ALIEN - symbolism of the space jockey / dead pilot
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- Опубликовано: 9 сен 2024
- Detailed study of one of the greatest film props ever made.
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The sheer alien strangeness of the Space Jockey was definitely my fave part of the film as well. The hints of antiquity, and a vastly larger universe out there. Leaving it unexplained was a far better storytelling choice than spoon feeding an explanation to the audience
Well everyone wanted to know. A rushed explanation was in favor.
I remember being struck by Dallas saying the figure was 'fossilized' for the same reason.
Agreed
Couldn’t agree more.
It never should have been explained. Not in a movie at least. The shroud of mystery around it was what made it so terrifying and exciting. Too bad Ridley Scott didn’t understand his own concept.
When we saw the Space Jockey in the theatre, my friends and I uttered, "whoa" in unison. We talked about that thing for years. What an image.
The fact that you were able to see this movie in theaters is amazing
I always wanted to know what it was too.
@@CarloisBuriedAlive I saw it the theatres too. I knew nothing about it going in, except that the Alien was hostile.
We talked about it for years too man, really mysterious.
I was younger the day it was released in my country, that image gave me serious nightmares for days
I always imagined the "space jockey" to not be some specimen of an alien species, but to be an integral part of the spaceship itself. The whole ship seems to be one huge bio-mechanic machine.
Ditto. The space jockey seemed to be another part of the ship, critical to its operating. The “father” to the nostromo’s “mother.” Except the father was grown out of the chair where people in the nostromo could just sit down and get up when done using it. Most definitely my favorite scene in any sci fi movie. Forgive me Stanley Kubrick.
The part of this comment that would please me the most, had I been involved in the production, was 'I imagined'. Let the audience fill in the blanks. When done right, it makes for great cinema!
I think Farscape heavily borrowed that idea, though their 'Pilot' is a lot tinier.
I always imagined this same thing. Either the Pilot was a essential part of the ship, or the ship "grew" out of the pilot. Since the ship itself seems to be fossilized and "dead" just as the pilot is. Almost like it was once "alive"
Perhaps the ship itself was some kind of superior lifeform, with the pilot being horn from it but still attached to its 'parent' as part of a symbiotic relationship with the pilot carrying out the commands of the larger creature
I can imagine the Boneships as being a vastly powerful and completely alien form of life that lived in space, moving through the galaxy millions of years ago
There was a shiver that always went up my spine when they discovered the space jockey... the realization that here was something that lived an existence that we could not comprehend and that it lived a very long time ago (I always took "fossilized" to mean that the jockey had been there potentially thousands of years) just makes the whole thing SO much creepier and exciting.
By retconning the space jockey as "human" and then having David create the xenomorphs, there's nothing "alien" left about the whole situation anymore. I totally agree with you that the two movies should not be connected except in the mechanics of who produced and where the visual inspiration originated.
Well David did not created the xenomorphs
The book version of covernant confirns This
And the new Alien comics from marvel looks like is trying to bring that "Alien" feels back
You could say that the humanoid creatures in Prometheus could have discovered that machine from a past being and then used there technology.
The idea of climbing up into that chamber in complete darkness before the light on your space suit draws the great creature out of the shadows, and immediately, you're in shock at how surreal and incomprehensible this creature is
“By retconning the space jockey as "human" and then having David create the xenomorphs, there's nothing "alien" left about the whole situation anymore”
Ridley Scott is a master at not understanding his own films.
@@synthstatic9889that’s because he only directed the first film. He did not come up with the idea, write the script or design the creatures. It’s a shame Ridley Scott as claimed other people’s work as his own and is now destroying that very work by turning it into a dumb down boring AI creation myth
The space jockey is the most bizarre and haunting image in sci-fi cinema history
It really is.
The way that the chamber it is in has the unsettling ribs, almost as if they were all walking inside a giant living thing, makes it particularly eerie, too.
In **all** cinema history.....
@CipherRage0909 That's a fascinating theory, and I'm sure that Ridley Scott and Gieger had it in mind.
The moment the music does that odd strum as the room is shown for the first time left a life long impression on me as a kid! 👌👌
What about The Rock as CGI Scorpion King? LOL
The hinting of there possibly being a hyper-intelligent extra-terrestrial species out there somewhere in the universe - possible extinct even, was so fucking cool
..and then Scott shot that awe inspiring idea in the face with a double barrel shotgun.
We will never forget, Ridley!
Yeah that was one thing I really liked in Alien, the way venturing out into space felt extremely scary, venturing out into the great unknown. Humans were extremely small and vulnerable. It's something it had over Star Wars where everyone just zips around space like it's a big theme park. Alien had that same feeling of older fantasy adventures exploring the deep ocean or unexplored parts of earth, where it was really mysterious and frightening because of the vast unknown.
@@system-error Key difference being that Star Wars was at its core a fantasy series that happened to be set in space, rather then a horror.
... but nope. made by a robot named David. Fuck Prometheus.
We can only imagine what's out there in the vast darkness and silence of our own universe. Unimaginable beings wirh power that would drive us insane
-"Mr. Giger, we just need a new horror monster..."
-" *G E N I T A L S* "
And my latest creation ... It has a giant testicle head with nipples for eyes and penis's for teeth.
@@robag555Think about this, the empty chamber was full of tissue when it was alive. Think of a rib cage, empty when dead , full of all kinds of stuff when alive.
The Space Jockey is a completely different creature than what we saw in Prometheus.
Giger had far more vision than Ridley.
Elderly, self-satisfied Ridley...
- Young, hungry ('70s / early '80s) Ridley is a world-class director!
... also Damon Lindelof and his nonsense bullshit
Well, it's not like this was Scott's film entirely. The script wasn't written by him and the general idea goes back to Dan O'Bannon.
I had no idea so many people believed this interpretation that I had never heard before. I always thought everyone just accepted that it was an engineer... But I like it better as a mystery so much more. It speaks to larger things
Like you would know the difference between vision and delusion.
Such a cool image. Thankfully Prometheus came along to remove any sense of mystery and wonder.
Couldn't agree more!
And Covenant proceeded to throw away Prometheus' lore and drive through assassinating Shaw. I cannot wait for Ridley Scott's Rise of Skywalker of his prequel trilogy or whatever, where everything is thrown out the window.
How?
@@MCCrleone354 Well, at the end of Prometheus, Shaw set out to find out why the Engineers created mankind only to suddenly set out to destroy them. Perhaps because most folks theorized that the reason was vengeance for Space Jesus, Scott was compelled to not follow his promising journey proposed at the end. Perhaps he always envisioned a David-centered story, but I think most would agree that his 'Shaw's Terrifying Journey in Space' premise was exciting nonetheless. It was a somewhat welcomed departure from the familiar Alien story line without really getting rid of the Alien imagery. A new door to creativity.
I can understand fans and company heads forcing Scott to return the franchise to its Alien base, but Covenant seemed like a halt in the creativity put forth in Prometheus. Shaw could've been an endearing new character struggling with the sheer monstrosity of the Engineer world, but she seemed to be replaced by a bland Ripley-esque clone in the Daniels character. Don't get me wrong; I like Covenant for it's Scott aesthetics. I loved the Walter, David and Daniels relationship. It was just a step back...ironically.
Prometheus had it's bad points (Lindelof) but it was promising and new at the least. Covenant also had it's brazenly bad characters and their decisions, but I like to watch it again from time to time. It feels like the Last the Jedi of the series because of the betrayal (or erasure) of it's characters and it's 180 degrees turn of story. Maybe that was inevitable since it's supposed to be a prequel to Alien.
