I've been listening to this version more times than I can count. This is THE best version of this concerto. And modern pianos just don't compare to the fortepiano.
@Dick Boy Actually I was underwhelmed by the orchestra in the 1st movt. Sloppy syncopations without any menace or foreboding, bad balances for a commercial recording btw soloist & accomp, and orch. sometimes not in sync with itself. Except for Bilsson's fine playing this is not Mozart for the Ages.
Hearing these performances on fortepiano is like hearing them for the first time all over again. Such a crisp and refreshing performance. I'm now on my 6th video of these concertos on period instruments.
This is definitely the BEST rendition of n° 20 Concert I ever heard. Though ancient music be my most intimate world, here Mozart sounds really "pre-classical" on the fortepiano. Gardiner is a well-known genius. Instead, Bilson is all a revelation for me.Thanks a lot for sharing this treasure.
The other day or should one say the other year 7 years ago I wrote a comment here. Today 28th of January 2023 I really turned up the amplifier volume till level 10, mind you JBL50 speakers. Stunning, moving, heart-beating, stomachache. Dear Augustine Road, thanks again for your upload.
I love the turbulence in the second movement and how bold the left hand is throughout. This really is Mozart as I've never heard him. Very glad to have found this.
God I really love the passage from 14:56 onwards, especially around 15:17 - perfect balance between the orchestra and the soloist and the grace notes are just SO mozart
This is one of the best performances of this concerto that I have ever heard. The first movement, especially, has a robust and energetic quality that other performers seem reluctant to approach. I think this performance captures all the storm and drama that the score indicates and that Mozart must have had in his head. It is great to hear a performance in which the players are not afraid to "go too far" in expression.
thanks Lothbury, for this superdramatic, powerful recording. I have always admired Bilson for presenting early keyboard instruments so well. He knows how to get very sensitive, colorful utterance from them. Gardiner is one of my very favorite performing musicians, being both exciting performer and scholar. I have many of his recordings, and always find them fresh and insightful as well as dramatic. Thank you. (Pretty picture of you.)
A classic ear-opener, this recording. The concerti for banda simply sound different on period instruments and the d minor especially. This way, the concerto receives the dramatic, operatic profile it was meant to have. The scoring in the very opening - string with horn, and gradually bassoon, oboe flute and then the banda in a tremendous subito fortissimo - it just sounds much more brilliant and to the fore on period instruments.
I don't know if I've said this before but this is absolutely my most favorite concerto ever! Plus I really like this performance because of the pianoforte, sounds really nice! :)
Mozart beautifully captures the conflict that he and his father had in this movement. Ironically Wolfgang Mozart's Father, Leopold Mozard was moved to tears after attending a performance of this piece.
One big difference in between this and the recordings with the modern piano that has a lot to do with the sound of the piece apart from the difference of the instruments is the pitch of the tuning is different. Our modern concert pitch of 440hz is far more sharp than the one we are hearing in this recording. I would bet it is on some baroque pitch between 415 Hz and 432 Hz.
Jazz Purr Hertz, Hz, are oscillations per second. This unit can be used to identify distinct notes of the scale. The normal "A" that is the standard middle A on the piano is typically tuned to 440Hz, or in some places currently in Europe or the USA slightly higher (sharper) c. 442Hz. Historically, the tuning system was more localised and different to what we used now, which is a more a "standardised" scale and pitch centre. In parts of Europe in the 18th Century the "A" was as low as 392 Hz (France) or as high as 465Hz (Italy), and everything in-between. We know this from lots of documentation on the subject as well as real evidence in fixed pitched instruments such as organs or recorders which still survive. The tuning systems were also different, so each semitone of the scale was not equally related, which affects the tuning and colour of each chord. Modern practice is to use "equal temperament" which equalises the divisions of the 12-note scale.
very true - mozart had said in letters to his father and friends that he LOVED larger forces - orchestras and choirs. to him the larger the better. however large groups were very rare at the time. it was Beethoven that forced the development of what became the modern grand
On fortepiano these Mozart concertoes sound far more better (and authentically) than on modern pianos. See: Martha Argerich with the same number with NJSO. Those horrible Stanways! Big sounds, big noise.
