What if the Balrog Got the Ring? | Tolkien Theory
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- Опубликовано: 22 мар 2024
- What would the Balrog do with the One Ring? What effect would it have on it? Would the balrog be loyal to Sauron? We tackle these questions and more in today's Tolkien Theory!
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Balrog - Jerry Vanderstelt
Balrog - Daniel_Govar
bridge of khazad-dum, gandalf vs balrog - kuliszu
Misty Mountains - Felix Englund
Moria Gate - Soni Alcorn-Hender
The Eastern Arches - Alan Lee
Balrog - John_Howe
Gandalf and Balrog - Daniel Dougherty
khazad-dum - CK Goksoy
The Balrog - Ted Nasmith
Felix Englund - Gandalf Balrog
Gandalf v Balrog - Dzmitry Yakhouski
Balrog - JG Jones
Flame of Udûn - Manuel Castañón
Bane of Durin - Jerry Vanderstelt
Gandalf and the Balrog - Matthew Stewart
Moria - John Howe
Gandalf - skullb*st*rd
Balrog - John Howe
Balrog - John Howe
Elessar - John Howe
Legolas - John Howe
Boromir - John Howe
Balrog - John Howe
One Ring To Rule - Anthony Catillaz
Balrog - John Howe
Balrog - John Howe
The One Ring - John Howe
Balrog - James Bousema
Gandalf and the Balrog Upon Celebdil - Ted Nasmith
At The Bridge - Ted Nasmith
balrog-benwootten - WETA
Fingon and Gothmog - Ted Nasmith
Balrog - John Howe
the one ring - Dzmitry Yakhouski
fall of gondolin, glorfindel vs balrog - mellorianj
Moria Orcs - John Howe
Gothmog - Steve Airola
Balrog - John Howe
Battle of Sudden Flame - Alan Lee
Tulkas and Morgoth - Ralph Damiani
Angband - dracarysdrekkar
ainur, children of iluvatar - nahar
Fantasy landscape - Felix Englund
Lorien - Ralph Damiani
Lothlórien - Alan Lee
Sauron - Jerry Vanderstelt
The Great Eye - Ralph Damiani
Sauron - SoW
sauron army - weta
Saruman the White - Daniel Govar
Approaching Edoras - Ted Nasmith
Saruman - John Howe
Sauron - Janka Latečková
Dark valley - Felix Englund
White Hand of Saruman - Ralph Damiani
Denethor with the palantir - Anna Kulisz
Lord Denethor - Peter Xavier Price
Minas Tirith - Alan Lee
The Riders of Rohan - Ted Nasmith
battle of ford - James Rinere
Helms Deep - Ralph Damiani
riders of rohan - kuliszu
Battle - Anke Eissmann
The One Ring - Kinko White
The One Ring - John Howe
King Aragorn - Steve Airola
Uruk Commander - John Howe
Easterling - Olanda Fong-Surdenas
Saruman - LOTRO
The Uruk-hai - John Howe
Saruman - Steve Airola
Mouth of Sauron - John Howe
Battle in the distance -Felix Englund
Morgoth and Sauron - Ralph Damiani
Ecthelion and Gothmog - Abe Papakhian
Sauron the Deceiver - Ralph Damiani
Sauron the Deceiver - Olanda Fong-Surdenas
Sauron - anotherstranger_me
But Morgoth sent the more - Catherine Chmiel
spirit of sauron - skullb*st*rd
orcs - Angus McBride
Orc Army - Jan Pospíšil
saruman - Dzmitry Yakhouski
Door of Night - John Howe
Morgoth - Ralph Damiani
saruman of many colours - Tolman Cotton
Saruman and Palantir - Angus McBride
Mirrormere - Alan Lee
gandalf the white - bembiann
#balrog #lordoftherings #tolkien 
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What theory would you like to see me cover next?!
What if Radagast gets the ring?
Perhaps what if Boromir survived the end of Fellowship of the Ring?
What if Isildur had been prepared for the attack in the gladden fields and the ring never got the chance to betray him?
Glorfindel playing uno reversal card and takes the Ring
what if elrond gets the ring
I think the ring would be a calming influence on the Balrog causing it to reevaluate its life. It would then travel to the shire where it would spend its days lying on the grass with the hobbit folk while smoking a pipe.
😂😂😂
Actually yeah.
If Hobbits are so easy going and masters of living in peace without ambition then the one ring should amplify that particular trait.
So actually the ring should really calm Frodo down 😆 But since it doesn't, maybe we can apply that kind of opposite logic onto the Balrog. 🤔
Just don’t ask it for a light.
For sure!!! How did I not see it!
*puffing smoke*
Balrog: „You know … I think my anger issues come from my chosen father Morgoth. He never saw me for who I really am you see…“
Missed opportunity to name the video ”What would happen if Durin’s bane got hold of Isildur’s bane”
WHY DOES HE WEAR THE MASK??
@@rvkice23 "Ah, you think the ring is your ally..."
" I dub thee...Bane Bane."
@@michaelcristel3060 Bane Bane then becomes Sauron's Bane.
Bane Bane, Sauron's Bane. Bane BaneBane.
Nobody cared before i put on the mask
I want to imagine a scenario where Sauron realizes just how badly has messed up and attempts to plead to the Valar like “I know I have done some really bad things, but can we all agree that is a bigger issue?”
Fighting the wielder of the One Ring, be it Sauron, the balrog, or anybody else, would still destroy Middle-Earth, so they would still not interfere. And the would not take Sauron back, because powerless shadow or not, he'd try to exert his influence anyway.
Wasn't sauron more powerful than a balrog?
@@MasterGhostf It's a bit hard to compare. Both were Maiar, so they were roughly at the same power level. Both served under Morgoth, Sauron as a capable lieutenant of "evil wisdom", the balrogs as Morgoth's elite guard and their captain as the commander of Morgoth's main fortress and home. It's pretty conceivable that a Balrog could use the Ring just as well as Sauron, though not with full finesse.
@@joachimdurchholz8554 definitely but I don't think it would be a "valar" level threat. Sauron wielded it and the valar didn't get involved.
@@joachimdurchholz8554So they make war on Morgoth, but leave a successor to do whatever? Don't buy it.
Would love to see a scenario "if Bilbo didnt have pity and killed Gollum".. this way not only Bilbo wouldnt give up the ring so easly, but also Sauron would never know about "Shire, Baggings" and Frodo wouldnt have a guide... kinda crazy
That's a wonderful suggestion, I'd love to see Nerd of the Rings cover that as well. :)
Sam would have picked up the slack, found a way into mordor, take the ring from frodo amd cast it into mount doom.
dude, what you envisioned for saruman is PERFECT
Thanks!! I figured he would be trying to use all his cunning and plan betrayals left and right.
