@@MrStephenLodge I mean he had to create angels of death to do it and needed to take steps for it to happen. The Toymaker could just make anything happen. And also, I don't think the doctor could have got a lead around the Toymaker's neck and drag him through the vortex.
@@adamfreddo5703 A bit like saying the big guy down the Gym was more powerful than Napoleon because he could personally beat people up.To me to be able to create people or take over people and control them is far more powerful than something that can trick people and do impressive conjuring tricks. Any defeating of any undefeatable being is always underwhelming Sutekh could of just of took his smoke form and slipped the leash but that would of been the end of everything and the show. LOL
I have a question that absolutely nobody so far seems to have touched on... How on earth did the dust kill the vlinx? I thought it was a computer but it would seem from that that there's some organic, or at least sentient component to the vlinx, which A. I didn't know, and B. In that case why did it not kill the tardis? I feel like I've missed something as nobody else has mentioned it... help?
i mean hes a god he can do what he wants. The tardis is basically a god level being you dont just dust a tardis. a random robot less sophisticated than an early cyberman isnt a challange
The question is often posed and in this episode the doctor worries he is a disaster and it is Kate who encourages him. I wonder... . The episode and season seems to leave faith in the doctor as a question. @choswnchimp like you noticed the sacrin resolution of ruby road story, i noticed the disconnect between the nostalgic answer of kate and the doctor's deeds in the episode. RTD problemitized the doctor in several ways this season, e.g. treatment of Susan, his absence in 73 yards, recklessness in rogue, etc. this episode is only a happy ending because of a sort of faith in the doctor. Sue says "i am a creature of a dark god, but you say i am fine." Each character died, but that is fine." Etc. because the doctor says so. Yet the doctor has been on the back foot this whole season. This ignorance is only reemphasized by floods 4th wall break looking like the white witch from the lion the witch and the wardrobe and it snows. Rtd is being subtle by half. If these things are un finished, rtd might be frustrating your question does it have a consistent feel once again. don't get me wrong there are moral delemas and character dramas in this season, but i think this season also asks questions of story-tellers. Is it true to life if there is a smile at the end of the episode? Is cannon or "fan service" satisfying? The necessity of play or fantasy or cosplay? I could go on. It is crazy to me how this season pushes the audiences buttons. Nice work here, chimp. Looking forward to your videos in the hiatas.
The episode was all over the place and then I was completely taken out of the story with the reunion at the end. I agree that they need to tone down the finales, the massive apocalyptic element has been overdone now, as soon as everyone dies it obvious it's just going to be another reversal. A waste of a classic villain really. As for my rankings: 8. Space Babies 7. Empire of Death 6. Rogue 5. The Devils Chord (as long as I skip the last 5 minutes) 4. Boom 3. 73 Yards 2. Dot and Bubble 1. The Legend of Ruby Sunday (Not the best story-wise but it was the only story that had me on the edge of my seat)
I crunched the numbers on my own ratings chart for the season, episode by episode. I loved The Legend of Ruby Sunday, but have not felt this let down by a part 2 since Last of the Time Lords.Empire of Death just failed to deliver on any of the tension or mystery of and elements of part 1 that I loved. The instant jump towards a reset button ending on top of the ending not coming together for me just simply hurt. That said however, this season has rated very highly with me overall. Like you, best since Capaldi, and maybe, MAYBE, the strongest of the revival/nu era in terms of consistent bangers and fun.
Teloses destruction can still work because it could of just happened before telos was destroyed remember time travel these were happening in different time lines so yea telos’s destruction can still work besides telos wasn’t really destroyed until the cyberman series I thought that telos was just seriously affected by that fleet of cyber ships causing an extinction level event also telos is bigger than earth
Hey everyone did anyone else notice the snow at the end of the episode of mrs flood since it always snows so do this mean that mrs flood has been following the doctor everywhere he went
I feel like Disney's making everyone be happily ever after which I don't like. With previous rtd finales there's been something bad to the characters but here there wasn't and it felt wrong. Ruby and the doctor parting ways didn't feel right because they've hardly been seen with each other and the doctors cried in every episode
I liked the reunion with her mother, so refreshing not to have the usual overblown drama that is normally played out with these reunions. Plus the "spoon section" like you said was a nice slow down but also told us the devastation had been going on for a while at this point which I feel you may of missed.
