www.patreon.com/GnosticInformant Please Consider joining my Patreon to help finding scholars to bring on. Any amount helps me. Thank you existing Patrons. CHAPTERS: 00:00:00 - Intro 00:00:45 - Main Arguments (Dionysian Roots of Christianity) 00:12:10 - John's Bacchae 00:14:08 - Greek Tragedy Mimesis 00:23:55 - Inverted Mysteries 00:28:24 - Syncretism & Competition 00:34:58 - Last Pagan Generation 00:40:40 - 'Lamb of God' Vs. 'Bull of God' 00:49:40 - Thracian Horse Rider 00:59:35 - Transfer of Eleusinian Mysteries 01:10:00 - Dionysian Eucharist 01:11:17 - New Testament World 01:12:56 - Judaizing the Greek World 01:15:55 - Hypsistarians & 'God-Fearers' 01:22:22 - 'Right Hand of God' (Benedictio Latina Gesture & Sabazius) 01:29:41 - Conclusion
nice job Neil....impress a lot! - if you want more info about "Epiphany time" what other meaning/layers I have some. -if you want my attempt/answer on what "Abrasax" what it mean/be... I have. - and other exemple about all that "purple subject" and other related stuff around all this... I can too!! you...Lady Babylon.... mythvision... on a other level!! Ancient Mystery Channel is very good on Sumerians etymology and it show a other layers on all that.
@gnosticinformant is there an email or way to contact you in a more private setting? I have come across something I feel to be important about this subject. It shouldn't take more than 3 to 4 sentences to explain and i feel it very relevant. It involves the "calculation" of a number. I would appreciate you very much.
Consuming the body and blood of Christ has bothered me since childhood 🕊 - The parish priest called me “the little heretic” .. he said I asked too many questions The truth will set us free 🕊
well Jesus said that to his disciples meant to be for them only as a remembrance is what i believe and is a catholic thing, not all branches of Christianity do that.
The small evangelical cult I was from taught us that the wine and bread literally became flesh and blood - I would sometimes worry that the bread and wine would taste like flesh and blood during holy communion
The bread is the physical body while the wine is the spirit, to consume both creates a union between man and female, the man being the material and the female the divine, the groom and bride marry into one. When the male becomes female and the female becomes male, that is when you will enter the kingdom. The orthodox and it's splinters have lost the true meaning of the Eucharist.
@@CausticSpace that’s really interesting- do you have a source on that? I’m still deconstructing from Christianity but I enjoy learning about the real roots of what may have been the original religion
@@Leggiebeans Gospel of Phillip and Gospel of Thomas off the top of my head are good reads Deconstructing from the religion of Christianity is good, but one must not lose sight of the Truth in doing so.
Well done and very thorough! My brother (a pastor) adamantly asserts Christianity is unique and any similarity with other religions or ancient characters is because they copied Christianity. Dates do not seem to matter because what he was taught in Bible College is definitely the correct truth. Indoctrination is powerful and difficult to overcome.
The gnostic informant calls himself an amateur, but he has obviously done years of research and has a working knowledge of Ancient languages. I personally have a couple of crappy RUclips channels, so I can tell that it must’ve taken weeks of editing to accomplish this video.
I've been wondering where you've been, Neal, and hoping all is well with you! I clicked this link with such a swiftness. Thank you for all your contributions!
Christianity pretty muched plagiarised paganism. Twisted the narrative to suit the monarchical narrative to control the masses. While exterminating, anyone still practising paganism. The 400-year "witch trials" was probably the peak of that.
This was amazing, Neal! Yours is hands down the best channel on RUclips. I immediately wanted to rewatch this video as soon as it ended. But I think I’ll rewatch your last Dionysus video from a few months ago, first, and then watch this one again. 😆 When you posted that last one, I shared that gem with everybody I know! It blew me away. I can’t believe you’ve done it again! Thank you so much for the research you do. 🙏
Worship. Never. 😊 Jesus said "you too will do great things, even greater than I" The Mystery of 🎄 is immortality, the great Lie..We don't Die. Hel no⚡🦚
Why was he called the good serpent and given the Ichthyus, which was Ea's symbol? Ea's symbols are the fish and goat, Capricorn december 21st is always the big holiday. The things that were big no-no's were hybridizing with mankind, giving them long life, and teaching them, but it's okay to mess with Jaochim and Anna to make a Mary incubator? Everyone is either worshipping Nephilim or the idea of a god ( El, Thor, Zues, Yahweh? ) who hated humanity and attempted to wipe it out of existence. Make it make sense. Wait till people realise the Baphomet is made of the symbols of Prometheus, Mithra, Sol Invictus, Ea Enki, Dagon Oannes, Thoth, Hermes Mercury all smashed together into a booby-goat mosaic of Satan, the creator and teacher of mankind, whos buddies like to take our women folk as wives and fight their cousins over it.
Why press Bahomet when you have Jesus? Already been done by the platonic-dionysian-jewish synthesis. Neals video proves it. Just become eastern Orthodox.
I think you are on to something with your first theory. Growing up Christian, you are taught that the unison of man and god is normal for belief. Then you notice that philosophy is missing in all the other modern religions, and only exists in the ancient ones. So then, if you are curious enough, you begin to wonder if Christianity's roots are of a long ancient past. Then you find out about the even more ancient, antediluvian period, where the concept of the god/man was very common, but instead of being a concept only from the "good guys", it was used by all sides. Even in the Bible, its all about the son of the serpent vs the son of the true God. Genesis 3:15 said it plainly when God was speaking to the serpent, "I will put enmity between you (the serpent) and the woman (Eve), and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel." Most of Christendom interprets that as the church of Christ overcoming those who stand against Christ (children of the serpent), because crushing a head is more lethal than getting bit on the heel, and most interpret offspring as being plural, even though the word doesn't have to be plural, like 'your deer' can be singular or plural. However, anyone who really thinks about it would understand that through most of mankind's existence, even in most countries today, being bitten by a venomous snake anywhere is a death sentence, and just as lethal as a snake's skull being crushed. Also, just as the serpent's bite didn't keep Jesus in the grave for good, the Book of Revelation would imply that the serpent's head wound didn't kill him (son of the Serpent/ man of perdition/ THE BEAST) for good either. Revelation 17:8-12 states: "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction. And the dwellers on earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will marvel to see the beast, because it was and is not and is to come. This calls for a mind with wisdom: the seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman is seated; they are also seven kings, five of whom have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come, and when he does come he must remain only for a little while. As for the beast that was and is not, it is an eighth but it belongs to the seven, and it goes to destruction. Then, Revelation 13:1-4, which is about the first beast: "And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with 10 horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads. And the beast that I saw was like a leopard; its feet were like a bear's, and its mouth was like a lion's mouth. And to it the dragon gave his power and his throne and great authority. One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast. And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying "Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?" " But wait, there is more, Revelation 13:11-18, which is talking about the 2nd beast (false prophet), but it talks about the attributes of the 1st beast that the 2nd beast is glorifying: "Then I saw another beast rising out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast in its presence, and makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound was healed. It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in front of people, and by the signs that it is allowed to work in the presence of the beast it deceives those who dwell on the earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lived. And it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast might even speak and might cause those who do not worship the image of the beast to be slain. Also is causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. This calls for wisdom: let one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man and his number is 666." Last but not least, Revelation 9:1-11 "And the 5th angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star fallen from heaven to earth, and he was given the key to the shaft of the bottomless pit. He opened the shaft of the bottomless pit, and from the shaft rose smoke like the smoke of a great furnace, and the sun and the air were darkened with smoke from the shaft. Then from the smoke came locusts on the earth, and they were given power like the power of scorpions of the earth. They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any green plant or any tree, but only those people who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads. They were allowed to torment them for 5 months, but not to kill them, and their torment was like the torment of a scorpion when it stings someone. And in those days people will seek death and will not find it. They will long to die, but death will flee from them. In appearance the locusts were like horses prepared for battle: on their heads were what looked like crowns of gold; their faces were like human faces, their hair like women's hair, and their teeth like lion's teeth, they had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the noise of their wings was like the noise of many chariots with horses rushing into battle. They have tails and stings like scorpions, and their power to hurt people for 5 months is in their tails. They have a king over them the angel of the bottomless pit. His name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in the Greek his is Apollyon."