Maybe he would, maybe not. the fortepianos had a very light and quick action. he DID love large forces such as big choirs and orchestras but these were not commonplace in his time, didnt come along really for about another 20 to 30 years after his death. BUT as to the sound of the piano, listen to how it BLENDS into the orchestra when they play together rather then standing out as it does in later concertos. at this time (1780s) the piano was not a major solo instrument in concertos yet
.... (addendum) Also, it's interesting that London, the first city in the world (aside from Rome and such) to reach a population of 1 million, and it did this at the very beginning of the 19th century-- the same general time that the new piano developments started appearing. This would have generally been the time of Schubert. But that itself is really relevant, and I'm not sure how it would really affect his work. Also, Mozart is still cooler than Elgar; the Victorians don't always win it all.
I'm not sure that I understand that last one as well, but basically.... yeah, pianos are expensive-- versatile, but expensive, we don't want them to break.... but, basically, if you say that you only wanted pianos built to the specifications of 1788, people will think that you're Sheldon Cooper or something, and not really being sensible, and especially if the newer ones are actually better.... that's not really the best way to be accessible to people, if that makes sense.
The middle to higher notes sound great on the fortepiano but the lower ones seem to bottom out and flatten; the resonance just isn't there. Great recording though.
That's actually the biggest advantage of the fortepiano over modern pianos: it can blend with the ensemble in the lower register, it can even play the continuo without sounding like a gunpowder instrument.
What I was trying to imply was more along the lines of.... If wood is good, then use wood in piano-- that would be using old ideas.... but surely there must be something good about modern pianos... why scrap *all* of the technical improvements in the new ones.... why go back to 1750? London in 1750 had a population of 700,000 and NYC-- wait for it-- *13,000*. Imagine being a piano seller in a town that size. Actually they must have got them all from 1750London-- smaller than Stockholm today.
The first time I heard this I thought there was something amiss with the piano. It's a pianoforte? Maybe I should give it a listen just to know what it is they have in mind. Huh. It's like it tells you just an bit more about Mozart.
I'm not quite sure what spirit you meant that in, but I was sorta driving at was, Maybe one day I could play it on keyboard, if you follow. But I've heard worse insults from the people who don't like my reviews of the Hitler ape movies that pass for 'science fiction', so, I suppose that it's no big deal.
I completely agree with you and I'm lucky to have chased down the complete box with all the mozart concertos on eBay. Just wanted to tip you on another amazing performance of the concerto that has the same energy you like this one for: Friederich Gulda (watch?v=VtTqpqGIIYU)
In all seriousness, what's the difference if it's played on 'period instrument'-- 18th century, in this case? How it is different, this older way of making pianos?
Clarification: I mean, if it was meant as an insult, I've heard worse, and nastier insults, so, it's no big deal. If it's just some obscure statement that does nothing to explain anything.... then, that's not so good, but also not so bad. So, okay.
That piano does not sound very good, little depth and soundstage, like some children piano. If we have much better sounding instruments, why not to use them ? I am sure Mozart would be delighted if he could play on Steinway .. similarly like Edison would prefer hifi recorder to his phonograph. These "authentic" things are rarely sounding better.
Trills and other quick but delicate and detailed bits of playing come through very cleanly and clearly on these old fortepianos - as well as the fact that you get not only an increase in volume, but a change in tone when playing harder, unlike with a modern piano, where there is little if any change in tone, and only the volume increases.
![Mozart - Piano Concerto No. 20 in D minor, K. 466 [complete]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/OtyYI2qNXRI/mqdefault.jpg)
![YoungBoy Never Broke Again - Sneaking [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1ILUps2zDFU/mqdefault.jpg)
I've been listening to this version more times than I can count. This is THE best version of this concerto. And modern pianos just don't compare to the fortepiano.
Eh, I think Levin's cadenza is more inventive
the drama, power, bite, this literally BLOWS AWAY any modern version I have heard. Thank you Gardiner and Bilson for opening our ears.
Agreed!!!
The other modern renditions are still out there, so I doubt they've been literally blown away.
@Dick Boy probably fair but I was poking fun more than anything.
