Customer States: Knocking Noise and Metal in Oil. (NO PROBLEM FOUND) Ford F-150 5.4 Lifted 4x2
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- Опубликовано: 6 май 2024
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”Intro Music by Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio”
Thanks to Jesse for making the intro and graphic for us to enjoy!! 
Авто/Мото
"No problem found" on a 3-valve Triton. History was made here.
Except that wasn't a 3-valve..... that was a 2-valve. It had black plastic valve covers which the 2Vs have. The 3-valve have cast aluminum with pass-throughs for very visible VVT solenoids on the front.
It's a 2 v
Either way, it was a joke. I'm sure it's a W VIN
I had a similar era 3V that was rattling the chains without a camshaft correlation code. That’s when I traded it in.
it's a 4.6 not a three valve Triton
Ray fooled us into watching another oil change video 🤣🤣
Yup, lol.
Anyone who makes their 2WD F-150 look like a Raptor is definitely going to have some "special" mods.
Maybe he rode that "Special" bus to school? Don't want to be mean but, raising a truck like that screws with the factory geometry. Not a fan, I know people like doing this, it's all for aesthetics.
he did all that bullshit, meanwhile he drives on bald tires. I call this RICED OUT
I worked with guy back in the early 90s that did this. When he tried to sell his raised 4x2 truck he thought all of his mods would add to the value. He was still trying to sell it 2 years after I quit there.
@@sfbfriend
You can install up to a 2-3 inch lift kit before you need to change the drive shafts
"special Mods" .... oh ... man ... I thought you were going to say "Special Problems" !! LMAO.
I am a computer technician and I encounter cases like this every day. All mechanics and technicians know how to use the equipment correctly. It would never occur to them to use it the way users sometimes do. This is why there are cases where the technician is not able to reproduce the situations that the user is complaining about. This is why you should always be honest with your mechanic and provide him with complete information and all the circumstances.
A long time ago I had a 1974 VW Beetle with the hydrostatic transmission.
My mother borrowed the car one day and when she returned she stomped in, angry at me because she "almost got stranded because my car's transmission was failing."
I took the car and drove for about 20 minutes, no problems, even up and down steep roads.
So I made my mother drive while I sat in the passenger seat, and figured out the car's problem before she left the driveway.
-
My mother drove a standard, and drove with hand resting on the shifter. But in a hydrostatic transmission, any force you applied to the shifted made it go out of gear.
-
So yeah... Use it like the person with the complaint uses it, not "the right way".
You are so on point. I'm an automotive locksmith. I get calls all day with odd issues. Customers explain things to me and I have an idea what's going on and I send one of my guys out and it's something in a million years I would never think someone would be doing. People call and say their key won't turn in the door. You figure the key and or lock is worn out. On scene they are using a house key to try to open the car door and swear that's the key they have always used for 10 years. People call say their fob won't open the car door in a parking lot. I send someone out and they are at the wrong car. We still get paid but it's just unreal some customers reality.
Ya, my sist gaved me a call cause she couldn't turn the ignition, so, we both of us bros ride to her car, the steering was turned and created some tension on the key cylindrer,,ya, thats all it was😂😮😂😂😂😂
@@rogerpr364 Technical name for that in business is a wiggle jiggle. :) I get those calls a few times a week. I tell them to take their cell phone out to the car. Put your left hand at 12 oclock on the wheel and turn hard to the left while turning the key and don't take pressure off the wheel. That gets it about 75% of the time. If that doesn't work same thing to the right. Gets another 20%. I can always tell when it works because the radio comes on. If neither works I tell them they probably have a NSS issue. Of course I don't charge for a phone call but at that point I tell them they need a mechanic not a locksmith. We don't do ignition repairs any more. I carried just every ignition there was and keying kits for them so I could match the existing key. We stay busy all day with lockouts and lost keys so more repairs.
I took the battery out to jump start my friends car because truck was not being driven and I wasn't gonna jump his car with my Prius I was honest seeking belts happened as it's been parked for awhile if you rev the engine slow and decelerate slow in park you can't hear knocking
I had the same problem with a part-time knock on a Ford. It was the tensioner pulley. Changed that no more knock.
