I’ve watched several videos and read a couple books about enneagrams recently. Until your video, I didn’t think I was any type. Most enneagram “experts” have a negative, almost visceral view of type 5 people. They all describe us as robots who suck the joy out of a room. I don’t feel that is me at all. You are the first content provider I have heard who seems to have some compassion for the 5’s, which seems to me to be the biggest redeeming quality of using personality typing. So, thank you. I am curious though. I am absolutely in my head, but I don’t think I use it to avoid emotions at all. I am typically more aware of my emotions than my peers. I don’t mind feeling them at all. I do, however, seem to experience life on so many levels at once that it is rare that I react to a situation solely on emotion. And I seem to feel more than one emotion in any given situation. For instance, if there is an emotionally charged situation, my friend might feel a tremendous amount of righteous indignation, and that guides her reaction. I might feel righteous indignation, compassion, confusion, concern, disgust, and fear. In the same time it takes her to rant, I have assessed my emotions, facts, possible sides, and several resolutions. I look like I have not reacted emotionally, but that’s not true. The only thing I haven’t done is rant. I get that many people really want me to rant (or cry or do a dance). I don’t understand what the payoff is, but there seems to be one. I guess I tend to be more curious about emotions than ruled by them, but it does not mean I don’t have them or run from them. Nor does it mean that they aren’t possibly more intense than those of my demonstrative friends. It doesn’t mean I can’t sit with sorrow or express genuine joy for those around me. I suppose the head part comes in knowing when that is appropriate or helpful and not just a way to meet my own needs. I am rather cold when others force themselves into my internal world (including emotions), and it feels like it is for their own ego rather than my benefit. I can be warm and open if I sense someone is genuine in their intent. And I get enraged when people attempt to emotionally manipulate me. I guess I’m just asking any 5s if you can be a 5 and have a rich emotional core.
Thanks so much for commenting and also opening your questions up to other 5s. I hope to see some answers come in on this. I think 5s are hard for a lot of people to understand, especially if they lead with one of the Heart or Body types. People seem to think 5s are complicated, and yet (I think) we are pretty simple. Don't invade us and respect intelligence and we'll get along fine (I'm joking there, but it's kind of accurate 😉). I agree that as a 5 I don't use my head engird to avoid my emotions. I dive into those, but prefer to do it either alone (so I can "hear myself think"), or with someone who really gets me. I don't know if that might resonate. I also get what you describe about feeling more than one emotion at once. For me that's something of a sorting process... I feel all the things, and my energy goes to sorting them out to perhaps label and definitely to understand them. This happens later though, not while I'm actively in the situation. The feelings need to go into their proper bins in my mind. There is also pattern differentiation: this emotion is like that experience. If I can figure out the patterns, I understand the feeling. I agree... that's not avoiding emotions. It's how we understand them. Because it's hard to feel alll of it in the moment. We need that distance to step back and assess it all. So, also, after writing that paragraph, I may be willing to concede that 5s are a little complicated. Because when I'm doing that it seems perfectly normal and simple. But re-reading that? Yeah, a little complicated maybe. LOL. As to the rich emotional core you mention, I'd be really curious to hear from the 5w4s on that because I'd bet they'd have some interesting words to share. But as a 5w6, I can still relate to all of what you said. So let's open it up to the 5s out there... what do you all have to say about how you feel your feelings as a Head type? How would you explain it to the other 8 types trying to understand the inner 5 world when it comes to emotions? Thanks again for your comment. And for the kind words. I'm glad that not only did this episode hold meaning for you, but that you were also able to land on your type!
I am a 5w4 with sexual subtype. I actually have quite deep emotions, but I am extremely reserved in sharing them (or the information in my head in general!) unless I can fully trust the other person. As of now, I truly crave that special someone in my life 😢. I reccomend watching this video on the subtypes : ruclips.net/video/-C61apTNHWk/видео.htmlsi=gJRYNzIudS4Xl1AJ
My description before knowing Enneahram is that I feel my emotions but I don't react to them. The common for is to react and express emotions, even if destructive but people allow, judge and forgive this approach. Non-reaction is seen as robotic. I have always struggled and assume a lack of imagination in other people. They can't imagine something is felt and not emoted. I always expect that everyone has emotions they just may or may not show them in a stereotypical way
I must be a 5w4 as a graphic designer. I identify with this, but I'm able to connect more with my emotions and honestly don't have a problem with multitasking. I definitely need to decompress. If I have a weekend where I need to have people over, I feel like I didn't get a weekend. I need at least one day a week where I can be alone, or just with my SO.