Am I a bad person for hoping that the destruction of the Vlinx would be permanent? It's far too close to the Kamelion for comfort. IMHO, a disembodied voice like TIM (Tomorrow People) or Zen (Blake's 7) would work better.
This was so badly written. The dialogue and some of the acting, too. The idea that Sutekh has been hanging on to the Tardis for what in the Doctor's time is over 1000 years is ridiculous. I also miss when U.N.I.T. was primarily a military organisation, not school kids and mums.
I had fun. I just found it “good”. Not as good as RTD’s other finales, but “good”. And “good” is good enough after many years of “not good”. I enjoyed the series. It’s the first time I’ve enjoyed Doctor Who in fifteen years, which is an ironic amount of time. Ranking: 1. 73 Yards 2. Dot and Bubble. 3. Boom. 4. Rogue. 5. Empire of Death. 6. Devil’s Chord. 7. Space Babies.
Cheers Chimp. Hope feel better soon. So so dissapointed. As a Doctor Who fan for over 40 years. This season as a whole has been very enjoyable. I dont get the hate it seems to be unjustly warranting as a whole, however after a sensational penultimate episode in The Legend of Ruby Sunday and the reveal of an old foe Sutekh, RTD let fans down in Empire of Death as he couldn’t stick the finale. Once again RTD gives us a Deus ex Machina ending. I dont like to be negative but it felt very rushed and lazy. The answers as to how Sutekh survived from Pyramids of Mars were nonsense. So we are meant to believe he has been inhabiting the Tardis all this time since the Fourth Doctor? Lazy. Then Sutekh was kind of redundant in this episode and defeated in bizarre fashion. What was with the whistle and Tardis??? Very confusing. How did the time vortex kill Sutekh when he survived in it previously?? Just felt at odds with what came before. We had too much mystery without much pay off. RTD couldn't land the finale imo. On the point of Ruby’s mum if she was just a 15 year old girl what was with the elaborate costume? Pretty sure this wasn’t the fashion for teens in 2004. Just feel deflated right now and certainly not invested in Mrs Flood.
LOL, it won't. Nothing about Ruby was important. Never explained why she was so crucial to why Sutec was so bothered about her. She's important because, "we think she's important". ........................ WHAAAAAAAAAT?
@@PeterCamberwick It was needing to know and understand, that was Sutekhs downfall. So its funny that some people are getting hate up by not being given all the answers to their satisfaction. LOL
This entire season has featured very sub-par story writing for the normally excellent Doctor Who series. This is not about so-called woke-ism, because if you ignore any social inclusion references, the stories are still not very intriguing. Sure, the special effects and sets are better, but thaty’s just due to Disney’s cash infusion.The stories are simple and lacking depth, as though they are written to appeal to children. I can’t tell whether this is on purpose, or whether the writers are out of good ideas or what.
Weird how The Toymaker felt more powerful than Sutekh. Guy could click his fingers and do anything, yet he feared Sutekh?
More dangerous than a being that turned all life to dust in the universe and beyond all because of his paranoia?
@@MrStephenLodge I mean he had to create angels of death to do it and needed to take steps for it to happen. The Toymaker could just make anything happen. And also, I don't think the doctor could have got a lead around the Toymaker's neck and drag him through the vortex.
