I was lucky enough to pick up an Arp 1621 sequencer recently but couldn´t get it to trig my 1974 Minimoog. CV & filter control works fine though. It was a relief to find your video, Thanks.
Hi Keith. Thanks for this great video. I have a question I'd like to ask you: How many envelopes can you trigger with just one circuit? I'm want to build a mult panel with a V-trig in and 3 S-trigs out. Do I need a transistor and resistor for each out or do I just need the one transistor and resistor at the input? I wouldn't want to overload the single transistor, yet I don't want to put an op amp buffer on the input because I would like to keep the module unpowered. Keep up the good work and take care.
#5 in my Google search. I was looking to replace my cable that EJE made for my Source in the 80's. I think I'm going with your 1/4 Female to 1/4 Male jumper. Then I won't get the cable confused with my other mini to 1/4 cables. Well done!
Keith that was an excellent explanatory video. I actually cleared my confusion, plus i gained extra valuably knowledge. Thank you from a new subscriber.
Thank you for the video. Most helpful. I actually bought a cable that didn’t have the resistor so I will be soldering one in. One thing I wanted to know; my Moog Source has a dual CV in/out. What would the wiring be? I have a keystep pro which is a eurorack compatible controller. Essentially sending out CV much in the same way the ARP Odyssey does. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Best wishes from across the pond here in the UK.
Hi Dan. The Moog Source uses 1v/Oct for pitch CV, but S-Trig for gates. I don't have a KeyStep Pro, but the manual mentions a parameter to output S-Trigs instead of V-Trigs.
@@krmelectronics hi, many thanks for your reply. The S trig converter cable with the circuitry is working perfectly. I have discovered that if I pull the cable out half way from the Moog, I get cv in as well. The confusion was that the socket was a two way one (in/out) on the moog which I have not seen before. No cable worked but this was a recent discovery so I now have my Source integrated with the rest of my system finally. Many thanks
Hey Keith. Question for you... in Moog's doc, they show a 1N4148 diode from B to gnd between the 100K and the Base of the trans. Is this not necessary? www.muffwiggler.com/forum/userpix/1663_moog_triggerconvert_1.jpg Thank you and especially thanks for the Synthi videos you produced a few years back, good to see you around after a few years.
+EMwhite Gear Demos The diode shown in the Moog circuit is used to protect the input on the transistor, and also guard against a V-Trig signal with reverse polarity (the positive voltage on the sleeve, instead of the tip). Strictly speaking, the diode isn't necessary. It would also be difficult to cram it into a 1/4" barrel, along with the transistor and resistor!
It gets even more confusing. In ARP terminology, what they are calling V-trig in Moogese is called GATE in ARPish. ARP's "TRIG" signal not a continuous signal but rather is a several millisecond pulse that has a selectable behavior on the ARP 3620 keyboard according to the SINGLE/MULTI switch. In SINGLE position, TRIG fires only on a key press when no other keys are pressed. In MULTI mode, TRIG fires with every key press even if other keys are held down. Meanwhile, GATE is always at a high voltage (10 V on the ARP 2600) when any key is pressed, and 0 V when no keys are pressed. The advantage of this setup is that it allows for selective retriggering of the ADSR envelope generator during legato play, such that even if a note is being sustained, the attack and decay can be re-triggered when the next note is played without first executing the release part of the ADSR envelope. Meanwhile, the AR envelope generator responds only to GATE (aka V-trig in Moogese). So for example if you wish to simulate a wind instrument, you can set the TRIG (ARPish - for pulse) to SINGLE mode. When the first note is played, the Attack and Decay are cycled simulating the initial breath, proceeding to Sustain. When other notes are played legato, there is no retriggering of Attack and Decay, which simulating the sustained breath while changing notes. If you wish to simulate a more harpsichord type sound or a plucked string instrument, set the TRIG selector switch to MULTI. This retriggers the Attack and Decay with every note played regardless of whether other keys are released first.
Did I understand right: V-trig is waiting for voltage signal to trig, S-trig is like sus-pedal - it have potential on wires and waiting for smbd short-circuit wires and drop potential to zero? So V-trig is useable with controllers, and S-trig can be used be simple passive devices?
saasrus Yes, that is it exactly. You can trigger an S-trig device with a passive switch, or even just touching 2 wires together! A V-trig device requires the trigger voltage to rise above some threshold. Usually 4 to 5 volts is required, but some older synths may require 12 or 15 volts.
Excellent video! Is it possible to do the opposite? In other words build a S-Trig to V-Trig converter cable? I have seen interface boxes built for that, but would prefer a single cable solution.
Not easily possible built into a cable because you have to pass an actual voltage for V-Trig (different manufacturers used different voltages, but they all must reach or exceed a given voltage before the trigger will happen). The S-Trig is just a shorting connection. So to do the opposite you have to add in a battery or tap into the power supply...Ergo, not easily done in a cable.
I was lucky enough to pick up an Arp 1621 sequencer recently but couldn´t get it to trig my 1974 Minimoog.
CV & filter control works fine though. It was a relief to find your video, Thanks.
In this video I sync up a Moog Source and Arp Odyssey, and show how to build a V-Trig to S-Trig converter cable.
Great video - all is clear and on the point. Cheers 😊
Great video I need to build one of these it reminds me of building DMX terminators for lights.
Hi Keith. Thanks for this great video. I have a question I'd like to ask you: How many envelopes can you trigger with just one circuit? I'm want to build a mult panel with a V-trig in and 3 S-trigs out. Do I need a transistor and resistor for each out or do I just need the one transistor and resistor at the input? I wouldn't want to overload the single transistor, yet I don't want to put an op amp buffer on the input because I would like to keep the module unpowered. Keep up the good work and take care.
