VRM Basics Part 1 - LFC
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- Опубликовано: 10 июл 2024
- I've been threatening to make a video about VRMs for a while now, but when I got down to it, it's harder than I thought. In any case, here's the basics for you so when people start talking about phases and regulators, you'll be able to follow along.
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Couple of notes: The B550-f Strix has 'non-smart' power stages, which don't have quite as much sensing as smart stages do. They're in the same category though, so close enough for the purposes of this video.
It's also worth noting that some of the VRM phases on every mobo are dedicated to powering other things in the CPU, such as the SoC in an AMD chip or the on-board GPU on an Intel chip. I'm not getting into that for this video because it's another complication, when we go down that rabbit hole, there's also notes that CPUs have half a dozen other power rails going to them as well as vcore, and we're getting outside the scope of this video.
i was looking at the asus tuf x570 pro to pair with 9 3900x, is that a good choice for moderate gaming?
@@ldenorio I have that combo, its been fine for me.
the b550 strix-f has a 8 phase controller and is a 6 phase vcore set up with component doubling (+1 for soc) using vishay sic639 50A power stages
@@cluthz actually it runs a 4-2 pahse (cpu+soc) setup, ASUS uses 3 power stages per cpu vrm phase on this model
This is absolutely fascinating. More of this, please.
I class myself as a well educated tech head. However I still find great pleasure in watching Graham & his beard and increase and update my own knowledge . Keep them coming. Stay safe.
Was looking for the 'Part 2' when I realized I'm not as much of a time traveler as I had thought >__< thanks for all the videos!!
Excellentissime vidéo ! Vous êtes, Monsieur, un champion de l'électronique et de l'informatique. I'm quite sure this doesn't require any translation. Except that I would add you undeniably have real teaching skills.
Such a underrated channel. So glad I've found you. I especially like the "Lets try to fix this PC"-videos.
Thank you 🙏 so much sir , I hope all is well . This info is very helpful and give me a better point of view ! I like the way you mix it up and show the difference in other mother boards !
Great video as always. Very well explained. Good job!
You deserve more subscribers, brilliantly conveyed information.
Great engineer!
Thanks.
You are a true hero sir. keep up the fascinating work.
wow i really appreciate this kind of videos
i already know some of the basics about VRM's
but your explanation is much better and makes more sense
Thank you for the brief explanation
Good Job
Thanks , my teacher, I want lessons of this kind
This man is the most underrated tech youtuber on yt! Absolutely fascinating!
Oh hey, the ROG Strix B550-F! It's my board, and one of the best boards I've ever owned. I have a 3900X running on this thing, with a 4 x 8GB kit of Trident Z Neo 3600 16-16-16-36. Stellar performance.
Great video, good sir. Very well done, very clear, well explained. Keep up the great work!
very educating and informative of basic of understanding motherboards. More of these please!
Thanks for posting Graham. It’s amazing how things have moved on over the past 25 or 30 years. I remember when a crude resistor seemed to be the only way to drop voltages
Good video, I already knew how the VRM worked but I learned a little more with you, keep it up Bro.
Thank you for the awesome explanation of VRMs.
This is very much appreciated. Thank you for the video.
Best video on VRMs/ motherboard.. very informative.. Thank You !
A nasty subject that can get out of hand explaining it, but you kept it simple and clear. Nice job so far. Can't wait for part 2. Cheers!
Very nice explained on the paper 👌🏻 better than most of teachers in university
Very cool content. Looking forward to the next one.
Thankyou for explaining very intresting
There it is, promised multiphase Vcore video!😊 Thanks Graham, precise and informative as always!😉👍👍
Great video, thanks
Bloody good idea for a video, thank you good work.
This is brilliant. Do more of these please.
Best Adam video so far.. that i´ve seen.. : ) .. Bis.
Great video m8 very informative
I waited for a long time to see a video regarding VRM's
When you explain it like that, it's so simple :)
Thanks very much for interesting and educational, more of it please...
Wow! 90Amps is massive! And that's PER POWER STAGE!
