I totally agree with you here this runeword system in d4 is better for the the long run and make the unique items even better than before and doesnt kill them like it did for diablo 2. W for this video!!!! Anyone who thinks d2 runewords were the best thing ever should just go play diablo 2 and stop complaining about D4... they are not the same game and as a D2 original fan boy, I am glad its not because we played D2 for 20+ years and its time for a change!
thank you!!!! i hate those d2 snobs that think the d4 ones need to be like the ones in d2. and as someone who played d2 for 20 years i can say that. the d4 ones are still runewords and are still great!
I’m not for or against either version, but D4 runewords simply are not runewords, they are just runes. They are boring let’s say that, can be overpowered for sure, but just boring. I would like runewords compete with aspects and uniques, but just my idea. D4 just don’t have runewords yet. Those are just runes. You can’t do anything with only one rune, one rune just doesn’t do anything. Two runes are a compete “rune”.
Eh, they don't have to be the same, but I think it's undeniable that D4 runewords are boring. They could be named anything else. They're just another loadout/power system like from seasons. They only called them runewords to activate nostalgia and get people to spend money again.
As already said by LittleRadicalThinker... D4's "runewords" are JUST RUNES. If they were runeWORDS.. they would have a list of.. get this... WORDS. If they were actually runewords. then name the list of those words.. the thing is.. they are NOT runeWORDSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. They are just runes. It's such a bullsh.. thing to market it as such.. just call them skill gems or runes.. simple. Then i have no issue w that.
D4 brought back RUNES, not runeWARDS. Anyone who says different is just objectively wrong. Putting runes in gear, doesnt make a runeward. Its like your jah ist ber example no different.
There’s already a rune meta and now that dissolves any rune build diversity. Which is the war cry effect and the petrify effect. So much for build crafting a “new” feature.
100% agree. I think the concept of Runewords in D4 is an improvement from D2, however taken from the PTR, Blizzard needs to rebalance runewords because there is a meta already. Blizzard failed to rebalance D2 and now Enigma is on every chest slot. But another point is that I like the fact that Runewords are inherently tied to gem slots and don't compete with the existing gear in the game. The idea that runewords in D2 are just uniques with extra steps meant that you had to use them at a cost. In D4 you don't have to compromise an entire item slot to engage with the system, only gem fragments. This expands build possibility because the two systems of gear and runewords aren't competing against each other and this allows for deeper itemization.
I love D2 but you had a great convincing argument against its runewords. In the current state tho I found a little unimaginative how it worked in the ptr but what you suggested would be totally fine plus unique stats, buffs for every unique combinations.
Runewords democratized decent fast builds. Before they were locked behind uniques or OP items, when runewords were released it felt like I was able to at least build OK builds (ignoring Enigma or high runewords)
Totally agree and i still remember how many people were crying when they introduced those runewords in D2. But almost everyone who could aquire those runes used it including myself. I found the chase of getting the right socketable items and runes a nice added component to the game. With D4 this is a fantastic start and im very exited to see whats to come and to use them myself. Hopefully they would add jewels and or unique jewels (mythic jewels…godly) too.
Finding the right socketable item will bring the game back to competing with unique items and is ultimately bad for the game. This part should not be added back into the game
@@phoeaterz Completely disagree, I believe having those other options will promote more variety and loot to look for and options to add into your items. To each his own though, I sure enjoyed it in D2 back in the day.
I think you missed my point and i think i missed yours. I see what your saying with the correct socketable items from D2, yea i don't want that in D4. My initial other point was saying adding (unique) jewels to socket into items like in D2 would add more diversity to the game.
I might be misunderstanding you but did you say at the end there that they could improve the D4 system by having them add an additional special effect when used together? Isn’t that basically the same thing as D2 rune words but instead of adding like 4-6 affixes you would be adding one, without the names attached?
Adding the additional effects is the essence of runewords without having to find base white items. That avoids the issue of having runewords compete with existing unique items.
