*2021:* rear wings flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered *illegal* by the FiA, and teams are forced to change it mid-season via TD *2022:* floors flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered *illegal* by the FiA, and teams are forced to change it mid-season via TD *2024:* front and rear wings flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered to be *just fine*, and the FiA wants to collect data first before they decide whether or not teams have to change it for next season This is another certified FiA moment
In 2021 FIA made everithying to screw Red bull, except for the last race, now the brakes TD is for sure to Red Bull. Now FIA decides who is the best car?
in Football this would be McVARen effect. The new owenrs are so busy trying to derail RB that they allow illegalities to make sure a team doesnt run away with 4-5 championships. All about the business model. Main victim here is Ferrari, which was trying to catch up to RB, and would be 2nd team and in some races like this one the best team, only for McLaren to overtake them within the span of a couple of months... No team has made more stride in a formula car with a chewed out concept than they have...
Last year FIA completely destroyed Aston Martin’s season by banning their flexible front wing, and yet this year McLaren is doing it even more aggressively but FIA doesn’t care! Toxic F1 indeed!
correct! and take note who's the number one sponsor of mclaren? you know that already. the FIA president is Muslim and the number 1 sponsor is saudi aramco. so what are we expected, they will try to capture the f1 world champshioship.
@@perdinantmakros3918if there is corruption in F1 his religion will Have nothing to do with it, if you are saying greed then for sure, mentioning his religion is strange not 1 person said Mentioned Bernie Ecclestones religious beliefs when investigating his corruption in F1
i remember a team principle once saying (icr who it was exactly) You read the rules once to see what they say Then you read them again to see what they don't say then you design your car around what they don't say
but the rules simply state that the aero is not allowed to move unless moved by the driver with the electronics ? so it seems they just did it and hoped for the best and it seems to have worked.
@@lukebennett.Redbull has had mid season TD changes pitted against their car in 21, 22, and 23 season. Yet, Mclaren gets nothing. Don’t know what F1 you’ve been following but FIA is not favouring Redbull what so ever 😂.
@@lukebennett. yeah and the FIAs fault not Max or Redbull lmao. Big difference from a team running the most obvious illegal wings and the FIA turning blind eye to it. Redbull has had their wings nerfed mid season many many times, yet McLarens is getting away with it. Not that hard to understand. Your logic is that since Redbull got away with something in 2021 which they had no control over we should just let Mclaren cheat and run illegal wings?
It's not just 3kph difference, if you think so, you don't understand how F1 works. If you can run bigger wing for the slow corners and this wing also gives you less drag on the straight, you effectively gain much more in overall lap time. This is why Flexi wings are so controversial. I feel like you should have mention this in your video. Although, I agree with the rest.
Couldn't agree more, they are gaining the advantage round the whole lap, that's why they have made such leaps and bounds from last year. You must be talking 1-2 seconds a lap of an improvement. Hopefully the other teams work it out and then we will see a true picture of who is fastest!!
@@scottferguson7863the reason they have made such leaps and bounds is because they’ve started using their new wind tunnel which i believe is the most advanced in F1 currently. and i assume this allows them to see things other teams can’t leading to innovations like this
Yeah it’s ever straight … every corner there’s a gain! I just don’t see why they don’t allow it! Again it’s a free boost Like DAS The asymmetrical braking Just free gains Even when they used to have a spring weight in the nose to cancel frequency’s All cost no fuel just better for the efficiency of the car
The problem isnt if its illegal or not, the problem is in the FIAs non existent consistency. In 2021 when redbulls wings were flexing while still passing all the FIA tests as it is with mclaren right now it was deemed illegal and they had to remove it within 2 races . In 2022 Ferrari and redbull were using flexi floors while still passing all the fia flex tests but still they had to remove it within 2 races with 2 new TDs during the season. In 2023 aston martins front wing was flexing but still passed all the FIA tests but somehow they had to remove it as well because it was deemed illegal . Now another team ,mclaren, comes up not only with a extreme flexing front wing but a flexible rear wing as well but now they suddenly say "as long as they pass the tests everything is legal " ???? When its mclaren abusing that right now they somehow suddenly cant do anything about it until 2025 ???? Where is your consistency? I think everyone can think of a reason why they are letting mclaren getting away with it right now but hey we ,me included, all hate F1 politics thats why we are following this page so yeah . I will call it a day by saying that the FIA should be consistent
See how quickly they clamped down on the Aston Martin front wing flexing last year and are now taking their sweet time with the Mclaren and Mercedes ones. MAFIA is back!
already crying 😂, redbull cheated in 2021 and got help from massi and breached the cost cap yet they got away with it and max was gifted a championship, i'm sure you weren't crying back then
@@larssonk22 they clearly want the fiabull in favor of max and gift him the championship and are ok with this, but when others beat them they start crying and blame the fia to start helping them again 😂
It's all about the dimensions where the parts are bending, inside the predefinied area teams can do basically anything, but if ut's bending outside the area that is illegal.. just remember a few races ago Albon was disqualified because his floor was 1,5mm bigger like the predefinied max.. if he stay inside the 1,5mm smaller area, nobody cares about his floor..
How its gonna go: fia wont do anything, redbull and ferrari will use the same trick, fia will call them out on that, redbull and ferrari will recall to mclaren, fia shuts up "unexpectedly"
I think its a clever trick and arguably lands within the grey area of not currently illegal - but for consistency the FIA should ban it, given their same responses in the past to front wings & floors - I baffles me why they say they don't want excess flex but then allow teams to have 2 piece elements across the front wing that allow extra flexing ...
I think McLaren think they designed it within the role parameters even if against the intent of the rules. Zero flex is probably impossible, that is why they specify maximum amounts of flex. But if you can engineer to be within those flex parameters but have it gain you the advantage they are trying to prevent, there's nothing you can do about it until next season by redefining the measurements that are currently within the rules.
@@Dakkyun AM also found a "loophole". But the FIA deemed it against the spirit of the rules and told them to remove it. And then conveniently changed the technical rules to ban it. But with this "Its a way around tests" and not "against the spirit of the rules". ok bud
flex due to materials combination and flex due to wear is not the same. Its just too sad too many people dont understand basic concepts and muddle two things into one because any level of critical thinking is too much for them.
I find immensly suspicious, that when RedBull had flex in their wings in 2021 and 22 the FIA saw no issue what so ever to demand change mid season, but now they need to evaluate everything and move it on to 2025 thereby almost deliberately choosing sides with McLaren and Mercedes. How is that anything but unfair? Ferrari and RedBull watched their flex and make sure they comply and yet somehow get screwed over by playing by the rules.
In 21 and 22 the FIA simply changed the way they took measurements in order to detect the flex. Obviously whatever McLaren is doing right now the FIA is currently at a loss as to how to reliably measure it. Unlike 21-22 this may actually need an extensive rewriting of the rules.
The rules allow for flex with some very specific numbers. Presumably they allow for flex because preventing it entirely is impossible in a lightweight car. McLaren has just found a way to engineer in some flex, deliberately, that stays within the specified parameters but does it in such a way as to give them an advantage which the other teams failed to figure out. In the other case, such as Red bull, I'm guessing that the flex did not stay within the parameters specified in the rules.
@@louiscypher4186 If they just applied their regulation they could just disqualify the car. Article 3.2.2 of the Technical Regulations stating that “all aerodynamic components or bodywork influencing the car’s aerodynamic performance must be rigidly secured and immobile”
@@FusedMovieyou could ban every car on the grid if you take that literally, “immobile” is defined by the rules which are enforced with tests. Said tests do not detect any illegal movement on the McLaren, and due to the nature of the flexing its difficult to design rules that ban it, hence why we haven’t seen a band-aid solution applied.
Drs trick or not, McLarens traction out of the final corner was brilliant. Piastri would be 5-6 tenths then out of the final corner piastri would pull 2 tenths ahead of Ferrari and red bull on every lap.
Just like they tried their best to stop the Merc dominance and make sure 2021 is interesting and attractive to Netflix fans till the last lap. Seems like now it turns against RB.
@@ShawnFX The new audience and better ratings mainly came with Netflix. It's not the change of winning team that did anything. Everyone was also desperate for Mercedes' dominance after RB succes with Vettel.
