It would be interesting to talk about solo vs team play with custom ammo. I have found a lot of sucess running flechettes as a solo because it forces them back to stop the bleeding, giving me more freedom to push them safely or disengage. Slugs are great, but if you don't kill the person you aim at, they basically made almost no difference compared to regular buckshot, whereas flechettes will always have the desired effect, which you can then exploit to your liking. Slugs seem to make more sense as part of a team, because it reduces the negative impact of missing shots/not killing your target as your team mates can follow up or at least capitalise on the situation for you while you reload or reposition.
Interesting, I've always thought of it the other way around. In solos you want to end fights rapidly and decisively, while in teams you can afford to play a role where you can suppress people.
@@4FSGaming i fought a solo on a a roof who had handcannon with flechettes. Because we were running poor man loadouts, our range was very low, and the flechettes made it impossible to push onto the roof. Pretty decent when you find yourself being rushed down as a solo
long ammo plus flechette has quickly become my favourite loadout. just extremely reliably at close to mid range with the shotguns serving as a pressure tool/finisher/opener, and for longer ranges you have the long ammo. You can even dial your preferred ranges by either going long shotgun with uppercut, or obrez with handcannon. Or you have Quartermaster of course.
I've been running Sparks with Rival Handcannon Flechettes for a while now. The Flechettes arent essential but the tighter spread to finish off helps a ton.
Awesome video! ❤️ 2 questions: 1) how can a player tell if you have slugs versus buckshot? You made it seem like this was possible to discern when fighting 2) would you be able to possibly have range samples of the distances you're talking about? Even just still frames of like "8 meters to this hunter" versus "15 meters to this hunter" would be massively helpful. Truthfully, I have no realistic understanding of the true implications of these distances when you mention such a wide array of ranges. That would really help it hit home, just how much further slugs can one tap, or two tap, or how much further flechette can two tap
Cheers! 1. I believe the audio cue is slightly different, but need to confirm as I'm not confident telling them apart at this point. Otherwise I find it's safest to assume they have slugs if I hear shotgun shots, and maintain appropriate distance until I can confirm (usually through player behavior) 2. ruclips.net/video/znnMdNzqbO4/видео.html - this might help, you can pace stuff out next time you get in a game. Sorry for posting a link, sometimes after making so many technical guides It almost feels like there's "required reading" haha
"Flechette Ammo: Can now one-hit-kill (OHK) if enough pellets connect with the head (9m for long/medium barrel shotguns, 8m for small barrel). While this range might feel quite far, in practise this will only really be effective with a precise headshot in close quarters." Posted 10 days after this video went live. Excellent video, perfect in every way. I just wanted to update people who may be under the impression that Flichette cannot OHKO under any circumstances, because that has changed.
Very interesting video as usual, I love those guides even with 1400H. To be honest I find these custom ammo more fun than actually good and they are for sure not a straight upgrade unlike many people think. The flechete+long combo is probably the most fun but then you have to remember you still cannot push any building even if you have a "shotgun" with Quartermaster paired with a Spark or Martiny, which often got me killed. In fact, the whole flechette got me killed far more often than it helped me, and I have a pretty good aim already, so I'd almost rather just keep a Uppercut in secondary for bigger ammo pool, much better penetration and versatility. As for Slugs, I think it is the most overrated thing and let me explain you why. 1- It makes the Caldwell go from 100$ to 250$, even if it is still far cheaper than a Crown & King. 2- Ammo turns into custom ammo, but I never run out of ammo before dying so I don't mind that one, however it is definitely a cons which you pay for. 3- You're never gonna 1 tap someone if you accidentally hit his leg or arms instead of torso, something that's quite unpredictable. What's the point of a shotgun if half the time I need a 2 tap instead of a 1 tap for 2.5x cheaper? 4- You then have some sort of bastard rifle/shotgun which is outgunned by any rifles >25m, or any shotgun
Flechete is still viable for breaching building what do mean it turns the Caldwell into a reliable two tappers or the terminus into a three or two tapper
I like slugs best on the Specter. More range, you get 5 shots, and with iron devastator (finally has a use, yay) you can fire surprisingly quick. Two downsides is it's not as great really close range if you have bad aim/there are two enemies coming at you at once, and it reloads really slowly. I think it's worth it just for the extra range personally.
Verry comprehensive, thanks for this. I think spectre slugs are a little more powerful though, The Rival does that that 2 tap, but having more ammo to play with is important against trios, it also makes it more viable at medium range while retaining its close range potential.
Thing is, without Iron Devastator, the Specter will be wayyy slower and just too slow for mid-range fights compare to any other shotguns imo. If you miss entirely ur first slug, ur 50% dead before the next shot, and then if he doesn't die on ur second shot which often happens, then ur most likely just dead. It's too easy to accidentally hit arms instead of torso and deal far less.
Crytec just love changing shotguns everytime you do an analysis of them Maybe you could make a pinned comment for the changes like a flush it can now headshot(one hit kill) and slugs now costing $200 But I love these weapon analysis videos that you do! I hope you get through all of them I always save them, as a reference to come back to This is at least my second time watching this video
Great video as always Ascendance. I appreciate that you take the time to find the detailed info and put in the ground work to find the data. You can only rely on the weapon stats in-game so much. With this video, you can learn to use each variation at the appropriate distance and in the most effective way. There is a LOT of value here. Thanks.