So now that you see the verses in there entirety, I can paraphrase from them. You can see that what causes the son of the serpent to be praised is that he was dealt a mortal blow, but yet he lived. He was said to be, not to be, and would be again. Clearly it is all just riddle of 'he died and rose again'. Also, Dragon was also just a word that meant large/great serpent, and so if you just replace Dragon with ' great serpent', and Beast with 'son of the serpent', you can clearly see a Father son dynamic that is almost identical to the dynamic Christ had with his father, in that the dragon gave great authority to the Beast (offspring of the serpent), and resurrected him. The thing is, there are some differences, so I'm not saying Christ is the beast, but there is a lot in common, as it goes back to Genesis, that both would receive mortal wounds, but later in the bible you see both resurrected from them. Not only that, but the 2nd beast, AKA false prophet, right hand man, even he can breath life into an in animate representation of the Beast. This is all to show mankind that there is more than one entity that has the power to give and take life, but ultimately the one who can take the life of the soul is the most powerful, and the Lake of fire used to kill souls is the representation of God's ultimate power. This is why in the new testament, one verse says, "fear not him who can kill the flesh, but not the soul, for God can kill both flesh and soul." (beginning of rambling)...You see on Gnostic informant and Myth Vision's channels, they talk a lot about other dying and rising gods, which the ancient world had many of. This is because apparently, the Watchers (fallen angles) and the Nephilim (their offspring) could pull the death and resurrection feat off potentially, because the nature of the Nephilim, being half divine and half man, have souls that do not die, like their fathers who are completely immortal. So every first generation Nephilim, being 50/50 divine/man, was basically going to live on in spirit even after their bodies died. So when you see Christ saying things like, "I am the bread of life...though you die, if you die in me, when you die yet shall you live", or "Do you not know that ye are gods", or when they are talking about Christ appearing and disappearing after his resurrection like a ghost, and when Paul spoke of our future glorified bodies like Christ, would be more flesh-less in the sense of how we have flesh now, we begin to see that many of the things Christ was saying, would really only apply to them if he were speaking to those who were like him, demi gods, as they would rule with him in the new kingdom upon his return. It could make one wonder if Christ was speaking to the angels who were watching the saga play out, as if that message was meant to impact them as much as his disciples he was talking to as well. However, Noah was Nephilim, as it was heavily implied in the book of Jubilees and/or Jasher, when Noah's father asked why his son looked like the angels, with glowing eyes, long blond hair, and bleach white skin. God didn't reply, but an angel told Enoch to tell Noah's father, Lamech, that he is the father. Funny enough, when you look at other flood accounts, where Noah is called by another name, because its another language, the story of Utnapishtim, Enki tells Utnapishtim to build an ark, because Enlil and the rest of the council of gods agreed to wipe mankind off the earth, but Enki defied his brother and the council, because Utnapishtim was his son, but no one else in the council knew that apparently. So Noah was a demi god, and that's probably one reason why the Nephilim existed after the flood as well, because it was in man's genetics. So who knows, maybe some humans souls can go on after death and some cant, but typically 2nd and 3rd + generations were fully mortal, unlike the 1st generation god/human hybrids. So maybe we all die the same, but its an unknown ...(end of rambling). Anyways, i'm getting off point with a lot of theory, but let me get back to solid givens according to texts. The 1st beast, which is the son of the great serpent, is said to have been, then wasn't, but is about to rise out of the bottomless pit and to go to destruction. Now, the book of revelations isn't in order of events, as its a bunch of different parallel timelines with different symbolism in order to show different aspects of one event. The thing is that the 1st beast is without a doubt Apollyon, a god of the underworld; the bottomless pit. The bottomless pit is where the Watchers were imprisoned until judgment day for all. So when Revelation 20 talks about the great dragon (beast's father) being put into the pit for 1000 yrs, and then released, you can understand that the bottomless pit, AKA abyss, or 'the deep', is the place where the Watchers were imprisoned. So when Apollyon rises out of the pit with his army, I don't know if that is before his death, or after his death, but he also goes or arises from the bottomless pit. Now notice the descriptions of the locusts. They are not talking about a single locust, but an army of them, so some of the descriptions are about how they sound when many of them are together. The have faces of men with women's hair, and teeth of lions. OK, so imagine lord of the ring elves with pure 1st generation vampire fangs. Now I mention vampire fangs, because in the book of Enoch, one of the 3 Nephilim breeds consumed human blood, so probably a trait from their fathers, and explains a lot of why there is so much blood rituals in so many religions. So before you thought I was crazy, I had to explain myself. Then they have wings. It says that all of them together sound like an army of horses, and seeing that there is so many, if their wings were like insects it would sound much different, so I think their wings are the eagle like wings we typically picture when we think of angels, but because there is an army of them, it sounds like an army of horses, and the locusts name probably is because whatever is before them gets obliterated in the same manner locusts make crops disappear. So I think the Watchers have maintained their looks as angels, there were just imprisoned. Fun fact, but most times prophets or anyone has seen angels in their true form, they often feint in fear, so the Revelation description of locusts is probably an accurate representation of angels rather than our PG13 version of just humans with eagle wings. The tails may give it a Cell from Dragon Ball Z look, but they probably looked bad ass. My whole point is that I think there is a lot of material to show that what you mentioned is possible. The religion of the angels could be the same regardless of the factions, but they are just fighting for who rules, not to change the traditions of the heavens and the earth. So its very likely any of your scenarios could be true. We could be worshiping vampires for all you know. We could be worshiping demons. The bible does talk about people doing that, most not knowing they are, because they just don't have the facts. Christians always want to talk about how crafty the devil is, but then always act like the devil couldn't have fooled them this whole time. They really underestimate a being who is inherently many times smarter.
I always wondered when you and Dr. McClellan would converge. Would love to hear you two speak in a podcast format or discussion regarding the subject matter.
Thanks for responding to Dan. I was really bothered by that episode. Dan was responding to an outlandish claim in a pop-culture book, then applied it to all Dionysus scholarship. If Judaism and Bacchism had nothing to do with each other, why did Justin name Priapus as the good created before everything? Clearly the truth is more complicated than just squinting.
im fine with it. We can disagree. Much of this stuff is very speculative but I agree with you at the end of the day. I think it becomes painfully obvious the more I get immersed in the primary sources.
There were some things I didn’t know prior to watching your documentary. For example: I didn’t know Dionysus rode on a donkey. Thanks for the extra details.
Neil, further to the Thracian horseman motif - add to that the 4th century sandstone bas-relief of the falcon-headed Horus on horseback spearing a crocodile (Set?). Discovered at the Faras archaeological site, Upper Nubia (Housed at Département des Antiquités Égyptiennes du Louvre, Room 180, Item E 4850).
Add to this, there are interesting analogies and linguistic connections to defeating a crocodiles, 🐊 which later becomes St George killing a dragon. 🐉 the root word of Messiah in Hebrew and other Semitic languages means “to anoint” Anointing a king with oil is a common motif. The Bible has the exact prescription of what their anointing oil is, with mirror in it, and other substances, including many people, canna bosum or cannabis to be one of the oils. The root word in Semitic languages for anointing is ‘yi-msah’. From where we get Messiah. The word ‘yi-mash’ derives from the root word for crocodile, ‘timsah’. That is, you rub the oil of the crocodile 🐊 over you, anointing yourself with the power of the animal. I find it striking that this root word to anoint a lap dovetails with the image of Dionysis on a horse and St. George. Fascinating. And thank you both you and Neil. Great synergy and knowledge sharing happening here.
Horseman with a spear and a bird shows up in Slavic and Norse mythologies also. Eventually synergies are created, and Odin has same attributes (crows as birds, spear) and later Odin hangs on a tree. Most scholars say that Aldin was impacted by Christianity and Jesus. But the proto-Slavic at George like horseman is also an existing motif. What’s so interesting about the Dionysus comparison is that is so obviously pre-dates Jesus and Christianity. Unlike the Odin example.
You said in the beginning that unlike Dyonisis Jesus had one mother, whereas Dionysus had two, one mortal one divine. But actually if you read the gospel of Thomas, Jesus says he has two mothers.
There is a Dios Pater/Papas (God/Zeus the Father) and Dios Nysus (God/Zeus the Son). Jesus quotes Dionysus in Acts of the Apostles 26:14, and God the Father is called Pater, Deus, and Dios in the gospels (Ex. John 8:54), Latin Vulgate, and Catholic masses. I grew up Catholic, and in the Spanish masses God is called Dios. Jesus is Dionysus, and God the Father is Dios/Deus/Zeus. Zeus is also YHVH (pronounced Yehuh/Jew/Jeu, the same name his followers the Yehudim/Jews/Jeus call themselves). His full name is Jew/Jeu Pater.
[00:00 - 02:14] The speaker discusses the similarities between the Christian ritual of communion and the cult of Dionysus, suggesting that they are not as closely related as some argue. [02:14 - 10:59] The speaker delves into the parallels between Jesus and Dionysus, including their divine parentage, miraculous births, and roles as the chosen heirs of their respective kingdoms. He also discusses the connections between the two figures in terms of their disciples, miracles, deaths, and resurrections. [10:59 - 15:08] The speaker explores the thematic resemblances between the Gospel of John and Euripides' play "The Bacchae," suggesting that the author of John's gospel may have subconsciously emulated the tragic framework of the play while reshaping the narrative about Jesus. [15:08 - 26:17] The speaker discusses the influence of Dionysian imagery and themes on early Christianity, including the use of Bacchic imagery by Clement of Alexandria, the connections between Jesus and figures like Orpheus, and the adaptation of Pagan symbols like the phoenix. [26:17 - 31:02] The speaker talks about the connections between Jesus and other gods, such as Ion and Deus, who were celebrated on the same day as Jesus' birth, baptism, and the wedding at Cana (January 6th). [31:02 - 35:16] The speaker discusses the connections between Dionysus and other gods, such as Osiris and Mithra, and their associations with sacrificial bulls. [35:16 - 51:55] The speaker explores the connections between Dionysus and the cult of the Great Mother, including the horse-rider iconography found in regions like Phrygia, Cappadocia, and Armenia. [51:55 - 1:10:29] The speaker discusses the rise of monotheistic tendencies in Greek paganism, including the worship of Theos Hypsistos ("God Most High") and the syncretism between Dionysian and Jewish religious elements that may have influenced the development of Christianity. [1:10:29 - 1:18:52] The speaker delves into the historical context surrounding the defeat of Antiochus III and the subsequent displacement of millions of Jews to regions like Asia Minor, which may have facilitated the cultural fusion that gave rise to Christianity. [1:18:52 - 1:26:25] The speaker explores the connections between the hand gestures used in early Christian art and the Dionysian symbolism of the "Hand of Sabazius," suggesting that this symbolism was repurposed for Jesus. [1:26:25 - 1:32:08] The speaker discusses the evolution of the Dionysian cult of Sabazius into the worship of Theos Hypsistos and the mingling of these religious elements with Jewish immigrants, which may have contributed to the development of Christianity in Asia Minor.