When people say: McLaren is cheating FIA: McLaren is not cheating 🇬🇧: Well, if the FIA says it’s okay, then it’s fine. But when people say: Red Bull is cheating FIA: Red Bull is not cheating 🇬🇧: Oh, it’s the MaFIA again! Red Bull is clearly cheating!
It was obvious McLaren had an advantage leaving the corner, and that kind of linear torque is electrical. Flexing wings then carry that advantage on down the straight. Explaining McLaren's recent resurgence.
I saw the same thing when i was watching the GP i should say that it should be all the same for all the teams if theres flexing its illegal or everybody will have flexing plain and simple I would love to see a revised point system it would make things more appaling for the smaller teams Btw love youre channel and dedication lets go and thank you
Thanks for this great video. Love the attention. The British media give great credit for Lando. But forgetting who the better driver in this team rn. Good that you give Oscar all the credit! What an incredible driver in just his second year.
@@Dyils What kind of logic is that? Are F1 teams only allowed to worry about one area of the car at a time? Redbull has many issues with the overall package of their car and it's seems their lack of CFD/wind tunnel time is finally catching up with them. However, I don't think it's a coincidence that Perez is suddenly close to Max's pace after the asynchronous braking rule clarification.
@@bewinwilsonmathews1892 It's been two weekends where Perez is very close to Verstappen. Since the summer break it seems like a big change for him, but perhaps it is just Perez finally finding his form (together with other teams upgrades being effective).
Its all legal until it isn't, currently its legal and passes all the tests so all's good.. However if they change the testing regime then that could change..
@shepardice3775 mate if a string of words in a RUclips comments section elicits such a negative reaction from you, I think its your own head you gotta worry about
1st half of the season didn't play out like that at all. McLaren has had the quickest car for a while now though and should have a lot more points but keep messing tactical decisions up
If the FIA doesn’t intervene in rear wing or front wing trick then we expect Ferrari and Red Bull using the similar concept in Austin maybe where the real test will begin for Ferrari Monza package
RB was always doing this kind of stuff, you have been sleeping past few years? Like honestly ,i wish all of you were so outraged when they doing it, but for some reason people like you are always silent about it
Why would they intervene if it's legal? All items brought to a car have to pass mandatory test, and all of them did. Ferrari and RedBull should simply step up their development.
@@TheMrakic bc when RB was using it and other teams where outraged FIA decided it was illegal, RB changed it but if McLaren is using some trick which is illegal they aren't doing anything.
@@alensabanovic747 Do you realize that Red Bull did the exact same thing in 2021 and despite passing all tests, it was deemed illegal as it was against the spirit of the regulations? And now suddenly, the FIA know it's sketchy but they turn a blind eye... Very unfair
Lots of people talking about Aston Martin having a flexi wing that got banned. You should get your facts straight. What Aston had was a flexing FLOOR. The floor would bend under heavy aerodynamic pressure and allow for more downforce. Your channel is rapidly becoming my favourite F1 channel. Congrats!
I do think it’s interesting because during the entire race Charles would get so close to Oscar but then after the straight just slowly fall back. Now Oscar did some excellent defending but after the straight Charles could just not get close enough and would immediately lose time, even if Oscar made a tiny mistake. Then, afterwards I saw this on X.
One lap Oscar made a mistake and Charles was roughly 4 tenths behind going onto the straights with a better exit, and still couldn’t pass him. And this is with a rear wing on the McLaren that was highest loaded on the entire grid. The amount of laptime they’re gaining in the corners from running a higher loaded wing, plus the mini drs effect would a HUGE advantage in lap time.
@@stevenst6337 Exactly, I agree. I mean Oscar’s defending was stellar but Charles kept up with him throughout the entire time and even when he had a better lap, couldn’t even get close to overtaking which I believe is partly due to the rear wing.
@@MarekFr their top speed was lower then both Ferarri, Mercedes, and Redbull with the DRS open, and with the DRS closed they were matching those teams top speed because of their “mini DRS”. Obviously more loaded then any of the top teams doesn’t take Adrian Newey level engineering to spot.
@@stevenst6337 There are so many things affecting top speed, you cannot say that the RW is more loaded because the top speed is lower, especially if you look at them and see that McLaren one is clearly the smallest.
Even though Max's race was not good, he and his side of the garage were still happy. They tried a setup that was different from FP1 and it wasn't the way to go, but the car exceeded some expectations. I think if the COTA upgrades deliver, Max might get another win or 2.
Aside from Red Bull clearly struggling due to being outside its optimized operational window and having to make numerous compromises, they remain competitive. Once they sort out the balance issues with the RB20, I suspect they'll be on top again
@@Zeep3unless they can bring back their illegal break system they aren't sorting out that car this season. Still probably too late though to prevent the Max win..
@maxsteel32 they never had assymetric brakes, they struggle with the balance of the car. It's why Perez was in contention for a win yesterday while Verstappen couldn't even turn the car properly. Perez had a good setup, Verstappen changed his after q3 and it ruined his quali and race. When the car is stable, they're very fast, just look at Austria.
From what I have seen and read so far it is a very difficult topic to judge! Regarding people's arguments about Aston Martin's flexing wings in 23 and Red Bull's in 2021 and 2022 I do get that it seems unfair and inconsistent that the FIA has not acted upon McLaren's wing flexing. HOWEVER and this is the big part which I have to little information about... It does matter HOW MUCH the wings flex. The rules clearly state some room of tolerance for flexing since making an on comand moving wing completely stiff when not comanded to open is almost impossible at such high speeds. So this really depends on how much both the McLaren and Mercedes wings this year flex compared to how much the Aston Martin and Red Bull wings flexed in the other years. If they were flexing over the tolerable room whilst the ones this year are not then the question is easily answered. Only problem is I doubt any of us will ever know how much all of these wings actually flexed so for me it's a topic that simply cannot and should not be discussed by casual F1 fans (including myself, all comment writers and RUclipsrs in this!!!)
First the brakes in 98, then the spy story in 2007-2008 and now this. It seems like Mclaren have been struggling to deliver successful results while also staying within the rules...
It’s not really a McLaren thing. I can’t think of any dominant car that did not have some sort of tech and/or rule controversy. Maybe someone else can think of one…
This is interesting because the Redbull flex wing was flexing the whole wing downwards on the straight, but had been noted that the gap in the wing for DRS was also changing. But Mclaren seem to be focusing on the DRS gap as the main objective for the flexing component. Regardless I can't wait for the FIA to come in a make a shit show of everything.
A couple things to say here. The MCL38 was definitely the 2nd fastest car that weekend. The SF24 in the hands of Leclerc dropped Piastri in the first sting, and it was only a divebomb from Piastri that allowed him to overtake Leclerc, but we saw that for around 30 laps the Ferrari was in the McLaren’s DRS. Furthermore, McLaren never said Piastri was a no.2 driver, and the “papaya rules” are a term of engagement for on track battles. The recent rhetoric was about Piastri occasionally helping Norris if the time came and if Norris is in a close title fight.
Where are all those who said RB is a cheater when actually everyone is exploiting grey area. Why now they are so quiet about McLaren mini drs? Why no shouting "McLaren is cheating"? 😂
I have a hunch that the Mclaren is running sometimes illegal. No car can gain that much performance in such a short period of time. Especially on a power dependent track.
Its not just that Mclaren gained performance, its that their direct competition for the front, RedBull, fell behind in the process. The increase looks dramatic because of this but without RedBull falling off it wouldnt look to be the same increase in performance.
@@Ixxlostinabox all team have gained time, even RB, just a lot less than others, and with balance issues along with those. Without the balance issues Max would be much faster but he has to adjust the car to make it work and cant attack corners the same way...
@@JM_daDoc That and, since this season has been turning out to be the year that every single conspiracy theory turns out to be true, something Redbull had got removed too. It's just bonkers without proof that the asymmetrical braking was a performance booster, but who knows with the Redbull falling so far behind.
@@milknwaffles9669 Its missing the point as the DRS element is not allowed to divert from the plane of the wing unlesss commanded by the driver. And in this case it is. That is EXPLICIT.