@Dick Boy Actually I was underwhelmed by the orchestra in the 1st movt. Sloppy syncopations without any menace or foreboding, bad balances for a commercial recording btw soloist & accomp, and orch. sometimes not in sync with itself. Except for Bilsson's fine playing this is not Mozart for the Ages.
Hearing these performances on fortepiano is like hearing them for the first time all over again. Such a crisp and refreshing performance. I'm now on my 6th video of these concertos on period instruments.
This is definitely the BEST rendition of n° 20 Concert I ever heard. Though ancient music be my most intimate world, here Mozart sounds really "pre-classical" on the fortepiano. Gardiner is a well-known genius. Instead, Bilson is all a revelation for me.Thanks a lot for sharing this treasure.
Mozart's music SPEAKS the language of the universe...
The other day or should one say the other year 7 years ago I wrote a comment here. Today 28th of January 2023 I really turned up the amplifier volume till level 10, mind you JBL50 speakers. Stunning, moving, heart-beating, stomachache. Dear Augustine Road, thanks again for your upload.
I love the turbulence in the second movement and how bold the left hand is throughout. This really is Mozart as I've never heard him. Very glad to have found this.
God I really love the passage from 14:56 onwards, especially around 15:17 - perfect balance between the orchestra and the soloist and the grace notes are just SO mozart
This piece is just so additive!!! The more I listen to it, the more I like it and hence the more I want to listen to it again!!!
Even thought the bit at 21:33 is just a descending pentachord, Mozarts does it so beautifully and it’s probably one of my favorite moments in this
This is just one of a scarce few videos where I could actually enjoy Mozart's music and read positive comments without running into spam or vulgarity.
or how Beethoven was so much better
He was. @@back2backband1
This is one of the best performances of this concerto that I have ever heard. The first movement, especially, has a robust and energetic quality that other performers seem reluctant to approach. I think this performance captures all the storm and drama that the score indicates and that Mozart must have had in his head. It is great to hear a performance in which the players are not afraid to "go too far" in expression.
00:00 1. Allegro
12:57 2. Romanze
21:57 3. Rondo. Allegro assai
The cadenza in the first movement gives me chills every time I hear it. This is surely the best recording of this piece!
I like the Fortepiano version!
thanks Lothbury, for this superdramatic, powerful recording. I have always admired Bilson for presenting early keyboard instruments so well. He knows how to get very sensitive, colorful utterance from them. Gardiner is one of my very favorite performing musicians, being both exciting performer and scholar. I have many of his recordings, and always find them fresh and insightful as well as dramatic. Thank you. (Pretty picture of you.)
I do not quite understand the music , but every time I heard the music of Mozart, I am moved very much., He is so excellent and great.
A classic ear-opener, this recording. The concerti for banda simply sound different on period instruments and the d minor especially. This way, the concerto receives the dramatic, operatic profile it was meant to have. The scoring in the very opening - string with horn, and gradually bassoon, oboe flute and then the banda in a tremendous subito fortissimo - it just sounds much more brilliant and to the fore on period instruments.
i really like the low notes on the forte piano; they sound more mozarty, it's more rock and roll.
Piccolo adorato Riki,che queste stupende note siano di buon auspicio per la tua salute e per i tuoi nove anni che oggi festeggi
I don't know if I've said this before but this is absolutely my most favorite concerto ever! Plus I really like this performance because of the pianoforte, sounds really nice! :)
It's opera! said Gardiner about Mozart's piano concertos.
Pleasant and comforting music.
Are you joking?
@@GGbreizh@eijaniemi should sound menacing, aggressive, and dark. Definitely not comforting
Absolutely fantastic, simple, clean and gorgeous playing.
Amazing, just incredible.
Wow this must be a period specific piano. Sounds amazing.
Bravo maestro I love the sound of the vintage instrument such a crisp performance
Wow! Nice intro of the cadenza! 10:41 - 11:05
Me encantó esta versión, el fortepiano le da otra vida a las interpretaciones!
A very fine recording and performance on period instruments...
I had a great time listening to this divine music.Very professional interpretation! Thank you!
Mozart beautifully captures the conflict that he and his father had in this movement. Ironically Wolfgang Mozart's Father, Leopold Mozard was moved to tears after attending a performance of this piece.
At 21:00 or so my heart exploded, brilliant performance !