I know you and related channels done lots of vids on these topics already cuz I seen most of them, but this one streamlines it all the best. It's like a better version of prior vids and info from podcasts n livestreams you and related channels been doin. Very good job. Did you have help? Great essay.
Persephone was called Kore because it is common to use euphemisms when referring to underworld deities for fear of invoking them. Similarly, Hades is called "he who has many guests". This has nothing to do with her name being particularly sacred. Also, Kore means girl or maiden. This can imply virginity, but the name itself does not mean virgin.
Ok for some critique in Dan's defense (Not much). When we look at these things we need to look at strata. Things invented in the past can affect the future, but things invented in the future cannot change the past. And so we then beg the question, when the books of the canon were written what tendrils to the past where significant. Lets talk about wine and wine making and then Bread and bread making. Wine making started in Asia (likely east) and reached Asia minor at the time of the growth of Kura-Araxes. Before we start talking about indoeuropean we need to first recognize that Maycopt and Kura-Araxes were the early bronze age trigger to both indoeuropean and Hittite/Luwian. There is no significant technological culture in thes regions before these. And we know that kura-Araxes was spreading because their settlements are found in Anatolia and the Galilee. And so its not surprising at all that a precursor to Dionysus is found broadly distributed over a vast area. Nor is it surprising that Mesopotamian gods are found or that many gods look similar to sumerian gods. Sumer had no copper, its initial trade contacts were with Samarah and some of the sites show extensive trade and gathering with lake Van region. To simplify, Samarah and Hassuna cultures sit exactly on the boundary of kura-Araxes and even into the Jemdet Nasr there is continual trade southward along the Tigris with Sumer. These two cultures, Sumer and PIE are joined so to speak at their dirty, mining, hands. Dealing with all of that let's address wheat. Bread as we call it is not made from mesopotamian or levantine wheat. Yes the first wheat comes from the cinvergence of Syria and Turkeye at the Mediterranean But that is not bread wheat. The exact version of Bread wheat used in Europe to make cakes and other items comes from Armenia plateau. Its the combination of the aforementioned early levantine wheat and a goat grass called Aegilops tauschii strangulata which is indigeonous to Armenia. This wheat was not popularly used for thousands of years and only spread in the context of later migrations. And so we now have three points of origin. We have Wine from Asia via protoHittites/Luwians Bronze from the divide between lake Van and Tell Shemshara Bread making from Armenia. If you draw a circle around all of these its a radius of a hundred miles and you are talking about something thats going on in Eastern Anatolia. We have no choice to lay this upon cultural flow from the east during the middle/late bronze age. And so the tendrils to the past do reach deeply eastward, and in this case not to Sumer, who we can thank for beer culture, but in the direction of azerbiajan, kurdistan and northwestern Iran. Having dealt with the deepest tendrils, you have done alot of good work showing links between Ephesus and surounding culture so lets take the bible apart. 7 books of Paul -Anatolian Jew, well studied in Torah, mysticism seems to reflect desert sage. 6 unauthentic texts and Hebrews. 1 epistles of Jude and 2 Peter- Enochian literary sources. 2 Peter has 2 century christian theology. 1 James - Jewish perspective on the jerusalem movement and competing grecan ideas. 1 Apocalypse - rooted in Maccabean apocalypticism, and spun with Jesus interpolations. 3 epistles of John - credibly written by the last major editor of same named gospel. 1 peter - 21 texts. 4 gospels including Acts. Mark - written in Alexandria. Luke/Acts - source driven Matthew source driven with a heavy eye on the Jewish law John - multiple layers. The first of which is driven by greek influences. So we know the church as distinguished from the gospels is driven by the attempt to universalize belief and included the inclusion of material from diverse cultures. The orthodoxy in the 8th and 9th century struggled with the problem of iconography (which islam called idolatry) and finally threw its hands up and basically was Que Sera Sera for all the idolatry that seeped into the church. So that we can remove most of this strata. For most christians communion is not all that important. In the next deeper strata od christianity we have the very diverse period that is characterized in many ways by gnosticism in its extreme. There is no doubt these are influenced by greek platonic and other philosophical notions as well as a fair dose of Egyptian belief of late antiquity. Removing that strata we get down to the Early second century when the greco-roman hemisphere of christians were increasinly differentiated from the fading levantine hemisphere. We have two relevent texts, the secret sayings gospel, a protognostic gospel that tips its hat to Judaism, and the gospel of John, its anti-semetic competitor. Its not an everything everwhere theology about anatolian gods that mesmerized christians, its about events that transpired in Ephesus. If we recall Ephesus became a major center for Pauline christianity, timothy was one of the Early elders of the Ecclesia. The problem in Ephesus is the "christians" are disrupting the synogogue and the Jews forbade them from entering the synogogue. And so, around 50 to 60 CE the christians, now with Paul over whatever horizon he went over, are free to explore their legendary Jesus (which Paul has given almost no details about). In this environment you see the Signs Gospel(alt. Dionysan Gospel) emerge. This text, following the Jewish revolt you probably have jesus followers fleeing the levant, many like Josephus think some of the war was a Jewish folly. In that context you have the anti-text being written, and they have a precedent, because Paul practically labels Yacov the Pious the anti-christ. On top of those layers you have the beloved disciple text, which attacks another version of Jewish "christianity" the short-list of secret sayings (the gospel of Tomas is toward the mid second century). And so in this mileau of text and ideas we have different regional motifs entering and modifying theology in the form of literature. Is there a Dionysan Jesus? . . . . .Yes, but its a very tiny Jesus in Gospel of John. Is there a Moses Jesus? . . . .he's a sizable fraction of Matthew and Luke Is there a Davidic-Messiah Jesus? . . . . according to Paul, he's coming. Is there an unknown messiah Jesus? ..... Mark Is Jesus the restorer of the Law? ... Matthew. Is Jesus all things to all followeds? Both messiah and righteous unto the law . . .Luke Is Jesus the Danielic Messiah? . . . .Revelations. Is Jesus the Heavenly Aware (Enochic) savior? . . . .Jude and 2 Peter. And so when we state that Dionysis belief had influences on the writing of christians, its also neccesary at the same time, in fact scholars would probably point ot first these other influences. In fact this kind of helps the case, if you can say, Yes, the accepted hebrew Tanakh (Sept Equive thereof) influence christian writings. Particularly making the point that the sayings in the gospels reflected both earlier Pharisean and Essenic writing which included non-accepted hebrew writings. and so did greek literary styles of biography writing. and so did the homeric literature through memesis (give examples) that we should not be surprised at all to see stark parallels between writings about greek mystery cults and christian writings given the very close parallels between christianity and mystery cults. 😊
Early Christians believed all religions in the ancient world had prophesied Christ, so they would shrug and say "yes, Dionysos was a prophesy of Christ our God".
I know it is foolish to just accept stuff that people post on the internet, but your content is GREAT!! It is all VERY intriguing, and it all makes me want to research these subjects more on my own! And you certainly deliver it in a VERY knowledgeable matter-of-fact NON-"CLICK-BAIT" fashion, which I TOTALLY appreciate!! (I get SO tired of all of the melodramatics of so many content creators!) Your videos are more like little Masters degree theses than RUclips videos!! I keep watching your videos over and over to try to get everything straight in my own mind! GREAT stuff!
A better comparison are the similarities between Horus and Jesus. For the people that invented Jesus, if you turned that paper in today you'd be kicked out of Uni for plagiarism.
Thank you for video, Neal I know it takes a lot to put a documentary like this out. It seems it would be a lot easier on you to filter in interviews with scholars between videos
2:10 “Unlike Jesus, Dionysius has two mothers, one divine, one mortal” If you look at the oldest Christian traditions, they call both the Holy Spirit (Divine) and Mary (Mortal) as mothers of Christ/Logos and Jesus respectively.