Would note that Oscar has more points than Lando (181 to 171) since Oscar received the upgrade in Imola. Love your data driven, objective, thoughful, well informed and researched content
I don't think it needs to be illegal by the current rules for the FIA to deem it illegal. Sometimes, the lack of precision in the rules or the excessive precision of the rules, both are possible, create gray areas that are not strictly illegal but our interpreted as violating rule intent or some other fuzzy idea.
It's fascinating to see what teams invent to gain an advantage. This invention highlights just how difficult it is for the F1 FIA to impartially regulate car specifications. In our humble opinion, the 'genius' Red Bull rear spoiler reduction system (used up to 2013), where they used exhaust heat to flex the rear spoiler down the straights, must rate among the most amazing ways to legally side step the FIA rules. That being said, all F1 teams have come up with brilliant ideas to give them an advantage....... especially Ferrari, Mercedes, McLaren & Williams.
Aston Martin’s wing was not complying with a current rule, they didn’t change the rules to stop them. They would have to change the rules to make McLaren’s wing illegal.
@@4700Pedro I dont know the exact rule,but its one of rules concerned about the bending of the DRS and the rear wing The FiA hasnt said anything if it is within the rules or not I bet money that FiA will make it illegal when Lando is more closer to Max in the WDC standings so they can ensure a more exciting finish to the season
@@bewinwilsonmathews1892 the rules speak about bending limits at static tests. To make it illegal, the tests need to change. And they prolly don't know how to do it
4:39 '500N' That 'N' stands for Newtons, the SI unit for weight. Divide Newtons by the force of gravity in metres per second squared and you get kilograms, the SI unit for mass - which, oddly enough, is the more common usage [don't ask me why]. In this instance it works out as 500 N / 9.80665 m/s2 = 50.98581 kg. My only quibble. Otherwise, a good report on the latest clever engineering trick. Keep diggin'.
If anything the other teams will complain to the FIA about it, FIA will say it’s fine and then ban it for next year like they do with every technological innovation
That opening it creates isn't much to give DRS like gains. DRS is worth like 15 km/h. That little gap doesn't even compare to the opening of the DRS flap. I'd be surprised if it's worth 1 km/h Also the flap at the bottom lifting up seems to be creating more drag on the rear wing than it is helping.
Basically if it doesn’t get deemed unsafe. It’s fine. I’m no engineer but I think it’s super clever! That’s how motorsport goes. Bend and innovate upon the rules until you break them or give reason for new rules
Not really, the DRS element is not supposed to move at all, it's quite clearly stated. But even if it were a loophole, why isn't the FIA closing it like every other time?
Article 3.10.10.c states that "there shall be no relative movement between the component parts of the DRS bodywork". Article 3.10.10.g is then even clearer: "Any change in the angle of attack of the upper closed section [the DRS flap] shall only be activated by direct input from the driver and only be controlled using the control electronics specified in Article 8.3.
It's not the element that's flexing, it's the main section and endplates that's twisting causing that gap to form. They can load test the element all they want, will still pass.
It doesn't matter what is technically legal or illegal by the books. If it passes the tests, then it is allowed. The best cars target loopholes and exploit them as much as they can.
Why not reduce the rules? Ive watched F1 for years and rules are getting so strict that all the cars are basically the same. Slacken the rules and you'll get some awesome sights like lotus's famous ground force curtain. I want to see more of that
for anyone who wants to bring up a live video of the flap opening and closing without activation go to 1:19:50 going on F1 TV and watch as the mclaren had the corners lifted, and at the turn they just close, right after that then you can see leclerc suffering behind.
These kinds of innovation are what F1 is about. I remember Double DRS last year with the flexible beam wing which was a genius innovation. Personally I even find banning assymetric braking for 2026 a damn shame but that's just me, I guess.
@@gaycha6589 Probably he meant that if the british team creates such things, then they are allowed to use it (at least for some time, e.g. das system) and it is ok. if other teams like rb/am create something in the same way (flexible front/back wing), then it should be changed almost immediately
@@mugiwara.eugene OK. But it’s not like these are hidden and only discovered after a few races, like the controversial brake bias at RBR. Best thing is to make them all legal so teams can adopt and all push the tech. Or clearly outlaw them. Maclren are doing nothing wrongs until FIA changes rules
By looking at the onboard cam, it looks like the wing elements around the top flap are flexing independently from the top flap, creating a 'mini DRS' gap without affecting the top flap angle/height, which would fall in line with current regulations
@@TayebMC Someone has already pointed out that this is illegal under section 3.10.10 C & D - it's stated that there should be no movement between the DRS parts and movement with the upper flaps should only be manually controlled. If you're using the flexi wing directive then it's legal, but under the DRS section this is completely illegal.
@@francebalante8254 Nope, the flap itself doesn't move at all and relative to the DRS pillar, it flexes the same amount, so it completelly fulfills the rules. The only thing flexing more than everything are the side portions of the main rear wing structure and if that passed static tests, it's legal (as you yourself said).
wing technically doesn't break any rules, but we all know it shouldn't flex. props to mclaren for finding out a way to bend the rules. had this happened at the beginning of the season then other teams probably would've copied mclaren, but now that we've passed the halfway mark i'm not sure how many teams can actually afford to develop the same rear wing, so they'll most likely protest it. i honestly don't see the FIA rolling with this shit, so they'll probably ban it. next season. F1 has always been like this. Teams finding loopholes and seeing how the FIA reacts.
I think your video is sound, the oversight though, is that while they can reach higher speeds on straights they can likely carry more speed in corners due having more wing there while not suffering on the straights for it
As long as the rules are followed the wing cannot be deemed “illegal”, you’re just being mad and should start seeing things from a rational perspective 😂
What people don't realize is that this is not the flap flexing. The flap is curved in a way that the flex of the wing as a whole creates the gap. That means the technical regulation isn't violated, since the angle of the flap in reference to the wing structure stays constant.
what they are dping is kinda like wind blowing in the sails creating a larger curve. When you only fix the top part to the wing that part which is tested does not move. The lower rim of the top wing get pressed upwards, creating the little opening below it
@@JM_daDoc and the tests described wouldn't catch it because they're only measuring the deflection in the vector of the force applied i.e. how much it bends _with_ the force, what isn't happening here, that is more of a torque rotation. In fact, this rotation is most optimal the less measured deflection you have.
So when red bull exploit a grey area in the rules and create an inertia valve, everyone’s claiming they’re serial cheaters and they should be stripped of titles. But when mclaren exploit a grey area in the rules, they’re all geniuses? Make it make sense pls….
It's a smart solution that's in an unregulated area, thats what F1 is all about. The ball is in FIA's court, they should make a quick decision whether it will be approved or not so that the other teams can implement it themselves it is so
The upper element is allowed to flex up to but not more than 7mm, to me and IMO that looks larger than 7mm, so if FIA investigate this, and find it okay, then we know what the other will do, until the FIA change the rules.
In Baku Mclaren had the highest loaded rear wing on the entire grid, and were flying past everyone like they didn’t exist. Piastri held Leclerc off from half a second for like 30 laps straight 😂. Double standards in the FIA if this was Redbull there would be a new TD within next 2 races. And not only is their rear wing creating a mini DRS, but their front wing also visibly flexing more then anyone else. Take away those wings and I highly highly doubt Piastri holds off Leclerc.
People can tell whatever they want but the rules clearly states that the bodywork of the DRS cant move lol its clearly illegal. Rule 3.10.10 Drag Reduction System (DRS) section C. There must be no relative movement between the constituent parts of the DRS Bodywork. section F The design is such that failure of the system will result in the uppermost closed section returning to the normal high incidence position. section G Any alteration of the incidence of the uppermost closed section may only be commanded by direct driver input and controlled using the control electronics specified in artice 8.3.
What most people missed is that the DRS flap doesn't flex at all. It's the rear wing around it that flexes more on the sides and thus creates that small opening in the corners. The DRS pillar and the DRS flap (= DRS bodywork) are staying in the same positions relative to each other (they do flex back in high speeds, but relative to each other, they flex the same). The +3 kph is also misleading, as McLaren clearly had less loaded rear wing, so it had less drag and the DRS was not as effective.