@wigglesza I just want the Neil Blomkamp Alien movie to come to fruition before we lose Sigourney Weaver and Michael Biehn. I guess it can have a comic book series, but I don't like that it's all owned by Disney now.
I always conceptualized the derelict as a formerly “living ship”. Even before I watched Prometheus I always thought of the space jockeys as a race of aliens who are so advanced bio-chemically that their machines can intermingle with their bodies in ways we haven’t even thought of yet. I imagine at some point they encountered a race with a far superior military force and as a result the jockeys were forced to feverishly produce weapons of mass destruction that backfired on them. I always felt Prometheus was a missed opportunity, it felt like an obtuse retread of Alien from a different angle. Covenant more so.
In Battlestar Galactica too
The superior military force...must have been the predators.
@@rattlejaw9976 not the predators. I don’t see AVP as canon to Alien.
You have your cannon and I have mine.
@@rattlejaw9976 more like Amengi or Drukathi, because they exist in Predator universe and are as strong and dangerous as Engineers
I was furious when they explained away the head as being a helmet of sorts. You are spot on with my opinion that this is not the same alien as that is definitely bone connected from head to chest in ALIEN.
I think so many original concepts were dumbed-down and/ or omitted to fit into a more simplistic film for the masses of today. He's right by calling it a mismatch.
Yeah but in prometheus arent there different evolved versions of the alien. Including an attempt to recombine ?
Prometheus was an absolute CF.
@@yrebrac Yeah but then I liked Blade runner 2.
Exactly.
prometheus reduced this mysterious bio-mechanical being that seams to be growing out of that chair and maybe a part of the ship itself, to just a humanoind albino alien in a suit.
Wrong. They found bones from the pilot. The engineers just replicated the pilots physiology and technology. The bones were the mystery. The engineers are still connected in an interesting way.
The saddest thing about this incredible sculpture is that the original was outside the theater during the premiere in Hollywood of Alien. My cousin was at the premiere and he said when they came out of the theater, some asshole had torched the sculpture and it had burned to cinders. A magnificent piece of art, gone in an instant.
Really! Wow!
What an arsehole. This sculpture would've gone great in a Giger Bar.
@@jocaerbannog9052 I ain't sure! I shiver at the thought of the creamy head for a pint of Guinness coming out of one of his penis shaped sculptures! That's a little too much symbolism to deal with when all you want is a nice pint! ;)
That is terrible, some people are just trashy.
Probably a religious freak
The biggest issue with the Space Jockey is his size...the genius move of using kids as adults in the original scene really made him appear gigantic, yet this simply wasn't the case when he appeared in Prometheus.
It really does look like two different Universes when you look at them side by side.
They're different species from what I've learned. Space jockeys are older and live for millions of years. The engineers are a newer species and smaller, with more human like features.
@@BadDreamFucker Prom date with Michael Fassbender's Alien aka Prometheus established that the Space jockey/Engineers are human with a 100% DNA match. Thus turning the Alien origin story into just another humanity origin story as if the world needed another religious perspective from earth to tilt the creative scales of the Alien "prequel" lie they tried to sell Alien fans.
The brilliance of Alien was it's mystery. The derelict space craft was never explained. The fossilized creature inside the craft was never explained. That was the point about the human's contact with the alien world; it was so alien that it made the humans feel unnerved. Nothing about the craft, its structure, its appearance was recognizable to them. Dallas even was that this is bizarre. Giger was a genius and what he designed as Rob says really was out of this world. Often other sci fi horror films involving aliens and extraterrestrial space crafts still look human I.e. in Carpenter's The Thing (one of my favourite films) the alien space craft we see from the beginning and than half way through the film still appears human in design. But the derelict in Alien looks so inhuman...almost organic and as mentioned in the making of Alien it looked like inside the of a beast. With Prometheus Scott messed up completely. He gave the space jockey human appearance...this ruined the whole film for me.
The name of the original movie "Alien" already underlines what makes it so strong. The xenomorph doesn't even have any classification, no lore, no explanation.
The more and further it's explained, the less "alien" The Alien becomes, and then it's just a franchise, toy figures, video game, a product . I don't understand how the F didn't Ridley Scott want to respect this. I'd like to believe that he does understand his own original movie. He was full of hubris thinking he could improve from original Alien without Giger, without respecting the mystery.
yeah the only tangible thing about the derelict in alien is that it looked like it was powered down/ in a coma or dead with only one room looking alive barely.
Lol Ridley Scott really messed it up.
@@AquaticAbominationYou're correct, even the immediate sequel "Aliens" despite being a fun action movie, just kills the mystery of the Alien and basically just turns them into giant parasitic wasps, with a nest and queen, well within human comprehension.
@@michaelblum410 Far more interesting than making the Engineer or Space Jockey a direct ancestor to humanity with a shared origin story in the "ALIEN" franchise of which absolutely nobody was questioning where humans came from. Ridley Scott fuqqed the pooch with prometheus and anyone that sides with him are creatively bankrupt themselves believing that black goop is the answer to everything life in the universe all amounts to the number 42 according to the braindead logic of the flat earther who loves the Prom Date with Michael Fassbender's Alien (Prometheus) fanbois.
I like that Giger sculpted the space jockey himself rather than his idea passed to someone else.
Too bad Giger's Idea passed over to a man that lit a torch to the entire theme of the space jockey by turning into a human being in a suit. Thats our Alien origin story according to canon established in Prometheus which is just another generic human origin story.
The soundscape to this scene really takes it to anyother level.
Good shout....and apt for yer name. heh heh.
I like the air of mystery the music conveys.
That's down to the genius of the late Jerry Goldsmith
I clearly remember the overwhelming sense of loneliness that came over me during that scene. That totally alien creature spending eternity in the silent darkness . I also think the engineer aspect ruins the space jockey.
Never thought of it this way, that's extremely eerie
The novelization of Alien was penned by Allen Dean Foster and was based on the original screen play. During the sequence where Ash's disembodied head is gurgling his last, the subject of the Space Jockey comes up. Ash has only a snippet of information about this unknown race for the remaining Nostromo crew. They are a noble race and perhaps someday, mankind will meet up with them. I have always felt the Space Jockey was a trucker, just like Ripley and Co. The Space Jockey and crew were hauling their deadly cargo as FAR AWAY as possible from known, occupied worlds. They mission ended in tragedy. I do not like Prometheus. It was a pointless and shallow effort. Ridley Scott suffers from Alien Alzheimer's. He failed to advance his own concept into something of substance. He should have remembered Ash's comment from the original screen play. I have not seen Alien Covenant. This series should have ended long ago.
Fox (now Disney) owns the franchise and everything in it. Basic entertainment law.
Prometheus was a money grab. It not only was boring and convicted, but destroyed the mystery of the first and second films. Best to be ignored or unseen, if possible.
I remembered that the most tantalizingly part of the novelization was when Ash suggested the xenomorph could be intelligent. Ripely or some other member of the crew asked if Ash communicated with it, and Ash replied “Let me take some secrets to my grave.” I always thought it was such a lost opportunity for the movies to follow up with, that the xenomorphs might actually be sentient. As far as I know I don’t think the comics ever followed up on that either.
As someone who fears developing Alzheimer's, I'm now much more afraid of developing alien Alzheimer's.
@@HiDesert004Big Chap act as something that may be intelligent but a kind of intelligence vastly different from humans. Something so alien that we could never understand or controll it.
