I have both a purchased mag loop and a home-made mag loop. My home-made antenna is far superior in terms of performace. I have had a mag loop for several years now and swear by them. I live in an HOA that prohibits the installation of visible antennas so I have my antenna sitting right beside me inside. Works like a champ, I use a qrp rig and was able to do a clean sweep on 13 colonies. (From Texas) Never seem to have issues RX or TX people that don't like mag loops are most likely using them wrong. I have reached Africa, North Canada, all of the Caribbean, South America, Japan on a mag loop inside the house on 10 watts.
I have had just about all the mag loops at one time, have to agree on the Alex Loop, especially for quick deployment and ease of use, but has no 6 to 1 reduction tuning which really helps but the best I have used for all around home and indoor use has been the Chameleon F loop 3.0 which is their newest smaller tuning box model, for tuning That loop has been near perfect for initial tuning by ear, the ferrite beads on the coax they supply with the 12ft coax run virtually eliminates any hand capacitance, On coax coupling loops you can shape the coupling loop from a circle to more of an oval (compress it some ) and it improves the efficiency, I did not do it on my F-loop as it used a hard aluminum coupling loop but did do it on the Alex Loop since it is basically a stiff thick wire and was able to oval it. It works and RBN testing verified it, Both loops have been great tuning has been easy, and my performance inside has been unbelievable at times. It is amazing how swinging the loops sometimes just a few inches can be the difference between a qso and nothing, I am trying out the W2LI mag loop next, made by a local club project and sold direct or off of Ebay, The price is around $169 plus shipping although I maybe a tad more now since they just finished another limited production run, I can't wait to check it out and compare it I once used my Alex Loop inside a concrete gym complex and was demonstrating it at my swap table at a local hamfest and using SSB and 5 watts was working the Washington Salmon Run contest and worked about 20 stations , the hamfest crowd was amazed, All that being said most mag loops are probably way over priced but so are countless other portable antennas on the market so I guess it just depends on the need and if the cost is worth it, hi I am nearly a 99% CW op and CW and digital will always be the best modes for mag loops, Thanks for the video and hope you work a lot of DX 73 J
Seems like a great compact antenna. I recently bought a QRP transceiver as my first hf transceiver. I've had 2 QSOs so far. Thanks for the video. 73s de N7MRF. Washington state.
Hi Jeff.. fantastic demo on tuning this loop.. I've been considering the AL705 purchase.. I really like watching the scope noise peak move as you tune it.. that was a choice demo.. I see how your hand affects the tuning.. thank you for showing that.. It appears that a 6 inch plastic extension rod connected between the knob and the cap would be beneficial.. It would allow the hand to be away from the cap while tuning.. Thank you for sharing this.. Nice Job.. Kevin ~ k0klb
Informative video and good tip using the scope for tuning the loop - thanks. I usually just use the SWR meter to fine tune after peaking the noise level using a Chameleon F-Loop.
The commercial coax mag loops can get to a 1:1 swr- but that doesn’t mean they’re efficient. Dummy loads have a 1:1 swr. The efficiency of the typical coax mag loops on 40 meters is dismal- around 15%; it gets at bit better at 20 meters, close to 50% and improves to 85/90% as you get closer to 10 meters. You get some direction in the plane of the loop which can help null unwanted stations or noise- outside of their size it’s one of their key features. They can be interesting/fun antennas. Careful using FT8 to draw conclusions, even 1-2 watts of radiated power can get out pretty far and can fool you if dumping 10 watts into the antenna.
Some excellent points. As you point out, the SWR is not the definitive measure of success with a MagLoop (or any antenna). With previous MagLoops I found that the antennas were actually better at radiating than at receiving. I relate that to the small capture area of the antenna. Although some die-hard MagLoop enthusiasts will claim equal performance as full size antennas, I would like them to demonstrate with a good antenna shoot-out. Nonetheless, MagLoop antennas do have valuable niche uses.