Runewords are kind of already in D4, just in a roundabout way. With 18 specific runes (And two Resplendent Sparks), you can now craft a specific Mythic Unique. Sure, it doesn't require slotting the runes into a chosen item to Craft it, but you still can still make a powerful item using runes. The real downside is that it requires Resplendent Sparks and 18 Runes (6 sets of 3 Different Runes). It's a bit steep of a cost for that, seeing as how generally farming those runes is nearly impossible without hundreds and hundreds of hours - unless you trade for them. I think if they fixed that D4 runes will knock out D2 runes for me on every other front. D4 runes are more interesting on their own and a more compelling game design overall.
Great video and good points. But, did anybody else feel some pain when Pho put in the jah ist ber in the incorrect way to simply show the stats? In D2, putting in the correct order of like 7 runes was like performing surgery.
While I really love D2's runewords, they just wouldnt fit in D4 and they would invalidate so many items that honestly probably still need to be buffed to even be competitive with even legendaries in the same slot. I initially didnt like D4's system because of my nostalgia for D2's, but I've come around to the concept, I think it just needs to be flesh out more. I'd like to see more than just a "cause" & "effect system, perhaps something that can also modify skills more drastically than just "evade becomes teleport once every 20s" or "use a core skill 20 times & cast warcry". Those abilities are nice, but just super 1 dimensional. Still, nice vid and I mostly agree!
Yeah I usually end up getting Tyrael's and because it's the best, but I'm tired of running it in almost all builds. If it's going to be that strong defensively, they should remove the holy bolt damage to let some other item use it lol
Its the best defensive armor in the game, its not the best armor in the game... Theres the cost of opportunity of another aspect/temper, I just go with raiment of the infinite 100% of the time.
some builds will use the new chest, the ones with strong passives. some rogues use their class specific chest already. oh yea sorcs use their class specific unique armor as well
Collectible rocks with different effects when put into open sockets that can be used to craft gear with insanely good stats. Take a guess which game I'm describing.
Rune words are wildly different from uniques.. you need the base, you choose the base eth or not, stats vary more, and you trade runes. They are 2 very different things.
I agree. Runewords in d2 is the same as sets in d3. They made everything single farm and op. D2 players want paladin with enigma and d3 players want easy street. I've played since diablo 1 so I get both sides. But runewords ruined d2 with its "the only thing to get", same as sets in d3. I believe d4 is stepping in the right direction direction, and as they said, most d2 players are playing d2r so they need to give what the current players want. I believe they'll iterate, just like they did with helltides and now nightmare dungeons, feedback is key
Yeah I hate how cringe the D2 Hardcore fanbois are. Yeah no shit its not the same its a completely different game 💀Like sure if you don't like it whatever but all they do is shit on D4.
d2 purist are old balding out of shape men that still live in the 90's bro leave them be, but i still hate them comparing old boring d2 to a more flush, smooth running d4😅
I'm fearful that in D4 these runewords will end up becoming all shout/petrify. I would rather have fewer options overall and more competitive choices than many junk choices and only a few real game changers for builds.
Every single class in D4, Tyraels, Tyraels and Tyraels same goes with the aspects. Anyhow, people think you can make BoTD or an Enigma in a weeks time... You can go almost a whole month of acquiring enough items to finally trade for the runes you need to make an enigma or BoTD and good luck making any of those in a months time without trading, my point is you'll still be using unique items as your go to gear to get those high end rune words. These are not rune words in D4, you don't create a unique item from a white item with its own rolls, this is just D4 devs trying to feed on D2 nostalgia to get more people playing D4, it's all just rune words by name and nothing else, if you all hate D2 so much then why get all excited over half ass rune words in the first place. If D4 is a different game then you're admitting its not diablo, D4 doesn't feel like a diablo game at all.
New mythics will change the armor game compared to enigma dominating for decades. Making a unique item from runes is a terrible idea and should not be added to d4 for reasons mentioned in the video. D4 is the next iteration of the franchise. D4 doesnt feel like d2 in the same way that d2 doesnt feel like d1. Things improve and move on.
