The End of White Christian America: A Conversation with E. J. Dionne and Robert P. Jones
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- Опубликовано: 21 фев 2018
- America is no longer a majority white Christian nation. Journalist, author, commentator, and Washington Post columnist E.J. Dionne and Dr. Robert P. Jones, author of "The End of White Christian America," discuss this seismic change, its impact on the politics and social values of the United States, and its implications for the future.
Learn more about Harvard Divinity School: hds.harvard.edu/
Now that evangelicals have replaced Jesus with trump I cannot take seriously anymore.
Are you denouncing Trump’s miracles?
I hear there is a Trump Tower of INFERNO being built !!! Eagerly awaiting the HYPOCRATS!!!
True. You can't serve two Lords. You will love one and love the other less. Jesus said so.
I see you can vote for whoever you want including Trump (It is a free country), but don't say it's because of your Christian values.
They have rationally concluded that Trump with all his faults is a better friend to Christians than someone like Hillary Clinton.
Mike Reseigh evangelicals will elect anyone, including Trump, as long as that person will appoint judges who will stop the killing of innocent babies from being killed.
As adults my children decided to excluded religion from their lives. I was seriously disturbed by this and during one Thanksgiving family gathering I asked my children, why? Each child explained very meticulously as to, why. They were all very clear to one point, they were tired of feeling GUILTY! They wanted to live their own lives as they saw fitting to move forward in this world without barriers. They felt that religion put a lot of barriers in their way and restricted them from being themselves and always questioning everything they did.They understood good and evil and that being human makes them imperfect.They let me know that the only sure thing in life is you're born and you will die. In-between that, "we want to live our lives, our way" and not guided by what COULD happen after we die.This was 10 years ago and just recently I was told I have lung cancer. I have opted not to do treatment and my children have rallied around my decision in a positive and supportive way. I had a very "trying" life and lot of regrets but at peace with the legacy I am leaving behind.
@Dee Sayers How's your faith?
💔💔💔💔
Well gee the mob could have given you a few more likes..
I love it that you asked them why..
I loved your short written story.
It’s quite obvious you are a fine person. EDIT: lol I just saw that u posted only 5 hours ago..
Good luck, Dee ❤️
The kids were a symbol of stupidity !!!
In Europe, if a politician mentions their religious affiliation, they are rejected as pandering.
Politicians should keep their religion to themselves.
I love that
Any belief about the way the world IS, and WHY it is here and WHY we are here in it is a "religion". Sadly the "religion" of secular humanism has replaced the Truth of God as found in the Bible upon which this country was founded, first with Puritans and Pilgrims, then in the Founding Fathers. The religion of secular humanism was probably put into full practice in the French Revolution when it was enthroned as "Reason" - of course their rejection of Truth and God led to one of the most bloodiest slaughters and oppression - of course, every place on Earth where there is no Bible, there is no freedom, little Bible - little freedom. And that is why all the godless heathens of third world pagan countries risk their lives to flood into America - one of the few countries left now that has a remnant of believers. But as geopolitical and technological events only confirm the end-time prophecies of the Bible as this last wicked empire of man reaches its well-deserved demise, I'm sure rebellious, prideful, hardcore, unrepentant people like yourself will continue to willfully close your eyes to what God has created you to know within your inner being.
Well in America they don't do that they love to put their religion out there so far out there. To the point where you have an evangelistical Christian Church that wants to put politicians and even supreme Court justices in place to enforce their religious beliefs on American people. And unfortunately a lot of that belief is racist and ideology that only white people should be in charge of this country.
I may be wrong but, wasn't most of Europe's governing monarchy based on religion and almighty God, namely Catholics? So the people were to worship their God or be punished, even death!?! What changed?
Amen! I mean, Hell Yeah! We could do with some of that around here Fo sho!
I've recently seen an Evangelical preacher spew all types of hate and dehumanizing remarks to a cheering congregation. It's disgusting and if that's the message I don't want any part of it.
@J H the bible is worse than the evangelical preachers, that's why they base their hate in the bible.
@@bluester7177 Do you HATE the Bible?
And the utterly shocking exposure of the years long, secret group of Pedophiles and Rapists within the SOUTHERN BAPTIST CHURCH.
@@forgiven2812
Are you going to be STUPID all of your pitiful life?
You DO KNOW that the JESUS guy DIDN'T write any of it....
NOT ONE WORD!
Just a bunch of hateful, vindictive weak-minded men who have easily poisened obvious fools like you!
@ J H
So subject yourself to personal cognitive biases and self-delusion?
Burden of proof requirements fall squarely upon the god-character creator claimant, Not upon the reasonable skeptic. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, claims presented without competent evidence are readily dismissed without evidence as distracting reckless speculations. "Prove all things " (1 Thessalonians 5:21).
"Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect" (1 Peter 3:15).
What created the alleged god-character creator? Then, What created the specific god-character creator you claim? Then, What created the creator that created the specific god-character creator you claim? Then, What created the creator that created the creator that created your specific god-character creator? Ad infinitum.... .
It's a reasonable presumption that you are an unwitting victim of religious indoctrination/ childhood brainwashing as put forth in Proverbs 22:6, which reads, "Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not [easily] depart from it."
If i was an agnostic, the televangelical preachers turned me into a committed atheist.
@Doug Bevins They matter because they are political and they misguide their sheep into voting against their interests.
@Sum ting Wong Right on. Taking advantage of others' gullibility is anti-Christian IMHO.
They do not represent Religion. They are Conmen.
NO ONE can turn you into anything, but YOU !!
Yes - you'd have been politicized to the polar opposite
The disenfranchised ( the young and the black people) wanted Bernie Sanders, because he spoke to their needs - like affordable housing, affordable, quality education, affordable healthcare,
jobs that paid a living wage, pensions etc., taxing of the rich, - which none of the churches were addressing. PEACE!!!!
The Democratic party conspired against Bernie Sanders! We need a young Social Democratic Bernie, who will that be?
wrong. Most of the black community wanted Hillary. But she wasn't pure enough for the white progressives and wouldn't guarantee to wipe away their student loans. Many stayed home. Some voted Jill Stein and a few even voted Trump. But yes it is white people that got us into the mess we are in, including the white far left Bernie crowd
Yes! I was rooting for Hillary because elections are like that. But your message was loud and clear. ✊💟
I think the black church and possibly some of the old out of the mainstream catholic churches are the only ones who may practice true Christianity most of the rest are havens if theft and platforms of political influence and manipulation,I saw this first hand at a church in alamogordo new mexico with a preacher named gene Brock who was telling the whole congregation how he expected them to vote if they were true Christians, I got up and walked out but a congregation of at least 100 stayed without even one other person following me out! It was as if they were a bunch of unthinking sheep being led to the slaughter!
Sanders also used Scandinavian countries as his example of how socialism works well. He lied. I didn’t check Finland, but Denmark, Sweden, and Norway dumped their brief experiments with Socialism. They couldn’t get rid of the Social programs, but they stopped making the well off and rich pay for most of them. EVERYBODY pays between 30-52% in income taxes. None have a minimum wage. When the economy is in a slump payouts go down. If a business is having problems the employers and employees talk about how to cut their incomes. Having a paycheck is better than not having one. Everybody just tightens their belt. In Sweden about half the schools are “for profit”. The money follows the children. If the parent can enroll the child 30 miles from home and get them there, no problem. About half the hospitals are “for profit”. Citizens take their vouchers to whichever hospital they want.
There seems to be hiccups when it comes to the not free free college. Before Covid Swedish college students and graduates had a higher average student loan debt than America. They did not explain that. I guess not every college expense is paid for out of the high income taxes.
I am not religious. I am old. Our government no longer says much about religions nor the religious who donate money, goods, services, and other things during disasters here and abroad. And just to help locally. They often get people and stuff to the disaster before our government does. Non religious people do the same. Most of my life Americans, not our government, were considered the most generous in the world during times of need. The media pretty much stopped reporting about the about 30 years ago. I can’t remember when they ever reported what other countries did. Separate from the UN.
I am a stranger. You should not believe everything strangers tell you. That includes politicians, intellectuals, academics, entertainers, teachers, and so on and so forth. I found out Sanders was not being truthful when I checked some of what actually happens in the Free Market, not socialist, countries he referenced in 2015.
If you have an all powerful faith and your soul is saved what do you have to “fight to the death over?” You should be living a life in peace.
Spoken like a child of God, the true one, not these one verse charlies walking around in mass with thier guns ready to take peace and life...
The government under which Jesus lived was corrupt and oppressive; on every hand were crying abuses,-extortion, intolerance, and grinding cruelty. Yet the Saviour attempted no civil reforms. He attacked no national abuses, nor condemned the national enemies. He did not interfere with the authority or administration of those in power. He who was our example kept aloof from earthly governments. Not because He was indifferent to the woes of men, but because the remedy did not lie in merely human and external measures. To be efficient, the cure must reach men
Ellen G. White, The Desire of Ages
Because Christians have been under attack for hundreds of years as well as the Jewish people and in their case, they generally don't believe in the Massai which God punishes as the Jewish are Gods chosen people (Christ was Jewish) and Hiter murdered the Jews and Christians were put in the lion's den or burned and it all boils down to Satan controlling man to destroy the death burial and resurrection of Christ quite simple.
