I think the biggest problem I have with the game loop is that the incentives are: inherent fun, competetive ranks, battlepass, and fighter road. The game doesn't have enough going on or enough variables for matches to truly feel unique over time for the inherent fun to last, imo. I can play for about 30 minutes, but its around then that, if Im in casual 2s, the game feels a bit stale. The fighting styles of characters dont feel unique to strategize against, despite their unique movesets that should, theoretically, make the fights feel different, but for whatever reason it feels very samey. It's like the range is in a cereal box. You can move around a bit, but it's pretty confined at the end of the day. Competetive ranks are one of the most unfun grinds I find myself going back to. ESPECIALLY, this season. I don't know if they changed the match making so drastically from last season or there are just fewer players at lower skill levels in competitive, but it is a GRIND to get out of bronze and silver, which took a couple hours last season. Fights are often agains the same handful of characters doing the same BM garbo throughout of cheap tactics, tbagging and taunting on cheap or very unimpressive ringouts, and just plain running away. The time it takes to get up in ranks doesnt feel like Im showing where I stand as a player in comparison to others, it feels like a slog through the worst to see if I can hold on long enough to rank up. I'm stubborn and want the ranked skins, so I can last longer, but it isnt exactly "fun" Battlepass. Its shorter than the last seasons and split in two, which was a choice. Its got much less compelling rewards than any other season (aside from Trouble Maker Taz and Mythic Raven). Its just not really much of a hook for me to want to keep going to the well of online matchmaking which, as previously discussed, gets old fast. Fighter Road is a good idea for allowing players to unlock new characters with playtime and does reward consistent online play. But it doesnt feel particularly "good" to unlock new characters when the online matches arent that fun to play. I like the game a lot, but it's missing something to really jazz up online play to make it something worth coming back to over and over again aside from earning cosmetics to use in an unfun setting. Thinking about other online PvP games Ive played a good chunk of time in, the only reason I would continue to play online without friends is an inherent fun in the mechanics. Team Fortress 2 ha some great mechanics. It's super fun and I easily put 500 hours or so into it solo because I just really loved the gameplay at it's core. By comparison: Dead by Daylight is one that is significantly less fun online because of almost constant BM and players who care more about winning than about fighting the fight. It's got good mechanics, and it is fun in private servers, but it's not so good as to keep going back online solo. However, the battlepass typically has some good cosmetics for characters I like and some neat challenges to earn them so it's sometimes worth the pain of other people to grind for 'em. It feels like MvS is currently lacking either of those motivators for me to consider it a compelling game loop. Im going to keep playing it because it is cool, it is fun for a short time every few days, the art, animation, and sound departments all do phenomenal jobs and it is a delight seeing how they adapt new characters when they come out. But I dont think it's at a point where I'd consider it a loop that I have to return to.
I'm in the same boat. There's a lot of games coming out this winter that make it where MVS is going to have to wait in line. Marvel Rivals drops tonight and if it's as fun as it was in the beta... yeah that's gonna take some MVS time away. The Current event for the elusive skins is cool. I've gotten 2 of them Raven and Velma, the art design team gets two thumbs up from me. I do like that they take risks with some of the costumes and make new variants that are MVS exclusive. I also agree that the gameplay loop doesn't offer enough incentive to be there. I like the majority of the roster but I'm not going to grind every individual character through the ranks. I don't have the time to do that. If I committed to only playing one character I could probably make it to Masters but I only play 3-6 hours a week. Which is way less than most of the creators in this space. Also it's a social game with no social elements. like no in game mics or ways to message a teammate GG or try to build comradery with someone you met through the game. Outside of inviting someone to a party chat or sending a message through your system. There's a lot of little annoyances that add up and not enough positives and content to offset that long term. Like it's cool today but is this the right track for say, another year down the line? Is this sustainable as is?
Whats really annoying is some characters just spam 1 button and accidentally win. While some characters take skill, setups, and a iq higher than 12 to play.
I still feel like the game could benefit from more varied modes to play in, especially some more offline/local modes (bring back the arcade ladder, for example) so that you can do more with the game than just online matches or Rifts. That's still a major issue with Multiversus that, to PFG's credit they're very slowly working on, but it still struggles with. I also think they still need to be more generous with rewarding players that spend their time playing the game. As it stands it's not as bad as early Season 1's grind, but the players still need more consistent and fruitful motivation if you want them to keep playing. That especially goes with the Fighter Road. That idea, in theory, already solves one of the biggest problems people had with the game; but the way its structured needs some massive retooling. Make Fighter XP more generous, give players the choice of which characters they want to unlock, ect. I also remember in the beta, you could unlock certain aesthetics if a character's level was high enough (mostly icons though). Why not let that be another venue where you can unlock costumes for characters instead of it being purely a shop/Battlepass thing?