Well Ray there ya go maybe thats it?
Might be tied to the belt noise
I had a full time rattle at idle. Totally gone after I changed all the idler pulley bearings.
A good doctor will not just tell a patient what they want to hear. A good mechanic does the same. I salute you Ray and thanks for the wife unit cameo appearances.
Replace the squeeky tensioner and fix the steering wheel problem first
The Sloppy Steering Wheel would be my main Concern..
Indeed. Likely the real knocking noise
I'm a 65 year old mechanic. Been wrenching since I was a young child.
Wix has always been the absolute best filter made. We cut oil filters open to discover elements that would indicate unusual engine wear etc etc...
Wix filters were always superior in handling heavy use. Most oil filters fail internally due to the lack of joining of filter material and other reasons. Wix are made different than other filters. Care and added procedures are in place that you will never see or know about but you will also never have a oil filter problem.
Added, wix filters elements are connected end to end. Others will just have a fold over and not attached. When under heavy use that pleat laying over anoter pleat will seperate in the filter and allow oil to move through the filter housing without going through the filter. Really, wix is the best for many little reasons that save you a fourtune.
probably that stering colum that is making the noise
That was my thought too.
Ed Zachary!!!
Agreed
Haha, thats what my wife said!!
It may have been residual oil from the lines, cooloers and such. After the last engine went boom. Everyone forgets about that. 😂.
PK, will tell customer to have BG flush first
See how easy turn signals are. If you start using them it becomes habitual and you use them without having to think about it. And they are free and serve a purpose 😎
I think turn signals are against the law in Massachusetts. Hardly anyone uses them.
Try florida lol , and as for these uturns here they are scary when no one signals a right whe your doing a left uturn
some people are too lazy to move the lever
I deadass think BMWs don't come with them lol, no one who drives them ever uses them
Some Drivers use Telepathy, I haven't learned to receive the messages yet.😅
If you don't have a stethoscope, another good trick is to use a large screw driver, cut a used washer fluid bottle in half, put handle of screwdriver in hole, now touch the tip of the screwdriver against stuff and listen, it will act a a megaphone
Stethoscope for locating noises, they work.
Get rid of the squeaks and squeals....then we can move on to the knock. New belt, new tensioner, and fix the steering wheel. After that, we can find the knock.
Broomhandle...
@@user-tg2eg6lz1t Yes, the broom handle (got to be wood) is very good at relaying sound, I have used it many times over the last 50 years. Ted from down under.
@@user-tg2eg6lz1t Sometimes it's hard to find, even with a stethoscope. This is often the case when the power steering pump goes out and the noise is everywhere on the front timing cover / belt pulleys.
I ran into a Ram that had a 318 that I was sure had a rod knock but when I pulled the engine I found a crack in the flex plate. Had already gotten the parts for a overhaul so the owner got a rebuild and new flex plate!
If that rebuilt is still early days, might be time to get the customer to invest in a couple tanks of gas and a road trip to get some miles on it after fixing that squeal and steering column.
And strict instructions to not clear codes or do any work themselves 🤣
Tell the customer to get rid of that colony of crickets under the hood, it'll make it easier to diagnose an internal engine noise.
Cricket sounds like a dog’s name.
@@Michael-yi4mcit use to be. 😂
Also? Those tires look to be somewhere in whispering distance of being too worn (using the 2/32" of tread standard).
At least the fronts do.
@@Michael-yi4mc Good one. I wonder how many here get the reference. It is already Googleable.
It was parked for a while brother
As the owner of a 4.6 2v I can DEFINITELY say that there are no issues with phasers because that engine does not have them. It looks like that truck may have come with a 5.4 3v (because when you were in All Data, it did show a 5.4 for that VIN). IMHO the 4.6 2v is a better engine. Change out those idler pulleys and see what happens. Other than blowing out spark plugs, those 4.6 2v engines are pretty reliable. Keep the videos coming! Good stuff.
I have a Grand Marquis with the 4.6. I have 160000 miles just replaced the original spark plugs and get 30 MPG on the road. About 21 around town. You can beat it.
