yeah it makes sense, when you're an actor you have to emerse yourself into the character and truly understand them to play as them, and it's easy to form bonds with fictional characters just like humans do. it's way different then show runners or whoever else that just cares about making money.💔
@sonic_the_freakyhog Yeah, but as a writer, the entire thing is your baby lol. They lost their motivation to care because the money was guaranteed, regardless of their effort.
Remember when the screen writers went on strike and DEMANDED that studios could NOT use AI to write scripts...? Yeah, they never said *they* couldn't use it, just not the studios. They want to be paid for promoting AI to write something, which makes them merely the middleman. And wow does it show.
I know right, why the hell was he coming out to EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE TOWN (I'm not exaggerating trust) It felt like an insult towards the queer community
@coltonskog3932 wrong, Season 4 had established that Brenner adopted Henry after he killed his family, Brenner knew about him having psychic Powers because Mrs. Creel told him. The whole thing about Henry going to High School with Joyce, Hopper, the Wheelers and Bob was fanfiction from the play that the Duffers tried to integrate into the real Netflix show last minute.
"it happened off screen" "leave to watcher's interpretations" Watch out for series where the writters come up with excuses like these, it's a sure sign the series will be bad.
I noticed that the internet would rather believe the most unlikeliest scenarios rather than the most obvious reason.😅 No the Duffers weren't playing 4D chess with us, they just lost interest and left their homework up to the last minute.
@dysmissme7343 And all the most interesting stuff happens off, too. The end of S4 sets up real stakes, the upside down in Hawkins. A really dark desperate stakes-raising guerilla-survival season would have been a dramatic move. Instead, we get "we put some metal band aids over the holes, now we’re all back to normal, so we can have endless committee meetings where the entire cast argues." 🤮
Gotta love how they zoom in on the chainsaw like it's gonna be used against the demagorgon and then Steve proceeds to cut a floor with it and never uses it for anything else. And they still showed him in the poster holding it.
My biggest problems with S5: -No one dies. I thought S5 could've still been good even without any deaths, but the amount of fakeouts and playing it safe was annoying. No one in the main party even suffered an injury in the final battle. If Karen and/or Ted died early in the season it would've set a much more dark and serious tone to let us know it was time for the heroes to stop screwing around. -After S4, the Duffers said S5 would pick up more or less right where S4 left off and would scale the show back down to something more intimate, with the main focus on the original S1 cast. Instead we got a disproportionate amount of time with Holly, while some S1 characters were almost completely sidelined. -The Mike/Eleven relationship, something that was historically the emotional heartbeat of the show, was pretty much nonexistent. -Dr. Owens, someone who had the ability to shield the party from government consequences, was nowhere to be found, or even mentioned. The most we can surmise is that he was killed based on what Hopper said to Akers during the interrogation? -The military quarantine was completely unbelievable as we don't even get a hint of frustration among the townspeople for being held there for 18 months. -After the amazing twist that concludes episode 4, Will barely does anything with his superpowers in the back half of the season. -For that matter, Henry/Vecna barely does anything with HIS powers in S5. He just didn't feel like a scary villain the way he did in S4. There's a lot more, but man, what a missed opportunity this last season was. The ending, purely on the surface, felt emotionally satisfying upon watching it for the first time, but as I had time to sit with it and let it digest, my opinion on it soured considerably.
Exactly. The first time watching was pretty emotional because the show was ending but upon the re-watch from s1 completely changed my thoughts on s5 and the whole show. Everything was destroyed by the end of the show. And what they did with Mike and eleven's relationship I'll never forgive the duffers.
Yeah good points. Also the people's lack of reaction to the lockdown is even more silly when you just remember a few years back when people absolutely lost their shit due to covid restrictions. We have a real life example of a lockdown and people's reaction to it just a few years back!!!! And covid restrictions where not enforced through the military
I’m also not sure why they took so much time bothering to give Karen a hero arc, with her wine bottle which actually damages demogorgons (who as we know from the Russian chapter aren’t damaged by literal machine gun fire). Then, head scratcher, they bring the mind flayer down with… machine gun fire? Maybe they should have given Nancy a broken wine bottle to fight the mind flayer… that’s how inconsistent their writing is, that a statement that ridiculous is logically correct. I thought for sure they were going to do the right thing and have Nancy die heroically, but then, no, plot armor.
Realistically, using the rules set by the prior seasons, the mindflayer should have been unbeatable. It’s an ancient eldritch entity so old it doesnt even know its own origin. It should be completely ambivalent to the kids, and killing them would be like swatting a fly. The mindflayer should never have had a “real form” and if it did it should not have been a fucking kaiju. Instead I prefer the idea that Henry was the mind flayer as implied in s4. Maybe time worked differently in the abyss and the years that passed in Hawkins during Henry’s banishment translated to decades, maybe even centuries in the abyss. Regardless, the mindflayer should have overwhelming psychic abilities that dwarfed Eleven’s and Henry’s since their powers are implied to originate from the mindflayer. The wrote themselves into a corner and frankly season 4 could have been the ending. S4 actually tied up a lot of loose ends.
Following the D&D logic, they made the mistake of "giving Cthulhu stats". Truth is, at some point they seemed to want to turn Stranger Things into a Cosmic Horror story (I mean, that first shot of the mindflayer among the red clouds in S2 is legit good and sold that idea), but forgot or ignored that by definition, happy endings aren't compatible with that type of story. By the end of the series run, it was less about telling a story than producing content.
Agreed. The only way to "defeat" it needed to be cutting off its connection to our dimension. Season 3 should have shown it who it's enemies were and that it needed a bigger foothold in our dimension leading to dispatching Vecna to rip more openings between the dimensions. From the moment those openings were created there would have been armies of demo-whatevers ready to come through and capture people for mass level hive-minding giving the mind flayer the foothold it needed to "consume" life on Earth. Instead we got an antagonist that didn't really do much and never really seemed prepared for their own "next step".
@JuanProano-uh9sp You said exactly what I was thinking, it seemed to be about cosmic horror and the pattern is really that there are no happy endings, unfortunately the script was very cowardly, the series started out being for adults involving children and ended up being for children involving adults.
@Nlzinhaedit I'm not going to jump into the "I only liked the first season" bandwagon, because to be fair, I did enjoyed seasons 2 to 4 a lot. But in hindsight, introducing a villain like Vecna destroys any semblance of the story being about Cosmic Horror, and it kinda proves that indeed the Duffer's knowledge about D&D was superficial. Vecna is the quintessential Big Bad Guy in the game: The god of lies and secrets and unquestionably evil. That kind of character doesn't mesh in a Cosmic Horror setting, were the antagonist's (in this case, the mind flayer, that is clearly D&D's version of a Lovecraftian horror) purpose is beyond human comprehension. And hell, you could have a bittersweet ending, with the surviving characters having a rather nice epilogue, but acknowledging that even if the mind flayer is somehow defeated by locking it away from our world, they only bought time.
A lot of movies/shows make references to “the abyss”. It’s a spiritual concept as much as a physical one. The angel of the abyss is Abadan, the destroyer. It’s where the fallen angels are chained in darkness.
Well. I took this from this comment section: @TheVideoViper: "Mike was wrong. Wills powers do not come from within, they come from his link to vecna. This makes vecna wills "patron" and makes will a WARLOCK, not a sorcerer". @CMVray: "Absolutely correct, moreover, there were no sorcerers and warlocks in DnD editions back then. It is an anachronism either way."
I really hate how the Duffer Brothers took inspiration from DND lore without knowing DND lore. Especially Vecna. Vecna in DND is damn near a god, a legitimate threat who's eye or finger ALONE could be the sole focus of an entire campaign because it's so powerful. He's one of the biggest BBEGs in all of dnd lore, next to Xanathar, Tiamat, and Strahd. But Vecna in stranger things? A fraud. A loser of a villain. You can even see it in Dead by Daylight. ST Vecna's just like any other killer: there because the Entity said so. But DND Vecna? That is the ONLY killer in the game who was EXPLICITELY STATED to have a special mark to NERF the killer, because the Entity knows DND Vecna could easily take over the trials without a sweat. And even with nothing but basic cantrips, DND Vecna is STILL a threat. How could the Duffer Brothers take a character with so much power, so much fear attached to his name, and completely ruin his reputation by giving the name to a boring, poorly written character?
They couldn’t decide if they want Mind Flayer or Vecna to be the main villain. Personally, I think everything would’ve been fine if he had just stayed the Mind Flayer’s “five star general”. It was simple, interesting, and didn’t take anything away from either character. Then that crap season 4 finale twist happened, and it was all downhill from there
@Arander92 That play really messed up Season 5. They had to account for all the retcons the play did. Once again business decisions superseded the creative decisions. It was completely unnecessary, an unforced error.
@One.Zero.One101 I’m personally happy the play exists, because Vecna being the main villain behind everything was a retcon in and of itself, and kind of ruined the upside down for me, so I’m glad that got overwritten. Mind Flayer is a much more interesting Big Bad, imo. What I’m NOT happy about, is how wishy washy the Duffers were in establishing that this season. It baffles me that they waited till the last episode to confirm what the play ALREADY ESTABLISHED, rather than just inform the audience early in the season that the Mind Flayer has been controlling Vecna this whole time. It would saved a lot of screen time from that ridiculous and Holly in the cave stuff. I got the distinct feeling that, while the Duffers were reestablishing the Mind Flayer, they were doing it resentfully. It felt like they really believed in Vecna (even though he sucks imo), thought he was the coolest villain ever, and were trying to have their cake and eat it too. None of this would have happened if that season 4 Vecna retcon had never happened. That’s the source of a LOT of these problems
Gotta love that they sidelined Will's character, his arc, his sexuality, and his relationship with Mike, just for Mileven to have such a horridly unsatisfactory conclusion. So much so that the fans were even more upset that Mike ended up sad and lonely regardless. Talk about not having your cake nor eating it.