You have described me at various stages in my life both good and bad. The part about respecting a secret is spot on. The times that people have divulged something I told them in confidence was enough for me to write them off forever and have. And yes I am very private and not an open book. As a five I often marvel at the way people reveal every nuance of their life and they do it with such high degree of self importance as if everyone really wants to know. Very strange to me….
That sounds pretty spot on for a Type 5. Did you get to check out the episode on Type 5 and Water Violet flower essence? I suspect it might resonate for you too. Thanks for commenting!
You described me so well I am sharing this with my family members, who are as confused as I have been. I live like a monk and I love my life. I understand how my family takes my lifestyle as a rejection. I try to explain but they don't get it. This episode describes me perfectly. If they don't get then I can rest easy knowing they never will. Thank you! ✌️❤️
Aw, glad I could help lend insight. And I hope your family can see you and embrace your type 5 gifts. Yes, 5s need privacy and solitude. But they also bring grounding and objectivity and are great to have in the family system. I hope they can see and value all of what your Type 5 brings! Thanks for commenting!
Well, this channel sure looks interesting. I just started studying the Enneagram a couple of months ago, mostly as a tool for developing characters in my fiction, but I've really fallen down the rabbit hole. I like your unique spin of looking at various types relationships with narcissists. I'm looking forward to binging your channel some time! Btw, I'm a 5w4, and everything you said here is very accurate.
Glad you found the channel and are enjoying the content! And what a cool application of the Enneagram! Kind of funny too as years ago I taught creative writing workshops and teaching character development was my jam (this was way before I found the Enneagram). You are giving me some ideas for future episodes. Enjoy the trip down the rabbit hole! Please feel free to comment or ask questions!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher Oh, thank you for replying. And YES PLEASE, I would love to learn more about how to use the Enneagram to develop fictional characters! As a INTJ 5w4, I tend to write complex plots, deep ideas, and characters who are 5s, 8s, or 1-dimensional. Studying the Enneagram help me how narrow those choices were and gave me great hints for what other types my characters *could* be. It helped me create backgrounds for them by suggesting what experiences could shape them into who they are now. It gave me ideas for how they should act when they’re doing great and when they’re in a breakdown. I’m going my whole WIP character list using this wonderful new tool I have, but I have so much more to learn before I can do this systematically and well!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher My BIGGEST issue in my writing is that I know my very best stories are the ones that started with an idea for a character, but when I have a story idea that a situation rather than a character, I struggle to craft engaging characters for it.
Spot on in describing me as a Type 5. What was disappointing in the presentation was the absence of any insights into the director / directee relationship - any customizations of direction which work well with us Type 5s. Any comments?
I try not to do absolutes in spiritual direction (making space instead for how the Spirit moves in the context of the enneagram in each conversation, which hopefully is always different). You may like the episode where I discuss prayers for the types… that may touch on some of what you’re seeking. Everyone enters as they are though, not as their type. Some are stressed, some focused on goals. Some in shadow. Some highly evolved. I like to give directees the opportunity to enter as they are each time… and only then do we weave the enneagram wisdom into the conversation. It’s all customized… moment to moment pretty much… as the Spirit so guides. Hope that helps.