Followers of Christ experience more challenges after giving their life to Christ because of the hatred they face. Peace of mind through Christ is a by product of learning to accept this worlds need for salvation. “God forgive them as they no not what they do”.
The church has murdered millions claiming they are the one and only stealing other cultures assets the whole way and calling them uncivilized, heathens,and even saying that Aztec were not even human more like a ape and then after robbing all their gold deciding to change their mind that the were human after all but not before the murdered them and robbed them blind!
I went personally to this event. And the conversation was so White British that I was reminded where the racism killings began and why. Sadly
None-christian white religions are also on the rise and one or two has abandoned the ideal that their of the human species and are using new words, labels or words in new ways to describe themselves other then baby pink or white. The word Daynar among a few others seem to be slowly replacing Caucasian and this may be a result of the left misusing the word with others just continue to use older words to describe themselves using more nationalistic words like German, Germanic, Celt, welsh, Irish with at least one that includes a religion is claiming their light elves that lost their pointed ears. People alter , create new words and change words for one reason or other and such thing spread through interactions of people. Peace is easiest achieved by separation of groups not forcing them to share the same space that causes conflict, hate and chaos.
I think the reason young people are moving away from religion is because they are actually reading the bible and thinking for themselves instead of just taking the sermon to be gospel spoken by someone that is paid to keep them in the flock.
Also these religions appeal to the weak, the old at heart - heaven seems to be one vast Retirement Home, billions sitting about doing nothing, a lazy, idle, useless & pointless existence for eternity!
Makes no sense!
Young people are moving away from religion because they're actually reading the Bible?
@@drfunk444 yes because unlike being brainwashed people they see all these children's stories, magic, miracle & understand these are fantasies not real
@@ramaraksha01 It would be pure torture. Imagine how bored you would be after the first 10^^10000000000 years.
@@harrycooper5231 That is why it is a fantasy, it cannot be real
Every time I ask these people what does one DO in Heaven/spiritual world etc, they run away!
Can you describe ONE DAY to me? They run away!
What is sad to see is that these are bright, educated, intelligent people who even after I show them how ridiculous these ideas are - Why would any magic being have billions of lazy bums sitting about shamelessly sponging off him, an idle, useless & pointless existence for eternity - they will run away rather than face the fact that their religion is exploiting them - telling them what they want to hear
It shouldn't be this way - not in the 21st century, not with the world filled with bright, educated people who question everything until they get to religion and then it is nodding to everything religion spews out like zombies!
Amazing, just amazing and a lot frightening!
Faith without works is Dead
What do u mean by that? And that’s a sincere question. I’m not trying to pick an argument
But works without faith is just humanity.
@Matt F ..... it is from the Book of James (2:26) & is the main theme in James Epistle www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2%3A14-26&version=NKJV
"Faith" is what's left after you run out of logic, evidence and thought.
@@MattFRox It's a statement from the Bible, and is generally understood to refer to the need for people to live out their faith with good works, things like charity, otherwise the faith isn't considered so meaningful if it doesn't lead to charitable action.
The evangelicals are fighting this tooth and nail. One of the reasons for the Jan. 6 riot.
Yes, LORTTTT!
@@cheryl6404 you my dear are Qlueless.
@@cheryl6404 there is already enough evidence in to com e to a reasonable conclusion. Why is faith now "disbelief in things seen" with evangelicals? For example, there were multiple scenes of people praying at the riots. Proof that evangelicals made up some of the rioters. Which is exactly what I claimed. At least believe the obvious, or remain Qlueless.
@@johnelliott5859
Your post is 100% on point ... grown ups believing in fairytales is exactly how the Qanon movement was able to gain traction in the first place...
@@cheryl6404 it's obvious if you don't research Christianity and become aware of how wrong you are you will continue to go through life blindly
When an evangelical comes to my door to tell me the good news I tell that person I don't want to join the republican party and then I shut the door.
@The Richest Man In Babylon yup Republicans are Neanderthals 😝
@J H People hate Republicans because of their hypocrisy. Nothing Christian in today’s Republican Party. It is all about greed, money , power and non sense. All of a sudden , people of value fall in love with prostitute Trump 😝
My son would have them questioning themselves when they came to our door never came back & bare in mind I believe in God & raised him so.
Well that’s just ignorance, Seymour.
@@Strika_713 God's chosen people don't believe Jesus is god's son so why should i ?
Let's make something perfectly clear: God doesn't have a religion.
Define ‘God.’ Define ‘religion.’ Define ‘to have’.
And lastly: how the hell would you know?
@@dorothysay8327, Hi Dorothy; I'm one of those nuts cases that believe that The Most High God and the Inner Most God are One and the same. So my quick answer is, ask your own heart. You'll get it. Sent with love. moi
Jesus Christ
@Bill Ng Jesus is Lord
@Bill Ng the Holy Bible says it ALL
Another way to summarize the disparity between those two polls at the beginning would be, 42% of white American evangelicals completely reversed their stance on a supposed core tenet of their politics for no other reason than, it enabled them to support a leader who violated not just one, but _most_ of their supposed principles.
Another way to put that would be, almost half of white American evangelicals were revealed to value political power over supposed principles, and it took only a tiny amount of research one of of those supposed principles to find that many.
Imagine if we did this for every issue over a period of decades. I wonder how many principled people, as defined by actions and not vague platitudes, would be left.
When faced with a choice in political leaders and who we should elect, we should elect a leader who is going to put the interests of the people first. If that leader is not an example of mostly Godly living, it is not hypocrisy to vote for him, for the other candidates can't be considered Godly if they are corrupt and ignore the concerns of the people.
In your above statement, you make it seem as if white Christians supported ungodly behavior. No, they do not. One can remain principled while voting for the lesser of two or more evils.
In politics, we never have Jesus himself running for office.
BRAVO👏 👏 👏 GOD Bless you. all do respect, to me the WHITE evangelical church is the tower of CORRUPTION HYPOCRISY materialism and GREED. and have taken their GREEDY PROSPERITY GOSPEL all over the POOREST COUNTRIES IN THE WORLD. DESPICABLE 😢
The surveys were speaking to behaviors not candidates.
It's very, very hard to be a principled person and most people of all religions and ideologies don't want to work that hard.
@@gatormama75 Yes, but we know the real reason for their shift. They love Trump more than they love their supposed principles, their country, or even their god. Simple as that.
It's about time. Evangelical practitioners preach through fear and intimidation.
No. They preach reality. You’re just an emotional addict of your own desires. A total looser in that respect. But you chose that so don’t complain.
Fear is a mighty motivator. Once the proper frightfulness has been attained, you can make people do just about anything.
BS I'm sick of the left - they control pop culture , the press , Hollywood and Academia - abd this Orwellian 'woke' censureship is corrosive to the free exchange of ideas and this 'cats' at Harvard carry that water for censureship !
God preached through fear and intimidation. Check the Old Testament: lots of murder, rape, and enslavement under God’s guidance there.
@@adeleennis2255 Christianity is the new testament. Not very smart.
I really think that if Christianity practiced what it preaches, it wouldn’t have a problem. No more of this “do what I say, not what I do”!
Christians are practicing what they preach, but they are not practicing what Jesus Christ preached. Concerning the Kingdom of God. The believers first called Christian was coined at Antioch. At no time did Jesus Christ ( the messiah) said to the disciples you are to be called ( Christian). Neither did Jesus visit here was to establish a religion Called christianity... there is no place in the entire written Word of God that the followers of the way of Christ were to be called Christians, the Apostles and Prophets they never heard of that name until they reached Antioch. At no time did any of them called each other Christians. ( Acts 11: 25-26). The church at Antioch never called themselves Christian. It is a Counterfeit " Gospel " enacted by the Sorcerer Simon Magus who tried to buy an Apostleship inGod'sChurch (Acts 8:9-25).
Thereupon this Simon appropriated the NAME of Christ, calling his Babylonian mystery religion "Christianity " Satan moved this man and used him as his instrument to persecute and all but destroy the true Church of God. By the end of the first century, probably around A.D.70 he managed to suppress the message Christ had brought from God.
By about A.D. 58 when the Apostles Paul wrote his letter to the Galatians, many ( the believers of Jesus Christ) were already turning to this now new Counterfeit " gospel " ( Galatians 1:6-7)...(2 Thessalonians 2:7)
Christianity, a religion of iniquity, lawlessness, a religion rejecting the law of God.
In the book of revelation there are two churches. Each go under the NAME of Christ. The twelve chapter, portrays the true Church of God. The other, in the seventeenth chapter, called " Mystery, Babylon the great, Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the earth " ( verse 5 ).
(2 Corinthians 11:2-4, 13-15). Don't take my word, read it for yourself. Why God Almighty allowed to happened? In order for the true Church believers to be able to differentiate His True Church from the false Counterfeit church.
All through out the entire relationship of God and man there was never a moment that God had prophesied that those who were to follow Jesus Christ were to be called Christians. Jesus never said it, the Apostles nor the Prophets never said it, there is no known written word of God that has penned it!
@@ernestmorellsr7929
Believing in fairytales solves nothing... help change humanity for the better.. our children’s lives are more important than ridiculous myths !!!
My reason for being an atheist isn't because Christian don't practice what they preach. My reason for walking away from faith was realizing that the bible is not historical, and the main doctrines of Christianity are immoral.
Simple as that.
