Working With Richlite Fretboards Pt 2 Frets Etc...
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- Опубликовано: 30 июл 2024
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Is Richlite a good fretboard material for you?
Matt works with a sample of this material that some of the larger companies have been using as an ebony substitute.
Texas Toast Guitars is an independent guitar shop and this channel is a place for people with common interests to come together and discuss their mutual hobbies, toys, and opinions. All are welcome.
Original score: Electric Boogie Dawgs
Artwork: Paul Shellooe 
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Everybody hates Richlite until they actually own it. I have a Les Paul custom with ebony and a Les Paul signature player plus with richlite. I love ebony the best. But the richlite is nice and I’d definitely take it over rosewood on looks alone. It’s jet black and has a grain. I suppose it’s a simulated grain, but if I never told anybody it was richlite, they would just assume it’s flawless ebony. I don’t get the hate? It’s a really nice material. And it’s really just wood pulp and a binding/strengthening agent. I have 6 guitars with ebony. If I put them all together and said “which one looks best?”, most would probably pick out the richlite because of its consistency. But the Gibson snobs won’t ever be happy. I don’t go out of my way to buy richlite. But if it’s on the guitar and I like the way it plays and looks, I’ll buy it.
Richlite is fine, but I guess my issue is in pricing. Is manufacturing richlite costly? I feel like pricing should be reflective.
I've been playing a Martin with Richlite for over 12 years now and it gets lots of use. No complaints whatsoever! Even when I had to get aome frets replaced, the lutier who worked on it was impressed with how great it was. And with how great the guitar sounds, so clearly it doesn't hurt your tone! Richlite made a fan of me as a player just as well as it did with you as a builder.
Hi Roy,
Thanks for watching, glad to hear your experience with Richlite has been positive. I still haven't made an actual neck with my samples but I have a few customers who have asked for it and I'm looking forward to it.
Richlite is the best
I've had one for a couple of years. No problem. Sounds and plays like my other Martin.
My Martin MMV (around 8-10 years old) has Richlite fingerboard & bridge & it has great tone. I've been playing over 40 years & had numerous high end guitars. This is by far one of the best guitars I've owned. It's definitely a keeper.
Thanks for watching Mike, I hear lots of good things about guitars with Richlite fretboards. Your Martin sounds like an awesome instrument for sure.
Getting ready to re-fret my worship pastor's Martin with Richlite. This has helped me feel at ease. Thank you!
Cool man glad I could help out
Very interesting and useful videos. I too owned a Richlite/stratabond necked Martin, and played a Gibson Midtown Custom in a shop which also used Richlite. I really like it as a board (the stratabond neck was fine too). Only issue is the price, when I can get exotic ebony boards for a fraction of Richlite’s cost. 🤷♂️
Thank you for posting this video. I have a little Martin with richlite fretboard. The frets on the cowboy chords are severely worn. I know I could pick up another little Martin for 300 or so, but it looks like I could easily get the first 3 or 4 replace, re-leveled, and be good to go for another umpteen years. I'd hate to toss this one, It's got a great road worn look, and just a great little guitar. Cheers!
Thanks for watching my friend, I think Richlite makes a fine fretboard
I have been considering purchasing an Aristides 070 and needed info on a Richlite fingerboard. thank you sir.
Thanks for watching Bryan, enjoy you new ax amigo.
This has helped me! I want to replace one of my frets that sounds a bit dead in my richlite fretboard.
Won't you burn the board
Matt, I know you're doing this for the board demo, but I see you clipping wire from the spool ... that will tend to wrench the wire back out of the groove if cutting after pressing in, similar to the guys I see cutting the frets at a common long length then trimming back after installed in the board using the nippers.
I have a 1x2 board with holes and numbers and cut the wire to 'filing length' for all the frets loading up the whole board. Then press them into the board as you go.
The other trick, I only nip half-way through and then bend the wire to break it - a change I made when I switched to 100% stainless steel fret wire.
Thanks for the Richlite videos!
thanks for watching amigo, glad you like the videos.
All of our necks feature a bound fretboard so all the fret work is done with specific cut frets for each slot. I have a few of those blocks with 22 holes drilled in them too.
I actually had the frets ready for the video but they got tossed somewhere between cutting them to size and a few beers. Chris says he threw them away accidentally. I had to shift on the fly for the video.
Stay cool brotherman
well Matt. Thanks for the new video. seems like this richlite can do no wrong!I guess people can rest a little easier about paying for top end guitars with this stuff.
p.s . you the man.🤘
Buy with confidence, However...