A residential main breaker- for the ENTIRE house's current, is usually rated at around 40-60Amps.
An arc welder delivers a steady stream of current for a good weld, when it is around 100Amps.
That, is, a, massive, amount of current available to the CPU! And again- that is PER power stage! Glorious really! The engineering is just amazing!
*Thinking about it now... I know it's low-voltage, but is there a danger of serious injury, or even death from these things, Graham?*
60-90 Amps is frightening.
Comparing a 220V installation to a 1V one is kinda silly!!
@@sassuki I don't know much about electricity- I'm a software engineer, which is why I'm amazed and why I asked if there is any danger in that.
If you don't know something, you ask, don't you? Doesn't matter how "st3wp|d" it may sound.
love it!
Very helpful, thank you.
good video well made video looking forward to part 2
Very nice useful video
A true scholar
Thank you, Little Clive.
I don't know how you don't have millions of subs. Love your channel!! Its like I'm at school you just have a way with words and makes its fun to watch!!. Keep them coming! Oh btw what are your thoughts on tuf x570-plus wifi motherboard?
well presented - I remember the vrm sockets when they 1st came out on AT boards - they had a couple of jumpers on them if you were fitting a 5v chip but removed the jumpers and fitted a small module if you were fitting a 3.3v chip - those boards were not in circulation for long if memory serves it was close to the time of motherboard cache shortages and some manufacturers were fitting fake cache chips with the words 'write back' embossed on them and also featured a bios tweaked to hide the crime... and of course the performance was awful
Very good explanation that my smooth brain can understand.
Thank you!.
very educational and interesting, i would love if you made more of these for other components in a computer aswell! i think it would be a big help for those starting in IT and computer science like me and such.
Nice. Really nice. More of this.
We need more of this
There was a TV series back in the 70's called Adam Adamant, he was a super hero.
great video ...big fan from Syria
we stand in solidarity with you guys in the face of terrorist bombing by Israel
Amazing video man. Thanks. You are very good in your subject and you explain very well. One question: How you learned all these things do you have electronic engineering degree, from books, videos, online classes...?
mindblowing :D
Thanks
how true indeed, have a b550m el cheapo board mining monero with a 3950x, was throttling, the vrms have no heat sinks so had to install a cooling fan to get it to work right.
Wonderful
Now this is what I call a real educational video!!! Excellent stuff, and nice pace too. Now could you explain the whole motherboard please. 😁😀
Hold up, we're not even done with the VRMs yet!
Will look forward to the next video. I actually have the MSI X470 gaming plus max board that you showed in this video paired with a Ryzen 7 2700X. I thought this board was a little cheap on VRMs but I'm not overclocking so I think it will be ok.
Very interesting.......more
YOU DA MAN
wow....... thankyou
10:15 Ok, Jay
Very interesting but I got lost after, “Hello Interwebs” 🤪
Watching here from philippines..:)
Very good explanation on how VRMs work, my only complaint is that at 7:14 the phases are connected directly to the PWM controller without doublers.
great video, could you explain how coil works and go more in-depth on it? i'm most interested in that stuff you were showing on paper, and then the visual follow-up on the motherboards. thing is, i feel like more needs to be explained on the paper about the basics like how a capacitor and inductor actually works.
and now you'll have to do a video explaining Mosfets
Thanks for this, wish I understood that before buying my current MB.
I was worried about BIOSs (as I had no old AMD CPU) and decided to go with a cheap 570 board (X570-A PRO).
Not a problem with my 3600 CPU but somewhat limiting for future upgrades.
I recently bought parts for a new PC and i was going to get the b550-f but i ended up with the b450-f because it was £100 cheaper
You are exceptionally knowledgeable about electronics
Ok, this is weird. I just bought a x470, this exact board. I picked it up because it was so cheap but I was suspect of it because it had that small heatsink over the vrm's. Thanks to your video I returned it and picked up a x570 instead. I want the 8 phase vrm's with a nice heatsink and the x570 gaming plus has got it and a lot more goodies. I just know I would regret it everyday knowing I only had 4 phases and plus it doesn't make it very sellable
How does the gigabyte b550 Aorus master vrm’s compare? I hear the master is way over engineered and run roughly 10°C less than almost all other b550 motherboards.