Would be dope if you could make a guide on explosive ammo next because it seems kind of broken to me. When I use it on the Martini, I get kills from insane ranges, plus ridiculous "around the corner" kills. Almost like a long range shotgun.
Same here, although it does bump the price up quite a bit. But I would say its worth it for the effective "pocket romero" you get out of it. Even if you miss, so long as you have fanning, you still have a reliable backup.
The timing of this video couldn’t be better; I love the Caldwell a lot, it’s personally for me as I have a lot of good memories hunting and being outdoors with a side by side shotgun. So despite its in game quirks, I prefer it over all other shotguns even though it objectively ranks lower than the others.
Amazing guide! Thank you so much And I'd LOVE to see more shotgun analysis because shotguns have always been on the more unreliable side of loadouts when it comes to numbers in game (such as range or damage) , so i really appreciate the amount of work and effort you guys have put in to make this guide and I'm really looking forward to see more shotgun analysis. Thank you
thank you for your effort, i was hoping a vid like this would appear. Will you also make fire/fmj/dragon rounds for other weapons? This is an endless pool of content righ now lol
The fact that you can hold incredibly tight angles with shotguns at essentially any cover type, and from a little further way... makes them insane for compound fights.
I'd like to see them implement some different audio cues based on ammo type, one of the biggest perks of slugs is having people think you're ineffective past 10m. My first encounter with slugs was actually a ridiculous max range headshot, I was so sure I had the kill when I went down at 30 meters lol.
Okay 4FS get out of my head Me yesterday: wow this caldwell rival is really good, I can't wait to keep using it and learn about it 4fs today: caldwell rival guide
Great video man! It's funny because it wasn't even last night I started getting some kills with the Caldwell rival and using slugs. Gladi watched this, very informative!
On the terms of slugs checks and balances, you are 100% right. The other day I was playing with a group of friends they were both down and I was the last one, I was using a Romero that I had stole from a hunter the match before that had slugs in it. When I went to where my teammates were downed I saw a guy in a bush and thought "This will be an easy kill" So I hover my crosshairs over him and shoot, But I completely miss, He than notices me and starts shooting back but he also misses giving me time to reload, I shoot him again and miss in point blank range, At this point I'm getting pissed and want to know why my shot isn't hitting him. He than proceeds to take out a knife and rush me, I load another round into the Romero and proceed to miss again, and he kills me. It was only after this when I am seriously pissed that none of those shots landed that I realized it was because I never bothered to switch back to my Buckshot before going to help them, Meaning instead of hipfiring lots of pellets I was hipfiring a slug that kept missing. Now my friends believes that Special ammo is more of a detriment than a benefit, though I still know Special ammo can be very powerful if used correctly, For slugs you are giving up the comfort of knowing that in point blank range you can kill any hunter with a hipfire shot for using your shotgun as a rifle.
I really enjoy long ammmo weapon+ rival with flechette. It's really easy to land a follow-up shot after hitting people with long ammo. And in case of cqb, flechette rival in my opinion is more reliable than 2 long ammo weapons loadout for guys like me who cannot always place an accurate headshot or a quick 2-tap in close range.
Great video! Just an FYI, but I tested the Crown and King's spread a few weeks ago and it seems that its spread is actually identical to the regular (long) Specter variant. I think there may have been unmentioned tweaks between now and your old shotgun spread analysis Also, I hope you guys will do an analysis of the Terminus 1887 cause there seem to be a few weird things going on with that one. The spread on the full-length terminus is actually higher than the other medium barrel shotguns (Rival / Spectre Bayonet), but despite that Crytek still claims it has a slightly longer one hit kill range. My thinking is that the Terminus 1887 is a 10 gaurge shotgun (it says so on the weapon model's barrel) whereas every other shotgun is a 12 gauge. Maybe Crytek actually reflected that in the stats by giving it a different damage profile
Im always losing my mind seeing people aim with the shotgun (without the use of slug) but regardless very good video xD Edit: I think btw the biggest downside is that you need to aim with slug on the rival which makes it much better on a range of 10 meters but much worse in a range of 5 meters. That is the main reason why i think the best way to use it is the romero because you get only positive effects out of it. The spread of the romero is so tight that even if you hipfire with slug than you one hit kill still on close range and on range you get the same advantage like the other shotguns with slug.
got two shot by flechette at 25m firstshot 90 something dmg 5dmg 1 sec bleed(actually not 1 sec but as long as the instant second shot hit me) secondshot 55 dmg... that made me consider playing the good old double barrel uppercut again like back in the nasty melee meta :D
im not a shotgun fan, just personally doesn't fit my play style this was though extremely informative on how they work in this game and why when i have used them they've felt inconsistent. it doesn't clear up everything considering its mostly info on the Caldwell and i kind of already had the key ideas of why its one of the ones i get killed with the most. however i would like to commend that in a game filled with rates you play the shotgun like a man. my team literally pushed the second bounty with me having 1 small bar of health, my buddy having 2 small bars, and our other having 1 big after fighting 2 (good) trios on our first bounty, we had to sit there for almost the entire contract time because they all had shotguns. wouldnt peak, just sat and corner camped a team that didnt have a full players bar of health between the 3 of them with shotguns. we ended up killing them with 5 minutes left to extract it was by far the dumbest game i have ever played in hunt. and the last one alive had the audacity to talk shit. its a good example of why warzone players should stay away from hunt.
Great content as usual. As long as long ammo is king, i would like to see other stuff getting buffed, not nerfed. Having meta guns in this game takes away some of its best having fun components.
