I would say you are just counting on the fact that you are hitting an enemy non stop. The place where nail arts shine are probably in flying enemies, where they move away from you quickly and can’t nail spam. Here, you will one shot them. Many people say colo 3 is hard, but if you spam to the ground enemies and nail arts to the flying ones you will to much better than just spam. And my final argument, dash slash is amazing against Radiant Markoth. Cyclone slash is the only nail art that I will consider it bad, the other 2 have their uses but this one seems to just exist.
Yes what you say is true and I don't think anything in the video is contrary to that. Yeah I honestly expected a bit more from cyclone slash before running the numbers! It was a bit disappointing wasn't it?
Cyclone actually has uses in speedruns with its fast fall ability. It is also very useful in enemy control in the collector battle, especially with all bindings.
Cyclone cam give you some soul from the beginning of the Galien fight, allowing you to pop off an almost immediate 120 damage. It's also good for the Obblobbles, giving you more sould per time you engage them for
Cyclone slash is the strongeat nail art, the vast majority of players just don't know that since it's the hardeat to use. I can explain why, but it'll be easier if you watch Remto's p5 all bindings hitless run. He uses cyclone slash there masterfully in ways that are often useful even without bindings.
i personally found using nail arts made nightmare king grimm a lot easier since it boiled down to holding a button, dodging until an opening presents itself then going in for big damage. Bosses like that where you dont really have time to get multiple hits in are where you'd use nail arts
I've been trying the Pantheon and learning consistent nail arts. It's great when experimenting with builds like healing builds. Quick deep unn focus, nmg, allow for a defensive style. In pantheons it's important to have a safety net for the moments where mistakes combined with bad luck create a temporary high risk of dying. People say "just learn to not get hit and be offensive build" but you could flip the argument around and say if you can avoid being hit then you don't need extra dps to win anyway. Most people aren't speedrunning. Nice video, very helpful
Well the thing is, i just use sharp shadow sooooo (But in all seriousness, yeah nail spam is definitely the way to go nail arts are difficult to use for my smooth brain)
I have recently found a nice mod expanding upon many grimm troupe charms, Nightmare Spark. This mod adds a new obtainable charm with 10 awesome special interactions themed around the grimm troupe. Its quite well made and balanced, and gives some lackluster charms like Grimmchild and Carefree Melody a new use. Am a big fan of your deep dives and would love to see a detailed explanation of these features!
The main appeal of going strong on nail arts is that to buff them as much as you can you only need 1 charm notch, whilst to use the nail you need 3 notches for Unbreakable Strength, 3 notches for Quickslash, and even more notches if you want Steady Body, Longnail, Mark of Pride or Sprint Master; charms that I have seen nail user use a lot. Meanwhile, you can take advantage of how little it costs to boost your nail arts to boost your spells at the same time, Shaman Stone + Soul Twister + Soul Eater is usually a very costly combo that doesn't work quite well because it leaves you with little options for the nail, but if you add Nailmaster's glory you have both ways of making damage, spells and nail arts, practically maxed out. Nail arts become viable as a consistent damage source and to gather soul and once its the right moments you can spam spells for a TON of damage. Furthemore, I feel obligated to add that while dps is very important in most fights you can't hit the boss all the time with constant hits, so there's not that much of an issue to be forced to hit then wait with nail arts because it what usually happens with regular nail swings anyways.
Man i was begging for there to be information for this and you came in clutch! I just want to note the fact that cyclone slash still has some use damage wise, as you don’t get knocked back, even without steady body, so it is more efficient at killing enemies like hornet protector assuming you don’t have it equipped. It also would’ve been cool to see how cyclone slash performs on x5, x4, and x3, to know whether its more worth it to use the great slashes or cyclone in situations where you can't hit all 6 slashes. Thanks for uploading!
