Go to nordvpn.com/gudi to get a 2-year plan plus 4 additional months with a huge discount! To state it once more: I am not saying that these dupes are not being handled. I am addressing the many ppl who seem to believe that no dupes are happening whatsoever - as that is almost certainly not the case.
this video was really cool and I was having a fun time learning about old school with my girlfriend and how the economy can get messed up from this stuff and then I got really sad because you used the Alex Jones clip using the r slur. It's really saddening and isolating watching a video having fun only to see ableist stuff like that would you be so kind as to not do that? I wish you a nice day your videos are very cool also great job catching the world going down and the dedication refreshing so much it's great to have documentation of that stuff
*re-subs with malicious intent* (doom music starts) but seriously... what's the point in caring about the economy when jagex never did? they actively have policies not put in place so botters can be subscribed for multiple months to make money off them. it's a very easy solution; no trading over a certain limit for the first 3-6 months of your accounts creation, and it's very easy to accurately gauge if someone is a bot or not based on the behavior of 3-6 months of data while it's not possible for them to make a profit botting for 3-6 months if they can't get the gold or items off the account.
One thing to bear in mind is that Jagex can't share much about bugs and the ways in which they might resolve it, because it would just point out further weaknesses. That being said, Jagex has a history of communicating very poorer with even the best-mannered, helpful members of the community reaching out, or in fact processing bug reports at all... So... Doomsday it is, I guess.
Gudi was talking about jagex fixing it and having comprehensive logs so they can sort it out. Meanwhile an account got 15m attack xp in an hour orso and didn't get banned for months (still not banned?). Yeah, seems like the logs do jack.
One of the biggest problems is the clients that assist people in logging into 1,000+ accounts at once have been sold to other people and spread further into the bug abuse community, so more and more people are able to crash worlds, and as you say, anyone can dupe in those worlds.
You should not blame Rendi.. As he only brought this to the light. I would gave the same information to everyone in the world in the hopes that jagex actually changing it but apparantly they don't do anything about it.
@@hitppohiman whats worse tho, bringing it to light to have a solution created, or leaving it in the shadows and having the true culprits trickle in and abuse it unnoticed
Wanna know whats messed up i assume double money started as hey loan me a few mil and ill go stake it and return you gp but in the end they'd lose or get greedy and never return now doubling money means ima scam the pics out of you
@@salt-emoji Except he literally admitted to that at the start of the video...? Jagex isn't talking about this, so there are no facts to go off on. Besides, the only thing he set out to prove was that a dupe could be possible, which he did, and confirmed nothing else. All of this was simply speculation because that's all we currently have on this.
Dear payers, i mean players. We are fucked, we don't know how to fix this without spending a shit-ton of money. So we ain't gonna. Sincerely, Jagex people
fr why give them more ideas, the situation is bad already. There's a reason Jagex goes silent when it comes to dupes n' shit, at least until they situation has been resolved, which clearly isn't the case atm...
@@BradShreds not gay, true. I could not take Framed’s voice seriously for a second if he did a topic like this. Guy sounds like he’s straight out of a dungeons and dragons bender 24/7
The best tactic to disguise something heavily abused is misinformation, or highlighting another issue to distract from the one the people are abusing. Anyone blanket denying that the dupes are happening is probably doing just this. Also wouldn't a very simple solution be to save accounts after trades? About as simple as adding a call to save after a trade is resolved. Similarly you could do it for dropping. The process of trading or dropping probably also won't be made too taxing by it, considering trading is already doing quite a lot of things by ways of sending messages between players, showing items, having menu transitions and checks for both people being ready to trade, actually moving items.
Saving more frequently = more stress on the server If the average player is staying online for 4 hours for example, And now you change it so every trade saves the account then this could go to like every 30 minutes if you’re including the GE in that, as well as dropping items. 8 times the stress on the server. No world would stay alive, game would permantely crash. Sure the “fix” might be simple to program. The hard part is minimising the consequences of applying that fix, as every fix has potential for abuse and downsides. It’s definitely not going to be 8times the load on the server, much less than that, but even a difference of like 1.2 times could cause massive problems. The final solution to this is to make it so crashing worlds isn’t possible. That’s a lot harder to solve but it completely removes the problem without increasing server load.
@@JamaiiQ it's a minecraft joke. The command /gamemode 1 puts you into creative mode allowing you to easily spawn any item in the game (amongst other things) Seto is an og RS player but also quite well known for his minecraft days.
have you seen world 308? Someone keeps dumping crafting supplies and other f2p items claiming its a giveaway. I know last week a streamer was doing it, but today some random guy was doing the same items.
I caught the giant dump which happened on a F2P world a couple of weeks back, but I hadn't seen what was going on in 308. I tried to avoid all but the most necessary details in this video - as the key source of controversy seemed to be the rumour mill churning out tales of ely/tbow drop parties etc. Hard to discern fact from fiction in those areas. Not possible to know the source of what is happening in those worlds. I am hella curious, though.