In Christianity and the mystery cults there are always two births: the first is from the human mother, and the second is a spiritual birth. In John Jesus says you must be born from above or born twice. Paul calls Jesus the "first born" of the resurrected. In Egyptian religion and the mystery cults the initiates are born after death through the womb of the mother goddess. _Death and Initiation in the Funerary Religion of Ancient Egypt_ by Jan Assmann: "In accordance with the principle of "transfiguration," as the correlation of this world's symbolic objects and actions with yonder world of values and realities, the coffin becomes the body of the sky- and mother-goddess, thus enabling the "placing of the body in the coffin" to be transfigured into the ascent of the deceased to the heavens and the return to the mother-goddess. The sky-goddess is the Egyptian manifestation of the Great Mother. A central aspect of this belief is the fact that the Egyptians imagined the deceased as being the children of this Mother-of-all-Beings... The texts underline the indissolubility of this bond, or more precisely of the embrace into which the deceased, when laid in his coffin, enters with the sky- the mother goddess, the goddess of the dead. The concept of rebirth, however, still plays an important role. "I shall bear thee anew, rejuvenated," exclaims the sky-goddess to the deceased in one of many such texts inscribed on or in nearly every coffin and tomb. "I have spread myself over thee, I have born thee again as a god." Through this rebirth, the deceased becomes a star-god, a member of the AKH-sphere, a new entity. This rebirth, however, does not imply a de-livery, a separation, but takes place inside the mother's womb, inside the coffin and sky... The deceased, now reborn through the sky-goddess as a god himself, is subsequently breast-fed by divine nurses and elevated to the heavens." _Instructions for the Netherworld: The Orphic Gold Tablets_ by Alberto Bernabe: "It is appropriate to interpret that when the initiate says ‘I plunged beneath the lap’, it means that he penetrates inside the goddess’ womb in order to be born again, converted into a god... the fact is that we seem to have reasons to suppose that the Orphic initiate, re-creating very ancient beliefs of the Mediterranean world, believed that after having been born from his mother’s womb, he is received at his death by the womb of Mother Earth, from which he is reborn, but to a new, higher, and divine life... In sum, the womb of Persephone is simultaneously the womb of the earth, also used as a reference to the innermost part of the underworld regions, the protective womb of the mother or nursemaid in which the child takes refuge, and the maternal womb from which the initiate hopes to be reborn, transfigured and divinized... Since the beginning of the 20th century, historians of religion have compared the refrigerium in the Beyond of some Orphic tablets with this eschatological development of ancient Egypt. The suckling by which the deceased is initiated into the Orphic-Dionysiac rituals may also have vague parallels in the funerary images of Egypt."
Dionysus is the (androgynous) Demiurge. He was slain by the Titans (like Osiris) and cut into 14 pieces (representing the seven upper worlds and the seven lower reflections). In the Kabbalistic Tree of Life, the aspect of the Sun represents the Elohim hierarchy (6th Sephira, heavenly ego), Jupiter-Zeus represents the Kyriotetes hierarchy (4th Sephira, cosmic intelligence), and so on: The lower reflections of these seven (Sephiras, which are PART of heavenly man) manifest (reflect) in the tenth Sephira, on earth and in earthly man. Zeus is irregular noun; the genetive is Dios. Nysa was a place (between Phoenicia and Egypt). Thus Dios-Nysos is the Zeus of Nysos or Jupiter. Dionysus was a spirit of materiality with a solar-eye, life-force and all-pervading spirituality or soul-quality (from the book, "Great Dionysiak Myth"). Sometimes Dionysus is divided into Apollo-Dionysos (Helios-Dionysos); to the sun spirit and the earth spirit. Sun-Spirit represents (kind of) the FATHER. Earth-Spirit represents (kind of) the Christos. Dios-Nysos is a limited transformation and distortion of the original ideas. John 10:8 "All who ever came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them."
Thanks for the share brother ….. much appreciation and respect for you and work you bring . Very packed with info , dare I say Gnosis 😬 as well as bread crumbs to follow . I could be stretching it on this , yet in video I thought I saw image which reminded me of honoring Juno ( wife of Jupiter ) whom is the feminine of genius . That being part of Italian/Roman traditions which supported a variety independent beliefs whom at times of year all united together for peace and unity . I wonder if this contributed or had any impact towards freedom , peace and individual rights of people as opposed to the dogmatic enforcing of law or a revelation upon its people . Just a seeker here thinking out loud ….. Be well ….. ✝️
Neal, watched it twice. You cracked the nut and solved, imo, the riddle of Christianity. Demetrius and the hypsistarians wove it all back together. Very nice. Any recommended sources for the hypsistarians? Have a feeling this is new ground.
I love the Bachnalia, the nyphys, fae, fairy’s, hedonism, yet, metaphorical metaphysical fun. Dance and music it’s beautiful, the Jesus stuff is a great children’s story. Love the pagan mythology
Fuck Bru I love the way you do your videos you're very honest and really grounded just a beautiful mind really searching for the truth not to arrogant to openly admit if you're not sure about something eventhough you're extremely knowlageble and really open minded and I'm impressed about your guests not little arrogant stupid idiots but really educated people who seem to enjoy your enthusiasm and just honest way of getting down to the truth and it's beautiful watching you. keep going much love thanks for your good work regards from Switzerland ps sorry if my grammar isn't correct but I'm German-speaking.. tried my best
Have u read manly p hall, secret teachings of all ages , this is where I heard of most these topics ur videos r great help to help rap my head around these complicated topics ❤
I haven’t listened to the whole thing yet, but there is a book that draws the conclusion that Dionysus and Jesus are one and the same, and it’s called The Immortality Key. It’s about the pagan continuity hypothesis (not sure I buy it wholesale, but it does make a strong case).
www.patreon.com/GnosticInformant
Please Consider joining my Patreon to help finding scholars to bring on. Any amount helps me. Thank you existing Patrons.
CHAPTERS:
00:00:00 - Intro
00:00:45 - Main Arguments (Dionysian Roots of Christianity)
00:12:10 - John's Bacchae
00:14:08 - Greek Tragedy Mimesis
00:23:55 - Inverted Mysteries
00:28:24 - Syncretism & Competition
00:34:58 - Last Pagan Generation
00:40:40 - 'Lamb of God' Vs. 'Bull of God'
00:49:40 - Thracian Horse Rider
00:59:35 - Transfer of Eleusinian Mysteries
01:10:00 - Dionysian Eucharist
01:11:17 - New Testament World
01:12:56 - Judaizing the Greek World
01:15:55 - Hypsistarians & 'God-Fearers'
01:22:22 - 'Right Hand of God' (Benedictio Latina Gesture & Sabazius)
01:29:41 - Conclusion
Feel free to refer to my 2 hour video on Dionysus. It has content that is no longer available on the web.
nice job Neil....impress a lot!
- if you want more info about "Epiphany time" what other meaning/layers I have some.
-if you want my attempt/answer on what "Abrasax" what it mean/be... I have.
- and other exemple about all that "purple subject" and other related stuff around all this... I can too!!
you...Lady Babylon.... mythvision... on a other level!!
Ancient Mystery Channel is very good on Sumerians etymology and it show a other layers on all that.
Dionealys
@gnosticinformant is there an email or way to contact you in a more private setting? I have come across something I feel to be important about this subject. It shouldn't take more than 3 to 4 sentences to explain and i feel it very relevant. It involves the "calculation" of a number. I would appreciate you very much.
We need to get you on Joe Rogan's podcast
The “Last Supper” plus “Dionysus” tableau scandal at the Olympic opening ceremony brought me here.
Me toov
Great place to find info on such subjects
Same here
"The parallels are too striking to ignore."
Christians: Hold my chalice
This video is going to be an epic comparison of Jesus and Dionysus! Im watching from start to finish NOW!
+1
You've already seen it😂
Lol😅😅😅
Just did. Fantastic
Derenysus
Consuming the body and blood of Christ has bothered me since childhood 🕊
- The parish priest called me “the little heretic” .. he said I asked too many questions
The truth will set us free 🕊
well Jesus said that to his disciples meant to be for them only as a remembrance is what i believe and is a catholic thing, not all branches of Christianity do that.
The small evangelical cult I was from taught us that the wine and bread literally became flesh and blood - I would sometimes worry that the bread and wine would taste like flesh and blood during holy communion
The bread is the physical body while the wine is the spirit, to consume both creates a union between man and female, the man being the material and the female the divine, the groom and bride marry into one.
When the male becomes female and the female becomes male, that is when you will enter the kingdom.
The orthodox and it's splinters have lost the true meaning of the Eucharist.
@@CausticSpace that’s really interesting- do you have a source on that? I’m still deconstructing from Christianity but I enjoy learning about the real roots of what may have been the original religion
@@Leggiebeans Gospel of Phillip and Gospel of Thomas off the top of my head are good reads
Deconstructing from the religion of Christianity is good, but one must not lose sight of the Truth in doing so.
Well done and very thorough! My brother (a pastor) adamantly asserts Christianity is unique and any similarity with other religions or ancient characters is because they copied Christianity. Dates do not seem to matter because what he was taught in Bible College is definitely the correct truth. Indoctrination is powerful and difficult to overcome.
The gnostic informant calls himself an amateur, but he has obviously done years of research and has a working knowledge of Ancient languages. I personally have a couple of crappy RUclips channels, so I can tell that it must’ve taken weeks of editing to accomplish this video.
shhhhh ! don't wake him up from his nice warm cozy little dream !
I've been wondering where you've been, Neal, and hoping all is well with you! I clicked this link with such a swiftness. Thank you for all your contributions!
Me too lol 😉
same
Thanks for being so quick
The long awaited. Neil one of the best to do it, with these amazing historical/religious documentaries.