@user-uw1do5yr4n in what world would it be a good show to make someone who has been unwaveringly devoted to his girlfriend get with someone he never showed romantic interest in at the last minute? It took 3 seasons, 2 years in universe, to explore Will's sexuality and Mike would suddenly come out and betray his gf right before the final battle? It would be absolutely unearned and would make the writers even more of a laughing stock they already are
@timetoobsess8860 Mike and eleven relationship is awful to say the least one of the worst love stories I've ever seen in media, if they wanted Mike and eleven to be a good couple then they should've written it better. "Devoted" where? He never said I love you to her not even in death lmao and Will had to encourage him to say it in season 4. What was the point of all of that? The reason? They never gave it to us. Making Mike gay and giving him a case of internalised homophobia (mind you they wrote Mike that way, they gave Mike and Eleven conflicts over conflicts and separated them EVERY SEASON except season one, where will was not present) would've given an explanation for all of that, meaning good writing. I'm sorry but you're just an awful judge of writing
9:26 "because it's just really a show made to profit off of outcasts while upholding conformity" banger line and perfectly sums up how I feel about the show now. a shame
Baffles me how people say this isn’t in the same tier as Game of thrones’s ending… This is damn near just as bad we literally got 5x more questions than answers and atleast a hundred plot holes
GOT was worse, but I get it is personal judgement of each viewer GOT: redeemed Jaimie and gave him an arch just for him to do 180° on at least two key things: Cercei is still his No1 and he will die with her no matter how wrong she is, and you see he didn't really care about regular people, let them burn 🤦♀️ ST: Steve and Dustin have some issues, being d*cks to each other, but Steve sticks around, doesn't reverse to his season 1 persona and they have one of the best scenes in the season together. GOT: fighting the Night King, where you could see nothing through the whole episode. Tactic was as if it was written by the enemy you are trying to defeat. (NK: how about you guys put your army in front of the battlements, send your whole cavalry into the midst of my minions to be dealt with in two minutes, the rest will struggle to get to the safety of the castle because you keep such a small retreat area, so many will die. Oh, and don't forget to put your most vulnerable people in the crypt, so I can finish them by resurrecting the dead already there.) ST: no minions, teleporting to the top of the canyon, poking blisters on the underbelly of Mind Flayer. 🤦♀️ Will is not affected by MF's pain and not really any meaningful help. Kids safe through the battle also not affected being inside something on fire GOT: Arya kills NK, not Cercei ST: Joyce gives the last blow...at least she's justified. In GOT fashion it would be Erica or Mr Clark GOT: although Daenerys is often cruel to her enemies she doesn't have enough space to grow evil like her father, it happens too rapidly. One episode she tells Varys to let her know if she's straying from the path and a few later she burns him, then burns Kings Landing ST: imagine if Eleven and Kali took control over the upside down and ruled their dominion in place of Henry and MF. And Mike would have to knife her in the end. GOT: John being in fact Targaryen was only revealed to make him and us cringe at him having sex with his own aunt. Three Eyed Raven used only as bait during the battle, scouting through birds is on the same level with Will not being used in the final battle, although Will had two badass scenes before, Bran didn't. GOT: the smartest men got really dumb ST: constant repetition: apparently the audience is dumb Theon and Kali die without meaning or redemption. A lot of parallels, but GOT had a lot of assassinations of the characters and dropped a lot of things being hinted or built up for seasons without resolution. ST still has likeable characters that make this season re-watchable. I guess the biggest betrayal was to start it not just after the events of season 4. Such a cliffhanger ruined. I think ST 5 is comparable to GOT season 7. Despite its cringe and bad writing GOT s8 is still the biggest betrayal.
@JR-sx3gl: "ST: constant repetition: apparently the audience is dumb" - nah, the audience is doomscrolling through tiktoks while the show is being playing in the background. This is the way!
For a show about outcasts and people who don't fit into normal societal standards, for the time period the series is set in, the bros really fumbled the bag on it's characters. Will, a sensitive little boy, who's been kidnapped, bullied, abused, came back, got possessed and has been established as gay since season 1, then given powers, only to be reduced to a side character, who needs to come out, because he's afraid. Jane/El, also a kidnapped, abused, imprisoned, experimented on since birth, treated as nothing more than a lab rat, given a safe place to stay, fell in love, was adopted, given a father figure, got to know girlhood, friendship, love, sisterhood, only to then be reduced to this superhero, magic of childhood archetype, because, if you're abused, well bye. Lucas, a black boy, who's called Midnight, constantly sidelined, bullied by Billy, had to watch his girlfriend die in front of him. Erica, his sister who was a stereotype of a loud sassy black girl, who according to the bros, is independent enough and fearless so she can take care of herself, not even given the decency of an epilogue. Johnathan, A sensitive older teen, who has to carry the guilt of his little brother being missing and also dealing with the fact, he may be dead, by the age of 16, has an abusive father who's a POS, only to be reduced to a love triangle and being a sidelined happy flower addict. Dustin, a boy who's different due to his disability and is also bullied for it, has to deal with rejection from girls, never seems to get there until Susy comes around, while his dynamic with Steve is great, he also lost his other best friend, who loved and accepted him for who he is, also had to deal with his death and the horiffic beating he received due to it. Robin, a girl who apart from being a lesbian is also possibly on the spectrum, going from this sarcastic, intelligent and very smart girl, to this bumbling idiot, who just cracks jokes. Eddie, a metal head, who has issues with powdered substances, gets unfairly accused of a murder, hunted down and then sacrifices himself for a town, that hated him. Mike, while him and Nancy are from a rich family, he really struggles with bullying and the loss of his best friend, has these amazing leadership qualities, lovingly takes El in, gives her a place to stay and risks his life to protect her, only to then be turned into an insufferable brat since season 3 and then completely butchered as a character, by his lack of depth and any meaningful reactions. Nancy, a rich girl, who has to deal with the loss of her best friend, carrying the guilt of that with her, shows excellent marksman skills, gets close with Johnathan, has a great reporter nose and then being turned into this curly haired Rambo, possibly struggling with alcohol issues and is trapped into this love triangle, passed around as this ultimate prize, not to mention, her dealing with Vecna's possession and completely breaking apart only when she's alone. Only to end up with that ridiculous haircut. Max, a troubled teen, who has to deal with her parent's divorce, has an aggressive and outright bully step brother, who's an ass to her, Mike then treats her like crap, El ignores her and even pushes her off a skateboard and she eventually opens up to Lucas, becomes besties with El, only to then lose her step brother to the Meat Flayer and in season 4, she has to deal with the loss and getting Vecna'd, then dying in her boyfriend's arms, getting revived by her best friend, gets stuck in a coma, only for their reunion to be the most lackluster thingy ever and she was reduced to nothing more than a plot device for Holly, only to then deal with the loss of her best friend. And finally Kali, an Indian girl, who at the age of 5 was kidnapped by Brenner, experimented on, given powers, was raised together with El, managed to escape, found a family on the streets of Chicago, finally was enjoying her freedom and then she meets El, her sister whom she immediately takes in, while her intentions were wrong, she did gave her a place to stay and taught her how to manage her powers better, she even shows her how to be free from the influence of others, despite El later realizing, that she needs to go back to Hawkins. And well the character in herself is universally the most hated/disliked, in some aspects I can understand why, but then as you mentioned, they have this character who's a POC, is hated by almost the entire fandom, you bring her back, use her as a plot device to serve El's ending and have her butt heads with Hopper, so that he can give her side eyes, because she wants the abuse to end, kill off her friends, have her taken to the UD by Kay, she is then used as a blood bank, treated like a lab rat, so that the military can get more super powered children, but since her blood isn't working, they need El. After they finally reunite you completely butcher any little character you gave her in season 2, just so that she can dump all this info onto El and basically tell her to off herself, because "they will kill Mike and its the only way", you don't even bother to have proper use for her powers, only giving her like two moments and completely waste her as a character, who like El is treated as nothing more than a concept, not to mention her being a POC, you really sent in a pretty telling message by Hopper leaving her there in the lab (while I understand he was focused on El's safety), it was really shitty writting imo. She was given no depth, no personality, no meaningful interactions, outside of El and Hopper. Her in my opinion being the biggest outcast on the show, brown, emo/goth look, purple hair, illusion based powers, only to then be turned into this suicidal plot device who's story was always going to end in death, bruh, get outta here.
THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS ABOUT KALI BECAUSE I WAS GENUINELY so upset with what they did with her same thing with the direction of all of the characters and how under utilized they all unfortunately were
I cant help but feel like the Duffers were doing the bullying in highschool. I dont feel like they really know what its like to be marginilized, rejected, bullied, or tokenized. So many missed opportunities and so much wasted potential. Thanks for taking the time to trace these character paths.
@vintageleeknowsWord, Kali deserved so much more, if the writing was smart, they could have great moments together, forming a plan, strategy to take down Vecna and the MF, without the need for that Kamikaze stuff, like we never even see Johnathan or El reacting to Will having powers, just...
They still could have saved it if they instead focused on the creeping evil of those rifts instead of Holly etc Like, the town is under quarantine, people aren't *happy* about it, per se, but are determined to Listen To The Authorities and rock along. But underneath, we could see that the military is DESPERATELY trying to stem the flood of the Upside Down from takimg over our world, that dozens, then hundreds of people & even wildlife are either missing or mutated etc, that sort of thing. Show the military cracking down HARD in response, make them almost completely unsympathetic (thus the *reason* for our central characters to go around & against them) only to have at a crucial moment realize that our world is FVCKED and all they have managed to do is buy VERY little time for a hail Mary, Do Something by 11 or what have you. A creeping evil, slowly being surrounded and taken over is 1000x scarier than a Kiju stomping slllloooowwwllllyyyy after people.
Netflix absolutely put together the doc when they realized the doofus bros f--ked themselves over and released it to cover their asses so all the blame is on the bros. Which is very warranted. You can only attribute so much bs to the 2nd screen policy. They had all the time and money to knock it tf out of the park and instead they just shit their pants and went tadaaaaaaaaaa! *Jazz hands*
I originally thought about re-watching seasons 1-4 in time to start watching season 5, but I ultimately didn't find the time. This was probably a good thing in the end as I'm sure I would have been even more disappointed in season 5 if I had the previous seasons so fresh in my memory.
