Marathon Training: what I wish I had known 5 years ago
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- Опубликовано: 5 сен 2024
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I wish I had known that when I'm 71 now and have stacks of marathon medals. I do not remember how long any of them took me to run but I sure do remember stopping at that hot dog stand during the DC Marine Corp in 1998 and loving that soggy bunned hot dog with must!!!. I wish I had known during my first 37 marathons to simply ignore my "Never Again" muttering after I crossed the Finish Line because I was always thinking about my next marathon by Tuesday!
Hi Seth, I read in runner's World magazine that the elite runner's no longer do a pre marathon race but concentrate on the race only.
I peaked at age 36 ran London in 02:39:53 and was in the elite tent (my claim to fame) now 66 still running 50+ miles per wk incorporating intervals, tempo, long run and easy day's but I wish I done more strength training and I'm going to incorporate a hill session every two weeks as I've stopped doing them and it tells.
So my advice as you get older keep the hill sessions, light weights, strength train.
Turn that door knob.
I don't get the door knob part
@@ryangrillo Turn the door knob means get outside (and run)
QD: I've done 6 marathons so far, and reached my PB in Chicago this year in a time of 2:42. I'd say the biggest learning has been to focus more on marathon specific training runs. There is nothing like the grind which comes at 30-35k, and more so at 35-40k. Therefore, my key workout for next build will be a ~30k long run with the first 15k steady, next 7.5k at a slightly faster pace, and then the last 7.5k at an even faster pace. I think this would simulate the exact experience you would feel of fatigue during a race.
Great advice Alex, will try this out
As of last weekend I ran my 85 marathon/ultra. At 51 years young still able to run under 3 hours. It was a tough year. Looking forward to a solid 2022🏃🏻♂️😊
I discovered the opposite epiphany last year at 42... I'll never be as fast as I was, I was tired of struggling for meager speed improvements and feeling like a has-been... so after only running a few halfs, I switched to ultras, and absolutely love it. Every long run and race is a PR, I'm constantly learning the NEW running info that comes with a drastic distance change, and focusing more on endurance than speed has reignited my love of running I'd lost over the last 20 disappointed years. I just ran my first marathon after a bad mountain 50k attempt, to regain my mojo, and found I LOVED the distance. I was able to run the whole thing, faster than in training, and sprint at the end, unlike my slow painful 50ks, and felt great 2 days later! Trail marathons will be my new favorite distance, with 50ks being my A goals! 😆 Off I go to find your ultra videos. Thanks for the great content!
QD: I've only got one Marathon under my belt but I think my mine takeaway is to respect the distance. Training can help but nothing can prepare you for being 16 miles into the race and finding the strength, energy, and drive to keep pushing forward.
QOD: I didn’t start running until COVID. I used to think speed was just something you were born with and that couldn’t really be developed all that much. I wish I would have known that so maybe I would have picked it up earlier. I’ve gone from a 52 minute 10k to a 37:11 and I just keep getting faster at age 41. I love exploring my ceiling just as much as I love to run. Cheers
Perspective from a old runner (67). Doing marathon goal pace runs for someone like me who aims only for 8:45 pace in a marathon, but runs 7:45 pace for 10k, are less useful. Running increasing distances ( 10k, 10miles, 12 miles ) at 8:15 to 8:30 as the race gets closer provide much more strength than 'goal pace' which is basically jogging 😃
Im coming from a no running family and all my friends don't run either, so Im kinda alone out there. I started in Nov 2020 just to see if I can make the 26.2 miles, just my local park virtual run. I was proud of myself, I finished and I had a time to build up on. In April 2021 I had a race, but I didn't knew the route. I started out fast and got the time I wanted for first 10k, a little less towards 1/2. But I was slow compared to the fast runners and alone on a mentally difficult route. Just after 1/2 I hurt myself and had to tap out at mile 16. I know if I were in it mentally strong I could have finished it but I wasn't. Now this Nov I tried again the park virtual race. I was more about speed, not so much getting out fast. And in the end I had a PB of 1h. Im happy, Im proud of myself, even so there was no one to share it with. Then I watched NYC marathon and got emotional seeing all these people cheering. I know they will lift me up and get me to go even faster. I signed up for NYC 2022. My friend said 'you want to run the NYC marathon? Na that is only for young fast runners.' Im 55 now and still 50lbs too much. But Im getting where I want to be. Thanks to runners like you who help so much. Thank you.
