Amen! Peter said it's for your children... Circumcision was for the males only and as early as the 8th day. There are NO restrictions for baptism, not according to sex, race, or age.
"Water doesn't save." Amen. But baptism does! Baptism is water with the word of God. Just as the Jordan River can't wash away leprosy; but with God's word with it, it was most effectual for Naamen the leper.
Love how you stoped right before verse 13 of Colossians 2 which explicitly discusses baptism replacing “circumcision of the flesh”. Are you lying to your people on purpose or did you not check the context after someone lied to you?
My motto is this: baptize your babies and anyone you like; the proof is in the pudding. We shall see in the long-run. Those who endure to the end, the same shall be saved.
Baptism is necessary for salvation for all men, including infants, for Jesus Christ has said, "Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God" [John 3:5].
@ericchampion7594 , Should we read, "destroy this Temple and I will raise it up in three days" in the context of those who heard Him then? It was properly interpreted for us after the resurrection and placed in the text. We should read what Jesus said of being born of water and Spirit in view of those born of water and Spirit on the day of Pentecost, because this is the fulfillment of it. Jesus wasn't teaching Nicodemus how to become born again. He was telling Nicodemus that unless one is born of water and Spirit, they can't even see the Kingdom of God because they remain in the dark (see context). This is why Jesus had to be lifted up like the bronze serpent in the wilderness. That bronze serpent was God's gift of repentance to the snake bitten Israelites. They gazed and were healed. We have something greater! Jesus was lifted up for us. Now juxtapose the rich young ruler whom Jesus told to keep the law, sell all, give all, and follow Him, with the Ethiopian eunuch in the book of Acts. The rich young ruler couldn't do the word of Jesus and went away grieved. The Ethiopian "did" all that was proclaimed to him through being done onto in baptism, and he went his way rejoicing. In baptism, the Ethiopian denied himself, his own righteousness. He cut off the offending member. He let the dead bury their own dead and followed Jesus, being buried by Him and with Him in His death. He died with Christ through baptism. He lost his life to find it... He was made a new creation in Christ. See Jesus' own baptism. He was baptized in water by John and apart from John's hands, but still in the water, came the eternal Spirit in the form of a Dove; and there also came the voice of the Father declaring the Son. This is the Spirit baptism. We are baptized, given the Spirit, and adopted by the Father, being Born of water and Spirit. It was at creation, the omnipresent eternal Spirit hovered over the waters. It was at Jesus' baptism that the Spirit came down on the Living water (Jesus) and it is in our baptism that we are clothed with Christ.
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God." "And whoever receives one child such as this in my name receives me." "Let the children come to me and do not prevent them; for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these." "When Jesus saw their faith he said to the paralyzed man, 'Son your sins are forgiven.'" It is through the faith of the Church that children's sins are forgiven, like the paralytic. And the Church receives children in His Name; into the Life of Christ, the body of Christ, into His Church that we may receive Him in return.
Your view makes no sense. You say that the early church has lots of falsehoods And that their beliefs are all over the place and yet you accept the teachings of the council of these very same people. You just arbitrarily choose to trust their view on the Canon and the Trinity and yet reject a belief that is arguably even more mainstream in Baptism regeneration and infant baptism
Matthew 18:1-4 “At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven? And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, and said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.” Jesus extols the purity and humility of children, suggesting they are inherently aligned with the kingdom of heaven. 2. Matthew 19:14 “But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.” This passage emphasizes that the kingdom of heaven belongs to children, indicating their innocence and special standing before God. 3. Deuteronomy 1:39 “Moreover your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, and your children, which in that day had no knowledge between good and evil, they shall go in thither, and unto them will I give it, and they shall possess it.” This verse suggests that young children, who lack knowledge of good and evil, are not held accountable in the same way as adults and are recipients of God’s mercy. 4. Ezekiel 18:20 “The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.” This passage highlights personal accountability for sin, implying that children, who have not sinned, are not subject to condemnation. 5. Romans 5:18-19 “Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.” This teaches that Christ’s grace and atonement cover all humanity, including those who have not reached an age of personal accountability. 1 Peter 3:21 “The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.” Peter describes baptism as “the answer of a good conscience toward God,” suggesting that an individual must have the capacity to understand and act in good conscience. This aligns with the idea that baptism is for those who are accountable. Romans 10:9-10 “That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.” While not directly about baptism, this verse underscores the importance of personal belief and confession, which a person must be capable of doing before taking saving steps like baptism.