I remember coming across that excerpt. It really is as impactful, if not more so, than Ash's famous statement about the xeno ("I admire its... purity.") The SJ being a trucker is a very interesting idea. The being and the species it was from fascinated me in that rare, special way only good sci-fi is capable of, to the point that it - combined with the origin of the xeno, because I'm still convinced there's some overlap - is what really drew me in to the series and kept me hooked.
Mostly just going off the "jockey" part of its name, and perhaps a throwaway remark by a member of the crew years ago saying something to this effect, I'd always seen the SJ and its species as nomadic spacefarers advanced first to a point of harnessing biotech, then after so much time (seemingly being an ancient civilisation) reaching a kind of singularity past which there ceases to be any real boundary between biology and technology.
I'd like to think this is a somewhat elegant solution, as it's potentially a coherent in-universe explanation for Geiger's otherwise entirely unreal art that's intentionally abstract, and indeed the film's psychology is so potent because of the way it weaves sci-fi realism with abstract biomechanical symbolism. Seeing the SJ as a trucker as you suggest, though, isn't just appealing as a parallel with the crew of the Nostromo, as it's at once compatible with the line of thinking I just described while explaining this particular specimen's situation of being found alone and dead - we can imagine "him" as an unremarkable individual who, while his species may be highly advanced and possibly even responsible for the creation of the xeno, is himself somewhat incompetent or just very unfortunate, depending on whether it would've been common for the SJs to collect and transport xeno eggs/specimens.
As for Prometheus... have to agree with you there as well. Scott having "Alien Alzheimer's" is a pretty reasonable (and amusing) way of seeing it. He really does seem to have gone the way of George Lucas, with age and success still being a competent filmmaker but losing a greater part of his creative flair, losing sight of what made the original so compelling and/or, becoming complacent - with no one around him (in Lucas' case, his first wife) capable of challenging his more questionable directions. Of course, simply becoming self-indulgent or even arrogant is also a distinct possibility, especially considering he said in an interview that he believed Prometheus to be "pretty good" (which, although it has its merits, it's just not).
Assuming you still haven't seen Covenant in the three years since your comment, it should go without saying that it's not worth watching except as a curiosity to fans so inclined. It's a continuation of Prometheus in the most disappointing and predictable way imaginable, doubling down on all the dubious elements of Prometheus while only digging itself a deeper hole that goes nowhere, rather than taking the opportunity and five or so intervening years to take stock and get back on track.
It's why I think the main reason is Scott having become out of touch to the point of completely disregarding the essence of Alien if he was even still conscious of it, insisting against all better judgement on his highly dubious and minimally cohesive exploration of plot devices (the xeno's origins, their evolution, the nature/involvement of the Engineers, etc.) that arguably should've either been left as mysteries open to interpretation or approached in a much more careful, measured, faithful manner. You would've thought I'd have learnt not to get my hopes up too much for long-awaited prequels from a filmmaker past his prime after Star Wars, but no.
Really, the fact that the SJ name - which was, to be fair, always only semi-official - was abandoned in favour of the far more generic and less interesting "Engineers" tells you everything you need to know about the prequels: the source material has been carelessly taken and twisted into a diluted, inferior form. Anyway, I'm just ranting at this point. Suffice it to say, you put forward some solid thoughts that show more appreciation for the franchise than its main creator apparently has nowadays.
The first two times I saw this movie, before I became a bit more knowledgeable about the sexual-technological themes in Giger's artwork, the "space jockey" visually registered for me as elephantoid. I imagined it was from some world where elephantoids, rather than humanoids, had gained the upper hand evolutionarily. I imagined that this species' form of technology required more corporeal fusing with machines than has been the case with humans (so far), because elephants don't have digits to manipulate complex buttons. I got all of that from a visual in one brief scene! Fast forward a couple decades and I actually wrote an entire book about elephants. Subcosnciously inspired by my (mis)read of the scene? Maybe!
Hmm. Very interesting co oinky dink ya think? Inspiration comes from surprising discoveries even self discovery.
Me too! Reminded me of a male elephant seal.
Giger said the jockey wasnt finished. And he was upset that he didnt have a chance to complete it.
And the sad thing is some DUMB ASS left a burning cigarette on it and the model caught fire and was destroyed
@Paul Wood I don't know I think Ridley would have actually seen it as the piece of art it was. It was a sculpture by an artist
Did he mention any details?
@@fuzzywuzzy1355 He is Ridley Twat.
@@fuzzywuzzy1355 where did u read it was a cig, I thought it was deliberately set on fire by some crazed religious freak who thought it was satanic
It is always the biggest mystery and sadly we may never get a proper prequel to set up how this came to be
I think it's better off without explanation. They already ruined it with those silly prequels saying it's just a guy in a space suit.
I think it's unfortunate that Prometheus and Covenant over-explained things that should remain unknown. I just consider them separate from the actual Alien franchise, more like a soft reboot. If not, then humans indirectly created the Xenos... and that's just disappointing.
An unexplainable creature killed by a Xenomorph, both from unknown worlds, much more intriguing.
Nailed it.@@darkwoods1954
@@espenstoro The only thing Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien (Prometheus) made me ask for at the end of the viewing was "Can I get my money back?" I don't even accept it as a valid entry to the sci-fi horror genre for how stupid it was.
The mystery of the space jockey is a highpoint of the film. There is a look of benign sadness about the skeletal being. That said, I think the whole film is great, the face hugger and chestburster are outstanding creations, featuring in some of the most memorable scenes in cinema
I don't believe there were any plans for a sequel when this came out, the Jockey was there to add a lot of genius mystery to the movie (and more weird Giger art), should have ended there
There were ideas for a sequel almost straight away. But when fox had a change of top executives, they weren't interested in Alien 2.
@@nutyyyy I didn't have that big of beef with Aliens it felt like a good continuance of the story and sure it introduced the concept of an alien nest and queen but it worked you may not love it but you cannot deny it was a huge success. I'd take it over Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien (prometheus) that gave the space jockey a human origin story that tampered with lore much more than adding a queen alien in my opinion..
Novice I watched the movie with...
Sees the space jockey: "Woah, is that the Alien?"
Sees the face-hugger: "Woah, is that the Alien?"
Sees the chest-burster:
-
-
"No way.... No f****** way!"
That 'novice' sounds exactly like my ex-girlfriend...!
You just don't get scenes like this anymore in movies. I don't care how good the CGI is, you can still tell its something that doesn't really exist, killing the immersion.
Agreed👍
The most far flung layered CGI that will ever exist: behold what we have created!!!!!!!!
Fibonachi Sequence: yeah....wow....I can almost not tell it is not physically real.....almost....
It always amazed me that people cannot tell the difference. I had a friend say that the animated Yoda from the SW prequels looked exactly like the puppet from ESB.... huh??
So true.
When I first saw this scene, very early during its original release, the movie had not yet got much word-of-mouth (I could be wrong but I believe it was a bit of a sleeper hit at the box office). So I didn't know what to expect. But with its superbly atmospheric build-up during the Nostromo crew's investigation of the alien ship--by itself already the strangest, most mysterious and "alien" thing I had ever seen on film--I was primed for some big reveal...and as the camera pulled back to show the monstrous scale (of whatever the hell that thing was), it literally took my breath away.
I later heard the machine was a telescope, probably very ancient, the seat occupant an astronomer, likely petrified. And I thought that was cool...but I didn't really much care one way or the other. I felt no need to further analyze the scene, content to just let it continue to work its magic on my obliviously ignorant imagination. And, despite all subsequent attempts to define most of these elements in canonical terms, I still don't need an explanation.