I’ve got 6 marathons done and the one rule I wish I would have kept in the first few race training cycles is to keep my long run around 25% and no more than 30% of my weeks miles. So many training plans will have you doing over 30% of the weeks miles in your long run which is a recipe for injury.
Happy WARM Thursday to my DGR Family
IDK, yet. Started running back in January of 2020 when I stopped smoking. Realized I really loved the experience and have been learning and building as I go. At 42 I’m signed up for Houston in January and my training plan has worked so far, it made me push myself more and become more focused on what I need to do. Every now and then I stop and panic thinking IDK what I’m doing! Get freaked out and doubt myself. As I always told my students part of life is doing things outside of your comfort zone. Go out get your butt kicked by something and then learn from it.
106 And counting. QOD: What I learned was making sure you drink enough and often. I'll walk a little at each aid station and make sure I get at lease 4oz of water every 2 miles. Turns out I run faster (2:55 PR) with those breaks than without. :)
I'm glad I researched this running thing, when I started 3 years ago at 53, SO GLAD to have RUclips Vloggers like Seth and others out there sharing and caring. MAYBE I will never make it to a marathon, but the 3 year journey from "couch to 15 miles a week" has been injury and relatively pain free. NEVER was a RUNNER till now.
Completed my 103 rd at the weekend Seth- a 42 mile trail ultra in Hampshire UK . Keep buttering the bread 🥖. Wonderful channel 👊
All about finding your niche, 5 years ago you were chasing different dreams and seeking different beauty!! Thx again for sharing your research and insight. Cheers to being a mad scientist while also doing what our heart desires💙!!!
QD: I've been running marathons for seven years now. It took me awhile to figure out that we need to run slower to get faster during the marathon training. I used to do so many long runs at marathon pace struggling in the last miles rather than at slower paces. Since I have adopted these slower paces in my long runs, I can finish stronger my runs, recover way faster and hence increase weekly volume too.
QD: Writing this response just 5 days after my first marathon, I would now tell myself from five years ago to just give marathon training a try. I am so glad that I did give marathon training a go this year because it resulted in the best race experience I have had in my roughly 15 years of on and off running. My boyfriend and I picked up watching DGR vlogs in the early days of the pandemic and Seth, your words have very much been the source of inspiration here. I will also add I am complete believer in watching the food intake during race week and my boyfriend and I took a tip from Gwen Jorgensen’s vlog about prepping a basic rice dish using a rice cooker. Yes, we travel with our rice cooker and we have not had race day stomach issues as a result.
This is why documenting the journey is so important. Diving into old vlogs to hear goals, dreams and the thought process
QoD: 13 marathons so far Seth, and really wished I had known that easy runs should be run slow and recovery runs even slower.
This. Easy means easy!!
Great advice! I still like doing a series of 5Ks leading up to a marathon...really helps with improving leg turnover and doesn't hurt your training after! Best of luck in everyone's training and adventure into the training/marathoning world!
Hi Seth, Try the London Marathon. We'll be here to shout you on! Would be good to have a short get together run
Now that I have 7 marathons completed, I know I can do the distance. I also know that there is always a point when I want to quit the race (usually around 17-18 miles). Something I know now is that you absolutely do not have to do 20 mile training runs to prepare. The last marathon I ran (a virtual one in 2020 where I stopped by my car at 20 miles to pick up more drinks), I was within 2 minutes of my 2012 PR, with the least preparation I've ever done, which was two 16 mile runs and one 18 mile run in the build up, and very little taper - I wasn't sure I would actually do this race until a few days ahead of time - convincing myself to run 26.2 miles by myself with zero support was difficult.
