This is a nightmare caused by their own corporate culture not able to pivot fast enough. They didn't want this transition to happen too fast for them so down played it hoping it would go away and here we are. They are getting kicked out of China and Europe AND Tesla is destroying them in North America. This is just starting to boil over, nightmare will be a soft descriptor.
I agree as suburban Detroiter who lived the japanese auto invasion I fought for Japan. The Olds Torinado was front wheel drive and Gramps was looking to buy one. He did not, but I did Fly to LA in 70's and buy a front wheel drive honda H100, $1600. taxes plates out the door. It fit on a side walk and its 10 inch were unstopable one drive in it. I told my father that in the future every car would be fwd. 40 mpg on the vaca back to detroit.
@@MrRaitzi I love driving an EV, but they are not ready to replace ICE everywhere. I still drive both. Government needs to stay out of the way and let the market decide.
Do you want to know what should be the real nightmare for the US car industry? China will soon be capable of selling EVs cheaper than the equivalent internal combustion car from traditional brands. Less than a week ago BYD declared another price war. This time not against other EV makers, but against the likes of VW, Toyota, and GM, and in particular their conventional, internal combustion cars. BYD is now offering medium sedan plug-in hybrids at a price that matches, or even undercuts, the cheapest, entry level medium sedans - not even the hybrids, but the cheaper, internal combustion ones. Even BYD medium sedan EVs are competing in price with the medium price trims of those traditional brand cars. Worse for those brands, BYD isn't doing that as a sale, but as a permanent price reduction. Even worse for them, this isn't fueled by reducing the margins, but by improvements to the manufacture of both EVs and their component parts - and there are enough improvements predicted to happen that BYD should be able to do it again next year, at which point it shouldn't be plugin hybrids undercutting the ICE cars, but instead EVs undercutting the cheapest ICE cars. And to make things even trickier, some of the other China EV brands seem intent on joining this price war. If BYD and other Chinese brands start passing those cost reductions to their export markets they could drive internal combustion cars from traditional brands right out of those markets. The traditional automakers need to learn how to make an EV cheaper than a conventional car, and fast, if they want to keep any market outside the US and perhaps Europe.
@@dzcav3 The Chinese "subsidies" seem to be mostly grants meant to speed up development and production ramp up; in other words, just plain old industrial policy (which western countries, for some reason, dislike using). China's government already made back all the subsidies it handed out to the EV industry, and then some (or a lot). The funny part about industrial policy subsidies is that the sooner they are made, the more effective they are. China started with its EV-focused industrial policy decades before the US - which means now the US needs to provide dozens of times more subsidies than China ever did in order to catch up. Had the US had the foresight to pass the green tech parts of the Inflation Reduction Act a few decades back, around the time China began to invest government funds into starting its battery, solar panel, and EV industries, the country leading the energy transition wouldn't be China, but instead the US.
Legacy OEMs are digging their own graves. I have no sympathy for them. But I have sympathy for all the workers that will founder in the bloodbath. OEMs have had atleast 12 years to sort this out but CEOs only think in a 3-5 year timeframe.
3-5 months. Only as far as the next quarter because that is when they will be judged by shareholders. We need to go back to a "Stakeholders" model where more people are involved in decisions.
It has more to do with the limits of battery technology, weight and cost than corporate short term focus. Even Toyota a company that thinks more long term thanks to Japan's culture is wary of going all EV and is instead concentrating on hybrids.
@@pbreedu That sounds good until you see Tesla and Chinese companies making profits on EVs. Then Toyota seems more like it may have missed the boat this time.
Oil companies dont care about evs. A barrel of oil isnt just used to make gas. Its made for jet fuel, diesel, ship fuel and products/grease. A barrel of oil is around 45% gasoline and then you get the other products as well but in order to get those other products you are essentially still distilling out the gasoline. That is really all that a refinery is. Its a distillery tower. Maybe we use less gasoline but the other stuff will take decades/centuries to not need anymore. Gasoline might get really cheap but everything else will get more expensive to make up for the lost revenue from the gasoline. That is why this whole idea of "just stop oil" is dumb. The world would completely fall apart in a real hurry if we actually listen to those people. The funny thing is if we actually listen to them they would end up being the first people screaming to start pumping oil again since their lives are typically much more reliant on oil than most of the people in the oil industry I know.
I slander EVs on my own. lol. Anyone looking at the drastic cost changes of EV ownership over the last 5 years should be enough for people to see where this is headed. Do your research people. You will see the negatives of EVs are quite bad in the long run.
The reality is that Detroit can’t profitably produce competitive EVs that consumers want, not compared to Tesla. There is no demand problem. Their dealers aren’t pushing them because all of their profits are tied to servicing ICE vehicles which fall apart and are expensive to maintain and operate by comparison. People wants Teslas
EV's are impractical, too expensive to purchase and fix, and the infrastructure doesn't yet exist to support them. Also, there is no battery out there that can be fully charged in under 15 minutes - makes long trips a nightmare. Plus the fact that when you consider the polluting processes needed to manufacture them, they turn out not to be "green". Then there is the cost of charging - which is expensive. Impractical....
If you have been sleeping, wake up, the world leader in EV sales are not the Chinese but the all american Tesla, which also happen to be the most technological advanced EV on the planet. All the other EV that are not selling in America dealers lots are EV produced by other producers but cannot compete against Tesla as they are considered the most efficient, the safest, the fastest, and needing the least amount of servicing.
@@sat7755 you are the one who should wake up to the truth, tesla is not the biggest ev producer since last quarter and this will continue. mark my word, chinese ev is going to dominate the world
Hey @@superpowerdragon let's split hairs huh? So maybe Tesla becomes number 2 in the world... or number 3 in the world.... Sat7755 argument holds and KThalman is sleeping. The US has a homegrown manufacturer who kickstarted the entire EV industry. Instead of celebrating this fact we have statements like: "we find ourselves behind China"... it's time to wake up and realise Tesla is the global catalyst for converting us to a better car technology and celebrate that we are lucky to have Tesla in the first place.... ps: I don't own a Tesla - I own a Kona EV - but I know Hyundai would never have made an electric if it weren't for Tesla.
bring the Chinese in to bring the price down and that’s good for the American consumers. it’s the only way to gradually build up a domestic battery capability at this point. And don’t just wait for the next gen battery tech to leapfrog everyone else, but build a million strong work force up and down the battery supply chain right now, even with the help of the Chinese. I would think the battery tech from China will still be useful 20 years later because we can use it for a lot of other things as well. And what is more, we’re more poised for the next gen tech this way. It cannot be bad for America.
lol just no, USA will not spend the budget required to match China's capacity and processes, only hope is to use leap-frog tech and establish nearby hubs in unregulated friend countries.
LOL heck no. These batteries made in China are made with Uyghurs labor. I couldn't imagine how they do to upskill an Uyghurs to build a battery that is on the bleeding edge of battery tech.
@@shoopddawhooped Nothing to do with budget. Chinese labor is $5.51/hr with no benefits. The UAW and manufacturing in the US will all be unemployed. I don't see any problem being 100% reliant on foreign countries for hospital equipment, transportation, and electrical grid. Do you?
GM used to earn over 2 billion dollars in China , and the figure dropped steeply from 2023 onward due to rapid demand of EV's in China . Price of high quality EV will drop to under $10,000 in the following few years .
@@bobbybishop5662 Let me help you out - Model Y (not combined or any other crap).... Model Y alone was the best selling car IN THE WORLD (not the USA.... not somewhere obscure.... the WORLD) at 1.23million cars. And where is the media on this?... crickets
I'm afraid it is a little more complicated than that. So far, GM and Ford haven't been able to put out EVs that compare favourably to Teslas so apples to apples, they just can't sell enough of them to reach scale and profits. They left it too late in the game and are now in panic mode and will have a very hard time staying alive at all...maybe 2 or 3 niche vehicles.
The United States broke a record in 2023 selling over 1 million EV vehicles you can talk shit about them all you want they are not going to go away and once you drive one you’ll understand why they are amazing
The real story. EV's are a night nightmare for *Legacy* auto. Ford/GM/Toyota/etc.. can't get it together. Tesla on the other hand is selling the number 1 car in the world and expanding.
Hybrids were fun, in 2012 until we all realized they are the worst of both worlds. Very slow to accelerate/brake/handle and twice the maintenance. I would bet against hybrids future for sure. A great short position if i see a company betting on Hybrids. @@TH-dr1kg
@@TH-dr1kgYou have old data from a rapidly expanding EV industry. IEA data states EV car sales world wide accounted for18% of all new car sales in 2023. Up about 35% year on year.
Exactly. These are whiny coverup artists trying to deny tesla is kicking the stuffing out of them. They say it can't be don't and all you have to do is point to the T and say they are doing it
I want a Chinese EV. I have a Tesla but I want access to BYD, and its superior cars, designs and pricing. EVs are the future, if only because they are the future in China, the world's biggest auto market. The US can do what it wants, but it will be left so far behind that it wont' be able to make it up.