I'd love to see active suspension and aero. They could use a positioning sensor (GPS) to map the tracks to control the systems automatically so the drivers could just focus on driving. Just give them a fail safe button to maximum down force.
Not at all, Ferrari Engine in 2018, Merc ‘new tests’ in 2021 and DAS in 2020. Hell the red bull brake balance had been a feature for over a year before the FIA took action. F1 has always been about who can exploit the grey areas of the rules the best.
It can & it WILL bite them in the ass later on; either it gets deamed illegal and lose that advantage or is legal and rivals would apply it on their cars as well which would wipe that advantage away. But the most important thing at the end of the day is..........Williams got a double points finish 👏👏👏
Hell no how stupid can you be? It was near equal to Ferrari on mediums but Charles made the difference and it was faster on hards but yet again Charles was making the difference
You are judging it by their qualy times, but those flex wings mean they slide less in the corner section which gives a huge advantage in tire management over race distances.... Lando driving just as fast on old hards while everyone changed to hards in their pitstops says enough. He was 1,5 secs quicker than everyone on his new meds. He just cucked it up by going out too late in Q1.
Great analysis, this is how F1 is right? Every team looking to push the edge of the envelope and then bitching when someone else beats them to an idea. Every team does it and if people can't accept this then they need to watch indycar.
Should obviously be banned.. They've done it previously when the intent of the rule was ignored. McLaren is clearly completely ignoring the intent of the rule, it should therefore be illegal. These "Gotcha" bs upgrades should lead to fines and DQ their car. Sure, it's okay to take risks and see what's not mentioned in the rules. But this is mentioned, they were just able to get away from it on a minor technicality. Previously they corrected it, and now because it's done in a slightly different way.. They're not immediately DQing them??
i re-watched the race, and on my streaming feed (good quality but only 1080p), i cant see anything that shows the gap widening in a consistent way. if they are causing an opening, how do we know it's an advantage? perhaps it's creating drag/turbulence, vs the smooth flow and reduced drag from DRS.
@@matthewbarrett8859 1) They couldn't prove it and Mercedes was doing the same but only Ferrari was penalized. 2) McLaren and Merc are CLEARLY cheating now with their wings and the FIA is doing NOTHING!
g. Any alteration of the incidence of the uppermost closed section may only be commanded by direct driver input and controlled using the control electronics specified in Article 8.3. - f1 technical regulations
Reading out the rules, this is a illegal rear wing. It’s just that they found a way to get away with it. Much like the 2019 Ferrari engine. This will get adressed but probably not penalized knowing FIA.
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*2021:* rear wings flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered *illegal* by the FiA, and teams are forced to change it mid-season via TD
*2022:* floors flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered *illegal* by the FiA, and teams are forced to change it mid-season via TD
*2024:* front and rear wings flexing despite passing all static load tests is considered to be *just fine*, and the FiA wants to collect data first before they decide whether or not teams have to change it for next season
This is another certified FiA moment
In 2021 FIA made everithying to screw Red bull, except for the last race, now the brakes TD is for sure to Red Bull. Now FIA decides who is the best car?
in Football this would be McVARen effect. The new owenrs are so busy trying to derail RB that they allow illegalities to make sure a team doesnt run away with 4-5 championships. All about the business model. Main victim here is Ferrari, which was trying to catch up to RB, and would be 2nd team and in some races like this one the best team, only for McLaren to overtake them within the span of a couple of months... No team has made more stride in a formula car with a chewed out concept than they have...
Anything to not have a Red Bull leading every race - remember kids: its all about the show not about the rules.
whats TD?
Mercedes still deep in FIA's pockets
Last year FIA completely destroyed Aston Martin’s season by banning their flexible front wing, and yet this year McLaren is doing it even more aggressively but FIA doesn’t care! Toxic F1 indeed!
correct! and take note who's the number one sponsor of mclaren? you know that already. the FIA president is Muslim and the number 1 sponsor is saudi aramco. so what are we expected, they will try to capture the f1 world champshioship.
FUCK ASTON MARTIN! - MaFIA probably
@@perdinantmakros3918if there is corruption in F1 his religion will
Have nothing to do with it, if you are saying greed then for sure, mentioning his religion is strange not 1 person said Mentioned Bernie Ecclestones religious beliefs when investigating his corruption in F1
@@perdinantmakros3918am sure Aramco is the Main sponsor of Aston Martin but we cant let the truth get in the way of a good narrative right ??
@@claudeumuhire1625 Maybe he doesn't mean religion, but oil money sure is nice.
i remember a team principle once saying (icr who it was exactly)
You read the rules once to see what they say
Then you read them again to see what they don't say
then you design your car around what they don't say
Ross brawn.
Exactly
but the rules simply state that the aero is not allowed to move unless moved by the driver with the electronics ? so it seems they just did it and hoped for the best and it seems to have worked.
FIA banned it when aston martin and red bull did it, but when the horseteeeth briiitshiiiits did it, they turn a blind eye
@@lightningv4210but the shape of McLaren's wing is clearly a design choice. It looks very different to the other top teams.
By the time Ferrari and Red Bull will have implented those new wings, see MaFia ban them. I'm calling it now
"We have enough data now, so now we ban them. Ty RB for spending your budget on these wings, hahahah" Sincerely, the organisers..
Acting like fia dont love rb@@JM_daDoc
@@lukebennett.Redbull has had mid season TD changes pitted against their car in 21, 22, and 23 season. Yet, Mclaren gets nothing. Don’t know what F1 you’ve been following but FIA is not favouring Redbull what so ever 😂.
@stevenst6337 so did merc in 2014-2021 when they where fastest, difference is the fia helped max win a wdc in abu dhabi 😂
@@lukebennett. yeah and the FIAs fault not Max or Redbull lmao. Big difference from a team running the most obvious illegal wings and the FIA turning blind eye to it. Redbull has had their wings nerfed mid season many many times, yet McLarens is getting away with it. Not that hard to understand. Your logic is that since Redbull got away with something in 2021 which they had no control over we should just let Mclaren cheat and run illegal wings?
It's not just 3kph difference, if you think so, you don't understand how F1 works. If you can run bigger wing for the slow corners and this wing also gives you less drag on the straight, you effectively gain much more in overall lap time. This is why Flexi wings are so controversial. I feel like you should have mention this in your video. Although, I agree with the rest.
Exactly
Couldn't agree more, they are gaining the advantage round the whole lap, that's why they have made such leaps and bounds from last year. You must be talking 1-2 seconds a lap of an improvement.
Hopefully the other teams work it out and then we will see a true picture of who is fastest!!
@@scottferguson7863the reason they have made such leaps and bounds is because they’ve started using their new wind tunnel which i believe is the most advanced in F1 currently. and i assume this allows them to see things other teams can’t leading to innovations like this
Over the course of an entire race the amount of time that will be shaved off is very significant.
Yeah it’s ever straight … every corner there’s a gain!
I just don’t see why they don’t allow it! Again it’s a free boost
Like DAS
The asymmetrical braking
Just free gains
Even when they used to have a spring weight in the nose to cancel frequency’s
All cost no fuel just better for the efficiency of the car
The problem isnt if its illegal or not, the problem is in the FIAs non existent consistency. In 2021 when redbulls wings were flexing while still passing all the FIA tests as it is with mclaren right now it was deemed illegal and they had to remove it within 2 races . In 2022 Ferrari and redbull were using flexi floors while still passing all the fia flex tests but still they had to remove it within 2 races with 2 new TDs during the season. In 2023 aston martins front wing was flexing but still passed all the FIA tests but somehow they had to remove it as well because it was deemed illegal . Now another team ,mclaren, comes up not only with a extreme flexing front wing but a flexible rear wing as well but now they suddenly say "as long as they pass the tests everything is legal " ???? When its mclaren abusing that right now they somehow suddenly cant do anything about it until 2025 ???? Where is your consistency? I think everyone can think of a reason why they are letting mclaren getting away with it right now but hey we ,me included, all hate F1 politics thats why we are following this page so yeah . I will call it a day by saying that the FIA should be consistent
Exactly! Well said.
best summary of the situation 👍
Its all about making CS exiting till end...if they banned this, RB will be ahead of every one buy 300 points, like it was it last year....