I used to do 20 mile runs (and at least one 21 or 22 mile run) in my marathon buildup, and now I know that's not necessary and actually might be hurting my marathon performance come race day.
QD: Consistency and volume are key. I used to run every couple of days. Just whenever I wanted to go for a run, I'd go out and do a run but almost always skipping days between runs, etc. At one point I joined a 100/100 run challenge and it changed how I ran. It made me a 7 day a week runner (not that 7 days is needed) and really transformed myself as a runner. I actually took a very similar path when getting into triathlons as well. Used to run year round but only start biking once it got warm. Now I'm biking, running and swimming year round and the difference is, as you'd imagine, HUUUGE. At the end of the day, consistency is key and with consistency comes volume.
Running my first marathon in about 14 weeks and I hope I can prepare in time! Thanks for the great vlogs.
QD: 13 marathons run.
1) Don't do tuneup races 2) Slow down your Speedwork to HM pace 3) Do a Tempo Run at EXACT race pace once a week, maybe up to 10-11 miles towards end of training.
QOD: I am not a marathon racer. I have raced numerous 800m, Mile, 2 Mile, 5K, 5Mile, 10k, 10mile, 15k, and 20k and even a Marathon (only one of those). I have probably done over 500 races during my 50 years of running. I hope I can still be racing for at least the next 10 to15 years. We will have to see if the old body can hold up.
Signed up for my first Marathon this coming Marathon in Stirling, Scotland near where I live. I've wanted to raise money for two charities that have been really important to my family in the last 5 years but had my problems with my ankles over the years. Seem to be on a good run recently so I've gone in for it, did my longest run of 9 miles last Tuesday but needed to back off a little since then as got a little tendon pain, hoping I stay injury free(ish) and get to the start and then finish line! Thanks for the videos, been lots of useful info!
The number one thing that helped was joining a track club and doing speed work every week. It made the long runs feel easy and enjoyable and my cardio fitness was better. So many people do nothing but high volume slow runs and wonder why they never get faster.
2 days away from my next 5k, and I'm going to be doing my first half marathon in March. REALLY looking forward to it. There is also another race called Hinson in September where you basically do as much as you can do in a 24 hour period and camp there and everything for. Never thought I would be running and since February, I just can't stop turning that doorknob! :)
This video I am thankful for because I just turned 28 and I am looking to enter my first major marathon when 30 rolls around. Having this advice two years out makes me excited for what's ahead and hopefully will help propel me to a solid finish when that day comes. Solid advice!
Something I wanted to share days ago, after your NYCM difficulties, I too suffered similarly and for the same reason(s) (pre-race food) in my bucket-list goal marathon, Boston 2000. QOD: after years of being a lone-wolf runner, I got much faster when I finally joined a running club and started doing weekly workouts with them.
Second marathon is in 3 weeks. These are great tips for marathon racing! 58 years old and just getting faster. Getting old doesn't mean getting slow! There are some 60-65 years old that are age graded way faster than most non-elite runners and plenty of the sub-elites.
WOOHOO Happy thursday yall
Yay! You're coming to Houston! You should have a meet and greet. I'm getting a property I just bought ready as an Airbnb. You can stay there. It has a full kitchen. Running my first Houston marathon.
I ran 8 marathons and am approaching the sub 3 hour mark. I am a trailrunner on the ultra distance and patiently lowering my PB ond the road half marathons and marathons. GREETINGS FROM SALZBURG/AUSTRIA!!!
QD: Run a hefty portion of your volume (~80%) aerobically. Starting from HS XC, I ran almost all my miles in what I now call “moderate intensity black hole”. I’d usually end up injured within a couple months of training without fail. Finally slowed down for 80% of my miles and now can train without getting immediately injured!
