@@unoriginalthoughts796 With the 1v1s your playing the kaiev is certainly much more useful since the game is concluding far before anyone gets Military T3 so yeah its a great choice You can threaten capitals, cruisers. I believe it pierces base defense armor, not completely unlike the Javelis but significantly better than the 150 pierce of your standard frigate autocannon
YES! The Gang of Freebooters is my favorite. Their siege ships are a great inclusion, and I delay siege frigates research until much later into the game as a result (though maybe I shouldn't). I believe "Pillaged Warchest" (if I recall) is the research that rewards you from planetary bombardment. Thanks for the breakdown. It echoes most of what I feel from playing the game. I do find the Gauss Frigates invaluable early game, as they + Hoshikos got me through many tough times. I keep surviving frigates until late game as anti-capital ship counters.
I admit I just play by feel than worrying about the math but I have to disagree with a few points (at least playing against the AI since I don't play PVP): I'd put Carriers as Solid. They typically sit safely on the edge of system pumping out strikecraft. Bombers are great for sending after missile boats, repair ships, and carriers, while your fleet is meleeing with the rest of the enemy fleet. I'd put Javelis in the Great category . They typically sit behind the front line pumping out damage and as such they tend to hang around longer than the Haracka. Speaking of the Haracka I'd move them into the solid category taking the place of the Cobalt. But because they are a front-line ship I am constantly replacing them I'd put the Akkan on the Solid Tier. Useful support ship but not offensive enough. I'd put Kol on the Great Tier. It starts strong and just gets stronger. I don't play Enclave so I can't rate the Anklyon from use but I'd put it on the Great tier because it is a Titan. I place the Ragarnov on the OP tier. Yes, it might not be as durable as the Ankylon but if your opponent does not have a fleet, it does not have to be. I put the pirate mercenary on the situational tier but that is because my play style doesn't use them very well, otherwise I might consider them solid. I put the Freebooters on the Great Tier because I they can't just go to my fleet which means they can get forgotten at the home planet when I need them most. I'd move the Krosov down to situational. Great for generating revenue and savage thrill, but constantly having to be replaced. If I was to put anything on the avoid tier I think it would have to Gaurdas. You have to field to many of them to really feel effective and since the AI often fields with fleets that 50 or more missile boats they just don't seem effective. They also seem to disappear quite easily.
@@FDBryantIII Thanks! Those are great Points. You play against ai you say, but you should definitely head into pvp since you seem to think well about the game. Yeah using the percheron bombers as a measure against vasari missiles seems like a viable strategy. If it was not for the high cost I would be more excited about getting them. Maybe with the new garrisons the percheron might find some use by being produced for free by the garrisons.
i think for this type of list to make sense you should also compare these ships to their alien counterparts. the tec colony cap is alot worse then the vasri egg in combat and ability wise. and the advent one with shield regen alone brings alot more fleet utilty. the kol battleship dps and tankyness wise is the best pure battle capitalship with the level 6 ability beam shield regen ect.
I guess i mostly agree, though personally i think the situational lable underplays just how useful those particular ships are in their specific role. I only really disagree with three takes here. Kol Battleship: its a really good ship for brawling with other capital ships. In fact, i think it might be better than the radiance and devastator for specifically brawling with other cap ships. Its also your tankiest option by far as the TEC. I can see a TEC player not getting a Kol at least third unless they are going for a meme (or hilariously unlucky). Akhan battlecruiser: this thing would best fit in the situational tiernon your list. Its either the first ship you build on maps with longer rush distances, or its one of the last. On a revular tier list id still probably give it a B+ or A- because when the Akhan is the correct choice, its the only correct choice. But otherwise its only a good call fairly late when you already have a good fleet to boost with its buff. At that point its economic benefits, while still good, will be muted. Early on, when it facilitates an incredibly greedy TEC build it suffers from losing to basically any rush that hits before 25 minutes. Ragnarov Titan: in my own gameplay i have seen the Ragnarov get to absolutely rediculous dps numbers. 2.5k dps agains Titans is possible while still having similar durability to other titans (accepting the ankylon). With just a few levels to get warpth and an autoloader it already gets absolutely hilariour damage output. Its litterally the only titan i fear in the hands of the ai. It should definitely be in op tier.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 No worries. I mean, you are still totally right that they are great Titan crackers. People underestimate how important it is to fully surpass durability with pierce, as even 100 armor that's not overmatched is cutting damage down to 50%. Still, they are even more geared for and critical to killing starbases (which unlike Titans can't run away.... except the Vasari one which can crawl away).