@@galicije83But McLaren should not be winning if their car is deemed illegal period. In the story unless you want your championship tainted.
McLaren is a British team, F1 is mainly British.. what do you expect? F1 Is a joke.
See how quickly they clamped down on the Aston Martin front wing flexing last year and are now taking their sweet time with the Mclaren and Mercedes ones. MAFIA is back!
already crying 😂, redbull cheated in 2021 and got help from massi and breached the cost cap yet they got away with it and max was gifted a championship, i'm sure you weren't crying back then
You mean the same people that protect Max Verstappen from being penalised for his desperate driving tactics?🙄
@@larssonk22 they clearly want the fiabull in favor of max and gift him the championship and are ok with this, but when others beat them they start crying and blame the fia to start helping them again 😂
@@larssonk22 you will say anything to put it on max
It's all about the dimensions where the parts are bending, inside the predefinied area teams can do basically anything, but if ut's bending outside the area that is illegal.. just remember a few races ago Albon was disqualified because his floor was 1,5mm bigger like the predefinied max.. if he stay inside the 1,5mm smaller area, nobody cares about his floor..
It's amazing how many F1 designers are in the chat !!!
Says the man with the Aston Martin founders name…
You must be really old.
If Red Bull had this it would be illegal.MCL does it and its innovative.
It’s all about money and so viewership.. all mafia
How its gonna go: fia wont do anything, redbull and ferrari will use the same trick, fia will call them out on that, redbull and ferrari will recall to mclaren, fia shuts up "unexpectedly"
i doubt other teams can develop that same thing just like the front wing flex because of the cost cap
Red bull fans crying about "cheating" is nothing short of hilarious 😂😂😂😂😂
@andrewmelton2686 I mean they literally got TD in 21 why wouldn't they be annoyed they want to use the flexi stuff as well
Ferrari looks already like that
if it passes the tests so xd
I think its a clever trick and arguably lands within the grey area of not currently illegal - but for consistency the FIA should ban it, given their same responses in the past to front wings & floors - I baffles me why they say they don't want excess flex but then allow teams to have 2 piece elements across the front wing that allow extra flexing ...
I think McLaren think they designed it within the role parameters even if against the intent of the rules. Zero flex is probably impossible, that is why they specify maximum amounts of flex. But if you can engineer to be within those flex parameters but have it gain you the advantage they are trying to prevent, there's nothing you can do about it until next season by redefining the measurements that are currently within the rules.
I hope you had that same energy when everyone was accusing redbull of asymetric braking with no proof
@@Paul-pj5qu did you say this when they accused redbull of asymmetric braking?
It’s illegal
In case of AM / RB : Illegal
In case of ML / MB : Completely legal
They just found a way around the tests. It's that simple.
@@Dakkyun yes. You call this simple and ok, only Ferrari 2019 is cheating. Clasic
If you gonna cry, send an audio.
@@Dakkyun AM also found a "loophole". But the FIA deemed it against the spirit of the rules and told them to remove it. And then conveniently changed the technical rules to ban it.
But with this "Its a way around tests" and not "against the spirit of the rules". ok bud
flex due to materials combination and flex due to wear is not the same. Its just too sad too many people dont understand basic concepts and muddle two things into one because any level of critical thinking is too much for them.
Loading...new wings for Ferrari and Redbull
I find immensly suspicious, that when RedBull had flex in their wings in 2021 and 22 the FIA saw no issue what so ever to demand change mid season, but now they need to evaluate everything and move it on to 2025 thereby almost deliberately choosing sides with McLaren and Mercedes. How is that anything but unfair? Ferrari and RedBull watched their flex and make sure they comply and yet somehow get screwed over by playing by the rules.
In 21 and 22 the FIA simply changed the way they took measurements in order to detect the flex.
Obviously whatever McLaren is doing right now the FIA is currently at a loss as to how to reliably measure it.
Unlike 21-22 this may actually need an extensive rewriting of the rules.
The rules allow for flex with some very specific numbers. Presumably they allow for flex because preventing it entirely is impossible in a lightweight car. McLaren has just found a way to engineer in some flex, deliberately, that stays within the specified parameters but does it in such a way as to give them an advantage which the other teams failed to figure out. In the other case, such as Red bull, I'm guessing that the flex did not stay within the parameters specified in the rules.
@@louiscypher4186 If they just applied their regulation they could just disqualify the car. Article 3.2.2 of the Technical Regulations stating that “all aerodynamic components or bodywork influencing the car’s aerodynamic performance must be rigidly secured and immobile”
@@FusedMovieyou could ban every car on the grid if you take that literally, “immobile” is defined by the rules which are enforced with tests. Said tests do not detect any illegal movement on the McLaren, and due to the nature of the flexing its difficult to design rules that ban it, hence why we haven’t seen a band-aid solution applied.
You could say liberty media are allowing it for a closer season
Drs trick or not, McLarens traction out of the final corner was brilliant. Piastri would be 5-6 tenths then out of the final corner piastri would pull 2 tenths ahead of Ferrari and red bull on every lap.
Fia just wants to make the season interesting, and will refuse to admit it’s illegal.
100% im not sure why more people aren't saying this, stefano domenicali hated the RB dominance because of the low ratings
Thank goodness we have all these social media channels to point out what the FIA and other teams can't see.
like when they flouted their own rules on the last lap of the last 2021 race to be sure of having a new world champion ?
Just like they tried their best to stop the Merc dominance and make sure 2021 is interesting and attractive to Netflix fans till the last lap.
Seems like now it turns against RB.
@@ShawnFX The new audience and better ratings mainly came with Netflix. It's not the change of winning team that did anything. Everyone was also desperate for Mercedes' dominance after RB succes with Vettel.
When people say: McLaren is cheating
FIA: McLaren is not cheating
🇬🇧: Well, if the FIA says it’s okay, then it’s fine.
But when people say: Red Bull is cheating
FIA: Red Bull is not cheating
🇬🇧: Oh, it’s the MaFIA again! Red Bull is clearly cheating!
It was obvious McLaren had an advantage leaving the corner, and that kind of linear torque is electrical. Flexing wings then carry that advantage on down the straight.
Explaining McLaren's recent resurgence.
McLaren will have made sure they're within the regulations. The 'F-duct' was found legal despite protests from other teams in 2010.
I saw the same thing when i was watching the GP i should say that it should be all the same for all the teams if theres flexing its illegal or everybody will have flexing plain and simple
I would love to see a revised point system it would make things more appaling for the smaller teams
Btw love youre channel and dedication lets go and thank you
DT39 and DT18 were implemented by FIA to stop flexy things from flexing, but now FIA is allowing McLaren to have a DRS 😂
Thanks for this great video. Love the attention. The British media give great credit for Lando. But forgetting who the better driver in this team rn. Good that you give Oscar all the credit! What an incredible driver in just his second year.
Asynchronous braking - 😡
Flexi wings - 😴
It’s true they were on that right away
Asynchronous braking was fake news dude
@@Dyils What kind of logic is that? Are F1 teams only allowed to worry about one area of the car at a time? Redbull has many issues with the overall package of their car and it's seems their lack of CFD/wind tunnel time is finally catching up with them. However, I don't think it's a coincidence that Perez is suddenly close to Max's pace after the asynchronous braking rule clarification.
@@Eric-om2xs Relax it was only just one weekend,lets just wait for the other races
@@bewinwilsonmathews1892 It's been two weekends where Perez is very close to Verstappen. Since the summer break it seems like a big change for him, but perhaps it is just Perez finally finding his form (together with other teams upgrades being effective).
Mini DRS is nothing new and still illegal, but FIA and F1 want the competition back so everything is allowed to beat RB.
its like 2020 election lol
Its all legal until it isn't, currently its legal and passes all the tests so all's good.. However if they change the testing regime then that could change..
@@cafe88racer53get your head checked.