Don't get me wrong--I still appreciate discussion and commentary like this video. Especially intelligent, well-researched, logical and informative analysis like this. I simply wanted to add here that I, personally, get as much enjoyment (possibly more) from NOT *knowing* exactly what's going on in this particular scene as I might from a rational, literal explanation. I don't need everything to make sense or be perfectly coherent.
When I look up at the night sky, yes, I want to know what's out there. And I'm certainly filled with awe and wonder. But because I DON'T know, and I'm still basically just an animal--full of primal instincts, superstition, and blind fear of the unknown--I'm also scared. It is precisely that rich mix of spine-tingling mystery, awe, wonder and fear that keeps me watching the skies. (BTW, nice work; kudos and thanks.)
Cheers, Despite making the vid it still holds the same allure for me too.
you must be old as fuck if you saw this in the movies
Mystery Science Theatre said it best by Tom Servo : KEEP WATCHING THE SKY! KEEP WATCHING THE SKY!
HR Giger is my favorite artist, I saw a complete collection of his works in the sickest quality print in a book store in russia when I was like 14. My life was never the same since.
The space jockey scene is something you almost forget about in how stunning and mysterious it is. Never ceases to amaze an adds such depth to one of the best films ever made. Shame they made the new ones really.
When it comes to the films after Aliens, I view Alien 3 and Resurrection as PTSD nightmares that Ripley is having during the return back to Earth. As for Prometheus and Covenant, I see those films as part of a different universe. Alien 1 & 2 tell a complete story and end on a very satisfying note.
Indeed. 👍
Kind of like Godfather 3
2 isn’t canon.
Totally ruined by Prometheus explaining it as just a guy in a space suit.
If the alien that emerged from Kane was terrifying, then imagine the one that emerged from the Space Jockey....
And what happened to it...
I don’t remember the movie much, but I’d think “is there a singular unique alien in Alien that may have come from the jockey?”
@@minicle426 possibly still roaming LV-426
I've always wondered about the alien that came out of him..that one mysterious alien is more interesting than the prequels.
I wonder if it was a queen that laid all those eggs.
It was alien. Then Ridley turned it into a big grey human.
I laughed at this comment cause I thought you were talking about the franchise name. "Big grey human" doesn't have quite the same ring to it
@@crowstakingoff "Went to the cinema last night"
"What did you see?"
"Big Grey Human"
"Oh? ....But what film did you see?"
Not human. Humanoid. The original space jockey has humanoid traits aswell
@@Romano2018 even the xenomorph is humanoid. Promotheus and Covenant are shit, and they made the franchise worse. Not that og fans care much, as much as we are concerned Alien ended with the first film, period.
Ridley is a major bodybuilding fan. He usually goes to shows and helps the male contestants oil up
What sticks out to me is that the whole design of the telescope apparatus, when taken in in full, resembles a *microscope.*, with the seat in place of a petri dish. As if the pilot themselves are being scrutinized and studied by something even more large and incomprehensible.
I like the line of reasoning you are following here. In a sense what you are describing with the Space Jockey and the telescope is a sort of rape machine. It is trapped in this and is compelled to perform its activities within this device. It symbolically externalizes the condition of living things within the larger framework of the uncaring universe with the idea of rape substitutable with any biological necessity that consciousness must confront. And it does this without answering the questions of function or purpose. The fact that the Alien appears to have used the Jockey as a host further subverts notions of purpose or design on the part of the Space Jockeys race. This is truly a brilliant and evocative enigma which lies at the heart of why this movie is so great.
Great Analyst - and certainly makes me look at the "Space Jockey" in a new light. Another detail from the Nostromo "Womb-room" , I believe the computer was actually called "Mother."
I was always fascinated by what the jockey hints at since I first saw the movie as a child - civilizations superior to ours thousands of years before us, the fusion of bio and mechanical life as the next step of evolution, unknown business and politics among star systems... They completely destroyed it with the simplistic rewriting of the narrative in the new series. Everything must be explained, no hints and mysteries are to be left for imagination.
Making the engineer/space jockey just another man in a suit within that Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien aka Prometheus obliterated the original lore setting fire to it and hoped people would like what came out the ashes sadly there were only ashes nothing left to appreciate when transforming the idea of Alien origin story to mean Human origin story. Ridley Scott fucked up huge with that miscalculation his hubris and arrogance has wrought.
I always thought the large machine the jockey sits in was a medical device that failed to remove the facehugger and/or chest burster. Prometheus messed that idea up.
Too distracted with gadgets and gizmo's we parish. Eaten away from the inside. That is the subtext. A critique on modern, urban life and our relation to (often increasingly intimate) technology.
That's an interesting idea. A medical device failure.
@Rob Ager: You always add another dimension to any film I've seen & thought I understood.
Rob, one of the biggest travesty of the prequel was Ridley abandoned most of the ideas from Prometheus and gave us that ratchet movie Covenant. What was in Prometheus could've lead us to what happened to the space jockey. I will NEVER accept David as the creator of the Alien. Never.
Also, the idea of ancient aliens being responsible for mans' evolution is a personal pet hate. As much as I love Scott's films, I can't abide by anyone who takes that idea seriously!
"Go do an image search for Giger artwork..." - do *not* do this at work, kids.
Great video as always, keep up the good work.
Prometheus ruined it for me. Watching it I could feel the mystery and fun evaporate.
@Dominus Illuminatio Mea Well, he's right, 30+ years of mystery so Scottie would came out with "A retarded looking albino bodybuilder in a suit LMAO". One of the biggest flops and let downs in cinema history.
@Dominus Illuminatio Mea 😘
There are some good idea in Prometheus and Covenant.. unfortunately none of them are as good as the idea of the alien evolving on its own to be the ultimate predator.
I've seen Alien so often that the prequels have barely registered enough to destroy it. But it would have been really nice if those movies had made any sense and maintained any of the original mystery.
AvP is, weirdly, a much better Prometheus, imo. There's a logic there, despite its own issues.
@@jneilson7568 AVP doesn't even register in the same universe its just another fan fiction more of a predator's fan fiction because they made it into the good guy and when you do that the other side naturally has to be the punching bag to make said good guy look badass. AVP did just that it glorified predator to such heights that just trivialized the xenomorph even more than that idiot pulling brain matter out the back of his head to look at it before dying to the alien teeth tongue attack moments before within that Reserrection film. Romulus came out recently and it panders to the covenant black goo concept and engineer human xeno hybrid nonsense I just wish they would stop fucking the lore with that black goop shit or the pasty white albino body builder engineer who isn't of alien origin. As Critical Drinker put it "fuck off film"
When seeing the space jockey for the first time in 79, I got the same exhilarating and pulse quickening reflex that I did when seeing the mother ship for the first time in Close Encounters of the Third Kind. An experience I'll never forget.
I got that same thrill in the cinema from seeing the Star Destroyer passing overhead in the opening seconds of Star Wars. Wow! 😲
And 2001, the Stargate
Symbolism of space jockey:
Jockey is big and the alien took him out.
Older crew failed against the Alien
Space is stranger than we think- what is the jockey, what is the instrument he is using - beacon, telescope, weapon?
Size of jockey and strangeness - shows the human crew is out of their depth.
Prometheus is crap.
Some thoughts on seeing it in the theater.
At the time:
Star Trek was a dead series.
No films yet,
No TNG,DS9,VOY,et cetera.
E.T. did not exist....yet.
Spielberg’s most successful film
so far was Jaws and there had only been one Jaws movie made
at that point.
(Alien was originally pitched to studios as “Jaws,but in space!”)
Raiders of the Lost Ark
did not exist yet...
at all.
Star Wars was A film,
NOT a franchise...
yet.