Sadly, I agree. I fear that this lack of competition will make the US auto industry like it was in the 1970s and 1980s before the Japanese really took hold. Or worse the US auto industry could become like the Soviet auto industry--building outdated crap for captive audiences. I love America, but I am sick of corporations blaming consumers for the crap they sell
@@ClunFunDun Tesla, Fisker, Lucid, Rivian, Polestar along with nearly all of the traditional automakers getting into the EV business.....yeah lack of competition 🤣🤣🤣
@@safeandeffectivelol Lucid is a vanity project. They are not scalable for multiple reasons.. Many EV models from the major manufacturers are not available in the US. And of course. No BYD in the US. BYD is now the largest EV maker on Earth. The lack of competition is hurting US consumers. For example, many companies make videogame consoles but if we excluded Japanese firms we wouldn't have PlayStation or Nintendo. Why is a lack of competition good? Why do you want Americans to have less choices than other countries? You can be proud of America, but the EV situation is not good for US consumers
I read somewhere that BYD employs 90,000 engineers in their research & development department (excluding design and production) and they file an average of 15 patents per day.
The USA can’t be dominant in evs only with Tesla , lucid and rivian have a very small target demographic and will go bankrupt, polestar is fcking Chinese 😂
And the ice engine was a nightmare for the guys who cleaned horseshit of city streets. My Tesla kicks the crap outa my previous cars , bmw , Chevy, Vw,ford,Pontiac, and even a Isuzu. It beats them all and I don’t pay for gas , or oil.
Air pollution from burning fossil fuels is the primary cause of premature death worldwide. Once you calculate the full cost of ICE vehicles, EVs are much cheaper for society.
Explain Rivian, Lucid, Polestar, and Fisker. Tesla got started when there was almost no competition and nearly went bankrupt several times according to Musk.
@@safeandeffectivelol what is there to explain? Fisker is almost broke having magna make the car. Rivian hasn't made money yet but probably will when they hit scale. Lucid great engineering poor execution but the new plant looks promising. Polestar too expensive. Byd making a good run of it. To make money you need a lot of Integration
@@ChicagoBob123 Some of those brands you mention people bought EVs that within one year lost half of their resale value. Its pretty bad for some people with car loans that are completely stuck with it.
Thoose brand are in the extra wealthy market so the buyers demographic is tiny, Tesla although still somewhat expensive every middle to upper class can afford it
Only legacy automakers are struggling to fit into the EV market. Tesla and China are new kids on the block speaking to a younger audience. Demand for EVs has continued to rise. No one reminds everyone the Model Y is the largest car worldwide. Not an ICE vehicle. Tesla listens to their audience, Highest satisfaction in the industry. Their speed of innovation drives them to a better vehicle with updates over the air on a regular basis. The Chinese similarly are new to the game and not using old methods to make cars. Even Toyota was impressed when a Chinese company made a height change in less than a year to a car.
Once upon a time "Cars are a Nightmare for Blacksmiths" no doubt held some weight. Don't be a LUDDITE! Guys are doing all kinds of engine swaps in gas powered cars. Batteries are MODULAR and easy to replicate in terms of physical dimensions. It's exponentially more difficult to get a modern V8 into a 1940's thru 70's car AND YET it's done successfully every week. How naive is it to think that popular cars won't have companies making batteries for them that are better than the batteries they came out with 4 years ago. Stop assessing technology living in real time while talking about the future.
@@markplain2555 That's what the EV industry said when gas cars arrived on the scene and took over. The first EV was invented in 1889 when most people were still riding in horse carriages.
Don’t worry everybody has and extra 30-40k for this and taking all this money from taxes is also helpful to help multi billion dollar companies. Sounds progressive national socialist. Yes it does.
If you are afraid of a used EV due to the battery and not afraid of a used ICE due to the transmission, engine, exhaust, fuel injectors, etceteras... you are poorly informed.
Holy Sh!t you are so F$%king right. You summarized it so beautifully. I bought a used Kona EV and have been driving it for 3 years now.... Everyday I get into my car it feels the same as when I first day got it.... no issues only pure performance.
Just to be clear, the rules about sourcing of materials and components of EVs written into the IRA only apply in order to qualify for the $7500 tax rebate. Manufacturers and customers who don't care about the rebates can choose whatever sources they want for materials and components. This seems entirely proper to me-American tax rebates should only be used to stimulate industry in the USA and perhaps also our friendliest trading partners.
I love biking and I love taking public transport.... ye know wha else I love.... going distant places, camping, rock climbing, skiing and coming back the same night. And I really love doing that with my EV.
For short distances, this is a great alternative. Electric bicycles will only increase bike use, as feeling overheated, or worried about hills, becomes a non-issue. Going to rural (hilly) Missouri towns, I am surprised at how many 30-60 year olds I see out riding bikes for fun or possibly errands. You wouldn't have seen as many bicyclists 10 years ago.
Tesla is a U.S. car company and it’s thriving, so this title doesn’t work. Demand isn’t the issue as Tesla has proved. Crappy, expensive choices are what’s keeping the legacy guys down. They are having trouble transitioning to the new tech. Ford’s Lightning and Mach E would be huge sellers if they didn’t have so many problems and were priced right. No demand problem. There’s a rotten supply problem. Also, I love the idea that cheap battery materials are a problem for legacy EV makers. Wtf? Strange motives behind this one.
It was Bloomberg Intelligence only a few years ago in 2021 or 2022 that predicted that VW would be outselling Tesla in EV's by 2025. The name is an oxymoron, and like you I was startled by the cheap battery materials comments. Pretty dumb even for Bloomberg I would have guessed. I need to drop my expectations from them another 2-3 notches.
The excuses continue, meanwhile many of us have been driving EVs for many years and China's kicking arse at making excellent EVS. These attitudes whould have lost ww2.
Almost the last comment highlights another bit of FUD that news articles spread--will the battery hold up? The truth is that lithium ion batteries with NMC chemistry are expected to last about 300,000 miles. They will outlive the car. Lithium ion phosphate batteries have an expected life of about 1,000,000 miles. A minimum of research would show that replacing the battery really is not a concern for cars manufactured in the last five years or so.
'Believed' The 2nd wave mainstream prospective EV buys are naturally hesitant, given the mixed (let's be honest) success of the early batteries. Why should they have to consider one of these early gen 2nd or 3rd hand cars / batteries if that's all they can afford? A lot of FUD I agreed, but its not entirely unfounded. So in essence, unless you are fortunate enough to be able afford to keep buying new to get the latest battery assurance (not proven with enough real world data for my liking yet) you then as a prospective 2nd hand buyer, need to wait at least another 3 years, before those types you mention become commonly available and affordable. Please don't quote 'million miles tesla stories' btw! :)
I live in a cold part of Canada and will wait until I see other people driving EVs that work well in -35°C cold, have already lasted 300,000 km, and electricity is still generally cheaper than gasoline. If that happens, and my gasoline car is no longer functioning, I will consider, but not restrict myself to, a well-maintained, rust-free used EV.
>> Lithium ion phosphate batteries have an expected life of about 1,000,000 miles. A minimum of research would show that replacing the battery really is not a concern for cars manufactured in the last five years or so.
We just bought our second Tesla this week. No more gas cars in our family. These are the best cars we've ever owned. Yes my wife agrees with me. Currently about the same prices as an 'equivalent' gas car. Cheaper to fuel and maintain and WAY more fun to drive. Best of luck to the OEMs that refused to make this transition until Tesla forced them...
Automakers like xpeng, BYD, and Nio need to be sold in America as well. But of course the United States will put tariffs on them that will make them unaffordable for most Americans so they can prop up the big 3 automakers.
That is a 2 way street however. So it remains to be seen if America has the stomach to do that. China can bite back very hard. In addition, the Mexico door has been opened to them and they are likely to start building factories there and getting into the US via your agreements with Mexico.
IF WE CAN START THINKING IN TERMS OF EV BEING A CAR, THEN WE WILL HAVE NONE OF THIS DOUBTS - EV DEMAND LIKE ANY CAR DEMAND DEPENDS UPON THE ECONOMY IN GENERAL, INTEREST RATE BUYERS NEED TO PAY, AND SORT OF TAKE TOTAL COST OF OWNERSHIP WILL RULE THE DAMAND. AND USA IS BEST SUITED FOR EVs, AS MOST OF ITS POPULATION LIVES IN SUBURBS AND NOT IN CITIES... MAKES EV OWNERSHIP EASIER
Chinese automakers are starting to move into Mexico BYD just announced that they are looking for a site to build a manufacturing plant there. That will be their first step towards selling in the USA.
I hope MG gets to the USA ASAP.... much better Chinese car than BYD and it sells for around $20k equivalent in the UK. And they already have an EV sports car.
The recent 2024 Beijing Auto Show featured 117 new chinese EV models. Even German Daimler and VW are adopting the philosophy, "if you can't beat them, join them," and using chinese technology for on board controls, navigation and entertainment in their upcoming models. And rumor has it that Japanese carmakers are exploring similar collaborations. It would be tragic if the Big Three sit still and rely on current US ban on Chinese EV imports (it's not going to work, Mexicans will drive them across the border to sell here, and if they are as cheap & reliable as claimed, Americans will buy them used).