Jagex cannot announce that they have identified a dupe *until* it has been fixed. Otherwise, if Jagex announced they knew of a dupe, but still have not taken action, the entire game freaks out about the impending rollback-apocalypse. A random f2p world at 2 am doesn't just get 2,000 players to join unless Zezima logs in with his pchat public. Let alone multiple f2p worlds per hour. What it sounds like here is, Jagex has never actually fixed the world crashing dupe simply because they don't know to create a way to continuously save a player's account in real-time. I'm assuming the data required to do such a large amount of gamesaves would be phenomenally large. Requiring them to invest in massively expensive data storage solutions, which, I am assuming is not in their business plan. Did the ever stop these types of dupes? Didn't they try some ways to curtail it on rs3?
One way of dealing with it is to safely disconnect that world. Assuming it runs out of memory or something. Wouldn't be a great solution, since crashing worlds or even disconnecting them can still ruin the game. But it'd be far better than allowing dupes to go on and hoping you catch them before damage is done. That's only assuming the abusers are overloading the world in some way that could be monitored. But we know nothing for sure.
@@SherryDC save account status after trade, duel, item drop, player death and storing gold in a coffer. Problem solved. Every single way to transfer items would effectively create a save of both accounts to prevent a duplication.
So what’s the exact reason the server crashes? If it’s a memory allocation issue, they could set up a script to restart the server when the server passes a memory threshold. If it’s bandwidth, then they can restart the server when the server is nearly out of bandwidth.
I think that a rumour of dupes can also be a way for merchers to increase their profits since a lot of people will most likely panic sell if they hear that "item XY" can be duped.
Gudi do you remember when hax unit crashed the world at ge using clockwork cats around 2009-2010? It was only like 30 people or something with 200 cats each, inspired by a forum post and done for fun. It's likely they are using some quest item to crash the worlds and spamming it such as clockwork items. It has to be something that puts a lot of load on the server so that it can't recover.
No need for dupes, if rendis new video bug worked also for one of the quests that give gp as reward they already could have generated unlimited money that way.
@@Gudi Yeh it's worth the watch, when you get to the steel claws part don't want spoil it, you will understand what I mean that they could have done the same thing but with GP rewards potentially.
This happens in rs3 during every system update but the window of doing it is couple seconds before you are booted out of the game. Just try it out by running forward during system update, mark where your character was when time hit zero and when logging in you will notice you are about 5-6tiles off of the place you got booted from.
Saying JaGex would roll back ASAP is false, their has been quite a few occasions in the past where they've let it all slide and its ruined points of the game, mainly RS3 but not osrs.. I'd hope they'd learn from mistakes but who knows, it's JaGex
It seems like this could easily be fixed by just saving a players account status after a trade. Then again, I'm no programmer so who knows how hard this would actually be to fix.
The game engine might not be able to support that without major reworks. Though I don't know either how it works, but it's possible that they designed it to save only with log outs and changing it now is essentially too late.
@@SwagbobKushpants its probably a bandwidth thing servers constantly having to save ppls accounts all the time could and probably would cause server lag so its limited to logouts
Thing is how do they determine who specifically is involved in this. For example what if you and a buddy happen to be a on world where the 2k accounts decide to do it on while trading and inadvertently dupe whatever it was you traded is that ban worthy? The chances of being on world that happens to targeted by this group while trading is slim but it's still possible.
Gonna depend on the circumstances on a case by case basis id imagine, if you're trading like, bond money they probably wont ban but if you "randomly" trade your friend a Tbow or 1b+ on a crashing world, it would seem those players knew exactly what was about to happen. They'll probably set a value threshold and look at things like login / log out timings and other activity from the same IP.
@@devilselbow ironmen that brag about being ironmen are the saddest virgin losers on the entire game. Who cares of we don’t waste our time fletching and crafting?
Such a frustrating thing. I made 4.5bill legit and it’s taken me ages. Seems worthless now. Imagine if 500 accounts traded each other 100mill each. That’s 50 bill in one attempt. Unreal
Surely the fix is just to save the profile after a trade, and other transactions, such as after a stake, if this means a 5 second delay to "finalize" a trade then that's totally worth it.
Honestly what should be done. Just taking a snapshot of the accounts after a trade and uploading it as a save-state for the account might be the only thing needed.
@@Top3Unveiled Well, it fixes one method and forces them to do drop-trades or get into PVP areas where other players could screw them up. But yeah, doesn't fix the issue altogether.
@@Top3Unveiled It makes it far more work for them, and more opportunity for things to go wrong. There are multiple small mitigations that could be implemented, which would make it far less practical. - Reducing the world capacity, so that the servers have better performance, building a performance buffer so that hopefully they don't crash. - Login queues. So that regular players aren't affected (most of the time) it could activate when it detects a sudden surge of players, or by monitoring the hardware of the server such as memory allocation, CPU usage, network usage. The queue could allow in 1 player per second or something. Long term the solution is most likely saving data at runtime, but this will likely require hardware upgrades which will take time, such as high performance SSD's or increased RAM to act as a write buffer, and tweaking the engine.
These crashes also mean that if you were to get a good drop or lets say a pet just before the crash, you would no longer have it when you log back in. So the savepoint system needs fixing anyways, as it's not impossible for worlds to crash on their own too.
I thought of this too, but most people leave or log as soon as it starts lagging. So that eliminates a lot of people, i'm sure it still happens or if you were doing tempoross or Wintertodt.