Lol😅
Crazy how much Christianity borrowed from Paganism.
Then persecuted them for being pagans lmfao
Christianity pretty muched plagiarised paganism. Twisted the narrative to suit the monarchical narrative to control the masses. While exterminating, anyone still practising paganism. The 400-year "witch trials" was probably the peak of that.
..or is it just a type of paganism..
or paganism went into the temple
@@DaveHawthorne-lk9mzor you’re just an idiot defending your imaginary god
I love how your music is all Skyrim loading screen music 😂
It works so well lmao
This was so packed with information it will require many watching. Excellent work showing the connections and providing where the info came from.
You are doing sterling work Neil, this content is top notch- greetings from England .
This was amazing, Neal! Yours is hands down the best channel on RUclips. I immediately wanted to rewatch this video as soon as it ended. But I think I’ll rewatch your last Dionysus video from a few months ago, first, and then watch this one again. 😆
When you posted that last one, I shared that gem with everybody I know! It blew me away. I can’t believe you’ve done it again!
Thank you so much for the research you do. 🙏
Nice New Video, Neal!! Love that intro.....You actually had me squinting.....🤣
I thought they said squirting
This was soooo smooth. Thank you!
It’s so funny how we hyper focus on worshipping these gods when they were just showing us the path to embodying our highest potential.
Worship. Never. 😊 Jesus said "you too will do great things, even greater than I" The Mystery of 🎄 is immortality, the great Lie..We don't Die. Hel no⚡🦚
@@annaaurora81303evangelical idiot 🤡
Ye are gods
Just started watching, but putting comment already for algorithm. This will be phenomenal as always! Thanks Neal for your HARD work!!!!
dope vid
good and careful research my friend Neal!Congratulations on your effort to highlight these unknown and complex religious cults of the ancient world!
When you see this laid out like this, so well its SO OBVIOUS. You can not argue with this
You never brought up the fact that Dionysus is represented as Zagreus the son) Sabazues (the father) and Dionysus the frenzy(the holy Ghost)
What about Syionysus and ZioSysisyinious?
@@CraigStCyrPlus what?
@@bradlyclark8943 Sounds like you have some reading to do.
@@CraigStCyrPlus there's no such thing.
Frenzy isn't in Christianity. That's Odinism.
Why was he called the good serpent and given the Ichthyus, which was Ea's symbol? Ea's symbols are the fish and goat, Capricorn december 21st is always the big holiday. The things that were big no-no's were hybridizing with mankind, giving them long life, and teaching them, but it's okay to mess with Jaochim and Anna to make a Mary incubator? Everyone is either worshipping Nephilim or the idea of a god ( El, Thor, Zues, Yahweh? ) who hated humanity and attempted to wipe it out of existence. Make it make sense. Wait till people realise the Baphomet is made of the symbols of Prometheus, Mithra, Sol Invictus, Ea Enki, Dagon Oannes, Thoth, Hermes Mercury all smashed together into a booby-goat mosaic of Satan, the creator and teacher of mankind, whos buddies like to take our women folk as wives and fight their cousins over it.
Why press Bahomet when you have Jesus? Already been done by the platonic-dionysian-jewish synthesis. Neals video proves it. Just become eastern Orthodox.
I think you are on to something with your first theory. Growing up Christian, you are taught that the unison of man and god is normal for belief. Then you notice that philosophy is missing in all the other modern religions, and only exists in the ancient ones. So then, if you are curious enough, you begin to wonder if Christianity's roots are of a long ancient past. Then you find out about the even more ancient, antediluvian period, where the concept of the god/man was very common, but instead of being a concept only from the "good guys", it was used by all sides. Even in the Bible, its all about the son of the serpent vs the son of the true God. Genesis 3:15 said it plainly when God was speaking to the serpent,
"I will put enmity between you (the serpent) and the woman (Eve), and between your offspring and her offspring; he shall bruise your head, and you shall bruise his heel."
Most of Christendom interprets that as the church of Christ overcoming those who stand against Christ (children of the serpent), because crushing a head is more lethal than getting bit on the heel, and most interpret offspring as being plural, even though the word doesn't have to be plural, like 'your deer' can be singular or plural. However, anyone who really thinks about it would understand that through most of mankind's existence, even in most countries today, being bitten by a venomous snake anywhere is a death sentence, and just as lethal as a snake's skull being crushed. Also, just as the serpent's bite didn't keep Jesus in the grave for good, the Book of Revelation would imply that the serpent's head wound didn't kill him (son of the Serpent/ man of perdition/ THE BEAST) for good either. Revelation 17:8-12 states:
"The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction. And the dwellers on earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will marvel to see the beast, because it was and is not and is to come. This calls for a mind with wisdom: the seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman is seated; they are also seven kings, five of whom have fallen, one is, the other has not yet come, and when he does come he must remain only for a little while. As for the beast that was and is not, it is an eighth but it belongs to the seven, and it goes to destruction.
Then, Revelation 13:1-4, which is about the first beast:
"And I saw a beast rising out of the sea, with 10 horns and seven heads, with ten diadems on its horns and blasphemous names on its heads. And the beast that I saw was like a leopard; its feet were like a bear's, and its mouth was like a lion's mouth. And to it the dragon gave his power and his throne and great authority. One of its heads seemed to have a mortal wound, but its mortal wound was healed, and the whole earth marveled as they followed the beast. And they worshiped the dragon, for he had given his authority to the beast, and they worshiped the beast, saying "Who is like the beast, and who can fight against it?" "
But wait, there is more, Revelation 13:11-18, which is talking about the 2nd beast (false prophet), but it talks about the attributes of the 1st beast that the 2nd beast is glorifying:
"Then I saw another beast rising out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb and it spoke like a dragon. It exercises all the authority of the first beast in its presence, and makes the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose mortal wound was healed. It performs great signs, even making fire come down from heaven to earth in front of people, and by the signs that it is allowed to work in the presence of the beast it deceives those who dwell on the earth, telling them to make an image for the beast that was wounded by the sword and yet lived. And it was allowed to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast might even speak and might cause those who do not worship the image of the beast to be slain. Also is causes all, both small and great, both rich and poor, both free and slave, to be marked on the right hand or the forehead, so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name. This calls for wisdom: let one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man and his number is 666."
Last but not least, Revelation 9:1-11
"And the 5th angel blew his trumpet, and I saw a star fallen from heaven to earth, and he was given the key to the shaft of the bottomless pit. He opened the shaft of the bottomless pit, and from the shaft rose smoke like the smoke of a great furnace, and the sun and the air were darkened with smoke from the shaft. Then from the smoke came locusts on the earth, and they were given power like the power of scorpions of the earth. They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any green plant or any tree, but only those people who do not have the seal of God on their foreheads. They were allowed to torment them for 5 months, but not to kill them, and their torment was like the torment of a scorpion when it stings someone. And in those days people will seek death and will not find it. They will long to die, but death will flee from them. In appearance the locusts were like horses prepared for battle: on their heads were what looked like crowns of gold; their faces were like human faces, their hair like women's hair, and their teeth like lion's teeth, they had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the noise of their wings was like the noise of many chariots with horses rushing into battle. They have tails and stings like scorpions, and their power to hurt people for 5 months is in their tails. They have a king over them the angel of the bottomless pit. His name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and in the Greek his is Apollyon."
So now that you see the verses in there entirety, I can paraphrase from them. You can see that what causes the son of the serpent to be praised is that he was dealt a mortal blow, but yet he lived. He was said to be, not to be, and would be again. Clearly it is all just riddle of 'he died and rose again'. Also, Dragon was also just a word that meant large/great serpent, and so if you just replace Dragon with ' great serpent', and Beast with 'son of the serpent', you can clearly see a Father son dynamic that is almost identical to the dynamic Christ had with his father, in that the dragon gave great authority to the Beast (offspring of the serpent), and resurrected him. The thing is, there are some differences, so I'm not saying Christ is the beast, but there is a lot in common, as it goes back to Genesis, that both would receive mortal wounds, but later in the bible you see both resurrected from them. Not only that, but the 2nd beast, AKA false prophet, right hand man, even he can breath life into an in animate representation of the Beast. This is all to show mankind that there is more than one entity that has the power to give and take life, but ultimately the one who can take the life of the soul is the most powerful, and the Lake of fire used to kill souls is the representation of God's ultimate power. This is why in the new testament, one verse says, "fear not him who can kill the flesh, but not the soul, for God can kill both flesh and soul."