The technique used to measure the end play was creative. You can safely conclude that the end play is 12 thousandths or less but... since your meter was anchored to the frame the movement could be play in the motor mounts and thus you can't be sure of the true end play. To get that, you would first need to pry on the front of the engine and not the front end of the crank and subtract that reading from your crank test. Unnecessary though given the reading was below spec.👍
The endplay is more than indicated because the indicator was not parallel to the axis of motion. It's probably a little over .014.
But - That test is only accurate with a flywheel. A flex plate has flex. As the name suggests.
Just a little tip on filter pleat inspection.. Take a section of pleats out, wrap in a ship rag, then squeeze in the vise until the oil is out.. you'll be amazed at how much you'll see on the filter media. The wix pro tec is the "lower" tier wix filter line, value priced for the jobber.
Okay you and Lauren having a waterfight on the end was hilarious. I'm sure Dave was questioning his life choices and then just laughed.
Intermittent problems suck. All you can do is hope something obvious eventually happens to give you a clue. Speaking of which, that loose steering wheel is pretty scary! That really needs sorting out.
Your hard work and modesty inspire the RUclips community. Congrats!
Ray you are a legend.
Happy Tuesday at midnight from Hawaii.
See you net winter.. I'm in MinneSNOWda.
1. owner cleared the OBD2 codes
2. owner dumped the oil did not bring in for inspection
3. squeak on pulley
4. steering column issue
diag:
fix pulley that is squeaking
fix steering column
my diag:
until the pulley squeak is fixed i cant hear any clunk in the engine
also i am betting that the steering column issue is where the clunk is coming from
If it was the first oil change after the engine was installed some shavings are normal as things are breaking in
I'm sure this guy knows that lol
He literally says this as a possibility if you watched the video
All this and a Dave sighting. Can’t wait to see what you find with this truck.
Good job Detective Ray, as " I Detect, Therefore I am " !!
Good Morning To You🚗
Good morning Ray and family
Greetings: Gotta love the 'creative wiring '. Thx 4 the share.
Good morning 🌅
Good day to you and thank you for sharing the today's video I do enjoy keep up the great work brother
About a month ago, I replaced a pully and tensioner on my 2010 f150.
It was squealing and a knocking. After replacing the above parts with oem parts, all that noise went away. I keep up on all pro active maintenance and fluid changes bumer to bumper. 250k miles runs great. Love your videos, keep up the great work.
Old mechanic here. Pull the oil plug. It should have a magnet on it. If not get one that does. It will collect metal debrees and make it easy to detect trouble.
Welcoming back!
The customer kind of shot himself in the foot by clearing the codes and changing the oil and filter. Add that he may have already voided his warranty by pulling the oil pan himself. Not much you can do with it. The tiny bit of metal could be from cutting the filter open. Nothing you can submit to the warranty company that they'll accept. Customer pretty much screwed himself by messing with it. Close the hood and send it on its way.
I hope that Ray doesn't get blamed for not finding the fault because of that
Might be misremembering this myself, but didnt he say that the customer had taken it to a couple other places first and they couldn't figure it out? Wouldn't it be more likely they cleared code's and changed the oil/filter?
@@aqua-op
He stated that the customer said that he (the customer) found metal in the filter he changed. Of course, if that is the case, then he should have submitted the oil filter as evidence.
Warranty? This is a 2005
@@georgeburns7251
He has a reman engine. It has a warranty. He’s trying to get Ray to find something wrong so he can get a replacement or refund from the builders. Pay more attention to detail.
WOW rays repair and project farm all in one video cool….
From my observation, the amount of metal on that paper towel could have been produced by cutting the filter.
I agree. When Ray dislodged the media, he damaged the rubber membrane.
That was my conclusion as well
Not really, such cutters are not producing particles. But those metal pieces could be residue from mechining the engine or from new rod/crank bearings in breaking period.
Yes from cutting the filter
So by your logic, a regular kitchen can opener will put metal particulate contamination in your food? Because the tool Ray used is the same kind of cutter.
The last 20 secs or so you were using the glass cleaner correctly. You were trying to clean the wife units glasses. Too bad she still had them on.