@@ernestmorellsr7929 if you actually read the bible tho Jesus was a bit of a bigot , it was Paul that pushed Christianity to the Gentiles. I think the "Christian Nationalists" have done a good job of reconstructing the Jewish Zealot movement of the early 1st century and Christianity is partially derived from it. It was the Zealots (Judas of Galilee) who were all about "cleansing the temple".
You know why they needed moneychangers? Jews had to go to the temple to make atonement sacrifices. But many lived outside of Israel and would use Roman money that had the graven images of deified emperors on them. They couldn't really use that in the temple as it would be a sin. So they had to swap their Roman money for "kosher" Jewish money to buy animals or other items to give as offerings.
@@pwoods100 would you mind listing the top three main doctrines? would love to understand more.
Watching in June of 2022. Still very relevant.
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
The tools that evangelicals taught me to interpret the Bible are the same tools I used to inadvertently leave orthodoxy. I unexpectedly felt a sense of freedom to be my True Self.
You know something...you have that experience in common with a famous world leader....Josef Stalin...he also was going down the road of faith when he abruptly decided he wanted to be free of it. And he became his true self...or rather ...what all people truly are apart from God...depraved.
@@markanthony3275 Thanks. But there's a difference between leaving orthodoxy and leaving God. It wasn't one thing that changed my mind but rather a culmination of various things: existential crisis, self-discovery ("finding myself"), meditation and silent prayers (hearing the Holy Spirit within), stories of near-death experiences, documentaries on children who had past lives, metaphysics, epistemology, religious epistemology, spiral dynamics, ego development, and social science. Even when I was a fundamentalist, I was already naturally an out-of-the-box thinker.
@@kindlerashod So you never considered the Bible ? I didn't see that in your list of authoritative sources, I just saw the usual pagan ones which equate to SELF as God. You do realize that unconditional acceptance of the inspired word of God and acceptance of the person and work of Jesus Christ is the only way to be connected to God...right ? If not , then I was correct in saying you have a lot in common with Josef Stalin , who saw himself as god.
@@markanthony3275 I did use the Bible. In my previous comment, I said that the same tools that evangelicals taught me to interpret the Bible are the tools I've always been using.
Are you familiar with Christian apologetics? Apologetics is a branch of theology that focuses on defending the Christian faith, usually with the use of philosophy and science. One of my favorite apologists is Frank Turek. He's a well-spoken guy.
When theologians study the Bible, they use more than just the Bible to understand reality. The theologians rely on historical science, linguistics, and cultural studies to help them interpret the Bible. They understand that their interpretations of scriptures would be different had they NOT considered the historical and cultural context.
There are some Christian apologists who say that God is the author of two books: The Bible and nature. There are a few scriptures that imply knowledge can be found in nature outside the Bible: Job 12:7-10, Romans 1:20, and Psalm 19:1-2. In other words, think of the Bible as "all of reality" instead of just a book. There are some things I learned in church/Bible that I did not learn elsewhere, there are some things I've learned elsewhere but not from the Bible, and then there are some things I've learn from both the Bible and elsewhere.
What's interesting about near-death experiences, for example, is that there's a common theme found in the stories of those who've had them. Christians and non-Christians alike have had near-death experiences. Some of these people say that there is no hell and that all major religions lead to God. The Christians who say these things are fully aware that they are saying that contradict what they've learned in church all their lives. They understand that their stories conflict with traditional theology.
On one hand, you could say these "Christians" were already weak in their faith and were more prone to believe in delusions. You could say their delusions caused them to "misinterpret" their own near-death experiences. But what's interesting is that there are atheists who also had near-death experiences and are now no longer atheists. These Christians and non-Christians say that human interpretation of the Bible caused us to believe that Christianity is the only true religion. However, I didn't change my mind because of these near-death stories. It was a combination of different things.
How do we know for sure with 100% certainty that Christianity is the one true religion. Muslims feel that Islam is the one true religion. How do we know the Muslims are wrong and Christians are 100% correct?
@@kindlerashod Jesus said "I AM the way, the truth and the life" those are exclusive truth statements that leave no room for any alternative . I have to apologize to you , in reading your post , I realized you were not just another new age quack mixing psychology with mysticism into some kind of a quasi religious demonic spirituality. I see that you are paying attention to some decent people like Turek . Here's another way you can distinguish Christianity from Islam ...Christianity is prophetically accurate...for example , John received a Revelation from Jesus Christ about 15 years after the Jewish temple was destroyed in 70 A.D. . Part of the prophecy includes the mention of persecution of Israel by the anti-christ, and a third temple. But how could this be when it had all just been destroyed ? In order for there to be a third temple , there had to be a nation . In the O.T. God asks a prophet " Can a nation be born in one day ?"...and that's precisely what happened , in one day , in May , 1948 Israel again became a nation. No such descriptions of the future exist in Islam...no such miracles are described in the Koran.
When was there ever a white Christian America? You must practice what you preach in order to be a Christian nation or person.
What church is called the wight one? never herd of it.
You got that right, Loretta Woodson!!!
To me Christians are not or should not be a race thing.Go and teach all nations.Jesus said.
You are right!
The bible is a horrendous book of fairytales....
If Right wing politically affiliated Christians in the US would actually practice Christianity, they wouldn't be in this situation.
This is what happens when Religious people try and take political power. Read and follow the New testament
You are the one who dictates what is authentic Christianity?
Funny, the United States was a overwhelmingly white Christian nation that unfortunately decided to open up its borders to non-white non-Christian people from all over the world. And look at what we get in return. . .accusations of racism, white privilege, systemic racism, inherent bias, bla bla bla. And yet these same non-white non-Christian countries do not do he same. They have very strict immigration and citizenship laws that are designed to keep their ethnic/racial (even religious) majority the same.
I think the State of Israel should open up their borders to anyone that would like to come there.
@@republitarian484 Israel has many Islamic citizens
@@shihyuchu6753 . . . but they don't have full rights. And why not just have open borders for Israel? And what is Right of Return? That's wacist.
@@republitarian484 What rights dont they have?
I'm so White I could hid in a snow storm.......but I can not vote Republican because I believe in science and decency
@kristof verbruggen Both sides are criminal and the country as you know and remember it, is doomed!
@kristof verbruggen I mean you know what they say about politicians. Probably I wouldn't be surprised. But if you're asking for something detailed right off hand I don't know of anything.
so white, that 'White' is your last name! sorry, but i had to state the obvious. But you are wise
Science doesn't support decency
Here we go again . You and Gladiator should date or at least join FB together.
No one wonders that could it be that as the Evangelicals become more radicalized in their "faith" they drive more and more people away.
Know them by their fruits. What are the fruits of indoctrinated hatreds?
I pray that will be their doom!! Sadly they will resort to more and more radicalisation and destruction in their journey to doom!
and the other side of christianity don't stand up to the hypocrites, false prophets...they say
"I can't judge"...spineless.
Believing in fairytales is dangerous to humanity !!! Grow up kids these religious doctrines are retarding the world !!!
That's what the enemy wants to cause confusion and use the human race to do his dirty work, and some of
us are falling into it
let's get closer to the true God and ask God to open our minds and hearts to get closer to Him and the word , because man can not save us only Jesus
Jesus said to give to Caesar that which belongs to him and to God that whish is His. I see him staying out of politics and instead focusing on loving the unlovable and giving sacrificially.
Mark Twain said “ when the first conman , met the first fool, religion was born. “Lol
Anti-semite. How dare you speak of God's Chosen Ones that way. Jews are very open minded people right?
Mark Twain said a lot of things. How was He a reflection Christ? Better yet was he a Believer at all?
Cool, we finally found someone who actually believed Hillary is a "deeply religious person" when she told us.
Exactly!
Hilary what about emails to Leading the death of M Ghadaffi nothing is said about her and Obama all this wars
People often believe what they want to believe, without knowing why they want to believe it. It’s the insidious way our subconscious mind feeds beliefs to our conscious mind. It seems to me that hatred of Hillary Clinton falls into that category, and I can’t tell from your comment which side of the fence you’re on.
If Hillary was a deeply religious person she as secretary of state would not have covertly sent weapons to benghasi she would not have a private unaccountable server hidden from scrutiny in colorado or enacted those government communications she does however have one religion and that is sale of influence to the highest bidders , covert weapons running and involvement in drug running worldwide Iran contra and other
Based on the empirical data that comes out of "white" interaction with indigenous people, isn't the term white Christian a bit oxymoronic?
well said, sir..... well said
Read a good book or two. Moronic describes these remarks quite well.
To be a Christian, don’t you actually have to follow what He said? Or is it like here- where they have replaced the Lord with themselves?
@@michaelharris6662 Jesus of Nazareth prepared his body for thirty years to receive the Christ consciousness. As a result gifts are manafest. The astral body is a way of viewing this phenomenon and what is meant by eternal life.
Chaplain Bob Walker B. Th. C
Talk starts at 6:06
That's always helpful to know, thanks.
Oh lord, thank you so much.
From 1:15:12. Please don't Think there will be 'Two Heavens'! God reads hearts. Racism in the world it bad enough. But racism in the church of Jesus Christ, is unacceptable! It's so sad! 😔🙏
Please think about the reasons you hold your beliefs. Did you reach these beliefs through evidence?
I am White, Christian, and perfectly comfortable in the Democratic Party
That's because you're "medicated"....good for you!