If Jagex has a method of logging players logouts and their items. It would simply be a string return. kind of like itemID:1234, itemID:12345, itemID123456. Which if the first statement is true, the inverse would be true. The same string could be generated on login. With a very simple line of code you could compare the item ID strings of player logout vs login and IF not a match notify person X and flag account X. I personally believe that Jagex has a margin of error, or a low variance rate, which they allow to occur on purpose.
Simple solution would be to somehow significantly increase the capacity of each world so it would take twice the number of players to crash the game but keep the player limit at 2000. Simple in theory, not sure how simple it is in practice. Also they can always lower the max players able to be logged on in the same world at once
I feel as though 'Jagex' is broadly used in the osrs community. I think it's important for people to distinguish exactly who they're pointing the finger at. All these NEETs don't understand how companies work. The devs make 0 managerial decisions, let alone the community team. To me, it seems like higerh up managers are neglecting osrs, same old story.
You don't get even the slightest bit curious as to what they actually do in the office? Shit cause after the Activision cases of late I am. What people don't always realise is that the content has been so slow in comparison to how it used to be an they have a much larger team.. makes you question what are they actually doing every year in the offices cause I genuinely wouldn't be surprised if its a shit show
Pretty much this. I can understand people being hesitant to jump to conclusions - but when the conclusion is so damn obvious, it is hard to take the enlightened redditors being so obtuse.
Here is the most mind blowing theory. It is the Jmods themselves behind the dupes. The content have dried out as they are busy with dupes for their own gains
@@alanwolensky the delayed response from jagex is what blows my mind. Of course they will eventually give a response but that is after the JMODS pockets the money.
@Gudi - I have an idea if you have connections with Jagex. Could they have a timer that checks the ping of a f2p world, when it hits a certain amount it saves all player data and then restarts the world? Hopefully this helps:) - good vid mate
The dupe brought gold prices from .55 to .19, overnight. While that was mostly due to panic and people not knowing how severe the impact was, the prices still haven't recovered to what they were prior to the dupe. Should these large, public dupes continue to happen, where people know something happened and then gold vendors proceed to confirm it, it's going to be an issue. If gold prices continue to crash, and the bots/gold farmers/bm services all pack up shop to go find profits elsewhere, the game dies.
yesterday some dude on YT claimed that item duplication happened, citing a trustful anonymous source. I didn't believe him, because I was told in other videos from other sources that the issue was fixed for quite some time on both OSRS and RS3.
indeed. it was "fixed" a while ago. But Jagex themselves said it was not impossible to crash a world or dupe, and that they only fixed that particular dupe. Oh and they fortified the servers to better handle it, obviously not well enough.
I have to start of complimenting this way of journalism in the OSRS community, and especially now i started to think about the whole HD client riots, it feels like they are pulling a media stunt on us, throwing this out there to throw the attention of the real problems that are lurking at this moment. And in all honestly, ive been thinking about leeching on them before you said so, because we all do need that quick buck, we are all freaking victims of this system we all keep fueling. We all do go to duelly, or so many viewers stake probably, stakers need money from the rwters etc. I will never allow myself to help ruin a game i had fun on for 1,5 decade easily, spent my youth on this game, but so many damaged people by the system in real life, seeing thousands of dollars come by per month, lets be honest, if OSRS can lead to gains more than youre average job? Yeah then for sure its tempting to alot of people, but sadly this is kind of stimulating the leeching as well, same as for bringing attention to it, the more attention we bring to it, the more itll be out of hand in no time, leading to actions to counter that. I truly hope this would be a trigger, or one of the soon to follow final trigger for them to make a move in the good direction, and i hope its not ending in a case of free trade being gone again, i hope they will just add warnings or extra warning message like : you are about to trade X amount over for nothing, you sure mate? Ok then... You really sure?! then to final trade screen making sure theres no way to rush over it within the reaction time of an individual. Lets see where this takes us! Great video nonetheless, nice length, going nicely in depth and showing how easily it is to abuse, and ride the wave they create, but never forget, if that is the road you TRULY want to be on? Would you go over the backs of others, hours of hard work to just gain some financial gain? Is it all worth it? To fuel the problems we see worldwide nowadays, in a game where we seek the escapism in it. We gamers are formed through hardships too, social awkwardness etc, reasons we all live this way, and thats why we shouldnt do this shit to eachother, live peacefully and help eachother out, that way we as a community can see our value, and our actual power and care for eachother! Much love to everyone n see ya around in scape
the bots could be in multi in wildy and if the crashes happen that frequently then that indicates the gold is not getting removed otherwise the crashers would stop doing it
you can also unban any account through a specific automated process (though you can be manually caught, it's never happened to me), it's not an in-game thing but possible on quite a lot of games due to their customer support processes & greed.
oh and regarding the dupe process being complicated/difficult to pull off - many tools necessary for this were made public after Jagex went after Rendi. hence the boom.
Repeatedly running the code for saving profiles is not a good idea. This can easily by exploited by getting 100s of accounts to trade over and over to cause an overload and crash the game
F2P trade limits would help. If they had to kill free trade in F2P because of this, I don’t think it’d be the end of the world. The problem is these gold sellers can probably afford to buy bonds for 2000 accounts if this duping is as lucrative as it seems.
Pretty easy fix in my opinion. Add a log-in queue, say, if more than 50 people are trying to log in at once, person 51 gets put at 1 in queue. Just an example. Could be fine-tuned further.