😂
Thanks!
thank you
You rock , Ray! Don't let the bastards get you down. You must remember that.
Difficult, or impossible, to diag a symptom that is not occurring at the time...or infrequently to the owner. Parts cannon or guessing not the way. Even though that crank end play was within specs, I thought it was a lot. But not the problem. Your wanting to fix the tensioner noise and then trying to drive and possibly recreate the engine noise is the only way to proceed.
Thanks for the Lauren cameo, beautiful as ever. And her first camera operator time too. 😊
Many years ago when we were drag racing, we were told not to use Wix oil filters because they had a cotton type of material that would restrict the oil pressure. I don’t know about now.
Wix XP has better flow than a regular Wix. The XP has synthetic material designed to flow full synthetic oil. On a race engine, the Wix Racing filter would give the highest flow.
@shakerman55 wix xp is intended for extended oil changes. xp has bigger "holes" in the synthetic filter media, so it doesn't plug up as easily. HOWEVER, regular paper filter media WIX filter filters better than XP. That said, I don't understand why people don't run FilterMags or the equivalent magnets on the filter, if they are concerned about metal contamination.
It's usually the customer misdiagnosing where a sound is coming from, that gets ya chasing ghosts.
Ray, you and Lauren are just hilarious :D
Hi Ray Wife Unit and Dave excellent video on ford and as always you all be safe 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Nice one Ray an easy one
Retired Jeep tech reporting in. Had a customer bring a big ol' lifted XJ (old Cherokee) for overheating. 3 times, could not reproduce complaint. Turns out my guy was a nice customer and washed it before towing into the shop, and it just so happened he washed it good enough to unclog the radiator fins of mud, so it was able to stay cool by the time it got to me.
Hola Wife Unit, que gusto verte de nuevo hoy.
Hello Wife Unit, how nice to see you again today.😄😄😄👍👍👍
I know that when I first got my reman (5.7 Hemi) from Jasper over a year ago it was very loud with all kinds of noises. As it broke in all those noises smoothed out and went away. Now it's actually quieter than the original motor was back when my truck was brand new.
During that first 3 months I was sick about it. I thought they had sent me a piece of junk despite it actually performing okay. Now it is performing even better, and I'm getting 2 mpg better fuel mileage since it fully broke in. 1 mpg better than the original motor.
Ray, you didn't see any metal in the pleats of the filter, only after you deconstructed the filter; perhaps a few bits of the casing when the cutter cut through the case. (it's a theory anyway)
This is the most probable cause.
he cannot be expert witness in this engine warranty case
I had a Ford with a knock. Timing belt tensioner, I thought. It was the water pump bearings. They began banging the pump fins inside the pump occasinally, which stretched the belt. Finally it broke the belt. Mechanic put new pump on and belt. Gone again in 100 miles. Didn't tension it properly.
Always nice to see Lauren. Looking good. Lucky man, Ray.
"Little slivers". You also ripped the filter apart. Think they might have come from that?
"I've got wood.". How often have you announced that, Ray? 😁
I'd like to thank you for the video on the white Ford. Pick up with the black stuff off back. Fenders the oil filter. Check everything you did to that and showing people the videos. It shows that they're honest. Mechanics out there that people you can trust people. That look you in the face and a videos. And in person, that are doing the right thing. And you, sir, are one of them, thank you very much.
These engines have a history of going through oil pumps. They make updated oil pumps by the aftermarket ie Melling which address the issue.
Something does not seem right... Engine light is disabled,oil brand new and codes cleared? 🤨
That's what I was thinking. I'm surprised that Ray didn't troubleshoot that light.
The knock is probably the steering wheel! 🤣🤣
If you cut the end caps off the filter element, fold it all nice and neat by the pleats, then squeeze out all the oil in the vice you can see metal easier.
My wife had an 08 Santa Fe with the 3.3 and it used the cartridge style filter with the exposed pleats. Long story short, previous owner did not change oil; the oil passages that feed the VVT became plugged and car went into limp mode on us. I tore the engine down to a long block, cleaned everything i could access and when it was all said and done, i did oil changes every 1000 miles for 2 years with seafoam in every oil change. When i would change the oil, i inspected the filters and ALWAYS found large chunks of baked oil that the seafoam cleaned and dislodged from inside the engine. That tool would be extremely useful for other vehicles to monitor the engine health and cleanliness.