They are commuter cars. Very nice golf cart type things. Worthless in large vehicles like trucks and busses. This winter showed how poorly they fail in the cold.
They say that "where California goes, others follow". California is the 10th biggest car market in the world and I understand represents about 1/5th of all US car sales. They hit 25% EV in 2023. So that's where the rest of the country will eventually go
The best thing about our Bolt EV besides the range is the incredibly easy "refueling" at home. I just plug it in at evening and it's full charge in the morning. There were 1960 shorts films about how cars would maintenance free in the future, because all the maintenance would be done automatically at home at night by robotics and automation. Things like fill with gas, change oil, luge, check car systems health. You just got in at morning and drove off, cool because I do that now in 2024.
Everything is a nightmare to them. They just like to sit comfortably relying on government subsidies and bailouts and not innovate much. Not unless absolutely necessary, because that would be needles work.
_"They just like to sit comfortably relying on government subsidies and bailouts and not innovate much"_ Well I KNOW that the 1980s GM and Chevies I've owned and the 2010s GM and Chevies I've owned ARE ALL THE SAME..... with the exception that the 2010s version MUST BE TAKEN TO ONLY A "certified General Motors mechanic" WHICH INCLUDES THE DEALERSHIP COST........
The bigger problem is the car-centric city design and planning, or the lack thereof. Car-centric suburbans are known to be highly inefficient and expensive to maintain. We could see tons of issues and keep pouring our tax money into maintaining these blackholes while not making money hand over fist on selling cars and oil.
Just as a quick note... you do know that 99% of all cities in North America had their street layouts before the car was invented right? . Also in Transport economics we learn that through "Road User Charges" suburban roads run at a suplus while all city transit systems run at a deficit. Perhaps google "Road User Charges" it's a formal Transport Economics module.
Spending billion$ on EV charging when enough "ICE charging" (aka gas stations) already exist. Goverments sure know how to waste taxpayers' money . . . . and enforce control.
It's the shareholders' mistake, they let business graduates run their engineering companies for more profits. Sandy Munro has been publishing about this for years and no one listened. And Tesla's market share is still growing, it is still opening new factories, it is still increasing production, it is still profitable.
China and Korea are the leaders in this space. From what I read, US legacy car makers are making EV's that no one wants - with questionable software and quality assurance. Tesla have been dominant and innovative in the EV space, but need to get a CEO that has their head in the game (and can keep up with BYD).
EV is a great signal to those big manufacturers where they need to figure out a new way, I would say this isn't a nightmare but a lesson... And for all of the consumers definitely, we benefit from this technology competition. Free market, no tariff, comparative competitiveness, that's all about.
You still do not understand. The problem is not producing the cars. The problem is: not enough power grid and infrastructure. And there never will be. In Germany the cost of electricity has already doubled in the last 2 years. And we only have a measly few % of EVs on the roads. People can not use them and they also do not want to. When will you understand?
"In Germany the cost of electricity has already doubled in the last 2 years" - When did Russia invade Ukraine? That's right...2 years ago. Stupid comment
@@hagenzwosta "The problem is: not enough power grid and infrastructure. And there never will be". Are you saying Germans are too stupid to be able to expand the energy grid? They could do so with refueling stations over the years, but they can't increase the supply of electricity? What about roads? Were all the roads you drive on there for the last 100 years? Were all the houses there 100 years ago? All the power stations and electricity lines? All the factories? We build shit. As population grows we build more shit. More places to work, to sleep, to play, to drive, to fill up. We don't seem to have had problems getting to where we are today, but you think that's it, we can't do this? And you think I'm stupid? lol
@@zoransarin5411 What you fail to understand is that Germany also shut down all of their nuclear power plants in favor of renewable energy. And that simply isn't going to work. Renewable energy alone cannot replace fossil fuels and nuclear power. And the war in Ukraine made it even worse for them since they relied on Russia for natural gas, which turned out to be a BIG mistake. Now they're scrambling to get it from us!
@@zoransarin5411 We are even more stupid than you can imagine. We spent 4 Trillion(!) Euros to destroy the superbly working powergrid and power generation we had. To replace it with solar panels and windmills. We also shut down all nuclear power plants. You have no idea how stupid we are.
Why is no one thinking about the waiting times. It takes ~5 mins to fill up, queue and pay. Electric cars take 30+ mins; what happens when we all have electric cars
China has virtually a monopoly when it comes to upstream mineral processing for batteries production. Even if US buys batteries manufactured in South Korea or Japan, their raw material such as COBALT SULPHATE or GRAPHITE is from China.
Not true. Cobolt doesn't need to be in batteries? LFP has no nickel and no cobolt Lithium is all over the place. US Australia etc. The ice auto makers are lazy and slow and paying the price
Let the marketplace decide. Government should not be giving tax subsidies. The US Taxpayer is paying for these subsidies. Why should I help someone buy an electric car. If they want one, then go buy one.
Engineer here: EVs have a big problem, the best batteries today only have 250 Watt-hours of energy per Kg, while diesel or gas have 30 times more, 10000 Watt-hours,so an Ev is an unpleasant car to drive due to its enormous weight,its Inertia as engineers call it; it's hard to corner, hard to accelerate, hard to brake, it's expensive and very wasteful all around, a little 3 cylinder diesel beats any Ev hands down in initial cost and running economy; CO2 is the best thing that ever happened to humankind; trees and plants need CO2,plenty of it, they'll die without CO2, and we'd die next; they keep the C for their bodies,their trunks, the cellulose, and they give us back the O2; amazing as it may seem, the bit trunks of huge trees are made from air, the air we breath, they use the CO2, combine it with water and hydrogen and they grow to heights amazing; all from the CO2; contrary to what lots say, CO2 is a blessing for the world; remember this: just because everyone says it, it does not mean it's true.
@@gboates please look up Patrick Boyle "electrifying everthing". We will need to build a very large infrastructure that no one is talking about or its cost.
@@mvs9122 where did all the service stations come from? Do you think man is incapable of building infrastructure? If there is a demand as big as you claim, then there is a business that sees a capitalistic opportunity to provide supply, satisfy the demand and make some money. You guys just think that everything we currently have was blinked here by I Dream of Jeannie in 2 seconds.
Hyundai is the number 2 EV car manufacturer in the states and NOT GM. Hyundai has a new plant coming online in 2025 with a possible Giga press . GM has nothing close to that.
The media can spread FUD, but with 7.6% of new vehicles being EVs last year, the media will pretty soon not be most people's source of information about them. It will be their neighbors, friends, and family.
@@mikeydude750 It is entirely possible to put AC charging in these areas. The infrastructure money being spent on DC fast charger would almost certainly go farther if it focused on improving he AC charging for renters.
@@martalli The charger itself costs like 1000 bucks, then you have to actually wire up electrical conduit to every single parking spot in a parking lot. Trust me - asking people to "share" the charger is NOT going to work at scale. A 240V charger at each parking space in a parking garage is going to be a huge drain on the grid and a huge cost to maintain. And then you get into the question of what to do about street parking and units without any assigned parking. Are you going to install an expensive L2 charger at every spot on the street?
@@mikeydude750 They don't cost that much, and L2 charging does not have to be 60 amps for overnight charging. Just 20-30 amps would work well, and it can be done with much cheaper wiring. I would pose that the issue would be ensuring the right person is paying for the charge and that they have access to the charging when needed. You know of course, these chargers would only supply the energy as needed. Perhaps if you are paying for a parking spot, you could pay a little more for a parking spot with a charger that you would pay the electricity for.
Hydrogen fuel cells will be perfected for autos in about 8-10 years, and then all of these EVs will be worth absolutely nothing. Green and blue hydrogen will wipe the EV market off the map.
Most of those issues with EVs are unimportant to most EV owners. My Tesla is the most amazing car I’ve ever owned. ( I said amazing. I didn’t say best build) I’m in my 4th. year and the operating costs are maybe 20% of the operating cost of any other car I’ve ever owned. The performance surpasses anything I’ve ever driven.
Global investors and EV customers committed to improving our Global Air Quality...FSR .. Fisker.. 45,000 Reservations for Ocean SUV EVS. Over 90 % Dip year. RIVN.. Rivian...XOS Trucks...Lion Electric School Buses..LEV... Vicinity Motors..VEV and more.
And the US legacy auto makers strategy is working so well now. They are all on the brink and locked out of the largest auto market in the world now. FORD is literally headed to Mexico. Train wreck of their own doing.
So profitable FORD is sitting on 137 billion in debt, GM at $119 billion and BYD with a Net 10 billion in cash. You wont be locking China out of anything if you want the parts to actually produce cars in the US. China controls most of the raw materials to even produce.
@@cherokee180c0 Ford has already lost over 4 billion dollars on EVs and GM has also lost over a billion. So I personally doubt either one of them will ever make any money on them.
