Catapults and trebuchets in Stronghold are nearly identical to onagers and trebuchets in AoE2: the first unit is good against mass units and deals splash damage, the latter has greater range and slower attack rate
in my experience, there is no situation in online play in which trebuchets beat catapults. my friends and I have resorted to outright banning catapults every game just because they are so ridiculously broken. any game just devolves into a catapult spam and there is no point in building defences anymore. I would so hope that, one day, firefly releases a stronghold crusader rework that balances units and game mechanics and fixes the outdated (and honestly often broken) controls. even with all the rough edges on this game tho, there is just no game like stronghold crusader...
The only way would be a cursed wall of never ending towers with ballistas on top but it would just take the fun out of the game just spaming fireballistas and tower ballistas. At a point the amount of bolts shot by those ballistas would shred the speakers imagine 100 tower ballistas and 70 fireballistas just shooting and shooting. Man that would be a complete earrape 😂😂
imo, catapults should have a much higher cost (at least 500 gold for each), a longer reload time (similar to that of trebuchets), and a slower movement speed (similar to that of fire ballistas) for them to be balanced
After years hearing that music filled my ears with hysteric emotions. I'm suprised that a fairly sized community is still active for this game and am proud.
the value is not "random" but rather calculated in a location-based way. Each shot has a base damage, and based on the location of the hit, the collateral damage is dealt on tiles around the main hit. If those tiles are part of the same building, the building takes more damage. For trebs this is 60 base, 30 collateral damage, for catapults its 20 base, 10 collateral damage. For example hitting a building from corner with a treb would do 60+(30*4)=180 damage, an edge hit would do 60+(30*6)=240 damage, and a center hit would do 60+(30*9)=330 damage. Similarly for catapults, the corner hit is 20+(10*4)=60, edge hit is 20+(10*6)=80, and a center hit is 20+(10*9)=110 damage. Though you almost never get a center hit with catapults because they dont shoot their rocks too high. It usually happens when you hit over low walls/or shoot on enemy buildings from up a cliff. Basically if you hit a building from a corner you do the minimum damage, if you hit the edge you do the average damage, if you hit in the middle of the building you do the maximum damage.
2:30 Trebs can one-shoot tower ballista. If you built it in about ¾ of max range to the enemy tower and order to shoot the area behind it, the stone will land on the top of tower and kill ballista.
On the Crusader Extreme trail I always used trebuchets to take out enemy outposts fairly early in the game, since the maps have tons of mountains around you and enemies, or you often have a wall placed and a trebuchet behind it can be safe from any enemy arrows/units while damaging everything. I like trebuchets because of that, and I'd rather stay away from cheesing the game with an army of catapults.
It's very obvious to me the devs designed this game for a much smaller scale. In a low economy situation where you can only build a few siege engines and only have to worry about taking down one castle, the range and high damage of treb clearly is better. I think this was clearly the case during Stronghold 1's final campaign mission. But when Crusader comes around with each player getting essentially infinite gold and stone, the mobility and speediness of catapult reigns supreme. The designer clearly didn't intend to make catapult an anti mass infantry unit lol. Stone was supposed to be very hard to get.
Massed catapults can kill themselves (as well as other units, for example when paired with shields) with a bit of bad luck, especially on uneven terrain. You also have to grind through every building between the catapult and your intended target, while the treb doesn't care and can just yeet that boulder right into the granary, or bessy into the lord's chambers.
army of catapults can raze to the ground directional castles (like sheriff, building only in one direction, not all around his keep) and keep moving to the next target, however if you play safer and slower, putting trebuchet just so it has enough range to destroy enemy granary or shoot at weapon crafters might cripple AI enough to win a match. Ai will continuously rebuild granary and buy food to keep peasants happy and if you destroy it over and over again, AI will lose a lot of gold. Weapon smiths cost money to build, so having trebuchet on auto attack around those buildings will also drain their money.
I have a tendency to only use trebuchets as a defensive siege engine. I place them on the inside of my castle walls and then throw rocks and cows at approaching armies
Trebuchets feel more like a crusade. In Multiplayer bootstrap trebs are far superior to cats, while having much higher cost, because they can easily snipe towers and one shot watchtower, which could reduce the HP of the units on it to 50%. And since there are much more tactical mountains it's far better to invest in them in oppose to catapults. In Vanilla and even peacetime it's kinda obvious cause of the flat terrain in almost all maps.
Trebuchets can outrange ballistas, I just tested it. Test the max range of ballistas/mangonels by slowly walking forward with a unit. When they start shooting at you, back away one tile and build the trebuchets there. Another advantage is that trebuchets can attack buildings behind walls if the enemy keeps rebuilding the walls. You already mention it when talking about terrain, but it's also useful here, especially when the better stone efficiency might become a factor if the enemy keeps rebuilding walls.