Completely agree. It's a slower firing specter bayonet, without the bayonet or any good custom ammo choices. Levering just doesn't make if fast enough either.
Slugs are super strong indeed. But I am not using them. Because for 2000+ hours I only used shotguns with hip-fire (with great success). So I am not going through the excessive learning curve to start using ADS with shotguns.
Rival with slugs is one of my favorite loadouts, it's incredibly fun to play. Also, one of my favorite meme loadouts is rival with slugs + rival handcannon with slugs.
I had been saying since slug's announcement that a single projectile that one shots up to 15 m that doesn't have the shitty Nitro sights is gonna be insane. Yet, everyone was still convinced that slugs were actually going to be underpowered because of the bad hipfire. Just... don't hipfire it. Well, at least someone agrees with me... I'd say just give it a bit of an ammo reserve nerf like explosive ammo has, so that you can drain someone's slug ammo a bit better by keeping your distance. Maybe also knock the price up to $200 for slugs so that the Rival lands in the $300 range, putting it on the same tier as Mosins and such. Food for thought.
I kinda disagree. While slugs definitely feel like an all around upgrade vs the buckshot, I still don't really change my playstyle against them, and most definitely don't try to make the enemy run out of ammo. Any nerfs to them I feel would be unwarranted. Kinda wish the headshot range was increased a bit though... Feels way too arcady having something of that mass, and velocity land on your head and do less damage than a pistol...
The problem with price gating, is that it's only a barrier to players that are struggling and have low funds, not to good players with plenty of cash. And since the slugs are a quick scope wet dream, and most quick scopers tend to be better at the game, it would just make it more frustrating for bad players getting killed my slugs all the time, but not being able to afford them all time. When quick swapping was the meta, the Mosin/Uppercut was the preferred load out. It's an expensive loadout, but anyone who was quickswapping was usually able to afford it.
AFAIK all long barrel shotguns have the exact same stats with slugs. The only thing good about the Romero is that you can switch between ammo types, otherwise I would consider it the worst shotgun for slugs
Now I haven't tested it, but the devs have put out information stating that all slugs for large slot weapons behave the same, while medium slot (and the Lemat) all perform the same as each other.
They should have a Caldwell Bayonet. With 2 cleaver like objects underneath each barrel and have the animation of the riposte. The legendary should be called Sabertooth.
There is no downside to slugs, the ones you mention are negligible and never actually stop from getting killed/kills since uppercut is on par with any rifle anyways. I m really hoping for some improvement to this ammo type, because it's rare to see anything else played at all aside from spark/mosin/dolch , which is extremely disheartening when everything in this game is capable of sending players to the death screen which would encourage exploration of this magnificent arsenal or firearms, but like with any other game people's goal is not to have fun, but to chase meta, use best items possible and the games become stale and sluggish ^_^ . The real selling point for hunt to me is that no matter what they use i can kill them with anything and these weapons dont really make anyone indestructible
I wanted to ask about something with slugs that confuses me. My understanding of buckshot is that it does 1.3x to the chest and 1.5x to the head. However, if slugs followed these same rules and were an OHKO to the head at 25m, they should one hit to the body at over 21m, so how are slugs being treated differently than buckshot to cause this?
My only problem with rival slugs in particular is that they can feel incredibly oppressive to fight. If you are stuck in the same building or compound as someone, it sometimes feels as if you can’t peak anything which is never fun.
@@4FSGaming interesting, thanks for letting me know. I was basing of my info from their latest testserver notes before the release of the update. steamdb.info/patchnotes/6326672/
Nitro needs a buff. Can't compete with Rival at close range. Can't compete with Rifles at mid to long range. If it keeps that ridiculously unwieldy aperture sight, it should one tap at every body piece at its current one tap kill range. Otherwise just give the ability to flip it. Kinda Rival slug with double range. Thoughts?
The nitro is no doubt difficult to use. However when a player knows what they are doing has the ability to one tap from 43m, and even in the arms at 20m...well it can be very intimidating.
@@4FSGaming That is somewhat the point. It isn't really intimidating anymore. It was for quite a while in the early days. It's just an loud, pretty useless piece of metal at the moment. Think what bugs me most no reliable kill at 43m, well, because of arms in the way. Also damage drop off is ridiculously bad, too after that. Also needs more than 3 bullets per boss. So it's just good for the memes. Nothing else imho
You say Slug Ammo's weakness is its potential to be outplayed, but it can be said about any weapon / ammo type, is a weak argument imo. I think its weakness is the same as its strength - no spread. It's weaker at shorter distances since you have to aim. You lose mobility and maneuverability , can't run/jump move around and shoot as easily, can't use hipfire, which is quite good for aiming at targets moving quickly at short distances. Slug requires more skill to hit and rewards it, but if you're like me and can't hit shit, holding angles with buckshot hipfire can be more reliable even though sometimes less rewarding. Also I am not sure how strong Rival's aimpunch is, but I think even hitting just few pellets is better than missing slug and not doing anything. So I think slugs are riskier, if you get what I mean. Overall Slugs are better at 7+ meters, but if I plan to fight at shorter distances I prefer buckshot.
Do you have any idea or data about the quick swap speeds between full barrel shotgun vs its handcannon counterpart? I always wonder about that but couldn't find any info anywhere. It's important especially using flechette rounds for follow up finishers. Maybe you would know since you like to go in detail with these kinds of things :D Great video by the way, cheers
Looking forward to getting your update on caldwell rival after 1.5.2. What do they mean exactly with the short and medium barrel improvements to reliability?
