This is why I love Rouge One and Andor so much because every single firefight feels like a an actual skirmish or war that you'd see in an actual battle.
@@potkan07 That's probably because you don't like stories that take their time to build up and would rather have cheap popcorn films with flashy lights every 5 seconds.
Another thing about this scene I absolutely hate is the storm trooper formations. Seriously, common sense would lead you to think that “hey if there are like, 4 other troopers in front of me I can’t shoot because it would hit the guy in front of me.” Yet this entire sequence makes the trooper block each other from shooting. :/
They make the Stormtroopers so cartoonishly stupid. They go through years of military training and we're supposed to believe they'll all run into a room without using proper formations?
Stormtroopers are supposed to be the Empire’s Special Forces and they’re constantly treated like Red Shirts. I want nothing more than to one day see an actual hardcore squad of Stormtroopers. Give us a squad who eat lightning and crap thunder. Not Bad Batch, just normal humans who are actually the best of the best.
@@paradoxinraindrops141there's this fan film called IMPS: the Relentless, that follows an imperial detachment in an 80s military documentary format, I know fan films are not the same thing but the quality of it is really good as far as fan films are concerned
Another thing I'd like to point out is the severe underuse of the Purge Troopers. It would have been nice to see more than the two that were present at that battle, in fact maybe just a squad of Purge Troopers and Reva would have made for a cooler action scene. Not too different to how the Death Troopers faced off against the rebels in Rogue One. I mean come on, they're death squads used by the Inquisitors, tasked with hunting surviving Jedi. But nope! Once again, Fallen Order made much better use of the Empire's special forces. You would think a show would be more mindful of these aspects in comparison to a game.
Since Obi-Wan is way more powerful than Reva they could have just used the Purge troopers to help her in a 3 vs 1 scenario, that could have been cool. But that show look so cheap im not sure it would have change much
actually 1600s military tactics were much more organised you usually had your pikemen out front with their big long pikes providing cover for the musketeers who generally were on the flanks or behind the pikes or inside pikes squares.
0:05 See those canisters on the Troopers belts? Those are the standard issue grenades. The only real concern with grenades is the force user throwing them back out.
@@juancabardo21Right, when he takes time to force away grenades he’s leaving himself open to getting shot because he’s no longer focused on his lightsaber.
Oh my god, finally a video where someone acknowledges how little of a character Tala and her droid are. People complain how utterly cheap it was to pretend Wade's death was a huge moment, but the same is true for Tala, and the same trick is pulled here. Even though she's had way more screen time, she has just as little character.
The writing simply did not compel us to care about any of the characters. They had plenty of time (Tala appears in part 3 and dies in part 5), but just failed to create any emotional bond.
''You forgot the detonators''' That would be a reasonable explanation, if only every stormtrooper in the scene didn't have something visible on their bodies that's been canonically confirmed to be an extremely powerful detonator. To be fair though, it's not like the movies and shows we've gotten prior to Kenobi have actually acknowledged the fact that that funny looking cylinder on the back of their belts is a thermal det, I don't think I've ever seen one being used apart from the clone version. There might be a scene where they use it in Rebels, but I've only seen two seasons of that show due to the rest being unavailable in my country.
I was going to say that they get used in Andor, and they *might*, but it turns out what I remembered was that a crate of them secondaried after the kid threw a bomb in the fight at the end. They're used in Jedi Fallen Order/Survivor, I'm pretty sure.
I keep forgetting I’m not watching a mega big youtuber when I watch Samwise’s videos. Incredible content, basically Star Wars version of cinema sins, but also good and more focused in analysis over humor.
Really excellent points. Why does Obi Wan never seem to remember that he is a Jedi master? I don’t care how out of practice you are. You can easily handle some stormtroopers in a narrow hallway and allow the women with children to actually escape. That sort of position is a dream as a hero in the original Battlefront 2.
Tala and the loader droid's death actually made me a little sad, but only because it was one of the few elements of the show I liked and thought had potential. Instead, they died somewhat meaninglessly and Tala blew herself up specifically instead of throwing the detonator to take out as many stormtroopers as possible
For real. I didn't show it in the video, but the scene soon after this where Vader pulls down the (empty) ship with the Force looks absolutely atrocious. It's one of the most obvious green screens I've ever seen.
Almost all of the visuals were terrible. I can't help but compare the scene where Obi-Wan's ship is being chased by the Star Destroyer with the very first scene of the original Star Wars movie. In 1977...the latter looks SO much better in every way. And directed with so much more excitement and tension. Obi-Wan is an embarrassment on every level. Really destroyed my faith in Disney's handling of Star Wars, even more than the sequel trilogy.