💯
Absolutely! It fit perfectly!
no it isn't
it requires teh ring helping kill it's master, which is nonsence
another one who unironically thinks the rings of powert wasnt a steaming abortion of tolkiens work.
One what if I think would be cool to see is what if Isildur survived, specifically surviving the final ambush after his retinue and eldest sons were killed and he lost the ring. There could be some interesting possibilities and explorations with him trying to cope with losing the ring, and maybe Arnor not splintering.
That would be a great what if
The first ring bearer. Interesting.
@@cooter882It would be interesting to have a situation where, at least on the face of it, the Free Peoples are actually in a better position than in canon. (Another interesting scenario to me would be what if Gondor collapsed and Arnor survived.)
He probably would have searched for the ring because he went crazy for it
@TheGreatUnwashedThing that's amazing aswell buddy your imagination is off the chart
A rematch of a balrog vs Glorfindel would be glorious
But if the balrog has the One Ring, then Glorfindel should have one of the three Elven rings if he's going to stand half a chance. Since he was last seen in Rivendell in the books, then it would make sense for Elrond to give him *his* ring. As powerful as Elrond is in his own right, he's never taken on a balrog -- and Elrond is only alive because Glorfindel saved Elrond's father when he killed the balrog at Gondolin!
I think Glorfindel defeats the balrog even with the ring. Though he probably dies in the process.
No he would die. Glorfindel killed a balrog without advanced powers and still died in the process
@Karin_Allen problem is, the wielder of the One has power over the Three. No elf have ever used a ring of power against Sauron. So no elf would or could use it against a Balrog who had claimed the One.
That said, Elrond+Glorfindel+Cirdan+ Thranduil could manage something I think. They still have great power. Maybe they could even ask for Earendil aid. Now immagine the light of the Silmaril piercing through the dark clouds, as Vingilot descends onto earth and hordes of orcs burn alive in the light of the Trees xD. That would be a sigth to behold. That would be a sight capable of having the Balrog shitting his royal pants.
@@hobbes1887 I have to admit I didn't *really* think Glorfindel would stand a chance against a balrog wearing the One Ring. 😉 But I like your idea of combining the forces of Elrond, Glorfindel, Cirdan, and Thranduil (though I'm not sure Thranduil is very powerful compared to the other three). The question then is, what would they do if Earendil *couldn't* help them? I'm asking mostly as a thought exercise, but Manwe seem to have a policy of "I'll only do this once," and he gave Earendil special dispensation to join the War of Wrath. And that was because they were fighting Morgoth himself, not a Maia. The only help the Valar gave Middle-earth in fighting Sauron was a handful of Istari, only one of whom succeeded in his mission.
But I do think the Elven leaders would have to contact the Valar. They could do it through Ulmo since he's still active throughout the world and is sympathetic to Middle-earth. Then maybe Ulmo could convince the Valar to send a different kind of assistance - at the very least, Istari who were *Valar* rather than Maiar. But if the Valar aren't willing to go that route, I'm not sure what the next option would be. What do you think? This is a fun thing to consider.
Durin's Bane picking up frodo and burning him to ash leaving nothing but the one ring in its hand is so badass
Okay but Saruman’s arc here was SPOT ON.
The Balrog getting the Ring would have been a massive hit on Sauron's fragile ego.
No, I don't think so
the ring corupts and contgrols, and so does saruon, so having this trap would just make sauron snear devilishly in anticipation of a new minion
It would take several hundred orcs to fix the damage done to the dry walls of Barad-Dûr, by the dark lord himself.
@@bobsterclause342 The balrogs served Morgoth long before Sauron
@@bobsterclause342 The balrog was already a corrupted Maiar. What’s with more corruption from a close relative? So nah, I think Sauron would have a problem in his hands with this type of ringbearer being way harder to control than a mere human, hobbit or even wizard.
I see you got the Ring.
And your Schwartz is as big as mine!
🤣
For starters, I think you should do a Part 2 to this video. The last Northern alliance led by Gandalf sounds interesting. A Balrog assault on Valinor could also be very interesting, because it puts into question one of my main gripes with the balance of power between good and evil in Tolkien's universe where even though Morgoth plants deceit and treasury in good, the greater world (i.e. Valinor) always felt that good vastly outnumbered evil even when evil seemed to get the upper hand on occasion. Basically, Valinor feels like a Deus Ex Machina solution if the worst truly were to come, so I'd want to see a Balrog plan that really tries to deal with a land of a pantheon of gods and legions of powerful elves. How would Saruman play a role in that? I don't think orcs, Easterlings,, and Haradrim would be enough.
Here's an idea: What if the Balrog and Saruman used Shelob to breed a force of spiders unlike anything ever seen? Maybe they would be larger, unafraid of light, able to spread darkness, insatiably hungry, and armored by the industry of the orc.
Please, do it
YES plz, a part 2 of this scenario would be amazing! when the video ended i was like NOOOOooo i wanna know how this ends so badly! lol
I love this pitch so much, I do feel like Valinor has too many unquantifiable variables in it's defence to figure out a decent idea of how it'd all go down there. But Gandalf the white returning to lead the last northern alliance, you gotta imagine Iluvatar would return him with the power and knowledge he needs to save the last vestiges of free people in middle earth. do you think he'd be returned with the intent to guide the free people to victory, or is the situation dire enough Eru has to step in and pull off a Deus Ex Machina through Gandalf and/or the Valar?
Saruman wouldn't want the destruction of Valinor. His ambition is to rule, not to wreak mindless havoc.
Leaving aside the impossibility of the "Balrog attacks Valinor" scenario, and assuming that the Balrog's fleet somehow reaches the shore without getting wrecked by Ulmo & co., the outcome will depend on whether orcs are considered Children of Iluvatar. We sort of have an idea of what would happen in either case. If they are, you will have Numenor 2.0 but slightly less apocalyptic: Manwe asks Iluvatar for help because he would literally have no other choice, and the story ends there. If they are not, you're looking at a souped-up Maia and bunch of savages attacking the seat of power of the Valar. Sure, there might be some destruction and some casualties, and some Teleri ships might get burned (again!), but... look at how the War of Wrath played out. A one-Balrog invasion would end in a curbstomp battle.
Your epilogues in these are always my favorite, because in all of them that I've seen, you give the world hope again. You remind us that even in your darkest what-ifs, hope isn't lost. Gandalf will still come back. Faramir and Eowyn will still meet and have a chance to lead their people together towards a stand against evil. Your epilogues in these, I think, are so in line with the overall themes in lotr, that no matter how bad it gets, light and good will find a way.