why do we need shields it aint gomna help we have armor, dodge, parry and auto tech why do we need another defensive move. they need to fix core problems and the moves that shields are supposed to be a solution for
One thing I also noticed is that whenever people talk about balance they talk about 1v1 when the devs themselves said they balance for 2v2’s, 2v2 is the “recommended” game mode for a reason, 1v1 has always been the “other mode” like Free For All, yet everyone acts like that’s the main mode the game should be balanced around
Bro my problem with this game is that they listen to the players TOO much it’s almost like they’re running the game based on which tweets go virals. There’s no real vision from the Dev team and it’s like they just let the players dev the game. When you try to please EVERYONE you end up pleasing NO ONE They need to hire another dev who has experience on a successful platform fighter to clean this up
I agree. I was saving that part for the other video. Also, seeing a Velma nerf come days after a tweet was peak comedy. Which is why I don't think "balance" will save the game. Because the things we are balancing around have zero consistency and even less centered around getting the non-fun elements out
i understand what you say, I get really mad when I get hit by samurai jack jab, Jake neutral air into neutral special, Powerpuff girls aerial dash attack, Steven neutral air, rick lasers, among others. but if you think shields will bring a wait and punish behavior you haven't played season 4 diamond+ ranked people both in 1v1 and 2v2, less in 2v2 for obvious reasons but still
There's an art to making top tiers and low tiers fun, and multiversus seems to fail at both. Look at PM or a lot of the top tiers in melee, like fox. A lot of these characters are really good, but it's because have a lot of options, and it makes them incredibly diverse and fun to play while still having weaknesses. Sure, you have the occasional ice climbers or jigglypuff that aren't like this, but those are few and far between. Then there's a there are top tiers like kazuya, sonic, or bayonetta who feel incredibly cheesy, dishonest, and make the game incredibly unfun. they don't even have that complex of a playstyle, most people play them the same exact way. Low tiers are like this too. You can either make a character who's just overall not very good, but really fun to watch and play like melee Kirby, ultimate ganondorf, or I'll even go as far as to say Smash 4 Zelda, but then you have characters like melee Zelda and ultimate Little Mac, who just rely on 1 or 2 broken strategies which are the only thing they have, so they constantly fish for it over and over, and it just makes fighting them incredibly annoying despite how bad they are. The key to making healthy top and low tiers is options. Well designed top tiers aren't overly oppressive, they just have a lot of tools to play with but still have weaknesses, and healty low tiers have them too, it's just that they have more glaring weaknesses (ult ganondorf with mobility and recovery, sm4sh zelda being tall and floaty but light as well as minimal disjoints, Kirby having both). I think the reason multiversus has badly designed low tiers and top tiers is that the game itself is incredibly simplistic, and a lot of characters just feel the same. Even characters that I enjoy playing as, I noticed that I keep fishing for jabs just so I can link them up into other things, and that's pretty much it. Even with characters like Jason or Beetlejuice, who you'd expect to be a lot different from say, batman or samurai jack, basically play the same outside of a couple of moves. This game really needs more tools and options in order to have a healthy competitive game. Also I just think this game needs more things to do. The rifts may not be as bad now, but that's mostly because rifts during season one were some of the most reprehensible things I've ever seen in a video game, and now they don't have that problem, but now the issue is that rifts are just incredibly boring and unfun to do.
Despite that I wish that the RRB's original designs were an alternate variant, (like a epic skin in the future or somethin'. Not to mention fixing the voiclines), the Rowdyruff Boys are pretty rad, and playin' as em' just hits a little different then simply playing as the PPG's. In a good way! You make some excellent points about the competitive field of this game. I personally could never join a tournament, since I can barely stand this game casually-
@@Buuutchhhh That might be a bit more complex, especially with the actors, but that reminds me of a comment saying if they add the Powerpunk Girls, they should have the reboot actors, which is really clever. I think Reboot Buttercup's voice would fit Brute.
Add the attack decay text and sound but louder and bigger. Just so spammers know they do that. Plus make is do 75% less damage, knockback, and distance. Yes i know its still in the game kind of.
In hindsight. The devs already got the wrong idea for how to make a game functional, balanced, or fun when they came up with the autoteching system. Shit was a bandaid fix for the ground bounce loops that were in the game. Which on it's own is a red flag for their competence. But then they started balancing characters around being able do more ground bounces. Which now only brings us back to square 1 with some characters like Harley. And you can't even tech off a platform or stage to escape. Speaking of platforms. No other game have I hated platforms more than I do in this game. They screw up my decents when I'm trying to fall with a move, they decide that I'm on them mid combo and give me the wrong moves. I again can't dodge off of them when there's a grenade right next to me. They are just terrible. Shields I see as another bandaid fix (and a bad one at that) for campy players and projectiles spam. And realizing what they did with auto teching. If anything the projectiles and annoying, virtually unpunishable moves, are going to get worse to compensate. As well as people continuing to run away and not engage.
"SAir song" is the only thing that make me smile in a while in multiversus. The game is great by i am having no more fun, all fights looks like i am playing prós and its exaustive. I hope it wont die before it became better.