This is funny, I have a GA-K8 Ultra 9, that I just recently ordered a Athlon X2 4800+ to build it up into some youngtimer sort of thing.
These old boards are great for explaining stuff, I even still have some Pentium 1 boards with an actual, slotted VRM module that you can exchange.
Slotted VRM? That's rad, I didn't know they ever used literal modules on computer motherboards. I thought that was just in integrated systems.
@@Adamant_IT Once I have one of the old Siemenses open again I'll send you a picture.
I think it had to do with the fact that on Socket 7 some CPU's required adifferent core voltage that other, like 2.2 instead of 3 or so, i don't remember from top of my head now.
I have the Asus x570 Pro Prime - the white-plastic accented consumer board, not the creator board.
I knew this ahead of time, but it claims "12" phases, but it's a four phase with each power stage Tripled and a crazy amount of filtration. Totally capable, yes, but a very silly way to get the correct power output. That said, it's not had a single issue, so...
Is that board same like ROG Strix B550-A model ?
👏👏👏👏👏👏
Brill More Please
Thank you graham for the great video (sorry teaching).i think iam the only one listening but all the comments on below struck me .every one listening to you.so kindly please upload basic repairing study materials of laptops
what a coincidence, my relative has this board for his rig lol
Great video Graham, to the layperson ,we wouldn't even notice this ,but even in electronics ,you can still cut corners! I have a MSI Tomahawk B450 Max which I am pleased with .I have the Ryzen 5 3600 which does me fine .I do mostly photography editing and don't game ,but as far as I know this board is rated pretty high . Could you please tell what the maximum CPU I could run on this board for what I do ?
Well, spoiler for Part 2, VRMs matter less than you might think in the majority of cases. For overclocking or number crunching, choice comes into play, but for general gaming and productivity, basic VRMs will do just fine.
No need to ask Graham. Just go to the MSI website and look it up yourself. Probably a Ryzen 9.
👍👍👍
13:32
**cough**
Intel
**cough**
I a m sick of intel too.
Hi everyone
If anyone can help ?
My laptop charger was broken i tried to repaired it but the moment i plugged it my laptop it went off ( no lights is turning on ) and the charging lights is not turning on i sent it for repair and it was diagnosed that the motherboard was fried and the motherboard needs to be replaced . Can it be be fixed without changing the motherboard?? (Laptop model dell inspiron 5521)
Please help
hello. can i use the thermal paste on my vrm heatsink instead of thermal pad? since itry to clean my vrm heatsink but i messed my stock thermal pad. i mean it was cut and messed. my board ia msi b550m mortar. thank you
You could try it, but you might not get a very firm mount. The push pins for the heatsink will usually assume that there's 1 or 2mm of thermal pad. If the heatsink fits ok (not loose) with thermal paste alone though, you should be fine.
👍
Valrage Regulafor Module :-) Your Handwriting teacher must be so proud, LOL.. Oh wait; they killed handwriting lessons in the uk ;-)
It took me so many takes to do that scene. After I messed up the hand writing I was like "yo know, I don't care. That'll do. Everyone will know what I mean." 😅
@@Adamant_IT I really am joking dude. I love your vids. But be kind to me, how could I not point that out? Had to do it :-)
Go for a beefier VRM than what you think you will need.
I was wondering does this then pull down more amps ?
Yes, bigger VRM setups can supply more amps. However, in theory a mobo should be capable of powering any CPU that's on its supported list.
Can you explain why CPUs have two power supplies? Yes, the ones without an integrated GPU have two power supplies, as the GA-K8NMF-9 has one above.
System Agent, System on Chip, stuff like that. The CPU is a very complicated device and has 5-7 different voltage rails feeding it. Vcore is just the big workhorse one.
are you threatening me ?!?!?!?!?!? :D
Asus skimped on the intel bioards previous 2 generations put 4 phase vrms they marketed as 8 or 12 phase vrms while charging more than the boards with real 12 or 16 phase vrms and then people were wondering why their overclocked CPUs were throttling when they well within temp spec .......