Well said, Master Samwise. No cover-use or not using the cannon more really hurt the battle. 7:37 Indeed, reminds me of poor Wade from the Fortress rescue. Also I think the budget wasn't there to have Reva forceleap to Obi's position. I really wish there was clone wars era wreckage littered about, this is taking place on Jabiim afterall. (one of the Republic's costliest battles)
Tbh, this whole breach scene and the escape - which was supposed to be the payoff from the last multiple episodes - was extremely underwhelming, nonsensical, and infuriating to me all at once. I really agreed with so many of your points … Especially the shields! I thought that was such a wasted opportunity as well. Maybe it was just meant to be a call back, but either way it kinda is ruined by how they just ran out in the open like you mentioned! “You’re not K-2SO dude” 😂 Ugh. The show had such potential, a wide audience that was tuned into it. Yet, the execution still failed on so many fronts.
You know, I rarely notice shaky-cam as being particularly egregious, but as that scene was playing, I literally had to pause and scroll down before restarting so that the video was out of view. I was getting a headache.
If Tala had enough energy left in her to pose dramatically, she had enough to throw the thermal detonator down the hall which would have resulted in many more enemy casualties and maybe even killing Reva.
They could have had thier cake and eat it too if they could choreograph instead of just do shaky cam. Obi-Wan is known for keeping his clones alive with the sheer power of blaster blocking.
Yeah the battle choreographer for this whole show kind of dropped the ball. Even down to the end where Obi Wan says “I will do what I must” a second time and then just doesn’t finish the job out of choice. Would’ve been much better if their separation was forced.
The funniest thing about the thermal detonators bit is the fact that those cylindrical cases on the belts of Stormtroopers are thermal detonators and not one of them used it. This is bad writing.
It's the basic incompetence that's commonplace at Disney. They have a threat bigger than the heroes can handle, the natural thing to do is to have the heroes run (if they can) or hit n run and hope majority survive. Disney in it's infinite wisdom just simply can't do this. Either the big threat is toppled immediately or it's flat out forgotten about, hoping the audience doesn't notice. This clip gave me a headache just deciphering all the stupid.
The purge troopers were completely useless in this show. They could have a few of them help Reva in a fight against Obi Wan since that's their job, but they are treated like normal storm troopers.
Also where are all their cool weapons? They just have standard issue death trooper rifles in this and not modified DC 15As or their awesome melee weapons
true, wish we saw a bunch take their electrostaffs and go up against Kenobi all at once, giving us both a sensical battle AND an awesome lightsaber duel similar to the Obi-Wan VS Magnaguards we weren’t able to see
I swear they made this show bad on purpose. They knew people would watch it anyway simply because of the returning actors and the idea of an Obi-Wan Vader rematch. They knew the show would be highly profitable regardless of the entertainment quality, so they gave it a low budget and put minimal effort into the production. Thus we get the most disappointing piece of Star Wars entertainment ever made. So much potential completely wasted by Disney's greed and lack of creativity.
Honestly, a sensible battle tactic would be for the storm troopers to form a semicircle in front of the door, blow it open then saturate the room with blaster bolts for a few seconds. Instead they just... charge in... getting mowed down by people in rags STANDING OUT IN THE FUCKING OPEN!
I mean a blaster bolt is only really super effective when it makes contact with squishies or delicate stuff it can essentially overload/melt. I would imagine the most an inert slab of metal would do is get hot after being hit a few times.
I like your take, But in honestly, I think the empire wanted to capture them, FROM Jedi Survivor, we now know that the REAL Path goes through Jedda, and Saw Garrera is helping protect that path, which from Jedda leads to Tanalor
If the stormtroopers had just lined up behind the wall as cover and threw out their grenades while the giant cannon provided covering fire, the battle would have been over in 5 minutes at most
So a armored trained soldier "dies" in one shot to the arm but a mother with no armor survives getting shot at her belly? adding to that, the stormtroopers are out of commission in one hit. but Talla survives long enough to kamikaze them !! XD
I can imagine all the stunt folk heaving a big sigh when the stunt coordinator laid out the scenes. "Really? ...well that's what they are paying us for I guess."
Pretty much every writing and story decision in this show was bad, it really sucks that they wasted the amazing talent and potential of everyone else who worked on this show.
I miss scenes like Duel of the Fates. The whole 3rd act where it builds up to Mauls entrance was epic. Then the saber duel that was just a real treat for any 13 year old to feast his eyes on.
@@master_samwise The fire fight is pretty good too. You may not care about every detail but you know the stakes and the heroes even think outside the box. For all the missteps George took he made sure to back it up with the where, why and how.