I had never seen ST so my friends and I binge watched it on time for the release of volume 2, I liked the first 3 seasons but S4 and S5 were really bad, and by the end of S5 I could not stand Hopper for my he is the worst character in the show.
the Duffs sure have a long eloquent way of basically saying "we didn't really care about giving this show a satisfying ending, we just wanted it to be over asap and move on"
I will say at least in ST most of the characters got an okay ending. The UA ending is like Eleven offing herself x7 - the most disappointing and weird ass season ever
Tbh I still feel TUA season 4 is worse that ST season 5. I was tired of that “apocalypse” shit for the 4th time. Season 5 of ST was atleast watchable to an extent. The only good part of TUA season 4 was the baby shark segment and the fight in that snow town.
I have a new policy when watching a TV series. If the next season doesn't come out the following year. I'm out. Spending a decade following a show just to be disappointed in the end is too much. I'll spend my finite time elsewhere.
While season 5 was horrible, there is one critique that's not quite right. The mind flayer being in a "desert" doesn't mean it's hot. Mars is one giant desert with an average temperature of about -81° F.
True, but if we're going with cinematography/visual storyrelling, the orange colour palatte evokes more of a hot desert than a cold one and there's nothing else to establish what kind of temperature the place is. None of the characters act affected, so all we have to go on so far as temperature is the visuals, which indicate a warm environment. If they wanted to communicate a cold desert without using the characters' reactions, they should've used a more blue-toned colour palette.
Just put them in an ice planet if they wanted to portray cold. Film is visual story-telling. There shouldn't be any need for head-canon explanations. A good director would be able to communicate with visuals. The most likely scenario is they just forgot what they wrote, the Duffers don't need you to come up with head-canon for them.😅
the scene of max getting her limbs completely broken and then the next scene completely normal with no explanation was like something out of Tom and Jerry or Loony Tunes. If El can heal to that extent she’s basically Stranger Things Jesus who didn’t need help from anyone.
Or what about when Steve, Dustin, Nancy and Jonathan crashed so hard in the Upside Down in Steve’s beamer but walking away without any scratches or injuries
Mike was wrong. Wills powers do not come from within, they come from his link to vecna. This makes vecna wills "patron" and makes will a WARLOCK, not a sorcerer
@ticiale20 to be honest it is not the only thing they turned into a sad joke. The entire season is a joke, and they did not get anything right (well maybe a couple of things out of a few hundred). But i have to say that for me as a D&D DM, things about dnd were exceptionally cringe worthy
The way I thought you would spend a minute or two naming all the lost plots and production errors but it ended up being the entire video says so much. Like we need a whole 10 hours just to unpack just how lost the plot got let alone find it.
I had just started watching the series for the first time last month (I never got into the hype when it was first released, and didn’t see the recent hype for the last season). I didn’t realize there were only 5 seasons. When I finished the last episode, I went to look for “next episode” button, but was so confused when I didn’t see it. I had my own version of conformity gate over here 😭😭 I did NOT want to believe that was it, after such an epic first season! I didn’t even get to cry the way I wanted to at the end of the series!! 😭😭
Also, why, when the whole gang was on top of the radio tower, did the colliding world just... stop? It reached the radio tower only to stop and let them climb up, then fart about for however long they were up in the mind flayer's domain. It pisses me off no end!
Eleven broke the children out of the trance when she tossed Vecna across the dining room, which stopped the merge. With that said, how did the Mind Flayer get revived when Henry was still chasing the kids around trying to get them back into a trance?
I mean, this is just a failure on your part and your own media literacy. They established that Vecna through the kids he abducted was making the worlds collide, and at that moment, Eleven interrupted him.
Man you brought up just about all the criticisms i have been saying since the end, it is crazy how hardly anyone else noticed or at least mentioned much if any of this stuff, so glad to hear it be laid out like you did here, great job. But yeah it is such a shame how they literally ruined the entire story/series with the almost infinite amount of bad decisions in the end. It just doesn't make sense, we need to learn what actually happened, i don't believe it could be a total accident, i think it was either sabotaged or maybe just maybe they didn't have enough time
There is a reason why no so many people turned down the duffer brothers before netflix picked it up. They all knew the brothers had no idea whats going on.
15:45 yes, it was certainly not serious writing. It was also certainly not passionate nor careful writing. It was merely "let's get this over with" writing.
21:20 The Duffers had no D&D knowledge and didn’t have the decency to study? “Yeah I’ll direct a Star Wars movie. I have it all planned out. What’s a Jedi again?”
I was dumbfounded the moment the duffer's called Will a Sorcerer instead of a Warlock. Any dnd player would have called him a warlock because sorcerers are innate magic users who cast spells, and warlocks are endowed with power from an other worldly being
Oh no, you can tell they definitely used chatgpt for the script. I've noticed the general theme for ai written things is the same for images. Like things not connecting in ways that makes sense, plots that end in ways that answer nothing but raise more questions, new plots coming from completely nowhere and inserted at points that just don't fit like Will's coming out party for example. It makes so much sense looking back at season 5
17:43 i mean, they already forgot the plot of season 4 since the play already contradicts multiple things that were clearly stated or implied in season 4..
@RNeditz-u3ino I agree there were great moments but overall it really was never THAT good but if they would have made this season amazing, which they could have, the problems with the other seasons could have been solved
Way back when, several years ago, when the second season was freshly out, I read a comment stating it would've been better if they'd left Eleven's fate unclear after season 1 and made the second season take place somewhere else, with new characters. That it'd have been better to make several seasons and each season be an independent mystery story, maybe with an occasional crossing of paths, or a few mentions or cameos. I've come to agree with that person.
that's what the duffers wanted tbh but because people were so hype about 11 and the boys, the studio wanted them to continue in a linear fashion. it was supposed to be an anthology series.
Why would the Duffers fix their mouths to say El's goodbye to Mike in the void didn't happened, but give zero indication ON SCREEN that it was Mike hallucinating? What is ON THE SCREEN is what happened in the story. That's it. That's all. I guess they can say next month, the entire show was Mike Wheeler's story he wrote while locked up in a mental institution after Will died. Are the Duffers mentally well? Becuase they seem bent on spitting on their story and some of these characters.
That sequence not a hallucination, they said she would not be able to communicate with them after she vanished in the epilogue. Its still a pretty ridiculous thing to say though and they even seem to have realized this themselves because they backtracked and said we could imagine they reunite…
They never said it was a hallucination, this person has poor reading comprehension or just repeates bylers misinterpretations trying to invalidate that scene and pretend El never said she feels seen by Mike. What the DB actually said: "The only thing I'll debunk is that Eleven does not communicate with Mike in any way. But what you just said at the end - yes, at graduation, he's hearing the speakers distort because the principal is so angry, and it makes him realize that there was the kryptonite. So how could she have possibly made it all the way to the gate? Not only that. How could she have possibly used her powers to bring him into the void?" They're saying she didn't communicate with him *in the epilogue*. But the bridge scene? She couldn't have made it to the gate but she was there, wasn't she? The same thing works for the void. It only could have happened if it was a Kali's illusion. Which means Mike's theory has a point. I can't believe people would believe for a second Mike suddenly got schizophrenic in the middle of running to El lol
Tysm for being respectful about the whole Mike and Will thing not a lot of people who make videos like these treat Will’s identity and his love for mike appropriately
The way El kills herself is just so upsetting. I’m all about characters dying, and if El died in a reasonable way I wouldn’t be opposed to it. But having her kill herself after fighting against the government for years was just horrible and genuinely made me angry. And then, while she’s standing there, nobody does anything. At the very least they should’ve killed Hopper as well. Hell maybe Hopper runs and throws El out of the way of the wormhole just in time and he dies. The whole show has been about Hopper fighting the grief he feels about letting his daughter die and not being able to protect her, and when he actually CAN protect his new daughter he just stands there.
if i had a nickel for every time a critically acclaimed netflix series decided that the best way for its most beloved and iconic character to end their "cycle of abuse" arc was killing herself, i'd have two nickels, but it's really weird that it happened twice
i’d also give a special mention to TUA for offing EVERYONE just for the apocalypse cycle to end after that being the WHOLE point of the show. to STOP it and LIVE. THEIR. LIVES.😭😭
21:51 genuinely the biggest reason why im still so mad. They lied about SO MUCH, and why?? Why lie about what we’re going to see and buildup anticipation to never see it through? Why would you purposefully do something to make your fandom angry with you??
Yea its crazy, if they never would have said anything and Netflix doesnt release the documentary it would have been a better show. Not a lot better, but still.
honestly, I tried to watch this show so many times, and hearing all of this for the first time makes me devastated to find out that the ending is atrocious. it had such potential, and they destroyed it in one fell swoop. I'm glad I never watched it, I'm sorry the rest of you had to endure such a shit ending.
i thought they were gonna do a bait and switch, like they act like she is gonna die and then she survives also calling Vickie and Robin "just a highschool romance that wouldn't last" makes no sense because there are ROMANCES that have lasted since MIDDLE SCHOOL in this show, you're telling me El and Mike can stay together from 5-6th grade but Vickie and Robin can't? okay Duffers, Okay.
I think divorce gate has a lot of truth to it but I also believe that alongside the Duffus brothers incompetence and lack of enthusiasm to write when in comparison to directing, Netflix might've also been part of cutting stuff out and making them dumb down their show just like they did with many other Netflix originals
Dude, I really liked this show. I was in fourth grade when it started and I'm in f*cking college now. I grew with this show. Season five is such a disappointment. I didn't have high expectations for season five. I knew it couldn't live up to the hype. But this is just embarrassing. It honestly makes me sad
as i was watching episode 7 prior to 8 coming out; watching them not doing anything abyss related, and then seeing it end as they were preparing to go through the gate, i knew the story was going to be bad. There's no way you wrap something like the end of the world in 1 episode, even if that episode is 2 hours long, when the other seasons had multiple episodes to resolve the final conflict.