After viewing literally hundreds of EV videos and reading as many articles, I finally test drove a Tesla Model Y. Within five minutes after finishing the drive, I completed my order. The technology package and ride comfort of this vehicle far surpassed my expectations. I will not miss my big ICE truck...
I love living in a world where RUclipsrs make a living out of showing up established media companies for talking utter FUD to please their legacy auto advertising sponsors. And here is the best part: many of those RUclipsrs now have a greater viewership than established media..... the game is up.
Tesla begs to differ. It's a U.S. company, you know, more so than Ford or GM. All the protectionism and "incentives" are nightmarish. I agree with you there.
Honda and Toyota know how to make money selling gas vehicles. Reminds me of Kodak Nokia and Blockbuster. Blockbuster was offered to buy Netflix very cheaply in the beginning when Netflix was struggling. Blockbuster declined
@@johnsutherland7561 We'll see. I'm looking at Ford and GM's EV efforts wilt. The Japanese are seldom cutting edge. They let others pioneer things then build their own version version when they're ready. For example, Honda's current hybrid system is really a small battery EV. The engine is used to charge the battery around town and never drives the wheels till it hits highway speeds. Your examples don't really apply because their replacements really were significantly better. EV's are a sideways move at best compared to an ICE powered car. There's no compelling case for EV's over ICE. They do have downsides, like poor resale value, high insurance and insufficient charging infra-structure. For the amount I drive, I can't justify the extra cost of an EV over my current cars. I suspect ICE is going to be with us longer than you might expect.
@@quademasters249 Cost of Bev's are coming down and once they reach price parity. To operate them is a lot less. I drive a lot now and spend over $500 a month on gas in Canada. I spoke to 1 Tesla driver who told me it only costs him $2 or $3 for 100km when charging at home. Resale presently is poor because the price of new one's has been coming down.
Considering that the industry ignored EV's and lobbied against them for 25 years or more, it's hard to feel sorry for them being so far behind China now
No, i think the car buyers who wanted to buy a n EV already bought theirs. And the ones sitting on the fence about EVs will have second thoughts because at this time people are now hearing and reading the drawbacks of owning an EV. Then people like me still think that EV is a niche and not mainstream cuz its too expensive and not practical. For example, an EV truck, when hauling heavy loads, will lose about 50% of their range. Then i dont think the grid is not ready and hidden cost like i will have to pay an electrician to install a 220 v receptacle in my garage..
Funny how he talks about engines as if they are 'not a worry' when compared to batteries. The fact is that the average ICE car is on the scrap heap before 200,000 miles. There are now thousands of EVs on the road with that mileage and more on the original battery. Typical degradation at that mileage is 10%. Electric motors themselves either seem to fail in the first few thousand miles (
I love how this complaint is bringing manufacturing back to North America .. sure Jan meanwhile China is setting up shop in Mexico .. the thesis of this piece is that us companies can’t set up supply chain in North America yet China is literally doing that right now to supply not only Tesla Mexico but also I believe ford Mexico .. just asinine reporting
The problem with electric vehicles (EVs) is that they depreciate quickly 📈, and you cannot drive them for a long time without experiencing severe battery degradation 🔋. To replace the battery, you may have to spend upwards of $25,000 💰, which makes it financially impractical for most people. Additionally, taking a road trip with family can be stressful due to the limited range of EVs 🚗🔋.
True, but it does depend on battery charge history. Really you need to be able to get that printed out when buying used. What is key is that charging and time matters more than miles driven
China gets the last laugh. US sends raw material to China for our battery production needs and components. So if the administration wants to add tariffs to that as well, up goes the price of the US EV. Also, the EV market has slowed, but if China really feels they want any of the dismal share of the US buyers, they'll build plants here.
BEVs made up 16% of market share in Europe in 2023. For the USA it was 7.6% market share for 2023. They are just the facts. Could speculate why, but at the end of the day the numbers still remain the same.
Now you know why Tesla started when they did. Make a compelling EV and people will buy it. Make a bad EV and they won’t. Demand for a good electric vehicle is up.
This is a nightmare caused by their own corporate culture not able to pivot fast enough. They didn't want this transition to happen too fast for them so down played it hoping it would go away and here we are. They are getting kicked out of China and Europe AND Tesla is destroying them in North America. This is just starting to boil over, nightmare will be a soft descriptor.
I agree as suburban Detroiter who lived the japanese auto invasion I fought for Japan. The Olds Torinado was front wheel drive and Gramps was looking to buy one. He did not, but I did Fly to LA in 70's and buy a front wheel drive honda H100, $1600. taxes plates out the door. It fit on a side walk and its 10 inch were unstopable one drive in it. I told my father that in the future every car would be fwd. 40 mpg on the vaca back to detroit.
Good summation. It’s very brutal. Especially for the workers and suppliers. Millions of jobs. But new jobs will come for those skilled workers.
Tesla has less than 3% of the car market. How are they "destroying" anyone?
No need to pivot now. Technology is not ready. EVs will become reasonable when they double the range and cut battery costs.
@@MrRaitzi I love driving an EV, but they are not ready to replace ICE everywhere. I still drive both. Government needs to stay out of the way and let the market decide.
Do you want to know what should be the real nightmare for the US car industry? China will soon be capable of selling EVs cheaper than the equivalent internal combustion car from traditional brands.
Less than a week ago BYD declared another price war. This time not against other EV makers, but against the likes of VW, Toyota, and GM, and in particular their conventional, internal combustion cars. BYD is now offering medium sedan plug-in hybrids at a price that matches, or even undercuts, the cheapest, entry level medium sedans - not even the hybrids, but the cheaper, internal combustion ones. Even BYD medium sedan EVs are competing in price with the medium price trims of those traditional brand cars.
Worse for those brands, BYD isn't doing that as a sale, but as a permanent price reduction. Even worse for them, this isn't fueled by reducing the margins, but by improvements to the manufacture of both EVs and their component parts - and there are enough improvements predicted to happen that BYD should be able to do it again next year, at which point it shouldn't be plugin hybrids undercutting the ICE cars, but instead EVs undercutting the cheapest ICE cars.
And to make things even trickier, some of the other China EV brands seem intent on joining this price war.
If BYD and other Chinese brands start passing those cost reductions to their export markets they could drive internal combustion cars from traditional brands right out of those markets. The traditional automakers need to learn how to make an EV cheaper than a conventional car, and fast, if they want to keep any market outside the US and perhaps Europe.
This is already happening in Thailand.
You "forgot" to mention massive Chinese government subsidies.
And you forgot to mention massive USA and European government subsidies as well. Just ask Elon Musk.
@@dzcav3 The Chinese "subsidies" seem to be mostly grants meant to speed up development and production ramp up; in other words, just plain old industrial policy (which western countries, for some reason, dislike using). China's government already made back all the subsidies it handed out to the EV industry, and then some (or a lot).
The funny part about industrial policy subsidies is that the sooner they are made, the more effective they are. China started with its EV-focused industrial policy decades before the US - which means now the US needs to provide dozens of times more subsidies than China ever did in order to catch up. Had the US had the foresight to pass the green tech parts of the Inflation Reduction Act a few decades back, around the time China began to invest government funds into starting its battery, solar panel, and EV industries, the country leading the energy transition wouldn't be China, but instead the US.
@@dzcav3the us has arguably the biggest subsidy EV program of the world
Legacy OEMs are digging their own graves. I have no sympathy for them. But I have sympathy for all the workers that will founder in the bloodbath. OEMs have had atleast 12 years to sort this out but CEOs only think in a 3-5 year timeframe.
Don't forget the shareholders! Why spend money to ensure success in 10 years when I can simply extract value from the company today?
3-5 months. Only as far as the next quarter because that is when they will be judged by shareholders. We need to go back to a "Stakeholders" model where more people are involved in decisions.
It has more to do with the limits of battery technology, weight and cost than corporate short term focus. Even Toyota a company that thinks more long term thanks to Japan's culture is wary of going all EV and is instead concentrating on hybrids.
@@pbreedu Toyota has always been Hybrid > ICE >>Hydrogen>>>>>>>EV
@@pbreedu That sounds good until you see Tesla and Chinese companies making profits on EVs. Then Toyota seems more like it may have missed the boat this time.
EV's Are a Nightmare for the Βig Oil companies who pay the media to slander Tesla and EVs in general...
This is a great alternate title to almost every EV story on youtube.
Oil companies dont care about evs. A barrel of oil isnt just used to make gas. Its made for jet fuel, diesel, ship fuel and products/grease. A barrel of oil is around 45% gasoline and then you get the other products as well but in order to get those other products you are essentially still distilling out the gasoline. That is really all that a refinery is. Its a distillery tower. Maybe we use less gasoline but the other stuff will take decades/centuries to not need anymore. Gasoline might get really cheap but everything else will get more expensive to make up for the lost revenue from the gasoline. That is why this whole idea of "just stop oil" is dumb. The world would completely fall apart in a real hurry if we actually listen to those people. The funny thing is if we actually listen to them they would end up being the first people screaming to start pumping oil again since their lives are typically much more reliant on oil than most of the people in the oil industry I know.
@@pin65371are you just ignorant or just stupid?