I still have a problem with charging premium money for a Richlite fretboard (this is a fault of the companies that use it not the manufacturer). For as good as Richlite seems to be from a manufacturing standpoint the only reason it is used is because of the issues with traditional materials.
I wish companies would pass savings associated with ease of manufacturing along to the customer...
To my minds eye it's sorta like paying hand-made money for a CNC guitar.
Oh, I'm not the man hahaha
Im commenting on old videos again. These videos are the reason I use richlite. I got them to update their website so that people could order from it in Canada. As was commented in the previous video, it's cheaper than most woods, and as you noticed, much better to work with.
Are you having any issues with the Richlite dulling your wood working tools Lloyd?
Not a one. No more than maple or ebony has anyways. I will say, when slotting it by hand it feels a little different, like when you go from one species to another.
Great video
I have richlite on a strat knock off. I like it just fine. Its seems very durable and cleans up nice. Ebony or richlite makes no difference to me. So now what's going to happen with the Rosewood, Pau Ferro issue. I just bought another guitar. It's coming with a Pau fingerboard. I have a suspicion that I will be just fine with it .
Was your fret slot cut wider than normal. I watched a video from Richlite that stated the slot should be wider, but he didn't go into any details.
I have no problem with the Richlight on my Martin DrJR. My problem is with the frets. They are low profile .035 and damage under the B string up to the 8th fret I assume at the factory that they poorly repaired make this almost impossible for me to play. My complaint as I did not find the problem right away fell on deaf ears. Any way now I have to replace the frets and maybe put higher ones on.
I'm getting ready to edit together a Richlite fretboard review for my channel. I'm pretty excited to work with it.
You will dig it my friend
It is sure a neat material but we decided that it was too hard on the tools. I'll be interested to hear what you think
@@TexasToastGuitars Alright I'll come back here and post when it's up.
I needed ebony but couldn't find a good price for a bass scale and this stuff crossed my feed and they sent me 2. At about $25 each the cost of tool maint/ replacement should off set pretty well.
Go see my channel. Would appreciate the feedback. It's newish.
I have a Martin made in Mexico model. Chris Martin made a whole video about the Model X guitars. The wood is made from the sawdust at the Martin factory. They combine the sawdust with a resin, so the spruce top is actually spruce...kind of. It has a richlite fretboard too. When this guy had the idea and brought it to him, he told him to go make him a guitar. If it doesn't sound like a Martin and be a quality guitar, then he wouldn't put the Martin name on it. In the end, he was sold and they've been making them at the Mexico factory. A lot of musicians have bought Model X Martins for touring. They're less susceptible to weather changes and they're very strong and durable guitars. I wasn't a believer, but I bought one anyway to see for myself. Out of the box the action was perfect and set pretty low for an acoustic. It's easy to play and sounds like my American made Martin. I don't have anything to say except it's a Martin.
That sound cool man. We haven't built any acoustics for MANY years but I would like to go back to them some time.
I must say, I'm out of the loop when it comes to what is going on in the acoustic market
It's made from paper which is wood. It's also more stable so no fret spout
Exactly
Just for the hell of it I would love to see a tap tone comparison between richlite and ebony. any Mass will make a sound, be it composite or wood. i'm just curious. thanks
Hi Zeb, I don't have anymore Richlite, we decided it was not for us after all... to hard on our tools, YMMV.
Could I ask Matt? what type of edge binding do you use with acetone? Is it celluloid or ABS or either? Thankyou
Hi Spannerman,
We have used acetone with both ABS and celluloid binding. I have set celluloid binding on fire with the heat gun and the radius sander hahaha
Great video. I have a 2015 Les Paul ES custom with a Ricklite fretboard.
Cool man, how do you like it?
I played one a few years ago and I thought it was really nice.
People make too much of a deal out of fretboard wood I think.
Having said that I don't really use it much these days because in my experience it is harder on the tools
Jury's still out. I like the smooth action and it seems to act like a wood fretboard. I am curious as to the best way to clean and maintain a Richlite fretboard. Do you have any suggestions?
@@RRoosa I used 409 and a rag. Worked great. It's very durable. It doesn't seem porous at all to me. Very smooth and slick I'd say
I personally loved the richlite fredboard on my Gibson custom and I wouldn't have sold it if I didn't need the money. Feel smooth and it'll probably last longer than the guitar itself being that it's synthetic.
I truly don't understand the hate. I have 2023 lp custom and 2018 lp custom (w/ richlite). I can't tell them apart. Feel the same and sound the same. I love the fact the richlite won't adjust to temperature and humidity. Purist will always be purist though. Hopefully the richlite models don't hold value and prices drop low. I'll happily buy more guitars if/when that happens.