In my opinion this would not help, as it is not how long it takes the accounts to log in, it is hundreds of accounts doing an action in the game in an enclosed space creating too many packets in one area to be sent back, ultimately crashing the game. I believe it works very similarly to a minecraft lag machine
Woah, I just have one question… if you’re getting setback to your last save… and let’s say you trade an ely, you’ll get that ely back, right? But wouldn’t it mean that the person you traded the ely to would get his last saved spot too therefore the ely wouldn’t be in his inv anymore? Or would the person who got traded the ely, keep the ely because his last saved spot was when he got traded the ely? And how is your last saved spot determined? And would you be able to manipulate it by logging out?
@@GizzyPope Yeah but he didn’t confirm it. How are you so sure that when the player logs out it won’t reset him back to before he had the ely? Because it would be a whole world reset so whoever was on that world within the last 10-20 seconds gets reset to where they last stood within 10-20 seconds
Go to nordvpn.com/gudi to get a 2-year plan plus 4 additional months with a huge discount!
To state it once more: I am not saying that these dupes are not being handled. I am addressing the many ppl who seem to believe that no dupes are happening whatsoever - as that is almost certainly not the case.
this video was really cool and I was having a fun time learning about old school with my girlfriend and how the economy can get messed up from this stuff and then I got really sad because you used the Alex Jones clip using the r slur. It's really saddening and isolating watching a video having fun only to see ableist stuff like that would you be so kind as to not do that? I wish you a nice day your videos are very cool also great job catching the world going down and the dedication refreshing so much it's great to have documentation of that stuff
Gudi lives again
*re-subs with malicious intent* (doom music starts)
but seriously... what's the point in caring about the economy when jagex never did?
they actively have policies not put in place so botters can be subscribed for multiple months to make money off them.
it's a very easy solution; no trading over a certain limit for the first 3-6 months of your accounts creation, and it's very easy to accurately gauge if someone is a bot or not based on the behavior of 3-6 months of data while it's not possible for them to make a profit botting for 3-6 months if they can't get the gold or items off the account.
One thing to bear in mind is that Jagex can't share much about bugs and the ways in which they might resolve it, because it would just point out further weaknesses.
That being said, Jagex has a history of communicating very poorer with even the best-mannered, helpful members of the community reaching out, or in fact processing bug reports at all... So... Doomsday it is, I guess.
@@chattychatotchannel go away
Wake me when these naughty boys find a way to actually trim armour.
Lol! for real XD
your comment wins sir!
Melvor Idle
It’s been a wild night watching rendi’s 99att bug abuse, crumbs staking plug-in video, and now a gold dupe video. Jagex gonna wake up to a shit storm
Lmao had the exact lineup today great minds select alike
Thank you for the comment. I only saw this vid until i read it.
Literally exactly what I just finished watching in the last 10 hours lol
Hell yeah brother
Gudi was talking about jagex fixing it and having comprehensive logs so they can sort it out.
Meanwhile an account got 15m attack xp in an hour orso and didn't get banned for months (still not banned?).
Yeah, seems like the logs do jack.
One of the biggest problems is the clients that assist people in logging into 1,000+ accounts at once have been sold to other people and spread further into the bug abuse community, so more and more people are able to crash worlds, and as you say, anyone can dupe in those worlds.
And fortunately those people who want to dupe were given very detailed instructions by Rendi in his original video, smh
You should not blame Rendi.. As he only brought this to the light. I would gave the same information to everyone in the world in the hopes that jagex actually changing it but apparantly they don't do anything about it.
@@hitppohiman or he could’ve stayed quiet.
@@Turkingtang imagine thinking rendi was the only person to figure it out.
@@hitppohiman whats worse tho, bringing it to light to have a solution created, or leaving it in the shadows and having the true culprits trickle in and abuse it unnoticed
best money making guide ive seen in a while, thanks theoatrix :)
Wwwwhats goin on guys, my names Theoatrix and today, I’m bringing you the infinite money guide!
Lighten up mate
Is theoatrix the guy that melted down on Twitter?
@@DecimusTheThinker yup
@@ethanavrigean6734 lighten up, mate
Actually doubling gold.
Doubling money legit
Better then the trimming armor
Wanna know whats messed up i assume double money started as hey loan me a few mil and ill go stake it and return you gp but in the end they'd lose or get greedy and never return now doubling money means ima scam the pics out of you
@@salt-emoji Except he literally admitted to that at the start of the video...? Jagex isn't talking about this, so there are no facts to go off on. Besides, the only thing he set out to prove was that a dupe could be possible, which he did, and confirmed nothing else. All of this was simply speculation because that's all we currently have on this.
@@salt-emoji Typical Brit behaviour he says, I’ve seen plenty of other nationalities do it including Americans the most lmao
Hi this is jagex, we fixed this issue now so plz don’t try
Sincerely,
Stakeholders of jagex
Dear payers, i mean players. We are fucked, we don't know how to fix this without spending a shit-ton of money.
So we ain't gonna.
Sincerely,
Jagex people
All this really just feels like Ronan tipping us off that we can dupe too
Then Jagex should fix this even sooner
Lets 👏 crash 👏 gold 👏 price 👏
Please dupe gold so I can be osrich
@@Leroyteam That's why I think this is a good thing
Information is just that. Jagex should just get off their asses really 🤷♂️
Make a bot to monitor the worlds and dupe my own gold you say? 🤔
no no no no no no please please no oh god oh fuck
@@Gudi Rekt
do it
fr why give them more ideas, the situation is bad already. There's a reason Jagex goes silent when it comes to dupes n' shit, at least until they situation has been resolved, which clearly isn't the case atm...
