication through honesty . . love it!
Thanks.
hi Todd great information! at address i understand that shoulders should be closed relative to target line, and torso open, that means that the hips are also open to the target line. is this correct or you don’t pay attention to your hips at address?
Thanks Todd, I've gotten away from the idea of keeping the back foot down during the downswing and as soon as our snow melts here on Cape Cod, I'll be putting it back into my swing. Question, what is that on the bottom of your grip? A reminder of some sort?
My club? No reminder.
Working on the separation of the torso.did not réalisé how we had to separate the arms and shoulders, taking that too the range.piece by piece to put this together.and then work on the lower body after...thanks Todd
Great video !
Thanks!
Good stuff T. I’ve heard you say when practicing this go slow. Is there a realistic slowed down swing drill or half swing to really ingrain the lower body limitations?
Thank you for excellent instruction pro.
Not really. You learn it BY keeping trail foot down and lead knee flexed. That is how you learn limitations.
excellent
Todd, you’ve probably had several of these moments over the years. Did you find yourself having some of these before you met Moe when you were doing your early VHS work comparing and trying to match with him, during the time you got to actually work in person with him or...have you found the most meaningful of these discovery moments coming in these more current stages of your career as you found yourself really having the resources to study every detail of the SPS? I find it interesting to know where guys like me should start really having a genuine moment that’s a real sign of progress. Of course it’s a “cheat” for me to be able to ask you these questions when you’ve already navigated these waters.
Good question. When I met Moe and started modeling his swing, I used video to understand his motion. There were A-HA moments there because I would finally understand what HE was feeling. When I started measuring and researching the swing, my A-HA moments came from understanding WHY he did what he did in his swing.
@@ToddGravesGolf That's a great way to phrase it, thanks.
Ty sir 💪
Hi Todd do the size of the clubs make a difference im 6 5 in height and just started using a standard set of clubs . Thanks
Absolutely . You need clubs that fit you. It makes a huge difference. Let me know if I can help you get fit. My email is toddg@gravesgolf.com.
As always Todd great instruction, my ha ha moment was the vertical drop in all you instruction and teaching this is not emphasized enough and only now discovered after 2 years that that drop is so crucial to stay in the plan so true that right knee plays a huge and crucial part with out the sequences it’s not happening
When Moe demonstrates the vertical drop and horizontal movement it looks like his upper body is moving a lot but that what he feels from what I see with his head still,because this happens so fast in my mind I need to really exaggerate to make that happen
When this is done that lag you produce is crazy good and even if you swing at 60% the distances are great with so little effort less is more
Please challenge me and build on what I be said and need correction
Just to add its How you start the vertical drop thats important it’s a very different feeling and when you get it you say what have I been doing all this time
How is the 15 degrees of torso left turn at address achieved? Is it forced or natural?
Natural if grip and arm position (single Plane) and tilt are correct.
Good analysis. I have always wondered if Moe played a closed or opened stance at address. I need to try opening the torso and closing the shoulders at address. Not sure how that will play out though
All you need to do is place the torso correctly and then the shoulders will be correct when you have the arms in the Single Plane Address.
hi. interesting, what about de finish and follow trough? Thanksd and regards
Coming soon
Is that film of Moe swinging ever going to be released in full?
What film? The documentary?
Todd Graves no, the video from the top
Wouldn’t limitations cause back pain?
No. Having poor positions and no limitations creates back pain.
It works
Percy Boomer 'On leaning Golf'
I know you like Moe’s “Robot” approach, but if you had to pick one swing thought, what would it be?
First move away from ball. That would be it.
@@ToddGravesGolf I like it! Thanks.
What about players like Rahm?
At 12:30 you goofed on the math. At position 2, your pelvis is at -40 degrees and your shoulders at -80. At position 4, they've moved to +30 for both. That's 70 degrees for the pelvis and 110 degrees for the shoulders. That's about a 1.6x turn of shoulders relative to pelvis. You said "twice as fast." Oops. The basic idea was correct.