35% of oil sales are for ICE vehicles.
If you had your wage cut by 35%,you wouldn't be concerned? 🤦.
I slander EVs on my own. lol. Anyone looking at the drastic cost changes of EV ownership over the last 5 years should be enough for people to see where this is headed. Do your research people. You will see the negatives of EVs are quite bad in the long run.
@@pin65371 Totally ignorant comment 🤦
The reality is that Detroit can’t profitably produce competitive EVs that consumers want, not compared to Tesla. There is no demand problem. Their dealers aren’t pushing them because all of their profits are tied to servicing ICE vehicles which fall apart and are expensive to maintain and operate by comparison. People wants Teslas
I don't even wanna drive..
No.. EV infrastructure sucks… model 3 drove like shit… i7 blows it away but still sucks
Real world range on a model 3 is like 200 mile range
Tesla fit and finish is total shit… not close to German.
Correct Chinese quality Chinese EV will zap the American ice car markets😮
EV's are impractical, too expensive to purchase and fix, and the infrastructure doesn't yet exist to support them. Also, there is no battery out there that can be fully charged in under 15 minutes - makes long trips a nightmare. Plus the fact that when you consider the polluting processes needed to manufacture them, they turn out not to be "green". Then there is the cost of charging - which is expensive. Impractical....
pretty stunning how often we find ourselves one step behind China. We need to learn how to take the long view.
If you have been sleeping, wake up, the world leader in EV sales are not the Chinese but the all american Tesla, which also happen to be the most technological advanced EV on the planet. All the other EV that are not selling in America dealers lots are EV produced by other producers but cannot compete against Tesla as they are considered the most efficient, the safest, the fastest, and needing the least amount of servicing.
@@sat7755 you are the one who should wake up to the truth, tesla is not the biggest ev producer since last quarter and this will continue. mark my word, chinese ev is going to dominate the world
The ones with money stop all advances till they can make money off the new
Hey @@superpowerdragon let's split hairs huh? So maybe Tesla becomes number 2 in the world... or number 3 in the world.... Sat7755 argument holds and KThalman is sleeping. The US has a homegrown manufacturer who kickstarted the entire EV industry. Instead of celebrating this fact we have statements like: "we find ourselves behind China"... it's time to wake up and realise Tesla is the global catalyst for converting us to a better car technology and celebrate that we are lucky to have Tesla in the first place.... ps: I don't own a Tesla - I own a Kona EV - but I know Hyundai would never have made an electric if it weren't for Tesla.
@@sat7755 Earth to sat7755, not only is China kicking our butts with EVs, but BYD is kicking Tesla to the curb in China.
bring the Chinese in to bring the price down and that’s good for the American consumers. it’s the only way to gradually build up a domestic battery capability at this point. And don’t just wait for the next gen battery tech to leapfrog everyone else, but build a million strong work force up and down the battery supply chain right now, even with the help of the Chinese. I would think the battery tech from China will still be useful 20 years later because we can use it for a lot of other things as well. And what is more, we’re more poised for the next gen tech this way. It cannot be bad for America.
lol just no, USA will not spend the budget required to match China's capacity and processes, only hope is to use leap-frog tech and establish nearby hubs in unregulated friend countries.
20 upvotes, really?🤔
LOL heck no. These batteries made in China are made with Uyghurs labor. I couldn't imagine how they do to upskill an Uyghurs to build a battery that is on the bleeding edge of battery tech.
@@shoopddawhooped Nothing to do with budget. Chinese labor is $5.51/hr with no benefits. The UAW and manufacturing in the US will all be unemployed. I don't see any problem being 100% reliant on foreign countries for hospital equipment, transportation, and electrical grid. Do you?
We don’t need your CCP to take over the world with your leader Winnie the Pooh.
GM used to earn over 2 billion dollars in China , and the figure dropped steeply from 2023 onward due to rapid demand
of EV's in China . Price of high quality EV will drop to under $10,000 in the following few years .
And GM-SIAC's Hongguang Mini EV was the best selling EV In China.
GM manufactures the top selling EV model in China.
GM will manufacture EVs abroad.
No manufacture wants to fight the lobbyists for Big Oil.
Someone please let the public know that the Tesla Model Y was the number one selling car in the world in 2023.
Nobody buys Tesla. Teslas have panel gaps. Teslas are expensive. Teslas rust.
Yes. 1,2 million of them. Best selling car worldwide 🎉.
What is the exact number of Model Y that they sold in 23 ? Exact number not the combined Model 3/model Y that is on the Tesla site.
@@bobbybishop5662 Let me help you out - Model Y (not combined or any other crap).... Model Y alone was the best selling car IN THE WORLD (not the USA.... not somewhere obscure.... the WORLD) at 1.23million cars. And where is the media on this?... crickets
@@markplain2555 What is your source for that number ? You don't have to be a smart ass.
If the media in the USA didn't created FUD about EV's then the car companies could easily scale up their supply chain.
I'm afraid it is a little more complicated than that. So far, GM and Ford haven't been able to put out EVs that compare favourably to Teslas so apples to apples, they just can't sell enough of them to reach scale and profits. They left it too late in the game and are now in panic mode and will have a very hard time staying alive at all...maybe 2 or 3 niche vehicles.
The United States broke a record in 2023 selling over 1 million EV vehicles you can talk shit about them all you want they are not going to go away and once you drive one you’ll understand why they are amazing
Simply incorrect
Either the Big Three are mostly incompetent, or they have put the B team on their EV projects, because they have seemed pretty inept so far.
@@michaelmackey754 A $7500 tax credit and they could only sell 1 million EV's vs 14.5 million ICEV's
The real story. EV's are a night nightmare for *Legacy* auto. Ford/GM/Toyota/etc.. can't get it together. Tesla on the other hand is selling the number 1 car in the world and expanding.
THIS ALL OF THIS!
Hybrids were fun, in 2012 until we all realized they are the worst of both worlds. Very slow to accelerate/brake/handle and twice the maintenance. I would bet against hybrids future for sure. A great short position if i see a company betting on Hybrids. @@TH-dr1kg
@@TH-dr1kgYou have old data from a rapidly expanding EV industry. IEA data states EV car sales world wide accounted for18% of all new car sales in 2023. Up about 35% year on year.
Exactly. These are whiny coverup artists trying to deny tesla is kicking the stuffing out of them. They say it can't be don't and all you have to do is point to the T and say they are doing it
This whining kinda reminds of talks about reusable space rockets before SpaceX started regular flying.
I want a Chinese EV. I have a Tesla but I want access to BYD, and its superior cars, designs and pricing. EVs are the future, if only because they are the future in China, the world's biggest auto market. The US can do what it wants, but it will be left so far behind that it wont' be able to make it up.
Sadly, I agree. I fear that this lack of competition will make the US auto industry like it was in the 1970s and 1980s before the Japanese really took hold. Or worse the US auto industry could become like the Soviet auto industry--building outdated crap for captive audiences. I love America, but I am sick of corporations blaming consumers for the crap they sell
@@ClunFunDun Tesla, Fisker, Lucid, Rivian, Polestar along with nearly all of the traditional automakers getting into the EV business.....yeah lack of competition 🤣🤣🤣
@@safeandeffectivelol Lucid is a vanity project. They are not scalable for multiple reasons.. Many EV models from the major manufacturers are not available in the US. And of course. No BYD in the US. BYD is now the largest EV maker on Earth.
The lack of competition is hurting US consumers. For example, many companies make videogame consoles but if we excluded Japanese firms we wouldn't have PlayStation or Nintendo.
Why is a lack of competition good? Why do you want Americans to have less choices than other countries? You can be proud of America, but the EV situation is not good for US consumers
I read somewhere that BYD employs 90,000 engineers in their research & development department (excluding design and production) and they file an average of 15 patents per day.
The USA can’t be dominant in evs only with Tesla , lucid and rivian have a very small target demographic and will go bankrupt, polestar is fcking Chinese 😂
China did not proceed quietly, but specific people outside China chose to ignore them.
And the ice engine was a nightmare for the guys who cleaned horseshit of city streets.
My Tesla kicks the crap outa my previous cars , bmw , Chevy, Vw,ford,Pontiac, and even a Isuzu. It beats them all and I don’t pay for gas , or oil.
Yes you do, you just don't see it. :)
Air pollution from burning fossil fuels is the primary cause of premature death worldwide. Once you calculate the full cost of ICE vehicles, EVs are much cheaper for society.
Maybe you didn't realize, the electric grid that charges your EV uses fossil fuel to create electricity in the first place.
@@pmonk1177 we could easily scale with modern nuclear reactors in the next 25 years
@@KBergs “Easily”??
Tesla producing decent cars at lower prices hurts the lie that ICE is better and your can't make EVs and make money. That's the big lie.
Tesla's are still very expensive.
Explain Rivian, Lucid, Polestar, and Fisker. Tesla got started when there was almost no competition and nearly went bankrupt several times according to Musk.