@@cafe88racer53 you MAGAT's are cultists
@shepardice3775 mate if a string of words in a RUclips comments section elicits such a negative reaction from you, I think its your own head you gotta worry about
stefano domenicali wanted higher ratings after last year so he nerfed RB and wanted other teams to be at the front for a more exciting season
1st half of the season didn't play out like that at all. McLaren has had the quickest car for a while now though and should have a lot more points but keep messing tactical decisions up
i was calling out the wing mid race to my friends and they said im stupid xd
If the FIA doesn’t intervene in rear wing or front wing trick then we expect Ferrari and Red Bull using the similar concept in Austin maybe where the real test will begin for Ferrari Monza package
and then it will be banned by the FIA
RB was always doing this kind of stuff, you have been sleeping past few years? Like honestly ,i wish all of you were so outraged when they doing it, but for some reason people like you are always silent about it
Why would they intervene if it's legal? All items brought to a car have to pass mandatory test, and all of them did. Ferrari and RedBull should simply step up their development.
@@TheMrakic bc when RB was using it and other teams where outraged FIA decided it was illegal, RB changed it but if McLaren is using some trick which is illegal they aren't doing anything.
@@alensabanovic747 Do you realize that Red Bull did the exact same thing in 2021 and despite passing all tests, it was deemed illegal as it was against the spirit of the regulations? And now suddenly, the FIA know it's sketchy but they turn a blind eye... Very unfair
Lots of people talking about Aston Martin having a flexi wing that got banned.
You should get your facts straight. What Aston had was a flexing FLOOR. The floor would bend under heavy aerodynamic pressure and allow for more downforce.
Your channel is rapidly becoming my favourite F1 channel. Congrats!
I do think it’s interesting because during the entire race Charles would get so close to Oscar but then after the straight just slowly fall back. Now Oscar did some excellent defending but after the straight Charles could just not get close enough and would immediately lose time, even if Oscar made a tiny mistake. Then, afterwards I saw this on X.
One lap Oscar made a mistake and Charles was roughly 4 tenths behind going onto the straights with a better exit, and still couldn’t pass him. And this is with a rear wing on the McLaren that was highest loaded on the entire grid. The amount of laptime they’re gaining in the corners from running a higher loaded wing, plus the mini drs effect would a HUGE advantage in lap time.
@@stevenst6337 Exactly, I agree. I mean Oscar’s defending was stellar but Charles kept up with him throughout the entire time and even when he had a better lap, couldn’t even get close to overtaking which I believe is partly due to the rear wing.
@@stevenst6337 Where did you get that McLaren had higher loaded RW? From the pictures it was clearly less loaded than the Ferrari and RBR one.
@@MarekFr their top speed was lower then both Ferarri, Mercedes, and Redbull with the DRS open, and with the DRS closed they were matching those teams top speed because of their “mini DRS”. Obviously more loaded then any of the top teams doesn’t take Adrian Newey level engineering to spot.
@@stevenst6337 There are so many things affecting top speed, you cannot say that the RW is more loaded because the top speed is lower, especially if you look at them and see that McLaren one is clearly the smallest.
Smaller and lower rounded wing edges could be the answer to the 3 kph as well. And even more engine power
Even though Max's race was not good, he and his side of the garage were still happy. They tried a setup that was different from FP1 and it wasn't the way to go, but the car exceeded some expectations. I think if the COTA upgrades deliver, Max might get another win or 2.
Aside from Red Bull clearly struggling due to being outside its optimized operational window and having to make numerous compromises, they remain competitive. Once they sort out the balance issues with the RB20, I suspect they'll be on top again
@@Zeep3unless they can bring back their illegal break system they aren't sorting out that car this season. Still probably too late though to prevent the Max win..
@maxsteel32 they never had assymetric brakes, they struggle with the balance of the car. It's why Perez was in contention for a win yesterday while Verstappen couldn't even turn the car properly. Perez had a good setup, Verstappen changed his after q3 and it ruined his quali and race. When the car is stable, they're very fast, just look at Austria.
@@maxsteel32 “iLeGaL bRaKe SyStEm”
Perez was doing fine and usually Max is still at least 3-5 tenths quicker with the same setup, therefore the potential is still there.
From what I have seen and read so far it is a very difficult topic to judge!
Regarding people's arguments about Aston Martin's flexing wings in 23 and Red Bull's in 2021 and 2022 I do get that it seems unfair and inconsistent that the FIA has not acted upon McLaren's wing flexing. HOWEVER and this is the big part which I have to little information about... It does matter HOW MUCH the wings flex. The rules clearly state some room of tolerance for flexing since making an on comand moving wing completely stiff when not comanded to open is almost impossible at such high speeds. So this really depends on how much both the McLaren and Mercedes wings this year flex compared to how much the Aston Martin and Red Bull wings flexed in the other years. If they were flexing over the tolerable room whilst the ones this year are not then the question is easily answered. Only problem is I doubt any of us will ever know how much all of these wings actually flexed so for me it's a topic that simply cannot and should not be discussed by casual F1 fans (including myself, all comment writers and RUclipsrs in this!!!)
It isn't a Rosberg Hamilton situation
It's more like a Alonso Hamilton situation although not as extreme
First the brakes in 98, then the spy story in 2007-2008 and now this. It seems like Mclaren have been struggling to deliver successful results while also staying within the rules...
brown does look like a used car salesman lol
bro the brake systen in 1998 wasnt illegal they banned it after bcs other teams didnt have the budget to build it
@@ЕргюнМаксимовexactly!!!
@@cafe88racer53 This is funny 😂
It’s not really a McLaren thing. I can’t think of any dominant car that did not have some sort of tech and/or rule controversy. Maybe someone else can think of one…
This is interesting because the Redbull flex wing was flexing the whole wing downwards on the straight, but had been noted that the gap in the wing for DRS was also changing. But Mclaren seem to be focusing on the DRS gap as the main objective for the flexing component.
Regardless I can't wait for the FIA to come in a make a shit show of everything.
A couple things to say here. The MCL38 was definitely the 2nd fastest car that weekend. The SF24 in the hands of Leclerc dropped Piastri in the first sting, and it was only a divebomb from Piastri that allowed him to overtake Leclerc, but we saw that for around 30 laps the Ferrari was in the McLaren’s DRS. Furthermore, McLaren never said Piastri was a no.2 driver, and the “papaya rules” are a term of engagement for on track battles. The recent rhetoric was about Piastri occasionally helping Norris if the time came and if Norris is in a close title fight.
Where are all those who said RB is a cheater when actually everyone is exploiting grey area. Why now they are so quiet about McLaren mini drs? Why no shouting "McLaren is cheating"? 😂
owned by yanks.... say no more.
hope you're feeling better miki, thanks for another insightful video as always! love ur content
Feeling much better my friend ❤️
I have a hunch that the Mclaren is running sometimes illegal. No car can gain that much performance in such a short period of time. Especially on a power dependent track.
Its not just that Mclaren gained performance, its that their direct competition for the front, RedBull, fell behind in the process. The increase looks dramatic because of this but without RedBull falling off it wouldnt look to be the same increase in performance.
@@Ixxlostinabox all team have gained time, even RB, just a lot less than others, and with balance issues along with those. Without the balance issues Max would be much faster but he has to adjust the car to make it work and cant attack corners the same way...
@@Ixxlostinaboxred bull is faster than they were last year.
@@JM_daDoc That and, since this season has been turning out to be the year that every single conspiracy theory turns out to be true, something Redbull had got removed too. It's just bonkers without proof that the asymmetrical braking was a performance booster, but who knows with the Redbull falling so far behind.
The Mercedes engine is the same for every other car, which means that Mercedes should’ve been fast too in Baku and monza😂
FIA: "Weird flex but okay."
I keep seeing some people unironically defend McLaren, because they passed the static tests 😭 like bro, they're missing the whole point
idk much about this topic and i dont wanna be one of the defenders, can you explain how its missing the point ?
@@milknwaffles9669any time a team beats (insert my favourite team) then it must be illegal so I'll post it on social media.
@@typhoon-7 makes sense
@@milknwaffles9669 Its missing the point as the DRS element is not allowed to divert from the plane of the wing unlesss commanded by the driver. And in this case it is. That is EXPLICIT.
so many times teams have passed static tests but the fia still bans it
Great work explaining this, not many other commentators have shown such detail. 👏
"N" = Newton force.