I mean, if we're giving the stormtroopers a competence boost, we might as well also say the rebels would be behind cover with multiple chokepoints to fall back to, and could absolutely make forcing that tunnel suuuck, and that's before we think about Kenobi.
This is why I love Rouge One and Andor so much because every single firefight feels like a an actual skirmish or war that you'd see in an actual battle.
Absolutely. I will be doing a breakdown of the Rogue One battle for sure. Hopefully some from Andor too... just have to find the time to watch it.
@@master_samwise Trust me, you'll love it. It's so much better than any other Star Wars show it's kind of hard to believe
@@master_samwiseI’d make it a priority. It’s basically the inverse of Kenobi- no shaky camera- everything has a purpose etc
Andor was boring asf
@@potkan07 That's probably because you don't like stories that take their time to build up and would rather have cheap popcorn films with flashy lights every 5 seconds.
Another thing about this scene I absolutely hate is the storm trooper formations. Seriously, common sense would lead you to think that “hey if there are like, 4 other troopers in front of me I can’t shoot because it would hit the guy in front of me.” Yet this entire sequence makes the trooper block each other from shooting. :/
Yeah you'd think they'd move in some sort of coordinated fashion, but nope, they all just shuffle toward the doors and shoot haphazardly.
They make the Stormtroopers so cartoonishly stupid. They go through years of military training and we're supposed to believe they'll all run into a room without using proper formations?
Stormtroopers are supposed to be the Empire’s Special Forces and they’re constantly treated like Red Shirts.
I want nothing more than to one day see an actual hardcore squad of Stormtroopers. Give us a squad who eat lightning and crap thunder. Not Bad Batch, just normal humans who are actually the best of the best.
@@paradoxinraindrops141there's this fan film called IMPS: the Relentless, that follows an imperial detachment in an 80s military documentary format, I know fan films are not the same thing but the quality of it is really good as far as fan films are concerned
Another thing I'd like to point out is the severe underuse of the Purge Troopers. It would have been nice to see more than the two that were present at that battle, in fact maybe just a squad of Purge Troopers and Reva would have made for a cooler action scene. Not too different to how the Death Troopers faced off against the rebels in Rogue One. I mean come on, they're death squads used by the Inquisitors, tasked with hunting surviving Jedi. But nope! Once again, Fallen Order made much better use of the Empire's special forces. You would think a show would be more mindful of these aspects in comparison to a game.
And I would actually buy obi wan struggling against purge troopers
Since Obi-Wan is way more powerful than Reva they could have just used the Purge troopers to help her in a 3 vs 1 scenario, that could have been cool. But that show look so cheap im not sure it would have change much
actually 1600s military tactics were much more organised you usually had your pikemen out front with their big long pikes providing cover for the musketeers who generally were on the flanks or behind the pikes or inside pikes squares.
I'm pretty sure pike and shot typically had the pike *behind* the muskets. Those things are pretty long.
0:05 See those canisters on the Troopers belts? Those are the standard issue grenades. The only real concern with grenades is the force user throwing them back out.
There is a loot of star wars movies around but I never seen one of those being used.
true. but if a few dozen stormtroopers chuck their grenades all at once onto the ground, even kenobi wouldn’t last long
@@juancabardo21Right, when he takes time to force away grenades he’s leaving himself open to getting shot because he’s no longer focused on his lightsaber.
@@wolftamer5463 great logic right there
Oh my god, finally a video where someone acknowledges how little of a character Tala and her droid are. People complain how utterly cheap it was to pretend Wade's death was a huge moment, but the same is true for Tala, and the same trick is pulled here. Even though she's had way more screen time, she has just as little character.
The writing simply did not compel us to care about any of the characters. They had plenty of time (Tala appears in part 3 and dies in part 5), but just failed to create any emotional bond.
Speak for yourself, wade was my hero
@@leonrussell9607Wade was the hero that we needed, but didn't deserve
''You forgot the detonators'''
That would be a reasonable explanation, if only every stormtrooper in the scene didn't have something visible on their bodies that's been canonically confirmed to be an extremely powerful detonator.
To be fair though, it's not like the movies and shows we've gotten prior to Kenobi have actually acknowledged the fact that that funny looking cylinder on the back of their belts is a thermal det, I don't think I've ever seen one being used apart from the clone version. There might be a scene where they use it in Rebels, but I've only seen two seasons of that show due to the rest being unavailable in my country.
I think Rogue One might be the only movie they actually use those.