@@safeandeffectivelol what is there to explain? Fisker is almost broke having magna make the car. Rivian hasn't made money yet but probably will when they hit scale. Lucid great engineering poor execution but the new plant looks promising. Polestar too expensive. Byd making a good run of it. To make money you need a lot of Integration
@@ChicagoBob123 Some of those brands you mention people bought EVs that within one year lost half of their resale value. Its pretty bad for some people with car loans that are completely stuck with it.
Thoose brand are in the extra wealthy market so the buyers demographic is tiny, Tesla although still somewhat expensive every middle to upper class can afford it
The novelty of EVs is gone. It's just another car.
It's just another car with a superior driving experience and lower TCO.
Only legacy automakers are struggling to fit into the EV market. Tesla and China are new kids on the block speaking to a younger audience. Demand for EVs has continued to rise. No one reminds everyone the Model Y is the largest car worldwide. Not an ICE vehicle.
Tesla listens to their audience, Highest satisfaction in the industry. Their speed of innovation drives them to a better vehicle with updates over the air on a regular basis.
The Chinese similarly are new to the game and not using old methods to make cars. Even Toyota was impressed when a Chinese company made a height change in less than a year to a car.
Tesla and most EVs do not speak to me at all. They are ugly to me, make an EV look like an actual car.
I think you know, you know.
I immediately head to the comment section just to look for this😁
@@bridicot I know.
I couldn’t listen past 1 minute, because you know why.
Once upon a time "Cars are a Nightmare for Blacksmiths" no doubt held some weight. Don't be a LUDDITE! Guys are doing all kinds of engine swaps in gas powered cars. Batteries are MODULAR and easy to replicate in terms of physical dimensions. It's exponentially more difficult to get a modern V8 into a 1940's thru 70's car AND YET it's done successfully every week. How naive is it to think that popular cars won't have companies making batteries for them that are better than the batteries they came out with 4 years ago.
Stop assessing technology living in real time while talking about the future.
Don’t worry this piece is pure propaganda and won’t age well
@@MathGPT That's what horse carriage drivers said when gas cars arrived on the scene.
@@markplain2555
That's what the EV industry said when gas cars arrived on the scene and took over. The first EV was invented in 1889 when most people were still riding in horse carriages.
Her in Australia there are people replacing Mitsubishi minicab miev and I-miev battery packs which more than double the original range. 😁
Don’t worry everybody has and extra 30-40k for this and taking all this money from taxes is also helpful to help multi billion dollar companies.
Sounds progressive national socialist. Yes it does.
If you are afraid of a used EV due to the battery and not afraid of a used ICE due to the transmission, engine, exhaust, fuel injectors, etceteras... you are poorly informed.
Holy Sh!t you are so F$%king right. You summarized it so beautifully. I bought a used Kona EV and have been driving it for 3 years now.... Everyday I get into my car it feels the same as when I first day got it.... no issues only pure performance.
Just to be clear, the rules about sourcing of materials and components of EVs written into the IRA only apply in order to qualify for the $7500 tax rebate. Manufacturers and customers who don't care about the rebates can choose whatever sources they want for materials and components. This seems entirely proper to me-American tax rebates should only be used to stimulate industry in the USA and perhaps also our friendliest trading partners.
Other countries give EV incentives to all EVs because they care about humanity and its future.
@@juliahello6673 >> Other countries give EV incentives to all EVs because they care about humanity and its future.
@@juliahello6673 If they cared about incentivizing the future they'd incentivize building walkable neighborhoods by making NIMBYism illegal
Fortunately for the US, there is a new US car maker which will replace legacy auto and have significantly higher margins plus global reach.
I haven't driven in a week. I ride my bicycle each day.
yup thats the nasty secret that cars will be used less and more public transportation in the future
In the open air!? Among the plebs!? You are bold
true, i take the metro, because the traffic is just unbearable
I love biking and I love taking public transport.... ye know wha else I love.... going distant places, camping, rock climbing, skiing and coming back the same night. And I really love doing that with my EV.
For short distances, this is a great alternative. Electric bicycles will only increase bike use, as feeling overheated, or worried about hills, becomes a non-issue. Going to rural (hilly) Missouri towns, I am surprised at how many 30-60 year olds I see out riding bikes for fun or possibly errands. You wouldn't have seen as many bicyclists 10 years ago.
Tesla is a U.S. car company and it’s thriving, so this title doesn’t work. Demand isn’t the issue as Tesla has proved. Crappy, expensive choices are what’s keeping the legacy guys down. They are having trouble transitioning to the new tech. Ford’s Lightning and Mach E would be huge sellers if they didn’t have so many problems and were priced right. No demand problem. There’s a rotten supply problem. Also, I love the idea that cheap battery materials are a problem for legacy EV makers. Wtf? Strange motives behind this one.
It was Bloomberg Intelligence only a few years ago in 2021 or 2022 that predicted that VW would be outselling Tesla in EV's by 2025. The name is an oxymoron, and like you I was startled by the cheap battery materials comments. Pretty dumb even for Bloomberg I would have guessed. I need to drop my expectations from them another 2-3 notches.
The demand for EV's is high and rising. It is the legacy auto, who cannot deliver, who spreads the rumours of low demand.
and they delete your messages if it supports EVs and saying how great they are.
My nightmare stopped the minute I sold my EV
The excuses continue, meanwhile many of us have been driving EVs for many years and China's kicking arse at making excellent EVS.
These attitudes whould have lost ww2.
5:51 people don’t concern themselves over whether internal combustion engines are going to be OK in used cars ??? Since when?
Almost the last comment highlights another bit of FUD that news articles spread--will the battery hold up? The truth is that lithium ion batteries with NMC chemistry are expected to last about 300,000 miles. They will outlive the car. Lithium ion phosphate batteries have an expected life of about 1,000,000 miles. A minimum of research would show that replacing the battery really is not a concern for cars manufactured in the last five years or so.
'Believed'
The 2nd wave mainstream prospective EV buys are naturally hesitant, given the mixed (let's be honest) success of the early batteries.
Why should they have to consider one of these early gen 2nd or 3rd hand cars / batteries if that's all they can afford?
A lot of FUD I agreed, but its not entirely unfounded.
So in essence, unless you are fortunate enough to be able afford to keep buying new to get the latest battery assurance (not proven with enough real world data for my liking yet) you then as a prospective 2nd hand buyer, need to wait at least another 3 years, before those types you mention become commonly available and affordable.
Please don't quote 'million miles tesla stories' btw! :)
I live in a cold part of Canada and will wait until I see other people driving EVs that work well in -35°C cold, have already lasted 300,000 km, and electricity is still generally cheaper than gasoline. If that happens, and my gasoline car is no longer functioning, I will consider, but not restrict myself to, a well-maintained, rust-free used EV.
>> Lithium ion phosphate batteries have an expected life of about 1,000,000 miles. A minimum of research would show that replacing the battery really is not a concern for cars manufactured in the last five years or so.
@@stuartburns8657 There is no mixed success - Tesla Model S's from 2013 only recently started needing new batteries.
@@pbreedu They exist.
EV’s… 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
We just bought our second Tesla this week. No more gas cars in our family. These are the best cars we've ever owned. Yes my wife agrees with me. Currently about the same prices as an 'equivalent' gas car. Cheaper to fuel and maintain and WAY more fun to drive.
Best of luck to the OEMs that refused to make this transition until Tesla forced them...
Automakers like xpeng, BYD, and Nio need to be sold in America as well. But of course the United States will put tariffs on them that will make them unaffordable for most Americans so they can prop up the big 3 automakers.
That is a 2 way street however. So it remains to be seen if America has the stomach to do that. China can bite back very hard. In addition, the Mexico door has been opened to them and they are likely to start building factories there and getting into the US via your agreements with Mexico.
You mean BIG2 as "chrysler" has disappeared into the netherworld of "stellantis"......
Dude says you know every three or four words
You know, you're right!
Sort of...
IF WE CAN START THINKING IN TERMS OF EV BEING A CAR, THEN WE WILL HAVE NONE OF THIS DOUBTS - EV DEMAND LIKE ANY CAR DEMAND DEPENDS UPON THE ECONOMY IN GENERAL, INTEREST RATE BUYERS NEED TO PAY, AND SORT OF TAKE TOTAL COST OF OWNERSHIP WILL RULE THE DAMAND.
AND USA IS BEST SUITED FOR EVs, AS MOST OF ITS POPULATION LIVES IN SUBURBS AND NOT IN CITIES... MAKES EV OWNERSHIP EASIER
I will NEVER buy an EV.
Neither will anyone I know.
They are vastly inferior in almost every aspect.
Tesla keeps lowering their prices and it hurts the value of all Electric vehicles.
Even Tesla owners get Fked by price cuts.
Chinese automakers are starting to move into Mexico BYD just announced that they are looking for a site to build a manufacturing plant there. That will be their first step towards selling in the USA.
I hope MG gets to the USA ASAP.... much better Chinese car than BYD and it sells for around $20k equivalent in the UK. And they already have an EV sports car.