When you turn baptism into law, 'the command of Christ,' you lose the entire thing. Baptism is gospel, it's promise. One wonders why baptize at all, if all you're doing is adding a new law in addition to the gospel. Resembles the Galatian error.
The whole craedobaptism argument is merely an argument from silence. There is nothing in the New Testament forbidding infant baptism. That's what you would need to find to say infant baptism is actually incorrect. The argument for paedobaptism doesnt solely hinge on the sign of the old covenant continuing in the new covenant as baptism isn’t merely a sign of the new covenant. That's only part of it.
As far as immersion, if you read early practices of the Church, they did not make a huge deal out of immersion. One quote talks about how they would look for a running body of water, if they couldn’t find one they would look for a standing body. If they couldn’t find one, they would then look for someone who had a water vessel like a tub in their home. If they couldn’t find that, they would sprinkle them with water. So as far as that, they didn’t make a huge deal out of it. Because baptism is not what saves you in the first place.
That is not the conclusion I take. The physical immersion does not save, but the thing signified, life with Christ and forgiveness of sin saves. What kind of water you use scarce matters for that
Also, Mark 7:4 says that they ritually baptized their dining couches, so unless they carried these to a river and dipped them, I see sprinkling going on.
Infant Baptism WAS ALWAYS practiced by Orthodox Christians. These are the Christians that wrote and preserved Holy Scriptures. These are the Christians that gave us The Nicean Creed.
Infant baptism didn’t become the main view of the early church, it was the practice from the very beginning!
Based
Amen! Peter said it's for your children... Circumcision was for the males only and as early as the 8th day. There are NO restrictions for baptism, not according to sex, race, or age.
"Water doesn't save." Amen. But baptism does! Baptism is water with the word of God. Just as the Jordan River can't wash away leprosy; but with God's word with it, it was most effectual for Naamen the leper.
Love how you stoped right before verse 13 of Colossians 2 which explicitly discusses baptism replacing “circumcision of the flesh”. Are you lying to your people on purpose or did you not check the context after someone lied to you?
Because it's Biblical
Just a reminder: We must read "unworthy manner" in the context of 1 Corinthians 11 in order to apply it rightly.
My motto is this: baptize your babies and anyone you like; the proof is in the pudding. We shall see in the long-run. Those who endure to the end, the same shall be saved.
Baptism is necessary for salvation for all men, including infants, for Jesus Christ has said, "Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God" [John 3:5].
Just a reminder: We must read "born of water"" in the context of the conversation with Nicodemus (John 3) in order to apply it rightly.
@ericchampion7594 , Should we read, "destroy this Temple and I will raise it up in three days" in the context of those who heard Him then? It was properly interpreted for us after the resurrection and placed in the text.
We should read what Jesus said of being born of water and Spirit in view of those born of water and Spirit on the day of Pentecost, because this is the fulfillment of it.
Jesus wasn't teaching Nicodemus how to become born again. He was telling Nicodemus that unless one is born of water and Spirit, they can't even see the Kingdom of God because they remain in the dark (see context). This is why Jesus had to be lifted up like the bronze serpent in the wilderness.
That bronze serpent was God's gift of repentance to the snake bitten Israelites. They gazed and were healed. We have something greater! Jesus was lifted up for us.
Now juxtapose the rich young ruler whom Jesus told to keep the law, sell all, give all, and follow Him, with the Ethiopian eunuch in the book of Acts.
The rich young ruler couldn't do the word of Jesus and went away grieved. The Ethiopian "did" all that was proclaimed to him through being done onto in baptism, and he went his way rejoicing.
In baptism, the Ethiopian denied himself, his own righteousness. He cut off the offending member. He let the dead bury their own dead and followed Jesus, being buried by Him and with Him in His death. He died with Christ through baptism. He lost his life to find it...
He was made a new creation in Christ.