Overall pretty good. I’d agree with your assessment of these ships. The only two things I would change is putting Ogrov in ‘great’ ranking as it is unit that can really help you take out capital ships/titans and starbases at range which a big deal as the factions who have their similar siege units need to get up close. As for the Javelis I’d switch it placement with the Kalev, they kind of compete for the same role of capital ship killer. And I’m just not impressed with the damage of the Javelis, even with its range. Kalev just hits harder, cheaper and you can get more pop-cap wise.
Cool! Yeah, I think that they serve similar roles in different stages of the game. If you are not already in tier 3 I also think kalevs are preferable.
One fairly big benefit of having even just a few ogrovs is that its torpedo is INSANELY tanky compared to any and all other missiles. If you have a fair bit of damage output from marzas, dunovs or Javelis then getting a few just to occupy PD a lot can up your dps quite a bit. Then again i mostly play against AI, so I dont have a clue about what people build in pvp.
Agree with most of the points you make but i would rate gaurdas higher maybe even great early game 3-5 of them will help allot with clearing ai on planets and derelicts as the lrm missle cruisers will do 0 dmg mid to late they help with enemy strikecraft.
Yes. against any amount of missiles having a couple of gardas with your fleet defnitiely helps alot. If you expect your opponent to get strikecraft or missiles it is also good to get them preemptively.
As long as devs keep missiles meta, Ankylon, Marza and Javelis always OP or atleast great (Javelis). All carriers is avoid, and main battleships caps are always great.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 yeah, but not so effective vs swarm of HEAVY missiles from ankylon and marza. If you caps spam, your main spam is Marza. If u rush, 100 Javelis can be field when enemies just have 10 caps.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 You can pretty easily over-saturate a Capitals defences even with Flak Burst with mass Javelis and Ogrovs, since TEC missiles are pretty resiliant and do high damage per missile. One mid-late game comp that works quite well is just to go all in on missiles, just does like a million damage to all the important targets.
I feel that the Marza Ultimate is not as much game breaking as it used to be. The targeting of "massive damage" is just a small circle. Within that small circle stuff just dies but nowhere near it used to be in Sins 1.
There is an upside in new ultimate. You can park Marza infront of enemy starbase and put circle on targets behind it to burst the starbase with the whole barrage.
Niche* was one of the words you were looking for. Great video keep up the grind sir o7
Tier lists like this are great channel builders.
Awesome video! thanks for making this, it's hugely helpful.
I would love to see lists for the other 2 factions. Thanks you for the vid
Yeah, hopefully I will get some help making it for the other factions soon enough!
Great list and explanations. I look forward to seeing the other factions.
i prefer gauss frigate over javelis. can snipe capital quite nice, cheaper, less population and can not be counterd by PD.
I absolutely agree.
Only advantage missiles have is their better range, right? Keep the gauss frigates from aoe and they will probably outperform
True! Javelis are more durable which is why I would prefer them later in the game. But Kalevs are very nice for early/midgame.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 With the 1v1s your playing the kaiev is certainly much more useful since the game is concluding far before anyone gets Military T3 so yeah its a great choice
You can threaten capitals, cruisers. I believe it pierces base defense armor, not completely unlike the Javelis but significantly better than the 150 pierce of your standard frigate autocannon
really insightful, thanks mate :)
YES! The Gang of Freebooters is my favorite. Their siege ships are a great inclusion, and I delay siege frigates research until much later into the game as a result (though maybe I shouldn't).
