Two things to consider in addition to the air conditions mentioned, would be the string swelling from absorption the colder temperature of the limbs and string increasing tension in the bow as each material should stiffen in cooler temperatures.
Garmin recommends 20ft in front of the chrono for an accurate reading. Read the manual. It’s a radar, much different than traditional shoot-thru chrono.
What’s likely happening that triggered this thinking is that rainfall affects arrow flight in a fairly significant way. Shooting Redding the last few years in the rain, everyone is adding a few yards to their sight because the rain is pushing the arrows down and adding drag during flight, not so much affecting the strings.
I agree and to me that's logical. I want to play with that if we ever get some rain. I have heard that your string saturates and you lose FPS so I wanted to try it.
Amazing effort on his video. Im sure there are a couple of ways to make the test more reliable and consistent to produce better results. Im just stoked that you guys were brave enough to dunk that bow in water. Mazive props on that.
I noticed that when shooting in rain or snow, the upper cam starts to lag and the arrows fly lower. Since the cables do not change in size, the reason may be the difference in friction in the slider One drop of water in the wrong place is enough and there will be a miss. Perhaps a roller slider is needed. In addition, you need to make an adjustment plus 1-3% of the distance, depending on the strength of the rain.
A very very long time ago, a few rainy oregon days actually siezed up my ripcord rest! Ever since I absolutely avoid letting my bow get wet!! 🤣 Now I don't have to worry near as much but this is so genius I may just test myself too!
So I think this video results are accurate. In Oklahoma TAC this last year my bow got soaked from the rain and my arrows started hitting high. Being it was TAC and to save arrows I made adjustments to my adjustable site and it was about a 5 yard difference at 40 yards. And I think I shot for 88 at the 100 yard targets. Gas bow strings too.
Cold air is dense so it should make it slower if any difference. I doubt it would really have any effect in that short of a distance. Maybe the change in the weight of the string is causing the difference like adding extra speed nocks?
What did you do to your knuckle on your left hand, Trail? I have found that the Garmin chrono is better with rifles than with bows. I have 3 different chronographs (Easton Bowforce Mapper, Garmin Zero, ProChony) and the Garmin is the least consistent.
Good bow hunters practice in the rain and wind, and know how it affect arrow flight. Even moderate RAIN drops your point of impact, and possibly more than you think depending on the distance. Test it.
Agreed. Because aside from the bowstring being wet there’s a downforce from the actual rain hitting the arrow and the air density is typically higher when raining due to increase moisture in the air
It's cold and rainy here in KY. Get me a discount on that awesome Garmin crono and I'll be happy to do an updated test. lol Seriously though, I can't wait for the spring test. I'm with everyone else who said temp change must be playing a factor. Maybe do it under a sprinkler mid day? I am Loving the Go Hunt Labs videos! keep them coming!
I don't necessarily think it's the string getting wet. I used a bloodline strings and I don't think those absorb humidity or water. What I think it is is the droplets hitting the arrow and messing with the air around the arrow through its trajectory. I do know for a fact it does something because I was at an archery event last year where it rained really really hard and my arrow would not make it to the Target at 100 yards.
You really want a accurate reading use a lab radar so many things affect that garmin chrono I’d definitely say the speeds are little off, cool video though wished I still lived in cedar so I could shoot with you
Perhaps the water acted as a lubricant and thus the increased speed. More concerning is the variance of speed in both the control group and the wet group between the arrows. An 8-fps variance would be an accuracy killer down range.
I agree, I'm not sure what happened there. I weighed arrows and they were all within a couple grains finished weight so I don't think it was that. If I were to do it again I'd want a couple Chrono options and I'd want to do it at similar temperatures. This is a bit of learning curve and far from perfect, but I think I'm relatively convinced that I didn't lose any FPS with a saturated bow/string. I do think the bigger impact is when it's actually raining and your arrow is losing FPS due to increased drag. I want to play with that if it ever actually rains :)
Hi, I have a theory: cold water hardens the blades and that increases the accumulated forces, that turns into more speed and makes the arrow hit higher. Another thing is how water affects bearings in a few days... Corrosion? Bye.