I have a question. When comparing damage multipliers 2:20, what if you shoot them in the back? Does the torso and upper torso apply to the back of hunters as well?
I like the design of the caldwell rival but not the spread. It feels "inconsistent" to me and I've found romero and specter more reliable and less random. But I will say the caldwell rival with slugs has been brutal lately.
Anyone else feel like slugs are kind of a problem? I've seen so many Slug-rivals on my death screens lately, to the exclusion of almost anything else (barring the occasional frag or dolch or winnie headshot), it makes it really hard to swallow the idea that they're somehow balanced in spite of how people openly admit that they won't play any other ammo on the rival. To clarify, I don't think slugs are a problem on the romero or specter in the same way as the rival, specifically because the rival has so much more RoF. It really sucks to be defending a compound and having almost nowhere you can go that's outside of the potential one-shot range, even with cover. And even outside of the one-shot range, it just feels like the old quickswap days just like 4FS said, and that was removed as an *exploit*... I dunno, I feel like rival-slugs are just the best option at too many ranges, and the number of people comfortably comparing it to a 'mini nitro' is kind of disgusting for how easy it is to place shots with the rival in comparison.
I don't see them as a problem in the same way the nitro or avtomat are not a problem, they are still less competitive than a winfield with HV rounds or any long ammo bolt action
It's pretty much a flare gun, so if you're full on equipment and want flares I guess you can gimp your gun... Also maybe for red barrel camping so you can one shot them. Overall pretty bad
My question is, does the bloodless trait reduce the impact damage taken by flechette? I love bringing flechette but my issue with it is sometimes I will get two back to back hits that are perfect, and hunters will just shrug it off and keep fighting me. Sometimes this has happened within 10 meters. Other times I have two shot hunters at 20 meters with flechettes, again in quick succession.
The spectres definitly better with slugs. You just need to make sure you 1 shot. But you gave 5 shots without needing to reload. The rival is just more forgiving and noob friendly.
My understanding is that any hitmarker will cause light bleed. Now I can't verify this for certain because I can't guarantee that only one projectile hit a target in any tests, but at long range with most projectiles missing, it still causes light bleed every time I tried.
Are we getting an analysis like this for every shotgun? cause that be awesome but a lot of work for you I suspect
It becomes less work each time fortunately!
Yeah, would like to see Romero next
More? Omg ❤️
@@4FSGaming thank you!
Yes. Specifically rom.hatchet w/ slugs and spec.bayonet w/ slugs
13:45 that poor guy, stuck behind a fence with an axe
It would be interesting to talk about solo vs team play with custom ammo.
I have found a lot of sucess running flechettes as a solo because it forces them back to stop the bleeding, giving me more freedom to push them safely or disengage.
Slugs are great, but if you don't kill the person you aim at, they basically made almost no difference compared to regular buckshot, whereas flechettes will always have the desired effect, which you can then exploit to your liking.
Slugs seem to make more sense as part of a team, because it reduces the negative impact of missing shots/not killing your target as your team mates can follow up or at least capitalise on the situation for you while you reload or reposition.
Interesting, I've always thought of it the other way around. In solos you want to end fights rapidly and decisively, while in teams you can afford to play a role where you can suppress people.
@@4FSGaming i fought a solo on a a roof who had handcannon with flechettes. Because we were running poor man loadouts, our range was very low, and the flechettes made it impossible to push onto the roof. Pretty decent when you find yourself being rushed down as a solo
I agree with you about how Flechette is the most well made custom ammo because it changes your play style but its not a upgrade or downgrade.
long ammo plus flechette has quickly become my favourite loadout. just extremely reliably at close to mid range with the shotguns serving as a pressure tool/finisher/opener, and for longer ranges you have the long ammo. You can even dial your preferred ranges by either going long shotgun with uppercut, or obrez with handcannon. Or you have Quartermaster of course.
I've been running Sparks with Rival Handcannon Flechettes for a while now. The Flechettes arent essential but the tighter spread to finish off helps a ton.
@@akerravala not to mention the range of the flechettes, allowing them to serve as an easy finisher far beyond buckshot range.
Awesome video! ❤️
2 questions:
1) how can a player tell if you have slugs versus buckshot? You made it seem like this was possible to discern when fighting
2) would you be able to possibly have range samples of the distances you're talking about? Even just still frames of like "8 meters to this hunter" versus "15 meters to this hunter" would be massively helpful. Truthfully, I have no realistic understanding of the true implications of these distances when you mention such a wide array of ranges. That would really help it hit home, just how much further slugs can one tap, or two tap, or how much further flechette can two tap
Cheers!
1. I believe the audio cue is slightly different, but need to confirm as I'm not confident telling them apart at this point. Otherwise I find it's safest to assume they have slugs if I hear shotgun shots, and maintain appropriate distance until I can confirm (usually through player behavior)
2. ruclips.net/video/znnMdNzqbO4/видео.html - this might help, you can pace stuff out next time you get in a game. Sorry for posting a link, sometimes after making so many technical guides It almost feels like there's "required reading" haha
"Flechette Ammo:
Can now one-hit-kill (OHK) if enough pellets connect with the head (9m for long/medium barrel shotguns, 8m for small barrel).