I wish this game was more balanced in its combat options. I think nail arts should do more damage and/or the strength charm should also apply to them. Also most of the "combat" charms in the game are either complete garbage (sporeshroom, glowing womb, defenders crest,...) or broken (strength, shaman, quickslash,...), so everyone ends up using similar builds. Flukenest is still glitched (and broken) after everything team cherry tried to nerf it. Hope Silksong will be more balanced
That's a good sentiment in theory, but I challenge you to figure out how you would fix these to make it all equally viable without making any one thing too overpowered, or having to completely nerf something until it becomes practically unusable. While there may be problems with something here and there, I will say that at least for the most part, things feel very fair and well balanced in actual gameplay for most people from what I've seen. Things like this really only apply for min-maxing. As for the point of everybody using similar builds, it's because there's just objectively only a few ways to make a nail build or spell build. It's obvious what charms were meant to help facilitate which builds. And they fit their niche well.
All of that is just about the optimisation, with an unspoken given that we always want to get the best dps no matter the cost. You failed to mention that Quickslash and Strength cost three charm notches each, while Nailmaster's glory costs one, singular, lone notch. All this free space can be taken by for example Souleater (sadly, realistically the only 4 notch charm ever worth using in combat) to lay the groundwork for a unique Nailarts-Spells build that excels at dealing really good damage while keeping more aggressive enemies and bosses at bay. Is it more efficient? I dunno, probably not. I still like using it. It's badass.
I understand what you are saying, but the thing I am more trying to point out is nail arts just aren't really supported by the charm system. sure NMG only costs 1 notch and the 2 other charms in question 6 - but notches aren't the problem, the problem is if I WANT to spend notches to enhance nail arts there simply isn't a way to do it. and yes you aren't going to be standing still DPSing the entire time like the video implies, however there are windows where you do where this at least somewhat applies! Also, I don't think its a problem or anything with the game - its just fun to compare!
I had an idea for a miniquest, where the Knight visits the Nailmasters with Heavy Blow equipped and they all recognise this charm as their master's scam, so they give you three pieces of a different charm, that replaces Heavy Blow and provides bonus to Nailarts damage. Could be called Triple Strike or something. I don't think anyone would miss Heavy Blow
@@Vegathron I get where they're coming from. Like yeah, nail spam will always be more effective, but if you're running a build that doesn't have 6 notches to spare, nailmaster's glory is a nice alternative that needs nothing else to support it. Saying it's "always bad" is underselling it when it was never meant to be as good with it being a one-notch charm.
Nail arts become extremely necessary when doing Pantheons with All Bindings due to the low base nail damage. Due to lower health/resources, a more patient game-plan gives yourself more time to charge nail arts and like said in the video, more range which makes attacks safer. Cyclone slash is great in the Pantheons with All Bindings against so many bosses, even bosses/enemies in the air since cyclone slash lets you stall as long as you're mashing the attack button (Obblobles, Galien at the start of the fight for example). Great/Dash slash also let you take care of little enemies in boss fights instantly, where other wise you would need to hit with the nail twice to dispatch of them (especially in the Collector fights in P3AB & P5AB)
I love Nailmaster's Glory. It's basically like getting a power boosted longnail+mark of pride sized slash with just one notch. Cyclone slash is also my go-to for recharging soul fast
id say one fight that is really good for cyclone is flukemarm, you charge up prematurely, cyclone while falling down, then obliterate with shrieks, its how i got my radiant for her
I dont understand how people, in a fight all based around reacting and manoeuvering around the attacks of NKG, try to damage him with attacks that freeze you in place for like 2 seconds every time you use them
This makes no sense, you must dodge the attack first, and If he is close to you when you finish dodging, you use a nail art. Except for the firebats, where you'll want to dash through them, and dash slash at the end. Also, on the drop kick attack, there is an advantage for stopping in some frames, since It will hold you in the air for longer, and If you release the great slash, at the direction NKG is heading, there is a chance you get free damage@@STNDD
I find that when I play the game I almost never use nail arts. The only time I really used nail arts was to kill annoying enemies like primal aspids in one hit. This can be quite useful in colosseums especially if you do not use spells much.