If you dont want to do the same thing everytime, the Trebuchet is very cool, but in relation you just go 30 catapults + shilds and boom there is no castle more. But with Trebuchets you can have a cooler game
If firefly would actually make a mod for this game or a patch smth so spearmen can run all the time like macemen, trebuchets move, healers, slingers to have more range and maybe flamethrower more range but it might make them super op since fire in sch 1 is like medieval napalm even greek fire is nothing compared to it(since it was mainly used in ships and not openly in battlefields).
Well triboches are good in The big one, because you can build a wall around them and permanently shoot the wazirs granary so he stops attacking because he runs out of Gold
Catapults are better in Crusader since you can build however many you'd like. Trebuchets, however, are invaluable Stronghold 1 due to incredible range.
hey man, I'm super new to the game and I wanna play multiplayer online with my friend to start learning. could you give us an updated tutorial on how to set up multiplayer as well how to play the game from a beginner point?
I don't recommend using trebuchets most of the time. Of course they have a higher range and can target the specific selected building more than catapults but actually their lake of mobility makes them lose the competition most of the times.
Catapults and trebuchets in Stronghold are nearly identical to onagers and trebuchets in AoE2: the first unit is good against mass units and deals splash damage, the latter has greater range and slower attack rate
2 my favourite games!!
in my experience, there is no situation in online play in which trebuchets beat catapults. my friends and I have resorted to outright banning catapults every game just because they are so ridiculously broken. any game just devolves into a catapult spam and there is no point in building defences anymore.
I would so hope that, one day, firefly releases a stronghold crusader rework that balances units and game mechanics and fixes the outdated (and honestly often broken) controls. even with all the rough edges on this game tho, there is just no game like stronghold crusader...
The controls suck thats right. Micromanagement in this game is a pain in the ass
The only way would be a cursed wall of never ending towers with ballistas on top but it would just take the fun out of the game just spaming fireballistas and tower ballistas. At a point the amount of bolts shot by those ballistas would shred the speakers imagine 100 tower ballistas and 70 fireballistas just shooting and shooting. Man that would be a complete earrape 😂😂
imo, catapults should have a much higher cost (at least 500 gold for each), a longer reload time (similar to that of trebuchets), and a slower movement speed (similar to that of fire ballistas) for them to be balanced
After years hearing that music filled my ears with hysteric emotions. I'm suprised that a fairly sized community is still active for this game and am proud.
the value is not "random" but rather calculated in a location-based way. Each shot has a base damage, and based on the location of the hit, the collateral damage is dealt on tiles around the main hit. If those tiles are part of the same building, the building takes more damage. For trebs this is 60 base, 30 collateral damage, for catapults its 20 base, 10 collateral damage.
For example hitting a building from corner with a treb would do 60+(30*4)=180 damage, an edge hit would do 60+(30*6)=240 damage, and a center hit would do 60+(30*9)=330 damage. Similarly for catapults, the corner hit is 20+(10*4)=60, edge hit is 20+(10*6)=80, and a center hit is 20+(10*9)=110 damage. Though you almost never get a center hit with catapults because they dont shoot their rocks too high. It usually happens when you hit over low walls/or shoot on enemy buildings from up a cliff.
Basically if you hit a building from a corner you do the minimum damage, if you hit the edge you do the average damage, if you hit in the middle of the building you do the maximum damage.
Thanks. Triggered me slightly that he didn't test against walls ^^
2:30 Trebs can one-shoot tower ballista. If you built it in about ¾ of max range to the enemy tower and order to shoot the area behind it, the stone will land on the top of tower and kill ballista.
On the Crusader Extreme trail I always used trebuchets to take out enemy outposts fairly early in the game, since the maps have tons of mountains around you and enemies, or you often have a wall placed and a trebuchet behind it can be safe from any enemy arrows/units while damaging everything.
I like trebuchets because of that, and I'd rather stay away from cheesing the game with an army of catapults.
Yeah trebs were really useful on extreme!
*doesnt want to use catapult cheese*
*proceeds to do trebuchet cheese*
@@majdavlk649 to each their cheese
@@fuyoutubeck i like niva and hermelins
@@majdavlk649 what are those ?
It's very obvious to me the devs designed this game for a much smaller scale. In a low economy situation where you can only build a few siege engines and only have to worry about taking down one castle, the range and high damage of treb clearly is better. I think this was clearly the case during Stronghold 1's final campaign mission. But when Crusader comes around with each player getting essentially infinite gold and stone, the mobility and speediness of catapult reigns supreme. The designer clearly didn't intend to make catapult an anti mass infantry unit lol. Stone was supposed to be very hard to get.
Yeah true, trebs are a lot more stone efficient too
well having that the Crusader was at first just an addon to SH1, it seems legit. SH1 is much, much smaller scale.
Massed catapults can kill themselves (as well as other units, for example when paired with shields) with a bit of bad luck, especially on uneven terrain.