Lol nothing improved in d3? Heres 2: Action and fluidity in combat: feels way better in d3. Try selling the d2 sorc blizzard spell today and i will watch you get laughed at. Endgame: Greater rifts were much better at testing your gear over trying to do chaos sanc for the 300 thousanth time. And these 2 things are absolutely the right things to bring to d4. If that makes it feel to much like d3, well i guess you can enjoy the buggy ass feeling spell of blizzard with the sorc in d2.
@@phoeaterz 1. Combat improved because D2 was released in 2000 and D4 in 2023. Sure I'll give you that. 2. Greater rifts is not an improvement. Have fun running the same rift over and over for the 300 thousandth time it gets boring real fast. To sum it up, you're just improving your characters damage by small margins which all rely on %x and %+x damage, that's your whole entire D4 experience in terms of items, pretty boring. Not here to argue but at least if you want D4 to be the next iteration for the genre than at least they shouldn't copy the name rune words from D2 that were actual success of the game and turn it into some spender generator system, that's not rune words my guy. White, blue and yellow items are still garbage I don't know why they're in the game anyway.
@@phoeaterz They need to just remove the if-then garbage and just have like 10 runes with unique stats for armor / wep / jewelry like runes in d2, which is what I think you're suggesting. Would love if a 'runeword' just added like 1 more bonus stat. Would keep the runes fun but not insanely broken because they still need to compete with 300 main stat...
No. The offering concept is not that big of a deal to me and they can keep it if they really want it. I am suggesting that they add the combos and give stats that is greater than the sum of the parts. Once they have that, they will have captured the essence of runewords.
runewords werent bad imo, runewords being so fkin strong that you would never think to ever use 90% of the items you have or will ever find made the endgame feel more generic. Wich could be good or bad depending on how deep your investment was. I could finish a best in slot character in a day or two because i didnt had to craft a perfect amulet or find a perfect stated once in a lifetime rare drop. Runewords allowed endgame builds in D2 to be streamlined for anyone with limited amount of time. Good or bad the developers who designed this system did it with clear passion for their craft, unlike we know who...
I might be misunderstanding you but did you say at the end there that they could improve the D4 system by having them add an additional special effect when used together? Isn’t that basically the same thing as D2 rune words but instead of adding like 4-6 affixes you would be adding one, without the names attached?
Not really, you ignored his whole other argument, which in D2 runewords replaced most Uniques and itemization became focused on the runewords themselves as any base white could be used for the system. The effects are so powerful that using Uniques instead at or near endgame is just ludicrous and you'd only do it for extra challenge by handicapping yourself
![KSI - Dirty [Official Visualiser]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VoDh1h1dPUE/mqdefault.jpg)
I totally agree with you here this runeword system in d4 is better for the the long run and make the unique items even better than before and doesnt kill them like it did for diablo 2.
W for this video!!!! Anyone who thinks d2 runewords were the best thing ever should just go play diablo 2 and stop complaining about D4... they are not the same game and as a D2 original fan boy, I am glad its not because we played D2 for 20+ years and its time for a change!
GREAT video. Blizzard take note please.
thank you!!!! i hate those d2 snobs that think the d4 ones need to be like the ones in d2. and as someone who played d2 for 20 years i can say that. the d4 ones are still runewords and are still great!
I’m not for or against either version, but D4 runewords simply are not runewords, they are just runes. They are boring let’s say that, can be overpowered for sure, but just boring. I would like runewords compete with aspects and uniques, but just my idea. D4 just don’t have runewords yet. Those are just runes. You can’t do anything with only one rune, one rune just doesn’t do anything. Two runes are a compete “rune”.
Eh, they don't have to be the same, but I think it's undeniable that D4 runewords are boring. They could be named anything else. They're just another loadout/power system like from seasons. They only called them runewords to activate nostalgia and get people to spend money again.
As already said by LittleRadicalThinker... D4's "runewords" are JUST RUNES. If they were runeWORDS.. they would have a list of.. get this... WORDS. If they were actually runewords. then name the list of those words.. the thing is.. they are NOT runeWORDSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS. They are just runes. It's such a bullsh.. thing to market it as such.. just call them skill gems or runes.. simple. Then i have no issue w that.