I think they had the right idea but I would argue that the nail arts was the weakest (in terms of fun and interesting) of the mechanics included in this game. I love this game but the nail arts aren’t for me tho with some tweaks they could have been amazing.
nail arts are better for all bindings pantheons than just spamming the nail. Also the cyclone slash is the best one of the nail arts because you just need to charge up 1 nail art and get a lot of damage. Useful for bosses that don't give you too much time to hit them. you can use it when fighting nkg during his fire pillars attack if you dont have soul for abyss shrek. Also the cyclone slash gives a lot of soul. you should also consider charm notches because the nail build is 6 charm notches as for the nail arts it's only 1. Over all, I prefer nail arts
Excuse me i have a question… from an old game you where playing , was there an update on the savant key on katana zero because for me , the second room doesnt appear its not the same , do you need to do something befor for this room to appear???
Now i know it wont make a huge difference and youve pretty much reached the point on this comparison but Due too how damage works It can round up or down your enitial base hit damage value At certain distances this could effect the average or ratio in dps comparision Tldr: In short Fury should have a difference All be it negligible
I would say you are just counting on the fact that you are hitting an enemy non stop.
The place where nail arts shine are probably in flying enemies, where they move away from you quickly and can’t nail spam.
Here, you will one shot them.
Many people say colo 3 is hard, but if you spam to the ground enemies and nail arts to the flying ones you will to much better than just spam.
And my final argument, dash slash is amazing against Radiant Markoth.
Cyclone slash is the only nail art that I will consider it bad, the other 2 have their uses but this one seems to just exist.
Yes what you say is true and I don't think anything in the video is contrary to that. Yeah I honestly expected a bit more from cyclone slash before running the numbers! It was a bit disappointing wasn't it?
Cyclone actually has uses in speedruns with its fast fall ability. It is also very useful in enemy control in the collector battle, especially with all bindings.
Me casually dealing 157 dmg to nightmare king grimm with cyclone slash:
Cyclone cam give you some soul from the beginning of the Galien fight, allowing you to pop off an almost immediate 120 damage. It's also good for the Obblobbles, giving you more sould per time you engage them for
Cyclone slash is the strongeat nail art, the vast majority of players just don't know that since it's the hardeat to use. I can explain why, but it'll be easier if you watch Remto's p5 all bindings hitless run. He uses cyclone slash there masterfully in ways that are often useful even without bindings.
was wandering this question myself when making the inventory ranking, glad its finally answered!
i personally found using nail arts made nightmare king grimm a lot easier since it boiled down to holding a button, dodging until an opening presents itself then going in for big damage. Bosses like that where you dont really have time to get multiple hits in are where you'd use nail arts
I've been trying the Pantheon and learning consistent nail arts. It's great when experimenting with builds like healing builds.
Quick deep unn focus, nmg, allow for a defensive style. In pantheons it's important to have a safety net for the moments where mistakes combined with bad luck create a temporary high risk of dying.
People say "just learn to not get hit and be offensive build" but you could flip the argument around and say if you can avoid being hit then you don't need extra dps to win anyway. Most people aren't speedrunning.
Nice video, very helpful
Well the thing is, i just use sharp shadow sooooo (But in all seriousness, yeah nail spam is definitely the way to go nail arts are difficult to use for my smooth brain)
Mental note for video idea: "What is the MOST damage we can do with sharp shadow?" XD I mean I DO have the numbers on my spreadsheet somewhere 🤣
@@Vegathron No way, That would be crazy... (as like a 10 second youtube short lol)
The best use for Great Slash: to get Primal Aspids out of my face without having to hit them more than once. I also use a spell build primarily so...
You can go with a spell build and just use nailmasters glory. Works out really well in some scenarios.
I have recently found a nice mod expanding upon many grimm troupe charms, Nightmare Spark. This mod adds a new obtainable charm with 10 awesome special interactions themed around the grimm troupe. Its quite well made and balanced, and gives some lackluster charms like Grimmchild and Carefree Melody a new use. Am a big fan of your deep dives and would love to see a detailed explanation of these features!
Hey there sounds neat! I will check it out! :)
@@Vegathron Thanks! You can read up on some interactions in the readme!