Well why wouldn't you be? Words have changed their meanings, especially sonce propaganda has been on steroids with internet news replacing print media. Terms like "White Christians" is such a loaded code word that means something different than what it may seem. I take it and replace Christian with facist, it fits better. Now you can leave the white as it's meaning is still the acceptable meaning of pinkish hued Europeans.
@@johnnytocino9313 Sad, but true, but I prefer to think of it as people who have not received the revelation. I am not as harsh on the Evangelicals for in some ways they are good people who follow biblical teachings, it is just the corrupting nature of power that corrupts, and they have had too much power for too long.
@@Zyworski bottom line- power. You said it bettet than anyone.
Bumper sticker i saw once:
Lord save me from your followers.
There were German Christians who were quite comfortable in the Nazi Party.
Religion is evaporating. Wonderful.
If all that we were to debate was the existence or non existence of god that would be one thing but ignoring the stupid policies and manifestations of s##t that is replacing religion would be quite another. How foolish can people be? Islam has no intentions of evaporating along with white Christianity and that is just one of the factors that will have negative consequences . Jerkoffs thinking this is simply an intellectual issue need to wake the hell up. That is what this presentation concerned itself with. Evaporation of white Christianity NOT RELIGION AS A WHOLE. Measure the consequence . England, Sweden, France , Denmark, Germany etc etc etc etc . I'm glad your so optimistic.
Good luck handling with agressivo islamists in the near future.
By religion do you mean dogma? I think being of service and a regard for all life is religion and the rituals of sheep are something else yet again. Pass the collection plate?
I do not see what there is to celebrate ? Manipulation by an institution to create an order favoring a hierarchy of control is not a religious feeling in life. Are you sure you are not talking about cults?
The religious drive is going the way of the sex drive. Which is to say, it's not going anywhere. It's just changing, perhaps evolving. Who knows.
Where are the answers about wealth consolidation, mass incarceration, the perpetuated horrors on non-whites/ect????????????????
Could this mean actual separation of church and state? Dare we hope?
I hope so with God's grace and starting to act more and more like Pharisees.
Republicans are losing the special interest group they began to cultivate in the 70's. ?? Not likely. They need people stupid enough to work like slaves for heaven.
Not after the Supreme Court got nasty.
@@glendabarton45barton48 the supreme Court is a groom Court picked off a list of judges from a federation who is ran by white evangelistical right-wing so-called Christians. They don't care about the law they have an ideology out of step with a 21st century. Manchurian candidates on the supreme Court. Said to bring back racist sexes barbaric laws. I have no respect or use for them. The nothing more than puppets. My faith lies in God.
@@glendabarton45barton48 I was just typing what you said
I'm glad this seems to be a largely inclusive, understanding, and "love"-based perspective/discussion of Christianity, but I feel like there's a huge blind spot of this analysis which effectively shifts it in a different direction entirely: capitalism. It would seem quite difficult for a Christian morality based on kindness and love for others to persist when people's material survival is dictated by an amoral economic system which fuels production by incentivizing the exact _opposite_ values and fundamentally is anchored in a power disparity between capital and the working class. I feel like a discussion of politics without a discussion of economics is going to misdirect and largely rely on aesthetics and subconscious biases to give the illusion of consistency because it is fundamentally missing half of the equation regarding how power is distributed in society. Cornel West and of course MLK jr. are some obvious but fantastic ambassadors to this sort of Christian socialist ideological framework.
Karl Marx's theory of Capitalism coincides with this discussion!
Blah blah blah.... Look how big tech is going to controling you and what and how you think
lol kindness and love with one side of the mouth & from the other side comes "if you are not with Jesus, you get hell" - what does it say about us when in the 21st century, the dominant religions are Master/Slave religions?
Any parent would ask - "what have you done with your life? Have you made me proud? Have you helped others?"
Instead this God asks, "what is your religion?" - that is a Master asking are you loyal to me or not?
In the 21st century the top religions Gods are no better than a Putin or Saddam, only interested in satisfying their own ego
@@ramaraksha01 You're definitely not wrong of course sadly, basically the point Nietzsche really hammers home in The Antichrist as I'm sure you're aware. It's actually Nietzsche who convinced me that "God" stripped of its proprietary garb and superficial distinctions is more of a universal representation a social consensus of collective values and by our very condition of consciousness, an unavoidable one at that even if we fail to recognize it, as his proclamation toward God being dead in context was not merely to state the obvious but to describe how God has only been killed in a very specific aesthetic form and will simply unconsciously move to some other form of a guiding principle which will simply now be more difficult to recognize, if that makes sense. To which I would say capitalism or more generally the worship of individual material wealth has filled this necessary social vacuum. I think it's quite transparent in the evolution of protestantism in America in particular with various sects emerging that display this absurdly transparently notably in "prosperity gospel" insanity. Max Weber's Capitalism and the Spirit of Capitalism made this point of course in the early 20th century, but so did Marx himself as someone said earlier, generating a material explanation for this evolution in dialectical and historical materialism.
Anyway, I guess my specific point in particular was trying to draw the distinction of what religion _can_ be or rather its potential as a unifying ideological focal point in opposition to how it manifests as you're obviously rightly pointing out, as a "slave morality", as a result of (I would argue) precisely how we organize material reality, ie capitalism. In other words, I feel like what's often referred to as "liberation theology" has incredible potential to unify the meaningful transcendent throughlines of a metaphorical religion toward an expansion of moral imagination to not only include others but _free_ them from the social bondage you're pointing out.
Hopefully that made sense, I would also just quickly mention that there's no need to go to Putin or Saddam haha...but don't get me started on our similarly distorted manichean foreign policy, I'd just maybe suggest looking into the history of how Putin and Saddam got into the positions they did (spoiler: they were quite useful to building and maintaining US empire). I guess I could loop back around there actually to the origin of liberation theology itself in South America which emerged precisely by necessity in unifying various peoples against pretty grotesque "Monroe doctrine" inspired influence, most recently in CIA operations like Operation Condor, particularly transparent in intention in Chile with Allende and our hand in installing Pinochet, but it's also why the mainstream corporate press will constantly present Venezuela the way that it does, in addition to backing up this illusion through absolutely insane unilateral economic sanctions and naval blockades meant to create the same economic instability (and importantly manufacture consent/justification for what is referred to as "regime change") as this is merely a continuation of US hegemony for resource extraction and debt peonage (specifically it comes down to the fact that they have the largest oil reserves on the earth, which under Chavez was nationalized).
@@Bisquick Well the similarities to Putin are there, right? I look for rational down-to-earth explanations to these ideas
There is zero evidence for God - obviously ideas of God came from life on earth
This is what most Atheists should be figuring out but it seems most Atheists are "Christian Atheists" - their silence is disturbing
Anyway Ideas of God came from life - what form might they take? How would a person living under brutal Kings/Dictators in a violent world view God? And how does a religion formed in such a world might use such a God to gain control?
A "God" who demands one join "his" religion, rewards those who do & brutalizes those that do not!
Exactly like Putin, Saddam!
The current supporters of Putin have killed, raped and tortured innocents those that have dared to criticize him. But of course, Putin is their meal ticket - the reason they live a good life. Their riches were not Earned, they were given
And we see religion uses the same terminology - Heaven cannot be Earned, it can only be given and of course to get it, one must pray to the "right" God, kiss the right butt
And now we have Putin's supporters as God's followers and they have done exactly the same things as these Putin's supporters - they have killed and murdered & raped in God's name
Most recent killing was that of a Teacher in France - killed by a Putin(God) supporter
Thank you. I feel comforted. I have faith in our young. almost 40% are freethinkers? They are unaffiliated. That's great!
right, we have faith in the pleasure seekers and averse to physical work, very astute.
I hope that goes to %60 by 2024!
Your FAITH is sadly misplaced.
We owe a debt of thanks to Dr. Jordan B. Peterson.
@@andyarellanoChannel 🤣
I don't know how you ended up in my RUclips feed, but I'm glad you did. Thank you all so much for this conversation. It was most enlightening.
surely! Don't you know how you ended up in my RUclips feed? you have been EnLIGHTertainment! God Bless thee.
@@himachalarana3454 :)
@@himachalarana3454 how did you end up in this feed or the comment section what are you really trying to say.
@@tammyjohnson1927 I am brown and I love white. Any trouble for the white troubles me.
@@himachalarana3454 we'll see there's the problem you only love one you should love all but again this your choice.
Knowledge can be powerful....hate is crippling
Almost all hate And discrimination comes from religion,thank goodness I was brought up in a secular home,and was thought to love everyone
The seculars are responsable for the most hate and the most number of deaths.
@@eclipsesolar8345 hitler was responsible for millions of murders BECAUSE of so-called christianity
We Need More Freemason And Scientologist
Hate And discrimination have been proven to come from anyone, but religion prolongs more of it, and complicates matters.
The old testament is largely a story of a people who used their imaginary gods to justify the extermination of their enemies, the enslavement of the survivors, the sexual enslavement of their women, and the stealing of their land, all while convincing themselves that they are wonderful and righteous.
What kind of fruits can we expect from those seeds.
They missed a huge clue which shows how monstrously unaware these religious types are. They are describing the group under discussion as “white christians”. I kinda expected them to go all the way and admit that it is white male christians they are interested in. Nevertheless, the inclusion of the adjective “white” should indicate to them that the group is more interested in racism than religion. The actual religion these people identify with is simply a cultural accident and does not inform their behavior in the least. If they think racists will no longer hide behind religion, well... they are simply mistaken.