I’m 12 minutes in so far & I gotta say, this video has done the best at describing how absolutely abysmal this season was with points I haven’t even realized yet lol. The Duffs really are encouraging offing yourself when hard times come in your life… yikes
The Duffers made a queer character WHO IS A CHILD get bullied, abused by his own father, kidnapped by an interdimensional monster, hurt, sexually assaulted, possessed, tortured, burned alive, haunted, used, treated as “weak,” treated as a “crybaby,” felt left out on his own birthday, struggled with his sexuality, felt like a monster, and basically sidelined throughout the show JUST SO HE COULD BE USED AS A PLOT DEVICE TO HELP/PUSH MILEVEN FORWARD.
Yea, something about that feels homophobic. 😬 Feels like the "kill your gays" trope but instead of killing him (Will), they just put him through hell for the sake of it.
@eli10589 It most definitley WAS homophobic. both of the queer ships gone (rip byler and rockie) and Will got a stupid epilogue boyfriend that isn't even real, and apart of mikes fantasy. and even if it WAS real whats with the bar?? will canonically hates smoking and drinking dude.. and it was SO styreotypical of a queer character being at a bar. He should've been alone at art school fulfilling his passion.. also an extra thing BOTH couples that had an insane amount of parallels to byler both ended up not endgame? (rockie and jancy)
I think the biggest problem of the show (not only season 5, I noticed it in season 4 and rethinking it since season 3) is that they want to please everyone. The show doesn't take risk anymore. It works with memes. Season 2 wasn't perfect but it try to take some risk. It try to reinvent itself (it failed I think, the show should have been an anthologie). Season 3 just became lazy, same with season 4 and 5.
this video was surprisingly reallly good! i was expecting a general-audience based biased view of the show but this was made really well. it was clear that you genuinely cared about how the show was supposed to be for marginalized groups and did not blame fans for disliking it. i love how you brought up the injustice with many character arcs, it shows how much you actually pay attention to the show and who the main characters are. i also loved the bits where you covered all the inconsistencies and how fans believed in the cut scenes and conformitygate without shaming them! great job.
But like, why did Eleven have to leave? 🤨 she was just fine when Dr. Owens was covering for her... and the Military showed no real special interest in replicating that failed experiment. One rogue general wanted to kill Eleven off because he mistakenly assumed she was the cause of all the death in Hawkins So instead of One Rogue General Wanting her dead, now we have the ENTIRE military wanting to replicate her...? huh? THAT MAKES NO SENSE
The Duffers really messed up in the interviews after the season was over. A simple question such as, “ where were the demogorgons in the Abyss?” To which they responded , “ well they were there, but off screen.” That was basically the way they the Duffers answered every interview question. They didn’t even have to give us the right answer. Just give us something that shows you put thought and passion into this season! Rather instead, the Duffers insisted on insulting the intelligence of the audience.
"What happened to Murray?" DUDE, HE WAS IN THE AUDIENCE AT THE GRADUATION. I don't get why some people keep forgetting that little detail in the finale. He was sitting next to the science teacher.
I think they meant "one of his best friends," since they're all so tight knit by the end of S4 (plus it's implied that Mike was one of the few people Max interacted with after Billy died, since they sat next to eachother at class and Lucas' game).
Why is it so hard to Close loops. Focus on originals. Don’t expand. That seems to be pretty basic to me. It's like storytelling has become more complicated than it needs to be.
I honestly don't get what Vecna's point was. Like what was his sad backstory? That he was shot as a kid? idk, it was just lackluster. all that build up and for what
Theory: I think this ending is supposed to make people wanna watch the animation offspin, and wait for a better solution. no idea if that could be better then a good ending.
the duffer brothers already have spin-offs and new projects coming… will you be tuning in?
Not if you paid me.
Absolutely not. I haven't cared about Stranger Things since Season 2. And nothing I've seen since has given me a reason to care.
Todd Howard, Dumb & Dumber from GoT, and now... the Duffer Brothers. Every project they do after that gets more & more worse
Is that a threat?
I've stopped giving money to people that order Cheese Pizza with Grape Soda and freshly walked over jerky. Aka Hollywood celebrities.
The actors give more fucks then the actual show runners.
They are the worst people who think everyone around them is wrong and cogs in their machine. Then they use AI to help write
yeah it makes sense, when you're an actor you have to emerse yourself into the character and truly understand them to play as them, and it's easy to form bonds with fictional characters just like humans do. it's way different then show runners or whoever else that just cares about making money.💔
@sonic_the_freakyhog Yeah, but as a writer, the entire thing is your baby lol. They lost their motivation to care because the money was guaranteed, regardless of their effort.
@mayathedreamgirl1357 exactly
Watch the table read for season of 8 of Game of Thrones. The cast is between holding in laughter and openly cringing at the lines the entire time
it feels like a mockumentary
Duffers were leaving Netflix so they had no reason to cover for them, they wanted to burn them on their way out. Kinda funny.
@viennacollings rightfully so imo bc how do you have 3 years and $500,000,000 to make the final season n THAT is what you come up with 😭😭
Watch mine then the real one 😂
They should have bought the premium version of chatgpt to write a better script 💀💀💀
Remember when the screen writers went on strike and DEMANDED that studios could NOT use AI to write scripts...? Yeah, they never said *they* couldn't use it, just not the studios.
They want to be paid for promoting AI to write something, which makes them merely the middleman. And wow does it show.
@sarasunshinemt4444 So one show fucks up and that justified everyone else in that industry losing their livelihood?
@pyerack Yes, Hollywood deserves to crash and burn on all levels. I want every writer homeless
@pyerackfree ynw melly
I grew up in the 80s. The upside down was more realistic than that coming out scene.
I know right, why the hell was he coming out to EVERY SINGLE PERSON IN THE TOWN (I'm not exaggerating trust) It felt like an insult towards the queer community
Right? 😂
Hopper or at least Murray would've said something not so nice to him lol
I didn't mind it. I just hated the fact that everyone outright was fine in the scene, during the 80s where homophobia was a big thing
@carbonrobin They wanted all characters to stay liked, so yeah... no choice. Can you imagine Max yelling at him that he's disgusting? lmao
It was nice of Dr Brenner to let Henry out of the lab so that he can go to high school for four years.
Aw $hit, I didn't realize that! 💀
he was released and taken back he went to school until he killed his family, brenner knowing the truth.. took him back
@coltonskog3932 wrong, Season 4 had established that Brenner adopted Henry after he killed his family, Brenner knew about him having psychic Powers because Mrs. Creel told him.
The whole thing about Henry going to High School with Joyce, Hopper, the Wheelers and Bob was fanfiction from the play that the Duffers tried to integrate into the real Netflix show last minute.
It’s a retcon, Henry is now 14 instead of 12 in 1959
@tsiffpyc7882Worse, they said Henry was 12 in high school
6:30 CORRECTION: They wrote THE most uncomfortable coming out scene of all-time.
I got called homophobic for trashing on the scene
@Chaos_MKS help what??
I was howling with laughter
@Chaos_MKSgaaaaayyyyy
i don’t believe that the same people wrote robin’s coming out in season 3 which was very very intimate and appropriate
the difference is just insane
Someone else posted that Season 5 should have been like Weirdmaggedon from Gravity Falls and I couldn't agree more.
I will forever keep maintaining that Stranger Things has always been desperate to reach the peak storytelling and emotions that Gravity Falls did
@ayywhbin like........1/25th the time. (2 seasons, 20 episodes each [i think], 23 minutes)
Ahhhh dude same I was expecting that
@ayywhbAlex Hirsch >>>>> Duffer Brothers
"it happened off screen"
"leave to watcher's interpretations"
Watch out for series where the writters come up with excuses like these, it's a sure sign the series will be bad.
Why did all of the important plot and character development happen OFFSCREEN?? 😭
I noticed that the internet would rather believe the most unlikeliest scenarios rather than the most obvious reason.😅 No the Duffers weren't playing 4D chess with us, they just lost interest and left their homework up to the last minute.
@dysmissme7343 And all the most interesting stuff happens off, too. The end of S4 sets up real stakes, the upside down in Hawkins. A really dark desperate stakes-raising guerilla-survival season would have been a dramatic move. Instead, we get "we put some metal band aids over the holes, now we’re all back to normal, so we can have endless committee meetings where the entire cast argues." 🤮
@Dowerealllyhavetopreach, i was wanting a survival horror season, instead i got plot hole soap opera
That sums up J J Abhrams.
Gotta love how they zoom in on the chainsaw like it's gonna be used against the demagorgon and then Steve proceeds to cut a floor with it and never uses it for anything else. And they still showed him in the poster holding it.
This needs more up votes
That’s just realistic, chainsaws are terrible weapons. Sure, they can cause a lot of damage but swinging it around would just break the thing.
It was an absolute mess! The duffers just wanted it to be over and the audience didn’t deserve this ending just because they got lazy.
No better way to get over something than a bunch of spin-offs. Gotta make that bag I guess 😅
This channel has a lot of bot comments.
I dont think they went lazy at all, but they just had a different mind than in 2016 and also wrong decisions
Not really. They stole a woman's ideas and talent and were caught with their pants down when she divorced one of them.
My biggest problems with S5:
-No one dies. I thought S5 could've still been good even without any deaths, but the amount of fakeouts and playing it safe was annoying. No one in the main party even suffered an injury in the final battle. If Karen and/or Ted died early in the season it would've set a much more dark and serious tone to let us know it was time for the heroes to stop screwing around.
-After S4, the Duffers said S5 would pick up more or less right where S4 left off and would scale the show back down to something more intimate, with the main focus on the original S1 cast. Instead we got a disproportionate amount of time with Holly, while some S1 characters were almost completely sidelined.
-The Mike/Eleven relationship, something that was historically the emotional heartbeat of the show, was pretty much nonexistent.