It’s sells for 30k€ in my country besides Dacia spring is they are the cheapest in ev in our market for now, they are opening dealerships everywhere
@@weird-guyDacia spring，实际上是由雷诺集团与中国东风汽车50：50合资的易捷特公司生产的，雷诺集团的工程师制定标准，通过中国丰富的产业链制造，这款车的技术很落后，在中国属于淘汰产品，销量为0。只是我很惊讶它能在你们国家的市场表现良好😅😅
@@weird-guyDacia spring 在中国的经销商定价低于9000欧元，实际成交还有折扣😂
@@markplain2555*:* _"I hope MG gets to the USA ASAP"_ MG *owned by Chinese auto company SAIC* wants to thank you very much.
No matter what those near sighted US automakers say.. HYUNDAI is doing it. Though the fear of battery replacement cost from them is truly terrifying.
I would NEVER buy an ev/
The petroleum industry hates EVs.
The recent 2024 Beijing Auto Show featured 117 new chinese EV models. Even German Daimler and VW are adopting the philosophy, "if you can't beat them, join them," and using chinese technology for on board controls, navigation and entertainment in their upcoming models. And rumor has it that Japanese carmakers are exploring similar collaborations. It would be tragic if the Big Three sit still and rely on current US ban on Chinese EV imports (it's not going to work, Mexicans will drive them across the border to sell here, and if they are as cheap & reliable as claimed, Americans will buy them used).
They are commuter cars. Very nice golf cart type things. Worthless in large vehicles like trucks and busses. This winter showed how poorly they fail in the cold.
Ehhh, the cyber truck is pretty damn big
@@ClunFunDun so?
Ok! I will give you that although byd buses are already in America and in some cities of my country but do Americans need a f150 to go to costco?
@@MarkSmith-js2pu Goodness. Well, I hope you like loving in the past.
I live in rural America and don't know a single person that says they're going to buy a EV.
EV cars have not used value. China has the engineering and will power to do this. America is good at arguing.
The real nightmare is mr and mrs average American dont want an ev
I think it is the other way around: it’s the U.S. car industry that is a nightmare for EVs
Yeah. Everyone's terrified of Chrysler Quality and Foresight.
They say that "where California goes, others follow". California is the 10th biggest car market in the world and I understand represents about 1/5th of all US car sales. They hit 25% EV in 2023. So that's where the rest of the country will eventually go
The best thing about our Bolt EV besides the range is the incredibly easy "refueling" at home. I just plug it in at evening and it's full charge in the morning.
There were 1960 shorts films about how cars would maintenance free in the future, because all the maintenance would be done automatically at home at night by robotics and automation. Things like fill with gas, change oil, luge, check car systems health. You just got in at morning and drove off, cool because I do that now in 2024.
good thing you have a house.
Everything is a nightmare to them. They just like to sit comfortably relying on government subsidies and bailouts and not innovate much. Not unless absolutely necessary, because that would be needles work.
_"They just like to sit comfortably relying on government subsidies and bailouts and not innovate much"_
Well I KNOW that the 1980s GM and Chevies I've owned and the 2010s GM and Chevies I've owned ARE ALL THE SAME..... with the exception that the 2010s version MUST BE TAKEN TO ONLY A "certified General Motors mechanic" WHICH INCLUDES THE DEALERSHIP COST........
The bigger problem is the car-centric city design and planning, or the lack thereof. Car-centric suburbans are known to be highly inefficient and expensive to maintain. We could see tons of issues and keep pouring our tax money into maintaining these blackholes while not making money hand over fist on selling cars and oil.
Just as a quick note... you do know that 99% of all cities in North America had their street layouts before the car was invented right?
.
Also in Transport economics we learn that through "Road User Charges" suburban roads run at a suplus while all city transit systems run at a deficit. Perhaps google "Road User Charges" it's a formal Transport Economics module.
Maybe if the cities were safer and cleaner, people wouldn't mind living there. Would you like to take a stroll in Detroit or Baltimore at night?
@@safeandeffectivelol So you pointed out another major problem. I have no problem living in Tokyo or in many other cities.
@@safeandeffectivelol i'd rather go at night. less likely to be spotted and attacked for being white.
@@quippy8402 America has a very very serious demographic problem that east Asian and most, but not all, European cities don't have.
Battery powered vehicles looking for a solution to a problem that doesn't exist.
The same way building quality efficient cars was a nightmare for the Auto industry in the 80s
Spending billion$ on EV charging when enough "ICE charging" (aka gas stations) already exist. Goverments sure know how to waste taxpayers' money . . . . and enforce control.
It's the shareholders' mistake, they let business graduates run their engineering companies for more profits. Sandy Munro has been publishing about this for years and no one listened.
And
Tesla's market share is still growing, it is still opening new factories, it is still increasing production, it is still profitable.
Cut the price, make it affordable even than gasoline cars.
China and Korea are the leaders in this space. From what I read, US legacy car makers are making EV's that no one wants - with questionable software and quality assurance. Tesla have been dominant and innovative in the EV space, but need to get a CEO that has their head in the game (and can keep up with BYD).
EV is a great signal to those big manufacturers where they need to figure out a new way, I would say this isn't a nightmare but a lesson... And for all of the consumers definitely, we benefit from this technology competition. Free market, no tariff, comparative competitiveness, that's all about.
i own tesla model y 2 years. nothing changed, got 30k miles. NOT single oil change.
You still do not understand. The problem is not producing the cars. The problem is: not enough power grid and infrastructure. And there never will be. In Germany the cost of electricity has already doubled in the last 2 years. And we only have a measly few % of EVs on the roads. People can not use them and they also do not want to. When will you understand?
"In Germany the cost of electricity has already doubled in the last 2 years" - When did Russia invade Ukraine? That's right...2 years ago. Stupid comment
@@zoransarin5411 You don't have to mention that, everyone knows you made a stupid comment.
@@hagenzwosta "The problem is: not enough power grid and infrastructure. And there never will be". Are you saying Germans are too stupid to be able to expand the energy grid? They could do so with refueling stations over the years, but they can't increase the supply of electricity? What about roads? Were all the roads you drive on there for the last 100 years? Were all the houses there 100 years ago? All the power stations and electricity lines? All the factories?
We build shit. As population grows we build more shit. More places to work, to sleep, to play, to drive, to fill up.
We don't seem to have had problems getting to where we are today, but you think that's it, we can't do this? And you think I'm stupid? lol
@@zoransarin5411 What you fail to understand is that Germany also shut down all of their nuclear power plants in favor of renewable energy. And that simply isn't going to work. Renewable energy alone cannot replace fossil fuels and nuclear power. And the war in Ukraine made it even worse for them since they relied on Russia for natural gas, which turned out to be a BIG mistake. Now they're scrambling to get it from us!
@@zoransarin5411 We are even more stupid than you can imagine. We spent 4 Trillion(!) Euros to destroy the superbly working powergrid and power generation we had. To replace it with solar panels and windmills. We also shut down all nuclear power plants. You have no idea how stupid we are.
EVs are crap. Not reliable. Too expensive.
Agree. Impractical
Why is no one thinking about the waiting times. It takes ~5 mins to fill up, queue and pay. Electric cars take 30+ mins; what happens when we all have electric cars
most can charge at home, plugin around once a week only, never need to go to gas station.
China has virtually a monopoly when it comes to upstream mineral processing for batteries production. Even if US buys batteries manufactured in South Korea or Japan, their raw material such as COBALT SULPHATE or GRAPHITE is from China.
Cobalt Sulfate is not needed.
LFP battery does not have those.
Not true. Cobolt doesn't need to be in batteries? LFP has no nickel and no cobolt
Lithium is all over the place. US Australia etc. The ice auto makers are lazy and slow and paying the price
@@Charvak-Atheist >> LFP battery does not have those.
Let the marketplace decide. Government should not be giving tax subsidies. The US Taxpayer is paying for these subsidies. Why should I help someone buy an electric car. If they want one, then go buy one.
Legacy Auto told us they would have 50 "Tesla killers" by 2020.
Bloomberg : "EV's Are a Nightmare for the U.S Car Industry" *showing an Italian car on thumbnail.
Engineer here: EVs have a big problem, the best batteries today only have 250 Watt-hours of energy per Kg, while diesel or gas have 30 times more, 10000 Watt-hours,so an Ev is an unpleasant car to drive due to its enormous weight,its Inertia as engineers call it; it's hard to corner, hard to accelerate, hard to brake, it's expensive and very wasteful all around, a little 3 cylinder diesel beats any Ev hands down in initial cost and running economy;
CO2 is the best thing that ever happened to humankind; trees and plants need CO2,plenty of it, they'll die without CO2, and we'd die next; they keep the C for their bodies,their trunks, the cellulose, and they give us back the O2; amazing as it may seem, the bit trunks of huge trees are made from air, the air we breath, they use the CO2, combine it with water and hydrogen and they grow to heights amazing; all from the CO2; contrary to what lots say, CO2 is a blessing for the world;
remember this: just because everyone says it, it does not mean it's true.