To defend your majority is not racist. It is common sense., People of color are breeding faster and having more children than white people , yet people of color, especially black people, are calling for the destruction of white culture. Why shouldn't white people be alarmed and defensive?
Nope. Christian churches in America are often very segregated.
@@chuckmclaughlin9490 You people of no color can't breed fast enough, that's the reason the decline of population of people of no color has reached the percentage of no return.
@@chuckmclaughlin9490 Black people are at the same % in population as they were decades ago. Since LBJ they predominantly destroy their own selves.
Ahem, a LOT LOT of people being called People of Color are white: MOST Hispanics, Italians, Sicilians, Slavs, Arabs, Iranians, Afghanis. They DO NOT have the anglo protestant culture. Hispanics, the biggest group now of newcomers are conservative in their culture, machismo (patriarchal) and usually religious. They aren't nay saying or dour, they have a lot of joy. They have their own culture, and it's NOT like Irish or Anglo Saxon. The only other RACE here aside from all these whites and the blacks is us Asians of many types, many Central Asians are thought to be some kind of white maybe or are thought of as maybe Hispanic. People aren't used to seeing us. To give an example: UYGHURS are Central Asians. Not all of us are Muslim. Uyghurs used to be Buddhist. Anyway, you can see what they look like since they are becoming more known to Americans who heh, never heard of them before. They are literally next door neighbors to my people (in China and around there). We are also the majority of people who used to live in the USSR. Another name for the whole group of this type is Tatar or Turanian; it includes Turks and Mongols (another term "turko-mongol"). There is no such race as "brown" that's invented by people who keep trying (in vain) to lump all these ethnics in with blacks. They never get the newsflash: IT IS NOT WORKING.
Way too much of what is being called "white culture" like good work ethic, good at math, focus on merit etc, is MORE ASIAN than white.
As Jason Black notes honestly, ALL of these ethnic groups are hostile toward blacks and Hispanics have always been. There are good reasons for it. Imo, however, Hispanics torturing and murdering Jessica Corde's son for being the only black KID in a party with Hispanics, for asking a girl to dance, is kinda pretty bad. NO, they were not gang members at all. I have to wonder why the boy went there. Did he fall for the "people of color" line of bs? Obviously he did fall for it. SURPRISE. That boy would have been totally safe in an all white evangelical party, and by white I mean IRISH, SCOTS IRISH and ANGLO SAXON. Blacks are often surprised when Mexicans or other Hispanics run them out of neighborhoods.
Jason Black is "The Black Authority" and when he uses the term "white supremacy" he does NOT mean only white people or Europeans.
Traditional Islamists and Africans and Mongols and Feminists fundamentally agree that: White Women Should Not Be The Property of White Men. See movie, DAY OF THE SIEGE. Vikings kidnapped like one Million white slaves out of Ukraine and Russia, until St. VLADIMIR rejected Islam. The vikings sold the captured white people to the North Africans because People of Color coveted the white-skinned sexslaves. Another million white slaves were directly captured by Crimean Tatar Muslims and North Africans, taken from all around Atlantic and Mediterranean Sea coast, including the 1631 Sack of Baltimore. Then, the Siege of Vienna in 1683 began The End of colored people enslaving white people. See movie, DAY OF THE SIEGE, online at TubiTV com. At Vienna, Polish and Austrian white supremacists united under the banner of Christianity (The Holy League), to oppose the enslavememt of white people by people of color. Later, the American idea was to unite "white citizens" against enslavement by people of color (retiring the need for unifying under the banner of a common religion). White Supremacist US President Thomas Jefferson built the US Marines specifically for the purpose of going to Tripoli to end the enslavement of white people by people of color. [And, Hindus copied the White Supremacists, to produce the Sikh army to oppose islamic conquest] Today, blacks look upon "whites" as beasts of burden who are born and raised simply to PROVIDE "EQUITY" for the benefit of blacks, and that blacks are entitled to the fruits of the labor of enslaved white people and to use Force (government) to take "equity" from enslaved whites for benefit of blacks. The open question is whether white people today will docilely submit to being enslaved by the same government that they originally created to protect them from enslavement.
What is white
Besides the color of clouds, chalk, coke and..... Well you get it. Are you from Whitonia? Whiteland? Somebody help me with this United States construct.
Thank you. I'm getting sick of the colour code. When a "black" and "white" person get children, have they made a new race? I prefer to be part of the human race. Personally I think that would end discrimination the fastest.
Being Christen or evangelical Not Enough now. You Have to be white Evangelical Christian.
How thin you are going to shrink yourself.
Essentially they want Anglo- Gsrman- Scandinavian- Dutch types. Religion and men is just a fog leaf to hide
Young people are more open mind and are influenced by internet where open discussion exist and where they are not afraid to express themselves. If you superimposed the chart of decline of religion of young people and the chart of internet access you will see they are co-related.
Nice
Sadly the rise in believing crazy conspiracy theories and the internet also correlates.
I'm a millennial, and all I see is social media that tends to reinforce pre-existing views on both sides.
I don't see that dynamic improving things.
Dee Neyugn, this is a very interesting point.
But look at the demographics! The largest group of Qanon believers is over 45... Most under 30 don't have attention span for conspiracy theories. If you think about it, maintaining a delusional world view is really hard work and requires constant self-policing and the kind of attention that one would apply to slot machine... another baby boomer habit!
Conservative white Christian stating the transition of a white male Christian world. Feels like I walked into a meta Tarantino film.
Wh
White people mAke up only 1 percent of global population I can not see white Christian people AS the problem they hAve morals and standards they encourage constructive action not proteSt .. All these liberal protest Action never follow Any of Neely Fuller suggestions in fact white action in teXt would be defined racist
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
Today, if you dare, you can actually learn about the origins of religions and where these stories really come from; as well as whether any of the characters even really existed. It’s no longer the days when people had no education at all.
I see the passing away of white Christian America to be a release and a relief. They were so abusive and exploitative and closed-minded and intolerant though hard-working and, in some cases, accomplishment-oriented.
Whatever.
Ok Buster.
That's so stupid, the same can be said of other great empires that have done much worse. America is awesome.
Right, has this what the church has become?
@@TheGuerillapatriot ugh.
Religion in it's death throes is a brilliant thing.
islam is thriving in the world.
You're going to find non-Christian America a very tyrannical and deadly place.
Not at all, Brian. Christianity is growing by leaps and bounds in China and parts of Africa.
But Christ lives!
@@1956gaba Only in the minds of scared wishful people too afraid to live in this world. Jesus, if he lived, would have been appalled at this Death Cult in his name.
Organized religions, being largely a product of man's making, tend towards corruption and politicization and are right to be mistrusted. The real church, and the only one that ultimately matters, is within ourselves where we respect, honor, and love our creator.
.. and each other....
prove that we have a creator
I don't need any more proof than I already have but you seem to need the proof, so you go find it. Blessings.
No. God meant for there to be organized churches. Read your Bible. Individualism is unworkable. People have to be held to a standard. They can not have individual versions of truth. No society can survive that. People have to be controlled. The country was & is in deep decline. Mostly due to the decline of morality at all levels. But it has the most immediate impact in government, academia, & business elites & the bad decisions they make. The elites are totally immoral & clueless.
@@clif26 - I suggest watching the Living Waters channel. Ray Comfort is excellent.
If you expect acceptance for the better aspects of religious practice you need to stand up against the worst that is done in its name .
Mark Twain said’ « If Christ came back today the last thing he would be was a Christian »
We never lose our demons, we can only learn to live above them.
I love Dr. Strange. A favorite Marvel character is indeed the Ancient One. Ah Ha. Gotcha.
@Debra Jenkins
Those who have had True demons, the kind the bible speaks of, as I know them,
can't live above them, but will resist them, and they shall flee. Demons, and their father ""SATAN""......loves your comments. I recall reading Mr. Hubbards book ,
""DIANETICS"......and it was about the demons, in our lives. I didn't complete
reading it, because my ""Spirit""......disagreed with it. And what the book was saying to me, after praying, and asking God for wisdom, He clarified it, and that
was it for me, and demons. The message was we, everyone, have their own ""Private""...little demons, ""NOT"......because it minimizes the power of these
demons, whereas people truly believe, they have the power to live above them.
We don't. And we can't lose our demons, nor can we live above them. Regard-
less, of what our beliefs are, concerning demons, whether real, or imagined,
they must ""GO""......period!!! Jesus taught about these ""demonic spirits"".....
And in His name, they must leave. Trump, is a perfect example, of being, either
""POSSESSED"" or heavily, '''""INFLUENCED""........Which ever, the man needs to be..................."""DELIVERED"".....There's a book written by, C S Louis, ""The
Screw Tape Letters""...A must read, to understand how demons, manipulate...
us, everyday, all through the day, and night. Blessings to you Deb, and others'
read this book...
Believing in fairytales as a grown up is dangerous to humanity !!!
@@Irishmule169 Losing your soul to eternal damnation is beyond dangerous.
Praying for you and all non-believers. 🙏
@Sunny Hill
Good to see how you prefer to use appeal to emotions and fear-mongering logical fallacies rather than simply honoring your burden of proof requirements as a specific god-character claimant. I appreciate your closed-minded approach and easily discredited opinions on social media.