Something has to be wrong with that garmin. If your speed is that variable you would never be able to shoot a decent group at distance. I do like the idea behind these videos.
back wall is pretty firm on the lifts, I've seen some inconsistent readings out of these garmins a lot sadly. Fantastic to get your speeds within a few feet, but side by side, traditional chronographs in the right lighting seem more consistent
@@ColeyRaymond I agree, if I were to do it again I'd want a couple different chronos and I'd want to do it within a similar temperature and time of day. Bit of a learning curve with these, but it's something I wanted to play with.
I think there’s definitely something to this with the Garmin. I setup my Dads bow this year for elk, he’s shooting same DL but lower DW. The velocities I would get with his setup were usually a few FPS higher than when he shot
With your strings wetted out, I would expect the strings to stretch which would increase your your draw length and therefore increase the speed and shifting poi up
It's a radar my man, it reads the projectile down range, give the arrow a chance to fly after it passes the radar, you will not see such deviations in velocity that you experienced in this video. I sure hope you decide do redo this video using the chronograph properly because your data is corrupted. I would love to see actual conclusive evidence on this topic, and thank you for the effort by the way :)
Instead of GOHUNT Labs, this should be call GOHUNT Myth Buster. In all seriousness you should repeat test at the same time of day. Try to make all environmental similar as possible. Fun stuff and thank you.
Two things to consider in addition to the air conditions mentioned, would be the string swelling from absorption the colder temperature of the limbs and string increasing tension in the bow as each material should stiffen in cooler temperatures.
Garmin recommends 20ft in front of the chrono for an accurate reading. Read the manual. It’s a radar, much different than traditional shoot-thru chrono.
I'd be interested to see arrows that have been soaked in water and how that affects speed and weight of the arrow.
I am glad someone else was thinking the same way. If your bow is wet more than likely the arrows would be wet too.
I love these videos!! Please keep them coming!
Very good info trail. I’m liking this new series as I have gone down the archery rabbit hole completely 😂
Interested if the cold water/air made the string shrink, thus tighter. Check draw weight before and after soak?
What’s likely happening that triggered this thinking is that rainfall affects arrow flight in a fairly significant way. Shooting Redding the last few years in the rain, everyone is adding a few yards to their sight because the rain is pushing the arrows down and adding drag during flight, not so much affecting the strings.
I agree and to me that's logical. I want to play with that if we ever get some rain. I have heard that your string saturates and you lose FPS so I wanted to try it.
@ yeah great experiment and it seems pretty indicative that the string saturation is not the issue.
@@trailkreitzer9163maybe you could convince GOHUNT to get one of those high FPS cameras that bowmar uses and film the water drops on the arrow. 🤞🏻
Amazing effort on his video. Im sure there are a couple of ways to make the test more reliable and consistent to produce better results. Im just stoked that you guys were brave enough to dunk that bow in water. Mazive props on that.
Appreciate the feedback and the love for the video!
Love these gohunt labs!!!
I noticed that when shooting in rain or snow, the upper cam starts to lag and the arrows fly lower. Since the cables do not change in size, the reason may be the difference in friction in the slider One drop of water in the wrong place is enough and there will be a miss. Perhaps a roller slider is needed. In addition, you need to make an adjustment plus 1-3% of the distance, depending on the strength of the rain.
A very very long time ago, a few rainy oregon days actually siezed up my ripcord rest! Ever since I absolutely avoid letting my bow get wet!! 🤣 Now I don't have to worry near as much but this is so genius I may just test myself too!
The video we've been waiting for!
So I think this video results are accurate. In Oklahoma TAC this last year my bow got soaked from the rain and my arrows started hitting high. Being it was TAC and to save arrows I made adjustments to my adjustable site and it was about a 5 yard difference at 40 yards. And I think I shot for 88 at the 100 yard targets. Gas bow strings too.
Cold might have contracted the strings, causing them to be tighter=faster arrow speed?
For sale! Like new Mathews lift! Only been shot a couple of times. Never been in the rain!!
Cool video!!
HAHAHA!
Cold air is dense so it should make it slower if any difference. I doubt it would really have any effect in that short of a distance. Maybe the change in the weight of the string is causing the difference like adding extra speed nocks?
I also wonder about wet arrows. Lots of water flies off when it is raining during 3D shoots.
Didn’t expect that!
I thought you shot your shed for a second, then realized it was a nice big target haha
Does added weight from the wet string more effectively transfer energy?
What did you do to your knuckle on your left hand, Trail? I have found that the Garmin chrono is better with rifles than with bows. I have 3 different chronographs (Easton Bowforce Mapper, Garmin Zero, ProChony) and the Garmin is the least consistent.