The big question I have is “Would a balrog master the ring?” Gandalf makes it quite clear that he would be mastered by it. Would a balrog be strong enough to flip the ring’s loyalty, or would its strength enhance the ring’s famed treachery?
I like the idea of Galadriel, Saruman, and Sauron suddenly realizing there’s a balrog on the loose.
I feel like the balrog would not be corrupted by the ring, as it is already corrupted by morgoth, a far stronger influence than sauron. If the white council found out there's a balrog on the loose, well they probably won't be very surprised. Gandalf would probably set out to meet the balrog in battle, galadriel could play more conservatively and decide not to act or join gandalf, and saruman would do as saruman does.
I think there is a misunderstanding here. One can both master the ring and be corrupted by it at the same time. Yes, the ring has a mind of its own since it was made with Sauron's own essence and power, but that doesn't mean that the ringbearer automatically turns into a puppet of the ring. A weak bearer may be tricked into claiming the ring and thus allowing Sauron to defeat him, but a powerful being who uses the ring can use it to its full potential (after some time of learning how to handle it).
The ring's sinister and corrupting influence isn't rooted in it's "mind", but in the power it represents for every living being. It's the ultimate tool of domination and coercion. The corruption it causes is the promise of total power over all things and beings - this is what makes it almost irresistible. The more noble-minded beings with strong will can resist this temptation longer than others, but in the end EVERYONE (except Tom Bombadil) would be corrupted. Yes, a weaker bearer would become a slave to the ring (like Gollum), but a being that is already powerful itself could successfully turn the ring against its own creator. But still, the new bearer would never give up on the goal of domination - that's what led Sauron to create it in the first place, what motivated him to join Morgoth, even what caused Morgoth to oppose Eru and the Valar in the very beginning of Ea. It's the "original sin" in Tolkien's world.
I agree with your theory. I believe Durin's Bane would be pulled towards Sauron, not to fight, but to pull it's "madter" to it's Real Master, Sauron. Then, the Balrog fights or Sauron gets the ring back and is as whole as he could be. Very intriguing! Also, would the Balrog even fight? Many underlings would leave him for "The True" Ring Bearer...
@@GmanGSW It's very clearly stated by Tolkien that a powerful enough bearer could defeat Sauron with the ring. I think you overestimate its "loyalty". The Balrog is a Maia, and one that is even more versed in forcing its will upon others than Gandalf or even Saruman. Mastering the ring would be easier for him.
The Balrogs are not interested in Sauron or his plans of ruling. Their master was Morgoth. Either the Balrog will deem himself the heir and continue Morgoth's plans or will try to bring back Morgoth.
I'll tell you, we wouldn't know because we'd all die in a fiery hell scape of utter horror.
I think a cool continuation to that epilogue could be that Durin's Bane turns on Umbar, Harad, and Rhun, since balrogs have no desire to rule Middle Earth like Sauron did; therefore the human realms in the south and east set aside their differences with the north and all band together to resist the balrog. I can even imagine Saruman and Gandalf reluctantly teaming up because of how perilous everything has become
I don't think Sauron would immediately leave Mordor with an army. He'd almost certainly send a Nazgul first to negotiate with the Balrog, to see if he can get any idea how the Balrog would feel about joining forces/serving Sauron. Sauron would definitely be afraid that the Balrog wanted to usurp him, as that's what he would do, and as we know from the "Why weren't the cracks of doom guarded" question, Sauron isn't great at viewing things from any perspective other than his own, but he would also know that if the Balrog truly did want to usurp him, riding out with an army to meet him would be futile. He would be terrified, and fortify himself in Barad Dur, just as Morgoth did in Angband.
I think it highly likely that in this scenario, particularly if Gandalf fails a second time, the Valar would ultimately intervene once more and Eriador would go the way of Beleriand.
I dunno. The Valar didn't destroy Eriador, that was Eru. So I think they would've intervened had the Balrog tried to invade Valinor. But if Sauron could have conceivably conquered Middle-Earth without the Valar intervening, than so could the Balrog.
@Theomite Beleriand was destroyed as a direct consequence of the War of Wrath, due to the utter devastation inflicted on the land by the warring hosts of Valinor and Angband, so I can't see Eriador faring too much better in the event of a second such war. Additionally, the reason I think the Valar would intervene against Durin's Bane even if they wouldn't against Sauron is because Sauron only ever wished to rule over Middle Earth, while the balrog's goal is explicitly Middle Earth's destruction and the return of Morgoth. The former preserves Eru's creations (which the Valar have at least some responsibility to protect), while the latter absolutely does not. Sure, Eru himself might be more prone to intervene in this scenario, too, but I believe he would rather have the Valar do it.
@@NewRepublicLoyalist
I would agree. While the Valar failed in their initial aims after Morgoth's initial defeat and then again on his escape after destroying the trees I think the sheer level of total devastation that a Balrog bolstered by the ring would prompt them to intervene, possibly with some prodding by Eru himself. It would likely be devastating to much of the west, although hopefully not as devastating as the destruction of Beleriand as their facing only a single Balrog, albeit one possibly strengthen somewhat by the ring.
@@stephenpickering8063if eru got involved, couldnt he take out the balrog without doing damage to the world?
@@tooslow4065
In theory he's all powerful so he should be able to do just about anything. However according to the books he's only intervened once, to destroy Numinor at the request of the Valar but why it was done in such a destructive way there might be something in the notes as to why a less destructive method couldn't be used?
This was a fun one, interested in Saruman's role in the theory. The epilogues always are fun, and this one did not disappoint. A follow up theory on attempting to free Morgoth would be awesome.
And if Galadriel comes back as the leader of the remaining Noldor to fight back would be nice.
If there was ever allowance for the use of a curse word in the Legendarium, it should be reserved for Denethor's reaction upon seeing a ring-bearing Balrog in the Palantíri.
What if: Bombur got the one ring!
Love these What If videos. Would love to see some centered around the 1st or 2nd Age maybe. Keep up the great work!!!❤
Oh the cliffhanger at the end with Gandalf the White returning! I know it is not in the style of this NOTR to further speculation, but what an alternate trilogy this scenario would make! Gandalf goes to Rivendell, inspiring Elrond to call upon his ancestor Earendil to return in his mighty skyship and the Valar to enter the fray and start kicking arse. Would love to have seen it!
Please, let this be the sequel!
It would be time to summon Tulkas back to work.