Hmmm....the "big elephant in the room", that Jones touched on, but did not specifically mention was the change from evangelical support by HUGE % of avowed born-again Christian Jimmy Carter's 1976 successful election against President Ford...and his much power white evangelical support versus Reagan in 1980 (the Reagan's reportedly were never regular Sunday churchgoers). Carter has written about this is his books over the years...and the hiercarchy of his Southern Baptist Convention turned extremely conservative over his 4 years as President. 1980 began the national presence of Jerry Falwell's Moral Majority.
You _have_ to study the Evangelical-Conservative Catholic alliance that formed in the 1980s, and especially the Charismatic movement. It's absolutely key to understanding the Religious Right today, and the conservative composition of the contemporary Supreme Court.
A lot of us have realized that we do not need a god in order to have morality. So... yeah
Mhm. And I don't have to defend Biblical genocide and slavery.
Wrong. God is the author of morality. Humans are the authors of immorality. By definition you can’t be right. You have no personal capacity to determine right from wrong. You can only stumble from one emotion/desire/lust to the next. You are incapable of anything more.
Yes, only when we're sick, hungry or dying of old age do we turn to God and 😄🏃🏃
You don't have morality. You're hedonist cretins
Do you support abortion?
Thank goodness. I think that the figures do not accurately reflect how religious Americans really are. Responding to a poll and religious practice probably tell a different story. How many of those that claim who they are religious actually attend mass once a week? Most of my catholic relatives only attend 'irregularly', and most of my protestant friends rarely do. Churches are empty on Sundays compared to my youth. Doubters are under counted. As Hitchins would say, 'That's progress.'
These religions appeal to the weak, the old at heart, the lazy & shameless
Down here we work, we are proud to EARN what we want, eat stale bread if that is all we can afford, we don't beg, we don't take charity, we are independent
Heaven seems to be one vast Retirement home, it is not earned, you get in down on ones knees begging & groveling for mercy, a shameless dependent life, live like prostitutes/gigolos/leeches/freeloaders do down here, a life of ease & comfort, sponging off their rich Sugar Daddies
A lazy, idle, useless & pointless existence for eternity
Makes no sense
they believe the churches are corrupted , my dad was a 7th day Adventist and we never went to church cos he "knew better than anyone else"
I can't say all churches are corrupt but I can say this there is corruption in a lot of the people who go to church they go to church they claim their Christian they claim they're this they claim they're that but their actions don't speak to the claim of Jesus Christ. My mom told me there's no perfect church and if it was the moment you step in it becomes imperfect. The problem we have is that when you see corruption in the church when you feel it when you hear it most people don't speak about it or do anything about it. I guess what I'm trying to say is there's nothing new under the Sun this is been going on since the beginning of the church.
Catholicism is a cult, actually. Many people put on clothing of Christianity, but are far from being Christians. They, in fact, follow man and his manmade religion. That’s Satan’s way of confusing the situation. The Bible says there just won’t be that many people in heaven. “Many are called, but few are chosen.” So, when you judge God on some Christian, you may be judging him based on an imposter. That’s what Satan wants you to do.
They certainly screwed the pooch, didn't they?
Congratulations to the producers on drawing back the camera to show the slides on the screens. It's nice to run across RUclips people who show a wee bit of sense toward us out here, their major audience.
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
@@charlotteSmith-yn1yo
The weather is 100% -- 'bout the same as my family, thank you.
Not quite the same, I've gotta confess. The weather is weather while the family is family.
The end that rubbish can't come fast enough.
all business has it's lifespan. Religious sales a bit longer than others.
@alien house Yeah I'm sure Christians around the world being martyred for their faith are just in it for the money. Your logic is bulletproof, after all, if one person in a huge group does something wrong, they must all be guilty.
If Christianity is ever gone from the front line of civilization than other religions will haste to take its place and two others are Islam and Buddism. And when it happens, you will beg God to bring back the Christianity so you can continue to feel so American but he won't hear you in that day.
@@kirillzapple Christians are that weak ? Get your Bible and go home and read it. Find out what it’s about. Helping people, visit the sick. Prisons. Vote for better healthcare for all, learn how to treat the stranger. It’s in the Bible. I never heard it in church.
If something had lasted a long time, it is robust and will continue to survive. Also, please remember, USA is not the centre of the world. You should also take into account the phenomenal conversion rate from atheistic religion like Buddhism to Christianity in India, China and rest of Asia. Always keep in the mind, the population of entire USA is same as a single state in India - UP.
Religious sales, great way to put it.
Can’t happen soon enough!!
If you haven't noticed, the Chinese now own most of America.
The loss of principles and sense of balance is not what we want.
Tru dat bro
@@jandeenphoto that’s what the GQP trumpubliqanon cult sycophants want. The right has been showing for years they’re willing (or feel righteously entitled) to break any rules, protocol, laws or norms to gain (steal) power.
The blind ambition and greed for power robs one of all morals, honor, decency, integrity, principles and values.
Like heroin junkies nothing matters but the next fix
Harvard divinity. How do you connect the word school with this? It should be indoctrination.
I've always been a huge fan of E.J. Dionne and now after watching this, I think Robert P. Jones will end up with me being one of his also. These 2 work well together and here's hoping it continues..
You should give E. Michael Jones a try.
Maybe it's time to shut down the Harvard Divinity School and replace it with something worthwhile, like fighting rape, homelessness, drug addiction, demanding working wages and benefits, and putting an end to blocking children from getting a forever family because the deciders don't like same-sex couples.
Factors impacting the GOP:
1. Their members tend to be older, as can be seen in how Fox News' viewership tends to be in their 70's and 80's.
2. The GOP as the speakers point out, tends to be more White than the GOP, and as the country becomes less White, Minorities will further in raise the size of the Democratic Party.
3. Covid 19 is impacting the GOP more than the DNC as, those who are unvaccinated and thus who tend to get seriously sick and or die tend to be Conservatives and Republicans.
All of these factors will further sharing the size of the GOP, due to it's members dying of old age, dying of Covid, and being less and less what Americans identify with.
The Republican party will shift to be a dude-bro nihilist party, legislating the same things for different reasons. Matt Gaetz is an example of this.
the anti trans/anti lgbt is going to be used to lure minorities into the GOP.
And young Democrats today
But their right. I don't care what color they are. That the Republicans are old , white is alright by me.
Younger Republicans watch independent media. Is there a millennial that still has cable?
Recent immigrant and/or lower class minorities prefer to vote for Democrats, but some that are wealthier and more established switch sides. Christian minorities can swing either way.
I believe the US is going to go further downhill before Christian whites are a tiny minority, so it's nothing to worry about or celebrate.
Evangelicals score very high on Right Wing Authoritarianism RWA. RWA followers, like tradition, defer to authority, and are aggressive towards outgroups (Altemyer, 1996, 2005). They are invariably prejudiced. They are also of lower IQ (Onraet et al. 2015).
Separating Christianity by race is actually part of the problem in this country.
No it's not
That’s how it been since the inception of this country. It’s too late to say it’s “part of the problem”
@@cuddlycuddlycactus2999 it's never too late to call it the way it is and always has been. What's even more important is creating ways to get rid of the problem for good. Past or present. More solutions and creative ways towards positive change are needed. No more excuses!
The Hebrew bible has nothing to do with religion. The GOD of the bible has a people, the Children of Israel, and he gave them Laws , Statues and Commandments.
Exodus 3 v 10.
10.Come now therefore, and I will send thee unto Pharaoh, that thou mayest bring forth my people the children of Israel out of Egypt.
The heathen nations started religions.
It was never GOD's plan for all nations to live together.
Deuteronomy 32 v 8-9. When the most High divided to the nations their inheritance, when he separated the sons of Adam, he set the bounds of the people according to the number of the children of Israel.
9.For the LORD'S portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.
The GOD of the Israelites will send his Son, again, to destroy his enemies and return his people to rulership.
Isaiah 63 v 1- 4. Who is this that cometh from Edom, with dyed garments from Bozrah? this that is glorious in his apparel, travelling in the greatness of his strength? I that speak in righteousness, mighty to save.
2.Wherefore art thou red in thine apparel, and thy garments like him that treadeth in the winefat?
3.I have trodden the winepress alone; and of the people there was none with me: for I will tread them in mine anger, and trample them in my fury; and their blood shall be sprinkled upon my garments, and I will stain all my raiment.
4.For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come.
Baruch 2 v 30 -35 . For I knew that they would not hear me, because it is a stiffnecked people: but in the land of their captivities they shall remember themselves.
31.And shall know that I am the Lord their God: for I will give them an heart, and ears to hear:
32.And they shall praise me in the land of their captivity, and think upon my name,
33.And return from their stiff neck, and from their wicked deeds: for they shall remember the way of their fathers, which sinned before the Lord.
34.And I will bring them again into the land which I promised with an oath unto their fathers, Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and they shall be lords of it: and I will increase them, and they shall not be diminished.
35.And I will make an everlasting covenant with them to be their God, and they shall be my people: and I will no more drive my people of Israel out of the land that I have given them.
APTTMH.
Christianity is actually most of the problem
"White Christian" seems like an oxymoron.
Unfortunately true, we all fall short but it seems most are not trying at all.
Thank you.