While this range might feel quite far, in practise this will only really be effective with a precise headshot in close quarters."
Posted 10 days after this video went live.
Excellent video, perfect in every way. I just wanted to update people who may be under the impression that Flichette cannot OHKO under any circumstances, because that has changed.
Very interesting video as usual, I love those guides even with 1400H. To be honest I find these custom ammo more fun than actually good and they are for sure not a straight upgrade unlike many people think. The flechete+long combo is probably the most fun but then you have to remember you still cannot push any building even if you have a "shotgun" with Quartermaster paired with a Spark or Martiny, which often got me killed. In fact, the whole flechette got me killed far more often than it helped me, and I have a pretty good aim already, so I'd almost rather just keep a Uppercut in secondary for bigger ammo pool, much better penetration and versatility.
As for Slugs, I think it is the most overrated thing and let me explain you why.
1- It makes the Caldwell go from 100$ to 250$, even if it is still far cheaper than a Crown & King.
2- Ammo turns into custom ammo, but I never run out of ammo before dying so I don't mind that one, however it is definitely a cons which you pay for.
3- You're never gonna 1 tap someone if you accidentally hit his leg or arms instead of torso, something that's quite unpredictable. What's the point of a shotgun if half the time I need a 2 tap instead of a 1 tap for 2.5x cheaper?
4- You then have some sort of bastard rifle/shotgun which is outgunned by any rifles >25m, or any shotgun
Flechete is still viable for breaching building what do mean it turns the Caldwell into a reliable two tappers or the terminus into a three or two tapper
Amazing! cant wait for when you get time to do the Crossbow special Bolts :)
Yes! Please!!
I like slugs best on the Specter. More range, you get 5 shots, and with iron devastator (finally has a use, yay) you can fire surprisingly quick.
Two downsides is it's not as great really close range if you have bad aim/there are two enemies coming at you at once, and it reloads really slowly. I think it's worth it just for the extra range personally.
Verry comprehensive, thanks for this.
I think spectre slugs are a little more powerful though, The Rival does that that 2 tap, but having more ammo to play with is important against trios, it also makes it more viable at medium range while retaining its close range potential.
Thing is, without Iron Devastator, the Specter will be wayyy slower and just too slow for mid-range fights compare to any other shotguns imo. If you miss entirely ur first slug, ur 50% dead before the next shot, and then if he doesn't die on ur second shot which often happens, then ur most likely just dead. It's too easy to accidentally hit arms instead of torso and deal far less.
Crytec just love changing shotguns everytime you do an analysis of them
Maybe you could make a pinned comment for the changes like a flush it can now headshot(one hit kill) and slugs now costing $200
But I love these weapon analysis videos that you do!
I hope you get through all of them I always save them, as a reference to come back to
This is at least my second time watching this video
Great video as always Ascendance. I appreciate that you take the time to find the detailed info and put in the ground work to find the data. You can only rely on the weapon stats in-game so much. With this video, you can learn to use each variation at the appropriate distance and in the most effective way. There is a LOT of value here. Thanks.
Would be dope if you could make a guide on explosive ammo next because it seems kind of broken to me. When I use it on the Martini, I get kills from insane ranges, plus ridiculous "around the corner" kills. Almost like a long range shotgun.
In progress...
hope you'll cover the ammo for the shotgun part of the LeMat, the slug on LeMat is a straight upgrade in my opinion.
The lematt shotgun profile is the exact same as the rival handcannon
@@philturner1336 i think it's even worse, 4fs made a video about all the spreads a while ago. here the special ammo are discussed too.
Same here, although it does bump the price up quite a bit. But I would say its worth it for the effective "pocket romero" you get out of it. Even if you miss, so long as you have fanning, you still have a reliable backup.
@@royceheflin8207 i have been able to one shot players through a wooden floor above me with the penetration of the slug.
Great video. You should do one of these comprehensive videos on the shotbolt. 1k+ hours into the game and i still don’t understand how it works.
The timing of this video couldn’t be better; I love the Caldwell a lot, it’s personally for me as I have a lot of good memories hunting and being outdoors with a side by side shotgun. So despite its in game quirks, I prefer it over all other shotguns even though it objectively ranks lower than the others.
Amazing guide! Thank you so much
And I'd LOVE to see more shotgun analysis because shotguns have always been on the more unreliable side of loadouts when it comes to numbers in game (such as range or damage) , so i really appreciate the amount of work and effort you guys have put in to make this guide and I'm really looking forward to see more shotgun analysis.
Thank you
Really waiting for Lemat analysis, aka adaptive sidearm. There are almost no videos about Lemat :(
Yes. Lemat.II w/ slugs
Thanks for this analysis! This helped me a lot to understand Caldwell. It's aesthetically my favorite shotgun but I find it hardest to use
Awesome guide! Caldwell became my go to main gun. with slugs -.-
Really enjoy your in depth analysis, as always my dude. Thank you for putting in the time. The Caldwell is my favorite shotty in Hunt, personally.
thank you for your effort, i was hoping a vid like this would appear. Will you also make fire/fmj/dragon rounds for other weapons? This is an endless pool of content righ now lol
really waiting on someone to post one of these kinda vids on the terminius.
The buckshot will be exactly the same as the Rival 78, but need to test how pennyshot works differently.
The fact that you can hold incredibly tight angles with shotguns at essentially any cover type, and from a little further way... makes them insane for compound fights.