The One Ring is a tool that works according to the intention of the wielder to use it and allows him to develop the natural abilities he brings from existence. In line with this general rule, the answer to the question of what would happen if the Balrog known as Durin's Bane had the One Ring varies depending on the motivation of that Balrog. Do we know this, no. However, the fact that they deviated from Melkor's will shows that they generally have a motivation around Melkor's nihilistic philosophy. This means possible unconscious and instinctive destruction. It is unclear whether they have a personal motivation like Sauron. Therefore, it cannot be determined precisely and clearly what kind of character they will turn into when they have the One Ring or whether they will act with a purpose like Sauron's. Because we do not have enough information at this point. I don't expect Sauron and the Balrog to clash in this scenario. Because if the Balrog dominates the One Ring, the situation for Sauron is equivalent to the destruction of the One Ring. In that moment, Sauron is reduced to an ineffective state of mind.
The Ring is not a mere tool. It has a will of its own. And Melkor is not a nihilist. He is a passionate creator for whom things very much matter. His sin was to create in a mode alien to Eru's will, being himself excessively willful. He became destructive of the works of the other Ainur only out of bitterness and pride, not by dint of a nihilistic philosophy. I suppose nihilism could be a misconception of his desire to unmake the product of the Ainulindale--but only to wipe the slate clean and remake it in accordance with his own "discordant" themes.
The Balrog would never subordinate themselves to Sauron, and Saruman would never subordinate himself to the Balrog. Saruman may reconcile with the White Council and resume his role as the White Wizard as intended, while hiding his true ambition to rule himself. As soon as the Balrog claims the ring for himself, the bearers of the Three would perceive it and remove their rings. The elves of Lorien would flee north to join Thranduil. Saruman could use him "voice" to convince leaders of Gondor, Rohan, Erebor, Mirkwood, and Rivendell to form an alliance against this new "dark lord." As the Balrog increased his hold over the one ring, Orcs, Trolls, and the Nazgul would desert Sauron. Sauron might attempt to fight the Balrog directly but would likely lose. Or Sauron may flee to the East as he has done several times before, but once the Balrog "masters" the One Ring, Sauron would fade as his power is ripped away. After that it's a crap shoot. The Blue Wizards may appear with forces from the East or South. Saruman joins the forces of Rohan and Gondor. The Elves of Lindon and Rivendell join with the Elves of Mirkwood, Men of Dale, and Dwarves of Erebor and the Iron Hills. Radagst marches alongside Thranduill and Celeborn. If the Balrog moved south, then the great battle would be in the Wold or nearer to Edoras. With the remaining four Istari present, Eru would have no reason to reincarnate Olorin. Who would win this battle? Without the Corsairs to distract a full muster of Gondor, the hosts of the West may hold their own against the Orcs of Moria and Dol Goldur. I'd give the allies a better than even chance to defeat the Orcs and Trolls. The Balrog cannot make a cloud of shadow over Rohan since that was done using Mount Doom's volcanic clouds. It would come down to a repeat of Elendil/Gil-Galad v. Sauron with Elrond, Celeborn, Theodred, Imrahil v. the Balrog. My money would be on Elrond since he would have the backing of four Istari. Saruman could not help himself and he lunges for the ring as the Balrog goes down but dies as the Balrog falls upon him, destroying Saruman's body. Elrond takes the Ring to Mount Doom, destroying it, escaping on an Eagle.
Eru wouldn't allow the Balrog to annihilate middle earth, so in any case, there would be some sort of heavy dues ex machina here.
I think Durin’s Bane definitely would not agree with Sauron’s vision of Middle Earth, so he would definitely try to keep the Ring in the hope of bringing back Morgoth. I think that is the most accurate of the video. Everything else is cool speculation. Good video. I can see it coming out a lot of different ways, but the result is always the same: destruction.
The One Ring would betray even the Balrog over time and even a defeated and formless Sauron would find a chance to recover the Ring. Only if the Balrog somehow released Melkor beforehand and surrendered the One Ring to him would The One Ring be born by a being with a will even greater than its creator's.
A suggestion: what if Faramir went to Rivendell instead of Boromir? I think that would be really interesting since Faramir would know more about the lands near Gondor and could offer a protection to Frodo and Sam in their travels with Gollum. Anyways, great vid, as always!
Honestly I think if a Balrog would become the true second coming of Morgoth, that's the point in which the Valar would start to take a more active approach once more.
At least the ones like Orome, Tulkas and Ulmo which all already hated the first dark lord, but probably even Manwhe as that would truly be the end of Illuvatars children outside of Valinor.
Probably, even though that would result in yet another catastrophic damage to Arda, like all the times before when the Valar directly intervened with force - which they hoped to avoid this time by sending the Istári. But if they indeed intervene themselves, there is no doubt that they would defeat the Balrog - not even Morgoth himself with all his Barogs and countless more Orcs was able to resist their full power.
@@untruelie2640 Assuming Eru would allow them to directly intervene then they wouldn't even need their full strength. The combined forces and strength of all the Valar were sent against Morgoth because he was also a Valar and the strongest of them. They needed that strength to guarantee a victory. Against a single Balrog, even bolstered by the service of the fallen Saruman and the ring, only a couple of Valar would be needed. Ulmo and Tulkas would muster the forces of the Elves of Valinor and probably a number of Maia aligned with them. That would overwhelm the Balrog and its forces while hopefully minimizing the destruction done to Middle Earth. It still wouldn't be fun for the free folk but hopefully there would be a land left after the war.
Im not sure, Melkor was more powerful than the other Valor (in his prime) and was orders of magnitude more powerful than any Maiar
@@Sleepy.Time. The Valar defeated him twice though. Once after the awakening of the elves when they destroyed Utumno and captured him and once in the War of Wrath. (He became more and more "earth-bound" as his power was distributed between his servants)
@@joshuahogan3475 There surely would be some land left, but when the literal powers of the world fight, the world itself is damaged.
I would think since Denethor was long preparing for the invasion, and since the costal attacks weren't happening, Gondor's southern forces would have already been at the City, having not been engaged and distracted in the first place.
Chills. I love all of your videos but the depth you can go into with these branching points, thanks to your mastery of the lore, is breathtaking.
Here's a What If for you: What if Boromir didn't die? How would the story change, if it changed, with his survival? The What If is a great concept, keep up the awesome work
I love how you incorporate elements and plot points from the actual story as much as possible. It really make your theories seem that much more credible.
This is the theory I've wanted to see for a long time! I agree that Durin's Bane wouldn't give the Ring to Sauron, as it would see him as a failed upstart, who joined Morgoth much later than the Balrogs had, and was too diminished without his Ring for the Balrog to respect his raw power, either. One difference I think as to how things would play out is that Sauron would be aware of this, and would, instead of confronting Durin's Bane with only his own forces, he would likely form an extremely mistrustful and uneasy alliance of sheer necessity with the Free Peoples to combat the even greater threat to all of them. What would come of THAT situation is anyone's guess...
Good points. I didn't buy that part of the story (what-if) either. Your versions makes for a better story too.
