HOW TO SETUP THE LONG HOSE | Hog loop setup on a single cylinder for recreational diving | Apeks DST
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 19 июн 2024
- Are you often confused at how some divers configure their regulators? Do you feel a little too shy to ask them? Well in this video I aim to show you how and why their kit is different and often better than what you were taught!
The Hogarthian cave diving configuration is the epitome of the minimalist philosophy. This basic system, also known as the Hogarthian system, is the genesis of all DIR diving and while its roots lie clearly within American cave diving during the 1980’sand early 90’s it’s progressive nature remains intact and primarily unchanged even today. The Hogarthian system was originally developed by veteran cave divers William Hogarth Main, Bill Gavin, Sheck Exley, and many others within the Florida cave diving community during the 1980’s.
At that time there was considerable interest in lowering the mortality rate in, a sport that was considered the worlds most dangerous, cave diving! And so this simple but strict, cohesive, bare bones, minimalist type configuration began to develop around a very basic concept eliminate the unnecessary while configuring the necessary in the most streamlined manner possible. What’s truly amazing is how well this very basic concept has stood the test of time. Even today with the more recent and sudden popularity of technical diving and constant equipment and technological advances, the Hogarthian configuration true to form, continues to adapt remarkably well.
For this configuration you'll need:
2 x primary second stages
1 x first stage (DIN)
1 x 2.1m regulator hose
1 x 49cm regulator hose
1 x SPG with HP hose
2 x LP Inflation hoses
Length of bungee chord or necklace
🔴 Links to this episode:
www.apeksdiving.com/products/...
www.apeksdiving.com/products/...
🔴 Subscribe for more Scuba Diving How To Videos:
ruclips.net/user/AndytheNort...
🔴 Share this video with a friend:
• HOW TO SETUP THE LONG ...
🔴 Checkout our Podcast: andythenortherndiver.podbean....
✅ Training Agencies and Affiliations:
Stream2Sea: stream2sea.com/?ref=dixCPtdlK...
Use coupon code: 'AndytheND' to get 10% off each purchase
Northern Diver: www.ndiver.com/
Olympus Cameras: www.olympus.co.uk/
Mojo Europe: www.mojoeurope.com/
Gear Aid: gearaid.eu/
Go Tec Dive: www.gotecdive.com.br/site/
✅ For business inquiries contact me at andythenortherndiver@icloud.com
✅ Lets Connect:
Facebook: / andythenortherndiver
Instagram: / andythenortherndiver
Twitter: / andythend
✅ Tools I use:
Olympus OMD EM-1 Mk2
GoPro Hero 8
RØDE Shotgun Mic
Audiotechnica ATR2100 Mic
Adobe Lightroom and Photoshop
Final Cut Pro X
Apple MacBook Pro
The music I used in my video:
app.soundstripe.com/'Outside In'
Written By S.L.J. Kalmeijer
Performed & Produced By Sounds Like Sander
✅ For a free Subscribe, Like and Comment on your Channel or Video simply do the same to any of my videos, send me a screenshot and I'll return the favour 
Спорт
I love both the "no BS content" and the way you pass on the wealth of your knowledge. Please keep up the good work!!
Thanks mate glad you like what I work so hard to produce
It took a bit of training but I'm now a happy user of the long hose setup. Having the extra space to maneuver during an OOG situation is certainly nice. One difference to the config shown in your video is that I dive sidemount and we alternate between primary and secondary regs so we breathe both tanks down equally. We still always donate the long hose, no matter what we're breathing at the time.
Speaking of sidemount, that could be a subject for a future video. Showing the difference between a common backmount and sidemount config. Doesn't even need to be about tec sidemount, since recreational sidemount is quite popular as well.
I converted to sidemount a few years ago, and love it now I have had plenty of practice. The difficulty in donating the reg on the long hose comes if its clipped up I suppose, but practice in the donation in that scenario will increase reaction time!
I swapped to a long hose setup, loving it 🤘🏼
S/V Lusca awesome welcome to the cool kids club!
That was great thanks
Glad you enjoyed it thanks for watching
I like wing and bk plate setup , I have a mares ER , as it allows me to configure everything for me and find it really beneficial, slim and compact, easy to stow on my boat , .. I am on the fence with the long hose, the only real benefit I honestly see is for confined spaces, which was the idea behind it as it stemmed from cave diving , egress and ingress while your buddy is on your second ... other than that , its a hard call ...