Alien was a breathtaking experience-
there was no CGI (yet),
there were no cell phones-
mobile phones were bulky,complicated temperamental and EXPENSIVE with next to no service....
and they were just PHONES.
They were mobile in as much as they were attached to a car.
Atari made the only real home video games-
Video Pong was a poor alternative option and that one would often damage your TV screen that you hooked it up to if you played it
too much or left it on and walked away...
It would burn up the pixels
in such a way
that you would permanently see the score numbers and field design when you tried to watch regular tv again...
VCR’s didn’t even exist yet,
not even the VHS tape version.
No Nintendo,Sega,Gameboy,etc.
Virtually no one had
a home computer.
Mobile computers didn’t exist-
programs came on cassette tape.
Digital watches were a futuristic novelty-
people could still tell time and kids learned cursive writing.
Sooo....
try watching the Original “Alien” again and imagine how that would have seemed to a child of that era.
I saw it at night alone in the
Center Cinema in Lafayette,LA.
It was a big deal for me since it was
rated R and I got to see it alone...
since I was underage.
I saw it on the newly opened
third screen...
having more than one screen was a big deal,3 was rare and I had never heard of a theater
with more than 5 screens...
yet.
That theater opened the year
I was born-
it no longer exists today.
CazMatazz
Would you prefer rambling run-on
“sentagraphs” like most people use now?
I wanted to keep the statements separate-
so,
that’s my preference.
Likewise,
you are free to write however you please.
Peace,
-g
CazMatazz:
Is there any particular reason that I should take you seriously?
I’m not most people.
👍too bad there's no option to save comments on youtube
Ficer Ed:
Thank you for your kind words.
The best thing that I can recommend for that is
a screen shot!
Ficer Ed:
I have never bothered to do this before but I’ve never gotten a comment like yours before.
I posted it for you
in the picture section
of a Facebook page
that I have.
DeathValleyMonsterTruck
It’s in the largest section-
“Mobile Uploads”.
(as well as “Timeline”,of course!)
You can “copy and paste it”
there if you actually so desire.
I’m not really expecting you
to do anything with it
but I just wanted you to know
how much I appreciate
knowing that someone out there
actually got something out of it!
☝🏿🤠👍🏿
Thank you again-
It’s always nice to find someone who understands and appreciates what you have to say...
and can look beyond grammatical, spelling or other “imperfections”!
The space jockey always appeared to me to have suffered a similar fate as Kane with something bursting out of its chest. It’s still possible it is an engineer with a bio-mechanical suit that kept growing long after it’s death into the chair and then fossilized. Perhaps atmospheric changes effected the suit as well as the ship which is bio-mechanic as well. The point could be to show that the technology is so advanced that it is also partially organic, like human/cybernetic fusion.
hell naw get that human origin story far and away from my Alien franchise enjoyments you'll poison them with your shit logic to put stupid humans into every sci-fi how about we leave humanity behind and make a truly out of this world Alien flick but no you flat earthers want chariots of the gods booshit.
The idea of man being 'fused' with their own machines was a nod to 2001 I felt. The propaganda of 2001 about man reaching boldly into the cosmos turned out to be just that, propaganda. The truth is man would be stuck out in space doing a shitty job for a corporation. Man would never be free of the machine, nor would he be free of the agencies that controlled the technology. You could have the music that opens the Jupiter mission sequence over the beginning of Alien and it would fit perfectly.
It's kinda funny because in Aliens intro scene the music is straight out of Space Oddysey Jupiter mission
@@T--kq3pj Yes, you're right. It's very mournful. I have heard PT Anderson use a similar piece too. Have a search for the 'Prospectors Arrive' scene in There Will Be Blood. The use of it there is similar to the Jupiter mission opening in 2001. Plainview is giving his speech about the benefits his oil well will bring to the small town (while the film shows his men arrive at the train station to begin work) ie his propaganda bit that will ensure the locals allow him to drill, but the mournful score suggests another, less celebratory tone.
Ridley Scott should never have used the space jockey in the prequels. The fact that they are 'mere' white translucent bodybuilders really takes away the mystery and awe of the jockey in the first alien film.
The space jockey should have NEVER been explained. The alien mystery of it's appearance should have lasted for all time.
YASSS!
There is no way this jockey was an engineer screw what Ridley Scott has ever said about it
Loved the mystery, mystique, depth and wonder of this scene. Always have. I was fascinated by the way the crew seemingly weren't that bothered by an extraterrestrial being.
I alaways thougt the pilot reminded me of an Elephant
And the Elephant symbolizes memory and wisedom
So i Think They did that on purpose to show it was a wiser and lager creature than humans
Agreed.
In some of the early Dark Horse Alien comics you see this character's species, and they look like elephant creatures.
@@RighteousBrother and they ended up winning in the end
@@bordaz1 No they didn't. We got that Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien (Prometheus) garbage that retconned the lore of the space jockey to be nothing more than the white man in a suit. According to Prometheus's bowel movement of a movie they're a 100% match to human DNA. *insert critical drinker's "fuq off film"*
The Space Jockey always appeared to be semi-fossilised, giving it a stone-like appearance suggesting that it has been there for a very long time.
This could be bone, as you suggest, or it could be xenomorph extrusion, or it could be composed of decayed technology (of the kind shown in Prometheus), or it could be a combination.
We know that a facehugger is easily able to grip to a human’s smooth space suit helmet and to eat its way inside. A human in a large, bulky helmet is about the same size as the Jockey’s head, so a facehugger would have no trouble in attaching, and then detaching (so there’s no sign of it when the skeleton is discovered) to the Jockey.
If we assume the Jockey is a pilot then the “telescope” must be a control interface, but there’s no evidence that it was a pilot. What if the Jockey was actually a “sacrifice” and the “telescope“ was a delivery mechanism for the egg (hence the bulbous shape?). Maybe it picked up eggs from the lower area and “delivered” them directly into the face of the restrained sacrifice?
Why? To create and unleash the ultimate weapon.
Just a theory...
I think what is unique is, the space jockey represents the rational life you expected to find in a traditional Sci-Fi movie. Instead, what we get is a terrifying creature, which is actually even more mysterious, and it worked. What bothered me most about Prometheus was that they made too strong of a connection with humanity. They were humanity's reason for cognitive development. They should have been kept as strangers just expressing the diversity of life in the universe
Please keep making movie analysis videos. I find your observations insightful, and interesting. This channel is sure to continue growing with subscribers.
My assumption on Space Jockey before Prometheus was it's a large humanoid with elephant trunk hanging from face and is able to bend his legs inside what i personally call a "navigation chair" and once this being died it could have partially melted into the seat either decay, extreme heat for potential fire inside the ship when it crash landed, there is much room for many possibilities of how it became to be like that aside the obvious Alien "infection".
The space jockey is very old. I've had as much experience with ancient humanoid bio-mechanical technology as the next Earthbound humanoid so I'm not really sure what an organic flight suit meant to conjoin the pilot to his craft would look like after having been decomposed for a few thousand years. Didn't Dallas say that it almost appeared fossilized? All melted together. Decomposing bio-mech space suit.
Maybe it only looked like that because it was cocooned by the alien
They never hinted or indicated that it was a suit, quite the contrary.
@@NitpickingNerd Or maybe none of that. Thats the beauty when you don't have a film like Prometheus that just shoves down your throat the explanation that no body wanted...A human origin back story.
I really wish that they did try to explain any of the species in the Alien franchise, it spoilt the mystery that made them so iconic.