It's also a bit strange to visualize the Balrog hold Sauron and burning him like that, when Sauron did a similar thing to Gil-Galad. I think Sauron's body was pretty similar to a Balrog at this point, black and hot, shadow and flame.
Next video, what if a troll got the ring. 😄
What a troll you are! 😅
April 1st video gold right here!
smhw I doubt they'd have it for long 😅
He would create an army vast enough to spam every RUclips video, Reddit thread, and news comment section with "FIRST!" comments
@@shinyespeon3995 😱
Dude, the way you described the fellowship getting run thru got my heart racing. Great theory stuff man, keep it up 👍 it’s just crazy enough to be hella entertaining
This one was insane, love it!!!
What If Bill the Pony got the ring😙
Then Bill Ferny would be in deep, deep trouble.
I really enjoyed the video, especially Saruman's win-win scenario and Balrog's refusal to submit, but I have a question for the scene immediately after: Even with the One Ring, could Durin's Bane simply make Sauron go "poof"? The visuals I picture are great on their own, just wanted to know how plausible that sounds.
it's a bit strange to visualize the Balrog hold Sauron and burning him like that, when Sauron did a similar thing to Gil-Galad. I think Sauron's body was pretty similar to a Balrog at this point, black and hot, shadow and flame.
I think we also have to take into account that the Balrog would not only have been in possession of The One Ring, but likely Narya and Nenya as well, adding even more to his power. He would've been extremely powerful and I personally don't see any except from Sauron himself posing a serious challenge. I actually really think of all the beings residing in Middle-Earth at the time, Durin's Bane acquiring The One Ring may have been the worst case scenario, even compared to Sauron. Think about it. Sauron wanted control. He wanted subjugation. He wanted to bring everyone under him and rule with an iron fist. Morgoth, and by extension the balrog's, wanted nothing but destruction and darkness and a remade Arda. A successful Sauron can, in time, be toppled thru revolt and revolution. You can't revolt against non-existence and wanton death and destruction. I also do not see a situation where Durin's Bane joins forces with Sauron simply because of the fact that, at least to me, it's clear that Sauron was aware of its existence and chose not to make contact. Thru stories, it was somewhat common knowledge among the elves what sacked Moria. Saruman knew. Gandalf knew. I really don't see a scenario in which Sauron was completely oblivious to the fact that there was a balrog dwelling in Moria. I don't think he tried to establish relations with it simply because he saw it as a threat to his power. As for Durin's Bane, I can't say for certain if it knew that Sauron endured or what had taken place outside of Moria, or if it really cared at all. It seemed content to remain hidden in its slumber until called upon by Morgoth, or until the end of days.
Exactly, Durin's Bane getting hold of the Ring would be amongst the greatest nightmares of Sauron I guess, a being as ancient and evil as himself, already corrupted and pure evil, the "temptation" of the Ring not being a problem but something the Balrog would welcome and embrace. I guess it would be the only being besides Sauron to make full use of the power of the Ring. And as you pointed out, their goals would not really align, and Sauron even "avoided" the Balrog already before, likely unsure if he could "control" it. If Sauron got the Ring, the Balrog would surely be one of his prime targets to get under his control, but without it, or even being in posession of the Balrog, Sauron would not dare to engage it.
@@DaRealNeithan Balrog and the Ring would be like a meme with Anakin and Padme:
- You'll take over the Earth and rule it , right? Right?
I’m a new subscriber to this channel, discovered it a couple of days ago and have been watching videos ever since, I’m utterly astonished at the depth of your content and the work that goes into each video, not to mention that fact you’re still managing to create content after all this time, thank you
Oh my god I remember commenting this exact question/idea back in the main Balrogs vid! Amazing to see you make a full theory vid about this!
I think this is, despite it being extremely unlikely, one of the more interesting what if's regarding the One Ring
There's 2 theories I'd like to see you eventually create! I've already seen a couple videos on these two topics I have in mind, but I'd like to hear your input and thoughts on "what if"!
1) "What if" Boromir got the ring?
2) "What if" Thorin Oakenshield survived the Battle of the Five Armies
I'd love to hear what you could come up with on both of those scenario's! I love all this stuff, keep up the good work 👍😉
Really cool! Now, for a what-if, how about a positive one? What if Feanor said "yes" instead of "no" when asked to break the Silmarils to restore the trees? Even though the Silmarils were already in Morgoth's possesion at this point, I expect this would have resulted in a much earlier War of Wrath, led by Feanor and the Noldor with full support and aid from the Valar, resulting in a much quicker defeat for Morgoth.
Your what if scenarios are always interesting, but this one was absolutely fascinating and gripping. The way you ended the epilogue, with the emergency of Gandalf the White, you absolutely owe us a sequel! Can hardly wait!
will you make a video about what if Faramir went to Rivendell instead of Boromir.
ohhhhh, good one!
I think faramir was mentally stronger than boromir, so he would be so tempted by the ring. he wouldn't try to take the ring from frodo. Boromir trying to take the ring from frodo made frodo decide to leave the rest of the fellowship and to not go to minas tirith. So in this alternative scenario frodo might end up in minas tirith with the whole fellowship. And without the 3 hunters, gandalf and the attack of the ends rohan would have lost the war against saruman.
WHAT IF ARWEN participate of the Fellowship representing Rivendell.
Aragorn probably would have been distracted all the time...
To be honest, the portraying of Arwen in the Fellowship movie was such a rape of the original lore, I mean, afaik Arwen was among the lastborn elves (the decision of mortality as being a half-elf was still to be made) in middle-earth, a precious treasure that the other elves would never have allowed to be put into danger. I mean, imho Elrond and his followers would have stormed nakedly into Mordor before they would allow Arwen to come to harm.
After 6,000yrs inside, the Balrog stands at the East Gate, blinking in the bright sunlight and looking at the vast, open spaces, starts feeling dizzy and runs back inside vowing that it'll "destroy the world tomorrow"
Daaaaaaaaamn!!! I've seen so many of your videos and love 'em all, but this one takes the cake. Such an enticing scenario, well-written and logical, and extremely grim and dark - bringing to mind the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. Thank you for your work, you rule!
If a Balrog got hold of the one ring.... He would become the End of level boss to end all the end level bosses you've ever had to fight anywhere at anytime.
I mean like it would be worse than the worse possible scenario.
Bascially it would be bad.
Ah yes, "You go to Brazil" kind've Boss
Sauron is significantly more powerful than a regular Balrog. Maybe Gothmog could've defeated him.