I was going to say that they get used in Andor, and they *might*, but it turns out what I remembered was that a crate of them secondaried after the kid threw a bomb in the fight at the end.
They're used in Jedi Fallen Order/Survivor, I'm pretty sure.
I keep forgetting I’m not watching a mega big youtuber when I watch Samwise’s videos. Incredible content, basically Star Wars version of cinema sins, but also good and more focused in analysis over humor.
My friend you are too kind! I'm glad you enjoy the videos!
@@master_samwise Great stuff, sub'd.
Really excellent points. Why does Obi Wan never seem to remember that he is a Jedi master? I don’t care how out of practice you are. You can easily handle some stormtroopers in a narrow hallway and allow the women with children to actually escape. That sort of position is a dream as a hero in the original Battlefront 2.
I love how after all the criticism you actually propose a better alternative. You rock!
Tala and the loader droid's death actually made me a little sad, but only because it was one of the few elements of the show I liked and thought had potential. Instead, they died somewhat meaninglessly and Tala blew herself up specifically instead of throwing the detonator to take out as many stormtroopers as possible
Loader droid had some potential, but it wasn't given enough time to actually develop into a character I cared about.
tbh i felt so sad for loader droid, bro was a real unit
I still can't believe somebody was able to make a million-dollars production look like it had a 20$ budget.
For real. I didn't show it in the video, but the scene soon after this where Vader pulls down the (empty) ship with the Force looks absolutely atrocious. It's one of the most obvious green screens I've ever seen.
Ewan, Hayden, Reva, and the director probably ate up the budget.
Almost all of the visuals were terrible. I can't help but compare the scene where Obi-Wan's ship is being chased by the Star Destroyer with the very first scene of the original Star Wars movie. In 1977...the latter looks SO much better in every way. And directed with so much more excitement and tension.
Obi-Wan is an embarrassment on every level. Really destroyed my faith in Disney's handling of Star Wars, even more than the sequel trilogy.
Well said, Master Samwise. No cover-use or not using the cannon more really hurt the battle.
7:37 Indeed, reminds me of poor Wade from the Fortress rescue. Also I think the budget wasn't there to have Reva forceleap to Obi's position.
I really wish there was clone wars era wreckage littered about, this is taking place on Jabiim afterall. (one of the Republic's costliest battles)
God I miss the Andor fights
Tbh, this whole breach scene and the escape - which was supposed to be the payoff from the last multiple episodes - was extremely underwhelming, nonsensical, and infuriating to me all at once.
I really agreed with so many of your points … Especially the shields! I thought that was such a wasted opportunity as well. Maybe it was just meant to be a call back, but either way it kinda is ruined by how they just ran out in the open like you mentioned!
“You’re not K-2SO dude” 😂
Ugh. The show had such potential, a wide audience that was tuned into it. Yet, the execution still failed on so many fronts.
You know, I rarely notice shaky-cam as being particularly egregious, but as that scene was playing, I literally had to pause and scroll down before restarting so that the video was out of view. I was getting a headache.
It's obnoxious, right? I don't understand why it has to be that way.
You deserve so many more subs man, this content is great, especially at the speed you're pumping it out at.
I appreciate it!
This is a chokepoint that would make a Spartan hard. How could they lose? Especially with a Jedi?
If Tala had enough energy left in her to pose dramatically, she had enough to throw the thermal detonator down the hall which would have resulted in many more enemy casualties and maybe even killing Reva.
They could have had thier cake and eat it too if they could choreograph instead of just do shaky cam. Obi-Wan is known for keeping his clones alive with the sheer power of blaster blocking.
Yeah the battle choreographer for this whole show kind of dropped the ball. Even down to the end where Obi Wan says “I will do what I must” a second time and then just doesn’t finish the job out of choice. Would’ve been much better if their separation was forced.
The republic had the zilo brast scales at that point
The funniest thing about the thermal detonators bit is the fact that those cylindrical cases on the belts of Stormtroopers are thermal detonators and not one of them used it. This is bad writing.
The only fighting experience I have is self taught nerf tactics, and even I have better since than those guys.
Hmmm, clone trooper shields in that fight scene, good idea
It's the basic incompetence that's commonplace at Disney. They have a threat bigger than the heroes can handle, the natural thing to do is to have the heroes run (if they can) or hit n run and hope majority survive. Disney in it's infinite wisdom just simply can't do this. Either the big threat is toppled immediately or it's flat out forgotten about, hoping the audience doesn't notice. This clip gave me a headache just deciphering all the stupid.
Colonial militaries had more formation than the stormtroopers
This fight looks like mine lego battles when i was 9
The purge troopers were completely useless in this show. They could have a few of them help Reva in a fight against Obi Wan since that's their job, but they are treated like normal storm troopers.