Would like to see the current analysis of this subject.
😢sad, it’s still stifling America
These kind of Stats can be deceiving. In Italy and Spain (for example) Everyone above a certain age identifies with being Catholic...Even if they are outspoken atheists. They go to church once a year with Christmas and still baptize their children.(often to please the older family members ) The same, or even more, with modern Muslims. Islam is part of their upbringing, even if they don't believe i it they will tick the box ' Muslim' without thinking.
This is very true. There's a gulf between religious affiliation and cultural identification that, so far, only the Jewish peoples openly recognise (and it took them 2000 years, so...)
The same was true of the UK for the longest time, where the default was CofE regardless. I threw a shitfit in hospital many years ago because "atheist" wasn't on the form and I refused to let them tick any box. The logic was who gets to come and talk rubbish at you if you're at death's door but that's the last thing I'd want to hear as my...er...last thing.
And America is pretty much the only place that hasn't had to beat religion down. In Europe there are centuries of religions at their worst and quashing them was a long and bloody business. The US is gradually becoming more secular and the religion itself is becoming more extreme as it tries to hang on. But the yes/no isn't a fair representation and especially in a country where declaring yourself atheist has such a negative connotation. We really have to stop eating babies or we'll never be accepted.
@@randomhumanoidblob4506 'We really have to stop eating babies or we'll never be accepted.''
'Hahaha. 😂Good one ! It's time to change our evil ways hey ;). Well i'm agnostic, and now i'm getting older and resited everything to do with organized religion for years , I now notice i actually start to feel sorry for some Christian denominations here in the Netherlands !. Especially Catholics. There are still some little all-protestant towns and villages around But in the cities all those beautiful age old Catholic churches with their antique statues etc are getting deserted and shut down . Even the few priest that are still around are trying very hard to be as openmined as they can. Poor sods .... They finally found some humility after they lost control over the masses ...;)
Separation of church and state is much more precious than any religion
Touche.
Ignorant
Given our history and present day “ conservatism” good riddance.
St. Jude (in the Bible ) talked about the corruption in the church .
ONE GLARING MISTAKE: It angers me that the illegal blending of church and state (especially in the modern US) is not discussed. A huge part of the religious/political link in the US today is the illegal use of tax-exempt platforms to promote specific candidates and party affiliations. One party has taken it upon themselves to dissolve the democratic freedoms of the US from within; if the country will not be implicitly run by affiliated christians (by default of everyone being one), then it must explicitly be run by affiliated christians. The christian response to real, honest freedom of religion has been a multi-pronged coup to install a theocracy. Where is that conversation???
Wishing u could state this more primitively, for my slowness of mind, because basically I agree...the dissolution of separation of
Church and state is really central cause of our loss of a republic.
@@ByDesign333 thats the wall they need to build
Knowing these demographic trends, does it not seem self-destructive of Republicans to go down the path of a theocracy? BTW...the ACLU and other good liberals will defend their religious rights so they really have nothing to worry about except their own self-destructive tendencies.
@@shroud1390 bingo!
One glaring misconception is that atheism, homosexual morality, infanticide abortion, the government as god is not a religion. The cult of the democrat considers disagreement with their agenda an abomination. They have taken any mention of God out public school and replaced it with their transgender secular humanism. The mental health crisis among our youth is spiritual crisis brought on by the satanic cult know as the democratic party.
I hope it's the end of religion. Enough of this foolishness.
You must be an atheist.
@@mr.stranger4951 Someone who seeks truth and evidence and you choose to mock in a rather pathetic way !
Im an atheist. Its still a frightening thought. Some people really need Jesus.
More people might agree with that position if Atheism had not become just as imposing, annoying and arrogant as evangelical Christianity. FK em both. Idiocy of sorts on both sides of that split. To think that all factors and issues discussed surrounding religion triggers a debate concerning the existence or non existence of god shows a flaw in a particular mindset. A flaw that is just as prevalent as overlooking all the crap that has been on the increase simultaneously with the decline of religion. That should be an area of concern but it wont be because people are too much more concerned with their egos and genitals.
@@gowdsake7103 The guy said he hopes it the end of religion. So how is that seeking truth and evidence??? And where's the mockery that makes me soooo pathetic? Who else would want to do away totally with religion?
And also this seems to be happening globally and in Europe especially. It's affecting the Monarchy too. So what is really going on? Explain that.
The anti christ and his beast walks among us today.
The Azkenazi want to replace us and promote the great replacement...
Thank you, again.
Has this discussion been updated?
In a private conversation - apparently leaked by a close associate, Billy Graham was allegedly heard to have said something like- "I know it's all BS - but I can hardly turn round and admit that now can I...."
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Politic and religion should never mix, just like water and oil.
European nations manage to be moral and ethical despite the fact that their populations almost never attend church services or affiliate with the Christian religion.
Can anyone who claims to be Christian and voted for Trump explain (I am sincerely curious) how s/he could believe in the divinity of Jesus without accepting His social gospel and vote for Trump.
@P.I.Mathew that is the question that I've been asking these last 4 years. There has been a frenzy, salivating christian demanding Trump is "the chosen one" as trump himself said
I am agnostic ( not atheist anymore, I don’t DO faith based stuff) so I cannot claim deep expertise on Christian doctrine(s). What I CAN do is listen to what self described evangelists have to say. See, if you are indeed genuinely curious about people , you listen to them, you try to imagine what it would be like to BE them. Listening to people tell you what they think/ feel/ believe is not the same as you telling them what they think. So for instance, a young man stopped me in the street to proffer a pamphlet on Jesus, his meaning, his identity etc etc etc just the other day. God is love was the main thrust of it ( does that ring a bell?) That idea ( if you listen to enough of these folks) keeps cropping up. Now YOUR idea ( I know because I used to share your religion) of what this young man believes is some bizarre , grotesque, ugly think that makes no sense to anyone. You like me, are starting to become genuinely curious about what is REALLY going on with the deplorable , sub human , flyover country untermensch. Because you are , you know, ( yawn) , cosmopolitan, inclusive, tolerant, educated, believe in science, logic, blah blah blah, and you might be starting to tire of all this sunshine coming out your backside. It is boring…also blinding. Here’s a couple clues: 1) Go read a book called “Unapologetic” by Francis Spufford. Don’t freak! He is a soft left old fashioned Brit labour type. Also a Christian. Go read ANYTHING by Thomas Sowell. Chill! Relax! He is more or less agnostic. If you find listening to ANY of these people too traumatising for your religion ( social justice) you can always pull the safety cord. The safety cord is the race card, your fundamental article of faith. The gift that keeps giving. Human beings are NOT individuals with free will, they ARE their sexual preference, accident of birth, skin colour, collective identity etc. No freedom, no responsibility, certainly nothing that could be described as sacred ( that “soul” word).
@@actionflower6706 I completely agree that too many people strawman those who disagree with them rather than listening to what they believe. But you are guilty of exactly the same thing, as the last five sentences of your comment show. That or you’re listening to someone with absolutely no grasp of what the people they’re mocking believe.
@@jamesmathai1138 Whether or not I am straw manning PI Mathew or you, James, rather depends upon what you DO in fact believe. I proceed on some rather unremarkable assumptions. I assume that Christians believe in the resurrection of Christ. I assume that Trump hating people repeat the slanderous nonsense about “racism” as an article of faith. Right? My admiration of Mr Trump ( more exactly my loathing of the crooked opposition) means that I MUST be all manner of grotesquely improbable things..right? All sorts of things that render me incomprehensible to you. An object of loathing. Deplorable. Stupid. Bestial. Untermensch. Not to be engaged on any grounds of civility or good faith. Right? Or wrong? You tell me.
people are often single issue voters so if someone finds either abortion, guns, or "CRT" an important issue to them they'll vote mindlessly
Good talk, however, these long winded, boring introductions of these academics are just too much. I spent over 25 yrs listening to these, mostly men, talking about their achievements....🙄nauseating.
Agreed
Yes. So tedious and unnecessary.
Reminds me of Sunday sermons !! Accept these guys aren’t asking you to get your wallet out ...to con you out of your hard earned money ... religions defined
Billy Graham was about bilking those huge crowds.
Roedy Green Billy Graham made $70,000 a year.
They all are.
I have studied science and engineering at two major American Universities. There one should recognize that American Christianity has been in steep decline. Even most whites declare to be agnostic or atheistic. In all my six years there, I had seen only one person saying grace before meal. Christianity is often derided as foolish. The US population at large is of course different.
With science it is hard to accept that god both (first) exists and also loves human beings. God if caring is not omnipotent, just powerful but limited. God has to be re-defined, losing its attractiveness. Just look at the world. How can there be a loving god? This is the simplest and immutable logical conclusion to not worship or have a relation with god, if she, he, it existed.