N = not this year RB and MB
i still feel if lando had qualified higher or atleast in top 4 then it would have probably been a 10+ second win for him
Would note that Oscar has more points than Lando (181 to 171) since Oscar received the upgrade in Imola. Love your data driven, objective, thoughful, well informed and researched content
Lando's DNF with Max's contact skews the data. It's very close but Lando has still been slightly stronger since Imola.
I don't think it needs to be illegal by the current rules for the FIA to deem it illegal. Sometimes, the lack of precision in the rules or the excessive precision of the rules, both are possible, create gray areas that are not strictly illegal but our interpreted as violating rule intent or some other fuzzy idea.
Didnt know john wick was into f1
White dude with long hair = John Wick 🤦♂️🤦♂️
@@shawcobrano one calls penguin 0, john wick
@@prafooldev786penguinz0 has been called John Wick before
It's fascinating to see what teams invent to gain an advantage. This invention highlights just how difficult it is for the F1 FIA to impartially regulate car specifications.
In our humble opinion, the 'genius' Red Bull rear spoiler reduction system (used up to 2013), where they used exhaust heat to flex the rear spoiler down the straights, must rate among the most amazing ways to legally side step the FIA rules.
That being said, all F1 teams have come up with brilliant ideas to give them an advantage....... especially Ferrari, Mercedes, McLaren & Williams.
Aston Martin’s wing was not complying with a current rule, they didn’t change the rules to stop them. They would have to change the rules to make McLaren’s wing illegal.
The mclaren's wing is already illegal, they do not have to change the rules.
They just need to enforce them 😂
@@francescotrombetta8548 What rule exactly?
@@4700PedroI’d like to know too.
@@4700Pedro I dont know the exact rule,but its one of rules concerned about the bending of the DRS and the rear wing
The FiA hasnt said anything if it is within the rules or not
I bet money that FiA will make it illegal when Lando is more closer to Max in the WDC standings so they can ensure a more exciting finish to the season
@@bewinwilsonmathews1892 the rules speak about bending limits at static tests. To make it illegal, the tests need to change. And they prolly don't know how to do it
4:39 '500N' That 'N' stands for Newtons, the SI unit for weight. Divide Newtons by the force of gravity in metres per second squared and you get kilograms, the SI unit for mass - which, oddly enough, is the more common usage [don't ask me why]. In this instance it works out as 500 N / 9.80665 m/s2 = 50.98581 kg.
My only quibble. Otherwise, a good report on the latest clever engineering trick. Keep diggin'.
If anything the other teams will complain to the FIA about it, FIA will say it’s fine and then ban it for next year like they do with every technological innovation
yup "pinnacle of motor-racing & innovation" except we outlaw any innovation.....
great reporting, please get it up. I"ll be tuning in
It's not illegal and a very good design.
I agree
Mclaren losers win 5 races in 12 years
It's a movable aerodynamic device. It's illegal.
That opening it creates isn't much to give DRS like gains. DRS is worth like 15 km/h. That little gap doesn't even compare to the opening of the DRS flap. I'd be surprised if it's worth 1 km/h
Also the flap at the bottom lifting up seems to be creating more drag on the rear wing than it is helping.
Didn’t the Ferrari have a flatter rear wing? Cuz it’s crazy that McLaren were faster on the straights with a deeper wing.
Rear wing isnt the only aerodynamic element to influence top speed. And dont forget about the engine
Basically if it doesn’t get deemed unsafe. It’s fine. I’m no engineer but I think it’s super clever! That’s how motorsport goes. Bend and innovate upon the rules until you break them or give reason for new rules
Disqualification like 2007 haha
I love the brilliance of F1 engineers
This is called a loophole. DAS, double diffuser, etc. It’s what the sport is all about.
how come when the same loophole was used by other teams it was deemed illegal ?, if its illegal for some teams its illegal for all teams.
Not really, the DRS element is not supposed to move at all, it's quite clearly stated.
But even if it were a loophole, why isn't the FIA closing it like every other time?
@@lightningv4210 if you think it’s the same and the FIA banned it then it is not the same.
@@thedutchfoxxx because they don’t want to
Article 3.10.10.c states that "there shall be no relative movement between the component parts of the DRS bodywork". Article 3.10.10.g is then even clearer: "Any change in the angle of attack of the upper closed section [the DRS flap] shall only be activated by direct input from the driver and only be controlled using the control electronics specified in Article 8.3.
‘Let’s go flexing’…Guenther Steiner
The McLaren MCL38 is the most flexible F1 car ever :p
😂😂😂
It's not the element that's flexing, it's the main section and endplates that's twisting causing that gap to form. They can load test the element all they want, will still pass.
It doesn't matter what is technically legal or illegal by the books. If it passes the tests, then it is allowed. The best cars target loopholes and exploit them as much as they can.
They are just jealous with McLarent dominant several races before
@@BroHazemanso if Redbull do it = illegal and if McLaren do it = other team jealous?
@@IceCream-uy4mc Hahaha so jealous. RedBull can do all things but Mclaren can't ? BS
Why not reduce the rules? Ive watched F1 for years and rules are getting so strict that all the cars are basically the same. Slacken the rules and you'll get some awesome sights like lotus's famous ground force curtain. I want to see more of that
for anyone who wants to bring up a live video of the flap opening and closing without activation go to 1:19:50 going on F1 TV and watch as the mclaren had the corners lifted, and at the turn they just close, right after that then you can see leclerc suffering behind.
These kinds of innovation are what F1 is about. I remember Double DRS last year with the flexible beam wing which was a genius innovation. Personally I even find banning assymetric braking for 2026 a damn shame but that's just me, I guess.
It is a British team that created this feature, so it is a very clever adaptation and certainly not illegal
McLaren is 80% owned by the Bahrain Royal Family.
British teams created F1 - what's you point?
@@gaycha6589 Probably he meant that if the british team creates such things, then they are allowed to use it (at least for some time, e.g. das system) and it is ok. if other teams like rb/am create something in the same way (flexible front/back wing), then it should be changed almost immediately
@@mugiwara.eugene OK. But it’s not like these are hidden and only discovered after a few races, like the controversial brake bias at RBR. Best thing is to make them all legal so teams can adopt and all push the tech. Or clearly outlaw them. Maclren are doing nothing wrongs until FIA changes rules
Ferrari, Maserati and Alfa Romeo created F1, not british teams bud.@@gaycha6589
Unique perspective & informative but definitely time to change the channel name to LandoMeLovezU.
I saw that when i got into the driver cam on f1TV i was like wtf ? Is that allowed ? The drs is opening Even without drs
It is definitely an odd look
@@F1Unchained it was even spotted on live but I was on Norris car it seems more open
that thing was quick on the baku straights even with Charles DRS open. Very suspicious.
By looking at the onboard cam, it looks like the wing elements around the top flap are flexing independently from the top flap, creating a 'mini DRS' gap without affecting the top flap angle/height, which would fall in line with current regulations
Finally someone who understands the grey areas of the rules, if it is grey it is not cheating.
@@TayebMC Someone has already pointed out that this is illegal under section 3.10.10 C & D - it's stated that there should be no movement between the DRS parts and movement with the upper flaps should only be manually controlled.
If you're using the flexi wing directive then it's legal, but under the DRS section this is completely illegal.
@@francebalante8254 let's see if they are still using it in Singapore.
@@francebalante8254 Nope, the flap itself doesn't move at all and relative to the DRS pillar, it flexes the same amount, so it completelly fulfills the rules. The only thing flexing more than everything are the side portions of the main rear wing structure and if that passed static tests, it's legal (as you yourself said).
@@TayebMC I will bet money that FiA will make it illegal when Lando is more closer to Max in the WDC standings so to ensure exciting racing
wing technically doesn't break any rules, but we all know it shouldn't flex. props to mclaren for finding out a way to bend the rules.
had this happened at the beginning of the season then other teams probably would've copied mclaren, but now that we've passed the halfway mark i'm not sure how many teams can actually afford to develop the same rear wing, so they'll most likely protest it.
i honestly don't see the FIA rolling with this shit, so they'll probably ban it. next season.