What IT certifications do you have?
None of note. I am 99% self-taught from experience and other RUclips channels.
I technically have an Advance Vocational Certificate in ICT, which I guess is similar to the A+, except it covers more topics. I did that in UK College (age 16-18). It was more useful in deciding what career direction to take than actually training me though.
Is that middle stage missing a cap?
The outputs from the Inductors are all joined together, so from that point onwards you can more or less add capacitors wherever you like. They tend to get positioned wherever there's space (they have to make sure there's standard clearances for CPU heatsinks) rather than making sure there's an even number for each phase. So long as there's enough in total that's what really matters.
Do motherboards for Intel processors have similar VRM Issues?
Yup, Intel is very similar, only differences are technicalities - AMD needs an extra phase or two for SoC, Intel uses one for on-board GPU, that sort of thing. Main CPU vcore requirements are very similar though. Intel currently gets more thirsty than AMD, but we're still talking 100-200w stock speed, 200-300w typical overclock. Extreme overclocking can get wild, you'll head into 400w and up categories, but that's why top end mobos cost $400 and have 16-phase 90amp smart power stages.
I have a 5600x on a b450 pro-m2. Bad VRM, but it works fine.
Hoping for someone to help me modify my EVGA Z370 Micro-atx board with LLC, it doesn't come with the mobo bios -_-
I own the B550-E. When I installed it it was rock solid. With a 5600X. Which has better VRM's than B550-F, with old EVGA Supernova Nex 750 watt Gold PSU
However, I wanted a power supply with silent running and installed it a week ago. The Corsair PSU did not like running on my PC and crashed 2 to 3 times a day for no reason, and found it hard to run my CPU and motherboard. I gave up after two days and reinstalled my old five year old power supply.
Now, my concern is that I may have damaged the motherboard or the new RTX Suprim 3070 from MSI. Or the DDR 4 memory. With the crap Corsair RMX 750 watt that has been found faulty by Scan....
Today , had random bluescreens. Civilisation 6 and a general Windows failure. Civ 6 has a known fault apparently with Logitech peripheral software. So uninstalled that. and adjusted the logi software It crashed once more. So uninstalled ASUS AI suite, Amory Crate and Dragon master MSI.
My next options are, mem test to test the 32 gig of RAM. Reinstall Windows 10, because, its bluescreens and restarts.
Any suggestions to identify the fault?
PS, I have the 8 slot PSU CPU cable plugged in and the extra 4 pin since reinstalling onto the motherboard with old PSU.
Yea start with memory testing. Unlikely that the mobo was damaged by the PSU in my experiance.
Try going to Bios and running base memory speeds for a few days, then enable xmp, if it's fine. I've had a memory overclock run solid for years, and then only crashed in one particular game, bluescreens and all. It passed 24 hours of mem test, too, but downclocking the RAM made it stable for the one title.
@@JonathanSias Put BIOS on auto memory. I will see if system stability returns/remains.
That Corsair PSU...hope it did not do a number on system. Its brand new (the system).
@@Adamant_IT I took drastic option and reinstalled Windows. Testing continues.
Well
You would be more accurate to call these "buck converters" rather than VRM's usually a mosfet, inductor, capacitor. Also called level shifters.
You said 90 amps per and a total of 1600 amps. You meant watts right?
Yes, I meant watts there 👍
@@Adamant_IT lol. Thx. Just sanity checking myself. I’m thinking, hmm, there has to be $200 in copper alone to handle 1600 amps. Must be quantum tunneling or something.
Asus motherboards are the best by far nearly all issues are caused by the user I have used hundreds of them and have only had one issue since 1999.
@@YoureUsingWordsIncorrectly you are obviously a novice with computers I didn't say they don't have failures but they have way less especially the more expensive boards Asrock have a high rate of failure as do Gigabyte MSI are virtually as good. But as said previously a lot of failure is human error when building the PC.