I wonder if anyone can explain this problem I had.
I was steaming a neck off a body and the Richlite bubbled up in 4 places or so. Freaked me out. It added another step that I didn’t want to deal with.
Any thoughts?
Worked on a ton of richlite boards over the years. Honestly, it’s pretty easy stuff to work with...easy to clean, easy to fret, very few complaints. Does it sound any better or worse than wood? 🤷♂️ The guitars I’ve played with it sound like Martins to me.
I really want to like Richlite we have found that all phenolic materials are just too hard on wood working tools
the earlier name for it by some manufacturers was/is ebonite, I think there was another name too, maybe phenolic? I had a Gretsch Japan made duojet with it as the fretboard material. I will recall when I first got it, looking at it and thinking is that a Plastic fingerboard. Supposedly some players have said it for tone is better than Wood and sustain too, do not know if it is true.
The Kramer aluminum necks had it too
Great have a Martin with richlite fretboard, what’s the best way or clean it? Thanks
Hi Charles,
I really don't know what the best way to clean Richlite is. I would contact Martin for the best practice
Hi Matt, a question... I own a Gibson es-275 with richlite fingerboard. I am about to get new frets mounted. I wonder whether there would be any problems while leveling the fretboard .. such as color fading or the richlite responding awkwardly to the process ..
Also, during sanding..
Hi jzwkr,
I can't imagine there would be any issues like that. The product is really stable but, you know how it is, it's going to be up to your repair guy. I'm sure it will be cool.
Texas Toast Guitars . Thnx for the reply Matt. He said, he’s seen some composite stuff that responded badly, especially during sanding of the fingerboard prior to placing the frets. He was a bit hesitant.
Did you try filing it? I would love to see how it scallops
It machines pretty nice, that is to say no chipping or tear-out to speak of but is it harder than wood that's for sure I ruined a fluted cutter with some Richlite the other day
where did you get the richlight from? trying to get an order together.
Hi Big D, Thanks for watching. Those were samples direct from Richlite.
I sent them a note. Who is your contact there? Can you send me a note derek@bigdguitars.com
is it sensitive to humidity like wood fretboards?
According to the manufacturer, Richlite is waterproof. One of the main uses is countertops... guitar parts are a drop in the bucket.
Another video recommends Richlite needs to be roughed up with sandpaper before gluing since Richlite is non-porous.
That was my experience
Excellent video guys. You earned a new subscriber! This was great but i must admit, I'm still afraid to buy a new Gibson Custom LP with rich light. Should I worry? Looks like a great product. Some say it sounds like cardboard and that is no bueno! But this is the future....that's for sure. I don't see ebony making a comeback unfortunately....We all might have to get used to this product. Cheers guys!
Hi Whitney,
Thanks for watching and subscribing as well.
I wouldn't worry too much about the Richlite fretbaord if I were you... I'll bet that those guys who claim it sounds like cardboard (whatever that means) would not be able to tell the difference if they were blindfolded?
Are you in a spot to try one out?
I think you are right, ebony isn't the wave of the future but you can still get it. We decided to not use Richlite because it is really hard on the tools... having said that I really like its functionality. We settled on Black Poison Wood which isn't really black or poison but the sap is, I hear.
Hey some good advice! Thank you... Ill have to track one down around my area and give it a go. Sounds like its great material, but unfortunately doesn't hold the resale value like the ebony les paul fret boards. And wow, that black poison wood sounds pretty exotic! Nice
Richlite fretboards look glossy on guitars I’ve seen why is that?
Richlite is like a lot of dense fine grained woods only more so. When fine sanded the surface can be very smooth, resulting in a natural sheen. If you are talking about an almost glass like gloss then the fretboard has likely been sprayed with a clear coat finish, like the Fender maple necks.
how would I go about fixing a small scratch in this material?
I don't know, we decided to NOT use Richlite
Who are the people that literally have a thumbs down??? WHY?? This video is great
Some people like feeling underwhelmed... buy a free video... that isn't very long... and isn't trying to sell them anything hahaha
Exactly.
I assume that richlite is almost the same as micarta... (if does not, please someone who clarify me that).
I have an issue with a truss rod in my Sigma, and I'm afraid I will need to take off the fretboard and replace it.
Do you have some experience taking off some micarta/richlite bridge or fretboard made of?
Thanks beforehand! :D
Greeteings from Finland
Hi Rodrigo
I have not dome much with Richlite but have made a few videos.