@@Gudi Whats that? You want me to dupe gold so i can sell it and never have to more a day in my life?
Spat out my drink at 4:37 LOL
Shit had me rolling
Amazing. 😂😂
You have the voice to pull off this kind of content.
gayyyyyy!
@@BradShreds lol
@@BradShreds not gay, true. I could not take Framed’s voice seriously for a second if he did a topic like this. Guy sounds like he’s straight out of a dungeons and dragons bender 24/7
@@Sahbab11 i swear framed speaks out his fuckin nose lmfao
The best tactic to disguise something heavily abused is misinformation, or highlighting another issue to distract from the one the people are abusing. Anyone blanket denying that the dupes are happening is probably doing just this.
Also wouldn't a very simple solution be to save accounts after trades? About as simple as adding a call to save after a trade is resolved. Similarly you could do it for dropping.
The process of trading or dropping probably also won't be made too taxing by it, considering trading is already doing quite a lot of things by ways of sending messages between players, showing items, having menu transitions and checks for both people being ready to trade, actually moving items.
Saving more frequently = more stress on the server
If the average player is staying online for 4 hours for example,
And now you change it so every trade saves the account then this could go to like every 30 minutes if you’re including the GE in that, as well as dropping items. 8 times the stress on the server. No world would stay alive, game would permantely crash.
Sure the “fix” might be simple to program. The hard part is minimising the consequences of applying that fix, as every fix has potential for abuse and downsides. It’s definitely not going to be 8times the load on the server, much less than that, but even a difference of like 1.2 times could cause massive problems.
The final solution to this is to make it so crashing worlds isn’t possible. That’s a lot harder to solve but it completely removes the problem without increasing server load.
They could also just bandaid fix and limit f2p worlds to like 500-800 people
Lol. The servers would never be able to handle it
Every time someone says something would be easy to put into the game, I sigh
except the current dev team has no knowledge to fix engine bugs from game created in 2001
Imagine not just using Gamemode 1 smh
imagine
@@JamaiiQ it's a minecraft joke. The command /gamemode 1 puts you into creative mode allowing you to easily spawn any item in the game (amongst other things)
Seto is an og RS player but also quite well known for his minecraft days.
I think uncle attack is a testament to the fact that gagex does NOT have detailed logs of the things that happen.
you should have duped something worthless to prove it, like 13 cooked trouts.
exactly. It is very suspicious that he had a perfect opportunit to prove duping was real but chose not to do it.
have you seen world 308? Someone keeps dumping crafting supplies and other f2p items claiming its a giveaway. I know last week a streamer was doing it, but today some random guy was doing the same items.
I caught the giant dump which happened on a F2P world a couple of weeks back, but I hadn't seen what was going on in 308. I tried to avoid all but the most necessary details in this video - as the key source of controversy seemed to be the rumour mill churning out tales of ely/tbow drop parties etc. Hard to discern fact from fiction in those areas.
Not possible to know the source of what is happening in those worlds. I am hella curious, though.
Great content. Thanks, Gudi. Nothing else could be expected from Jagex. Always when some actions needs to be taken asap nothing is being done.
Jagex cannot announce that they have identified a dupe *until* it has been fixed. Otherwise, if Jagex announced they knew of a dupe, but still have not taken action, the entire game freaks out about the impending rollback-apocalypse. A random f2p world at 2 am doesn't just get 2,000 players to join unless Zezima logs in with his pchat public. Let alone multiple f2p worlds per hour. What it sounds like here is, Jagex has never actually fixed the world crashing dupe simply because they don't know to create a way to continuously save a player's account in real-time. I'm assuming the data required to do such a large amount of gamesaves would be phenomenally large. Requiring them to invest in massively expensive data storage solutions, which, I am assuming is not in their business plan. Did the ever stop these types of dupes? Didn't they try some ways to curtail it on rs3?
One way of dealing with it is to safely disconnect that world. Assuming it runs out of memory or something. Wouldn't be a great solution, since crashing worlds or even disconnecting them can still ruin the game. But it'd be far better than allowing dupes to go on and hoping you catch them before damage is done.
That's only assuming the abusers are overloading the world in some way that could be monitored. But we know nothing for sure.
/r/2007scape is unbearable
“So I’ve taken some precautions”
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Why not just make characters save after confirming a trade?
Because they would just avoid trading and move to something else
@@SherryDC save account status after trade, duel, item drop, player death and storing gold in a coffer. Problem solved. Every single way to transfer items would effectively create a save of both accounts to prevent a duplication.
So what’s the exact reason the server crashes?
If it’s a memory allocation issue, they could set up a script to restart the server when the server passes a memory threshold.
If it’s bandwidth, then they can restart the server when the server is nearly out of bandwidth.
I think that a rumour of dupes can also be a way for merchers to increase their profits since a lot of people will most likely panic sell if they hear that "item XY" can be duped.