-Dr. Owens, someone who had the ability to shield the party from government consequences, was nowhere to be found, or even mentioned. The most we can surmise is that he was killed based on what Hopper said to Akers during the interrogation?
-The military quarantine was completely unbelievable as we don't even get a hint of frustration among the townspeople for being held there for 18 months.
-After the amazing twist that concludes episode 4, Will barely does anything with his superpowers in the back half of the season.
-For that matter, Henry/Vecna barely does anything with HIS powers in S5. He just didn't feel like a scary villain the way he did in S4.
There's a lot more, but man, what a missed opportunity this last season was. The ending, purely on the surface, felt emotionally satisfying upon watching it for the first time, but as I had time to sit with it and let it digest, my opinion on it soured considerably.
Agree with literally everything you said
Exactly. The first time watching was pretty emotional because the show was ending but upon the re-watch from s1 completely changed my thoughts on s5 and the whole show. Everything was destroyed by the end of the show. And what they did with Mike and eleven's relationship I'll never forgive the duffers.
Yeah good points. Also the people's lack of reaction to the lockdown is even more silly when you just remember a few years back when people absolutely lost their shit due to covid restrictions. We have a real life example of a lockdown and people's reaction to it just a few years back!!!! And covid restrictions where not enforced through the military
Why did the kids just cough up mind flayer dust and not THE DEMO WORMS THEY SPENT SEASON TWO ON
I’m also not sure why they took so much time bothering to give Karen a hero arc, with her wine bottle which actually damages demogorgons (who as we know from the Russian chapter aren’t damaged by literal machine gun fire).
Then, head scratcher, they bring the mind flayer down with… machine gun fire? Maybe they should have given Nancy a broken wine bottle to fight the mind flayer… that’s how inconsistent their writing is, that a statement that ridiculous is logically correct.
I thought for sure they were going to do the right thing and have Nancy die heroically, but then, no, plot armor.
Realistically, using the rules set by the prior seasons, the mindflayer should have been unbeatable. It’s an ancient eldritch entity so old it doesnt even know its own origin.
It should be completely ambivalent to the kids, and killing them would be like swatting a fly.
The mindflayer should never have had a “real form” and if it did it should not have been a fucking kaiju. Instead I prefer the idea that Henry was the mind flayer as implied in s4.
Maybe time worked differently in the abyss and the years that passed in Hawkins during Henry’s banishment translated to decades, maybe even centuries in the abyss.
Regardless, the mindflayer should have overwhelming psychic abilities that dwarfed Eleven’s and Henry’s since their powers are implied to originate from the mindflayer.
The wrote themselves into a corner and frankly season 4 could have been the ending. S4 actually tied up a lot of loose ends.
Following the D&D logic, they made the mistake of "giving Cthulhu stats".
Truth is, at some point they seemed to want to turn Stranger Things into a Cosmic Horror story (I mean, that first shot of the mindflayer among the red clouds in S2 is legit good and sold that idea), but forgot or ignored that by definition, happy endings aren't compatible with that type of story.
By the end of the series run, it was less about telling a story than producing content.
Agreed. The only way to "defeat" it needed to be cutting off its connection to our dimension. Season 3 should have shown it who it's enemies were and that it needed a bigger foothold in our dimension leading to dispatching Vecna to rip more openings between the dimensions. From the moment those openings were created there would have been armies of demo-whatevers ready to come through and capture people for mass level hive-minding giving the mind flayer the foothold it needed to "consume" life on Earth. Instead we got an antagonist that didn't really do much and never really seemed prepared for their own "next step".
@JuanProano-uh9sp You said exactly what I was thinking, it seemed to be about cosmic horror and the pattern is really that there are no happy endings, unfortunately the script was very cowardly, the series started out being for adults involving children and ended up being for children involving adults.
@Nlzinhaedit I'm not going to jump into the "I only liked the first season" bandwagon, because to be fair, I did enjoyed seasons 2 to 4 a lot. But in hindsight, introducing a villain like Vecna destroys any semblance of the story being about Cosmic Horror, and it kinda proves that indeed the Duffer's knowledge about D&D was superficial.
Vecna is the quintessential Big Bad Guy in the game: The god of lies and secrets and unquestionably evil.
That kind of character doesn't mesh in a Cosmic Horror setting, were the antagonist's (in this case, the mind flayer, that is clearly D&D's version of a Lovecraftian horror) purpose is beyond human comprehension.
And hell, you could have a bittersweet ending, with the surviving characters having a rather nice epilogue, but acknowledging that even if the mind flayer is somehow defeated by locking it away from our world, they only bought time.
truthnuke
For a place of chaos, the Abyss didn't seem very chaotic...or abyssal.
abyss-mal
Fr it was just a regular desert with a monster in it
A lot of movies/shows make references to “the abyss”. It’s a spiritual concept as much as a physical one. The angel of the abyss is Abadan, the destroyer. It’s where the fallen angels are chained in darkness.
Max has Wolverine and Deadpool’s healing factor. There’s your answer to that one.
Or she's like the Eve from Invincible. She can manipulate organic matter and heal herself. But only unconsciously.
😂
max is almost confirmed to be a mutant in spiderman 4 so that makes sense
Max is the lovechild of wolverine and deadpool, the duffer brothers just kept it a secret and didnt want anyone to find out
The guy who said there had to be Demo-something wrote the highest rated episodes of the entire show! Sorcerer and Dear Billy!
Well.
I took this from this comment section:
@TheVideoViper: "Mike was wrong. Wills powers do not come from within, they come from his link to vecna. This makes vecna wills "patron" and makes will a WARLOCK, not a sorcerer".
@CMVray: "Absolutely correct, moreover, there were no sorcerers and warlocks in DnD editions back then. It is an anachronism either way."
I really hate how the Duffer Brothers took inspiration from DND lore without knowing DND lore. Especially Vecna. Vecna in DND is damn near a god, a legitimate threat who's eye or finger ALONE could be the sole focus of an entire campaign because it's so powerful. He's one of the biggest BBEGs in all of dnd lore, next to Xanathar, Tiamat, and Strahd. But Vecna in stranger things? A fraud. A loser of a villain. You can even see it in Dead by Daylight. ST Vecna's just like any other killer: there because the Entity said so. But DND Vecna? That is the ONLY killer in the game who was EXPLICITELY STATED to have a special mark to NERF the killer, because the Entity knows DND Vecna could easily take over the trials without a sweat. And even with nothing but basic cantrips, DND Vecna is STILL a threat. How could the Duffer Brothers take a character with so much power, so much fear attached to his name, and completely ruin his reputation by giving the name to a boring, poorly written character?
They couldn’t decide if they want Mind Flayer or Vecna to be the main villain.
Personally, I think everything would’ve been fine if he had just stayed the Mind Flayer’s “five star general”. It was simple, interesting, and didn’t take anything away from either character. Then that crap season 4 finale twist happened, and it was all downhill from there
@Arander92 That play really messed up Season 5. They had to account for all the retcons the play did. Once again business decisions superseded the creative decisions. It was completely unnecessary, an unforced error.
@One.Zero.One101 I’m personally happy the play exists, because Vecna being the main villain behind everything was a retcon in and of itself, and kind of ruined the upside down for me, so I’m glad that got overwritten. Mind Flayer is a much more interesting Big Bad, imo.
What I’m NOT happy about, is how wishy washy the Duffers were in establishing that this season. It baffles me that they waited till the last episode to confirm what the play ALREADY ESTABLISHED, rather than just inform the audience early in the season that the Mind Flayer has been controlling Vecna this whole time. It would saved a lot of screen time from that ridiculous and Holly in the cave stuff.
I got the distinct feeling that, while the Duffers were reestablishing the Mind Flayer, they were doing it resentfully. It felt like they really believed in Vecna (even though he sucks imo), thought he was the coolest villain ever, and were trying to have their cake and eat it too.
None of this would have happened if that season 4 Vecna retcon had never happened. That’s the source of a LOT of these problems
You said it better than I could. I wholeheartedly agree 👍.
Gotta love that they sidelined Will's character, his arc, his sexuality, and his relationship with Mike, just for Mileven to have such a horridly unsatisfactory conclusion. So much so that the fans were even more upset that Mike ended up sad and lonely regardless. Talk about not having your cake nor eating it.
Byler was never going to happen. Grow up and move on weirdo
@akumu9301 obviously, because that meant writing a good show
@user-uw1do5yr4n in what world would it be a good show to make someone who has been unwaveringly devoted to his girlfriend get with someone he never showed romantic interest in at the last minute? It took 3 seasons, 2 years in universe, to explore Will's sexuality and Mike would suddenly come out and betray his gf right before the final battle? It would be absolutely unearned and would make the writers even more of a laughing stock they already are
@timetoobsess8860 the world of loons obsessed with anything to do with the alphabet
@timetoobsess8860 Mike and eleven relationship is awful to say the least one of the worst love stories I've ever seen in media, if they wanted Mike and eleven to be a good couple then they should've written it better. "Devoted" where? He never said I love you to her not even in death lmao and Will had to encourage him to say it in season 4. What was the point of all of that? The reason? They never gave it to us.
Making Mike gay and giving him a case of internalised homophobia (mind you they wrote Mike that way, they gave Mike and Eleven conflicts over conflicts and separated them EVERY SEASON except season one, where will was not present) would've given an explanation for all of that, meaning good writing. I'm sorry but you're just an awful judge of writing
9:26 "because it's just really a show made to profit off of outcasts while upholding conformity" banger line and perfectly sums up how I feel about the show now. a shame
Baffles me how people say this isn’t in the same tier as Game of thrones’s ending… This is damn near just as bad we literally got 5x more questions than answers and atleast a hundred plot holes
game of thrones was a steeper dive in quality from season 4 - 8 though
If Game of Thrones ended today you’d see thousands of apologists saying it’s actually great and that “it just didn’t meet your headcanon”
GOT was worse, but I get it is personal judgement of each viewer
GOT: redeemed Jaimie and gave him an arch just for him to do 180° on at least two key things: Cercei is still his No1 and he will die with her no matter how wrong she is, and you see he didn't really care about regular people, let them burn 🤦♀️
ST: Steve and Dustin have some issues, being d*cks to each other, but Steve sticks around, doesn't reverse to his season 1 persona and they have one of the best scenes in the season together.