I'd like to see them implement some different audio cues based on ammo type, one of the biggest perks of slugs is having people think you're ineffective past 10m. My first encounter with slugs was actually a ridiculous max range headshot, I was so sure I had the kill when I went down at 30 meters lol.
Great video! Please keep on going!
That's the plan!
Okay 4FS get out of my head
Me yesterday: wow this caldwell rival is really good, I can't wait to keep using it and learn about it
4fs today: caldwell rival guide
Great video man! It's funny because it wasn't even last night I started getting some kills with the Caldwell rival and using slugs. Gladi watched this, very informative!
Awesome review with so much detail. Would love to see this for the Spector and Romero
I snorted coke through my nose with axe guy on the fence lmao... been there done that...
On the terms of slugs checks and balances, you are 100% right.
The other day I was playing with a group of friends they were both down and I was the last one, I was using a Romero that I had stole from a hunter the match before that had slugs in it.
When I went to where my teammates were downed I saw a guy in a bush and thought "This will be an easy kill" So I hover my crosshairs over him and shoot, But I completely miss, He than notices me and starts shooting back but he also misses giving me time to reload, I shoot him again and miss in point blank range, At this point I'm getting pissed and want to know why my shot isn't hitting him. He than proceeds to take out a knife and rush me, I load another round into the Romero and proceed to miss again, and he kills me.
It was only after this when I am seriously pissed that none of those shots landed that I realized it was because I never bothered to switch back to my Buckshot before going to help them, Meaning instead of hipfiring lots of pellets I was hipfiring a slug that kept missing.
Now my friends believes that Special ammo is more of a detriment than a benefit, though I still know Special ammo can be very powerful if used correctly, For slugs you are giving up the comfort of knowing that in point blank range you can kill any hunter with a hipfire shot for using your shotgun as a rifle.
I really enjoy long ammmo weapon+ rival with flechette. It's really easy to land a follow-up shot after hitting people with long ammo. And in case of cqb, flechette rival in my opinion is more reliable than 2 long ammo weapons loadout for guys like me who cannot always place an accurate headshot or a quick 2-tap in close range.
THX for guía really, keep it Up, want too see all shotguns
Great video!
Just an FYI, but I tested the Crown and King's spread a few weeks ago and it seems that its spread is actually identical to the regular (long) Specter variant. I think there may have been unmentioned tweaks between now and your old shotgun spread analysis
Also, I hope you guys will do an analysis of the Terminus 1887 cause there seem to be a few weird things going on with that one. The spread on the full-length terminus is actually higher than the other medium barrel shotguns (Rival / Spectre Bayonet), but despite that Crytek still claims it has a slightly longer one hit kill range.
My thinking is that the Terminus 1887 is a 10 gaurge shotgun (it says so on the weapon model's barrel) whereas every other shotgun is a 12 gauge. Maybe Crytek actually reflected that in the stats by giving it a different damage profile
Thanks! This is one of my most recent favorite guns!
Thanks for the content :)
Im always losing my mind seeing people aim with the shotgun (without the use of slug) but regardless very good video xD
Edit: I think btw the biggest downside is that you need to aim with slug on the rival which makes it much better on a range of 10 meters but much worse in a range of 5 meters. That is the main reason why i think the best way to use it is the romero because you get only positive effects out of it. The spread of the romero is so tight that even if you hipfire with slug than you one hit kill still on close range and on range you get the same advantage like the other shotguns with slug.
This was the gun I got my first kills with. Found it in a shack and proceeded to one-tap each member of a duo. :)
Very informative, thanks.
Slugs are brutal, in real live above 25m but this will disturb the whole weapon balance in Hunt i think...
got two shot by flechette at 25m
firstshot 90 something dmg
5dmg 1 sec bleed(actually not 1 sec but as long as the instant second shot hit me)
secondshot 55 dmg...
that made me consider playing the good old double barrel uppercut again like back in the nasty melee meta :D
Amazing video. Thanks mate!
im not a shotgun fan, just personally doesn't fit my play style this was though extremely informative on how they work in this game and why when i have used them they've felt inconsistent. it doesn't clear up everything considering its mostly info on the Caldwell and i kind of already had the key ideas of why its one of the ones i get killed with the most. however i would like to commend that in a game filled with rates you play the shotgun like a man. my team literally pushed the second bounty with me having 1 small bar of health, my buddy having 2 small bars, and our other having 1 big after fighting 2 (good) trios on our first bounty, we had to sit there for almost the entire contract time because they all had shotguns. wouldnt peak, just sat and corner camped a team that didnt have a full players bar of health between the 3 of them with shotguns. we ended up killing them with 5 minutes left to extract it was by far the dumbest game i have ever played in hunt. and the last one alive had the audacity to talk shit. its a good example of why warzone players should stay away from hunt.
Great content as usual. As long as long ammo is king, i would like to see other stuff getting buffed, not nerfed. Having meta guns in this game takes away some of its best having fun components.
Cracking vid. Well done lads.
Glad you enjoyed it!
WE NEED MORE CONTENT!!!!!
I prefer using slugs as my primary choice of ammo since you get the added effect of grossing out whoever you are shooting at
Great review! What do you think about the terminus? I feel like its the least effective shotgun for its price but id like to know your opinion on it
Completely agree. It's a slower firing specter bayonet, without the bayonet or any good custom ammo choices. Levering just doesn't make if fast enough either.