That’s funny… in my clinic I occasionally I get patients who hammer me with questions about ailments they never included in their intake. And I’ll joke and say, “well, I love a challenge!” I never thought of that as being rooted in my 5, but probably is! Thanks for sharing!
a LOT of this resonates with me, but the emotions part is not really accurate for me. I do feel them fairly strong, is just that there is a detachment from them. INTP type 5 is different than INTJ type 5 Joining mbti paints a more complete picture to me. - INTJ 5w4
Death is not a great fear. It's not a fear at all. Overload and intrusion are yuck. Not knowing the answer doesn't scare me. It's something that delights me... More to learn 😂
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher so I am 5w4 subtype self-pres... But I am new to this stuff, relatively so anyhow. I hear that severe situations can complicate things. I was sold into human trafficking as a toddler. I wasn't free until the end side of my 3o's. I'm so over joyed to be able to learn and grow and be me as I am... It's still unbelievable for me some days that I'm not still locked in that cage... 💜 Thank you for your videos by the way. I love to learn and this is really great to see people as they are. It's magical in a way. It unlocks a lot of the mystery that always seemed to allude me. The major pieces that I'm missing are the emotional responses and the lack of, what I perceived to be logical thought but instead emotive responses that appear to be survival responses. I loved that way for a while. Emotional responses seem to be survival responses, not well thought out. I'm not wrong about it all the time... But I am some of the time. Emotions confuse me 😂
@@auntieb3621 I'm so sorry you have seen such a painfully hard journey, especially at such a tender age. I am grateful that you have come through it and are now free. Your story certainly accounts for your earlier reply and makes great sense to me, and yes, such a history would complicate things, I agree. I also think (especially if it's strong) that your 4 wing can perhaps help you delight in not knowing the answer. The 4 energy likes to be unique, so finding a tough answer might make them feel special (and thus the risk of being wrong would be a lesser concern). It's a possibility anyway. Also, there's that stress line to 7 to consider as a 5... 7 is the Epicure, who likes to experience things and wants to have fun (learning delights you, so "fun" has a 5 vibe to it. Imagine a stack of a lot of books, you're reading a little bit of all of them, but never seem to finish one... this is a common theme for a stressed out 5... there's a sort of chaotic joy around learning new things. It need not be exactly this for you, but it is an example). But the lens of the survival response would definitely be in this. You have a very real understanding of true danger, so having the wrong answer is small stuff given what you've lived. Glad you found the episode helpful. And so glad you have found the enneagram! Thank you for sharing!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher you are so tender and kind. I read your replies to one of my best friends. We both ooo'd and awwwed... At your sweet remarks. I really enjoy conversing with you. Thank you again
The idea that 5s are unemotional is not true and isn’t even indicated by the Enneagram. (They are not robots.) Instinct is repressed in type 5, emotions scramble with the intellect. Many 5s are sensitive - it’s true that a lot of 5s disconnect from emotion in real time but that’s not a sign that they are unemotional. This sort of analysis causes a lot of 5s to mistype.
Much of what I talk about in the episodes has to do with the lower side of type. You are correct though, 5s don’t have easy access to the Heart Center (except through the harmony triad). So emotions are difficult, often overwhelming or even awkward, and require processing later. The level of emotionality also has to do with whether they are a 5w4 or 5w6, as well what their subtype is. Many factors come into play. The episodes can’t cover it all. That’s for deeper, personal, and more individualized work. I think it’s interesting you see 5s as mistyping themselves. My experience is most 5s land pretty solidly on their type and are pretty resolute about it. Thanks for commenting!
A bit of hyperbole. Perhaps a better way of saying it is that not having the answer feels like death. It’s not a “bigger fear” than death so much as it is a visceral response around not having the answer.
as a 5, i would sooner give away the diamond than other people's secrets
Absolutely!!! (I'm a five and a Deacon, so I get to do this as a vocation. 😊)
I’ve watched several videos and read a couple books about enneagrams recently. Until your video, I didn’t think I was any type. Most enneagram “experts” have a negative, almost visceral view of type 5 people. They all describe us as robots who suck the joy out of a room. I don’t feel that is me at all. You are the first content provider I have heard who seems to have some compassion for the 5’s, which seems to me to be the biggest redeeming quality of using personality typing. So, thank you.