Bloomberg talks bad about Elon, Tesla and Space X all the time!😂
Where all the electricity is gonna come from?
nuclear - small scale nuclear
@@gboates please look up Patrick Boyle "electrifying everthing". We will need to build a very large infrastructure that no one is talking about or its cost.
@@mvs9122 where did all the service stations come from? Do you think man is incapable of building infrastructure? If there is a demand as big as you claim, then there is a business that sees a capitalistic opportunity to provide supply, satisfy the demand and make some money. You guys just think that everything we currently have was blinked here by I Dream of Jeannie in 2 seconds.
@@zoransarin5411 look up the video in my previous comment
@@mvs9122, Thank you so much for reminding us of Patrick Boyle’s take on this 😎🤙 I listen to him quite often.
Hyundai is the number 2 EV car manufacturer in the states and NOT GM. Hyundai has a new plant coming online in 2025 with a possible Giga press . GM has nothing close to that.
EVs are the future.
EV's are the future alright. Future graveyard of toxic non recyclable elements and components as well as barren land as a result of strip mining.
The media can spread FUD, but with 7.6% of new vehicles being EVs last year, the media will pretty soon not be most people's source of information about them. It will be their neighbors, friends, and family.
Exacto mundo
The only people I know with EVs own their own homes. If you only have a condo or rent, you can't use a EV.
@@mikeydude750 It is entirely possible to put AC charging in these areas. The infrastructure money being spent on DC fast charger would almost certainly go farther if it focused on improving he AC charging for renters.
@@martalli The charger itself costs like 1000 bucks, then you have to actually wire up electrical conduit to every single parking spot in a parking lot. Trust me - asking people to "share" the charger is NOT going to work at scale. A 240V charger at each parking space in a parking garage is going to be a huge drain on the grid and a huge cost to maintain.
And then you get into the question of what to do about street parking and units without any assigned parking. Are you going to install an expensive L2 charger at every spot on the street?
@@mikeydude750 They don't cost that much, and L2 charging does not have to be 60 amps for overnight charging. Just 20-30 amps would work well, and it can be done with much cheaper wiring. I would pose that the issue would be ensuring the right person is paying for the charge and that they have access to the charging when needed. You know of course, these chargers would only supply the energy as needed. Perhaps if you are paying for a parking spot, you could pay a little more for a parking spot with a charger that you would pay the electricity for.
Hydrogen fuel cells will be perfected for autos in about 8-10 years, and then all of these EVs will be worth absolutely nothing. Green and blue hydrogen will wipe the EV market off the map.
Most of those issues with EVs are unimportant to most EV owners. My Tesla is the most amazing car I’ve ever owned. ( I said amazing. I didn’t say best build) I’m in my 4th. year and the operating costs are maybe 20% of the operating cost of any other car I’ve ever owned. The performance surpasses anything I’ve ever driven.
Global investors and EV customers committed to improving our Global Air Quality...FSR .. Fisker.. 45,000 Reservations for Ocean SUV EVS. Over 90 % Dip year. RIVN.. Rivian...XOS Trucks...Lion Electric School Buses..LEV... Vicinity Motors..VEV and more.
And the US legacy auto makers strategy is working so well now. They are all on the brink and locked out of the largest auto market in the world now. FORD is literally headed to Mexico. Train wreck of their own doing.
>> They are all on the brink and locked out of the largest auto market in the world now.
So profitable FORD is sitting on 137 billion in debt, GM at $119 billion and BYD with a Net 10 billion in cash. You wont be locking China out of anything if you want the parts to actually produce cars in the US. China controls most of the raw materials to even produce.
@@cherokee180c0 Ford has already lost over 4 billion dollars on EVs and GM has also lost over a billion. So I personally doubt either one of them will ever make any money on them.
After viewing literally hundreds of EV videos and reading as many articles, I finally test drove a Tesla Model Y. Within five minutes after finishing the drive, I completed my order. The technology package and ride comfort of this vehicle far surpassed my expectations. I will not miss my big ICE truck...
Trust the random guy talking from his bedroom!!
blablabla
Sanctions is coming to competitor, national security raise 😂😂😂
Only a nightmare if youre trying to sell gasoline cars, real simple, stop selling gas cars, phase out inventory
I love living in a world where RUclipsrs make a living out of showing up established media companies for talking utter FUD to please their legacy auto advertising sponsors. And here is the best part: many of those RUclipsrs now have a greater viewership than established media..... the game is up.
Tesla begs to differ. It's a U.S. company, you know, more so than Ford or GM.
All the protectionism and "incentives" are nightmarish. I agree with you there.
Honda and Toyota are sitting out current EV's. That tells me all I need to know about this craze. They'll wait till there's a real demand for them.
Honda and Toyota know how to make money selling gas vehicles. Reminds me of Kodak Nokia and Blockbuster. Blockbuster was offered to buy Netflix very cheaply in the beginning when Netflix was struggling. Blockbuster declined
@@johnsutherland7561 We'll see. I'm looking at Ford and GM's EV efforts wilt. The Japanese are seldom cutting edge. They let others pioneer things then build their own version version when they're ready.
For example, Honda's current hybrid system is really a small battery EV. The engine is used to charge the battery around town and never drives the wheels till it hits highway speeds.
Your examples don't really apply because their replacements really were significantly better. EV's are a sideways move at best compared to an ICE powered car.
There's no compelling case for EV's over ICE. They do have downsides, like poor resale value, high insurance and insufficient charging infra-structure.
For the amount I drive, I can't justify the extra cost of an EV over my current cars. I suspect ICE is going to be with us longer than you might expect.
@@quademasters249 Cost of Bev's are coming down and once they reach price parity. To operate them is a lot less. I drive a lot now and spend over $500 a month on gas in Canada. I spoke to 1 Tesla driver who told me it only costs him $2 or $3 for 100km when charging at home. Resale presently is poor because the price of new one's has been coming down.
Considering that the industry ignored EV's and lobbied against them for 25 years or more, it's hard to feel sorry for them being so far behind China now
No, i think the car buyers who wanted to buy a n EV already bought theirs. And the ones sitting on the fence about EVs will have second thoughts because at this time people are now hearing and reading the drawbacks of owning an EV. Then people like me still think that EV is a niche and not mainstream cuz its too expensive and not practical. For example, an EV truck, when hauling heavy loads, will lose about 50% of their range. Then i dont think the grid is not ready and hidden cost like i will have to pay an electrician to install a 220 v receptacle in my garage..
I don’t understand why ev is bad after California promoted tax rebates
Funny how he talks about engines as if they are 'not a worry' when compared to batteries. The fact is that the average ICE car is on the scrap heap before 200,000 miles. There are now thousands of EVs on the road with that mileage and more on the original battery. Typical degradation at that mileage is 10%. Electric motors themselves either seem to fail in the first few thousand miles (
I love how this complaint is bringing manufacturing back to North America .. sure Jan meanwhile China is setting up shop in Mexico .. the thesis of this piece is that us companies can’t set up supply chain in North America yet China is literally doing that right now to supply not only Tesla Mexico but also I believe ford Mexico .. just asinine reporting
drove my Xpeng G6 5000km cost was a tank of gas... n virtually no maintenance costs... no brainer
Hi from Canada ! No EV in my future ! I’ll stick to my classics and 4x4 crew cabs !
Im from Canada as well take a cyber truck for a spin you might change your mind. Plus all that saving on gas
@@johnsutherland7561🤡🤡
buying a used electric car is like buying used iPhones. never happens
this guy obviously doesn't own a Tesla, the market is so huge!
The United States of America won't be here in 50 to 100 years at the rate things are going so we need to get it right like now.
If there was sufficient demand, they'd be motivated.
The problem with electric vehicles (EVs) is that they depreciate quickly 📈, and you cannot drive them for a long time without experiencing severe battery degradation 🔋. To replace the battery, you may have to spend upwards of $25,000 💰, which makes it financially impractical for most people. Additionally, taking a road trip with family can be stressful due to the limited range of EVs 🚗🔋.
True, but it does depend on battery charge history. Really you need to be able to get that printed out when buying used. What is key is that charging and time matters more than miles driven
China gets the last laugh. US sends raw material to China for our battery production needs and components. So if the administration wants to add tariffs to that as well, up goes the price of the US EV. Also, the EV market has slowed, but if China really feels they want any of the dismal share of the US buyers, they'll build plants here.
If US citizens want a bigger car, there will soon be an abundance of Cybertrucks.
The day I buy EV is the day I can swap battery out at a station. My merc is comfy enough.
Lol gets a degraded battery or faltiy one battery swapping makes no sense for main stream cars
They already have this in China.
So you will probably end riding a bicycle. Good for you.
"merc" LIKE IN "mercury"?
*mercury IS STILL AROUND?*
How could Europe be further along with the transition to EV when they can’t even afford AC in there homes
BEVs made up 16% of market share in Europe in 2023. For the USA it was 7.6% market share for 2023. They are just the facts. Could speculate why, but at the end of the day the numbers still remain the same.
Now you know why Tesla started when they did. Make a compelling EV and people will buy it. Make a bad EV and they won’t. Demand for a good electric vehicle is up.
No you don’t. You built this you can’t complain