Now, hear me out: Combining NMG with Fury makes the nail arts look REALLY cool.
The main appeal of going strong on nail arts is that to buff them as much as you can you only need 1 charm notch, whilst to use the nail you need 3 notches for Unbreakable Strength, 3 notches for Quickslash, and even more notches if you want Steady Body, Longnail, Mark of Pride or Sprint Master; charms that I have seen nail user use a lot.
Meanwhile, you can take advantage of how little it costs to boost your nail arts to boost your spells at the same time, Shaman Stone + Soul Twister + Soul Eater is usually a very costly combo that doesn't work quite well because it leaves you with little options for the nail, but if you add Nailmaster's glory you have both ways of making damage, spells and nail arts, practically maxed out. Nail arts become viable as a consistent damage source and to gather soul and once its the right moments you can spam spells for a TON of damage.
Furthemore, I feel obligated to add that while dps is very important in most fights you can't hit the boss all the time with constant hits, so there's not that much of an issue to be forced to hit then wait with nail arts because it what usually happens with regular nail swings anyways.
But do the nail arts have the same soul gain multiplier as damage?
Man i was begging for there to be information for this and you came in clutch! I just want to note the fact that cyclone slash still has some use damage wise, as you don’t get knocked back, even without steady body, so it is more efficient at killing enemies like hornet protector assuming you don’t have it equipped. It also would’ve been cool to see how cyclone slash performs on x5, x4, and x3, to know whether its more worth it to use the great slashes or cyclone in situations where you can't hit all 6 slashes. Thanks for uploading!
I wish this game was more balanced in its combat options. I think nail arts should do more damage and/or the strength charm should also apply to them. Also most of the "combat" charms in the game are either complete garbage (sporeshroom, glowing womb, defenders crest,...) or broken (strength, shaman, quickslash,...), so everyone ends up using similar builds. Flukenest is still glitched (and broken) after everything team cherry tried to nerf it. Hope Silksong will be more balanced
That's a good sentiment in theory, but I challenge you to figure out how you would fix these to make it all equally viable without making any one thing too overpowered, or having to completely nerf something until it becomes practically unusable.
While there may be problems with something here and there, I will say that at least for the most part, things feel very fair and well balanced in actual gameplay for most people from what I've seen. Things like this really only apply for min-maxing.
As for the point of everybody using similar builds, it's because there's just objectively only a few ways to make a nail build or spell build. It's obvious what charms were meant to help facilitate which builds. And they fit their niche well.
All of that is just about the optimisation, with an unspoken given that we always want to get the best dps no matter the cost.
You failed to mention that Quickslash and Strength cost three charm notches each, while Nailmaster's glory costs one, singular, lone notch.
All this free space can be taken by for example Souleater (sadly, realistically the only 4 notch charm ever worth using in combat) to lay the groundwork for a unique Nailarts-Spells build that excels at dealing really good damage while keeping more aggressive enemies and bosses at bay.
Is it more efficient? I dunno, probably not. I still like using it. It's badass.
I understand what you are saying, but the thing I am more trying to point out is nail arts just aren't really supported by the charm system. sure NMG only costs 1 notch and the 2 other charms in question 6 - but notches aren't the problem, the problem is if I WANT to spend notches to enhance nail arts there simply isn't a way to do it. and yes you aren't going to be standing still DPSing the entire time like the video implies, however there are windows where you do where this at least somewhat applies! Also, I don't think its a problem or anything with the game - its just fun to compare!
I had an idea for a miniquest, where the Knight visits the Nailmasters with Heavy Blow equipped and they all recognise this charm as their master's scam, so they give you three pieces of a different charm, that replaces Heavy Blow and provides bonus to Nailarts damage.
Could be called Triple Strike or something. I don't think anyone would miss Heavy Blow
@@Vegathron I get where they're coming from. Like yeah, nail spam will always be more effective, but if you're running a build that doesn't have 6 notches to spare, nailmaster's glory is a nice alternative that needs nothing else to support it. Saying it's "always bad" is underselling it when it was never meant to be as good with it being a one-notch charm.