I agree with balancing will not save the game I think the game is still has a lot of bugs, absurd overpriced microtransactions that are pushed in and out of rifts and events the player base having a lot of toxicity as of recent there's just alot problem that aren't and can't be adressed
Honestly I can’t play platform fighters for very long , and I think I need a break from it, and it sucks there’s no single player content. I’ll still watch your videos though cause your channel deserves love not going to cap 🧢 10:40 Personally at a high level, I 100% hate this game.
Aight you asked at the end of the video. Heres my spicy hot take(s) There are two points im gonna cover and a third that's just the honest truth. 1. We need a reason to fight/play. Rifts are fun and all, but we need something more. Something to actually grind and play for that makes people wanna come back. 2. Bigger take most people who complain about balance and want sheilds are in the 1v1 catagory. People need to realize this game is literally built for 2v2s. I dont play the 1v1 meta cause its not fun nor do I and many others find it interesting. But the 2v2 situation is very dif. You have teammates to help interrupt crazy op combos. You have extra things to keep track of, and you have literal combo attacks WITH YOUR TEAMATE. Personally, i think people just need to buckle down and start trying out 2s mkre cause i promise it's a different experience. 3. Balance in the end will be what it will be. Smash has a meta. In cod, there is a gun meta. In a card game, there is a meta. At the end of the day, we're gonna have good and mid or bad characters, and that's what it's just gonna be. That's how we get things called formats. And the best things about formats? THEY CHANGE! and that's where the fun kicks in cause things shift. Sorry for the ramble but this is my honest voiced opinion. If people disagree thats cool no skin of my back. But then take the time to look at yourself, look at your gameplay, and look at what your actually playing the game for. For me its just race to masters and be done with the season. What about you? Again, sorry for the ramble.
No need to apologize this is exactly the type of post I wanted. I do agree with most of your points. I wondered how shields would affect 2v2. Especially when you have characters like steven who can already provide the teammate with a barrier. Should shields be in 1s only? I'm not sure we've had ample time to test this out yet. And yes I agree that teammates do help with the long combos. However the game has enticed people to learn those combos and if we were to get rid of them completely there will be a lot of unhappy players for sure. I've been playing 2s a bit more and there's some things about that I find frustrating as well but ill save that for a video down the line.
@BPlusEfforts long story short. Sheilds in 2s almost never get used. This I only know cause I watched and talked to some fellow reindog players, and they have gotten top 8s in the brackets with them. They pretty much had said that in 2s, there is almost no point in shielding as there's other things you can do that is just better. Overall, I'm personally against sheilds and only see this as a band-aid fix as well. I do think that the community does have some fault to the current issue, but at the same time, the game I just in a weird state. And yes there are flaws in 2s as well as 1s I won't deny, but I do find people enjoying themselves more in the 2s feild than the 1s from my perspective. Ither way thank you for reading my long comments and rambles. Can't wait for the next video drop. Maybe....just maybe you'll be cooking with my boi reindog again? Haha!
I’m kinda confused. You don’t think balance will fix it but you recognize that the broken moves that get abused are part of what makes the game un-fun.. wouldn’t get balancing those moves then make the game more fun?
Balance just means everyone can fight evenly. If everyone has BS moves, then that means the game is "balanced" because most characters can fight most other characters. My point is that the balancing we're doing is centered around those broken moves being the norm. The balance decisions keep a lot of these unfun moves the same. So yes the overall MU for your character might be even, but it just turns the game into 2 people fishing with their unfun move in 1v1s or people just throwing out obnoxious disjoints in 2v2s. Imagine if EVERYONE in the game had a zero to death off jab/side attack 1? The game would be "balanced" because EVERYONE has access to a Touch of Death. However that wouldn't be FUN. They would need to dial back a lot of these moves and tune down A LARGE PORTION of the roster and add whiff recovery to almost every characters initiation tools. This will discourage people from tossing out moves that aren't punishable unless you parry.
Yeah idk when they added it but the air dash attack sends downward now. I assume it's to stop it from being a kill move at the top of the stage but... I think it's a buff because it adds a lot to their damage potential off of side attack and down attack
But no in all seriousness i wish theyd just fix the game in its entirety. I feel like the social ambassadors on this game have alot of impact on how balancing is handled as opposed to listening to the community as a whole. That may just be my crazy tin foil hat theory but why else would there be so little change in what the people have been asking for?
Dumb question but- does anybody know how to do the in air dash on ps5? I’ve been looking for answers and for those who knows I look dumb but I have genuinely been trying to find out for forever
I genuinely love the game. But going against the same 5 characters doing the same 2/4 moves on the same 4 maps is very annoying. In 1v1 it's easy to avoid powerful move spam, but in 2v2 it's a lot harder to avoid everytime. And I have the want to play the game more, I just don't have a reason why. It'd be cool if they added a character camo grind. Like at lvl 20 you get a sick skin and so on. That'd be cool. Ranked skins are awesome but the amount of time and pain it takes to get them is not worth. And by pain I mean I'll be in gold while going against constant master players. How do you know your true skill standing in ranked if you go against ranks multiple lvls ahead of you??? Oh, and don't even get me started on passive spacers. PLAY THE GAME!! STOP SITTING THERE AS HARLEY MAKING ME DO ALL THE PUSHING AS RAVEN!!!