I keep my secondary (octo) on a necklace , which makes good sense to me , easy to access , not dragging ... no excess hoses round my neck .. If my buddy ( mainly my daughter ) needs air I can give them my octo , they can take it without me having to do anything .. if my primary is taken under panic I have my secondary on a necklace just like the "long hose method" ...
If I was to go cave diving , or even some technical wrecks in confined spaces , I would deff swap for a long hose , but for the most , it just seems a little more than I need, is there other real obvious benefit to the long hose that im missing ..
Cheers , nice vid ...
Hi mate thanks for watching and your comment. The reason long hose works so well is no matter what configuration you are in, what location your buddy is in they can get your spare regulator and rely on it working. The octo is only suitable for open water in an upright very close to each other situation heading to the surface. The methodology we use to configure our kit is best practice for all forms of open circuit diving and means if we get to become cave or wreck penetration divers little or no change to our kit and skill set is required. We have dived like this since we first started and most of our dive buddies have followed suit because it is practically and functionally as well as asthetically better than the octo bent double in a D ring or stuffed in a pocket way
@@AndytheNorthernDiver thanks for a speedy reply , yeah there is sense in what you say about future proofing , and train as you mean to go on , I agree the octo is better suited to an upright position ...
I opted for the wing and back plate for exactly the future proofing , and it being small and easy to stow , I like the fact I could set everything up for me , and if need be I can swap bits in and out ..
If I were to try the long hose method I guess I could just change hose lengths on my current regs .... food for thought .. cheers
Really helpful video this. I had watched a few others on the subject but this is by far the clearest and most concise. BZ shipmate!
Thanks matey!
Excellent, thanks Andy ✌
Cheers mate
Greetings from Fuerteventura! Nice Hoodie !!!
Very useful video indeed, as I changed my config into yours a few months ago to fit exactly the same as my dive buddy. Thanks a lot!
Cheers mate
A great informative video. Would like to see one on Twinset and Sidemount!
Stay tuned fot the Twinset video out in a few days, Sidemount coming soon! Thanks for watching
Applause on all the link recommendations 🤙🏽🔥 Thank you 👍🏽
Which ones mate?
@@AndytheNorthernDiver How to tie a bolt snap 💯
Thanks Andy
Love your videos
Love your podcast fancy a brew
Listening on Spotify all the time
Thanks!!! Keep it up
Great thanks so much anything I can do let me know
Great video!!!
Seb Vaux thanks twin set episode complete now out in a few days
Andy. As a "full time"( recreational diver, meaning 4 or 5 trips a year and a few local dives to supplement, i feel like a large concept is overlooked , or glossed over. ive found that so many of these videos seem to be relying on the "good buddy" or an experienced buddy, and the importance of the familiarity. If we are honest though, most peope that are watching these videos are going to be like me, debating the long hose, and might dive as often as we can , but are rarely with the same buddies, and or genrally in mixed groups with unknown skiilsets.
As a relatively new rescue diver ( maybe 60 dives since certification) i have paid more attention and have seen more pancked or out of air divers then I thought possible on dive boats etc .I should note that my dving is generally warm water recreational in the mddle east and east ( red sea , thailand , malaysia etc) and will be on live aboards or day boats. This might matter re buddy context as UK and North American divers tend to dive less in organized groups on large dive boats. Anyway the point is often I am paired with a buddy i just met , and while I do as required (brief and explain my gear ) others definately do not and consistantly a panicked diver simply grabs the nearest regulator genrally out of someones mouth.
The problem ive seen is that it often is not your buddy , but some random person close to you that you might not see coming and grabbing. if i have a long hose and they grab it frm the opposite side (50 percent chance) is it then a wrap /choke hazard for me ? is it not our responsibility to kinda stay in our lane so to speak? While i am a huge (physical size ) and the added length to my hose would be way more comfortable ( ive extended my hose about 20 Cm anyway) , Ive found that my Air 2 and primary donate setup confuses those around me and have since switched back to wearing the octo 2nd for those around me as really thats teh point anyway .
All this said ( i do like my words) what are your thoughts on a longer octo hose versus a long primary ? and how much of a risk is the half wrap around the neck ( tech guys get all upset by the Wrap word) and even on recreational divers that configure "tech" ways , do they inadvertantly cause a risk to those around them?
All I can say is each to there own mate, this suits my diving with my mates so is what I use. Wrap is not an issue for me , long octo sounds good if it suits you and isn’t a snag hazard.