Yep exactly. Wasted opportunity to see Obi and Reva duel with the Purge Troopers making it a fair fight.
Also where are all their cool weapons? They just have standard issue death trooper rifles in this and not modified DC 15As or their awesome melee weapons
true, wish we saw a bunch take their electrostaffs and go up against Kenobi all at once, giving us both a sensical battle AND an awesome lightsaber duel similar to the Obi-Wan VS Magnaguards we weren’t able to see
I swear they made this show bad on purpose. They knew people would watch it anyway simply because of the returning actors and the idea of an Obi-Wan Vader rematch. They knew the show would be highly profitable regardless of the entertainment quality, so they gave it a low budget and put minimal effort into the production. Thus we get the most disappointing piece of Star Wars entertainment ever made. So much potential completely wasted by Disney's greed and lack of creativity.
Honestly, a sensible battle tactic would be for the storm troopers to form a semicircle in front of the door, blow it open then saturate the room with blaster bolts for a few seconds.
Instead they just... charge in... getting mowed down by people in rags STANDING OUT IN THE FUCKING OPEN!
I mean a blaster bolt is only really super effective when it makes contact with squishies or delicate stuff it can essentially overload/melt. I would imagine the most an inert slab of metal would do is get hot after being hit a few times.
I like your take, But in honestly, I think the empire wanted to capture them, FROM Jedi Survivor, we now know that the REAL Path goes through Jedda, and Saw Garrera is helping protect that path, which from Jedda leads to Tanalor
Especially after playing in a lot of clone wars battle sim games, this is just hard to watch
Believe me, it was even harder to watch it 50x while editing this video.
I love this
In regards to shaky cam: yes. Battlestar Galactica.
In the beginning of the video you can see a stormtrooper kick Riva's lightsaber
If the stormtroopers had just lined up behind the wall as cover and threw out their grenades while the giant cannon provided covering fire, the battle would have been over in 5 minutes at most
Why didnt tala use the detonator as soon as the door opened.
The troopers were so packed thay woulda at least killed half of em
Early clone wars/ geonosis battle syndrome
Nobody took cover because they knew stormtroopers could never hit anything
Wow, they took a meaningless fight between characters we barely know and managed to make it even less compelling than it should have been... 👏
Common samwise W
I hear you talking, but all I can focus on is how BAD that shaky cam is.
Why don't they just make body armor out of whatever lightweight, invincible shit they make those shields out of?
I think it takes more skill yo not shoot a single path member then to hit multiple
So a armored trained soldier "dies" in one shot to the arm but a mother with no armor survives getting shot at her belly?
adding to that, the stormtroopers are out of commission in one hit. but Talla survives long enough to kamikaze them !! XD
Wow I did not expect a comment on THIS video today.
@@master_samwise i am binging your entire channel XD
I can imagine all the stunt folk heaving a big sigh when the stunt coordinator laid out the scenes. "Really? ...well that's what they are paying us for I guess."
Pretty much every writing and story decision in this show was bad, it really sucks that they wasted the amazing talent and potential of everyone else who worked on this show.
I miss scenes like Duel of the Fates. The whole 3rd act where it builds up to Mauls entrance was epic. Then the saber duel that was just a real treat for any 13 year old to feast his eyes on.
Absolutely. The prequels had many, many problems (writing, characters, etc...) but damn if that duel with Maul wasn't incredibly directed and scored.
@@master_samwise The fire fight is pretty good too. You may not care about every detail but you know the stakes and the heroes even think outside the box. For all the missteps George took he made sure to back it up with the where, why and how.
And people take cover (except clones on geonosis, but that makes sense cuz the jedi were not prepared to be generals)
@@gamervet4760 zero words - endless stakes - 5 minutes of high quality combat
@@Philipp3022 There were stakes. That's why it's called duel of the fates.
The scene in a real war scenario would have resulted in storm troopers in formation mowing down a bunch of wanna be rebels in like 5 seconds
I mean, if we're giving the stormtroopers a competence boost, we might as well also say the rebels would be behind cover with multiple chokepoints to fall back to, and could absolutely make forcing that tunnel suuuck, and that's before we think about Kenobi.
and the rebels here weren’t even trained, it makes every imperial soldier here look incompetent and stupid.
Horrible. Kenobi felt like the laziest Star Wars project to date.
no one hates starwars more than starwars fans
No one hates *Disney Star Wars* more than Star Wars fans
No one repeats the same worthless mantra than shills
I cant imagine how stupid the actors must've felt while filming