BRAVO MOZART GENIO INMORTAL GENIO INCOMPARABLE NINO ETERNO VIVA EL NINO ETERNO!!!!!!!!
professor Malcolm Bilson rocks!
Son conciertos hermosos estos VIVA MOZART!
Ahí Mozart why are you so awesome
Brilliant music from a native Austrian. Thank you European peoples for this superb contribution.
One big difference in between this and the recordings with the modern piano that has a lot to do with the sound of the piece apart from the difference of the instruments is the pitch of the tuning is different. Our modern concert pitch of 440hz is far more sharp than the one we are hearing in this recording. I would bet it is on some baroque pitch between 415 Hz and 432 Hz.
hertz is frequency cycle right?..ur right it is sharp to the ear..why was it changed and can u explain how this works..hope u dnt charge by the hour
Jazz Purr Hertz, Hz, are oscillations per second. This unit can be used to identify distinct notes of the scale. The normal "A" that is the standard middle A on the piano is typically tuned to 440Hz, or in some places currently in Europe or the USA slightly higher (sharper) c. 442Hz. Historically, the tuning system was more localised and different to what we used now, which is a more a "standardised" scale and pitch centre. In parts of Europe in the 18th Century the "A" was as low as 392 Hz (France) or as high as 465Hz (Italy), and everything in-between. We know this from lots of documentation on the subject as well as real evidence in fixed pitched instruments such as organs or recorders which still survive. The tuning systems were also different, so each semitone of the scale was not equally related, which affects the tuning and colour of each chord. Modern practice is to use "equal temperament" which equalises the divisions of the 12-note scale.
This is somewhere around 432 Hz
I think this is 432hz
Yes it is 432 Hz
love every movement very much，moved every time when i hear it.⋯⋯13:00⋯⋯-14:57-15:31-16:16-16:48-17:12⋯⋯thank you for uploading.
I don't know this concerto well, but if it's unfamiliar, it's probably improvised! I think most of Mozart's concerto's have improvised cadenzas :D
Beautiful ! Thank you for posting :)
The best Drama in Musica ever ❤
Amazing performance and cadenza!
AMAZING! great orchestra!!! love it!
4:37 is the most amazing progression.
Interesting, Fascinating and Beautiful Mozart Song
Събирам сили и радост. Е, това е музиката.
NICE videos eceziunale veramente
very true - mozart had said in letters to his father and friends that he LOVED larger forces - orchestras and choirs. to him the larger the better. however large groups were very rare at the time. it was Beethoven that forced the development of what became the modern grand
Mozart ❤
beautiful.
Superb!!!
wonderfull performance. Many thanks for this incredible upload :).
Incredible
On fortepiano these Mozart concertoes sound far more better (and authentically) than on modern pianos. See: Martha Argerich with the same number with NJSO. Those horrible Stanways! Big sounds, big noise.
I just loooove it when people don't play Mozart as written. You need to improvise!
9:30 sounds pretty close to the end of Dvorak's violin concerto 1stmovment, coincidence?!
his own for all concerti where Mozart did not write (or at least publish) a cadenza
more and more I find myself completely and utterly turned off to Mozart's keyboard works played on modern pianos
Soberbia esta versión con fortepiano !
Taa dii daa dii dadaa
Apart from a discours on Hz and so on, could anyone inform us, me when this very agreeable recording dates?
+BoldyBaldyBastard April 1986.
Panos Adams Thank you, very kind of you.
12 midnight, nyc, 5/25/2020
I wish you could hear the lower strings more clearly in this. Otherwise great.
How could you not? lol
🤯❤💯
Maybe he would, maybe not. the fortepianos had a very light and quick action. he DID love large forces such as big choirs and orchestras but these were not commonplace in his time, didnt come along really for about another 20 to 30 years after his death. BUT as to the sound of the piano, listen to how it BLENDS into the orchestra when they play together rather then standing out as it does in later concertos. at this time (1780s) the piano was not a major solo instrument in concertos yet
You can use a program "aTube catcher" to download the sound of a video in youtube. That's how I do it.
Does anyone know which candenzas he uses?
I believe he improvises his own, as Mozart himself would have done.