Gudi do you remember when hax unit crashed the world at ge using clockwork cats around 2009-2010? It was only like 30 people or something with 200 cats each, inspired by a forum post and done for fun. It's likely they are using some quest item to crash the worlds and spamming it such as clockwork items. It has to be something that puts a lot of load on the server so that it can't recover.
No need for dupes, if rendis new video bug worked also for one of the quests that give gp as reward they already could have generated unlimited money that way.
I haven't watched it yet. Loading it up rn. You're the third person to mention it to me, so it has to be good.
Pretty sure he said they've patched what he used in that video
@@Gudi rendi's recent videos are all crazy good
@@TheVastoLordes Yeh they patched one way to do it, doesn't mean people can't find a new way to do it. The usual.
@@Gudi Yeh it's worth the watch, when you get to the steel claws part don't want spoil it, you will understand what I mean that they could have done the same thing but with GP rewards potentially.
Imagine knowing about this 15 years ago.. oh wait.
This happens in rs3 during every system update but the window of doing it is couple seconds before you are booted out of the game. Just try it out by running forward during system update, mark where your character was when time hit zero and when logging in you will notice you are about 5-6tiles off of the place you got booted from.
Saying JaGex would roll back ASAP is false, their has been quite a few occasions in the past where they've let it all slide and its ruined points of the game, mainly RS3 but not osrs.. I'd hope they'd learn from mistakes but who knows, it's JaGex
It seems like this could easily be fixed by just saving a players account status after a trade. Then again, I'm no programmer so who knows how hard this would actually be to fix.
The game engine might not be able to support that without major reworks. Though I don't know either how it works, but it's possible that they designed it to save only with log outs and changing it now is essentially too late.
@@SwagbobKushpants its probably a bandwidth thing servers constantly having to save ppls accounts all the time could and probably would cause server lag so its limited to logouts
People would find ways around it, they could drop trade or put items on tables or get pked etc.
@@atroxie Yeah true, it could really be any number of things. We can't know how or why they designed it like that.
@@elsiekonpaku9530 it becomes a slippery slope very quickly but still: why not save state on those events as well then
Can't believe rendi is at it again!
Loooool
You wanna tell us why mod lenny is "worse" or you gonna ignore like jagex. Go to 5:05
Thing is how do they determine who specifically is involved in this. For example what if you and a buddy happen to be a on world where the 2k accounts decide to do it on while trading and inadvertently dupe whatever it was you traded is that ban worthy? The chances of being on world that happens to targeted by this group while trading is slim but it's still possible.
Gonna depend on the circumstances on a case by case basis id imagine, if you're trading like, bond money they probably wont ban but if you "randomly" trade your friend a Tbow or 1b+ on a crashing world, it would seem those players knew exactly what was about to happen. They'll probably set a value threshold and look at things like login / log out timings and other activity from the same IP.
They collect two two terabytes of data everyday on every players action. Every trade, every click. The difficulty is sorting through the data.
@@sugondiesthephilosopher how do you know
@@jordanclarxon6246 a former big cheese Jagex mod gave an interview with content creators a few weeks back. Mod Mark or Matt K I think is their name.
@@sugondiesthephilosopher thanks
thank you. ive duped countless tbows now.
ill venmo u 20 doll hairs for one
Ironmen over here not giving af about the economy lmao. Ironman is the only way to play RuneScape anymore
@@devilselbow kinda devalues your entire account and all your achievements but ok
@@devilselbow ironmen that brag about being ironmen are the saddest virgin losers on the entire game. Who cares of we don’t waste our time fletching and crafting?
Such a frustrating thing. I made 4.5bill legit and it’s taken me ages. Seems worthless now. Imagine if 500 accounts traded each other 100mill each. That’s 50 bill in one attempt. Unreal
great video man! always like your content!
Surely the fix is just to save the profile after a trade, and other transactions, such as after a stake, if this means a 5 second delay to "finalize" a trade then that's totally worth it.
Honestly what should be done. Just taking a snapshot of the accounts after a trade and uploading it as a save-state for the account might be the only thing needed.
That fixes exactly nothing. They will just drop their items over or kill each other in the wildy.
@@Top3Unveiled Well, it fixes one method and forces them to do drop-trades or get into PVP areas where other players could screw them up. But yeah, doesn't fix the issue altogether.
@@Top3Unveiled It makes it far more work for them, and more opportunity for things to go wrong.
There are multiple small mitigations that could be implemented, which would make it far less practical.
- Reducing the world capacity, so that the servers have better performance, building a performance buffer so that hopefully they don't crash.
- Login queues. So that regular players aren't affected (most of the time) it could activate when it detects a sudden surge of players, or by monitoring the hardware of the server such as memory allocation, CPU usage, network usage. The queue could allow in 1 player per second or something.
Long term the solution is most likely saving data at runtime, but this will likely require hardware upgrades which will take time, such as high performance SSD's or increased RAM to act as a write buffer, and tweaking the engine.
LOL the music at the beginning really sold it XD.
why hasnt this been posted to the sub reddit yet? It feels weird how little discussion there is still
Why wouldnt you dupe something like 1 raw shrimp just to see if its truly possible
These crashes also mean that if you were to get a good drop or lets say a pet just before the crash, you would no longer have it when you log back in. So the savepoint system needs fixing anyways, as it's not impossible for worlds to crash on their own too.