You can always put a magnet on the oil filter and see if something accumulates.
I had a similar situation on a standard transmission car. Turned out that the fly wheel bolts hadn’t been torqued correctly and it was wobbling making the knocking noise. Good job checking that flex plate! Ot many think of that.
Color (paint) fragments from filter exterior and small metal bits present from cutting open filter.
A simple oil sample taken and sent to a lab for around $30 will tell all with this engine. Ray I'm surprised you aren't a proponent of this or recommend it on your channel. I'm an engineer on tugboats and work on large marine diesel engines and we use oil analysis regularly as part of our regular maintenance program and to help diagnose issues with engines. Works so well I send in samples of oil at every oil change in my personal vehicles, boat, Harley and motorhome. I highly recommend people do this. $30 is very cheap insurance in the grand scheme of things. I use Oil Analyzers/Horizon Labs but there are a number of oil analysis labs out there.
yeah Have to agree the metal in the filter was miniscule won't warrant an engine break down. I would start by fixing the Check engine self test and the squeaky tensioner
I had an idler/tension wheel starting to squeal like that. It seemed to happen most after driving in the rain, which I guessed was due to water getting into the bearing.
While they're relatively cheap to replace, I decided to do a little experiment. I took the idler off the truck, lubed the bearing well with waterproof grease (boat trailer axle grease), installed a large washer (left over from a shock absorber replacement) to shield the bearing from any splash, then put it back on the truck. It still spins freely when checked and has been running quietly ever since... probably for 50K or 75K miles.
I do anticipate the tensioning spring will weaken eventually and require replacement, but was surprised how easily the squeal was fixed (with grease, not glass cleaner 🤔).
The engine is probably in its break-in period, and the owner is overly nervous that the engine may have problems ... and is looking for problems that doesn’t exist.
The number of pleats on the filter does not necessarily indicate the quality of the filter. You have to remove the filter media and measure the length and width to determine the area of the filter media.
Could the knock be the steering wheel?
I take the end caps off the pleats put the folded pleats in the vise squease the oil out when open you will seethe sparkly bit easier.
Great end of the video!
McGuier's Tire Shine makes that squeal go right away !!
So does belt dressing, and is cheaper...
Hey Everyone ! ! Grab a cup of coffee and enjoy to enigma that faces Ray.
Ray, I see you are in Bradenton. I provably went by your shop several times (or at least nearby) in my way from Venice to Tampa (I hate driving on the Interstate (too many idiots on that road).
As a semi-retired Instructor/trainer and Tech I love when people are shown comparisons.
Ford F-150. Have problems. Great video Ray. Like to see a video when if you fix the truck.
A old Truck Mechanic always went for Wix when He Could .He was the Best Mechanic I know
Changed often enough, it doesnt even matter what filter you run. From a mechanic.... i dont care to advertise anybodies sht, they aint paying me...
Derek isn’t that old
Good day Ray and hi to Dave
you already know the check engine lite has been defeated(?),the oil was fresh, the filter was fresh and the codes have been cleared. sure seems you are being "set up".
That’s the first thought I had. It’s like buying a car, taking it home and washing and then waxing it. Then driving the car back to the dealer to complain that they sold you a dirty car. All evidence has been “cleaned” up. 🤔
Hence why hes recording. Shows all his troubleshooting steps.
i hate to admit it but it does look this way now that you say this
I would have saved the used oil with the metal and brought it in ( assuming it's legitimate)
Bought the truck at a dealership with the engine light not on I thought it was good no engine light lol then I did research found out it's supposed to come on at first then I two weeks later started smoking out the exhaust like you wouldn't believe then started knocking got new engine it was junk leaking out rear main sent me new one slightly knocked but ran good 15 k into it I decided to just drive it now I'm fed up got new car try to change oil pan gasket didnt work sent it to ray not a set up
I have 3 fuel filters on my 05 5.8 cummins a 5 micron water separator with a drain and after that a 2 micron cat filter and the third filter is the stock location that’s a 5 micron filter and this has been on my truck at 2 yrs old and I bought this truck new !!