I am curious though. I am absolutely in my head, but I don’t think I use it to avoid emotions at all. I am typically more aware of my emotions than my peers. I don’t mind feeling them at all. I do, however, seem to experience life on so many levels at once that it is rare that I react to a situation solely on emotion. And I seem to feel more than one emotion in any given situation. For instance, if there is an emotionally charged situation, my friend might feel a tremendous amount of righteous indignation, and that guides her reaction. I might feel righteous indignation, compassion, confusion, concern, disgust, and fear. In the same time it takes her to rant, I have assessed my emotions, facts, possible sides, and several resolutions. I look like I have not reacted emotionally, but that’s not true. The only thing I haven’t done is rant. I get that many people really want me to rant (or cry or do a dance). I don’t understand what the payoff is, but there seems to be one. I guess I tend to be more curious about emotions than ruled by them, but it does not mean I don’t have them or run from them. Nor does it mean that they aren’t possibly more intense than those of my demonstrative friends. It doesn’t mean I can’t sit with sorrow or express genuine joy for those around me. I suppose the head part comes in knowing when that is appropriate or helpful and not just a way to meet my own needs. I am rather cold when others force themselves into my internal world (including emotions), and it feels like it is for their own ego rather than my benefit. I can be warm and open if I sense someone is genuine in their intent. And I get enraged when people attempt to emotionally manipulate me.
I guess I’m just asking any 5s if you can be a 5 and have a rich emotional core.
Thanks so much for commenting and also opening your questions up to other 5s. I hope to see some answers come in on this.
I think 5s are hard for a lot of people to understand, especially if they lead with one of the Heart or Body types. People seem to think 5s are complicated, and yet (I think) we are pretty simple. Don't invade us and respect intelligence and we'll get along fine (I'm joking there, but it's kind of accurate 😉).
I agree that as a 5 I don't use my head engird to avoid my emotions. I dive into those, but prefer to do it either alone (so I can "hear myself think"), or with someone who really gets me. I don't know if that might resonate. I also get what you describe about feeling more than one emotion at once. For me that's something of a sorting process... I feel all the things, and my energy goes to sorting them out to perhaps label and definitely to understand them. This happens later though, not while I'm actively in the situation. The feelings need to go into their proper bins in my mind. There is also pattern differentiation: this emotion is like that experience. If I can figure out the patterns, I understand the feeling. I agree... that's not avoiding emotions. It's how we understand them. Because it's hard to feel alll of it in the moment. We need that distance to step back and assess it all.
So, also, after writing that paragraph, I may be willing to concede that 5s are a little complicated. Because when I'm doing that it seems perfectly normal and simple. But re-reading that? Yeah, a little complicated maybe. LOL.
As to the rich emotional core you mention, I'd be really curious to hear from the 5w4s on that because I'd bet they'd have some interesting words to share. But as a 5w6, I can still relate to all of what you said.
So let's open it up to the 5s out there... what do you all have to say about how you feel your feelings as a Head type? How would you explain it to the other 8 types trying to understand the inner 5 world when it comes to emotions?
Thanks again for your comment. And for the kind words. I'm glad that not only did this episode hold meaning for you, but that you were also able to land on your type!
I am a 5w4 with sexual subtype. I actually have quite deep emotions, but I am extremely reserved in sharing them (or the information in my head in general!) unless I can fully trust the other person. As of now, I truly crave that special someone in my life 😢. I reccomend watching this video on the subtypes :
ruclips.net/video/-C61apTNHWk/видео.htmlsi=gJRYNzIudS4Xl1AJ
My description before knowing Enneahram is that I feel my emotions but I don't react to them. The common for is to react and express emotions, even if destructive but people allow, judge and forgive this approach. Non-reaction is seen as robotic.
I have always struggled and assume a lack of imagination in other people. They can't imagine something is felt and not emoted.
I always expect that everyone has emotions they just may or may not show them in a stereotypical way
I must be a 5w4 as a graphic designer. I identify with this, but I'm able to connect more with my emotions and honestly don't have a problem with multitasking. I definitely need to decompress. If I have a weekend where I need to have people over, I feel like I didn't get a weekend. I need at least one day a week where I can be alone, or just with my SO.
Thanks for commenting! Definitely sounds like 5w4!
You have described me at various stages in my life both good and bad. The part about respecting a secret is spot on. The times that people have divulged something I told them in confidence was enough for me to write them off forever and have. And yes I am very private and not an open book. As a five I often marvel at the way people reveal every nuance of their life and they do it with such high degree of self importance as if everyone really wants to know. Very strange to me….