Seth - forget about an AirbNb. With all your fans around the world I’m pretty certain you can get a home stay wherever you travel!
Seth - Outstanding VLOG - good work! Love the goal race pace runs and tune-up race recommendations. My marathon is one 03 April. Can't wait for the focused training and the ups and downs of reaching a goal. Your positivity is infectious.
I haven't run a marathon yet but plan to do my first in June 2022. Having only started running 8 years ago at 52, I wish I had learned earlier in life that running could be fun and such a great benefit to overall life.
I’ve done over 20 marathons now and in the earlier years I was stuck on running as many goal race pace runs as possible but never led to great race results. Once I learned to vary my training in both pace and intensity my race results improved drastically and it actually made training more fun too!
Your marathon training plan is getting better…but you should be doing more volume at threshold-i.e. weekly. Something around 5-8 miles of T, which you can break up into intervals. Long runs should be around 2 to 2.5 hours with some marathon race pace miles thrown in.
I havent run so concistent as You in my life Seth and after I got pension when I was 19 year because I got diagnosed with autism I havent have the options to run consistent. I have anyhow been able to run almost 3-6 times every week the last 5 years and have been able to train alone making a running plan by myself up to Berlin marathon in 2017 and I was 54 years old and did it as my first marathon in 4 hours and 55 min and I ran my run of my life and I still get intuciasting when I get a chance to tell others I meet about my run in Berlin. Isent that a great story my friend ? cincerely Inga DK.
Great tips. I always remind myself that there is no such thing as a perfect build up, training block, taper, etc.. but that running is a balance and very complex optimization problem
In Taiwan, one runner has run over 100 marathon races with his dogs (with the race officials permission). The oldest dog just passed away last month, but he finished 100 marathon races with PB 3hr59min.
This was some great insight and reflections- for newer runners like me it’s good to learn from others and see these lessons. I’ve already seen many things in this list that I can improve. All the best in your rest and prep for Spring
Your videos are the best. Running, great vibes, and always great advice/experience. Well done!
Great tips! For me, 3 weeks out for a half works great, but it is different for everyone. Wondering if when you change/reduce your mileage in future blocks if you still think you’ll need 4-5 weeks before your marathon for a tune up.
If you look at Hal Higdon's marathon plans, he recommends you run a HM 8-10 weeks before, with 9 weeks being the ideal. Having said that, his plans are 18 weeks, not 12 weeks.
I still don't really understand the food explanation. It's NYC, one of the places in the world where you can literally get any type of food you want. There is no standard portion size, there is no standard for being rich and oily. I'm not trying to be a hater, but it's just weird how he blames the food and the city when he was in full control of what he ate. No one forced him to eat at the places he did, and no one forced him to eat giant portions. He's the one that poured all that oil on his bread. Come on.
“Nothing like to hit REGISTER” So so true!!
Funny you play with mountain stuff and marathons. I did the same but focused more on marathons. One year I ran 2:26 at Grandma's Marathon and then finished 12th or 13th at US mountain championships. I think being more mountain like you and running road marathons would be harder.
QD: I wish I had known about proper strength training and lower kms per week. At 62 I have learned the hard way that my body will only tolerate higher kms for a limited time before it gets injured. I like your suggestion that if you lack speed on the track, you may need to cut back in the kms.
Still new to the marathon and absorbing all those great tips. Thanks for sharing with us
QoD.. PASTA PARTY IS NOT FOR THE NIGHT BEFORE🤣. I now know that my sweet spot for carbo loading is 2 nights out. The night before.. I actually eat cautiously. It took me a few races to figure out why I felt so bloated on race day haha
Same for me... previous dinner has to be light.