From the moment I saw it in 1979 I felt the space jockey had become petrified, stone-like, rigid and hard like its surroundings due to it being incomprehensibly ancient.
Just blew my mind about the connection between the space jockey room and the room containing Muther. Wow amazing.
The "spine to the forehead" in Giger's art looks like a breathing tube or some similar artificial device and not an organic spine.
Yes it does and yet he constructed and dressed the prop himself, turning into into an organic connection.
@@robag555 interesting
@@robag555 I'm with you on every other part of the analysis but, yeah, what you describe as a "spine" looks just like an air hose going to where the jockey's nose would be. It mimics the hoses entering into the base of the neck/back of the head. While its ribs do join up to it, those are the bio and the breathing hose is the mecha they're connecting to. Further, it doesn't actually look like a spine, but a segmented air hose. It biomechanically joins to the nose and the two merge on the bridge of the forehead. It's just not a terribly persuasive interpretation and it kind of weakens the more interpretive points of your analysis.
A true classic full of mystery, The hole melted in the floor that Kane went down had me thinking the space jockey had wounded an adult alien
An aspect of Alien I seldom read or hear about is how humanity is portrayed as hapless and functional. Even in 1979, most of modern society lived life according to a corporate hierarchy where considerations for individual needs are reduced and compartmentalized. We see this with the structure of the Nostromo and its hierarchical ranking amongst the crew. The Alien's presence completely exposes this for what it really was all along with the revelation of Ash and his directive.
The prometheus retcon works. We don't know what materials the suits are made of, what fluids or resin ooze from the suit or the chair over time, what effect being exposed to the air of a primordial atmosphere has etc. The appearance of bones may be due to calcification or just an illusion
Scott doesn't have the faintest idea what the Alien pilot and the resulting alien creature killing everyone was about. Giger created a truly alien world into a movie that had some cool mysterious concepts even in the script. Scott thought the jockey was a suit and the ship was a bomber even though the concepts were leading towards creatures beyond our understanding, a temple of sorts harboring these eggs/jars and the ship crashed on it thus revealing an entrance to the egg chamber. Not to forget the egg morphing. Cameron fucked that up with making the aliens into common oversized bugs.
Cameron's offense to the works were much better received than Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien (Prometheus) Ridely Scott really put the fuck to the Alien lore making the engineers albino muscle body builder humans with a human origin story yeah just what the Alien franchise needed to answer was where humanity came from as if there wasn't already tons of literature on that very premise we have numerous religions on earth still operating right now selling the answers to that fucking question that no Alien fan ever asked for.
If you ask me which director tossed a nuclear bomb onto the original concept of Alien it would be Ridley Scott and this love affair with Michael Fassbender who obliterated the lore. At least Aliens felt like if belonged in the same universe unlike that prom date with michael fassbender's alien boolshittery Prometheus that movie nuked the concept from orbit
Interesting analysis and yes food for thought. My own observation on the "space jockey" creature, the ship and the alien itself is that it must have been an intention choice that H.R. Geiger was responsible for all the designs. His unique style is reflected in all three, suggesting to me that the Alien and the "space jockey" creature share some common heritage. The alien, alongside the alien ship and the "space jockey", looks like it is in a habitat that suits its design. It would blend in well with everything around it. In Aliens, I think they retroactively added the idea that the aliens created a secretion that made the walls of their hive resemble the interior of the alien ship in the first film. Possibly the first film proved more lucrative than they had anticipated and were looking for a way to revisit the world - to me the mystery of the alien has only been diluted by its sequels. Not that I didn't enjoy Aliens, but to my mind, the cosmic horror of the organism suffers from being overly explained.
I agree that the space jockey is not meant to be interpreted logically, but to communicate subconsciously. Beyond the demonstration of the face hugger here, what matters is how it hits us beneath our conscious understanding. To me, the themes of organic-technology fusion, alienation and loneliness, technology over natural beauty, and natural brutality and violence really come through in the scene. Whatever dramas exist in this alien world, nature is cold and brutal -- that's what I take away from this scene.
Ridley Scott has put some greatness on screen...but he doesn't get that you don't have to explain EVERYTHING
I'm 59 and saw this in theaters when released, and have since watched this easily once a year going back to VCR days. The scene you depict at @5:47 - when the audience gets a close look at the space jockey's head, in it's decomposed state, with light and shadow tricking your eye into wondering if you saw it move - or might move, has stuck w/ me to this very day. It was the anticipation of horror that was so palpable...the foreshadowing of some very bad shit.
The feeling is ominous. Disquiet.
There is another symbolic rape scene in which Ash tries to choke Ripley to death by shoving a magazine that has been curled up like a phallic symbol down her throat. Very interesting interpretations and parallels.
Scott absolutely destroyed the allure of the jockey with Prometheus. I didnt even watch Covenant because I just dont care for the story anymore.
I used to speculate what the Jockey was. Maybe an engineered organism whose only purpose was to pilot the ship? Hence its lack of legs. Maybe it could leave the chair and pull itself through the ship using those elongated arms? Or maybe the jockey is the "brain" and the ship is its "body"? So many more interesting things could have been done with this other than "Its big, white, humanoid, space Jesus in a suit".
I would have much rather seen an Alien homeworld a biomechanical planetoid that births juggernaut ships and all other biomechanical entities that have a specific function to perform. A story more akin to Forbidden Planet just replace Robby the Robot with an android character and the rest human explorers who find's this biomechanical world in a state of stasis that is until the planets auto immune system is triggered by the explorers where the horrors begin to make their presence known with lethal results. Something like that would have suited me better than Prom Date With Michael Fassbender's Alien (prometheus)
@@lunarvvolf9606 See, fans of the genre come up with better stories than Ridley did.
@@hullbreach33 couldn't agree with you more on that front. What Ridley Scott did was take the flame thrower to the xenomorph lore himself with the most half assed story to literally merge human and alien origins together instead of being their own separate origins.
Prometheus is a prime example of how trying to explain what was never meant to be explained just always goes wrong.
We were never supposed to get an Alien prequel. These creatures were a mystery and should have remained as such, because the mystery is what captures your attention. You have so many questions while looking at this ship, trying to figure out what the pilot was, how they got there, were they born in that chair or forced into it, etc. As you said.
But when you start answering questions, the mystery goes away, and it often doesn't make any sense because unanswerable questions aren't supposed to have answers. Writers often cut corners when making new films or games in an exceedingly popular franchise and are rarely the original people who worked on that original successful film or game.
So what you wind up with is some dude who has no idea what he's talking about trying to give an answer to a question he probably doesn't even care that much about and wants to put his own spin on it. That's how you get some biomechanical suit that doesn't fit with what we saw in the original. Even if it was somehow Ridley Scott himself that got involved in that aspect and thought "yeah that's better", it still shows a lack of respect on not just the original source material (death of the author being a relevant topic here, but let's not get into that), but also the fans of the original film.
He thought this new idea was better than giving fans a satisfying explanation.
I don't want to go on a long rant, because ultimately it's just a work of fiction and you can ignore Prometheus' existence (and you probably should) if it really bothers you, but just because it doesn't really matter doesn't mean it doesn't matter at all or that it can't. If it bugs you, complain away.
Personally, I'm pretty detached from the Aliens franchise. I like it, but I'm not obsessed with it, so while I don't care for Prometheus much, I can at least separate myself from it all pretty easily, but if this were a franchise I *did* love like I love the Thing, for example, I would probably tear it apart for every mistake. But even in that case, I didn't mind the Thing prequel all that much. I feel like they did a decent job outside of the obsessive CGI effects they threw in that ruined the quality of it. It's nowhere near on the level of the original, it lacks a lot of the paranoia and mystery (being set during the day for any of the truly paranoia-driven scenes, rather than in the dark, was a huge mistake for one; it didn't deliver the tone of the creeping dread, that feeling like you're being slowly surrounded and something could happen at any moment), but it was still entertaining at least.