Well my range of torso movement at the top is average of 80. I accept -85 degrees too. My average range of torso is +30. But 25 is good too. So No matter how particular you want to get on what I say, it still shows separation and how the torso must move faster.
Ahah. This is good.
So, are we saying this is not an arm driven swing? The arms do swing but driven by body position through the ball? The whole instruction of Natural Golf emphasized arm driven swing with body following the arm swing. Or, is this body movement anticipatory to the arm swing and not something we actually have to do?
Explain “Arm Driven” with biomechanics (what the body is doing) and you will answer this question. Arm Driven means nothing - really. Yes the arms move but the body must move as well. Positions matter too. This video describes what his body is doing to support arm movement - so you can produce speed.
@@ToddGravesGolf Excuse me, the term used in the Natural Golf videos is "arm generated" swing. I disagree with "position learning golf". It's a motion, not a bunch of positions. The positions happen, they are not something you consciously do successfully . As Moe described Manuel de la Torre as the greatest instructor in the world for all time, I agree whole heartedly. I'm sure you have read his book Understanding the Golf Swing and the view on "positions". I have used Moe's swing for years with great success over the previous years. My videos show all the "positions" during the swing, but they're nothing I'm thinking about. My humble suggestion,is to use de la Torre's swing the club back using the hands, swing the club forward using the arms, but use the single plane set up, grip, stance, ball and club head position, etc and that's it.
@@Hacker-xe8yv The term used was actually "Arm Generated Body Motion". Positions happen? I would suggest that there is a domino effect of positions. For example if you place your hands incorrectly on the club, you will rotate your forearms. Yes, the rotation happened but it was unnecessary but a cause of incorrectly placing your hands. So, yes in this instance, you hand "Positions" matter and Yes the hand position at address was learned - it didn't just happen. This goes for the body's position at address including tilt, forward bend, foot positions, hand positions, arm position etc. So no, I don't believe that positions just happen. As far as Manuel de La Torre, I'm sure he was a great instructor but there are a lot of really quality instructors. Moe said the same thing about Craig Shankland and eventually mentioned me as "The only on who really knew his golf swing". Take that for what it's worth.
For me the correct club path fixes all this automatically.
After considering all these positions. I tried to walk to the Teebox and fell over
You ok?
Actually, the only way. you can move your torso is to move your hips or your shoulders. That is because to move the torso ( chest) you must move the spine.
And the spine can only move if either the hips move or the back muscles move . And when the back muscles move, the shoulders move.
Try this: stand up and fold your arms in front of your chest. Now try to move your torso without moving your shoulders or hips. You cannot do it. So if your torso is open either your hips are open or your shoulders are open.
Sounds good.
I like your videos. I purchased one length irons partly because of your videos.
But this one left me scratching my head.
In your video of Moe. His shoulders are open at address not closed.
And I think your estimations of degrees are off.
And I think you need to explain a little more how the torso is different from the hips.
I think if you stood over a circle with degrees marked off painted on the ground. And had sticks strapped to your body. Or have someone hold sticks against your body. You may find that you are not doing what you think you are doing. Which is almost the rule . Not the exception..what we feel isn't necessarily what we are doing.
I enjoyed the previous video of keeping the right heal down to stop hips and then shoulders. At times one of brothers keys were to stop the shoulders when square . I sent the link to him
I have measured the Torso position with the most sophisticated equipment available. So the angles are extremely accurate. Regarding the video angles, they may be a bit off due to trying to draw 3D lines on a Two dimensional video. Sticks strapped to the body don't work by the way. You must have sensors that measure the 3D metrics of every Axis.
Double Maximum Compound Brain Damage
You talk too much
Merry Christmas.
Study begets data which begets information which begets knowledge which is power ... in the swing. A new definition of the separation of powers. ;)
interesting.