Morgoth coming back would be wayyy worse.
post game super boss
It would still seem weird for a maia with a ring made by a maia be more of a threat than Morgoth, who can occasionally temporarily be beaten by first age heroes
The Moria Balrog attacks Rivendell - and Glorfindel becomes the first and only person to slay two Balrogs! Of course, Glorfindel dies too - again - and his spirit goes off to the Halls of Mandos. Maybe Bilbo finds his old ring in the ruins of Rivendell??
this is the best follow up for the scenario the Nerds have discribed. This comment needs more likes people.
OMG! SUCH a great video, you are an awesome story teller my dude!
Have been asking myself this for a while. Loved the video and love ur content too. Really fires up my imagination.
In my headcannon, Durin's Bane was aware of the Ring's existence and presence, and the attack on the Fellowship was his second attempt to claim it, the first being the attack on Isildur in the Gladden Fields, which was the reason the Ring chose to be lost, rather than found by an orc loyal to a different master.
Well em if you read Unfinished Tales it becomes clear that the orcs who attacked Isildur followed Sauron and also why they did it
Wow! You just did more storytelling in this video than Hollywood has done in years. Good work!
Woah.. this clip was cooler than I imagined. Well done 👏
Well speculated! Enjoyed that a lot--thank you.
It's a truly harrowing thought to think about being Elrond, seeing the fires come up over the hills surrounding Rivendell, and realize that this must have been what the sky looked like over Gondolin before the end.
With the One and two of the Three in the hands of Durin's Bane, the Witch-King in Minas Tirith, and Saruman in Orthanc, I don't think Mirkwood, Dale, and Erebor can do this thing on their own. Maybe the Hail Mary play is sending Gandalf and a party of emissaries out to seek help among the Easterlings and Haradrim.
I would like to conjecture that Sauron, a Maiar, placed a lock on his One Ring; preventing any other Maiar from taking or being empowered by his One Ring. This is why Gandalf when approaching the One Ring, recoiled when it lay for the taking by Bilbo and when offered it by Frodo. Maiars and above are the only ones capable of controlling the One Ring and Sauron would lock them out of his soul; preventing them from assuming power over him. As for men, elves and dwarfs, his soul power in the One Ring would overpower them eventually. Hobbits the same, over a longer span of time.
Highly doubtful, as there were no other Maiar in ME other then Sauron and the Balrog when he forged the one ring. Whether he knew about the Balrogs existence before its reawakening is not clear. I don't think he would use needless magic and efforts to put such a long on it.
I got the impression that he recoiled because he sensed Sauron. He might not have known _why_ that was, but he wasn't going to find out the hard way.
9f course there was a protection.
A part of Sauron's soul was in the ring. Mastering it is like a constant battle with Sauron. The ring answers only to Sauron.
Gandalf in the books claimed that of all the beings in Middle-earth, he alone could make it his if he tried, although it would still corrupt him.
@@adorp Sauron without the ring is nonetheless in a weakened state. Being in a constant battle over yielding the one ring despite it really answering to Sauron, would probably be doable for any of the 5 wizards in ME. The Ring also had no effect on Tom Bombadil and it seemed as if the force behind the one Ring was easily and effortlessly subdued by Bombadil. For all we know, his wife would probably have done the same.
@@Aeros802 The ring had no effect on Bombadil, but Bombadil had no effect on the ring either. He is detached from the world. That is why he is immune. If he leaves his self-imposed boundary and attempts to seek more, he will likely become seduced by Sauron very easily.
About the five wizards, two were gone, one was too busy with birds are trees, another was busy playing game of towers.
Saruman did assist in the assault on Goldur... Eventually... But I doubt he would have, if not persuaded by Gandalf.
You got my sub. First time seeing any of your content. I loved this so much.
I DEMAND YOU CONTINUE THIS THAT WAS AWESOME
A potentially great What If would be if Morgoth escaped the void earlier and Sauron had just reclaimed his ring….. would he submit to Morgoth again or challenge his former master for domination over Middle Earth?
I think Sauron would submit to Morgoth pretty quickly, even with his Ring back. That might have been his ultimate goal after the conquest of Middle-earth, to dominate the land while waiting for his master to return. Sauron’s words to Ar-Pharazoan during Ankallabêth, encouraging the king to the worship of Melkor (and not to Sauron himself), seem to indicate this pretty strongly to me
Even with the ring Sauron is not even close to Morgoths power so yeah he would ultimately submit.
@@Destroyer94100 Yup. No disagreements there. Sauron poured the majority of his power into his ring while Morgoth’s ring is Middle Earth itself. Be one hell of a fight though.
Most likely. And then Morgoth, being the greedy drama queen that he is, would claim the Ring for himself, since he's probably weakened from his last encounter with the Valar. Then, he would seek out the two Silmarillions which are left on Arda (the one at the bottom of the sea and the one deep inside the Earth's magma) and challenge the Valar and Eru again.
@@--...-.-.-...- I think Morgoth would consider Sauron's ringcraft an inferior weak invention, he wouldn't care about the ring, he'd either destroy it or have it melted down to be remade with his own essence. If he DID try to claim the ring for himself, that might actually lead to his undoing as he'd essentially be submitting himself to Sauron's influence through the ring and with enough time he might be able to eventually overcome Morgoth. I think Morgoth would be far too clever and knowledgeable about ringcraft to ever be caught with that kind of guile though, he'd immediately perceive the flaw of doing that and reject or remake the ring (or more than likely try to remake the Iron Crown - with the remaining Silmarillion and perhaps then use the same sort of craft to put his essence into that).
Balrog could also take Gandalf's ring.
Wow, this is REALLY well done! Good work!
Yay! I asked this question about a year and a half ago what if the ball rug had gotten a hold of the one ring when they were in Boria? Thank you for deeming it a worthy question and a subject to research and develop. And wait to see what you come up with!
Ball Rug! :D
Wouldnt the Valar just smite the Balrog as soon as he gets into the sunlight? It is still the remainings of Morgoth . Thought the Balrog remained in Moria all those years to hide from the Valar
One of the theories about why Durin's Bane didn't leave Moria to ally with Sauron is because it was so traumatized by the War of Desolation and how the Valar almost completely wiped out the forces of Morgoth that it refused to step into the light again.
It’s funny you mention this because in the movies Gandalf does use a sword that gets hit by literal lightning to smite the Balrog. I wonder if Gandalf summons this lightning himself or if this is a nod at the Valar or maybe even Eru himself lending aid.
This. I think also if it tried to take the ring, Sauron would probably try to spook it and manipulate it with this very weakness, quietly whispering to it about how the Valar were going to come and get it, until he could make the Balrog submit or give into despair.
For sure thought you would mention Glorfindel. If he wore all three elven rings maybe he would stand a chance
I don't think Tolkien magic works that way. He would like likely lose control of all three.