I believe "Pillaged Warchest" (if I recall) is the research that rewards you from planetary bombardment.
Thanks for the breakdown. It echoes most of what I feel from playing the game. I do find the Gauss Frigates invaluable early game, as they + Hoshikos got me through many tough times. I keep surviving frigates until late game as anti-capital ship counters.
I admit I just play by feel than worrying about the math but I have to disagree with a few points (at least playing against the AI since I don't play PVP):
I'd put Carriers as Solid. They typically sit safely on the edge of system pumping out strikecraft. Bombers are great for sending after missile boats, repair ships, and carriers, while your fleet is meleeing with the rest of the enemy fleet.
I'd put Javelis in the Great category . They typically sit behind the front line pumping out damage and as such they tend to hang around longer than the Haracka.
Speaking of the Haracka I'd move them into the solid category taking the place of the Cobalt. But because they are a front-line ship I am constantly replacing them
I'd put the Akkan on the Solid Tier. Useful support ship but not offensive enough.
I'd put Kol on the Great Tier. It starts strong and just gets stronger.
I don't play Enclave so I can't rate the Anklyon from use but I'd put it on the Great tier because it is a Titan.
I place the Ragarnov on the OP tier. Yes, it might not be as durable as the Ankylon but if your opponent does not have a fleet, it does not have to be.
I put the pirate mercenary on the situational tier but that is because my play style doesn't use them very well, otherwise I might consider them solid.
I put the Freebooters on the Great Tier because I they can't just go to my fleet which means they can get forgotten at the home planet when I need them most.
I'd move the Krosov down to situational. Great for generating revenue and savage thrill, but constantly having to be replaced.
If I was to put anything on the avoid tier I think it would have to Gaurdas. You have to field to many of them to really feel effective and since the AI often fields with fleets that 50 or more missile boats they just don't seem effective. They also seem to disappear quite easily.
@@FDBryantIII Thanks! Those are great Points. You play against ai you say, but you should definitely head into pvp since you seem to think well about the game. Yeah using the percheron bombers as a measure against vasari missiles seems like a viable strategy. If it was not for the high cost I would be more excited about getting them. Maybe with the new garrisons the percheron might find some use by being produced for free by the garrisons.
i think for this type of list to make sense you should also compare these ships to their alien counterparts. the tec colony cap is alot worse then the vasri egg in combat and ability wise. and the advent one with shield regen alone brings alot more fleet utilty.
the kol battleship dps and tankyness wise is the best pure battle capitalship with the level 6 ability beam shield regen ect.
I guess i mostly agree, though personally i think the situational lable underplays just how useful those particular ships are in their specific role.
I only really disagree with three takes here.
Kol Battleship: its a really good ship for brawling with other capital ships. In fact, i think it might be better than the radiance and devastator for specifically brawling with other cap ships. Its also your tankiest option by far as the TEC. I can see a TEC player not getting a Kol at least third unless they are going for a meme (or hilariously unlucky).
Akhan battlecruiser: this thing would best fit in the situational tiernon your list. Its either the first ship you build on maps with longer rush distances, or its one of the last. On a revular tier list id still probably give it a B+ or A- because when the Akhan is the correct choice, its the only correct choice. But otherwise its only a good call fairly late when you already have a good fleet to boost with its buff. At that point its economic benefits, while still good, will be muted. Early on, when it facilitates an incredibly greedy TEC build it suffers from losing to basically any rush that hits before 25 minutes.
Ragnarov Titan: in my own gameplay i have seen the Ragnarov get to absolutely rediculous dps numbers. 2.5k dps agains Titans is possible while still having similar durability to other titans (accepting the ankylon). With just a few levels to get warpth and an autoloader it already gets absolutely hilariour damage output. Its litterally the only titan i fear in the hands of the ai. It should definitely be in op tier.