#5 in my Google search. I was looking to replace my cable that EJE made for my Source in the 80's. I think I'm going with your 1/4 Female to 1/4 Male jumper. Then I won't get the cable confused with my other mini to 1/4 cables. Well done!
Keith that was an excellent explanatory video. I actually cleared my confusion, plus i gained extra valuably knowledge.
Thank you from a new subscriber.
Thank you for all your good videos. Informative and entertaining, great TV.I'd love to see you use the PAiA that's up at the top.
Thank you for this!
You are welcome Daniel.
Very informative. Thanks.
nice, very well done! thx
Thanks for the compliment Dukimusic!
what a great kludge - thanks!
antigen4 i'll make one and put it with my RJ45 ethernet crossover cable :)
Thank you for the video. Most helpful. I actually bought a cable that didn’t have the resistor so I will be soldering one in. One thing I wanted to know; my Moog Source has a dual CV in/out. What would the wiring be? I have a keystep pro which is a eurorack compatible controller. Essentially sending out CV much in the same way the ARP Odyssey does. Any advise would be greatly appreciated. Best wishes from across the pond here in the UK.
Hi Dan. The Moog Source uses 1v/Oct for pitch CV, but S-Trig for gates. I don't have a KeyStep Pro, but the manual mentions a parameter to output S-Trigs instead of V-Trigs.
@@krmelectronics hi, many thanks for your reply. The S trig converter cable with the circuitry is working perfectly. I have discovered that if I pull the cable out half way from the Moog, I get cv in as well. The confusion was that the socket was a two way one (in/out) on the moog which I have not seen before. No cable worked but this was a recent discovery so I now have my Source integrated with the rest of my system finally. Many thanks
Hey Keith. Question for you... in Moog's doc, they show a 1N4148 diode from B to gnd between the 100K and the Base of the trans. Is this not necessary? www.muffwiggler.com/forum/userpix/1663_moog_triggerconvert_1.jpg Thank you and especially thanks for the Synthi videos you produced a few years back, good to see you around after a few years.
+EMwhite Gear Demos
The diode shown in the Moog circuit is used to protect the input on the transistor, and also guard against a V-Trig signal with reverse polarity (the positive voltage on the sleeve, instead of the tip).
Strictly speaking, the diode isn't necessary. It would also be difficult to cram it into a 1/4" barrel, along with the transistor and resistor!
Excellent!
Excellent video, just subscribed to your channel. Im going to see if I can implement this to my DIY from scratch prototype project.
Go for it! FM synthesis is a very under rated method.
Synthesizer Keith Indeed FMs timbral diversness and potential is amazing .
Hi Keith. How do You play one note on the ARP and throught the V/S trig, play the same note on Moog keyboard ?
It gets even more confusing. In ARP terminology, what they are calling V-trig in Moogese is called GATE in ARPish. ARP's "TRIG" signal not a continuous signal but rather is a several millisecond pulse that has a selectable behavior on the ARP 3620 keyboard according to the SINGLE/MULTI switch. In SINGLE position, TRIG fires only on a key press when no other keys are pressed. In MULTI mode, TRIG fires with every key press even if other keys are held down. Meanwhile, GATE is always at a high voltage (10 V on the ARP 2600) when any key is pressed, and 0 V when no keys are pressed.
The advantage of this setup is that it allows for selective retriggering of the ADSR envelope generator during legato play, such that even if a note is being sustained, the attack and decay can be re-triggered when the next note is played without first executing the release part of the ADSR envelope. Meanwhile, the AR envelope generator responds only to GATE (aka V-trig in Moogese).
So for example if you wish to simulate a wind instrument, you can set the TRIG (ARPish - for pulse) to SINGLE mode. When the first note is played, the Attack and Decay are cycled simulating the initial breath, proceeding to Sustain. When other notes are played legato, there is no retriggering of Attack and Decay, which simulating the sustained breath while changing notes.
If you wish to simulate a more harpsichord type sound or a plucked string instrument, set the TRIG selector switch to MULTI. This retriggers the Attack and Decay with every note played regardless of whether other keys are released first.
how can i do the opposite? S-Trig to V-Trig...
What about the ms20 hertz per octave vs volts per octave?is there a way to make a special connector or conversion box?
Look into one of two Eurorack modules for this conversion: English Tear, or Disting mk4. I recommend Disting, as it can also do many other things
Did I understand right: V-trig is waiting for voltage signal to trig, S-trig is like sus-pedal - it have potential on wires and waiting for smbd short-circuit wires and drop potential to zero?
So V-trig is useable with controllers, and S-trig can be used be simple passive devices?
saasrus Yes, that is it exactly. You can trigger an S-trig device with a passive switch, or even just touching 2 wires together! A V-trig device requires the trigger voltage to rise above some threshold. Usually 4 to 5 volts is required, but some older synths may require 12 or 15 volts.
Excellent video! Is it possible to do the opposite? In other words build a S-Trig to V-Trig converter cable? I have seen interface boxes built for that, but would prefer a single cable solution.
Not easily possible built into a cable because you have to pass an actual voltage for V-Trig (different manufacturers used different voltages, but they all must reach or exceed a given voltage before the trigger will happen). The S-Trig is just a shorting connection. So to do the opposite you have to add in a battery or tap into the power supply...Ergo, not easily done in a cable.