Nail arts become extremely necessary when doing Pantheons with All Bindings due to the low base nail damage. Due to lower health/resources, a more patient game-plan gives yourself more time to charge nail arts and like said in the video, more range which makes attacks safer.
Cyclone slash is great in the Pantheons with All Bindings against so many bosses, even bosses/enemies in the air since cyclone slash lets you stall as long as you're mashing the attack button (Obblobles, Galien at the start of the fight for example). Great/Dash slash also let you take care of little enemies in boss fights instantly, where other wise you would need to hit with the nail twice to dispatch of them (especially in the Collector fights in P3AB & P5AB)
I love Nailmaster's Glory. It's basically like getting a power boosted longnail+mark of pride sized slash with just one notch. Cyclone slash is also my go-to for recharging soul fast
id say one fight that is really good for cyclone is flukemarm, you charge up prematurely, cyclone while falling down, then obliterate with shrieks, its how i got my radiant for her
Ooh that sounds like a really cool strat!
I just thought about this yesterday, and now this video shows up, haha.
I dont understand how people, in a fight all based around reacting and manoeuvering around the attacks of NKG, try to damage him with attacks that freeze you in place for like 2 seconds every time you use them
You know you can charge the nail arts while you move around right? Ive fought NKG several times with heavy nail art usage and its very fun.
@@WhatISawJuly7th I mean when you release it
This makes no sense, you must dodge the attack first, and If he is close to you when you finish dodging, you use a nail art. Except for the firebats, where you'll want to dash through them, and dash slash at the end. Also, on the drop kick attack, there is an advantage for stopping in some frames, since It will hold you in the air for longer, and If you release the great slash, at the direction NKG is heading, there is a chance you get free damage@@STNDD
@CorujaVerdeBS Ooooor... You can just hit the boss ಠ_ʖಠ
@STNDD Did I just wrote all that lines of text for nothing?
5:45 how are you base attacking with shadow
I find that when I play the game I almost never use nail arts. The only time I really used nail arts was to kill annoying enemies like primal aspids in one hit. This can be quite useful in colosseums especially if you do not use spells much.
which nail art do u prefer and why?
Cyclone slash for fast soul gain also cyclone go BRRRR
I think they had the right idea but I would argue that the nail arts was the weakest (in terms of fun and interesting) of the mechanics included in this game. I love this game but the nail arts aren’t for me tho with some tweaks they could have been amazing.
But.. but... you can use the lingering great slash hitbox
nail arts are better for all bindings pantheons than just spamming the nail.
Also the cyclone slash is the best one of the nail arts because you just need to charge up 1 nail art and get a lot of damage. Useful for bosses that don't give you too much time to hit them. you can use it when fighting nkg during his fire pillars attack if you dont have soul for abyss shrek. Also the cyclone slash gives a lot of soul.
you should also consider charm notches because the nail build is 6 charm notches as for the nail arts it's only 1.
Over all, I prefer nail arts
4:56 staggering counts number of hits though
Keep in mind nail arts will stall you like when you use spells.
So use them at your own risk!
Excuse me i have a question… from an old game you where playing , was there an update on the savant key on katana zero because for me , the second room doesnt appear its not the same , do you need to do something befor for this room to appear???
Hmm nothing changed as far as I know. Double check you're definitely in the right level/area is the only thing I can think to tell you.
Nah, imma still use it anyway.
Now i know it wont make a huge difference and youve pretty much reached the point on this comparison but
Due too how damage works
It can round up or down your enitial base hit damage value
At certain distances this could effect the average or ratio in dps comparision
Tldr:
In short
Fury should have a difference
All be it negligible
Always sub to an Aussie creator. On ya mate.
aay thanks champion!
Nail or spells?
Soon!
Wah- do people really think nail masters glory buffs the arts dmg?
One of the Nail master comment said overcharm it... Yea good luck overcharming a 1 notch charm, misinformation going crazy
I'm the fourth comment me subscribe just 2 months ago!!
Yooo thanks for the support man!