Great tutorial! I'm going to use my sidemount regs for twin set. Just need to get a few hoses 😂
Keep an eye on those o rings for threads coming off them and swap out if any doubts with the right sized replacement
The long/short hose configuration benefits photographers by keeping all the hoses tucked into the body profile, so that your strobe arm clamps don't get caught in the hoses, which I find always happens with the octopus set-up. Many photographers try to deal with that by reversing the clamps (i.e. facing the adjusters forwards, away from the hoses), but I found that hard to maintain throughout a dive, when constantly adjusting strobe positions. So the long/short hose configuration is easier for me, and I've never gone back!
I only ever use a Octopus setup now if a student on an entry level course I'm instructing has one. From then on I try to show the practicality, safety and simplicity of the long hose and as much gas as I can carry too. Thanks for watching
Just discovered this channel. Fantastic production quality and great information. Keep it up!
Cheers mate
Love a long hose!
Hahahah
nice video, I´m suscribed and a fan now.
Quick question: Can this Hogarthian configuration be set up on a jacket BCD? or is it exclusive for a wing?
Hi, thanks for watching and liking what I’m doing. The hog loop will work on a bcd as long as you have the D rings to help support it, the long hose and spg being the points that require somewhere to clip up to. Hope that answers your questions mate
Do you solely rely on a single first stage when diving cold waters? I always thought, that it was the first stage, which tends to freeze up rather than the second stage, hence I've put two second stages on my can.
Yeah but it’s not that cold here and technology has improved so many 1st stages are environmentally sealed now and have louvres built in to dissipate the temperature change to reduce freezing
Very informative video. I consider to switch to long hose myself, love the idea behind it. Can you tell me what length your neck strap for your back up regulator has?
I think it’s about 17” once tied, but it all depends on where you like it to sit.
@@AndytheNorthernDiver thanks! i am gonna buy myself a meter of bungee cord and experiment. Would be ideal to just grab the regulator with my mouth in case of an emergency
@@sandafoks7056 totally agree
Been diving on an octo and jacket BC for 4 years and just bought a harness, BP and wing. I have a plain gauge on the way too as my console is bulky.
If you don't mind, I have a few questions I'd love to hear your answers to.
1) How do you judge the hose length for your secondary second stage (the one you would use if a buddy was out of air)? I'm really struggling to make a judgement call.
For context, I have the DS4 1st stage w/ ATX regs. I've been spending hours trying to decide what lengths to go for.
2) I am also unsure about the 210cm long hose for the diving I do and the size of me - mostly shallow shore diving, and I'm 5ft 4. I take a camera rig with me on every dive.
3) I have trawled through many forum debates about whether or not to go for miflex hoses too. What's your preference? I see you're using a mixture.
4) Do you have an opinion on colour? Should all hoses/regs be black?
Sorry for all the questions, but I found this far more intuitive than the hours of reading I've done so far so figured I'd pop you a comment. Great vid.
Hi Georgie, I use the standard length for the secondary 2nd stage on the necklace, I'm not much bigger than you and 210cm is the right size for any setup for the hog loop, either kind of hose will be suitable but I prefer Miflex for SM as they slide through the cylinder strapps easier than rubber, any colour will do its all personal preference we choose black because thats what we had and the face plates to my wifes are yellow. Thanks for watching hope this answered your questions.
regardless of the wing and back plate , why do you need a long hose system ??
I only ask , as I have a bk plate and wing for reasons I find really beneficial , but im struggling with the idea of a long hose for anything other than confined space ?
@@aevans692 It works well in every situation and configuration, and means that if and when you move on to more technical configurations you have already used the required hose configuration for that setup (Twins/Double or Sidemount). Octo setup doesn't really lend itself to those. So we have future proofed our training, practice and skills ready for the inevitable shift to technical diving. If you're happy with your setup that's absolutely fine.
Having looked into the long hose setup, I can see the benefits. Couple of quick questions! Firstly, I note you dive with a wing, would you recommend a long hose with a jacket style bcd? Secondly, following Covid 19 would you consider keeping your alternate regulator on a 1m hose for a “low on air situation” ie a controlled sharing of air?
I’d recommend what ever suits your style of diving and budget. The jacket bcd and 1m alt reg hose are both popular and work well, but in my opinion for they way I dive, who I dive with and what I think is safer, the wing and long hose work better. I hope that answered your question thanks for watching.
If your buddy is out of gas, fuck covid. Shouldn't compromise anything in that situation.