F1 has always been like this. Teams finding loopholes and seeing how the FIA reacts.
illegal is deabatable but FIA needs to look at it
I think your video is sound, the oversight though, is that while they can reach higher speeds on straights they can likely carry more speed in corners due having more wing there while not suffering on the straights for it
Its clearly illegal yet we all know the fia will not do anything about it
It's only illegal if it fails the load test. There is no 'spirit' of the regulations.
@@Redskies453 It's technically legal - which in F1 is the best kind of legal.
As long as the rules are followed the wing cannot be deemed “illegal”, you’re just being mad and should start seeing things from a rational perspective 😂
@@matthewbarrett8859lol it's as illegal as a f1 car having nos on the straight 😂😂😂😂
@@Franceee___"just being mad" no lil kiddo no car is allowed to flex their back wing so much lota 😂😂😂
2:30 you can see a similar open slit in the Ferrari as well.
What people don't realize is that this is not the flap flexing. The flap is curved in a way that the flex of the wing as a whole creates the gap.
That means the technical regulation isn't violated, since the angle of the flap in reference to the wing structure stays constant.
what they are dping is kinda like wind blowing in the sails creating a larger curve. When you only fix the top part to the wing that part which is tested does not move. The lower rim of the top wing get pressed upwards, creating the little opening below it
It’s safe to say then that the mini DRS effect is simply a stroke of genius by McLaren?
@@JM_daDoc and the tests described wouldn't catch it because they're only measuring the deflection in the vector of the force applied i.e. how much it bends _with_ the force, what isn't happening here, that is more of a torque rotation. In fact, this rotation is most optimal the less measured deflection you have.
So? Red bull passed all tests in 2021, yet their wing was still banned.😒
@@antiwokehuman Not saying that it won't get banned. Just saw a lot of people complaining about the flap flexing which just isn't what is happening.
The Red Bull front wing flexes as much as everyone elses.
So when red bull exploit a grey area in the rules and create an inertia valve, everyone’s claiming they’re serial cheaters and they should be stripped of titles. But when mclaren exploit a grey area in the rules, they’re all geniuses? Make it make sense pls….
Yet every single comment here is calling for it to be banned. Silly butt hurt red bull fan boy that cant read 😅
It's a smart solution that's in an unregulated area, thats what F1 is all about. The ball is in FIA's court, they should make a quick decision whether it will be approved or not so that the other teams can implement it themselves it is so
Illegal rear wing DRS, extremely flexable Front wing. FIA must have some sort of "agreement" with Mclaren or their sponsors imo.
The upper element is allowed to flex up to but not more than 7mm, to me and IMO that looks larger than 7mm, so if FIA investigate this, and find it okay, then we know what the other will do, until the FIA change the rules.
thats why Leclerc wasnt able to pass him..cheating!
You've solved it Sherlock.
Leclerc couldn't pass him cuz he always fumbles his poles lol
In Baku Mclaren had the highest loaded rear wing on the entire grid, and were flying past everyone like they didn’t exist. Piastri held Leclerc off from half a second for like 30 laps straight 😂. Double standards in the FIA if this was Redbull there would be a new TD within next 2 races. And not only is their rear wing creating a mini DRS, but their front wing also visibly flexing more then anyone else. Take away those wings and I highly highly doubt Piastri holds off Leclerc.
People can tell whatever they want but the rules clearly states that the bodywork of the DRS cant move lol its clearly illegal.
Rule 3.10.10 Drag Reduction System (DRS) section C. There must be no relative movement between the constituent parts of the DRS Bodywork.
section F
The design is such that failure of the system will result in the uppermost closed section returning to the normal high incidence position.
section G
Any alteration of the incidence of the uppermost closed section may only be commanded by direct driver input and controlled using the control electronics specified in artice 8.3.
What most people missed is that the DRS flap doesn't flex at all. It's the rear wing around it that flexes more on the sides and thus creates that small opening in the corners. The DRS pillar and the DRS flap (= DRS bodywork) are staying in the same positions relative to each other (they do flex back in high speeds, but relative to each other, they flex the same).
The +3 kph is also misleading, as McLaren clearly had less loaded rear wing, so it had less drag and the DRS was not as effective.
@@MarekFr the DRS Flap is flexing that is the controversy happening right now.
I'd love to see active suspension and aero. They could use a positioning sensor (GPS) to map the tracks to control the systems automatically so the drivers could just focus on driving. Just give them a fail safe button to maximum down force.
no
Usually goes like this when doing something new or hitting a grey area:
Merc/Mclaren : Innovation
Red Bull / Aston Martin : Cheating
lol well said
You should add Ferrari to Red Bull/ Aston Martin
It’s definitely a little bias by the looks of it
Not at all, Ferrari Engine in 2018, Merc ‘new tests’ in 2021 and DAS in 2020.
Hell the red bull brake balance had been a feature for over a year before the FIA took action.
F1 has always been about who can exploit the grey areas of the rules the best.
Is it just me or is the Ferrari Wing flexing way more? Only the RB wing seems to not create a gap
Hahahahahaha the ferrari doesn't flex their wings at all lol, if so they would have destroyed Mclaren on the straight 😂
It can & it WILL bite them in the ass later on; either it gets deamed illegal and lose that advantage or is legal and rivals would apply it on their cars as well which would wipe that advantage away. But the most important thing at the end of the day is..........Williams got a double points finish 👏👏👏
To engineer this flexing in composites is *not* easy. Fair play to Mclaren
McLaren was the 3rd fastest car on the grid after ferrari and Rb
Hell no how stupid can you be? It was near equal to Ferrari on mediums but Charles made the difference and it was faster on hards but yet again Charles was making the difference
good one
You are judging it by their qualy times, but those flex wings mean they slide less in the corner section which gives a huge advantage in tire management over race distances.... Lando driving just as fast on old hards while everyone changed to hards in their pitstops says enough. He was 1,5 secs quicker than everyone on his new meds. He just cucked it up by going out too late in Q1.
Clown
@@JM_daDoc Nope am talking about race pace
Piastri clocked max 335 with drs
Charles clocked max 338 with drs
Verstappen clocked max 339 with drs
1:28 it’s all brilliant until it’s illegal
innovation isn't illegal imo
Good job man. I now consider your content better than The Race!
Makes me happy to hear that 😁❤️
@@F1Unchained Yeah for real! I mean, your videos are very concise but still go deep enough.While the race tend to lack conciseness.
Great analysis, this is how F1 is right? Every team looking to push the edge of the envelope and then bitching when someone else beats them to an idea. Every team does it and if people can't accept this then they need to watch indycar.
Should obviously be banned.. They've done it previously when the intent of the rule was ignored. McLaren is clearly completely ignoring the intent of the rule, it should therefore be illegal. These "Gotcha" bs upgrades should lead to fines and DQ their car.
Sure, it's okay to take risks and see what's not mentioned in the rules. But this is mentioned, they were just able to get away from it on a minor technicality. Previously they corrected it, and now because it's done in a slightly different way.. They're not immediately DQing them??
i re-watched the race, and on my streaming feed (good quality but only 1080p), i cant see anything that shows the gap widening in a consistent way.
if they are causing an opening, how do we know it's an advantage? perhaps it's creating drag/turbulence, vs the smooth flow and reduced drag from DRS.
McLaren and merc does illegal stuff
Fia: i sleep
Red bull and Ferrari do the same
Fia: real shit?
I mean, Ferrari were cheating with the engine thing lol. They just got caught.
@@matthewbarrett8859 1) They couldn't prove it and Mercedes was doing the same but only Ferrari was penalized. 2) McLaren and Merc are CLEARLY cheating now with their wings and the FIA is doing NOTHING!
And Ferrari then became ambassadors for catching other teams cheating.😂😂 Fia never told us the results of the extra oil being burnt.
g. Any alteration of the incidence of the uppermost closed section may only be commanded by direct driver input and controlled using the control electronics specified in Article 8.3. - f1 technical regulations
Reading out the rules, this is a illegal rear wing. It’s just that they found a way to get away with it. Much like the 2019 Ferrari engine. This will get adressed but probably not penalized knowing FIA.