You are right in that it is kinda like micarta... kinda
It is a phenolic material
I have never removed a Richlite board
05/21/2021: would sanding Richlite fretboard show the layers of paper?
It does indeed
@@TexasToastGuitars: Thank you, I will not buy a guitar with Richlite and stick to Ebony real wood.
What are luthiers finishing Richlite with? Just sanding and buffing? Or is there some finish that should be applied?
You got me Rob?
We never got that far
@@TexasToastGuitars I just sanded up to 3000 and put on 6 coats of paste wax and I'm liking how it looks. Weird stuff but it seems to work. Love your vids! You're teaching me how to build guitars! instagram.com/pipedreamfretworks/
How does it bond with woodglues?
Prep is important when using wood glues. I did a video called "Glues You Can Use With Richlite" when I use a bunch of stuff and test it if you are interested
Is is ok to work or shave that fingerboard without using any respirator???? I ve read that this is very bad chemical stuff!!!
You're responsible for your own safety never ends
How to Treat richlite Fretboard?
You got me man?
Since it is a phenolic material it won't exactly absorb oils. I love the idea of Richlite and I wanted to use it more but the reality is we don't... it is too hard on tools
where can I buy some richlite at?
If you look on the website you should see some links to wholesale guys near you. I'm still thinking about buying a sheet of it I'll keep you posted.
here:
shop.ecosupplycenter.com/products/richlite-ebony-guitar-fingerboard-blank-22-x-4
How long did the glue set for?
Oh man I can't remember, that was a while ago. I'm sure I did it one day, went home and then took the clamps off the next day. That way I wouldn't trip over it while I was working.
You're so smart
You think so
@@TexasToastGuitars Well you built it yourself...
@@TexasToastGuitars Real question though: I've heard this debate likened to tube amps vs solid state... Thoughts?
Can I use oil on that?
Hi googoo I don't think you need to use anything on the richlite boards. In my experience the oil will just sit on the top and wipe off. They use it for exterior siding it is so weather resistant
What does it do to tool sharpness?
Hi John, in our testing it was not good to our tools and we stopped using it
@@TexasToastGuitars WOW! Thank you for the quick response! Much appreciated. I had a funny feeling that they would take a toll on tools. Merry Christmas to all there.
Matt,it works well,im just a snob,i prefer wood,
It seams to me put some Jascar 6100 Stainless Steel Frets on those boards and you are set for a very long time!!
Hi Jack, thanks for watching. Yeah man that set-up would probably last for the life of the guitar.
Texas Toast Guitars Those frets ate awesome. I have them on my Carvin and they play so smooth. I would have gotten stainless steel 6000's if they would have offered them. Thank you.
But what about the tonality of Richlite? I am skeptical that it would sound as good as wood.
This product is, certainly, not for everyone. If you appreciate things like controlled woods and nitrocellulose lacquer for first or second cool I understand... Fortunately they are still growing trees.
Martin and Gibson have been using it for several years and I'm sure you could find one at a shop near you to test out.
Having said that the industry is changing and players should get used to seeing this kind of thing
Thanks for watching
Nitro? I can take it or leave it. But I am all about controlled woods. Funny, now Indian Rosewood is now the subject of such things. The problem is there is no sense of balance when it comes to managing resources. It would seem to me with the composition of the stuff that it would not impart much to the tone of an instrument. Yeah I know they have been using it for a while. I seen a Les Paul Custom with Richlite the other day and I was thinking "there is no way I would pay 5000 smackers for a guitar with a Richlite fretboard". I guess if it was hard enough it could impart a "crispness to the tone". But admittedly I am not open minded about it. It's wood or nothing for me.
I call that the second kind of cool (I stole the phrase from another guy). You know, that stuff that is hard to explain or quantify but you know what you like and who could blame you for that.
When I build with ebony the fret-board blanks are anywhere from 20 to 50 dollars. It's not a big deal for a small player like me to get it. Gibson on the other hand probably has a lot more issues even if the price would be lower. I still don't know how to justify 5K for a Les Paul Custom. Of course, they have to keep the lights on at that factory.
Have a nice weekend amigo.
You do the same. Blessings. :-)
Well I know that Aristides uses Richlite for their guitar fretboards. The Aristides are all composite and sound amazing. They are incredibly resonant. Just my two cents. Oh and for the record, you might want to check out some of these more cutting edge guitar makers. The times they are a changing...and for the better, at least for guitars.
How much do you charge for something like this
I'm sorry but we do not offer anything like this for sale
Run some through a plek and tell me how you feel about it after..idk if it's the softness or what but it never pleks right
This kind of presupposes that I have access to such a machine. You might as well say go back in time and buy an bunch ebony when it wasn't as expensive and then tell me how you feel about Richlite.