I thought of this too, but most people leave or log as soon as it starts lagging. So that eliminates a lot of people, i'm sure it still happens or if you were doing tempoross or Wintertodt.
If Jagex has a method of logging players logouts and their items. It would simply be a string return. kind of like itemID:1234, itemID:12345, itemID123456. Which if the first statement is true, the inverse would be true. The same string could be generated on login. With a very simple line of code you could compare the item ID strings of player logout vs login and IF not a match notify person X and flag account X. I personally believe that Jagex has a margin of error, or a low variance rate, which they allow to occur on purpose.
They have bots upvoting comments that deny the dupes and they downvote the post itself
VERY interesting video! Thank you for taking a step out of the ordinary path for this!
wave2: Duplicate GF 2k e/a world 1
Did anybody notice his name ? “COIN “ he’s apart of dicing bots ! ;)
Simple solution would be to somehow significantly increase the capacity of each world so it would take twice the number of players to crash the game but keep the player limit at 2000. Simple in theory, not sure how simple it is in practice. Also they can always lower the max players able to be logged on in the same world at once
I dont know anything about coding but cant Jagex fix this duping issue by making it so when you make a trade it saves your account?
Any exchange of items/money, so also dropping gp will need to be saved then
I feel inspired to go look for these worlds now 😂👏🏼
I feel as though 'Jagex' is broadly used in the osrs community. I think it's important for people to distinguish exactly who they're pointing the finger at. All these NEETs don't understand how companies work. The devs make 0 managerial decisions, let alone the community team. To me, it seems like higerh up managers are neglecting osrs, same old story.
You don't get even the slightest bit curious as to what they actually do in the office? Shit cause after the Activision cases of late I am. What people don't always realise is that the content has been so slow in comparison to how it used to be an they have a much larger team.. makes you question what are they actually doing every year in the offices cause I genuinely wouldn't be surprised if its a shit show
idk idk dupe is definetly hapening, who tf would log in 2k accounts at once for anything else other than a dupe
Pretty much this. I can understand people being hesitant to jump to conclusions - but when the conclusion is so damn obvious, it is hard to take the enlightened redditors being so obtuse.
Everybody gangsta until Spooky comes on the video
Here is the most mind blowing theory. It is the Jmods themselves behind the dupes. The content have dried out as they are busy with dupes for their own gains
Definitely crossed my mind. Takes just one bad apple.
@@alanwolensky the delayed response from jagex is what blows my mind. Of course they will eventually give a response but that is after the JMODS pockets the money.
@@jjjc20 not dissimilar to how they handled Mod Jed.
Thanks for this. I’m getting in on this for sure.
i was today years old when i learned why duping always was mentioned along with world crashing lol. thanks Gudi cool vid
@Gudi - I have an idea if you have connections with Jagex.
Could they have a timer that checks the ping of a f2p world, when it hits a certain amount it saves all player data and then restarts the world?
Hopefully this helps:) - good vid mate
They fix shit when it’s to late more times then not
if you ever make a less than 10min vid again ill do something wild on osrs.
MORE GUDIIIIII
That Alex Jones edit is so fucking golden. OMFG 💀 🤣
GF oak dice Gudi is now the best drama channel
i love how sir pugger has a monopoly on that one song
Time to join the duping discord.
Thanks for the video, i've succesfully duped large amounts since the release of this video. Large amounts of nothing because i dont play this game.
Lower world limits would fix this AND hopefully bring back the social part of the game by forcing players to not always hop to empty worlds
that would be shitty imagine pvming and slayer with less w
When mobile was released an absurd amount of F2P worlds were added to the game. I think it's time for them to go.
Why not do a forced character save when a save is completed when it's value is over a certain amount of value?
Interesting idea.
But it would also have to work for droptrading then.
Easy fix, set lower player limits so the servers don't get overwhelmed if they refuse to get more powerful processing
Thanks Bowl man I'm gonna join in on the next one.
Gudi just taught us how to item dupe, now im refreshing worlds every few minutes with an inv full of tbows :D
Loan me just one of these beast so I can waste my life at inferno
Jager watching: *eyes squint* Rendi!
wait doesn't the explanation at the start assume the devs haven't figured out the obvious solution of saving both players's data after a trade?
true dat
legit as he said "people could leach and dupe" i was already making more accounts on a vpn. lets fuckin gooooo bois. LOL
Petition to change the Lumby doomsayer's name to Gudi.
Are you ever making that video about pking Yolo Mission that C Engineer said you would make? Or did I just miss it?
thanks ronan i started duping now
The dupe brought gold prices from .55 to .19, overnight. While that was mostly due to panic and people not knowing how severe the impact was, the prices still haven't recovered to what they were prior to the dupe. Should these large, public dupes continue to happen, where people know something happened and then gold vendors proceed to confirm it, it's going to be an issue. If gold prices continue to crash, and the bots/gold farmers/bm services all pack up shop to go find profits elsewhere, the game dies.
I can't tell if gold prices being cut down so hard is good or bad...
Now take a look into the world economies and the havoc being rekted by the central bankers...
yesterday some dude on YT claimed that item duplication happened, citing a trustful anonymous source. I didn't believe him, because I was told in other videos from other sources that the issue was fixed for quite some time on both OSRS and RS3.
indeed. it was "fixed" a while ago. But Jagex themselves said it was not impossible to crash a world or dupe, and that they only fixed that particular dupe. Oh and they fortified the servers to better handle it, obviously not well enough.