I have a DIR set-up utilizing an MTX-RC first stage and I am using the top MP port identical to the 5th port on your first stage for my primary 2nd stage. Is there any downfall to having your primary 2nd stage run like that?
The choice of port should be to reduce bends and kinks in your hoses and direct their routing as simply as possible.assuming you have the top port pointing at your right shoulder it sounds ok to me.
If your trilobite is on your top left shoulder, how do you access it once your wing inflate hose is put through it’s black loop on the shoulder strap?
With your hand
Also, looking at it closely, if the hose for the back up reg was shorter would you still need the elbow?
James Sanderson a good point , the elbow is really only needed in my Sidemount config, but for ease in reconfigurations of kit for single and twin, I just leave it on.
What is the standard short hose length for the alternative necklace regulator for single tank and if any difference for the twin set configuration?
Basically with the single tank configuration the hose terminates at the middle base of the divers neck opposed to a twin set terminating behind the divers left shoulder.
Single Alternate Necklace Regulator
Average 22”
55 cm / 21.5 inch to 60 cm / 23.6inch
Honestly mate I use the same hose for both
I can work with that. It’s only a few inches difference at most. 🤙💪🤿
Hi andy is it always necessary to use BCD when scuba diving
I’m struggling to think of a reason not to as a recreational / sport diver
Hey mate, Great video, and I know its pretty old now but can you tell me about your integrated weight in your backplate... I have been struggling to find narrow weights to fit between my twin 12Lt steel tanks (under the wing), and your set-up with weight in front of the plate would help me out. Q) Is it home made or where did you buy it please? Cheers Paul
Hi Paul look at DIRdirect.com that’s who sells them, cheers for watching mate
@@AndytheNorthernDiver thanks I'll hit em up!
@@AndytheNorthernDiver Awesome thanks for that. It seems UK/Euro guys call them P-weights. We can't get them here in Australia foe some reason, but looks like a piece of cake to pour my own... The BP is a perfect mould :)
From my point of view this setup is nice, but better idea is to take at least 10cm shorter backup hose, 5-10cm shorter high pressure hose... and throw out your myflex hoses.
Yeah definitely the lengths but myflex do have their place in my Sidemount kit
By the way Andy, what about a dual first stage in a single cylinder config?
Like H or Y valve, it’s not a common configuration here in the UK but it would work similar to a twin cylinder setup - see other videos in the series
Hi Andy, great video, very informative content - thank you! What do you think about a 150cm hose for the primary regulator instead of the usual 210cm?
My reasoning is that I do not do any cave diving, just recreational. I do feel that the usual set-up is not enough for comfort, but 210cm is too much. Also, I dive in lakes and sometimes the visibility is less than a metre! This means I wouldn't even see my buddy at the end of the 210cm hose...
Do you think 150cm is ok?
I would really appreciate your view on this. :)
Thanks and happy diving!
210cm works perfectly for this setup, I too am not a cave diver but do dive in wrecks where there are restrictions. There’s a fair argument that says two short hoses are enough (in side mount) as you’d hand off your spare cylinder to your buddy and end the dive. But this is how I like my configuration and regardless of my cylinder configuration, the hoses are always the same so it helps both me and my buddy to know where everything is on every dive. Her kit is also configured the same. But how you and anyone else configured there kit is up to them. How did you come up with 150cm? Hope that helps
Thanks so much for the quick reply 😊 I came up with 150cm as I simply cannot seem to find a 180cm hose! 180cm would probably be better as I am not tall and it would have resulted in a nice streamline configuation. @@AndytheNorthernDiver
So what I had in mind would be 150cm for my primary regulator which is what I would hand over to my buddy, and the secondary regulator on a bungee around my neck, just as you have. I can still tuck the primary 150cm hose under my arm and around my neck, but there is no looping in my belt or under the cannister.
@@tanjadupuis6629 I’m 165cm tall if that helps but looped properly under my torch and round my head, it’s still slick, if a little long you can always tuck it in your waist belt
@@tanjadupuis6629 if it works it’s not wrong
Why isn’t the primary donate hose in yellow color?
Because it’s not an octopus mate. Often in technical diving, divers carry identical kit configurations, they are self sufficient and don’t rely on a dive master (they would likely have a surface supervisor). At this advanced level of diving it’s expected that divers remain calm and won’t panic so the visual stimulation of a yellow hose isn’t required. They would usually carry some form of redundant gas supply for themselves also.
Hope that resolved your question 🤞🏼
if i have two different regulators, should i not swap out my "octo" hose with a long hose? and save some money to swap both?