I don't see the allure of the plek machine, hell I don't even know what it does except grind the frets. I'm not sure how a fretboard material would have anything to do with that unless the slots were cut in the wrong spots.
In all seriousness... as much as I liked the idea of Richlite we never actually used it and only cut 4 fretboards for testing. I can tell you that it is very hard on the tools that we use and for that reason we never went any further down the path.
What happens when your truss rod breaks and you have to remove a fretboard that has been epoxied on? How about that video???
I'd have to have that happen to be able to make that video
@@TexasToastGuitars
Epoxy your test fretboard to a piece of maple or mahogany?
I hear the neck is junk on your 5K Gibson
HI GOOD PEOPLE, PLEASE BUILD 2 IDENTICAL GUITARS ONE WITH RICHLITE AND ONE WITH A REAL ROSEWOOD FRET BOARD, THEN DO A TONE TEST, DO THEY SOUND THE SAME ? WHICH ONE SOUNDS BETTER ! GOOD STUFF GUYS
I would be happy to do this if someone else was willing to pre-pay for the two guitars.
i liked the video, but the chewing noise during close-ups was a little annoying. Other than that, this is becoming my favorite guitar channel on youtube!
Thanks for watching amigo
I was working that gum pretty hard... the nuns in Catholic school would have hit me with a ruler hahaha.
If you keep watching I'll stop chewing gum
yeah man. Those nuns were fucked! I'll keep watching all right. As I said, best guitar channel on youtube. But ditch the gum or I'm telling on you to mother superior. hahah
5:45 Queso
Mmmmm queso, dude, now I'm hungry for nachos
richlite fret board with stainless steel frets would probably last a lifetime.
Probably until you were sick of playing the guitar anyway
Yeah but the paper tone 😦
Yeah
Great vid, SPIT THE CHEWING GUM OUT!
I did
@@TexasToastGuitars keep up the good work!
Awesome video, but personally, not into gum chewing during taping. Is that weird? I could swear I kept hearing it. The microphone is also peaking a bit cause ur volume is set on “dad”. Just talk normal we’ll hear ya.
I will not alter the way I talk, sorry you don't like it
Soon, we're going to need a new name for Luthiers. I know... Toy Makers!
Why, whatever do you mean Guitartec?
Richlite is NOT plastic.
Thanks for that Mark... short and pointless
Well, it's epoxy based. It's more plastic than wood, that's for sure.
The problem with Richlite is that it is a cheap, inexpensive industrial material. You would not expect to see this used on quality guitars costing in the thousands of dollars. Gibson and Martin would not be using Richlite if the United States did not sanction them for their import and use of ebony. Very importantly, there is the tactile quality of natural wood and its oils that are extremely important to the touch, feel and playability of a fretboard. Richlite may be a good alternative for inexpensive mass-produced beginner instruments, but should not be used by reputed manufacturers. Lastly, instruments made with Richlite are less desirable and valuable will not appreciate as well as their genuine wood counterparts.
John Capaldi , where do we separate value and responsibility? I agree with you, don’t get me wrong but we can’t keep clearing forests for what boils down to a luxury or hobby purchase for a huge percentage of musicians. With Taylor setting the prices through the roof for Ebony , that option is dwindling like rosewood. Thermally treated maple (roseacer) is a viable option, for now anyway, but most people won’t even give it a second look because of the inability to let go of “tradition”. If done right, it can look pretty dang close to rosewood and you can oil it unlike a more traditional maple board. We can get into the whole debate of tonal qualities etc but I’ll let Matt make a video for that and wait in anticipation lol. Thanks again for another cool video Matt . It’s interesting to see how builders are confronting the issue of shrinking resources for our beloved instruments.
You can blame the "tradition" on the guitar manufacturers. For decades - generations, even - they beat the drum about "tone woods, tone woods, tone woods". Now that the tone wood supplies are dwindling or illegal they switch to alternatives that they would never have touched if they did not have to and they tell us it's just as good as whatever. Maybe it is - but that isn't what they have been telling us for ages. They are caught in a dilemma of their own creation.
Richlite is great. and you can't say quality guitars aren't made from composite materials. More people are starting to learn that tonewood is b******* on an electric. Harris tides guitars are great proof that you don't need magical snake oil tone wood.
a fretboard made with real ebony wood only costs $45 pre slotted. that's not what makes a guitar expensive the craftsmanship is what makes a guitar expensive.