See Jesus' own baptism. He was baptized in water by John and apart from John's hands, but still in the water, came the eternal Spirit in the form of a Dove; and there also came the voice of the Father declaring the Son. This is the Spirit baptism.
We are baptized, given the Spirit, and adopted by the Father, being Born of water and Spirit.
It was at creation, the omnipresent eternal Spirit hovered over the waters. It was at Jesus' baptism that the Spirit came down on the Living water (Jesus) and it is in our baptism that we are clothed with Christ.
"For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith - and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God."
"And whoever receives one child such as this in my name receives me."
"Let the children come to me and do not prevent them; for the kingdom of heaven belongs to such as these."
"When Jesus saw their faith he said to the paralyzed man, 'Son your sins are forgiven.'"
It is through the faith of the Church that children's sins are forgiven, like the paralytic. And the Church receives children in His Name; into the Life of Christ, the body of Christ, into His Church that we may receive Him in return.
Your view makes no sense. You say that the early church has lots of falsehoods And that their beliefs are all over the place and yet you accept the teachings of the council of these very same people. You just arbitrarily choose to trust their view on the Canon and the Trinity and yet reject a belief that is arguably even more mainstream in Baptism regeneration and infant baptism
It was the only view.
Matthew 18:1-4
“At the same time came the disciples unto Jesus, saying, Who is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven? And Jesus called a little child unto him, and set him in the midst of them, and said, Verily I say unto you, Except ye be converted, and become as little children, ye shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven. Whosoever therefore shall humble himself as this little child, the same is greatest in the kingdom of heaven.”
Jesus extols the purity and humility of children, suggesting they are inherently aligned with the kingdom of heaven.
2. Matthew 19:14
“But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”
This passage emphasizes that the kingdom of heaven belongs to children, indicating their innocence and special standing before God.
3. Deuteronomy 1:39
“Moreover your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, and your children, which in that day had no knowledge between good and evil, they shall go in thither, and unto them will I give it, and they shall possess it.”
This verse suggests that young children, who lack knowledge of good and evil, are not held accountable in the same way as adults and are recipients of God’s mercy.
4. Ezekiel 18:20
“The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.”
This passage highlights personal accountability for sin, implying that children, who have not sinned, are not subject to condemnation.
5. Romans 5:18-19
“Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.”
This teaches that Christ’s grace and atonement cover all humanity, including those who have not reached an age of personal accountability.
1 Peter 3:21
“The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God), by the resurrection of Jesus Christ.”
Peter describes baptism as “the answer of a good conscience toward God,” suggesting that an individual must have the capacity to understand and act in good conscience. This aligns with the idea that baptism is for those who are accountable.
Romans 10:9-10
“That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.”
While not directly about baptism, this verse underscores the importance of personal belief and confession, which a person must be capable of doing before taking saving steps like baptism.
When you turn baptism into law, 'the command of Christ,' you lose the entire thing. Baptism is gospel, it's promise. One wonders why baptize at all, if all you're doing is adding a new law in addition to the gospel. Resembles the Galatian error.
The whole craedobaptism argument is merely an argument from silence. There is nothing in the New Testament forbidding infant baptism. That's what you would need to find to say infant baptism is actually incorrect.
The argument for paedobaptism doesnt solely hinge on the sign of the old covenant continuing in the new covenant as baptism isn’t merely a sign of the new covenant. That's only part of it.
Submit to Rome.
As far as immersion, if you read early practices of the Church, they did not make a huge deal out of immersion. One quote talks about how they would look for a running body of water, if they couldn’t find one they would look for a standing body. If they couldn’t find one, they would then look for someone who had a water vessel like a tub in their home. If they couldn’t find that, they would sprinkle them with water. So as far as that, they didn’t make a huge deal out of it. Because baptism is not what saves you in the first place.
That is not the conclusion I take. The physical immersion does not save, but the thing signified, life with Christ and forgiveness of sin saves. What kind of water you use scarce matters for that
Also, Mark 7:4 says that they ritually baptized their dining couches, so unless they carried these to a river and dipped them, I see sprinkling going on.
Infant Baptism WAS ALWAYS practiced by Orthodox Christians.
These are the Christians that wrote and preserved Holy Scriptures.
These are the Christians that gave us The Nicean Creed.