:QoD: I've run 11 marathons and two 50K. For the first ones, each new PR was great but by now I've learnt that the fastest ones don't translate necessarily into the happiest. I always get emotional (during & after) and seeing other people crossing the finish line with a smile on their faces puts a big one in mine too :) Another thing I learnt: electric massage guns for the quadriceps are a blessing for recovery :P
1) The tune up race, I wonder if it is wise to try and pr. An alternative would be to run a halfmarathon about 2 minutes slower. It would still be faster than marathonpace, and I'm sure you would recover from that halfmarathon in 2 to 3 days.
2) Of course no one forced you to eat your entire meal, the night before the marathon. If a restaurant serves portions that are too big, just stop when you've had enough!
You should come out to Jacksonville FL for the GRR 15K Championship!
Great advice Seth, love this type of content very much. You are the man!
QD: as someone early in their marathon life (just ran my first in October at 23) I really spent a few years since I ended my XC career after high school by assuming that marathons had to be perfectly executed- that I couldn’t do it unless I did it exactly like I wanted to with all the bells and whistles to match. I learned finished is endlessly better than perfect, because finished is real. And hopefully, it will be again!
I still do not have a Marathon...but I wish I knew correct approach in to Marathon training...now I already know
Glad to have the Shoedio back
Great tips in there Seth 👍
For me I completely agree with the tune up race further out, I made that mistake 3 weeks out and it felt like I lost fitness and sharpness on the Day and a long run would've been more beneficial at that stage rather than racing a half.
So in future I will be finding one that's 5-6 weeks out OR even doing a time trial if I can't find an event that fits in to schedule.
QD: I've only run one marathon, but I think that goal pace is rarely applicable to any workouts unless they are tempo or planned marathon pace specific. A three mile tempo should be faster than marathon pace, mile repeats should be way faster, track workouts shouldn't be anywhere close to goal marathon pace, and in general I think that referring to goal marathon pace is often a cop out for doing an unproductive workout.
Thank you so much for this video. So much good tips and inspiration for me 💥
QD: 1) Learn to listen to your body. Learn what it needs to prevent you from injuries. 2) Set yourself goals,, make a plan,, execture it 3) Never forget:to have fun
Very good tips, thank you Seth !
May 26th is my birthday! Way too funny! Thanks for the tips Seth!!!
I’m gonna listen to all your advice and create a framework for training plans and call it the DeMoor Do-More Method.
I’ve only run 2 BUT definitely to figure out which form of nutrition works for you (gels, drink, tablets) since everyone’s bodies handle that different. Also, hitting 2-3 long runs of 20-22 miles really helped me.
Dude Sinead Diver is 44 , you've time !
Might seem like being critical , but your plans always seem like a giant base phase and not enough specificity for marathon speed. I'd say if you looked into some coach help you would nail the marathon easy .More long run workouts and definitely a weekly threshold run in a specific plan. You have the base and the turnover now you need to nail the training for it.
All the best !
My only marathon experience was Chicago and did a 4:10 just ran with a pacer as i started with a big pack and i finished with 3 runners at the end at my 50 years young. I started running at 40 and wish i started 5 year’s earlier for some speed 😉
All qualifiers got into Boston!
Great advice Seth! Spot on!
Hello Seth I´ve never even run a 10k . I´m 24 and stopped running at 17, I really wish I could go back in time... I was a good sprinter. Thank you for your daily videos.
You have still plenty of time to come back. Just turn that door knob and feel the wind on your face again. I started at the age of 40, so it's never too late. 💪
QD: Something I wish I knew was that the workouts you do are less important than the people you do them with. I had so many botched workouts that I tried to run solo. I began doing my teammates' workouts and every day was right on the 💰. I got way fitter than ever before. Training groups are ESSENTIAL
Tbh I have done 30 plus marathons broken 3hr but never could do 2.45 it's a hard distance and needs a lot of respect
Threshold is not the same as race pace training. Threshold is roughly the equivalent of a pace you could hold for one hour, so half marathon race pace for the top elites. Which you were correct in saying is about 20-30 seconds slower then 5k. Race pace training for the marathon should be a little slower then threshold. Both are great workouts for the marathon but they are not the same thing.