(beginning of rambling)...You see on Gnostic informant and Myth Vision's channels, they talk a lot about other dying and rising gods, which the ancient world had many of. This is because apparently, the Watchers (fallen angles) and the Nephilim (their offspring) could pull the death and resurrection feat off potentially, because the nature of the Nephilim, being half divine and half man, have souls that do not die, like their fathers who are completely immortal. So every first generation Nephilim, being 50/50 divine/man, was basically going to live on in spirit even after their bodies died. So when you see Christ saying things like, "I am the bread of life...though you die, if you die in me, when you die yet shall you live", or "Do you not know that ye are gods", or when they are talking about Christ appearing and disappearing after his resurrection like a ghost, and when Paul spoke of our future glorified bodies like Christ, would be more flesh-less in the sense of how we have flesh now, we begin to see that many of the things Christ was saying, would really only apply to them if he were speaking to those who were like him, demi gods, as they would rule with him in the new kingdom upon his return. It could make one wonder if Christ was speaking to the angels who were watching the saga play out, as if that message was meant to impact them as much as his disciples he was talking to as well. However, Noah was Nephilim, as it was heavily implied in the book of Jubilees and/or Jasher, when Noah's father asked why his son looked like the angels, with glowing eyes, long blond hair, and bleach white skin. God didn't reply, but an angel told Enoch to tell Noah's father, Lamech, that he is the father. Funny enough, when you look at other flood accounts, where Noah is called by another name, because its another language, the story of Utnapishtim, Enki tells Utnapishtim to build an ark, because Enlil and the rest of the council of gods agreed to wipe mankind off the earth, but Enki defied his brother and the council, because Utnapishtim was his son, but no one else in the council knew that apparently. So Noah was a demi god, and that's probably one reason why the Nephilim existed after the flood as well, because it was in man's genetics. So who knows, maybe some humans souls can go on after death and some cant, but typically 2nd and 3rd + generations were fully mortal, unlike the 1st generation god/human hybrids. So maybe we all die the same, but its an unknown ...(end of rambling).
Anyways, i'm getting off point with a lot of theory, but let me get back to solid givens according to texts. The 1st beast, which is the son of the great serpent, is said to have been, then wasn't, but is about to rise out of the bottomless pit and to go to destruction. Now, the book of revelations isn't in order of events, as its a bunch of different parallel timelines with different symbolism in order to show different aspects of one event. The thing is that the 1st beast is without a doubt Apollyon, a god of the underworld; the bottomless pit. The bottomless pit is where the Watchers were imprisoned until judgment day for all. So when Revelation 20 talks about the great dragon (beast's father) being put into the pit for 1000 yrs, and then released, you can understand that the bottomless pit, AKA abyss, or 'the deep', is the place where the Watchers were imprisoned. So when Apollyon rises out of the pit with his army, I don't know if that is before his death, or after his death, but he also goes or arises from the bottomless pit. Now notice the descriptions of the locusts. They are not talking about a single locust, but an army of them, so some of the descriptions are about how they sound when many of them are together. The have faces of men with women's hair, and teeth of lions. OK, so imagine lord of the ring elves with pure 1st generation vampire fangs. Now I mention vampire fangs, because in the book of Enoch, one of the 3 Nephilim breeds consumed human blood, so probably a trait from their fathers, and explains a lot of why there is so much blood rituals in so many religions. So before you thought I was crazy, I had to explain myself. Then they have wings. It says that all of them together sound like an army of horses, and seeing that there is so many, if their wings were like insects it would sound much different, so I think their wings are the eagle like wings we typically picture when we think of angels, but because there is an army of them, it sounds like an army of horses, and the locusts name probably is because whatever is before them gets obliterated in the same manner locusts make crops disappear. So I think the Watchers have maintained their looks as angels, there were just imprisoned. Fun fact, but most times prophets or anyone has seen angels in their true form, they often feint in fear, so the Revelation description of locusts is probably an accurate representation of angels rather than our PG13 version of just humans with eagle wings. The tails may give it a Cell from Dragon Ball Z look, but they probably looked bad ass.
My whole point is that I think there is a lot of material to show that what you mentioned is possible. The religion of the angels could be the same regardless of the factions, but they are just fighting for who rules, not to change the traditions of the heavens and the earth. So its very likely any of your scenarios could be true. We could be worshiping vampires for all you know. We could be worshiping demons. The bible does talk about people doing that, most not knowing they are, because they just don't have the facts. Christians always want to talk about how crafty the devil is, but then always act like the devil couldn't have fooled them this whole time. They really underestimate a being who is inherently many times smarter.
I always wondered when you and Dr. McClellan would converge. Would love to hear you two speak in a podcast format or discussion regarding the subject matter.
Interesting that they used this exact symbolism during '24 Olympics
Thanks for responding to Dan. I was really bothered by that episode. Dan was responding to an outlandish claim in a pop-culture book, then applied it to all Dionysus scholarship.
If Judaism and Bacchism had nothing to do with each other, why did Justin name Priapus as the good created before everything? Clearly the truth is more complicated than just squinting.
im fine with it. We can disagree. Much of this stuff is very speculative but I agree with you at the end of the day. I think it becomes painfully obvious the more I get immersed in the primary sources.
WOW! I cant imagine the work that went into this documentary. Amazing ! Thank you ❤
There were some things I didn’t know prior to watching your documentary. For example: I didn’t know Dionysus rode on a donkey. Thanks for the extra details.
yo
Legendary
Keep up the good work.
Favorite part! 1:05:42
Been missing you Gnostic Informant 💯✌️💕🤘
Wow! This is an Epic Masterpiece 👏🙌. I'm so happily informed that I'm simply speechless❤
Do Christians believe that these similar stories aren’t actually older than the Bible. That Noah’s flood predates the flood in the epic of Gilgamesh ?
Does it matter? They tell of the same event from a different perspective.
Dionysus (Titus) is on a Donkey because Vespasian his father bred them,lol.
Welcome back buddy! Its been a while. You've been missed 😊
Not by me
Amazing work, the info, the graphics, subscribed.
I am so overwhelmed with all this freaking information. And I'm only an hour into it! It's no surprise you put this video out 5 months ago.
Neil, further to the Thracian horseman motif - add to that the 4th century sandstone bas-relief of the falcon-headed Horus on horseback spearing a crocodile (Set?). Discovered at the Faras archaeological site, Upper Nubia (Housed at Département des Antiquités Égyptiennes du Louvre, Room 180, Item E 4850).
Add to this, there are interesting analogies and linguistic connections to defeating a crocodiles, 🐊 which later becomes St George killing a dragon. 🐉
the root word of Messiah in Hebrew and other Semitic languages means “to anoint”
Anointing a king with oil is a common motif. The Bible has the exact prescription of what their anointing oil is, with mirror in it, and other substances, including many people, canna bosum or cannabis to be one of the oils.
The root word in Semitic languages for anointing is ‘yi-msah’. From where we get Messiah.
The word ‘yi-mash’ derives from the root word for crocodile, ‘timsah’.
That is, you rub the oil of the crocodile 🐊 over you, anointing yourself with the power of the animal.
I find it striking that this root word to anoint a lap dovetails with the image of Dionysis on a horse and St. George.
Fascinating. And thank you both you and Neil.
Great synergy and knowledge sharing happening here.
Horseman with a spear and a bird shows up in Slavic and Norse mythologies also.
Eventually synergies are created, and Odin has same attributes (crows as birds, spear) and later Odin hangs on a tree.
Most scholars say that Aldin was impacted by Christianity and Jesus. But the proto-Slavic at George like horseman is also an existing motif.
What’s so interesting about the Dionysus comparison is that is so obviously pre-dates Jesus and Christianity. Unlike the Odin example.
You said in the beginning that unlike Dyonisis Jesus had one mother, whereas Dionysus had two, one mortal one divine. But actually if you read the gospel of Thomas, Jesus says he has two mothers.
Oh wow amazing find tbh
After watching Dr Ammon, nothing else serms to matter. Lol
Hey if you add some "purple" to water, it may look like wine 🍷 😅😂
Purple rain.... Purple Rain!!🎶
bloodmoon and skull.
stairway to heaven.
white snow and the apple.... sweat dream...
Charles Manson.
From one devoted researcher to another, this one is absolutely stunning info. Keep it up my friend!!
There is a Dios Pater/Papas (God/Zeus the Father) and Dios Nysus (God/Zeus the Son). Jesus quotes Dionysus in Acts of the Apostles 26:14, and God the Father is called Pater, Deus, and Dios in the gospels (Ex. John 8:54), Latin Vulgate, and Catholic masses. I grew up Catholic, and in the Spanish masses God is called Dios. Jesus is Dionysus, and God the Father is Dios/Deus/Zeus. Zeus is also YHVH (pronounced Yehuh/Jew/Jeu, the same name his followers the Yehudim/Jews/Jeus call themselves). His full name is Jew/Jeu Pater.
Yes, Jesus is that of the Demiurge, but the Christ is that of the ineffable. One must create a union of both.
This was a phenominal video. well done!
wake up babe new gnosticinformant video just dropped
This is perfection… simply gorgeous
I beg to differ, it's horrible a complete failure
@@nerdvana101and you are?
[00:00 - 02:14] The speaker discusses the similarities between the Christian ritual of communion and the cult of Dionysus, suggesting that they are not as closely related as some argue.
[02:14 - 10:59] The speaker delves into the parallels between Jesus and Dionysus, including their divine parentage, miraculous births, and roles as the chosen heirs of their respective kingdoms. He also discusses the connections between the two figures in terms of their disciples, miracles, deaths, and resurrections.
[10:59 - 15:08] The speaker explores the thematic resemblances between the Gospel of John and Euripides' play "The Bacchae," suggesting that the author of John's gospel may have subconsciously emulated the tragic framework of the play while reshaping the narrative about Jesus.