I will forever throw mud at Prometheus fans who simp for the concept of a human origin story and their advocacy for the complete removal of the xenomorph from their Prometheus prequels. Those prometheus freaks are like the SJWs complaining about Star Wars fans being bigots for not liking the woke bullshit pushed in movies these days. I won't even see Romulus because it panders to that black goo concept born from that Prometheus garbage lore. I just settled on spoiler reviews to get the jist of that movie.
Got to say I’ve been reading a lot of jung and you could apply his theories to this movie. He has talked a lot about the “terrible mother” archetype we must break free from to live individually. A lot of the mother symbols or feelings connected to it are symbolized as libido. So when I heard Cain (symbolic name too?) say he remembered suffocating after the alien, it seemed more like a terrible mother symbol. As the mother is often symbolized with creepers and being suffocated by water or plants. So couldn’t we also say that the whole plot is breaking free from this “terrible mother” as ripely manages to do in the end?
Very good analysis of one of the great mystery concept in cinematic art design!!!
It's not alien anymore. This is us now. Transhumanism. Wait til Bill and his pals are done wit us. Our Grandchildren may look just like this, if humanity makes it that long. Edit: Sorry Rob. Don't mean to offend your Metabunk soul. I'm sure Snopes would have a better explanation. I do love your work, so I hope you aren't too angry that I've taken the obviously dubious approach of distrusting our kind powers that be. They so clearly care for the greater good.
The dome like cockpit with the jockey in its space suit that looks like it's grown into a projector like contraption is a symbol for the Thalamus Region of the brain also known as The Eye of Horus. The weird shape of the spacecraft, when look upon at the right angle. Gigers artwork (1:10) also certainly indicates he was working with this idea. The Thalamus is where our consciousness, our Kundalini, enters into the physical realm. The jockey has grown into the chair as to symbolize our fixation into this location in our bodies both on a physical as spiritual level. The bursted chest is a metaphor for what Giger thought of our true nature breaking free from the enclosure of the mind.
Personally, I like trying to come up with headcanons to justify why the space jockey in Alien looks too much like a biological creature and is too big compared to the actual engineers that we see in Prometheus (as well as trying to find ways so that the AVP films are still canon since those films introduced me to both franchises as a kid and I was allowed to watch the first movie because it was PG-13).
Update: In case anyone gets the wrong idea, when I make headcanons, I don’t take them seriously nor treat them as fact. It’s not like I’m treating them as legitimate theories and trying to convince everyone (or anyone) that they should be taken as serious theories.
The 'theatre of the mind'. We all do this. Indeed, some of the best films are those that either allow, encourage or require the viewer to fill in the blanks so to speak. It's why I love sci fi so much.
My headcanon is that it's a head cannon
Dmitry Terek Geez, calm down. It’s not like I’m acting all defensive about this and saying “No, it’s all connected you moron!”
@Dmitry Terek gosh that sounds fun🤔
@Dmitry Terek I don't live in a city or the US, so I dunno how you deduced all that you did from four words.
As a kid that was the most captivating scene for me. I would rewind that scene many times.
Same with the trophy room scene at the end of predator 2
Definitely my favourite movie set ever, and some nutter set it on fire as they thought it was the devils work.
I mean the space jockey was burned outside a film theatre where the movie was being showed for i guess the first time and they sat the space jockey at the theatre and some Christian type thought it was the work of the devil and set it on fire. A work of art like that and some idiot just thinks he or she knows better and does that.
@@transmissionggb2820 I don't want to derail your hate rant too much, but do you have some evidence that it was "some Christian type"? Cause after a quick search I only find several statements that it was caused by a cigarette accident. Aside from that I found several people asking for evidence regarding the version that you bring up - as there does not seem anything credible - just rumors spread by demagogues, who blame people they disagree with.
@@DoubleBob Okay docky.
@@transmissionggb2820 So, no evidence. Why are you spreading lies and blaming random groups of people with baseless accusations?
@@DoubleBob aye no problem I still have no idea what the fuck you are talking about.
That creature is at least 12 feet tall. When you watch Prometheus, it's like Ridley Scott completely forgot his original masterpiece.
I think the entire derelict ships in Alien and Prometheus are bio-mechanical. That's what the humanoid Engineers do... they make bio-mechanical stuff.
Therefore, I think the Space Jockey helmet and tube are also bio-mechanical and subject to degradation. I bet if they cracked open the Space Jockey helmet/skull, they would have found another skull inside it.
I don't think what we see in Prometheus matches what's in the first movie, but did notice the engineers in prometheus seem to have "clothes" that are blended into their flesh.
@@robag555 Thanks for replying! I agree. The design was changed / improved upon. But the principle is the same. The helmet and armor are bio-mechanical IMO.
@@robag555 lmao, they are pressure suits. Get your facts right!
The space jockey was actually given a living appearance in the earth war trilogy. He will never be a engineer to me.
ALIEN proved Lovecraft can't be effectively adapted without extremely strong visuals.
I'm sorry, but your claim doesn't make any sense. Why would you even want to prove a negative?
@@KajiCarson It's the claim of the screenwriter of ALIEN, Dan O'Bannon, not me. He, like his friend H.R. Giger, were Lovecraft aficionados. Here's a quote from Dan: "It's very, very difficult to achieve that tone in film. I'm not sure anyone had. I tried very hard on ALIEN to do that, to do, erm... ALIEN was strongly influenced tone-wise by Lovecraft, and one of the things that it proved it is that you can't adapt Lovecraft without an extremely strong visual style. It has to be very very stylized and very particular. What you need is a cinematic equivalent of Lovecraft's prose; that's the problem, that's very hard to achieve. Lovecraft can't be adequately adapted for ordinary cinematography at all."
@@bingerz237 Ah, I see. Regardless, claiming something from one's opinion and having "proved" it are two separate issues - particularly when talking about future movies that haven't been released. We have no idea how next generations of filmmakers will interpret Lovecraft. Sorry for being a stickler about this. ;)
Amazing analysis once again Rob!
Given that you're a fan of John Carpenter, I was wondering after this if you could try to do an analysis of his film Christine based on the novel of the same name by Stephen King. Surprisingly, despite being a relatively good film, it's one that's not even talked about much by Carpenter fans.
Watched Christine about 6 months ago after about a 30 yr gap and it holds up really well. Will give it another watch but not sure if I can find the time to read the book again - King's books tend to drag on and on.
Rob Ager Cool. I'd say that after The Thing, Christine is my favourite Carpenter film. But anyways, while I do understand and ironically tolerate people rejecting the idea of sexual messages, imagery and innuendos in Alien, if they were intended by the crew, then I'll accept it for sure.
Well done, kind sir. Perfect symbolic juxtaposition.
Hey Rob, I've been watching a lot of your videos lately and I was interested in your reasoning behind disliking the hateful eight. Do you reckon it's just too slow or underwhelming?
I didn't mind it because I like a lot of the actors.
I also wonder of your opinion on the film Chinatown.
Keep it up!
You are my favourite film related RUclips channel:)
That Movie was f*king Amazing! One of Tarantino's Best imo.
On FaceBook, yes, he has said that Hateful Eight was really too slow, but also the story, dialogue and acting are below par for Tarantino films. Worst film he has ever done, I'm afraid. And he really likes Chinatown. Even though Polanski has been an arsehole, he did very good movies.