Every character should struggle to win.not just the more popular ones with easy comfirm op moves.wile the low tier characters are hard to play and hard to win with.
There’s a plethora of things wrong with this game hit boxes,characters and the toxicity is next level can’t have a friendly 1v1 without somebody tbagging or salt emoting it’s always the same shit. Also this dev don’t know what direction they wanna go with certain characters WB is a billion dollar company half of these things going on in this crap of a platform fighter shouldn’t be in here and everybody plays the same for example Harley,Batman, samurai jack etc it’s like these people are all wired to the same brain cell and that auto tech shit Is GARBAGE does nothing but make you drop combos and get in F’d up situations lol idek how they can fix this game anymore honestly PFG and WB are jokes
I agree on Taz. My point about iron giant is that his design and gameplay is either he's nerfed to the point to where hes just a big hitbox for combo food and can't move against half the roster. Or he's buffed and ends up becoming a killing machine who won't die and kills you at 30
@darkrainbowcakeyt8749 13 days bud. The season is longer now than ussual. But mid season is coming soon. Well have her and the ugly sweater event come sooner than you think!
This game was never going to be a good Esport. Smash Bros. was created as a casual game. The Esport scene was even actively hindered in that game. An interior clone of Smash Bros. was never going to be successful.
Was 3rd strike developed specifically with esports and balance in mind? Not even close. Do you think Justin Wong NEVER enjoyed 3rd strike? let's not do this. Did third strike have the majority of the roster doing cool stuff, flashy moves, a fun parry system, cool supers? Yes, yes it did. Did 3rd strike have some of the most beautiful sprite work at the time, a story mode arcade ladder for high scores and endings? Also a parry that works? Yes Justin got out played in an overall HYPE moment but no one has ever said "LMAO WHAT A BS PARRY" in that moment. Also Daigo didn't even go on to win that tournament. EVO Moment 37 did not even happen in grand finals.
@ bro didnt they a 100k prize pool for beta and then trolli had a 7,500 prize pool the other day as well my bad in that moment you think justin was thinking about fun
Did you NOT watch the video? I'm one of those people that DOES enjoy the game? What I'm saying is at the moment the balancing isn't the overall problem for most people. If there were more things to do besides "Ranked/Not ranked/Rifts" we might have reasons to keep players invested long term. Balancing the game is a good thing in theory but most of the successful esports are fine with strong metas and bad match ups. Look at Street Fighter, Guilty Gear, Melee, Apex Legends, Team Fortress 2. All unbalanced as fuck messes historically but people STILL love them and make for good competitive games. However those games offer significantly more things to do than Casual/Ranked/Horrible Mode. I am enjoying the game for now but what we have is not a formula that can last another 8 seasons.
Multi who!!? I don’t care for esports, I just want a fun game. I been mentally drained of emotion. I just play a hour of the game get bored and call it quits. Not even playing with friends make me play the game. Who the duck made these decisions. Not even uncle grandpa will make me come back. For those of you who have faith in this game. GL
I think the biggest problem I have with the game loop is that the incentives are: inherent fun, competetive ranks, battlepass, and fighter road.
The game doesn't have enough going on or enough variables for matches to truly feel unique over time for the inherent fun to last, imo. I can play for about 30 minutes, but its around then that, if Im in casual 2s, the game feels a bit stale. The fighting styles of characters dont feel unique to strategize against, despite their unique movesets that should, theoretically, make the fights feel different, but for whatever reason it feels very samey. It's like the range is in a cereal box. You can move around a bit, but it's pretty confined at the end of the day.
Competetive ranks are one of the most unfun grinds I find myself going back to. ESPECIALLY, this season. I don't know if they changed the match making so drastically from last season or there are just fewer players at lower skill levels in competitive, but it is a GRIND to get out of bronze and silver, which took a couple hours last season. Fights are often agains the same handful of characters doing the same BM garbo throughout of cheap tactics, tbagging and taunting on cheap or very unimpressive ringouts, and just plain running away. The time it takes to get up in ranks doesnt feel like Im showing where I stand as a player in comparison to others, it feels like a slog through the worst to see if I can hold on long enough to rank up. I'm stubborn and want the ranked skins, so I can last longer, but it isnt exactly "fun"
Battlepass. Its shorter than the last seasons and split in two, which was a choice. Its got much less compelling rewards than any other season (aside from Trouble Maker Taz and Mythic Raven). Its just not really much of a hook for me to want to keep going to the well of online matchmaking which, as previously discussed, gets old fast.
Fighter Road is a good idea for allowing players to unlock new characters with playtime and does reward consistent online play. But it doesnt feel particularly "good" to unlock new characters when the online matches arent that fun to play.