@@tekspeditionplanet9109 They are kind of neat. You can set one up on a camera tripod, use it indoors/outside. I have an Alex loop and a chameleon. Performance is indistinguishable; but you really, really want a gear reduction on your capacitor. I am QRP almost exclusively, even at my QTH, with a flex 1500 @ 5w. I use an end-fed half wave for 40-20-15-10, it’s up about 50’, NE/SW broadside. I won my states QSO party this past year for QRP, blowing the old record away by something like 4x (I got like 250) the number of QSO’s and triple the points. Almost all on 40m. There is no way I could have done this with a 15% efficiency on 40m witha standard commercial coax loop. My ERP would have been 750mW, on SSB, or approx -9db under 5W - that WSPR territory. I have used them on 20m and got into Europe on SSB during the peak of the last solar cycle. You just can’t get around the physics of a short radiator for the band you’re broadcasting on. The other thing is that if you’re trying to hunt down stations across the band, like for parks on the air or something like that, you have to adjust that antenna every single time you change frequencies. For POTA, that’s almost 50 times on a busy weekend of hunting. No Fun. But, if you’re on a single frequency, ideally on 20m and shorter, calling CQ, oriented in the direction you want they’re definitely an option. The only thing the operator needs to ask themselves is why buy one for $300-$400, when a 31’ piece of wire, a 4:1 balun, and a SHORT run of coax (less than 10 ft) all of which can be had for $75 can let you work all bands with a tuner and near 100% efficiency. Throw it in a tree and go.
Antenna efficiency is directly proportional to a combination of area encompassed by the loop and the antenna conductor dimensions. Because of skin effect, a tube formed into the circle is vastly better than a wire in a circle. Because of this, I have made loops for each band of interest. The 10 meter loop is remarkably small, the 40 meter loop is about 10 feet in diameter and made of 5/8th inch copper tubing. I use the MFJ portable loop tuner since it uses variable capacitor for matching and another for tuning; no need to fiddle around with a small loop dangling inside the big loop. It is pretty easy to get a perfect match, no tuner needed, at any band for which you have made a loop.
I have an AlexLoop and it came with an accessory that you attach to the loop. It has a red LED that indicates when you reach optimal tuning. It is very helpful since my FT-817nd doesn't have an SWR meter. Thanks for the video.
Nice demo - have to say I think the Alexloop hampack is a superior magloop looking at ath AL-705. I've used it on several QRP PoTA activations and its done really well for rapid deployment. I would say the best advantage on the alexlooop is the gauge/tuning and the LED light showing the power coming thru. I appreciate your video for showing other tuning methods tho, something i will check out next time. Thanks again for good content ! 73 2E0FWE
I got a AL-705 magnetic loop for my IC-705. Got my first DX contact with it on 10m SSB one afternoon into Coasta Rica. I also got the Enhancement Kit from Alpha Antenna that gives 60 amd 80m. The Tuning Spacer from the Enhancement Kit work great with the standard configuration and gives it more bandwidth if you got the 15ft coax. Using the clips that come with the antenna isn't going to tune on 20m. Get the Tuning spacer and it will tune 20m. The Standard configuration tunes 40 and 10m to around a 1.2:1 SWR, maybe less. 12m will not tune because it's a small band. 15m is a bit difficult as well. I just use mine inside the house for listening to 40m when I get home from work in the morning. Haven't used it for SSB in quite some time. Might need to get it out on a good day. 73, W4ISB Mike in Tennessee.
Agree on the shaping of the coupling loop. I mention in the video to shape into a triangle to get a better coupling/SWR, which is along the lines of your egg shape comment. The idea is to increase the angle between the main loop and the coupling loop.
The best mag-loops are homemade, and a whole lot cheaper. Manufacturers are too cheap to make the conductor of their loop large enough in diameter to give them the extremely high Q they need for transmit efficiency, and narrowest bandwidth on reception. BTW, if doing hand tuning, use a flexible extension on the tuning knob. I'm also using a small variable capacitor in parallel for fine tuning.