GOT: fighting the Night King, where you could see nothing through the whole episode. Tactic was as if it was written by the enemy you are trying to defeat. (NK: how about you guys put your army in front of the battlements, send your whole cavalry into the midst of my minions to be dealt with in two minutes, the rest will struggle to get to the safety of the castle because you keep such a small retreat area, so many will die. Oh, and don't forget to put your most vulnerable people in the crypt, so I can finish them by resurrecting the dead already there.)
ST: no minions, teleporting to the top of the canyon, poking blisters on the underbelly of Mind Flayer. 🤦♀️ Will is not affected by MF's pain and not really any meaningful help. Kids safe through the battle also not affected being inside something on fire
GOT: Arya kills NK, not Cercei
ST: Joyce gives the last blow...at least she's justified. In GOT fashion it would be Erica or Mr Clark
GOT: although Daenerys is often cruel to her enemies she doesn't have enough space to grow evil like her father, it happens too rapidly. One episode she tells Varys to let her know if she's straying from the path and a few later she burns him, then burns Kings Landing
ST: imagine if Eleven and Kali took control over the upside down and ruled their dominion in place of Henry and MF. And Mike would have to knife her in the end.
GOT: John being in fact Targaryen was only revealed to make him and us cringe at him having sex with his own aunt. Three Eyed Raven used only as bait during the battle, scouting through birds is on the same level with Will not being used in the final battle, although Will had two badass scenes before, Bran didn't.
GOT: the smartest men got really dumb
ST: constant repetition: apparently the audience is dumb
Theon and Kali die without meaning or redemption.
A lot of parallels, but GOT had a lot of assassinations of the characters and dropped a lot of things being hinted or built up for seasons without resolution. ST still has likeable characters that make this season re-watchable. I guess the biggest betrayal was to start it not just after the events of season 4. Such a cliffhanger ruined. I think ST 5 is comparable to GOT season 7. Despite its cringe and bad writing GOT s8 is still the biggest betrayal.
@JR-sx3gl, nothing is wtong with Jon banging his auntie. He should have stick with that, but he participated in ruining the show finale.
@JR-sx3gl: "ST: constant repetition: apparently the audience is dumb" - nah, the audience is doomscrolling through tiktoks while the show is being playing in the background. This is the way!
For a show about outcasts and people who don't fit into normal societal standards, for the time period the series is set in, the bros really fumbled the bag on it's characters.
Will, a sensitive little boy, who's been kidnapped, bullied, abused, came back, got possessed and has been established as gay since season 1, then given powers, only to be reduced to a side character, who needs to come out, because he's afraid.
Jane/El, also a kidnapped, abused, imprisoned, experimented on since birth, treated as nothing more than a lab rat, given a safe place to stay, fell in love, was adopted, given a father figure, got to know girlhood, friendship, love, sisterhood, only to then be reduced to this superhero, magic of childhood archetype, because, if you're abused, well bye.
Lucas, a black boy, who's called Midnight, constantly sidelined, bullied by Billy, had to watch his girlfriend die in front of him.
Erica, his sister who was a stereotype of a loud sassy black girl, who according to the bros, is independent enough and fearless so she can take care of herself, not even given the decency of an epilogue.
Johnathan, A sensitive older teen, who has to carry the guilt of his little brother being missing and also dealing with the fact, he may be dead, by the age of 16, has an abusive father who's a POS, only to be reduced to a love triangle and being a sidelined happy flower addict.
Dustin, a boy who's different due to his disability and is also bullied for it, has to deal with rejection from girls, never seems to get there until Susy comes around, while his dynamic with Steve is great, he also lost his other best friend, who loved and accepted him for who he is, also had to deal with his death and the horiffic beating he received due to it.
Robin, a girl who apart from being a lesbian is also possibly on the spectrum, going from this sarcastic, intelligent and very smart girl, to this bumbling idiot, who just cracks jokes.
Eddie, a metal head, who has issues with powdered substances, gets unfairly accused of a murder, hunted down and then sacrifices himself for a town, that hated him.
Mike, while him and Nancy are from a rich family, he really struggles with bullying and the loss of his best friend, has these amazing leadership qualities, lovingly takes El in, gives her a place to stay and risks his life to protect her, only to then be turned into an insufferable brat since season 3 and then completely butchered as a character, by his lack of depth and any meaningful reactions.
Nancy, a rich girl, who has to deal with the loss of her best friend, carrying the guilt of that with her, shows excellent marksman skills, gets close with Johnathan, has a great reporter nose and then being turned into this curly haired Rambo, possibly struggling with alcohol issues and is trapped into this love triangle, passed around as this ultimate prize, not to mention, her dealing with Vecna's possession and completely breaking apart only when she's alone. Only to end up with that ridiculous haircut.
Max, a troubled teen, who has to deal with her parent's divorce, has an aggressive and outright bully step brother, who's an ass to her, Mike then treats her like crap, El ignores her and even pushes her off a skateboard and she eventually opens up to Lucas, becomes besties with El, only to then lose her step brother to the Meat Flayer and in season 4, she has to deal with the loss and getting Vecna'd, then dying in her boyfriend's arms, getting revived by her best friend, gets stuck in a coma, only for their reunion to be the most lackluster thingy ever and she was reduced to nothing more than a plot device for Holly, only to then deal with the loss of her best friend.
And finally Kali, an Indian girl, who at the age of 5 was kidnapped by Brenner, experimented on, given powers, was raised together with El, managed to escape, found a family on the streets of Chicago, finally was enjoying her freedom and then she meets El, her sister whom she immediately takes in, while her intentions were wrong, she did gave her a place to stay and taught her how to manage her powers better, she even shows her how to be free from the influence of others, despite El later realizing, that she needs to go back to Hawkins.
And well the character in herself is universally the most hated/disliked, in some aspects I can understand why, but then as you mentioned, they have this character who's a POC, is hated by almost the entire fandom, you bring her back, use her as a plot device to serve El's ending and have her butt heads with Hopper, so that he can give her side eyes, because she wants the abuse to end, kill off her friends, have her taken to the UD by Kay, she is then used as a blood bank, treated like a lab rat, so that the military can get more super powered children, but since her blood isn't working, they need El. After they finally reunite you completely butcher any little character you gave her in season 2, just so that she can dump all this info onto El and basically tell her to off herself, because "they will kill Mike and its the only way", you don't even bother to have proper use for her powers, only giving her like two moments and completely waste her as a character, who like El is treated as nothing more than a concept, not to mention her being a POC, you really sent in a pretty telling message by Hopper leaving her there in the lab (while I understand he was focused on El's safety), it was really shitty writting imo. She was given no depth, no personality, no meaningful interactions, outside of El and Hopper.
Her in my opinion being the biggest outcast on the show, brown, emo/goth look, purple hair, illusion based powers, only to then be turned into this suicidal plot device who's story was always going to end in death, bruh, get outta here.
When you put it like that sheesh. They really did a number on these characters and its sad.
THANK YOU FOR SAYING THIS ABOUT KALI BECAUSE I WAS GENUINELY so upset with what they did with her
same thing with the direction of all of the characters and how under utilized they all unfortunately were
I will never forgive them for what they did with kali, el, and will
I cant help but feel like the Duffers were doing the bullying in highschool. I dont feel like they really know what its like to be marginilized, rejected, bullied, or tokenized. So many missed opportunities and so much wasted potential. Thanks for taking the time to trace these character paths.
@vintageleeknowsWord, Kali deserved so much more, if the writing was smart, they could have great moments together, forming a plan, strategy to take down Vecna and the MF, without the need for that Kamikaze stuff, like we never even see Johnathan or El reacting to Will having powers, just...
Man. As soon as they paved over the interdimensional chasms I was like ohhhhhhhhhh so this is going to be bad. Damn.
They still could have saved it if they instead focused on the creeping evil of those rifts instead of Holly etc
Like, the town is under quarantine, people aren't *happy* about it, per se, but are determined to Listen To The Authorities and rock along. But underneath, we could see that the military is DESPERATELY trying to stem the flood of the Upside Down from takimg over our world, that dozens, then hundreds of people & even wildlife are either missing or mutated etc, that sort of thing. Show the military cracking down HARD in response, make them almost completely unsympathetic (thus the *reason* for our central characters to go around & against them) only to have at a crucial moment realize that our world is FVCKED and all they have managed to do is buy VERY little time for a hail Mary, Do Something by 11 or what have you.
A creeping evil, slowly being surrounded and taken over is 1000x scarier than a Kiju stomping slllloooowwwllllyyyy after people.
Had me on the floor like whaaaaaat
Netflix absolutely put together the doc when they realized the doofus bros f--ked themselves over and released it to cover their asses so all the blame is on the bros. Which is very warranted. You can only attribute so much bs to the 2nd screen policy. They had all the time and money to knock it tf out of the park and instead they just shit their pants and went tadaaaaaaaaaa! *Jazz hands*
Actually they realized this would be an even better story…
Man they shit all of our pants
The Steve fakeout was just plain insulting.
Horrible
I originally thought about re-watching seasons 1-4 in time to start watching season 5, but I ultimately didn't find the time. This was probably a good thing in the end as I'm sure I would have been even more disappointed in season 5 if I had the previous seasons so fresh in my memory.
Season 5 just confirmed what I've always thought, season 1 is the only good season
@nicholasbintner4677it's true.
I had never seen ST so my friends and I binge watched it on time for the release of volume 2, I liked the first 3 seasons but S4 and S5 were really bad, and by the end of S5 I could not stand Hopper for my he is the worst character in the show.
