When the Korean alphabet was created, ㅚ was really pronounced as the combination of ㅗ and ㅣ sounds as the writing ㅚ actually conveys. Over time it coalesced into just one vowel sound /ø/, a sound similar to German and Turkish letter ö. Just recently is when Koreans started pronouncing /ø/ as /we/, a process called Vowel Breaking, eventually merging with ㅙ and ㅞ. Hope that helps clarifying! 😊
This video doesn't cover the origins of these vowels, only how they're used nowadays. And correct! ㅚ is originally a combination of the vowels ㅗ + ㅣ (though not said that way anymore). I was tempted to add that to this video, but decided not to since knowing the vowel's origins isn't necessary to know why ㅚ has two pronunciations today. Maybe the topic of a different video?
The vowel sound that 외 conveyed used to be /ø/ which is like in turkish and swedish and it's still pronounced this way in north Korea They used two vowel letters for it cuz it makes sense
Thats interesting, but I learned it in a different way 🤔 Could you maybe share your sources? That would be interesting! If you search word with ㅗㅣ like 열쇠 or even better 회사 in naver dic and you click on the sound file, the voice will pronounce it in two different ways, but not in the way you described. One time it will sound like the "ancient pronounciation", you described and one time it sounds like the german "ö". I never actually saw anyone pronouncing it that way, but I was told, that this second pronounciation is a old way to pronounce ㅗㅣ. If you put "Hö" in the german google translate, it sound exactly like the 회 in the 회사 soundfile of naver. From my opinion this modern pronounciation where 외 sounds like 왜 is not part of the naver dictionary. What do you guys think about it?
You can read the two pronunciations in Naver dictionary. For example, 열쇠 shows [열ː쐬/열ː쒜], and 회사 is [훼ː사/회ː사]. I don't speak any German so I can't compare Korean sounds to German sounds.
@GoBillyKorean But if there is a soundfile with two different pronounciations, you would assume that they match the two pronouciations 열:쐬 and 열쒜. But that is not the case, if the pronounciation of 열쐬 and 열쒜, like you did it, is correct.
@@baum-jd6zj I listened to the two files, and they do match their written sounds. You can say ㅚ quickly (as the recording does) or more slowly. When said quickly, ㅚ is more like just "ㅔ." The same goes for the other diphthongs too (even ㅘ is often pronounced more like just ㅏ unless it's said slowly or extra clearly).
When I listen to the naver dic files I also clearly hear the german ö in the ㅗㅣ pronounciation. However when I try pronounce it that way in conversations natives don't seem to understand me. It might sound similar to me to "ö" as a german, but maybe to korean ears it sound very different? I think I will try to go to more of a ㅗㅐ pronounciation.
@@Niemja395 It's fine to compare sounds to other languages to help you hear them in the beginning, but past the beginning stages it's best to avoid doing that. Even the most similar sounds can be completely different. A really common example I see is ㅎ in Korean, which is not "H" and people who learn it that way end up pronouncing it strangely especially mid-word, and/or have issues with sound change rules involving ㅎ. An even more common example is with ㄹ being equated to "R" or "L."
When the Korean alphabet was created, ㅚ was really pronounced as the combination of ㅗ and ㅣ sounds as the writing ㅚ actually conveys. Over time it coalesced into just one vowel sound /ø/, a sound similar to German and Turkish letter ö. Just recently is when Koreans started pronouncing /ø/ as /we/, a process called Vowel Breaking, eventually merging with ㅙ and ㅞ. Hope that helps clarifying! 😊
This video doesn't cover the origins of these vowels, only how they're used nowadays. And correct! ㅚ is originally a combination of the vowels ㅗ + ㅣ (though not said that way anymore). I was tempted to add that to this video, but decided not to since knowing the vowel's origins isn't necessary to know why ㅚ has two pronunciations today. Maybe the topic of a different video?
@@GoBillyKoreanYes please!
The vowel sound that 외 conveyed used to be /ø/ which is like in turkish and swedish and it's still pronounced this way in north Korea
They used two vowel letters for it cuz it makes sense
You mean "Ö" right? I think turkish has no ø, does it?
@@baum-jd6zj ø is a symbol that is part of the international phonetic alphabet used to accurately transcribe pronunciation around the word
Before even that, it likely used to be pronounced /oj/
@@flatbreadjk Thanks! You said that it is still pronounced that way in NK. Do you have any source for this? I am just curious
"This is the more common way"...I see what you did there Billy!
I love a good Billy grammar deep dive 🙌🙌🙌
Now it makes sense
thanks for another great lesson!
Now, I, too, know the right way to weigh whey. I'm so sorry.🥶
두유 라이크?
Thats interesting, but I learned it in a different way 🤔 Could you maybe share your sources? That would be interesting! If you search word with ㅗㅣ like 열쇠 or even better 회사 in naver dic and you click on the sound file, the voice will pronounce it in two different ways, but not in the way you described. One time it will sound like the "ancient pronounciation", you described and one time it sounds like the german "ö". I never actually saw anyone pronouncing it that way, but I was told, that this second pronounciation is a old way to pronounce ㅗㅣ. If you put "Hö" in the german google translate, it sound exactly like the 회 in the 회사 soundfile of naver. From my opinion this modern pronounciation where 외 sounds like 왜 is not part of the naver dictionary. What do you guys think about it?
You can read the two pronunciations in Naver dictionary. For example, 열쇠 shows [열ː쐬/열ː쒜], and 회사 is [훼ː사/회ː사]. I don't speak any German so I can't compare Korean sounds to German sounds.
@GoBillyKorean But if there is a soundfile with two different pronounciations, you would assume that they match the two pronouciations 열:쐬 and 열쒜. But that is not the case, if the pronounciation of 열쐬 and 열쒜, like you did it, is correct.
@@baum-jd6zj I listened to the two files, and they do match their written sounds. You can say ㅚ quickly (as the recording does) or more slowly. When said quickly, ㅚ is more like just "ㅔ." The same goes for the other diphthongs too (even ㅘ is often pronounced more like just ㅏ unless it's said slowly or extra clearly).
When I listen to the naver dic files I also clearly hear the german ö in the ㅗㅣ pronounciation. However when I try pronounce it that way in conversations natives don't seem to understand me. It might sound similar to me to "ö" as a german, but maybe to korean ears it sound very different? I think I will try to go to more of a ㅗㅐ pronounciation.
@@Niemja395 It's fine to compare sounds to other languages to help you hear them in the beginning, but past the beginning stages it's best to avoid doing that. Even the most similar sounds can be completely different. A really common example I see is ㅎ in Korean, which is not "H" and people who learn it that way end up pronouncing it strangely especially mid-word, and/or have issues with sound change rules involving ㅎ. An even more common example is with ㄹ being equated to "R" or "L."