That sounds pretty spot on for a Type 5. Did you get to check out the episode on Type 5 and Water Violet flower essence? I suspect it might resonate for you too. Thanks for commenting!
Remember it can be considered very strange not to be open about yourself
You described me so well I am sharing this with my family members, who are as confused as I have been. I live like a monk and I love my life. I understand how my family takes my lifestyle as a rejection. I try to explain but they don't get it.
This episode describes me perfectly.
If they don't get then I can rest easy knowing they never will.
Thank you! ✌️❤️
Aw, glad I could help lend insight. And I hope your family can see you and embrace your type 5 gifts. Yes, 5s need privacy and solitude. But they also bring grounding and objectivity and are great to have in the family system. I hope they can see and value all of what your Type 5 brings! Thanks for commenting!
very accurate. I like your concept of hoarding time and information. Being exposed for something i didn't prepare for is terrifying
Glad it was helpful! Thanks for sharing your experience!
Doom scrolling. I love that term. I've also heard it combined with bed rotting (staying in bed all day scrolling).
Bed rotting is a new one for me! Thanks for commenting!
You are so good. I am 5 and you are spot on.
Thanks for commenting. Glad to hear the content resonates for you!
Wish I would have known about this years ago. Could have made a difference with a lot of problems I had.
I totally get that. Me too. But we get the information when we get it and what matters most is what we choose to do with it then.
Thanks Maria, I am a 5w6. You are on point.
Thanks for the feedback! Glad you liked the episode!
Well, this channel sure looks interesting. I just started studying the Enneagram a couple of months ago, mostly as a tool for developing characters in my fiction, but I've really fallen down the rabbit hole. I like your unique spin of looking at various types relationships with narcissists. I'm looking forward to binging your channel some time! Btw, I'm a 5w4, and everything you said here is very accurate.
Glad you found the channel and are enjoying the content! And what a cool application of the Enneagram! Kind of funny too as years ago I taught creative writing workshops and teaching character development was my jam (this was way before I found the Enneagram). You are giving me some ideas for future episodes. Enjoy the trip down the rabbit hole! Please feel free to comment or ask questions!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher Oh, thank you for replying. And YES PLEASE, I would love to learn more about how to use the Enneagram to develop fictional characters! As a INTJ 5w4, I tend to write complex plots, deep ideas, and characters who are 5s, 8s, or 1-dimensional. Studying the Enneagram help me how narrow those choices were and gave me great hints for what other types my characters *could* be. It helped me create backgrounds for them by suggesting what experiences could shape them into who they are now. It gave me ideas for how they should act when they’re doing great and when they’re in a breakdown. I’m going my whole WIP character list using this wonderful new tool I have, but I have so much more to learn before I can do this systematically and well!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher My BIGGEST issue in my writing is that I know my very best stories are the ones that started with an idea for a character, but when I have a story idea that a situation rather than a character, I struggle to craft engaging characters for it.
Resonates with me 100%. Thank you.
Glad you appreciated the content! Thanks for commenting!
Spot on in describing me as a Type 5. What was disappointing in the presentation was the absence of any insights into the director / directee relationship - any customizations of direction which work well with us Type 5s. Any comments?
I try not to do absolutes in spiritual direction (making space instead for how the Spirit moves in the context of the enneagram in each conversation, which hopefully is always different). You may like the episode where I discuss prayers for the types… that may touch on some of what you’re seeking. Everyone enters as they are though, not as their type. Some are stressed, some focused on goals. Some in shadow. Some highly evolved. I like to give directees the opportunity to enter as they are each time… and only then do we weave the enneagram wisdom into the conversation. It’s all customized… moment to moment pretty much… as the Spirit so guides. Hope that helps.
Very accurate and balanced type assessment skills . Rare!
Thank you! Glad you liked the episode!
I’m a 5w4 and a retail manager. The bombarding amount of questions that customers have for me can be overwhelming, but I’ve taken it as a challenge
That’s funny… in my clinic I occasionally I get patients who hammer me with questions about ailments they never included in their intake. And I’ll joke and say, “well, I love a challenge!” I never thought of that as being rooted in my 5, but probably is! Thanks for sharing!