@deepindigo1937I understand your take but Murray and Kali are still the worst characters imo
@nicholasbintner4677 fair, but for me they are not even characters much as they are plot devices.
the Duffs sure have a long eloquent way of basically saying "we didn't really care about giving this show a satisfying ending, we just wanted it to be over asap and move on"
They basically pulled an Umbrella academy with this final season.
I will say at least in ST most of the characters got an okay ending.
The UA ending is like Eleven offing herself x7 - the most disappointing and weird ass season ever
its arguable umbrella academy just got worse and worse post season 1 where season 3 was eh
Tbh I still feel TUA season 4 is worse that ST season 5. I was tired of that “apocalypse” shit for the 4th time. Season 5 of ST was atleast watchable to an extent.
The only good part of TUA season 4 was the baby shark segment and the fight in that snow town.
umbrella academy has been godawful since they left dallas at least stranger things was passable for a few seasons
The actors knowing the characters and the story better than the creators tells you everything you need to know about the Duffers.
I have a new policy when watching a TV series. If the next season doesn't come out the following year. I'm out.
Spending a decade following a show just to be disappointed in the end is too much. I'll spend my finite time elsewhere.
wish we knew this back in 2016 😭
@everythingeverywher3 4:49 All those pregnant women were killed when the upside down was destroyed. That has been answered by the duffer brothers
@cassfowler8633man what the hell is this show
Honestly I don’t want to stick around to find out, because the Duffer Brothers logic is so exhausting to listen to.
It's just retcon over retcon. Between seasons. Between the play and the show. Between comics and the show. Signs that this was not at all planned.
and then they dismiss the fandom for noticing plot holes
@everythingeverywher3 not only dismiss. They straight up mock.
But the Duffers said they already knew the ending 50 years ago?🤣
While season 5 was horrible, there is one critique that's not quite right. The mind flayer being in a "desert" doesn't mean it's hot. Mars is one giant desert with an average temperature of about -81° F.
True, but if we're going with cinematography/visual storyrelling, the orange colour palatte evokes more of a hot desert than a cold one and there's nothing else to establish what kind of temperature the place is. None of the characters act affected, so all we have to go on so far as temperature is the visuals, which indicate a warm environment. If they wanted to communicate a cold desert without using the characters' reactions, they should've used a more blue-toned colour palette.
Maybe he likes cold because he is stuck in warm environment 😊
You are right but as writers they should have described the real or used a background that doesn't make us thing hot environment by visuals
Just put them in an ice planet if they wanted to portray cold. Film is visual story-telling. There shouldn't be any need for head-canon explanations. A good director would be able to communicate with visuals. The most likely scenario is they just forgot what they wrote, the Duffers don't need you to come up with head-canon for them.😅
the scene of max getting her limbs completely broken and then the next scene completely normal with no explanation was like something out of Tom and Jerry or Loony Tunes. If El can heal to that extent she’s basically Stranger Things Jesus who didn’t need help from anyone.
Or what about when Steve, Dustin, Nancy and Jonathan crashed so hard in the Upside Down in Steve’s beamer but walking away without any scratches or injuries
Mike was wrong. Wills powers do not come from within, they come from his link to vecna. This makes vecna wills "patron" and makes will a WARLOCK, not a sorcerer
Absolutely correct, moreover, there were no sorcerers and warlocks in DnD editions back then. It is an anachronism either way.
YES, they made a joke about how specific dnd players are about the spell casting classes AND DIDN'T EVEN GET IT RIGHT!!! 😅
@ticiale20 to be honest it is not the only thing they turned into a sad joke. The entire season is a joke, and they did not get anything right (well maybe a couple of things out of a few hundred). But i have to say that for me as a D&D DM, things about dnd were exceptionally cringe worthy
The way I thought you would spend a minute or two naming all the lost plots and production errors but it ended up being the entire video says so much. Like we need a whole 10 hours just to unpack just how lost the plot got let alone find it.
14:27 oh my gosh I don’t even think they meant for that to be as bad as it was but that sounds so bad
I had just started watching the series for the first time last month (I never got into the hype when it was first released, and didn’t see the recent hype for the last season). I didn’t realize there were only 5 seasons. When I finished the last episode, I went to look for “next episode” button, but was so confused when I didn’t see it. I had my own version of conformity gate over here 😭😭 I did NOT want to believe that was it, after such an epic first season! I didn’t even get to cry the way I wanted to at the end of the series!! 😭😭
Also, why, when the whole gang was on top of the radio tower, did the colliding world just... stop? It reached the radio tower only to stop and let them climb up, then fart about for however long they were up in the mind flayer's domain. It pisses me off no end!
I interpreted it like that was El's doing by distracting vecna from the inside of his mind, but I could be wrong about it.
Eleven broke the children out of the trance when she tossed Vecna across the dining room, which stopped the merge.
With that said, how did the Mind Flayer get revived when Henry was still chasing the kids around trying to get them back into a trance?
I mean, this is just a failure on your part and your own media literacy. They established that Vecna through the kids he abducted was making the worlds collide, and at that moment, Eleven interrupted him.
@stephengrant4841Ok then, I stand corrected 😂
@skakirask I forgot about the trance part tbh. I don't know about the rest tho 🤷♀️
Thank you for pointing out how damaging the message of the last season is.
thanks! stick around for more 🤘
Remember when Hollywood writers went on strike over ai? Turns out they just wanted to use it themselves and didn’t want to be cut out of the equation.
jeeeeez
Man you brought up just about all the criticisms i have been saying since the end, it is crazy how hardly anyone else noticed or at least mentioned much if any of this stuff, so glad to hear it be laid out like you did here, great job.
But yeah it is such a shame how they literally ruined the entire story/series with the almost infinite amount of bad decisions in the end.
It just doesn't make sense, we need to learn what actually happened, i don't believe it could be a total accident, i think it was either sabotaged or maybe just maybe they didn't have enough time
Actually pretty much all of this has been mentioned by lots of people
There is a reason why no so many people turned down the duffer brothers before netflix picked it up. They all knew the brothers had no idea whats going on.
omg
They're terrible writers. Now they moved on to scam Paramount 😂.
Ngl it’s funny how the actors are even trashing on the show now
15:45 yes, it was certainly not serious writing. It was also certainly not passionate nor careful writing. It was merely "let's get this over with" writing.
21:20 The Duffers had no D&D knowledge and didn’t have the decency to study? “Yeah I’ll direct a Star Wars movie. I have it all planned out. What’s a Jedi again?”
I was dumbfounded the moment the duffer's called Will a Sorcerer instead of a Warlock. Any dnd player would have called him a warlock because sorcerers are innate magic users who cast spells, and warlocks are endowed with power from an other worldly being
Oh no, you can tell they definitely used chatgpt for the script. I've noticed the general theme for ai written things is the same for images. Like things not connecting in ways that makes sense, plots that end in ways that answer nothing but raise more questions, new plots coming from completely nowhere and inserted at points that just don't fit like Will's coming out party for example. It makes so much sense looking back at season 5
17:43 i mean, they already forgot the plot of season 4 since the play already contradicts multiple things that were clearly stated or implied in season 4..
this is the first time I ever agreed fully with a stranger things video
thanks! follow for more commentaries :)
I guess the good finale happened off screen
Unpopular Opinion: this show shouldn’t have continued after season 1
True Season 1 is best
Everyone with a brain agrees on this. Sure the other seasons had fun moments but the writing and plot declined after season 2
but it's not like there nothing good about the other seasons, it gave us many things.
@RNeditz-u3ino I agree there were great moments but overall it really was never THAT good but if they would have made this season amazing, which they could have, the problems with the other seasons could have been solved
Actually season 2... (It had a perfect ending)
Season 5 going south is so because they lost leigh and her influence on the show
is she the mindflayer? goofy
@drip2575what?
@M@Malsyyyyleigh had very little influence stuff can just be bad dude
@drip2575I promise you she had more influence then you think
@Malsyyyythe duffers wrote some episodes for the earlier seasons but there were also other writers none of them were Leigh
Way back when, several years ago, when the second season was freshly out, I read a comment stating it would've been better if they'd left Eleven's fate unclear after season 1 and made the second season take place somewhere else, with new characters. That it'd have been better to make several seasons and each season be an independent mystery story, maybe with an occasional crossing of paths, or a few mentions or cameos.
I've come to agree with that person.
that's what the duffers wanted tbh but because people were so hype about 11 and the boys, the studio wanted them to continue in a linear fashion. it was supposed to be an anthology series.
Why would the Duffers fix their mouths to say El's goodbye to Mike in the void didn't happened, but give zero indication ON SCREEN that it was Mike hallucinating? What is ON THE SCREEN is what happened in the story. That's it. That's all. I guess they can say next month, the entire show was Mike Wheeler's story he wrote while locked up in a mental institution after Will died. Are the Duffers mentally well? Becuase they seem bent on spitting on their story and some of these characters.
the entire show was Mike Wheeler's story he wrote while locked up in a mental institution after Will died seems better now i d say
@eva@evangelinechen3967 It’s just what happens when you turn Tommy Westphall’s snow globe upside down
That sequence not a hallucination, they said she would not be able to communicate with them after she vanished in the epilogue. Its still a pretty ridiculous thing to say though and they even seem to have realized this themselves because they backtracked and said we could imagine they reunite…
They never said it was a hallucination, this person has poor reading comprehension or just repeates bylers misinterpretations trying to invalidate that scene and pretend El never said she feels seen by Mike.
What the DB actually said: "The only thing I'll debunk is that Eleven does not communicate with Mike in any way. But what you just said at the end - yes, at graduation, he's hearing the speakers distort because the principal is so angry, and it makes him realize that there was the kryptonite. So how could she have possibly made it all the way to the gate? Not only that. How could she have possibly used her powers to bring him into the void?"
They're saying she didn't communicate with him *in the epilogue*. But the bridge scene? She couldn't have made it to the gate but she was there, wasn't she? The same thing works for the void. It only could have happened if it was a Kali's illusion. Which means Mike's theory has a point. I can't believe people would believe for a second Mike suddenly got schizophrenic in the middle of running to El lol
That part of the video is not true. What they said was El doesn't communicate with Mike in the future.