Wow this is amazing please make a part 2!!! What If's are the way your channel should go. ✊🏿😁🔥
first time watcher and have to say, nice collection of fan art on your channel! I enjoy this work, subbed
Very interesting! I feel like the Nazgûl would submit to the Balrog immediately once he became the ring-bearer. This is precedented in the books when they talk to Saruman and he essentially says 'If I had what you are looking for, I would be your master." The Ringwraith's would bring with them all of Sauron's forces which would put Sauron, who can't take a physical form yet, in an uncomfortable spectator position. Not wanting to serve the balrog, he would likely be manipulating things as best he can so that any of the balrog's ambitions are thwarted. I can totally see Saruman feigning support for Durin's bane but all the while also conspiring against the balrog. In any case, I completely agree that nothing good is going to come from a balrog wielding the one ring. The forces of good would likely be destroyed one-by-one until Sauron or Saruman did something to trip up Durin's Bane.
He had physical form. Gollum saw his hand missing a finger.
Gandalf coming back at the end as the last hope. He's like the nemesis of Durin's Bane.
The intro is so dark and ruthless..... I love it!
Nice theory. I have a questions and an alternative event to propose. You've mentioned in an older video about the fate of the Orcs after Sauron's demise, that he had a hold on them, and by my reckoning the ring would be a powerful draw as well. So wouldn't the Orcs and Uraki in Sarumon's domain feel compelled to leave him for this new power? Might this alienate him from the events about to transpire between Sauron and the Balrog? It seems at that point he might be forced to become the new Gandolf. He would have to be the Wizard to unite the fragments of humanity if he were to have a shot at taking the ring at some future date. He might free Theoden from the brain fog, and he might encourage humanity to rally somewhere, including sending the eagles to rally support from the East.
Another thought you touch upon but don't capitalize on are the other rings. The Balrog might feel compelled to hunt the rings down to consolidate power. He has the one ring, but also likely Galadriel's as well. It seem logical that he would seek to bring them all under his command, and indeed become invincible. The time he might take to track down the Dwarven rings might buy the southern kingdoms time to come up with a plan... and as in your epilogue, Gandalf returns,bearing the last of the Elven rings. This could be quite the messy and desperate campaign.
Awesome video, maybe Gandalf with his new powers would now roam on the east for centuries as Sauron did to amass a force greater than the ones in Middle Earth, and maybe even travel to Valinor to get new allies and explain the situation, but for all of this to happen maybe another era would have to pass, maybe the fifth era would be the one were men, dwarfs and elves rule the world again.
What if Nerd of the rings was the main man regarding building out a TCU Tolkien Cinematic Universe. What age would he start in what characters both good and bad would he give us. As a fan I’d love to see a mini series about the children of Hurin & Beren and Luthien. 2 shows about them. Then a amazing Trilogy with when Melkhor first landed on Arda aka earth and took over. With each movie coming out every 2 - 3 years with a series between movies 1-2/2-3 just as extra flesh out time between the movies to get as much of the full story from Tolkien as possible. Also it would be kinda funny to see how Sauron being the big bad in 2 trilogies to being so much less then the true dark lord Morgoth
This video had me exclaiming out loud, over and over. The epilogue was an epic turn! Wonderfully conceived and delivered!
for other “what ifs”, I still turn to the intervention of the Vala. Ulmo comes to the Fellowship and brings them on an island to the middle of the Ocean, protected by his students, and likely out of the reach of Sauron given the repeated claim that the enemy has no dominion over water. Ulmo then requests Aluë to come to the island to destroy the ring. 😮
This was way cooler than expected. Awesome job!
One what if would be to see what would happen if Turgon leave Gondolin when Tuor said him that he must leave with his people
What if YOU got the One Ring? 🤔
My guess is he would try to use it for good - spreading the love and knowledge of Middle Earth to everyone in the world. But everyone would become so obsessed with Middle Earth that noone would have time to do anything else. Hence civilization would grind to a halt.
I think this one could use a part 2. Perhaps of some great struggle that results in the Balrog's defeat, and a hurried rush to get the ring to mount doom. I'm imagining Rivendell in battle, with Gandalf, Elrond, and Glorfindel battling against the Balrog in some great hope of it's defeat. ALthough I don't know if it would be within their power.
One of your best one ! Very thrilling! Thanks a lot !
What if Thranduil got the ring from capturing Bilbo while he was trying to break the dwarves out of jail. Would be interesting.
May I just say, I love that you snuck in a certain * young captain of Gondor * among the wounded. Between this and your Saruman theory, we’ve got amazing Farawyn fanfiction 😂 I love that no matter what alternate reality, they always find their way to each other!
Also if I hear a certain Aussie actor’s voice alongside Miranda’s this December I’m going to absolutely LOSE it 😂
This is one of the more interesting fan theories. Nice work! 😊
Definitely need a part 2 to this! Gandalf's return, the finding of Ringil, The Balrog opening the door of night but being quickly thwarted by Gandalf with help from the timely return of Radagast & a mysterious wizard in blue thought long perished. Queue the Dagor Ungo ar runya.
The Balrog recognizes Gandalf as a fellow Maia, and says, “Olórin? Is that you?” “Jerry?” says Gandalf. “Long time no see, dude! You still got some of that wine?” “You betcha!” replies the Balrog. “I’ll be right back!” He dashes back down the corridor and returns with a case of very old bottles full of very old wine. Everybody has some, and soon they all break out in song (the Balrog extremely off-key).
🎶Jeremiah was a Balrog
He was a good friend of mine
I never understood a single word he said
But I helped him drink his wine
And he always had some mighty fine wine🎵
(with apologies to Hoyt Axton and Three Dog Night)
The ring would definitely be bigger. Lol
That would make sense. Look at how small it normally is compared to one finger lol.
More of this exact theory playing out - it’s so well written 😊
I can’t imagine Galadriel would just stay in one place waiting for the balrog to come get her. More than likely, she would dispatch a company of archers to delay the orcs as much as possible while her people would attempt to make a run for it.
As for her, I could see Galadriel taking a small escort to make an escape eastward. The trick would be to evade both the Balrog to the north and Sauron to the east. Eventually though, she’d make it and reunite with her people in Mirkwood. Just in time for Gandalf’s return.
There's one thing missing from this : the plans of Eru Iluvatar. In Eru's vision and theme in the Music, every deviation created by Melkor came back into harmony.
Thus, we see that Bilbo's and Frodo's pity of Gollum allows Gollum to become the instrument of the One's destruction.
I think what this, and many of the alternate theories forget is that Eru always had a plan. The end was never going to be that the forces of Darkness would prevail. The Age of Men was always inevitable. On a human time scale, it may have appeared that Eru had forsaken Arda, but that wasn't the case. Eru was ever present, always in the nature of things, always leading fate to its inevitable conclusion.