"why has FT8 taken over ham radio?" During low sunspots; the narrow bandwidth and low data rate of FT8 permits contacts where voice would be impossible. Other modes are similar; Olivia can make contact when you cannot even see the signal on the waterfall. Olivia is a conversational mode; FT8 is for contacting only. There's another aspect; FT8 simultaneously decodes dozens of QSO's in the audio passband and you don't even have to receive on the same frequency you transmit (in fact, it is better if you "split"). "Have we lost the skill of just talking?" There is no WE. Only you know if you have lost the skill of just talking. But I take your meaning; carefully tuning across the band, listening, asking if a frequency is in use, calling CQ and giving people a chance to reply (might be they are tuning their antenna), seems less common. With waterfall displays in common use the thrill of "catching one" by careful tuning is not really necessary. You can still do it; turn off the waterfall.
@@sammiller6631 VarAC is catching on as a good HF chat app. Very robust data management; great weak signal performance. Built on top of VARA HF. But you have to buy a license to get full features.
![Lil Uzi Vert - Chill Bae [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/D7F42F_JM3U/mqdefault.jpg)
I have both a purchased mag loop and a home-made mag loop. My home-made antenna is far superior in terms of performace. I have had a mag loop for several years now and swear by them. I live in an HOA that prohibits the installation of visible antennas so I have my antenna sitting right beside me inside. Works like a champ, I use a qrp rig and was able to do a clean sweep on 13 colonies. (From Texas) Never seem to have issues RX or TX people that don't like mag loops are most likely using them wrong. I have reached Africa, North Canada, all of the Caribbean, South America, Japan on a mag loop inside the house on 10 watts.
I have had just about all the mag loops at one time, have to agree on the Alex Loop, especially for quick deployment and ease of use, but has no 6 to 1 reduction tuning which really helps but the best I have used for all around home and indoor use has been the Chameleon F loop 3.0 which is their newest smaller tuning box model, for tuning That loop has been near perfect for initial tuning by ear, the ferrite beads on the coax they supply with the 12ft coax run virtually eliminates any hand capacitance, On coax coupling loops you can shape the coupling loop from a circle to more of an oval (compress it some ) and it improves the efficiency, I did not do it on my F-loop as it used a hard aluminum coupling loop but did do it on the Alex Loop since it is basically a stiff thick wire and was able to oval it. It works and RBN testing verified it, Both loops have been great tuning has been easy, and my performance inside has been unbelievable at times. It is amazing how swinging the loops sometimes just a few inches can be the difference between a qso and nothing, I am trying out the W2LI mag loop next, made by a local club project and sold direct or off of Ebay, The price is around $169 plus shipping although I maybe a tad more now since they just finished another limited production run, I can't wait to check it out and compare it I once used my Alex Loop inside a concrete gym complex and was demonstrating it at my swap table at a local hamfest and using SSB and 5 watts was working the Washington Salmon Run contest and worked about 20 stations , the hamfest crowd was amazed, All that being said most mag loops are probably way over priced but so are countless other portable antennas on the market so I guess it just depends on the need and if the cost is worth it, hi I am nearly a 99% CW op and CW and digital will always be the best modes for mag loops, Thanks for the video and hope you work a lot of DX 73 J
Seems like a great compact antenna. I recently bought a QRP transceiver as my first hf transceiver. I've had 2 QSOs so far. Thanks for the video. 73s de N7MRF. Washington state.
Great video. Sold, Sold, Sold! thanks for the efforts you put into these videos. Can't wait to get the AL-705. DE K6WXZ. 73.