[15:08 - 26:17] The speaker discusses the influence of Dionysian imagery and themes on early Christianity, including the use of Bacchic imagery by Clement of Alexandria, the connections between Jesus and figures like Orpheus, and the adaptation of Pagan symbols like the phoenix.
[26:17 - 31:02] The speaker talks about the connections between Jesus and other gods, such as Ion and Deus, who were celebrated on the same day as Jesus' birth, baptism, and the wedding at Cana (January 6th).
[31:02 - 35:16] The speaker discusses the connections between Dionysus and other gods, such as Osiris and Mithra, and their associations with sacrificial bulls.
[35:16 - 51:55] The speaker explores the connections between Dionysus and the cult of the Great Mother, including the horse-rider iconography found in regions like Phrygia, Cappadocia, and Armenia.
[51:55 - 1:10:29] The speaker discusses the rise of monotheistic tendencies in Greek paganism, including the worship of Theos Hypsistos ("God Most High") and the syncretism between Dionysian and Jewish religious elements that may have influenced the development of Christianity.
[1:10:29 - 1:18:52] The speaker delves into the historical context surrounding the defeat of Antiochus III and the subsequent displacement of millions of Jews to regions like Asia Minor, which may have facilitated the cultural fusion that gave rise to Christianity.
[1:18:52 - 1:26:25] The speaker explores the connections between the hand gestures used in early Christian art and the Dionysian symbolism of the "Hand of Sabazius," suggesting that this symbolism was repurposed for Jesus.
[1:26:25 - 1:32:08] The speaker discusses the evolution of the Dionysian cult of Sabazius into the worship of Theos Hypsistos and the mingling of these religious elements with Jewish immigrants, which may have contributed to the development of Christianity in Asia Minor.
I know you and related channels done lots of vids on these topics already cuz I seen most of them, but this one streamlines it all the best. It's like a better version of prior vids and info from podcasts n livestreams you and related channels been doin. Very good job. Did you have help? Great essay.
You nailed it Neil. Congratulations! 🎉
lol that intro 🔥
Superb video, mich revelation. Thanks infinitely 🙏🏻🙏🏻⚡⚡
Great content as always. I've studied this stuff for decades and you still manage to blow my mind
Some of your best work yet! I have to watch it again! So much here! Ty!
Persephone was called Kore because it is common to use euphemisms when referring to underworld deities for fear of invoking them. Similarly, Hades is called "he who has many guests". This has nothing to do with her name being particularly sacred. Also, Kore means girl or maiden. This can imply virginity, but the name itself does not mean virgin.
Ah now I'm getting my favorite chair and telling my boss I gotta get back home to watch this! 😊 hail!
lmao
@@GnosticInformant 😈❤
I don’t get it
Ok for some critique in Dan's defense (Not much).
When we look at these things we need to look at strata. Things invented in the past can affect the future, but things invented in the future cannot change the past.
And so we then beg the question, when the books of the canon were written what tendrils to the past where significant.
Lets talk about wine and wine making and then Bread and bread making.
Wine making started in Asia (likely east) and reached Asia minor at the time of the growth of Kura-Araxes. Before we start talking about indoeuropean we need to first recognize that Maycopt and Kura-Araxes were the early bronze age trigger to both indoeuropean and Hittite/Luwian. There is no significant technological culture in thes regions before these.
And we know that kura-Araxes was spreading because their settlements are found in Anatolia and the Galilee. And so its not surprising at all that a precursor to Dionysus is found broadly distributed over a vast area. Nor is it surprising that Mesopotamian gods are found or that many gods look similar to sumerian gods. Sumer had no copper, its initial trade contacts were with Samarah and some of the sites show extensive trade and gathering with lake Van region.
To simplify, Samarah and Hassuna cultures sit exactly on the boundary of kura-Araxes and even into the Jemdet Nasr there is continual trade southward along the Tigris with Sumer. These two cultures, Sumer and PIE are joined so to speak at their dirty, mining, hands.
Dealing with all of that let's address wheat.
Bread as we call it is not made from mesopotamian or levantine wheat. Yes the first wheat comes from the cinvergence of Syria and Turkeye at the Mediterranean But that is not bread wheat. The exact version of Bread wheat used in Europe to make cakes and other items comes from Armenia plateau. Its the combination of the aforementioned early levantine wheat and a goat grass called Aegilops tauschii strangulata which is indigeonous to Armenia. This wheat was not popularly used for thousands of years and only spread in the context of later migrations.
And so we now have three points of origin. We have
Wine from Asia via protoHittites/Luwians
Bronze from the divide between lake Van and Tell Shemshara
Bread making from Armenia.
If you draw a circle around all of these its a radius of a hundred miles and you are talking about something thats going on in Eastern Anatolia.
We have no choice to lay this upon cultural flow from the east during the middle/late bronze age.
And so the tendrils to the past do reach deeply eastward, and in this case not to Sumer, who we can thank for beer culture, but in the direction of azerbiajan, kurdistan and northwestern Iran.
Having dealt with the deepest tendrils, you have done alot of good work showing links between Ephesus and surounding culture so lets take the bible apart.
7 books of Paul -Anatolian Jew, well studied in Torah, mysticism seems to reflect desert sage.
6 unauthentic texts and Hebrews.
1 epistles of Jude and 2 Peter- Enochian literary sources. 2 Peter has 2 century christian theology.
1 James - Jewish perspective on the jerusalem movement and competing grecan ideas.
1 Apocalypse - rooted in Maccabean apocalypticism, and spun with Jesus interpolations.
3 epistles of John - credibly written by the last major editor of same named gospel.
1 peter -
21 texts.
4 gospels including Acts.
Mark - written in Alexandria.
Luke/Acts - source driven
Matthew source driven with a heavy eye on the Jewish law
John - multiple layers. The first of which is driven by greek influences.
So we know the church as distinguished from the gospels is driven by the attempt to universalize belief and included the inclusion of material from diverse cultures. The orthodoxy in the 8th and 9th century struggled with the problem of iconography (which islam called idolatry) and finally threw its hands up and basically was Que Sera Sera for all the idolatry that seeped into the church.
So that we can remove most of this strata. For most christians communion is not all that important.
In the next deeper strata od christianity we have the very diverse period that is characterized in many ways by gnosticism in its extreme. There is no doubt these are influenced by greek platonic and other philosophical notions as well as a fair dose of Egyptian belief of late antiquity.
Removing that strata we get down to the Early second century when the greco-roman hemisphere of christians were increasinly differentiated from the fading levantine hemisphere. We have two relevent texts, the secret sayings gospel, a protognostic gospel that tips its hat to Judaism, and the gospel of John, its anti-semetic competitor.
Its not an everything everwhere theology about anatolian gods that mesmerized christians, its about events that transpired in Ephesus. If we recall Ephesus became a major center for Pauline christianity, timothy was one of the Early elders of the Ecclesia. The problem in Ephesus is the "christians" are disrupting the synogogue and the Jews forbade them from entering the synogogue. And so, around 50 to 60 CE the christians, now with Paul over whatever horizon he went over, are free to explore their legendary Jesus (which Paul has given almost no details about). In this environment you see the Signs Gospel(alt. Dionysan Gospel) emerge. This text, following the Jewish revolt you probably have jesus followers fleeing the levant, many like Josephus think some of the war was a Jewish folly. In that context you have the anti-text being written, and they have a precedent, because Paul practically labels Yacov the Pious the anti-christ. On top of those layers you have the beloved disciple text, which attacks another version of Jewish "christianity" the short-list of secret sayings (the gospel of Tomas is toward the mid second century).
And so in this mileau of text and ideas we have different regional motifs entering and modifying theology in the form of literature.
Is there a Dionysan Jesus? . . . . .Yes, but its a very tiny Jesus in Gospel of John.
Is there a Moses Jesus? . . . .he's a sizable fraction of Matthew and Luke
Is there a Davidic-Messiah Jesus? . . . . according to Paul, he's coming.
Is there an unknown messiah Jesus? ..... Mark
Is Jesus the restorer of the Law? ... Matthew.
Is Jesus all things to all followeds? Both messiah and righteous unto the law . . .Luke
Is Jesus the Danielic Messiah? . . . .Revelations.
Is Jesus the Heavenly Aware (Enochic) savior? . . . .Jude and 2 Peter.
And so when we state that Dionysis belief had influences on the writing of christians, its also neccesary at the same time, in fact scholars would probably point ot first these other influences.
In fact this kind of helps the case, if you can say,
Yes, the accepted hebrew Tanakh (Sept Equive thereof) influence christian writings. Particularly making the point that the sayings in the gospels reflected both earlier Pharisean and Essenic writing which included non-accepted hebrew writings.
and so did greek literary styles of biography writing.
and so did the homeric literature through memesis (give examples) that we should not be surprised at all to see stark parallels between writings about greek mystery cults and christian writings given the very close parallels between christianity and mystery cults.
😊
GREAT STUFF NEAL! AWESOME VISUALS! Thank you for all your hard work on your videos.👍👍👍
its a good video mate, i appreciate your effort, thanks
There’s nothing new under the sun
where is under the sun?
Incredible work! Your scholarship in inspiring.
Scholarship isn't making up a headcanon and writing fanfiction of history.