@@4FSGaming thanks bruh
Slugs are super strong indeed. But I am not using them. Because for 2000+ hours I only used shotguns with hip-fire (with great success). So I am not going through the excessive learning curve to start using ADS with shotguns.
Rival with slugs is one of my favorite loadouts, it's incredibly fun to play.
Also, one of my favorite meme loadouts is rival with slugs + rival handcannon with slugs.
Have you done an analysis on the spread pattern of the Winfield Terminus? I'm curious to see how it compares to other shotguns
Thank you for this, it really helps
They even buffed the flechette, it can one-tap hunter now. Which is nice .
I've been on a hunt break but think its time to play more
Great video thanks
The funny thing about guides is that there is no guide on youtube with how to deal with shotguns and not make the game a staring contest.
If you want to counter shotguns, learn your utility.
I was able to kill a hive at ~50-35 meters away with 4 shots from a specter bayonet. The range on flechette is crazy.
I had been saying since slug's announcement that a single projectile that one shots up to 15 m that doesn't have the shitty Nitro sights is gonna be insane. Yet, everyone was still convinced that slugs were actually going to be underpowered because of the bad hipfire. Just... don't hipfire it. Well, at least someone agrees with me...
I'd say just give it a bit of an ammo reserve nerf like explosive ammo has, so that you can drain someone's slug ammo a bit better by keeping your distance. Maybe also knock the price up to $200 for slugs so that the Rival lands in the $300 range, putting it on the same tier as Mosins and such. Food for thought.
I killed 5 people solo with a romero 77 slug it's so powerful
I kinda disagree. While slugs definitely feel like an all around upgrade vs the buckshot, I still don't really change my playstyle against them, and most definitely don't try to make the enemy run out of ammo. Any nerfs to them I feel would be unwarranted. Kinda wish the headshot range was increased a bit though... Feels way too arcady having something of that mass, and velocity land on your head and do less damage than a pistol...
They're expensive enough, and the Rival will never be on the same tier as the Mosin.
Slugs are fun but they don't hold a candle to the nitro like everyone says.
The problem with price gating, is that it's only a barrier to players that are struggling and have low funds, not to good players with plenty of cash. And since the slugs are a quick scope wet dream, and most quick scopers tend to be better at the game, it would just make it more frustrating for bad players getting killed my slugs all the time, but not being able to afford them all time.
When quick swapping was the meta, the Mosin/Uppercut was the preferred load out. It's an expensive loadout, but anyone who was quickswapping was usually able to afford it.
You are my hero!
Great analysis!
I would really like to see what slugs does for the romero
I got 5 kills solo with the 77 slug it's op
Don't listen to that other guy. Slugs on the Romero aren't bad, but they do the least for it out of every other shotgun.
AFAIK all long barrel shotguns have the exact same stats with slugs. The only thing good about the Romero is that you can switch between ammo types, otherwise I would consider it the worst shotgun for slugs
I miss the classical music in the background... You should bring it back imo
Do a breakdown video on all slugs!
Now I haven't tested it, but the devs have put out information stating that all slugs for large slot weapons behave the same, while medium slot (and the Lemat) all perform the same as each other.
@@4FSGaming Hmm, I'm not sure I trust that info at face value, but I guess I'll have to go off of that for now. Thanks for the reply!
They should have a Caldwell Bayonet. With 2 cleaver like objects underneath each barrel and have the animation of the riposte. The legendary should be called Sabertooth.
Would love to see the spread of the terminus class
There is no downside to slugs, the ones you mention are negligible and never actually stop from getting killed/kills since uppercut is on par with any rifle anyways. I m really hoping for some improvement to this ammo type, because it's rare to see anything else played at all aside from spark/mosin/dolch , which is extremely disheartening when everything in this game is capable of sending players to the death screen which would encourage exploration of this magnificent arsenal or firearms, but like with any other game people's goal is not to have fun, but to chase meta, use best items possible and the games become stale and sluggish ^_^ . The real selling point for hunt to me is that no matter what they use i can kill them with anything and these weapons dont really make anyone indestructible
Thanks for the work done! Comprehensive analysis and great stuff!
Caldwell is my go to for the nights when my aim doesn't seem to want to work.
I wanted to ask about something with slugs that confuses me. My understanding of buckshot is that it does 1.3x to the chest and 1.5x to the head. However, if slugs followed these same rules and were an OHKO to the head at 25m, they should one hit to the body at over 21m, so how are slugs being treated differently than buckshot to cause this?
My only problem with rival slugs in particular is that they can feel incredibly oppressive to fight. If you are stuck in the same building or compound as someone, it sometimes feels as if you can’t peak anything which is never fun.
What kind of penetration would you say slugs have? Comparable to small or medium ammo?
Slugs the poor man's nitro ಡ ͜ ʖ ಡ
Considering the price I would call it the middle class man's nitro.
Where do you have the 15 meters chest kill range from ?
Acc to Patchnotes they onehit to torso up to ten meters.
Check the store damage, it does over 150 at 10 meters, so we know it's longer than that for sure, I checked the 15m number with the devs.
@@4FSGaming interesting, thanks for letting me know. I was basing of my info from their latest testserver notes before the release of the update. steamdb.info/patchnotes/6326672/
Nitro needs a buff. Can't compete with Rival at close range. Can't compete with Rifles at mid to long range. If it keeps that ridiculously unwieldy aperture sight, it should one tap at every body piece at its current one tap kill range. Otherwise just give the ability to flip it. Kinda Rival slug with double range. Thoughts?