@@adamfreddo5703 A bit like saying the big guy down the Gym was more powerful than Napoleon because he could personally beat people up.To me to be able to create people or take over people and control them is far more powerful than something that can trick people and do impressive conjuring tricks. Any defeating of any undefeatable being is always underwhelming Sutekh could of just of took his smoke form and slipped the leash but that would of been the end of everything and the show. LOL
Mrs. Flood acts like a reformed The Master, to me. Although others have brought a good point about her outfit looking like Mary Tam's
A three part finale? Why not a whole season trying to fix Sutekh's shenanigans?
I have a question that absolutely nobody so far seems to have touched on... How on earth did the dust kill the vlinx? I thought it was a computer but it would seem from that that there's some organic, or at least sentient component to the vlinx, which A. I didn't know, and B. In that case why did it not kill the tardis? I feel like I've missed something as nobody else has mentioned it... help?
No not missed anything just sadly I don’t think RTD thought this one through.
@@worldgame7754 I really hope there's more to it than that...
i mean hes a god he can do what he wants. The tardis is basically a god level being you dont just dust a tardis. a random robot less sophisticated than an early cyberman isnt a challange
@@lilkris3008 That's probably more thought than Russel put in to it.
To put it simply, this isn't what I pay my TV license for
The question is often posed and in this episode the doctor worries he is a disaster and it is Kate who encourages him. I wonder... . The episode and season seems to leave faith in the doctor as a question. @choswnchimp like you noticed the sacrin resolution of ruby road story, i noticed the disconnect between the nostalgic answer of kate and the doctor's deeds in the episode. RTD problemitized the doctor in several ways this season, e.g. treatment of Susan, his absence in 73 yards, recklessness in rogue, etc. this episode is only a happy ending because of a sort of faith in the doctor. Sue says "i am a creature of a dark god, but you say i am fine." Each character died, but that is fine." Etc. because the doctor says so. Yet the doctor has been on the back foot this whole season. This ignorance is only reemphasized by floods 4th wall break looking like the white witch from the lion the witch and the wardrobe and it snows. Rtd is being subtle by half. If these things are un finished, rtd might be frustrating your question does it have a consistent feel once again. don't get me wrong there are moral delemas and character dramas in this season, but i think this season also asks questions of story-tellers. Is it true to life if there is a smile at the end of the episode? Is cannon or "fan service" satisfying? The necessity of play or fantasy or cosplay? I could go on. It is crazy to me how this season pushes the audiences buttons. Nice work here, chimp. Looking forward to your videos in the hiatas.
RTD is now a genius at creating unintentional comedy. So bad it’s hilarious.
The episode was all over the place and then I was completely taken out of the story with the reunion at the end. I agree that they need to tone down the finales, the massive apocalyptic element has been overdone now, as soon as everyone dies it obvious it's just going to be another reversal. A waste of a classic villain really.
As for my rankings:
8. Space Babies
7. Empire of Death
6. Rogue
5. The Devils Chord (as long as I skip the last 5 minutes)
4. Boom
3. 73 Yards
2. Dot and Bubble
1. The Legend of Ruby Sunday (Not the best story-wise but it was the only story that had me on the edge of my seat)
I crunched the numbers on my own ratings chart for the season, episode by episode. I loved The Legend of Ruby Sunday, but have not felt this let down by a part 2 since Last of the Time Lords.Empire of Death just failed to deliver on any of the tension or mystery of and elements of part 1 that I loved. The instant jump towards a reset button ending on top of the ending not coming together for me just simply hurt.
That said however, this season has rated very highly with me overall. Like you, best since Capaldi, and maybe, MAYBE, the strongest of the revival/nu era in terms of consistent bangers and fun.