Do as you see fight that fits your budget mate, the reason we use two of the same is so both in theory fit the first stage and they’ll breathe the same. Hope that helps
@@AndytheNorthernDiver it helps✌
I like the idea behind the long hose but I think I’ll stick to my octopus for now.
For me it was always the simplicity and functionality of that method. It fits every open circuit configuration I use - single, twins and sidemount, so other than the cylinders changing everything else is the same. Certainly for a new diver consistency is the easiest thing they can control.
That's fine. Once you get into more demanding situations, such as wreck dives and even cavern and cave dives, a long hose configuration becomes more important since you may not be able swim close together to use an octopus. When swimming single file in a wreck you'll need a long hose to donate gas. But by that time you should have received training for that scenario.
Agreed, I think a octopus really has no place in diving outside of the swimming pool, certainly in any penetration or diving at depth.
It looks to me there’s nothing plugged at the 5th port? Can you do a closeup? I’m thinking of getting the DS4 as my first regulator for long hose configuration, and that doesn’t have a 5th port conversion.
Correct there’s nothing in it on single cylinder setup, but when used on twinset it is. See my other videos
@@AndytheNorthernDiver thanks! So would you recommend against getting the DS4 if one day I may want to progress to doubles? Or could I perhaps use it as a stage regulator or augment it with a DST for the doubles?
@@orestismarkou534 ds4 works well for singles bail out, stages etc. but dst is better for twins ‘in my opinion’
@@AndytheNorthernDiver thank you! Assuming that regulators like this will probably last “a lifetime” I think it’s good to have room to grow. Shame to have to buy a new one down the line, right?
@@orestismarkou534 totally mate these are a safe buy 100%
Been diving this summer with long hose setup along with my backplate and wing. Don’t see any reason to go back to traditional.
Great stuff mate it seems to work well for every OC setup I use and promotes a strong platform for user friendly muscle memory development
Why's there a 90° elbow joint on the backup?
Andrew Pilley honestly only because I use the same hoses and regulators for single, twin and Sidemount setups. So for ease and less chance of damage to the o rings I leave it on, but it’s not a requirement for any but the Sidemount setup.
Would you not turn the first stage the other way and route the long hose from the 5th stage. It cleans up the hose routing at the first stage. It does point the seal upwards but Apeks have some of their first stages intentionally designed to point the seal upwards.
*the 5th port!
I suppose there’s many ways to route your hoses, this in how I do mine and think it works best for me. I don’t think there’s any added benefit to doing it using the 5th port but if people do and turn the reg 90deg then I’m happy for them
@@AndytheNorthernDiver it just routes all the hoses down, which for me is advantageous although I never like having the seal pointing upwards.
All good except for the cable tie and O ring, cord is more secure.
Hi Mark, security is not my issue with cord but the ability to breakaway quickly. I have found that cord has come undone on one occasion just as the o ring has broken on a dive both are a pain either are good ways. I've even seen people using 2x cylinder o rings which seem tougher to break! Thanks for watching
How long is the long hose?
Have you looked in the description of this video for the information? Each hose is detailed in the video and description. It’s 2.1m
Why is the 5th port pointed upwards?
To allow the turret to twist freely and protect the Enviromental seal, thanks for watching.
@@AndytheNorthernDiver do you actually plug anything in the 5th port?
another grat video not sure I would like that thou
Alan Donaldson thanks mate just finishing the twin set episode. It’s truly a great setup very simple and sensible suitable for all types of diving
That's fine. Once you get into more demanding situations, such as wreck dives and even cavern and cave dives, a long hose configuration becomes more important since you may not be able swim close together to use an octopus. When swimming single file in a wreck you'll need a long hose to donate gas. But by that time you should have received training for that scenario.
How did you get to be so handsome or were you always this way?
Largely by my wife’s help with my skin care routine, thanks for being so kind 🤪
@@AndytheNorthernDiver that's a lucky lady
Just call it primary and secondary, without the “second stage” identifier. We all know not to donate the first stage haha.
Hahahah fair point, but for the less informed I wanted to be clear, although it did become a tongue twister, thanks for watching mate
Backup is a little long with that swivel on it.
Agreed, only left on from my Sidemount setup for ease
@@AndytheNorthernDiver I'm using long hose for the first time on a liveaboard trip this week. Single tank, back inflate need to get s swivel for my secondary.
"Upermost" mmmmmmmmm
Matt Glynn lols