I like the game a lot, but it's missing something to really jazz up online play to make it something worth coming back to over and over again aside from earning cosmetics to use in an unfun setting. Thinking about other online PvP games Ive played a good chunk of time in, the only reason I would continue to play online without friends is an inherent fun in the mechanics. Team Fortress 2 ha some great mechanics. It's super fun and I easily put 500 hours or so into it solo because I just really loved the gameplay at it's core. By comparison: Dead by Daylight is one that is significantly less fun online because of almost constant BM and players who care more about winning than about fighting the fight. It's got good mechanics, and it is fun in private servers, but it's not so good as to keep going back online solo. However, the battlepass typically has some good cosmetics for characters I like and some neat challenges to earn them so it's sometimes worth the pain of other people to grind for 'em. It feels like MvS is currently lacking either of those motivators for me to consider it a compelling game loop.
Im going to keep playing it because it is cool, it is fun for a short time every few days, the art, animation, and sound departments all do phenomenal jobs and it is a delight seeing how they adapt new characters when they come out. But I dont think it's at a point where I'd consider it a loop that I have to return to.
I'm in the same boat. There's a lot of games coming out this winter that make it where MVS is going to have to wait in line. Marvel Rivals drops tonight and if it's as fun as it was in the beta... yeah that's gonna take some MVS time away.
The Current event for the elusive skins is cool. I've gotten 2 of them Raven and Velma, the art design team gets two thumbs up from me. I do like that they take risks with some of the costumes and make new variants that are MVS exclusive.
I also agree that the gameplay loop doesn't offer enough incentive to be there. I like the majority of the roster but I'm not going to grind every individual character through the ranks. I don't have the time to do that. If I committed to only playing one character I could probably make it to Masters but I only play 3-6 hours a week. Which is way less than most of the creators in this space.
Also it's a social game with no social elements. like no in game mics or ways to message a teammate GG or try to build comradery with someone you met through the game. Outside of inviting someone to a party chat or sending a message through your system.
There's a lot of little annoyances that add up and not enough positives and content to offset that long term. Like it's cool today but is this the right track for say, another year down the line? Is this sustainable as is?
Idc for balance anymore but the toxicity in this game is extra annoying especially when we all know certain character take negative iq to use
Shaggy and Samurai Jack
Saying you don’t like toxicity, but then being toxic towards players lol
@@thejoker194only the toxic ones though🤷♂️ they deserve use your what’s left of your brain to make it make sense
@thejoker194 not being toxic toward players. Saying a fact isn't toxic. Some characters in this game don't really require much thought.
@@uzakikena8294no character in this game takes much thought if we are being fair tho, game has the depth and skill ceiling of a kindergarten
I need to watch this on my break. This a hot take for sure.
YEAHHH WE GETTIN ROWDY
Whats really annoying is some characters just spam 1 button and accidentally win. While some characters take skill, setups, and a iq higher than 12 to play.
Let's be honest, there's not a single character in this game that takes actual skill to pull off, some of them only require like a single braincell
I still feel like the game could benefit from more varied modes to play in, especially some more offline/local modes (bring back the arcade ladder, for example) so that you can do more with the game than just online matches or Rifts. That's still a major issue with Multiversus that, to PFG's credit they're very slowly working on, but it still struggles with.
I also think they still need to be more generous with rewarding players that spend their time playing the game. As it stands it's not as bad as early Season 1's grind, but the players still need more consistent and fruitful motivation if you want them to keep playing.
That especially goes with the Fighter Road. That idea, in theory, already solves one of the biggest problems people had with the game; but the way its structured needs some massive retooling. Make Fighter XP more generous, give players the choice of which characters they want to unlock, ect.
I also remember in the beta, you could unlock certain aesthetics if a character's level was high enough (mostly icons though). Why not let that be another venue where you can unlock costumes for characters instead of it being purely a shop/Battlepass thing?
Yeah I don't really play 1v1 so when 2v2 and FFA starts getting stale I just turn the game off cause there's nothing else to play
why do we need shields it aint gomna help we have armor, dodge, parry and auto tech why do we need another defensive move. they need to fix core problems and the moves that shields are supposed to be a solution for
One thing I also noticed is that whenever people talk about balance they talk about 1v1 when the devs themselves said they balance for 2v2’s, 2v2 is the “recommended” game mode for a reason, 1v1 has always been the “other mode” like Free For All, yet everyone acts like that’s the main mode the game should be balanced around
Bro my problem with this game is that they listen to the players TOO much it’s almost like they’re running the game based on which tweets go virals. There’s no real vision from the Dev team and it’s like they just let the players dev the game. When you try to please EVERYONE you end up pleasing NO ONE
They need to hire another dev who has experience on a successful platform fighter to clean this up
I agree. I was saving that part for the other video. Also, seeing a Velma nerf come days after a tweet was peak comedy.
Which is why I don't think "balance" will save the game. Because the things we are balancing around have zero consistency and even less centered around getting the non-fun elements out
We just came to get rowdy
Facts.