I was getting ready for my first marathon next year. Then I broke my ankle two months ago. Back to square one. I’m devastated
Cheer up and look forward to next year when your recovery is over. You will be back stronger. Mentally for sure. I discovered hernia after my first Marathon in June and had to operate it 6 weeks ago. That's another 6 weeks of no running at all. Yes it's not easy but Seth channel keeps me sane and I love to cheer others on their journey in the meantime. Also I do small exercises for my foot and ankles in the meantime, as I cannot do anything else. 😂 I hope to have better toe off from it when the come back time comes 👍 take care, you'll be back on the road soon!
Air BbB can cancel on you last minute which could be a disaster. Happened to a runner I know before a Marathon.
FYI if Airbnb is too expensive Residence by Marriott have great kitchenettes
40 is the new 20 didn't you know 🙂👌
I feel stronger now then I did in my 20s both physically and mentally
Keep turning that door knob
9. Use a HR strap in training to monitor your training load, and recovery :)
HR varies so much on any given day, dependent on many factors. Temperature, hydration, elevation, wind, coffee, stress from work/life, etc. It's hard to trust as a training metric, aside from just looking at general trends over time. On a day to day basis, just go by feel and plan out any paced run as part of your training block relative to your race distance.
10 miler tune up 3 weeks out works well for me. Half marathon definitely 4-5 weeks out.
Too expensive for tune up races. The 2 marathons or ultra races a year are expensive for most of us. It costs more than a pair of Saucony Speeds to get in to them...so I choose new shoes! 10K or Halfs costs are ridiculous. I don't need any support for that distance yet they want 80 bucks or more. The greed in the business is making it elitist and corporate driven. The love of running is being drowned out with the prohibitive costs. It means most of us have to live and race vicariously through shoe tubers instead of participating...because we LOVE running but have to decide between quality shoes or Tune up races.
QD no matter what you do, no matter how careful you are, all the strength, all the miles, will mean nothing to the things you can’t control.
Seth I relate to the rest so much. I just ran the turkey trot and I have been having some ups and downs since 2018. I got a coach in 2020 I ran a 10k at 10 seconds per 5k faster then my 5k pr from 2018. I have just been itching to see what I can for just a single 5k now. Yet my coach wants me to take 15 days off. I am on day one and already want to go out and race a 5k
I've run two marathons one each year, I'm hoping next near to run 2 or 3 in one year to start making extra gains
Don’t give up the free hotel! Just bring (or buy cheap when you arrive) a hot plate and a pot to make sure you can cook your own boring food :)
I'm 20 still practically teenager but I'm just gonna use my mid distance speed in my early 20s and late 20s I transition to long distance
nothing wrong with lifting heavy weights. I much rather have a david goggins or even nick bare physique than the prisoner of war look, even if it means running a bit slower
I wish I would have hired a coach after college.
Run to the like button for Seth!!!!
For a newbie may any of these advices can be really obvious, but take care... any small mistake can spoil 3-4 months of work.
2 marathons.
1. 3;57:58
2. 2:59:55
QD: Don't be afraid to lift weights and do a lot of training in zone 2 (doesn't necessarily have to be running, swimming or biking works too)
Lol I just posted a question asking why Seth hasn’t considered ultra running and then about a minute into the video he mentions how he was an ultra runner. I think next time I’m going to read through the questions before answering the test ;-). I knew those school teachers were onto something Wayback win…
Now if TrueLove will just sign you up quickly for CIM marathon. What about S. Flanagan 6 marathons all under 3 hrs. in about a 2-3 month time span?!? Incredible!!
At the NYC marathon this year, did the shoes give you blisters on your heel? One tip I have is that I wear my racing shoes a couple times (no more than 20 miles) before the race so I know they fit well and feel great.
Cross train, for strength. Hamstring injuries suck, need to prevent them