Teloses destruction can still work because it could of just happened before telos was destroyed remember time travel these were happening in different time lines so yea telos’s destruction can still work besides telos wasn’t really destroyed until the cyberman series I thought that telos was just seriously affected by that fleet of cyber ships causing an extinction level event also telos is bigger than earth
I'm being too picky if I'm bothered about the snow? Is a plothole? it's obviously important, but it is never explained
Hey everyone did anyone else notice the snow at the end of the episode of mrs flood since it always snows so do this mean that mrs flood has been following the doctor everywhere he went
I feel like Disney's making everyone be happily ever after which I don't like. With previous rtd finales there's been something bad to the characters but here there wasn't and it felt wrong. Ruby and the doctor parting ways didn't feel right because they've hardly been seen with each other and the doctors cried in every episode
I liked the reunion with her mother, so refreshing not to have the usual overblown drama that is normally played out with these reunions. Plus the "spoon section" like you said was a nice slow down but also told us the devastation had been going on for a while at this point which I feel you may of missed.
Glad I wasn't the only one to question a Machine Gun Segway (and its location behind the Front Line).
Was it explained why Sutekh needed Susan Triad AND Harriet Arbinger?
Am I a bad person for hoping that the destruction of the Vlinx would be permanent? It's far too close to the Kamelion for comfort.
IMHO, a disembodied voice like TIM (Tomorrow People) or Zen (Blake's 7) would work better.
I still don't believe that woman is rubys real mum
This was so badly written.
The dialogue and some of the acting, too.
The idea that Sutekh has been hanging on to the Tardis for what in the Doctor's time is over 1000 years is ridiculous.
I also miss when U.N.I.T. was primarily a military organisation, not school kids and mums.
I had fun. I just found it “good”. Not as good as RTD’s other finales, but “good”. And “good” is good enough after many years of “not good”.
I enjoyed the series. It’s the first time I’ve enjoyed Doctor Who in fifteen years, which is an ironic amount of time.
Ranking:
1. 73 Yards
2. Dot and Bubble.
3. Boom.
4. Rogue.
5. Empire of Death.
6. Devil’s Chord.
7. Space Babies.
Cheers Chimp. Hope feel better soon. So so dissapointed. As a Doctor Who fan for over 40 years. This season as a whole has been very enjoyable. I dont get the hate it seems to be unjustly warranting as a whole, however after a sensational penultimate episode in The Legend of Ruby Sunday and the reveal of an old foe Sutekh, RTD let fans down in Empire of Death as he couldn’t stick the finale. Once again RTD gives us a Deus ex Machina ending. I dont like to be negative but it felt very rushed and lazy. The answers as to how Sutekh survived from Pyramids of Mars were nonsense. So we are meant to believe he has been inhabiting the Tardis all this time since the Fourth Doctor? Lazy. Then Sutekh was kind of redundant in this episode and defeated in bizarre fashion. What was with the whistle and Tardis??? Very confusing. How did the time vortex kill Sutekh when he survived in it previously?? Just felt at odds with what came before. We had too much mystery without much pay off. RTD couldn't land the finale imo. On the point of Ruby’s mum if she was just a 15 year old girl what was with the elaborate costume? Pretty sure this wasn’t the fashion for teens in 2004. Just feel deflated right now and certainly not invested in Mrs Flood.
It's perfect.... Perfectly awful. RTD just can't write finales and someone should stop him.
"Parting of the Ways" was rather good.
Just remembered you said Rubys mother had an abusive partner, it was in fact an abusive step father it may or may not be important next season.
LOL, it won't. Nothing about Ruby was important. Never explained why she was so crucial to why Sutec was so bothered about her. She's important because, "we think she's important". ........................ WHAAAAAAAAAT?
@@PeterCamberwick It was needing to know and understand, that was Sutekhs downfall. So its funny that some people are getting hate up by not being given all the answers to their satisfaction. LOL
This entire season has featured very sub-par story writing for the normally excellent Doctor Who series. This is not about so-called woke-ism, because if you ignore any social inclusion references, the stories are still not very intriguing. Sure, the special effects and sets are better, but thaty’s just due to Disney’s cash infusion.The stories are simple and lacking depth, as though they are written to appeal to children. I can’t tell whether this is on purpose, or whether the writers are out of good ideas or what.