Trump is a traditional white opponent of slavery (a White Abolitionist), and so he and his supporters opposes the use of government to enslave white people. Traditional Islamists and Africans and Mongols and Feminists fundamentally agree that: White Women Should Not Be The Property of White Men. See movie, DAY OF THE SIEGE. Vikings kidnapped like one Million white slaves out of Ukraine and Russia, until St. VLADIMIR rejected Islam. The vikings sold the captured white people to the North Africans because People of Color coveted the white-skinned sexslaves. Another million white slaves were directly captured by Crimean Tatar Muslims and North Africans, taken from all around Atlantic and Mediterranean Sea coast, including the 1631 Sack of Baltimore. Then, the Siege of Vienna in 1683 began The End of colored people enslaving white people. See movie, DAY OF THE SIEGE, online at TubiTV com. At Vienna, Polish and Austrian white supremacists united under the banner of Christianity (The Holy League), to oppose the enslavememt of white people by people of color. Later, the American idea was to unite "white citizens" against enslavement by people of color (retiring the need for unifying under the banner of a common religion). White People invented "White Supremacy" to obviate their needing to have and reply upon a common "religion"/God as their justification to unite to fight in opposition to the enslavement of white people by people of color. White Supremacist US President Thomas Jefferson built the US Marines specifically for the purpose of going to Tripoli to end the enslavement of white people by people of color. [And, Hindus copied the White Supremacists, to produce the Sikh army to oppose islamic conquest] Today, blacks look upon "whites" as beasts of burden who are born and raised simply to PROVIDE "EQUITY" for the benefit of blacks, and that blacks are entitled to the fruits of the labor of enslaved white people and to use Force (government) to take "equity" from enslaved whites for benefit of blacks. The open question is whether white people today will docilely submit to being enslaved by the same government that they originally created to protect them from enslavement.
Woodensurfer, you wrote: "Just look at the world. How can there be a loving god? This is the simplest and immutable logical conclusion to not worship or have a relation with god, if she, he, it existed." You've referred to science and engineering, but neither branch of study offers anything about what is good or not good. You asserted a "logical conclusion" from no valid premises, since a rhetorical question is neither argument nor evidence -- and the conclusion certainly has nothing to do with science or engineering.
@@nunca789 When 20 primary school kids were shot dead, is it good or not good? When branch of science is needed to determine this goodness or lack of?
@@woodensurfer Your post actually agrees with mine, so we're on the same page. Science and engineering don't supply the answers to many immaterial questions -- other ways of thinking do. So your claim to being science-engineering based and therefore rejecting theism doesn't make sense. Science alone doesn't establish the existence (and cannot prove the nonexistence) of God. And it appears you realize that many aspects of human existence are not defined or explained by science alone. Ridiculing theism "because of science" is unfounded.
@@nunca789 Don't be deluded. It does not take any science to decide that the lives for 20 little kids have intrinsic undeniable value and the grief their deaths cause are equally real. There is no science needed to conclude that your god is either of limited power, unable to protect you no matter how you pray, or don't care enough because it/he/she is callous.
Thus, Christianity has no value and is just garbage, or prostitution of the mind.
So much effort, money, pain and suffering in the world is wasted and wrought over these myths from more than 2000 years ago. How much longer will the world be subject to the fraud, hate and evil done in the name of religion?
Excellent topic and moderation- will a new verticality emerge?
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
It's not true that slaves had the whole bible. There was a bible printed which was i believe 10% of the whole bible but looked as bulky. There is a copy in the slave museum there in America.
Anything that talked about freedom was taken out.
Most parts of the bible was taken out
@Sarah Hodgins : Personally I find a very significant moral inconsistency with the slavery in the Bible when contrasted with the message of Jesus Christ in the Bible which focuses on love.
Most Christian apologists I have discussed this with defend biblical slavery but would not like to sequestered in it’s loving embrace. This I find inconsistent and the product of indoctrination propaganda and dishonesty.
@Sarah Hodgins : Perhaps God did not author the injunctions concerning slavery we find in Leviticus and other parts of the Old Testament?
@@clarkent61 yea, but if you beat your slave so bad they die within 2 days the owner is punished. That's better right? (Sarcasm)
American christianity is equivalent to hypocrisy. the two can be used interchangeably.
We will see change when religious people call the right Christian nationalists what they truely are. A hard line needs to drawn this is about power and not in the least bit about religion. Domestic terrorism under the guise of religion. This is why so many people can't affiliate.
There are plenty of countries without their own official language, race, and/or religion, and the United States is one of them.
“for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.”
Galatians 3:26-29
Galatians 4 v 4-5. But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
5.To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of son.
What nation of people were under the Law?
I believe Christopher Hitchens was our most recent comprehensive and precise intellect to take on the topics involving religious debate and atheism vs. the church. We do not have a map of consciousness and dimensions that allows for great clarity of what we mean by any of this without consulting esoteric literature, drug culture, and clairvoyant experiences by respected sources from a hundred years ago. Steiner called it the quest for a religious science and yet we still separate and ill define the discussions. Aren't we bored with going over the same tired cliches? I have said what I have to say. God bless you all.
hitchens is a fool. i must have watched 20 of his videos. you think you are an accident?
It all about the roots of our decisions. They are made by results of living.
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
The presenters here seem to bemoan the decline of their religion. I think it's fantastic news and gives me hope for humanity.
I don't think it's necessarily fantastic news. If the people who leave religion end up embracing reason then sure. But I suspect most of them will end up subscribing to "new age spirituality" or some other kind of pseudoscientific nonsense.
@@abhishekmhatre1554 A legitimate concern. But at least the new age crowd generally doesn't try to ram unjust laws down everyone's throat or try to overthrow the government.
@@abhishekmhatre1554 In my estimations, you can not get more irrational than claiming a a Jew who has been dead for 2000 years is coming back to take his cult to Disneyland, while he kills everyone who is not in his cult. Tell me how to get less rational than that.
I disagree that the presenters were bemoaning the decline of their religion. On the contrary, I was pleasantly surprised to watch an American discussion where the presenters were completely objective in their stance towards the subject matter - even to a self-deprecating degree in some instances. One of the most intelligent discussions I have watching in a long time.
religion teaches people to value human life...treat others. as children of diety. teaches right and wrong...personal accountability...creates more harmony..... our society is not growing in harmony but in division and anxiety.....Nothing seems to be improving.
Where are we headed? I wrote this song, Watch and Pray. I think demographics may change but God remains the same. I regret that most white Christians were duplicitous and denied basic human rights to all Americans. I regret that they were people who did not find it profitable to include minorities from the beginning. Love was tainted with a Racist view and this was extremely bad for the country even though most could not or would not see it that way. But we are one people under God. There were some whites who have always extended love to minorities, as well as jews, and they were the extended arm of Jesus. Those who were Christian in name only do not properly define Christianity.
Divinity schools are all going away, religion is out of touch.
Don't hold your breath moron.
It is the educational system itself, not just so called religion, whatever that means since so far nothing is defined or clear.
How can religion be out of touch. Humans are in or out of touch. Hello?
Massive child and animal abuse, destruction of nature and rewards for undeserving make me wish belief in something worth while was a dominant trait.
People are out of touch with God and our educational institutions are in part responsible. Society or the “world” is responsible for almost the rest.
Lost me when he mentioned Donald Trump (a pathological liar) and christianity.
Trump demanded obedience & loyalty and rewarded accordingly
Isn't that what christians say God will do - only the loyal christians get heaven, everyone else - morals, values do not matter - get hell?
you were just tried and you failed YOU KNOW LIARS GO TO HELL DONT YOU ? well you are going to have to stop lying if you want to go to heaven
Ever since I seriously read and study the Old Testament I am shocked by its violence. Psalmes are full of cruel revenges of god in the interest of one folks, the chosen one. Im confused. I was taught god loves everyone, because everyone of us are his children.
I personally dropped the faith for its brutality, but there are plenty that just say they were deeply flawed people in the OT and God didn't seem to care enough to speak against it until Jesus came or something.
The government under which Jesus lived was corrupt and oppressive; on every hand were crying abuses,-extortion, intolerance, and grinding cruelty. Yet the Saviour attempted no civil reforms. He attacked no national abuses, nor condemned the national enemies. He did not interfere with the authority or administration of those in power. He who was our example kept aloof from earthly governments. Not because He was indifferent to the woes of men, but because the remedy did not lie in merely human and external measures. To be efficient, the cure must reach men
Jesus was a revolutionary. He challenged the Roman political structures. The political religious order and called them vipers. He over turned the money chargers in the church. So much so they trumped up a fake trial to crucify Him. What Bible are you reading. Rome set the conspiracy to put Jesus on trial and it was the Jew's of the time, who were used by the government to have Jesus crucified. Jew's who stood a lot to loose politically and religiously at that time. They had the best seats in the Synagogues. Political power. Lot of similarities today.
He took a fucking bullwhip to those people. Rethink your life.
Thank you for this informative analysis. Having spent nine years of my childhood in Jackson Mississippi, I included historical events from that venue in my 2017 novel, King of Soul, a work of historical fiction. Events surrounding the assassination of Medgar Evers in 1963 enter into the story in chapters 4 and 5. Therein, attempts by a small group of blacks to enter into two different church services are described.
After establishing an historical context for the main storyline, King of Soul presents, in the ensuing novel narrative a portrait of what happened to our nation during the Vietnam war. That war turned out to be a moral crisis for our nation that deeply affected my boomer generation.
Since 1977, I profess Christ, but with a respect and appreciation for representatives of all denominations and religions.
Thank you for this lively, enlightening discussion.
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
The Bible states you’ll know them by the fruits of their Labor.
It shall be restored. Greatness demands it.
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
How are you doing,how's the weather condition over there? and also How is your family,Well I'm Henry smith and you?
It is the hypocrisy of the evangelical right that causes anger in youths. This is why they are suspicious of the religious right.