D4 brought back RUNES, not runeWARDS. Anyone who says different is just objectively wrong. Putting runes in gear, doesnt make a runeward. Its like your jah ist ber example no different.
We have no disagreements
@@phoeaterz not even that they are runewords not runewards?
There’s already a rune meta and now that dissolves any rune build diversity. Which is the war cry effect and the petrify effect. So much for build crafting a “new” feature.
100% agree. I think the concept of Runewords in D4 is an improvement from D2, however taken from the PTR, Blizzard needs to rebalance runewords because there is a meta already. Blizzard failed to rebalance D2 and now Enigma is on every chest slot. But another point is that I like the fact that Runewords are inherently tied to gem slots and don't compete with the existing gear in the game. The idea that runewords in D2 are just uniques with extra steps meant that you had to use them at a cost. In D4 you don't have to compromise an entire item slot to engage with the system, only gem fragments. This expands build possibility because the two systems of gear and runewords aren't competing against each other and this allows for deeper itemization.
I love D2 but you had a great convincing argument against its runewords. In the current state tho I found a little unimaginative how it worked in the ptr but what you suggested would be totally fine plus unique stats, buffs for every unique combinations.
If only they had cool affects and changed gameplay, instead we get more damage.
Wow this is really a good and informative video!! Good job
Runewords democratized decent fast builds. Before they were locked behind uniques or OP items, when runewords were released it felt like I was able to at least build OK builds (ignoring Enigma or high runewords)
Totally agree and i still remember how many people were crying when they introduced those runewords in D2. But almost everyone who could aquire those runes used it including myself. I found the chase of getting the right socketable items and runes a nice added component to the game. With D4 this is a fantastic start and im very exited to see whats to come and to use them myself. Hopefully they would add jewels and or unique jewels (mythic jewels…godly) too.
Finding the right socketable item will bring the game back to competing with unique items and is ultimately bad for the game. This part should not be added back into the game
@@phoeaterz Completely disagree, I believe having those other options will promote more variety and loot to look for and options to add into your items. To each his own though, I sure enjoyed it in D2 back in the day.
Did you even watch the video?
@@phoeaterz you are spot on.
I think you missed my point and i think i missed yours. I see what your saying with the correct socketable items from D2, yea i don't want that in D4. My initial other point was saying adding (unique) jewels to socket into items like in D2 would add more diversity to the game.
Keep preachin, Pho! Love your passion & ty 4 not allowing ignorance to overcome the truth. D2 & D4 needed to be differentiated. appreciate it!
I might be misunderstanding you but did you say at the end there that they could improve the D4 system by having them add an additional special effect when used together?
Isn’t that basically the same thing as D2 rune words but instead of adding like 4-6 affixes you would be adding one, without the names attached?
Adding the additional effects is the essence of runewords without having to find base white items. That avoids the issue of having runewords compete with existing unique items.
Totally agree with your take on runewords in d2 and d4✌️
Similar thoughts here. Cheers!
Runewords are kind of already in D4, just in a roundabout way. With 18 specific runes (And two Resplendent Sparks), you can now craft a specific Mythic Unique. Sure, it doesn't require slotting the runes into a chosen item to Craft it, but you still can still make a powerful item using runes. The real downside is that it requires Resplendent Sparks and 18 Runes (6 sets of 3 Different Runes). It's a bit steep of a cost for that, seeing as how generally farming those runes is nearly impossible without hundreds and hundreds of hours - unless you trade for them. I think if they fixed that D4 runes will knock out D2 runes for me on every other front. D4 runes are more interesting on their own and a more compelling game design overall.
Great video and good points. But, did anybody else feel some pain when Pho put in the jah ist ber in the incorrect way to simply show the stats? In D2, putting in the correct order of like 7 runes was like performing surgery.
Blizzard should notice this video right now! Well done +1sub from me
Couldn't agree with you more. Thanks for the good video.