Definitely feel seen and understood as a 5! Appreciate this video!
Glad the content resonated for you! Thanks for commenting!
This was really good and really helpful. Thank you.
You’re very welcome. Glad the information was helpful!
a LOT of this resonates with me, but the emotions part is not really accurate for me. I do feel them fairly strong, is just that there is a detachment from them. INTP type 5 is different than INTJ type 5 Joining mbti paints a more complete picture to me. - INTJ 5w4
Yep, I was going to say that sounds like 5w4.
Death is not a great fear. It's not a fear at all. Overload and intrusion are yuck. Not knowing the answer doesn't scare me. It's something that delights me... More to learn 😂
Interesting. Do you know your subtype? This could be part of it.
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher so I am 5w4 subtype self-pres... But I am new to this stuff, relatively so anyhow. I hear that severe situations can complicate things. I was sold into human trafficking as a toddler. I wasn't free until the end side of my 3o's. I'm so over joyed to be able to learn and grow and be me as I am... It's still unbelievable for me some days that I'm not still locked in that cage... 💜 Thank you for your videos by the way. I love to learn and this is really great to see people as they are. It's magical in a way. It unlocks a lot of the mystery that always seemed to allude me. The major pieces that I'm missing are the emotional responses and the lack of, what I perceived to be logical thought but instead emotive responses that appear to be survival responses. I loved that way for a while. Emotional responses seem to be survival responses, not well thought out. I'm not wrong about it all the time... But I am some of the time. Emotions confuse me 😂
@@auntieb3621 I'm so sorry you have seen such a painfully hard journey, especially at such a tender age. I am grateful that you have come through it and are now free. Your story certainly accounts for your earlier reply and makes great sense to me, and yes, such a history would complicate things, I agree. I also think (especially if it's strong) that your 4 wing can perhaps help you delight in not knowing the answer. The 4 energy likes to be unique, so finding a tough answer might make them feel special (and thus the risk of being wrong would be a lesser concern). It's a possibility anyway. Also, there's that stress line to 7 to consider as a 5... 7 is the Epicure, who likes to experience things and wants to have fun (learning delights you, so "fun" has a 5 vibe to it. Imagine a stack of a lot of books, you're reading a little bit of all of them, but never seem to finish one... this is a common theme for a stressed out 5... there's a sort of chaotic joy around learning new things. It need not be exactly this for you, but it is an example). But the lens of the survival response would definitely be in this. You have a very real understanding of true danger, so having the wrong answer is small stuff given what you've lived. Glad you found the episode helpful. And so glad you have found the enneagram! Thank you for sharing!
@@mariamandarino-wisdom-teacher you are so tender and kind. I read your replies to one of my best friends. We both ooo'd and awwwed... At your sweet remarks. I really enjoy conversing with you. Thank you again
The idea that 5s are unemotional is not true and isn’t even indicated by the Enneagram. (They are not robots.) Instinct is repressed in type 5, emotions scramble with the intellect. Many 5s are sensitive - it’s true that a lot of 5s disconnect from emotion in real time but that’s not a sign that they are unemotional. This sort of analysis causes a lot of 5s to mistype.
Much of what I talk about in the episodes has to do with the lower side of type. You are correct though, 5s don’t have easy access to the Heart Center (except through the harmony triad). So emotions are difficult, often overwhelming or even awkward, and require processing later. The level of emotionality also has to do with whether they are a 5w4 or 5w6, as well what their subtype is. Many factors come into play. The episodes can’t cover it all. That’s for deeper, personal, and more individualized work. I think it’s interesting you see 5s as mistyping themselves. My experience is most 5s land pretty solidly on their type and are pretty resolute about it. Thanks for commenting!
Do 5s become addicts?
I’d say there are 9 unhealthy reflections of addiction. Addiction has more to do with the level of health (or lack of health) in the individual.
Death is a bigger fear than not having the answer.
A bit of hyperbole. Perhaps a better way of saying it is that not having the answer feels like death. It’s not a “bigger fear” than death so much as it is a visceral response around not having the answer.
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