Tysm for being respectful about the whole Mike and Will thing not a lot of people who make videos like these treat Will’s identity and his love for mike appropriately
The way El kills herself is just so upsetting. I’m all about characters dying, and if El died in a reasonable way I wouldn’t be opposed to it. But having her kill herself after fighting against the government for years was just horrible and genuinely made me angry. And then, while she’s standing there, nobody does anything. At the very least they should’ve killed Hopper as well. Hell maybe Hopper runs and throws El out of the way of the wormhole just in time and he dies. The whole show has been about Hopper fighting the grief he feels about letting his daughter die and not being able to protect her, and when he actually CAN protect his new daughter he just stands there.
Hoper killing Eleven in the tank was such a good idea, it's a shame they weren't brave enough to stick to it
I've never heard of this channel before, but wow! Brilliantly broken down - you deserve so many more views. Awesome job!
appreciate it! stick around for more :)
if i had a nickel for every time a critically acclaimed netflix series decided that the best way for its most beloved and iconic character to end their "cycle of abuse" arc was killing herself, i'd have two nickels, but it's really weird that it happened twice
wait, what's the other series?!
@everythingeverywher3 arcane, with jinx
i’d also give a special mention to TUA for offing EVERYONE just for the apocalypse cycle to end after that being the WHOLE point of the show. to STOP it and LIVE. THEIR. LIVES.😭😭
21:51 genuinely the biggest reason why im still so mad. They lied about SO MUCH, and why?? Why lie about what we’re going to see and buildup anticipation to never see it through? Why would you purposefully do something to make your fandom angry with you??
they hate their fandom the duffer brothers literally act like the show's fans are lame for caring about their show
@everythingeverywher3it’s so unfortunate truly, excellent video by the way I loved it!
Yea its crazy, if they never would have said anything and Netflix doesnt release the documentary it would have been a better show. Not a lot better, but still.
@i@iandevine3063actly!!!! We wouldn’t have had so many specific expectations!
Some other company made the doc. The Duffers probably had no say in it.
It does not change the fact that they showed their own incompentence.
@kylejoe5477 Obviously.
Good, they'd just keep twisting their tongues
honestly, I tried to watch this show so many times, and hearing all of this for the first time makes me devastated to find out that the ending is atrocious. it had such potential, and they destroyed it in one fell swoop. I'm glad I never watched it, I'm sorry the rest of you had to endure such a shit ending.
i thought they were gonna do a bait and switch, like they act like she is gonna die and then she survives
also calling Vickie and Robin "just a highschool romance that wouldn't last" makes no sense because there are ROMANCES that have lasted since MIDDLE SCHOOL in this show, you're telling me El and Mike can stay together from 5-6th grade but Vickie and Robin can't? okay Duffers, Okay.
El and Mike are a couple?!!
@ForsakenGod23 a bad one but yeah still
I think divorce gate has a lot of truth to it but I also believe that alongside the Duffus brothers incompetence and lack of enthusiasm to write when in comparison to directing, Netflix might've also been part of cutting stuff out and making them dumb down their show just like they did with many other Netflix originals
Even Papa actor in his Insta expressed his opinion on the show finale and he admittedly said he didnt like it
The coming out scene was extremely unrealistic
Dude, I really liked this show. I was in fourth grade when it started and I'm in f*cking college now. I grew with this show. Season five is such a disappointment. I didn't have high expectations for season five. I knew it couldn't live up to the hype. But this is just embarrassing. It honestly makes me sad
as i was watching episode 7 prior to 8 coming out; watching them not doing anything abyss related, and then seeing it end as they were preparing to go through the gate, i knew the story was going to be bad. There's no way you wrap something like the end of the world in 1 episode, even if that episode is 2 hours long, when the other seasons had multiple episodes to resolve the final conflict.
I’m 12 minutes in so far & I gotta say, this video has done the best at describing how absolutely abysmal this season was with points I haven’t even realized yet lol. The Duffs really are encouraging offing yourself when hard times come in your life… yikes
thank you!
13:16 well, I haven't watched Hell of a Summer yet, but looking at all these atrocities in Stranger Things, I'm gonna guess that it's actually true.
The Duffers made a queer character WHO IS A CHILD get bullied, abused by his own father, kidnapped by an interdimensional monster, hurt, sexually assaulted, possessed, tortured, burned alive, haunted, used, treated as “weak,” treated as a “crybaby,” felt left out on his own birthday, struggled with his sexuality, felt like a monster, and basically sidelined throughout the show JUST SO HE COULD BE USED AS A PLOT DEVICE TO HELP/PUSH MILEVEN FORWARD.
Teenager* but pretty much the same
Yea, something about that feels homophobic. 😬 Feels like the "kill your gays" trope but instead of killing him (Will), they just put him through hell for the sake of it.
@eli10589 It most definitley WAS homophobic. both of the queer ships gone (rip byler and rockie) and Will got a stupid epilogue boyfriend that isn't even real, and apart of mikes fantasy. and even if it WAS real whats with the bar?? will canonically hates smoking and drinking dude.. and it was SO styreotypical of a queer character being at a bar. He should've been alone at art school fulfilling his passion.. also an extra thing BOTH couples that had an insane amount of parallels to byler both ended up not endgame? (rockie and jancy)
And then they couldn't even let Mileven stay a thing.
@Hawaiigaming100teenagers are children. Hope this helps.
those 3 tabs of chatgpt really hurts because people really aren't trying to create anymore. Writers aren't even trying to wrinkle their brains anymore
I think the biggest problem of the show (not only season 5, I noticed it in season 4 and rethinking it since season 3) is that they want to please everyone. The show doesn't take risk anymore. It works with memes.
Season 2 wasn't perfect but it try to take some risk. It try to reinvent itself (it failed I think, the show should have been an anthologie). Season 3 just became lazy, same with season 4 and 5.
They used chatGpt for sure. How much? We'll never know.
saying this with an ai profile is the cherry on tip
@drip2575what does that have to do with anything?? I'm a real person.
@J.Sofferidk don’t go moral policing if you can’t handle the same 🤷♂️
@cameronferland7889your comment has no context tho. That's all.
@J.Soffer you're criticizing the use of AI while using it for the simplest thing like a profile picture
The tissues were for bean flicking 🫤
4:49 All those pregnant women were killed when the upside down was destroyed. That has been answered by the duffer brothers
1:36 "That guy", Paul Ditcher wroter s4e4(Dear Billy) and s5e4(The Sorcerer), the most hype moments of each season
3:51 THATS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING
21:33 that means that they were making stuff up on the spot
yup!!!
The 3 tabs of ChatGPT suddenly makes everything in season 5 make sense.
this video was surprisingly reallly good! i was expecting a general-audience based biased view of the show but this was made really well. it was clear that you genuinely cared about how the show was supposed to be for marginalized groups and did not blame fans for disliking it. i love how you brought up the injustice with many character arcs, it shows how much you actually pay attention to the show and who the main characters are. i also loved the bits where you covered all the inconsistencies and how fans believed in the cut scenes and conformitygate without shaming them! great job.
this means a lot, thank you! glad that came through
But like, why did Eleven have to leave? 🤨 she was just fine when Dr. Owens was covering for her... and the Military showed no real special interest in replicating that failed experiment. One rogue general wanted to kill Eleven off because he mistakenly assumed she was the cause of all the death in Hawkins
So instead of One Rogue General Wanting her dead, now we have the ENTIRE military wanting to replicate her...? huh? THAT MAKES NO SENSE
All it's legacy is, is old music that a younger generation experienced for the first time in the first place
This is the second time i regretted starting a show after the shitty final season. First time was GOT.
we need accountability... it's so unfair and so tiring
The Duffers really messed up in the interviews after the season was over. A simple question such as, “ where were the demogorgons in the Abyss?” To which they responded , “ well they were there, but off screen.” That was basically the way they the Duffers answered every interview question. They didn’t even have to give us the right answer. Just give us something that shows you put thought and passion into this season! Rather instead, the Duffers insisted on insulting the intelligence of the audience.
GOT and now Stranger Things.. man. In my best Jessie from BB voice, "They can't keep getting away with this!!!" 😂
11:45 ironically the same thing happened in the ending of Umbrella Academy and people hated that just as much
vecna needed exactly 12 because fuck it hes obsessed with grandfather clocks, 12 is a full cycle = reset
"What happened to Murray?"
DUDE, HE WAS IN THE AUDIENCE AT THE GRADUATION. I don't get why some people keep forgetting that little detail in the finale. He was sitting next to the science teacher.
I'm convinced that documentary was a hit piece by Netflix
This is the best analysis I've seen of this show and especially of season 5. Fantastic work!
appreciate it, thanks for watching!
They should have picked up S5 from where S4 ended. That was the mother of all mistakes
Lucas Spartan kicking a big ass Demigorgon was when I turned it off and never finished the season. 😑
Nah, 6:39 the coming out scene in Umbrella Academy is the weirdest shit. 😂
Omg YES
12:50 I wouldn't consider Max to be mikes best friend, she's his friend for sure but best friend is pushing it.
Mikes best friend is either Lucas or Will depending on wether or not Mike is treating Will like shit for no reason that day
I think they meant "one of his best friends," since they're all so tight knit by the end of S4 (plus it's implied that Mike was one of the few people Max interacted with after Billy died, since they sat next to eachother at class and Lucas' game).
Why is it so hard to Close loops. Focus on originals. Don’t expand. That seems to be pretty basic to me. It's like storytelling has become more complicated than it needs to be.
I absolute love how you verbalize every point i think of but never knew how to put it into words.
11 was a good child actor, but as an adult it seems she is not up there.
I honestly don't get what Vecna's point was. Like what was his sad backstory? That he was shot as a kid? idk, it was just lackluster. all that build up and for what
it's sooooo lame
Theory: I think this ending is supposed to make people wanna watch the animation offspin, and wait for a better solution.
no idea if that could be better then a good ending.
Who else wants a redo of volume 2?