Well said… besides your pronunciations. Ber is not said like bear. It’s pronounced ‘bur’. And shako is pronounced ‘Shay Ko’, not ‘Shack O’
ruclips.net/video/c54x7gFRgZ8/видео.html
@@phoeaterz I deserve to be belittled. Apologies. I shall never doubt you again hood sir.
Lol
He's right
Found the grammar nazi.
this man hit the nail in the head with a nuke!!Enigma ruined any diversity in builds...
same can be said about shako and tyraels might in d4? lol
While I really love D2's runewords, they just wouldnt fit in D4 and they would invalidate so many items that honestly probably still need to be buffed to even be competitive with even legendaries in the same slot.
I initially didnt like D4's system because of my nostalgia for D2's, but I've come around to the concept, I think it just needs to be flesh out more. I'd like to see more than just a "cause" & "effect system, perhaps something that can also modify skills more drastically than just "evade becomes teleport once every 20s" or "use a core skill 20 times & cast warcry". Those abilities are nice, but just super 1 dimensional.
Still, nice vid and I mostly agree!
Well said. Concisely said. Thank you.
Let's just see how it plays out next season, it will be a big test.
I agree with you.... Sidenote .. in d4 we have an armor that's in every build and it's tyreals lol. It annoys the crap out of me
Agreed, they just need more mythics in each category and some slightly better uniques
Yeah I usually end up getting Tyrael's and because it's the best, but I'm tired of running it in almost all builds. If it's going to be that strong defensively, they should remove the holy bolt damage to let some other item use it lol
Its the best defensive armor in the game, its not the best armor in the game... Theres the cost of opportunity of another aspect/temper, I just go with raiment of the infinite 100% of the time.
some builds will use the new chest, the ones with strong passives. some rogues use their class specific chest already. oh yea sorcs use their class specific unique armor as well
Collectible rocks with different effects when put into open sockets that can be used to craft gear with insanely good stats.
Take a guess which game I'm describing.
Rune words are wildly different from uniques.. you need the base, you choose the base eth or not, stats vary more, and you trade runes. They are 2 very different things.
runewords = uniques with extra steps
I agree. Runewords in d2 is the same as sets in d3. They made everything single farm and op. D2 players want paladin with enigma and d3 players want easy street. I've played since diablo 1 so I get both sides. But runewords ruined d2 with its "the only thing to get", same as sets in d3. I believe d4 is stepping in the right direction direction, and as they said, most d2 players are playing d2r so they need to give what the current players want. I believe they'll iterate, just like they did with helltides and now nightmare dungeons, feedback is key
I always thought that D2 "snobs" want D4 to be like D2 (with free trading being the important feature) so that they can sell on D2JSP.
Trading is now allowed on all items besides mythic uniques now
Yeah I hate how cringe the D2 Hardcore fanbois are. Yeah no shit its not the same its a completely different game 💀Like sure if you don't like it whatever but all they do is shit on D4.
d2 purist are old balding out of shape men that still live in the 90's bro leave them be, but i still hate them comparing old boring d2 to a more flush, smooth running d4😅
I'm fearful that in D4 these runewords will end up becoming all shout/petrify. I would rather have fewer options overall and more competitive choices than many junk choices and only a few real game changers for builds.
I think they could add extra stats from the runes in D4
Fun and informative!
Tyrael's Might go brrrrrrrrrrrr
We don’t want D2 runewards. We don’t want an item to outclass ALL other items like in D2.
D2 snobs needs to take their meds n chill
Every single class in D4, Tyraels, Tyraels and Tyraels same goes with the aspects. Anyhow, people think you can make BoTD or an Enigma in a weeks time... You can go almost a whole month of acquiring enough items to finally trade for the runes you need to make an enigma or BoTD and good luck making any of those in a months time without trading, my point is you'll still be using unique items as your go to gear to get those high end rune words. These are not rune words in D4, you don't create a unique item from a white item with its own rolls, this is just D4 devs trying to feed on D2 nostalgia to get more people playing D4, it's all just rune words by name and nothing else, if you all hate D2 so much then why get all excited over half ass rune words in the first place. If D4 is a different game then you're admitting its not diablo, D4 doesn't feel like a diablo game at all.