Thanks! Yeah, I might have to abuse Ragnarok again!
Pretty sure titans have 750
Durability. Starbases have 1,000 durability. Great video!
@@JesseAStern Oh, you're absolutely right! Thanks!
@@unoriginalthoughts796 No worries. I mean, you are still totally right that they are great Titan crackers. People underestimate how important it is to fully surpass durability with pierce, as even 100 armor that's not overmatched is cutting damage down to 50%. Still, they are even more geared for and critical to killing starbases (which unlike Titans can't run away.... except the Vasari one which can crawl away).
Overall pretty good. I’d agree with your assessment of these ships. The only two things I would change is putting Ogrov in ‘great’ ranking as it is unit that can really help you take out capital ships/titans and starbases at range which a big deal as the factions who have their similar siege units need to get up close. As for the Javelis I’d switch it placement with the Kalev, they kind of compete for the same role of capital ship killer. And I’m just not impressed with the damage of the Javelis, even with its range. Kalev just hits harder, cheaper and you can get more pop-cap wise.
Cool! Yeah, I think that they serve similar roles in different stages of the game. If you are not already in tier 3 I also think kalevs are preferable.
One fairly big benefit of having even just a few ogrovs is that its torpedo is INSANELY tanky compared to any and all other missiles. If you have a fair bit of damage output from marzas, dunovs or Javelis then getting a few just to occupy PD a lot can up your dps quite a bit.
Then again i mostly play against AI, so I dont have a clue about what people build in pvp.
Agree with most of the points you make but i would rate gaurdas higher maybe even great early game 3-5 of them will help allot with clearing ai on planets and derelicts as the lrm missle cruisers will do 0 dmg mid to late they help with enemy strikecraft.
Yes. against any amount of missiles having a couple of gardas with your fleet defnitiely helps alot. If you expect your opponent to get strikecraft or missiles it is also good to get them preemptively.
As long as devs keep missiles meta, Ankylon, Marza and Javelis always OP or atleast great (Javelis). All carriers is avoid, and main battleships caps are always great.
One thing that is nice is to build flak burst on all your capital ships. That can really stop missiles in their tracks for a relatively cheap cost.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 yeah, but not so effective vs swarm of HEAVY missiles from ankylon and marza. If you caps spam, your main spam is Marza. If u rush, 100 Javelis can be field when enemies just have 10 caps.
@@unoriginalthoughts796 You can pretty easily over-saturate a Capitals defences even with Flak Burst with mass Javelis and Ogrovs, since TEC missiles are pretty resiliant and do high damage per missile. One mid-late game comp that works quite well is just to go all in on missiles, just does like a million damage to all the important targets.
interesting list! my main change suggestion would be to make a tier above "OP" to put freebooters in lol
"Freebooters tier" 😅
Would love one for Vassari!
Definitely an idea! Might need some knowledge help on that though.
I feel that the Marza Ultimate is not as much game breaking as it used to be. The targeting of "massive damage" is just a small circle. Within that small circle stuff just dies but nowhere near it used to be in Sins 1.
@@DKTrue Definitely not as strong as in sins 1. But still extremely potent for wiping frigates in the Midgame.
There is an upside in new ultimate. You can park Marza infront of enemy starbase and put circle on targets behind it to burst the starbase with the whole barrage.
When they fix the Shriken DPS, maybe I will consider it. Hard avoid for now...
@@Spectification Hopefully they will. Have not noticed any problems with the damage myself, but might not have looked carefully enough.
Do the same for Vasari and Advent
Have some plans for that! Stay tuned.
I miss bloody Kodiak battlebricks!
Kodiak bears?
just do carrier with fighters.
@@thepcfd Decent if you are facing other strikecraft!