Ray if Lauren poke a hole in the water bottle cap she’ll win. The truck might need more miles on it to diagnose it
No way you can diagnose a noise with that squeezing going on! Every video I get more intrigued by the big box in the middle of the workshop…🤔 great video as always Ray. 👌
I use a magnet screwdriver just like you have lying on the workbench to see if the re is mag metal. If there is aluminum or non ferrous particles they might be visible.I use Blackstone lab for oil analysis for engines like this, they are a little slow but comprehensive. It also sounds like a bad bearing on the idler. Very common on these engines. Good job for troubleshooting, as you always do. Hope your finger doesn't fall off. LOL
You made the right call Ray can’t start a claim when you don’t know for certain
I use a clean wire brush on both sides of the belt. If the squeaking goes away, it's the belt itself. If not, it's probably the tensioner
As an industrial tech, i had one customer who sent a machine back several times at a pretty high cost each time for warranty work because of clunking and clicking noises. Never found a problem until a tech was in their area and stopped in to see the issue in its environment. They were letting the fluid go low causing the pump to suck air. It was randomly happening during breaks when the operator wasn't there to add fluid. The clunking and clicking was the air bubbles popping.
Ive also lost count of how many controllers have been sent back because of intermittent issues that turned out to be either normal (calibration) or customer caused (electrical noise).
Good morning Ray! I'd definitely ask how long ago that reman engine was put in. If it is a new install, then I'd say that metal the owner seen is probably from the rings seating and break in material. And if it's a new install and the owner did the first oil change, then that's what he was seeing!
My first thought is the knock they here is the steering
Take a sample of the oil and send it to a lab for analysis. And next time you install an oil filter, lube that gasket up first! Will make it easier to remove the filter next time. Filling it with oil if it mounts upright is also a good idea, to prevent the time the engine spins with no oil pressure.
See ya Ferd✌️
Shop Dog says, "Don't Worry, Be Happy."
It could've been his steering wheel tht he heard since it knocked when u pulled on it
The plastic shield under the oil filter does catch oil on the front, but only as you pull the filter out. at least on the 4WD 5.4, with a normal subframe
pan must be in place to catch oil from both sides
I think it's something else making the noise !!! 😊😊😊
Hmmmm, but what could it be? Hmmmm....🤔😂
@@92mrsrdb 😂😂😂
My dad showed me how to find a rod knock when I was 10. One ROCKS the throttle and if there is a lose rod you will hear it knock as the speed is increasing. It may be harder with a throttle by wire than just rocking the butterfly.
My favorite new term is "Forbidden Glitter" from the I Do Cars channel.
Not that you have time to watch, but Ford Boss Me cut apart a lot of different brands of filters to compare them, also has sent a lot of oil samples to Blackstone. Pretty interesting...
I think Ford Boss Me and Ray are friends through YT.
Ford Boss Me put a lot of effort into that test(sic). I appreciated it. In the end I stuck with what I’ve been doing for years. OEM filter and Penzoil Ultra every 5K.✌️
Had something like this happen to me once with a dealership / warranty issue: had a rattling throw out bearing, but the noise would only present itself while the engine was cold.
Managed to catch the sound on video and showed it to the tech there after they couldn't repeat the issue and that ended up being what they needed to see / hear to justify a replacement. Bearing that came out was completely toast, but had I not given them some video evidence they would have had to pull the transmission on a complete guess, which I wouldn't blame them for not wanting to do.
Might be worth asking your customer to keep their phone handy and record the noise they're talking about next time it happens, could provide you with the missing link on this unit
Ray, Please buy a head camera so that you can use both of your hand for us. [I get giddy with the unsteady camera movement]
good morning to you. I believe the phaser cams are in three valve engines and have no egr valve phaser engines also have aluminum valve covers. I never seen a 2005 f 150 with this configuration. hope you get to take it apart so we can get to the bottom of this.