New mythics will change the armor game compared to enigma dominating for decades. Making a unique item from runes is a terrible idea and should not be added to d4 for reasons mentioned in the video. D4 is the next iteration of the franchise. D4 doesnt feel like d2 in the same way that d2 doesnt feel like d1. Things improve and move on.
@@phoeaterz D4 exact same copy pasta of D3 with better graphics. Nothing improved and are way worse than D2, D2 improved a ton from D1.
Lol nothing improved in d3? Heres 2:
Action and fluidity in combat: feels way better in d3. Try selling the d2 sorc blizzard spell today and i will watch you get laughed at.
Endgame: Greater rifts were much better at testing your gear over trying to do chaos sanc for the 300 thousanth time.
And these 2 things are absolutely the right things to bring to d4. If that makes it feel to much like d3, well i guess you can enjoy the buggy ass feeling spell of blizzard with the sorc in d2.
@@phoeaterz
1. Combat improved because D2 was released in 2000 and D4 in 2023. Sure I'll give you that.
2. Greater rifts is not an improvement. Have fun running the same rift over and over for the 300 thousandth time it gets boring real fast.
To sum it up, you're just improving your characters damage by small margins which all rely on %x and %+x damage, that's your whole entire D4 experience in terms of items, pretty boring.
Not here to argue but at least if you want D4 to be the next iteration for the genre than at least they shouldn't copy the name rune words from D2 that were actual success of the game and turn it into some spender generator system, that's not rune words my guy. White, blue and yellow items are still garbage I don't know why they're in the game anyway.
Tell me you havent played the game since season 4 without telling me you havent played the game since season 4.
Warcry and Petrify could have literally no additional affect and i'd still run them over your proposed change though, they're that broken.
They were simply suggestions to get the idea across. Balancing the powers is a different conversation
@@phoeaterz They need to just remove the if-then garbage and just have like 10 runes with unique stats for armor / wep / jewelry like runes in d2, which is what I think you're suggesting. Would love if a 'runeword' just added like 1 more bonus stat. Would keep the runes fun but not insanely broken because they still need to compete with 300 main stat...
No. The offering concept is not that big of a deal to me and they can keep it if they really want it. I am suggesting that they add the combos and give stats that is greater than the sum of the parts. Once they have that, they will have captured the essence of runewords.
runewords werent bad imo, runewords being so fkin strong that you would never think to ever use 90% of the items you have or will ever find made the endgame feel more generic. Wich could be good or bad depending on how deep your investment was. I could finish a best in slot character in a day or two because i didnt had to craft a perfect amulet or find a perfect stated once in a lifetime rare drop. Runewords allowed endgame builds in D2 to be streamlined for anyone with limited amount of time. Good or bad the developers who designed this system did it with clear passion for their craft, unlike we know who...
Bro.. You didn't need to burn those runes to make a point. That hurt.
It must be done.
It's cool he will just go and purchase more with real money
Sounds reasonable
POE 2 releases soon :)
And Titan Quest 2 ❤
@@Afura33 my dude!
@@hp5310 Hell yea brother
eat more pho!
Back at d2? Nice
Meh who cares. It's a great pillar for d4. I'm excited
Every time i see d2 purists praising d2 runes i cant help but imagine if they actually played the game. That system sucks.
Nostalgia is a powerful drug
🎯
Bear
D4bad sorry not sorry. Not a single item is fun interesting or exciting in d4. Plus there is no economy a year later.
I have a better solution for people who want d2 runewords: d2 is still there for them to play.
All the cry babies who say it should be like d2 should just go play d2.
I might be misunderstanding you but did you say at the end there that they could improve the D4 system by having them add an additional special effect when used together?
Isn’t that basically the same thing as D2 rune words but instead of adding like 4-6 affixes you would be adding one, without the names attached?
Not really, you ignored his whole other argument, which in D2 runewords replaced most Uniques and itemization became focused on the runewords themselves as any base white could be used for the system.
The effects are so powerful that using Uniques instead at or near endgame is just ludicrous and you'd only do it for extra challenge by handicapping yourself