Thanks to this I finally got my T-bow :)
It's sad 😔 killing the game slowly
I have to start of complimenting this way of journalism in the OSRS community, and especially now i started to think about the whole HD client riots, it feels like they are pulling a media stunt on us, throwing this out there to throw the attention of the real problems that are lurking at this moment.
And in all honestly, ive been thinking about leeching on them before you said so, because we all do need that quick buck, we are all freaking victims of this system we all keep fueling. We all do go to duelly, or so many viewers stake probably, stakers need money from the rwters etc.
I will never allow myself to help ruin a game i had fun on for 1,5 decade easily, spent my youth on this game, but so many damaged people by the system in real life, seeing thousands of dollars come by per month, lets be honest, if OSRS can lead to gains more than youre average job? Yeah then for sure its tempting to alot of people, but sadly this is kind of stimulating the leeching as well, same as for bringing attention to it, the more attention we bring to it, the more itll be out of hand in no time, leading to actions to counter that.
I truly hope this would be a trigger, or one of the soon to follow final trigger for them to make a move in the good direction, and i hope its not ending in a case of free trade being gone again, i hope they will just add warnings or extra warning message like : you are about to trade X amount over for nothing, you sure mate? Ok then... You really sure?! then to final trade screen making sure theres no way to rush over it within the reaction time of an individual.
Lets see where this takes us! Great video nonetheless, nice length, going nicely in depth and showing how easily it is to abuse, and ride the wave they create, but never forget, if that is the road you TRULY want to be on? Would you go over the backs of others, hours of hard work to just gain some financial gain? Is it all worth it? To fuel the problems we see worldwide nowadays, in a game where we seek the escapism in it.
We gamers are formed through hardships too, social awkwardness etc, reasons we all live this way, and thats why we shouldnt do this shit to eachother, live peacefully and help eachother out, that way we as a community can see our value, and our actual power and care for eachother!
Much love to everyone n see ya around in scape
when i see stuff like this i honestly wonder if it's corporate espionage. Stuff like this could permantly break the game and kill the playerbase
for sure if i had GP rn id be taking advantage of these dupes
Yo help me look for the duped worlds and I'll pay you good
the bots could be in multi in wildy and if the crashes happen that frequently then that indicates the gold is not getting removed otherwise the crashers would stop doing it
Better ban Rendi again
FREE RENDI
you can also unban any account through a specific automated process (though you can be manually caught, it's never happened to me), it's not an in-game thing but possible on quite a lot of games due to their customer support processes & greed.
oh and regarding the dupe process being complicated/difficult to pull off - many tools necessary for this were made public after Jagex went after Rendi. hence the boom.
Ruined my money making method smh
why not save the accounts immediately after a trade, boom fixed it
Repeatedly running the code for saving profiles is not a good idea. This can easily by exploited by getting 100s of accounts to trade over and over to cause an overload and crash the game
This is what they do in diablo 2
F2P trade limits would help. If they had to kill free trade in F2P because of this, I don’t think it’d be the end of the world. The problem is these gold sellers can probably afford to buy bonds for 2000 accounts if this duping is as lucrative as it seems.
I dropped my coins and pressed Alt + F4 and my gold is gone???
This is what sir pugger thinks his videos are like
Very well done and narrated. You have good theory crafting at the very least. Brings good insight
Wow it's crazy this game is still going
Pretty easy fix in my opinion. Add a log-in queue, say, if more than 50 people are trying to log in at once, person 51 gets put at 1 in queue. Just an example. Could be fine-tuned further.
In my opinion this would not help, as it is not how long it takes the accounts to log in, it is hundreds of accounts doing an action in the game in an enclosed space creating too many packets in one area to be sent back, ultimately crashing the game. I believe it works very similarly to a minecraft lag machine
The world was lagging like crazy… WHAT DO YOU MEANXD my worlds are always like this….
Woah, I just have one question… if you’re getting setback to your last save… and let’s say you trade an ely, you’ll get that ely back, right? But wouldn’t it mean that the person you traded the ely to would get his last saved spot too therefore the ely wouldn’t be in his inv anymore? Or would the person who got traded the ely, keep the ely because his last saved spot was when he got traded the ely? And how is your last saved spot determined? And would you be able to manipulate it by logging out?
the person getting the ely literally just has to log out and he gets saved. one of the first things explained in the video
@@GizzyPope Yeah but he didn’t confirm it. How are you so sure that when the player logs out it won’t reset him back to before he had the ely? Because it would be a whole world reset so whoever was on that world within the last 10-20 seconds gets reset to where they last stood within 10-20 seconds
Awesome video man tyvm.
Thanks for telling everyone how to dupe, now they HAVE to fix it :D
I'm not playing myself, so... have fun duping XD
that was public white portal, they coulda done a private one
They need to get it together or this game won't last another 5 years.
5 years? If they don't fix this shit we're talkin 5 months. No economy = no game
RotMG has had a broken economy due to duping for years.
The game will survive, it's just the market will be more... interesting.
pretty crazy i played another mmo with this exact same bug
Why not limit total player per world at 1k? I mean most of the worlds aren't 1000 players plus....
Nothing sums up reddit in it's entirety better than that clip of Alex Jones.