However, Eru had to bring about the Age of Men in such a way as to forge Men into strong stewards, truly worthy of inheriting Arda. Eru allowed Morgoth and Sauron to shape the character and mettle of Men through adversity, but was never going to let Morgoth or Sauron succeed in the end.
If, in the end, the Men did not rise to the challenge, if they showed they were not worthy to inherit Arda, then Eru would have brought about the Final Battle. Arda would have been destroy, but so would the Darkness, clearing the way for Eru to bring about his true vision.
So, any hypothetical that results in darkness winning doesn't fully appreciate Tolkien's view of what Eru's plan truly was.
This was so cool! I would love seeing animations of these scenarios.
Your best most compelling theory video yet!
the problem w/ this theory is that it basically eradicates men and mortals who are not allowed in valinor unlike elves. that cant be allowed. men were not created by mistake to be erased altogether. there is unrevealed purpose in creating mortals. something would have to stop it. like sauron was thwarted the first time.
Illuvatar would just send the Valar a second time to prevent it, but he would allow his Children to be destroyed if it was their own doing that brought about their destruction - in this case its an external force they have no chance of matching, so he'd either even the playing field or just remove the external threat.
@@futuza I'm not sure he'd directly intervene. I feel like a God like Illuvatar creating a universe is kind of like us creating a large language model. We might completely understand how it's made, we might understand all of the inputs, but sometimes what comes out of it is just weird. Same thing creating a universe. It's a bit of a "black box" if you're watching it from the outside. It creates interesting outputs (Illuvatar seems interested in the beauty of the weavings or songs), but if you directly tinker with it you might break it beyond all recognition, and have to reset it and start from scratch.
So Illuvatar might well change an input to prompt a high order action by the Valar (like them sending more Maiar), but if he dinkered directly with the fine inner workings of the universe on too small a scale while trying to fix things, that might mess things up.
Even being a God has limits;), especially when you're trying to debug your own universe-sandbox code.
Thanks for crediting the Balrog as a true rival to Sauron and more than a mindless beast!
Your analysis seems reasonable. JRR Tolkien himself said that if Sauron and Saruman had fought for the One Ring, the winner would emerge free from doubt and more powerful. However, I love the ending, which indicates the West has not despaired and resurrected Gardalf.
Fantastic job! I love how Sauron is killed the same way he killed Gil-galad!
Saruman is written perfectly here, though I do wonder if perhaps not enough credit was given to Sauron whose skill for treachery and strategy were even greater than Saruman's.
Regardless, I love this story and I really hope you continue it sometime with Gandalf uniting what remains of the Free Peoples.
Much of the difficulty in LotR is getting the disparate nations to unite against an evil which most didn't know had returned, and whose rule was often subtle and relied on exploiting existing power structures (having towns pay tribute to him while letting them control banal day-to-day governance). Obviously this was still terrible oppression, a cause of horrific suffering, but easier for its victims and their rulers to resign themselves to than the certainty of absolute destruction that Sauron's Bane brings. Perhaps it wouldn't be so hard to unite the Men, Dwarves, and Elves against this more overt and destructive threat.
Gandalf might then turn his attention to Harad, as those Men would no longer be "employed" by Sauron, and unlikely to ally with a literal demon that wants to burn the whole earth to ash. So too would it be with the Men of Rhûn, and the 2 secret weapons hiding there: the Blue Wizards. Maybe together, eventually, after much treachery and consequence, they could convince Saruman to join them, the 5 Istari united in their sacred mission once more.
The combined forces of the remaining Elves (including Glorfindel), Dwarves, and Men (maybe even the full might of the Shire once the influence of the Balrog affects their lives), along with the 5 Istari, and anyone else they can find (the Great Eagles perhaps?) against Sauron's Bane who wants to bring Morgoth back into the world (but with the One Ring's influence, maybe it can trick him into bringing back Sauron's spirit instead) and is ready to wage war on Valinor itself to accomplish this.
Obviously I have some ideas of my own, but I would love to see You continue this story!💙
In PART 2 what I'd like to see is while the Balrog is in orthanc. The witch king is victorious in the seige of Minas Tirith (Part 1). The witch king then meets the Balrog some time later.
After pledging it's allegiance to the Balrog, it awards the Witch King Nenya, or the Ring of fire taken from a perished Galadriel or Gandalf.
Thus the Balrog gives the ring to witch king increasing his power with the rank of new Chief Lieutenant of middle earth along with Sarumon as advisor (Chief Lieutenant was Sauron's rank in the first age)
If any assault beyond Middle earth was going to happen the witch king would be needed in my opinion.
Would the Nazgûl have continued to serve Sauron once the Balrog had the ring? They are Ringwraiths after all. Wouldn’t the Balrog, a Maiar like Sauron, control the Nazgûl once he controls the ring?
They're only really loyal to Sauron because he's the lord of the ring, if someone else wielded it as intended, they could probably control them just off that. Even Frodo could've possibly controlled them, he just didn't use the ring.
They didn't serve Frodo when he had it, so, my guess is that yes, they would still serve Sauron.
@@plebisMaximusNo, no one can really wield the Ring except Sauron. All it does for everyone else is corrupt them, prolongue their life and transport them to the unseen realm when worn. Only Sauron knows all of the One Ring's secrets and only he can fully control it.
@@--...-.-.-...- Is that said directly anywhere? The way I understood it is it's a ring made to control other beings, that's it's primary and strongest power. If nobody but Sauron could use that power, then why would Galadriel and Gandalf be afraid of it wielding power through them? It's not like an immortal being could have their life extended, nor would Gandalf, a Maia like Sauron, be affected by the transport to the unseen realm he already half exists in. Same thing for Galadriel who's been to Valinor and therefore has a foot in the unseen realm herself. Instead, the only real explanation for their fear would be that they'd be able to use it to more or less the extent of its power, which includes the main feature of controlling the other rings of power and through them the Nazgul. Of course, they're extremely powerful in their own right, whether Frodo could feasibly do it if he really tried can be debated, but I don't think it would be impossible, after all, Boromir suggested letting the men of Gondor use it and that was shot down because it's too dangerous, not because it would be impossible. You're probably right Sauron would be the best at harnessing its power, he did make it and part of what gives it power is the piece of himself inside it, but I don't think there's anything in the source material that suggests he's the only one who could use the more alluring powers it holds.
@@plebisMaximus I believe it was Gandalf sho said that 'There is only one Lord of the Ring, only one who can bend it to his will, and he does not share power.'
This was a random recommendation and really cool.
Very well narrated and engaging.
Love this what if! Exceptionally told with valid theory crafting backing your ideas!