@@jocaerbannog9052 LMAO that movie had the best dialouges imo.
@@jocaerbannog9052 thanks a tonne!
I respect the stance but I disagree with any certain claim it's his worst film. There is some argument there probably because they are all pretty good. Either way, I'm interested to learn more of Rob's criticism on generally popular stuff:)
@@jothishprabu8 "Well, I used the same soap you did, but my towel don't look like a f**king Maxi-Pad!"
The deleted scene of the nest forming, digesting the crew... THAT is the real horror. Like a mold that you can never, ever, fully remove.
After Ridley kept digging his hands into the story the space Jockey (probably one of the most thought provoking sequences in any sci fi movie) no longer has any deep meaning. The explanation provided by Ridley is assinine and what should have been left alone is now ruined. What he did to Alien is on par with what George Lucas did with Star Wars in his old age. Lightning does not strike 5 times in a row.
Nathan Hassall Indeed. Old men should leave the artistic creations of their youth well alone. As RLM pointed out, the originals were a collaboration of many talents (Giger, Cobb, Shussett, and Scott etc) whereas Scott had total control over all aspects of the prequels with no-one to challenge his diktats - and boy did it show.
Unlike Alien and Prometheus, the Star Wars prequels expand the mythos of the Original trilogy without major alterations. The prophecy is the main thing that contradicts the first movies.
And don't give me any of that midi-chlorian crap, it doesn't necessarily ruin or demistify anything.
@@dzhonazsen9620
The magic and mystery of the Force reduced to Midi-chlorians.
One of the coolest villains in cinema history reduced to an annoying whiny brat who can’t act.
Darth Vader designed and built C3PO !! (completely ridiculous lore-breaking universe-reducing lazy writing)
Droids get honoured by the queen as if they were human.
Jedi training looks like kiddies exercise class at the local gym but with mini-lightsabers.
Jedi are a bunch of boring sexless weirdos.
“This weapon is your life”.
No - Lucas didn’t break anything.
@@brickmissing8295 It's not reduced at all. The Force is in no way explained via midi-chlorians.
_One of the coolest villains in cinema history reduced to an annoying whiny brat who can’t act._
He's only cool since the second movie - Empire. Otherwise, he was just some guy taking orders.
_Darth Vader designed and built C3PO !!_
Lame as fuck, but doesn't outry contradict anything. He didn't design it either, he basically just repaired a droid of that class.
_Droids get honoured by the queen as if they were human_
So?
_Jedi training looks like kiddies exercise class at the local gym but with mini-lightsabers._
Lame as fuck, but doesn't outry contradict anything.
_Jedi are a bunch of boring sexless weirdos._
They're based on several warrior organisations, including the templars. Warriors are "weird" in the sense that they are highly spiritual and generally don't stray from their chosen path.
And don't give me that bullshit line by Mace Windu as contradictory evidence. If anything, that line serves to show how far gone the Order had become.
_“This weapon is your life”._
How is that contradictory? Obi-wan lived and died by the sword.
Also, I didn't say that he didn't ruin some aspects of Star Wars, I said he didn't really contradict anything he had already established.
I like the theory that the engineers mimiced the space jockeys. It would at least help explain the difference in scale.
Rob, "Alien" is existentialist piece of art, deriving from Space Odyssey 2001. It seems occult, but is actually marxist - symbolically, shows that people are threatened biologically as they always were by oppressors for thousands of years, but in modern time the oppression became technological as well. Thus, the threat in "Alien" is bio-technical in shape. (in addition, humans are entrapped in sexual/reproduction circle, thus so many sexual allusions). The whole Nostromo ship is technocratic sarcophagus imprisoning proletarians, and symbol of overall corporate technocratic World we know and live in, presented in the nutshell. And alien beast is the culmination - the embodiment of capitalist/corporate/technocratic evil destroying humans/humanity. It's a demon of a soulless corporate capitalism.
I also think that James Cameron emphasizes the struggle of proletarians in his works (Aliens/Terminator, Abyss) with great sympathies, from the humanist and marxist point of view. HAL in Odyssey, or Skynet in the Terminator - they are just technical means of corporate control. Alien is the horrible demon of the same.
Finally, this fusion of the "Space Jockey" with the machinery is a symbol of mankind entrapped within highly technical/technocratic system, and you made good parallel with the chair in Mother's "womb". It's Gigger's and Ridley's nightmarish dream of the everyman enslaved. Surreal vision. In addition, and it's kinda sad, the Jockey is in front of some kind of telescope, gazing at the stars - symbolizing the belief in the progress of the human kind through the "system of production" that glues him to the machine. And it isn't, from the ideological/economic system that imprisons him comes the opposite - he gives the birth of the core of the System - the destructive force of the Alien-demon.
We may accept Jockey as an advanced human being from the future, trying to warn Nostromo people/humanity not to go that way. But it happens all wrong.
So Space Jockey *is* Prometheus after all? Although I completely disagree I do like your thinking nonetheless. :)
@@adissabovic , to tell the truth, I got nothing from "Prometheus", I've seen it and got bored to death, remember nothing from that one. My analysis is strictly based on my life-long reverence for the first two "Alien" movies.
PS - I don't like the idea that Jockey is human - no, it's alien from distant places (sounds much better), but symbolically its a warning message carrier for a human kind. And a demon carrier at the same time. In the context of my analysis, he is simply a message from one possible future of humanity (or every form of existence).
Ash is Marxism; looks practical, beneficial but is ultimately a human designed contraption that inevitably malfunctions and is downright murderous when it does so.
@@thomasjoyce7910 Funny. Because I always thought of Ash as capitalism incarnated; profits first, and the crew not even second - but expendable.
@@adissabovic , what Thomas describes is typical propagandist vision of Marxist societies as brainwashed hives. The magnificent thing about "Alien" movies is that they follow that subtle, fine tradition of movies like THEM! and Body Snatchers, also old version of The Thing... all classic Cold War era films exploring collective psyche of the capitalist world, confronted to hive-mind, BUT SHOWING THE SIMILAR TRAITS! There is also satire movie, Space Troopers, exploring fascist premise of human society confronting bugs. But sometimes one can't find the difference between people and the bugs (or capitalists slaves/consumers and "commies").
Yes the space jockey sequence was visually awe inspiring but I also vividly remember Jerry Goldsmiths incredible score for this movie, especially during this segment, the instruments he used most of us had never heard before
I always thought the original space jockey was grown as part of the ship which may also have been grown. Today drones can be grown in floatation tanks, it's an amazing parallel with this old movie.
Fun fact: The name of H.R Gigers artwork that inspired the creation of Xenomorph was called actually called a Necromorph.
Dead Space was not the first to name its monsters as Necromorphs.
I always imagined that the pilot has been there a long time. So long that the xenos have incorporated it's corpse into their hive. The xenos coat everything in a silicon mucus to shape the surfaces into their ideal habitat. They also like to encapsulate their victims in goo.
None of these ideas had ever occurred to me. Thanks, man. Well done.
The space jockey scene stuck with me since I was a kid seeing this in the theater
Great space sci fi thriller
"It's just a big pale guy in a suit" is the fucking worst thing they could've done.
There is a comic where you can see the original space jockey get facehugged and the facehugger just simply wraps its tail around the trunk like spiral the comic is named aliens they're coming it is the RUclips channel scifi explained also bro good video
My favorite part as well. It was just so... ALIEN. As a 13 yr old it had a lasting effect on me. I remember seeing a Dark Horse comic that showed them as Elephant creatures.