Man you got some of the best gaming intros NO GLAZE 💯
I appreciate that man. Especially coming from someone pushing to be the content GOAT.
i understand what you say, I get really mad when I get hit by samurai jack jab, Jake neutral air into neutral special, Powerpuff girls aerial dash attack, Steven neutral air, rick lasers, among others. but if you think shields will bring a wait and punish behavior you haven't played season 4 diamond+ ranked people both in 1v1 and 2v2, less in 2v2 for obvious reasons but still
There's an art to making top tiers and low tiers fun, and multiversus seems to fail at both. Look at PM or a lot of the top tiers in melee, like fox. A lot of these characters are really good, but it's because have a lot of options, and it makes them incredibly diverse and fun to play while still having weaknesses. Sure, you have the occasional ice climbers or jigglypuff that aren't like this, but those are few and far between. Then there's a there are top tiers like kazuya, sonic, or bayonetta who feel incredibly cheesy, dishonest, and make the game incredibly unfun. they don't even have that complex of a playstyle, most people play them the same exact way. Low tiers are like this too. You can either make a character who's just overall not very good, but really fun to watch and play like melee Kirby, ultimate ganondorf, or I'll even go as far as to say Smash 4 Zelda, but then you have characters like melee Zelda and ultimate Little Mac, who just rely on 1 or 2 broken strategies which are the only thing they have, so they constantly fish for it over and over, and it just makes fighting them incredibly annoying despite how bad they are.
The key to making healthy top and low tiers is options. Well designed top tiers aren't overly oppressive, they just have a lot of tools to play with but still have weaknesses, and healty low tiers have them too, it's just that they have more glaring weaknesses (ult ganondorf with mobility and recovery, sm4sh zelda being tall and floaty but light as well as minimal disjoints, Kirby having both). I think the reason multiversus has badly designed low tiers and top tiers is that the game itself is incredibly simplistic, and a lot of characters just feel the same. Even characters that I enjoy playing as, I noticed that I keep fishing for jabs just so I can link them up into other things, and that's pretty much it. Even with characters like Jason or Beetlejuice, who you'd expect to be a lot different from say, batman or samurai jack, basically play the same outside of a couple of moves. This game really needs more tools and options in order to have a healthy competitive game.
Also I just think this game needs more things to do. The rifts may not be as bad now, but that's mostly because rifts during season one were some of the most reprehensible things I've ever seen in a video game, and now they don't have that problem, but now the issue is that rifts are just incredibly boring and unfun to do.
Despite that I wish that the RRB's original designs were an alternate variant, (like a epic skin in the future or somethin'. Not to mention fixing the voiclines), the Rowdyruff Boys are pretty rad, and playin' as em' just hits a little different then simply playing as the PPG's. In a good way! You make some excellent points about the competitive field of this game. I personally could never join a tournament, since I can barely stand this game casually-
That would be lit, but I feel like they'd have to add the reboot version of the ppg aswell to make it fair (sadly)
@@Buuutchhhh That might be a bit more complex, especially with the actors, but that reminds me of a comment saying if they add the Powerpunk Girls, they should have the reboot actors, which is really clever. I think Reboot Buttercup's voice would fit Brute.
That could be possible cuz they have the Elusive variant in the game now, wouldn't be surprised for it soon tbh.
@@ItchyBurritoMiniAltThingy The things I'd do for that...!
I get the hate for Shaggy now. Fought a toxic teabagging Shaggy in the shield mode and a shield did not help at all
Add the attack decay text and sound but louder and bigger. Just so spammers know they do that. Plus make is do 75% less damage, knockback, and distance. Yes i know its still in the game kind of.
It doesn't feel like it
Best example for this is tf2.
Balance is kinda shitty, bugs are everywhere, no dev at all yet it's still alive thanks to it's community
That's a terrible thing
What happened to people's manners?
In hindsight. The devs already got the wrong idea for how to make a game functional, balanced, or fun when they came up with the autoteching system. Shit was a bandaid fix for the ground bounce loops that were in the game. Which on it's own is a red flag for their competence. But then they started balancing characters around being able do more ground bounces. Which now only brings us back to square 1 with some characters like Harley. And you can't even tech off a platform or stage to escape.
Speaking of platforms. No other game have I hated platforms more than I do in this game. They screw up my decents when I'm trying to fall with a move, they decide that I'm on them mid combo and give me the wrong moves. I again can't dodge off of them when there's a grenade right next to me. They are just terrible.
Shields I see as another bandaid fix (and a bad one at that) for campy players and projectiles spam. And realizing what they did with auto teching. If anything the projectiles and annoying, virtually unpunishable moves, are going to get worse to compensate. As well as people continuing to run away and not engage.
Sair your boat is crazy lol
"SAir song" is the only thing that make me smile in a while in multiversus.
The game is great by i am having no more fun, all fights looks like i am playing prós and its exaustive.
I hope it wont die before it became better.