Hi Jeff.. fantastic demo on tuning this loop.. I've been considering the AL705 purchase.. I really like watching the scope noise peak move as you tune it.. that was a choice demo.. I see how your hand affects the tuning.. thank you for showing that.. It appears that a 6 inch plastic extension rod connected between the knob and the cap would be beneficial.. It would allow the hand to be away from the cap while tuning.. Thank you for sharing this.. Nice Job.. Kevin ~ k0klb
Informative video and good tip using the scope for tuning the loop - thanks. I usually just use the SWR meter to fine tune after peaking the noise level using a Chameleon F-Loop.
Good stuff!
The commercial coax mag loops can get to a 1:1 swr- but that doesn’t mean they’re efficient. Dummy loads have a 1:1 swr. The efficiency of the typical coax mag loops on 40 meters is dismal- around 15%; it gets at bit better at 20 meters, close to 50% and improves to 85/90% as you get closer to 10 meters. You get some direction in the plane of the loop which can help null unwanted stations or noise- outside of their size it’s one of their key features. They can be interesting/fun antennas. Careful using FT8 to draw conclusions, even 1-2 watts of radiated power can get out pretty far and can fool you if dumping 10 watts into the antenna.
Some excellent points. As you point out, the SWR is not the definitive measure of success with a MagLoop (or any antenna). With previous MagLoops I found that the antennas were actually better at radiating than at receiving. I relate that to the small capture area of the antenna. Although some die-hard MagLoop enthusiasts will claim equal performance as full size antennas, I would like them to demonstrate with a good antenna shoot-out. Nonetheless, MagLoop antennas do have valuable niche uses.
@@tekspeditionplanet9109 They are kind of neat. You can set one up on a camera tripod, use it indoors/outside. I have an Alex loop and a chameleon. Performance is indistinguishable; but you really, really want a gear reduction on your capacitor. I am QRP almost exclusively, even at my QTH, with a flex 1500 @ 5w. I use an end-fed half wave for 40-20-15-10, it’s up about 50’, NE/SW broadside. I won my states QSO party this past year for QRP, blowing the old record away by something like 4x (I got like 250) the number of QSO’s and triple the points. Almost all on 40m. There is no way I could have done this with a 15% efficiency on 40m witha standard commercial coax loop. My ERP would have been 750mW, on SSB, or approx -9db under 5W - that WSPR territory. I have used them on 20m and got into Europe on SSB during the peak of the last solar cycle. You just can’t get around the physics of a short radiator for the band you’re broadcasting on.
The other thing is that if you’re trying to hunt down stations across the band, like for parks on the air or something like that, you have to adjust that antenna every single time you change frequencies. For POTA, that’s almost 50 times on a busy weekend of hunting. No Fun. But, if you’re on a single frequency, ideally on 20m and shorter, calling CQ, oriented in the direction you want they’re definitely an option. The only thing the operator needs to ask themselves is why buy one for $300-$400, when a 31’ piece of wire, a 4:1 balun, and a SHORT run of coax (less than 10 ft) all of which can be had for $75 can let you work all bands with a tuner and near 100% efficiency. Throw it in a tree and go.
Antenna efficiency is directly proportional to a combination of area encompassed by the loop and the antenna conductor dimensions. Because of skin effect, a tube formed into the circle is vastly better than a wire in a circle.
Because of this, I have made loops for each band of interest. The 10 meter loop is remarkably small, the 40 meter loop is about 10 feet in diameter and made of 5/8th inch copper tubing. I use the MFJ portable loop tuner since it uses variable capacitor for matching and another for tuning; no need to fiddle around with a small loop dangling inside the big loop. It is pretty easy to get a perfect match, no tuner needed, at any band for which you have made a loop.
I have an AlexLoop and it came with an accessory that you attach to the loop. It has a red LED that indicates when you reach optimal tuning. It is very helpful since my FT-817nd doesn't have an SWR meter. Thanks for the video.
Thanks for the info!