Good bow hunters practice in the rain and wind, and know how it affect arrow flight. Even moderate RAIN drops your point of impact, and possibly more than you think depending on the distance. Test it.
Agreed. Because aside from the bowstring being wet there’s a downforce from the actual rain hitting the arrow and the air density is typically higher when raining due to increase moisture in the air
It's cold and rainy here in KY. Get me a discount on that awesome Garmin crono and I'll be happy to do an updated test. lol Seriously though, I can't wait for the spring test. I'm with everyone else who said temp change must be playing a factor. Maybe do it under a sprinkler mid day? I am Loving the Go Hunt Labs videos! keep them coming!
We are looking into doing another test in the spring!
I don't necessarily think it's the string getting wet. I used a bloodline strings and I don't think those absorb humidity or water. What I think it is is the droplets hitting the arrow and messing with the air around the arrow through its trajectory. I do know for a fact it does something because I was at an archery event last year where it rained really really hard and my arrow would not make it to the Target at 100 yards.
what are those targets made of?
What grip tape is that?
Rain hitting the arrow will affect poi at long range. Know this from shooting out of my barn.
We really want to test this on a really rainy day!
You really want a accurate reading use a lab radar so many things affect that garmin chrono I’d definitely say the speeds are little off, cool video though wished I still lived in cedar so I could shoot with you
Perhaps the water acted as a lubricant and thus the increased speed. More concerning is the variance of speed in both the control group and the wet group between the arrows. An 8-fps variance would be an accuracy killer down range.
I agree, I'm not sure what happened there. I weighed arrows and they were all within a couple grains finished weight so I don't think it was that. If I were to do it again I'd want a couple Chrono options and I'd want to do it at similar temperatures. This is a bit of learning curve and far from perfect, but I think I'm relatively convinced that I didn't lose any FPS with a saturated bow/string. I do think the bigger impact is when it's actually raining and your arrow is losing FPS due to increased drag. I want to play with that if it ever actually rains :)
Hi, I have a theory: cold water hardens the blades and that increases the accumulated forces, that turns into more speed and makes the arrow hit higher.
Another thing is how water affects bearings in a few days... Corrosion?
Bye.
The string likes the added weight
Maybe the water washed away all the dirt in the cams and that’s why it was faster?!? Idk. Kinda crazy. Was the water dirty when you took the bow out?
Something has to be wrong with that garmin. If your speed is that variable you would never be able to shoot a decent group at distance.
I do like the idea behind these videos.
Water acts as a lubricant. Could b part of the equation. Arrows should b wet too. In the rain everything is wet.
It could be the air density and rain falling on the flying arrow that alters the impact point more than a saturated bow and string.
The old wood arrow would absorb water, making them heavier. It’s not the bow being slower.
Hello, good evening. An old school technician once told me that the best lubricant I have ever used is water. That may be your answer.
Best Regards.
Garmin needs to be set up farther from the target.
Could the inconsistency in speeds be coming from how hard your pulling against the back wall at the moment the arrow’s released?
back wall is pretty firm on the lifts, I've seen some inconsistent readings out of these garmins a lot sadly. Fantastic to get your speeds within a few feet, but side by side, traditional chronographs in the right lighting seem more consistent
@@ColeyRaymond I agree, if I were to do it again I'd want a couple different chronos and I'd want to do it within a similar temperature and time of day. Bit of a learning curve with these, but it's something I wanted to play with.
I think there’s definitely something to this with the Garmin. I setup my Dads bow this year for elk, he’s shooting same DL but lower DW. The velocities I would get with his setup were usually a few FPS higher than when he shot
I’d like “what happens when you lubricate a mechanical device” for 200
Man i cringe when you dropped that bow in the cooler😢😮😂
It hurt us too...
With your strings wetted out, I would expect the strings to stretch which would increase your your draw length and therefore increase the speed and shifting poi up
It's a radar my man, it reads the projectile down range, give the arrow a chance to fly after it passes the radar, you will not see such deviations in velocity that you experienced in this video. I sure hope you decide do redo this video using the chronograph properly because your data is corrupted. I would love to see actual conclusive evidence on this topic, and thank you for the effort by the way :)
Instead of GOHUNT Labs, this should be call GOHUNT Myth Buster. In all seriousness you should repeat test at the same time of day. Try to make all environmental similar as possible. Fun stuff and thank you.