I agree with balancing will not save the game I think the game is still has a lot of bugs, absurd overpriced microtransactions that are pushed in and out of rifts and events the player base having a lot of toxicity as of recent there's just alot problem that aren't and can't be adressed
I miss Halo 2 and 3: I love games that would put you on equal ground. After they introduce the class system, it wasn't halo.
Honestly I can’t play platform fighters for very long , and I think I need a break from it, and it sucks there’s no single player content. I’ll still watch your videos though cause your channel deserves love not going to cap 🧢
10:40 Personally at a high level, I 100% hate this game.
I feel this.
@@BPlusEffortsside note: I’m just not playing high level ranked, I’m not full on quitting
Aight you asked at the end of the video. Heres my spicy hot take(s) There are two points im gonna cover and a third that's just the honest truth.
1. We need a reason to fight/play. Rifts are fun and all, but we need something more. Something to actually grind and play for that makes people wanna come back.
2. Bigger take most people who complain about balance and want sheilds are in the 1v1 catagory. People need to realize this game is literally built for 2v2s. I dont play the 1v1 meta cause its not fun nor do I and many others find it interesting. But the 2v2 situation is very dif. You have teammates to help interrupt crazy op combos. You have extra things to keep track of, and you have literal combo attacks WITH YOUR TEAMATE. Personally, i think people just need to buckle down and start trying out 2s mkre cause i promise it's a different experience.
3. Balance in the end will be what it will be. Smash has a meta. In cod, there is a gun meta. In a card game, there is a meta. At the end of the day, we're gonna have good and mid or bad characters, and that's what it's just gonna be. That's how we get things called formats. And the best things about formats? THEY CHANGE! and that's where the fun kicks in cause things shift.
Sorry for the ramble but this is my honest voiced opinion. If people disagree thats cool no skin of my back. But then take the time to look at yourself, look at your gameplay, and look at what your actually playing the game for. For me its just race to masters and be done with the season. What about you? Again, sorry for the ramble.
No need to apologize this is exactly the type of post I wanted. I do agree with most of your points. I wondered how shields would affect 2v2. Especially when you have characters like steven who can already provide the teammate with a barrier.
Should shields be in 1s only? I'm not sure we've had ample time to test this out yet. And yes I agree that teammates do help with the long combos. However the game has enticed people to learn those combos and if we were to get rid of them completely there will be a lot of unhappy players for sure. I've been playing 2s a bit more and there's some things about that I find frustrating as well but ill save that for a video down the line.
@BPlusEfforts long story short. Sheilds in 2s almost never get used. This I only know cause I watched and talked to some fellow reindog players, and they have gotten top 8s in the brackets with them. They pretty much had said that in 2s, there is almost no point in shielding as there's other things you can do that is just better. Overall, I'm personally against sheilds and only see this as a band-aid fix as well. I do think that the community does have some fault to the current issue, but at the same time, the game I just in a weird state. And yes there are flaws in 2s as well as 1s I won't deny, but I do find people enjoying themselves more in the 2s feild than the 1s from my perspective. Ither way thank you for reading my long comments and rambles. Can't wait for the next video drop. Maybe....just maybe you'll be cooking with my boi reindog again? Haha!
I’m kinda confused. You don’t think balance will fix it but you recognize that the broken moves that get abused are part of what makes the game un-fun.. wouldn’t get balancing those moves then make the game more fun?
Balance just means everyone can fight evenly. If everyone has BS moves, then that means the game is "balanced" because most characters can fight most other characters.
My point is that the balancing we're doing is centered around those broken moves being the norm. The balance decisions keep a lot of these unfun moves the same. So yes the overall MU for your character might be even, but it just turns the game into 2 people fishing with their unfun move in 1v1s or people just throwing out obnoxious disjoints in 2v2s.
Imagine if EVERYONE in the game had a zero to death off jab/side attack 1? The game would be "balanced" because EVERYONE has access to a Touch of Death. However that wouldn't be FUN.
They would need to dial back a lot of these moves and tune down A LARGE PORTION of the roster and add whiff recovery to almost every characters initiation tools. This will discourage people from tossing out moves that aren't punishable unless you parry.
@@BPlusEffortsahh okay that doesn’t feel like a hot take. They def need to balance the game to a level of low bull shit. Fully agree
i know that dash attack didnt spike!?
Yeah idk when they added it but the air dash attack sends downward now. I assume it's to stop it from being a kill move at the top of the stage but... I think it's a buff because it adds a lot to their damage potential off of side attack and down attack
yeah like bro i was playing a match and this black Adam spammed dash attack maybe 50 times like how is that fun???
I believe in world place, lets take the nukes away!
But no in all seriousness i wish theyd just fix the game in its entirety. I feel like the social ambassadors on this game have alot of impact on how balancing is handled as opposed to listening to the community as a whole. That may just be my crazy tin foil hat theory but why else would there be so little change in what the people have been asking for?