.... (addendum) Also, it's interesting that London, the first city in the world (aside from Rome and such) to reach a population of 1 million, and it did this at the very beginning of the 19th century-- the same general time that the new piano developments started appearing. This would have generally been the time of Schubert. But that itself is really relevant, and I'm not sure how it would really affect his work. Also, Mozart is still cooler than Elgar; the Victorians don't always win it all.
I'm not sure that I understand that last one as well, but basically.... yeah, pianos are expensive-- versatile, but expensive, we don't want them to break.... but, basically, if you say that you only wanted pianos built to the specifications of 1788, people will think that you're Sheldon Cooper or something, and not really being sensible, and especially if the newer ones are actually better.... that's not really the best way to be accessible to people, if that makes sense.
The middle to higher notes sound great on the fortepiano but the lower ones seem to bottom out and flatten; the resonance just isn't there. Great recording though.
That's the way the instrument sounds. Not as bright as the modern piano because of it's overall construction.
That's actually the biggest advantage of the fortepiano over modern pianos: it can blend with the ensemble in the lower register, it can even play the continuo without sounding like a gunpowder instrument.
Modern piano bass notes are muddled due string crossings. Fortepianos is reedier but in my opinion more texturally appropriate for the music
Whose Cadenzas are these?
What I was trying to imply was more along the lines of.... If wood is good, then use wood in piano-- that would be using old ideas.... but surely there must be something good about modern pianos... why scrap *all* of the technical improvements in the new ones.... why go back to 1750? London in 1750 had a population of 700,000 and NYC-- wait for it-- *13,000*. Imagine being a piano seller in a town that size. Actually they must have got them all from 1750London-- smaller than Stockholm today.
The first time I heard this I thought there was something amiss with the piano. It's a pianoforte? Maybe I should give it a listen just to know what it is they have in mind. Huh. It's like it tells you just an bit more about Mozart.
I. Allegro
12:58 II. Romanza
21:58 III. Rondo: Allegro assai
I'm not quite sure what spirit you meant that in, but I was sorta driving at was, Maybe one day I could play it on keyboard, if you follow. But I've heard worse insults from the people who don't like my reviews of the Hitler ape movies that pass for 'science fiction', so, I suppose that it's no big deal.
from 7.30 starts to sound like beethovens seventh..
Beethoven loved this D minor concerto & Mozarts 24th concerto in C minor. Beethoven borrowed A lot from Mozart
5:38 on: Gould-like humming. I really revere Maestro Bilson, but this is so distracting. Pity.
The same reason why you don't play a fugue on timpani.
Where can I download this?
very likely they are originals by the soloist.
Just go to youtube [dash] mp3.org and copy the vid URL..then it's an mp3 on your desktop.
The problem with the fortepiano is that its sound is drowned out by the orchestra
Great performance. I just wish that the fortepiano was more prominent. The orchestra is so loud that it sometimes drown the sound of the fortepiano.
Which is precisely why it evolved as it did.
I completely agree with you and I'm lucky to have chased down the complete box with all the mozart concertos on eBay. Just wanted to tip you on another amazing performance of the concerto that has the same energy you like this one for: Friederich Gulda (watch?v=VtTqpqGIIYU)
In all seriousness, what's the difference if it's played on 'period instrument'-- 18th century, in this case? How it is different, this older way of making pianos?
csodaszép
LOL
Clarification: I mean, if it was meant as an insult, I've heard worse, and nastier insults, so, it's no big deal. If it's just some obscure statement that does nothing to explain anything.... then, that's not so good, but also not so bad. So, okay.
Beethoven who?
That piano does not sound very good, little depth and soundstage, like some children piano. If we have much better sounding instruments, why not to use them ? I am sure Mozart would be delighted if he could play on Steinway .. similarly like Edison would prefer hifi recorder to his phonograph. These "authentic" things are rarely sounding better.
Trills and other quick but delicate and detailed bits of playing come through very cleanly and clearly on these old fortepianos - as well as the fact that you get not only an increase in volume, but a change in tone when playing harder, unlike with a modern piano, where there is little if any change in tone, and only the volume increases.
Ma come si fa a rovinare questo capolavoro con l’uso di strumenti assurdi e incompatibili con la bellezza di tale musica? Schifezza allo stato puro!