Nice demo - have to say I think the Alexloop hampack is a superior magloop looking at ath AL-705. I've used it on several QRP PoTA activations and its done really well for rapid deployment. I would say the best advantage on the alexlooop is the gauge/tuning and the LED light showing the power coming thru. I appreciate your video for showing other tuning methods tho, something i will check out next time. Thanks again for good content ! 73 2E0FWE
Thanks for the feedback. Yes, this is a real bare-bones MagLoop with no frills. And that includes even a lack of a way to mount the antenna.
What's the mimimum and max capacity of this variable condensator of this antenna?
I don’t know the specs of this particular model. There are plans for building mag-loops on line.
I got a AL-705 magnetic loop for my IC-705. Got my first DX contact with it on 10m SSB one afternoon into Coasta Rica. I also got the Enhancement Kit from Alpha Antenna that gives 60 amd 80m.
The Tuning Spacer from the Enhancement Kit work great with the standard configuration and gives it more bandwidth if you got the 15ft coax. Using the clips that come with the antenna isn't going to tune on 20m. Get the Tuning spacer and it will tune 20m.
The Standard configuration tunes 40 and 10m to around a 1.2:1 SWR, maybe less. 12m will not tune because it's a small band. 15m is a bit difficult as well.
I just use mine inside the house for listening to 40m when I get home from work in the morning. Haven't used it for SSB in quite some time. Might need to get it out on a good day.
73, W4ISB
Mike in Tennessee.
Very good demo. Thanks for sharing.
I can get mine down to almost 1 to 1 SWR! It’s a lot to do with the shape of the loop, my case if I form an egg shape it seem to have the lowest SWR.
Hi Gerald... Good info.. thanks for sharing... Kevin ~ k0klb
Agree on the shaping of the coupling loop. I mention in the video to shape into a triangle to get a better coupling/SWR, which is along the lines of your egg shape comment. The idea is to increase the angle between the main loop and the coupling loop.
Can you use the AH-705 tuner with the AL-705 magnetic loop antenna? Does the manual tuner need to be removed from the mag loop?
The AL-705 has a built-in manual tuner. Due to the nature of the antenna I believe the AH-705 will not tune it.
I have a Chameleon F Loop Total. Love it.
The best mag-loops are homemade, and a whole lot cheaper. Manufacturers are too cheap to make the conductor of their loop large enough in diameter to give them the extremely high Q they need for transmit efficiency, and narrowest bandwidth on reception. BTW, if doing hand tuning, use a flexible extension on the tuning knob. I'm also using a small variable capacitor in parallel for fine tuning.
All good points! I sold my AL-705 and I'm now collecting the parts to build a mag loop at home.
Good demo....but....why has FT8 taken over ham radio? Have we lost the skill of just talking?
Yeah, I know what you mean. My reason for demonstrating with FT8 was the ability to display signal reception reports globally with PSKReporter.
"why has FT8 taken over ham radio?"
During low sunspots; the narrow bandwidth and low data rate of FT8 permits contacts where voice would be impossible. Other modes are similar; Olivia can make contact when you cannot even see the signal on the waterfall. Olivia is a conversational mode; FT8 is for contacting only. There's another aspect; FT8 simultaneously decodes dozens of QSO's in the audio passband and you don't even have to receive on the same frequency you transmit (in fact, it is better if you "split").
"Have we lost the skill of just talking?"
There is no WE. Only you know if you have lost the skill of just talking. But I take your meaning; carefully tuning across the band, listening, asking if a frequency is in use, calling CQ and giving people a chance to reply (might be they are tuning their antenna), seems less common. With waterfall displays in common use the thrill of "catching one" by careful tuning is not really necessary. You can still do it; turn off the waterfall.
JS8Call is for "just talking"
@@sammiller6631 VarAC is catching on as a good HF chat app. Very robust data management; great weak signal performance. Built on top of VARA HF. But you have to buy a license to get full features.
@@tekspeditionplanet9109 Buying a license is worth it for quality work. Too many people expect everything for free these days.