My boy b plusss
Dumb question but- does anybody know how to do the in air dash on ps5? I’ve been looking for answers and for those who knows I look dumb but I have genuinely been trying to find out for forever
Example of a Toxic gamer? I present to you exhibit A.
I genuinely love the game. But going against the same 5 characters doing the same 2/4 moves on the same 4 maps is very annoying. In 1v1 it's easy to avoid powerful move spam, but in 2v2 it's a lot harder to avoid everytime. And I have the want to play the game more, I just don't have a reason why. It'd be cool if they added a character camo grind. Like at lvl 20 you get a sick skin and so on. That'd be cool. Ranked skins are awesome but the amount of time and pain it takes to get them is not worth. And by pain I mean I'll be in gold while going against constant master players. How do you know your true skill standing in ranked if you go against ranks multiple lvls ahead of you??? Oh, and don't even get me started on passive spacers. PLAY THE GAME!! STOP SITTING THERE AS HARLEY MAKING ME DO ALL THE PUSHING AS RAVEN!!!
The main problem with this game is that it was trying to be different, and that's why it will fail.
Every character should struggle to win.not just the more popular ones with easy comfirm op moves.wile the low tier characters are hard to play and hard to win with.
There’s a plethora of things wrong with this game hit boxes,characters and the toxicity is next level can’t have a friendly 1v1 without somebody tbagging or salt emoting it’s always the same shit. Also this dev don’t know what direction they wanna go with certain characters WB is a billion dollar company half of these things going on in this crap of a platform fighter shouldn’t be in here and everybody plays the same for example Harley,Batman, samurai jack etc it’s like these people are all wired to the same brain cell and that auto tech shit Is GARBAGE does nothing but make you drop combos and get in F’d up situations lol idek how they can fix this game anymore honestly PFG and WB are jokes
Unpopular opinion but I don't think fighting IG is that bad. Taz is the worst when it comes to that though, I never have fun when fighting taz.
I agree on Taz. My point about iron giant is that his design and gameplay is either he's nerfed to the point to where hes just a big hitbox for combo food and can't move against half the roster.
Or he's buffed and ends up becoming a killing machine who won't die and kills you at 30
That is not a hot take. Games being not completely balanced adding to fun is actually a dead horse at this point.
They need to get rid of armored moves
Thank goodness I stopped playing this game after S2... Looks like not much has changed from what I can see game loop wise 👀
When is marceline coming out? I’ve been waiting everyday.
I think 13 or 14 days
@ but a new character comes out every month? And Raven came out around a month ago
Middle of Season I THINK
@darkrainbowcakeyt8749 13 days bud. The season is longer now than ussual. But mid season is coming soon. Well have her and the ugly sweater event come sooner than you think!
been stopped playing this game when i’m running into ONLY SHAGGY AND SUPERMAN WHEN THERE IS MULTIPLE OTHER CHARACTERS yeahh..im done with this trash
This game was never going to be a good Esport. Smash Bros. was created as a casual game. The Esport scene was even actively hindered in that game. An interior clone of Smash Bros. was never going to be successful.
you really think justing wong was having fun when he was getting parried by diago & ended up losing a tournament? what are you yapping about man
Was 3rd strike developed specifically with esports and balance in mind? Not even close.
Do you think Justin Wong NEVER enjoyed 3rd strike? let's not do this.
Did third strike have the majority of the roster doing cool stuff, flashy moves, a fun parry system, cool supers? Yes, yes it did.
Did 3rd strike have some of the most beautiful sprite work at the time, a story mode arcade ladder for high scores and endings?
Also a parry that works? Yes Justin got out played in an overall HYPE moment but no one has ever said "LMAO WHAT A BS PARRY" in that moment. Also Daigo didn't even go on to win that tournament. EVO Moment 37 did not even happen in grand finals.
@ bro didnt they a 100k prize pool for beta and then trolli had a 7,500 prize pool the other day as well
my bad in that moment you think justin was thinking about fun
your right about balance
some people enjoy this game though so?
Did you NOT watch the video? I'm one of those people that DOES enjoy the game?
What I'm saying is at the moment the balancing isn't the overall problem for most people. If there were more things to do besides "Ranked/Not ranked/Rifts" we might have reasons to keep players invested long term.
Balancing the game is a good thing in theory but most of the successful esports are fine with strong metas and bad match ups. Look at Street Fighter, Guilty Gear, Melee, Apex Legends, Team Fortress 2. All unbalanced as fuck messes historically but people STILL love them and make for good competitive games.
However those games offer significantly more things to do than Casual/Ranked/Horrible Mode.
I am enjoying the game for now but what we have is not a formula that can last another 8 seasons.
Smash Bros, Brawlhalla, and Rivals do it the best for me fr I don't even play mvs like that unless I'm waiting for fortnite to update lol!
Ok
Multi who!!? I don’t care for esports, I just want a fun game. I been mentally drained of emotion. I just play a hour of the game get bored and call it quits. Not even playing with friends make me play the game. Who the duck made these decisions. Not even uncle grandpa will make me come back. For those of you who have faith in this game. GL