You also have to grind through every building between the catapult and your intended target, while the treb doesn't care and can just yeet that boulder right into the granary, or bessy into the lord's chambers.
army of catapults can raze to the ground directional castles (like sheriff, building only in one direction, not all around his keep) and keep moving to the next target, however if you play safer and slower, putting trebuchet just so it has enough range to destroy enemy granary or shoot at weapon crafters might cripple AI enough to win a match.
Ai will continuously rebuild granary and buy food to keep peasants happy and if you destroy it over and over again, AI will lose a lot of gold. Weapon smiths cost money to build, so having trebuchet on auto attack around those buildings will also drain their money.
I really liked your sense of humor on the start :D
I have a tendency to only use trebuchets as a defensive siege engine. I place them on the inside of my castle walls and then throw rocks and cows at approaching armies
I love that tactic... But do not do it myself, for some reason... :p
It is rather interesting to hear a computer voice saying god damnit.
Trebuchets feel more like a crusade.
In Multiplayer bootstrap trebs are far superior to cats, while having much higher cost, because they can easily snipe towers and one shot watchtower, which could reduce the HP of the units on it to 50%. And since there are much more tactical mountains it's far better to invest in them in oppose to catapults. In Vanilla and even peacetime it's kinda obvious cause of the flat terrain in almost all maps.
Yeah I've seen them used in bootstrap matches, Other than maps I wasn't sure what else was changed in bootstrap
@@Jefflenious Prices (20 stone, 250 gold), Sone Refill (20 stone for 10 shots) and range
Trebuchets can outrange ballistas, I just tested it. Test the max range of ballistas/mangonels by slowly walking forward with a unit. When they start shooting at you, back away one tile and build the trebuchets there. Another advantage is that trebuchets can attack buildings behind walls if the enemy keeps rebuilding the walls. You already mention it when talking about terrain, but it's also useful here, especially when the better stone efficiency might become a factor if the enemy keeps rebuilding walls.
I still prefer trebs. Trebs can lob the dead cows over the castle walls much better and I really enjoy doing that 😉
Trebs are very useful the wolf uses them. At least if your castle is close enough to your enemys castle.
Damn if I had these instructions at high school I would have been a superstar
If you dont want to do the same thing everytime, the Trebuchet is very cool, but in relation you just go 30 catapults + shilds and boom there is no castle more.
But with Trebuchets you can have a cooler game
I can just imagine someone kiting knights with catapults now
"When this catapult so accurate" 🤣🤣🤣
I think it would be cool if trebuchets could shoot oil pots.
Also, trebs are more expensive because you need one more engineer to use them.
Trebuchets are nice when you have an enemy right beside you. Build some trebs and put a wall in front of them and they can never be hit by anything.
dont worry about daily uploads so much, dont burn yourself out over interesting content pls
Can u make some unit videos, maybe a tier list for stronghold warlords ?:#
If firefly would actually make a mod for this game or a patch smth so spearmen can run all the time like macemen, trebuchets move, healers, slingers to have more range and maybe flamethrower more range but it might make them super op since fire in sch 1 is like medieval napalm even greek fire is nothing compared to it(since it was mainly used in ships and not openly in battlefields).
1:08 or macemen in stronghold crusader 2
moving targets can run away [move slighly] causing meele unit to fking miss]
i found out trebs are good as a defencive/offencive tool to deal with towers from the inside of your own castle
Well triboches are good in The big one, because you can build a wall around them and permanently shoot the wazirs granary so he stops attacking because he runs out of Gold
trebs with walls around them can be pretty nice
Well explained!
Each has its own advantages and disadvantages, they are not comparable. 👍
Any map where you have to shoot across a river it's a treb that works
Catapults are better in Crusader since you can build however many you'd like. Trebuchets, however, are invaluable Stronghold 1 due to incredible range.
trebuchet 40 gold more if gets destroyed cause +1 engineer.
also t. cant be reused when siege is over but c. can be
If enemy is close enough to your base you can surround your trebuchets with wall and enemy archers cant do shie
hey man, I'm super new to the game and I wanna play multiplayer online with my friend to start learning. could you give us an updated tutorial on how to set up multiplayer as well how to play the game from a beginner point?
i use a program called "game ranger" , download it , then host a new game and invite your friend
You can use trebuches vor defence
@Mithrandir Wouldn't mangonels do the same tho?Lol.+They have free ammunition so...
@@Ugh718 yes but they range isnt big
@@Ugh718 Your name is cringe
and that is why they nerfed catapults into oblivion in stronghold 2
in order to nerf catapults with the least amount of work would it be just enough to decrease the range such that archers can *easily* shoot them?
I use trebuchets in defense to throw cows at the attackers. Pretty strong against swordmen!
Trebs in stronhold 2 is fking too op
Catapults all the way because good damage and you can move them the trebuchets are good but only in few missions but that is only my opinion
If your enemy dosent use balistas on tower well you shouldn't use catapults
I prefer trebuchets.
I don't recommend using trebuchets most of the time. Of course they have a higher range and can target the specific selected building more than catapults but actually their lake of mobility makes them lose the competition most of the times.
Catapults team