The nitro is no doubt difficult to use. However when a player knows what they are doing has the ability to one tap from 43m, and even in the arms at 20m...well it can be very intimidating.
@@4FSGaming That is somewhat the point. It isn't really intimidating anymore. It was for quite a while in the early days. It's just an loud, pretty useless piece of metal at the moment. Think what bugs me most no reliable kill at 43m, well, because of arms in the way. Also damage drop off is ridiculously bad, too after that. Also needs more than 3 bullets per boss. So it's just good for the memes. Nothing else imho
You say Slug Ammo's weakness is its potential to be outplayed, but it can be said about any weapon / ammo type, is a weak argument imo. I think its weakness is the same as its strength - no spread. It's weaker at shorter distances since you have to aim. You lose mobility and maneuverability , can't run/jump move around and shoot as easily, can't use hipfire, which is quite good for aiming at targets moving quickly at short distances. Slug requires more skill to hit and rewards it, but if you're like me and can't hit shit, holding angles with buckshot hipfire can be more reliable even though sometimes less rewarding.
Also I am not sure how strong Rival's aimpunch is, but I think even hitting just few pellets is better than missing slug and not doing anything. So I think slugs are riskier, if you get what I mean.
Overall Slugs are better at 7+ meters, but if I plan to fight at shorter distances I prefer buckshot.
Since 1.5.2, how often have you experienced 1-shot kills from Flechette-loaded shotguns? My Specters have been treating me well, personally.
Please make a Video with every Shotgun !!!!
Do you have any idea or data about the quick swap speeds between full barrel shotgun vs its handcannon counterpart? I always wonder about that but couldn't find any info anywhere. It's important especially using flechette rounds for follow up finishers. Maybe you would know since you like to go in detail with these kinds of things :D Great video by the way, cheers
Good idea, certainly worth looking into!
Looking forward to getting your update on caldwell rival after 1.5.2. What do they mean exactly with the short and medium barrel improvements to reliability?
Super informative video, super appreciated. Do romero and specter actually have the same spread?
Romero shotguns have a tighter spread than the rest of their general archetypes
You wanna go full send? Rival 78 with slugs, rival hand cannon with slugs. 💦
Tried that is too crazy
Is the slug headshot range longer on the Romero vs any other shotgun? It feels like this is the case anecdotally.
How does a Caldwell Rival or Romero hand cannon compare to the LeMat as a sidearm assuming slugs in every case?
Nice vid mate. Thx and keep going.
Greetings :)
I have a question. When comparing damage multipliers 2:20, what if you shoot them in the back? Does the torso and upper torso apply to the back of hunters as well?
Yeah, the back still has upper and lower torso values
Slugs on the rival turn it into a micro nitro, they're awesome
love your vids
I like the design of the caldwell rival but not the spread. It feels "inconsistent" to me and I've found romero and specter more reliable and less random. But I will say the caldwell rival with slugs has been brutal lately.
Anyone else feel like slugs are kind of a problem? I've seen so many Slug-rivals on my death screens lately, to the exclusion of almost anything else (barring the occasional frag or dolch or winnie headshot), it makes it really hard to swallow the idea that they're somehow balanced in spite of how people openly admit that they won't play any other ammo on the rival.
To clarify, I don't think slugs are a problem on the romero or specter in the same way as the rival, specifically because the rival has so much more RoF. It really sucks to be defending a compound and having almost nowhere you can go that's outside of the potential one-shot range, even with cover. And even outside of the one-shot range, it just feels like the old quickswap days just like 4FS said, and that was removed as an *exploit*... I dunno, I feel like rival-slugs are just the best option at too many ranges, and the number of people comfortably comparing it to a 'mini nitro' is kind of disgusting for how easy it is to place shots with the rival in comparison.
I don't see them as a problem in the same way the nitro or avtomat are not a problem, they are still less competitive than a winfield with HV rounds or any long ammo bolt action
With the exception of special ammo types is this still accurate?
Has anyone found a legitimate purpose for starshell ammo yet?
It's pretty much a flare gun, so if you're full on equipment and want flares I guess you can gimp your gun... Also maybe for red barrel camping so you can one shot them. Overall pretty bad
RESEARCH HYPE
SPREADSHEET HYPE
4FS HYPE
I hope they fix slugs on the rival a little bit quicker than they fixed quick-swapping :/
My question is, does the bloodless trait reduce the impact damage taken by flechette? I love bringing flechette but my issue with it is sometimes I will get two back to back hits that are perfect, and hunters will just shrug it off and keep fighting me. Sometimes this has happened within 10 meters. Other times I have two shot hunters at 20 meters with flechettes, again in quick succession.
Bloodless doesn't reduce the damage, just caps bleed intensity at tier 1.
The spectres definitly better with slugs. You just need to make sure you 1 shot. But you gave 5 shots without needing to reload. The rival is just more forgiving and noob friendly.
I’d be interested to know what the minimum amount of flechette needs to hit to apply Atleast light bleeding.
My understanding is that any hitmarker will cause light bleed. Now I can't verify this for certain because I can't guarantee that only one projectile hit a target in any tests, but at long range with most projectiles missing, it still causes light bleed every time I tried.
What about penny shot?
Does anyone else from 4fs make videos? I have only ever seen ones by ascendance
Slug gamers gang
There's another reason point blank shotguns don't kill. Lag.
Yeah I don't touch shotguns when playing with mates on US or EU servers