You’re about to get a plethora of new viewers from the Olympics drama 😂
Keep up the great work my friend. I enjoy all your videos and even more watching people loose there minds over your content. Great stuff
judeo-christian is an oxymoron. its like saying watery-fire
Dionysus endorses this message 💪
Early Christians believed all religions in the ancient world had prophesied Christ, so they would shrug and say "yes, Dionysos was a prophesy of Christ our God".
Christianity is very similar to these paganism religions of greece and romans. Thank Allah for Islam
@@twahathomas3514 pedo guy married 9 years old girl and said God speak to him when in bed with the girl, woww
I know it is foolish to just accept stuff that people post on the internet, but your content is GREAT!! It is all VERY intriguing, and it all makes me want to research these subjects more on my own! And you certainly deliver it in a VERY knowledgeable matter-of-fact NON-"CLICK-BAIT" fashion, which I TOTALLY appreciate!! (I get SO tired of all of the melodramatics of so many content creators!) Your videos are more like little Masters degree theses than RUclips videos!! I keep watching your videos over and over to try to get everything straight in my own mind! GREAT stuff!
So many interesting details that I didn’t know….Thanks for the video!
Excellent work.
A better comparison are the similarities between Horus and Jesus. For the people that invented Jesus, if you turned that paper in today you'd be kicked out of Uni for plagiarism.
what an intro. You are my G! 🙌
Yo
@@Janedominic666 yoself already kno.0w😌
Thank you for video, Neal I know it takes a lot to put a documentary like this out. It seems it would be a lot easier on you to filter in interviews with scholars between videos
Dionysus, Jesus... they both tell you not to believe them as they're both "sus" 🤔🤷♂️🤣👉
It's nice to know that there are still enlightened people in the 🌎 ❤
2:10 “Unlike Jesus, Dionysius has two mothers, one divine, one mortal” If you look at the oldest Christian traditions, they call both the Holy Spirit (Divine) and Mary (Mortal) as mothers of Christ/Logos and Jesus respectively.
In Christianity and the mystery cults there are always two births: the first is from the human mother, and the second is a spiritual birth. In John Jesus says you must be born from above or born twice. Paul calls Jesus the "first born" of the resurrected. In Egyptian religion and the mystery cults the initiates are born after death through the womb of the mother goddess.
_Death and Initiation in the Funerary Religion of Ancient Egypt_ by Jan Assmann:
"In accordance with the principle of "transfiguration," as the correlation of this world's symbolic objects and actions with yonder world of values and realities, the coffin becomes the body of the sky- and mother-goddess, thus enabling the "placing of the body in the coffin" to be transfigured into the ascent of the deceased to the heavens and the return to the mother-goddess. The sky-goddess is the Egyptian manifestation of the Great Mother. A central aspect of this belief is the fact that the Egyptians imagined the deceased as being the children of this Mother-of-all-Beings...
The texts underline the indissolubility of this bond, or more precisely of the embrace into which the deceased, when laid in his coffin, enters with the sky- the mother goddess, the goddess of the dead. The concept of rebirth, however, still plays an important role. "I shall bear thee anew, rejuvenated," exclaims the sky-goddess to the deceased in one of many such texts inscribed on or in nearly every coffin and tomb. "I have spread myself over thee, I have born thee again as a god." Through this rebirth, the deceased becomes a star-god, a member of the AKH-sphere, a new entity. This rebirth, however, does not imply a de-livery, a separation, but takes place inside the mother's womb, inside the coffin and sky... The deceased, now reborn through the sky-goddess as a god himself, is subsequently breast-fed by divine nurses and elevated to the heavens."
_Instructions for the Netherworld: The Orphic Gold Tablets_ by Alberto Bernabe:
"It is appropriate to interpret that when the initiate says ‘I plunged beneath the lap’, it means that he penetrates inside the goddess’ womb in order to be born again, converted into a god... the fact is that we seem to have reasons to suppose that the Orphic initiate, re-creating very ancient beliefs of the Mediterranean world, believed that after having been born from his mother’s womb, he is received at his death by the womb of Mother Earth, from which he is reborn, but to a new, higher, and divine life... In sum, the womb of Persephone is simultaneously the womb of the earth, also used as a reference to the innermost part of the underworld regions, the protective womb of the mother or nursemaid in which the child takes refuge, and the maternal womb from which the initiate hopes to be reborn, transfigured and divinized... Since the beginning of the 20th century, historians of religion have compared the refrigerium in the Beyond of some Orphic tablets with this eschatological development of ancient Egypt. The suckling by which the deceased is initiated into the Orphic-Dionysiac rituals may also have vague parallels in the funerary images of Egypt."
good point
Dionysus is the (androgynous) Demiurge.
He was slain by the Titans (like Osiris) and cut into 14 pieces (representing the seven upper worlds and the seven lower reflections).
In the Kabbalistic Tree of Life, the aspect of the Sun represents the Elohim hierarchy (6th Sephira, heavenly ego), Jupiter-Zeus represents the Kyriotetes hierarchy (4th Sephira, cosmic intelligence), and so on: The lower reflections of these seven (Sephiras, which are PART of heavenly man) manifest (reflect) in the tenth Sephira, on earth and in earthly man.
Zeus is irregular noun; the genetive is Dios.
Nysa was a place (between Phoenicia and Egypt). Thus Dios-Nysos is the Zeus of Nysos or Jupiter.
Dionysus was a spirit of materiality with a solar-eye, life-force and all-pervading spirituality or soul-quality (from the book, "Great Dionysiak Myth").
Sometimes Dionysus is divided into Apollo-Dionysos (Helios-Dionysos); to the sun spirit and the earth spirit.
Sun-Spirit represents (kind of) the FATHER.
Earth-Spirit represents (kind of) the Christos.
Dios-Nysos is a limited transformation and distortion of the original ideas.
John 10:8
"All who ever came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them."
You were literally here 4 months ago acting normal like you weren’t out there broadcasting private messages. You are gross. 🤮 scum of the earth. 🤢
lol this was only 4 months ago. Acting completely normal. But behind scenes. 🤮 gross.
first 45 seconds was gold
Thanks for the share brother ….. much appreciation and respect for you and work you bring . Very packed with info , dare I say Gnosis 😬 as well as bread crumbs to follow . I could be stretching it on this , yet in video I thought I saw image which reminded me of honoring Juno ( wife of Jupiter ) whom is the feminine of genius . That being part of Italian/Roman traditions which supported a variety independent beliefs whom at times of year all united together for peace and unity . I wonder if this contributed or had any impact towards freedom , peace and individual rights of people as opposed to the dogmatic enforcing of law or a revelation upon its people . Just a seeker here thinking out loud …..
Be well ….. ✝️
it's in the name... Dion-Ysus/Jsus
Definitely a classic Gnostic Informant video already! Good work!!
Wow! New video! Just now!? I have never been first to anything. Woo hoo!
I have just attained TRUE GNOSIS. Thanks a lot. Gonna have to review many times.
Excellent work
Neal, watched it twice. You cracked the nut and solved, imo, the riddle of Christianity. Demetrius and the hypsistarians wove it all back together. Very nice. Any recommended sources for the hypsistarians? Have a feeling this is new ground.
Excellent video GI
Thank you Neal 💯
This documentary is amazing! Great Work!
I always look forward to your videos Neal you are the cheat code to gnosis
Thanks neal. keep it up
44 seconds in, and I'm seeing Jesus so hard. 0_O!
It's almost as though a tiny insignificant bunch of herders borrowed other stories and made them their own so as to be a "real" sophisticated people.
your content is 🔥🔥🔥🔥
Hey! Love all your work. Where can I find citations?
My favorite part about your videos is quoting other writings. Thank you
Reject Jesus, Embrace Dionysus
I love the Bachnalia, the nyphys, fae, fairy’s, hedonism, yet, metaphorical metaphysical fun. Dance and music it’s beautiful, the Jesus stuff is a great children’s story. Love the pagan mythology
Outstanding work. Saving this so I can watch it again.
Fuck Bru I love the way you do your videos you're very honest and really grounded just a beautiful mind really searching for the truth not to arrogant to openly admit if you're not sure about something eventhough you're extremely knowlageble and really open minded and I'm impressed about your guests not little arrogant stupid idiots but really educated people who seem to enjoy your enthusiasm and just honest way of getting down to the truth and it's beautiful watching you. keep going much love thanks for your good work
regards from Switzerland
ps sorry if my grammar isn't correct but I'm German-speaking.. tried my best
🍷
Have u read manly p hall, secret teachings of all ages , this is where I heard of most these topics ur videos r great help to help rap my head around these complicated topics ❤
Such a great book. I always come back to that one. It's bigger than a bible lol
I love the comedy added
It helps digest the information
Gnosis UNLOCKED 👆🏛️🏺
I am blown away!
Nice work!!! 👍
Oh my goddess I love this! Amazing! Thank you so much, I’m going to have to listen again. I always wish that these were books I could buy. (Hint hint)
I haven’t listened to the whole thing yet, but there is a book that draws the conclusion that Dionysus and Jesus are one and the same, and it’s called The Immortality Key. It’s about the pagan continuity hypothesis (not sure I buy it wholesale, but it does make a strong case).
Then every church should be a swingers club gourging on wine!😂