ELECTRONIC Air Filters are USELESS! Here's Why!
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- Опубликовано: 2 авг 2024
- After conferring with a RUclips viewer about electronic air filters, I thought I'd do a video expressing why I feel most electrostatic/electronic air filters are useless! It's not that they are a horrible product. It's mostly to do with the poor maintenance that the majority of them receive. This poor care results in a useless product which leads my belief that installing them are pointless most of the time. There are better products on the market requiring less maintenance.
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Actually, I do take care of mine as they should be. Indeed, my thermostat displays a giant warning when it comes time to clean it. It seems misleading to judge the worthiness of a filter based on what people do or do not do to them; therefore, I take it that electrostatic or electronic air clearners do work and are worth it. On their own merits, that is. Thank you.
Drops mic* lol
People who dont clean their electronic cleaner are not going to maintain filters either!! Just a thought
That’s actually a good point
Installed Honeywell units in my last home and they made a huge difference in air quality especially on smoky days in the pacific northwest. Will be installing them in my new home soon as well. I agree with the guy that was arguing with the poster with regards selling them, you should at least give people the weighted options before deciding everyone is too lazy. People need to change the paper air filters regularly as well or they royally mess up the efficiency of the system. But then I'm an engineer and do everything myself and maintain my systems regularly.
Arguably the advantage of electrostatic filters is that the homeowner can wash it themselves, but not everyone appears to.
Agreed. I have had one, and I loved it, so lo g as I maintained it. I knew, when I was no longer hearing an occasional snapping whenever a dust particle came across an element that it was time to pull it and clean the elements (usually after a year). There was seldom much dusting to do as long as maintenance was done.
Really it trapped dust that well?
So I have the system you are describing. I did try to clean it 4x a year but for awhile now it won't come on anymore. I want to replace it with a paper type filter but I can't find anything to fit. Can you help?
What are my options if I have an older hvac system with a low max MERV filter rating of 4 and I want to clean the air? I can't just stick in a high MERV media filter as I understand it.
You can say that again but in all areas of HVAC, folks don't take care of their stuff.
All areas of everything! Life skills are not required in school, but should be imo.
We use the Aprilaire units. They have a large pleated filter that still cleans the air even if they dont clean the grid. Same with humidifiers, if they dont maintain them they turn to junk quickly. In all honesty the people that have systems with all the bells and whistles have us on a twice a year schedule for maintenance anyway.
Joshua that's very true; many moons ago we had a customer with a Honeywell automated EAC which did the washing, drying and inserting. It was very expensive!
You mean if they pay someone to service?
Yeah, good point Josh, a system is only as good as the attention of the user. My mom used to put the plate assemblies in the dishwasher. Over the years they got kinda loose. They would arc once in a while even new but that increased with age. They did "work" but the installer put them right behind the return grille where a filter element should reside and the electrostatics upstream of the filter element. Being so exposed to all the incoming dust dirties them faster and increases the arcing.
I’ve never heard of someone putting them in the dishwasher. That’s interesting. Most of them can be cleaned with simple water
@@NewHVACGuide
They get a film residue on them, at least my parents' ones did, that didn't rinse away from under the faucet water.
What do you recommend instead?
You can count me on that hand because we do change them every three months and the amount of dust, dirt, and other airborne detritus is astonishing vis a vis standard Filtrete filters.
Nice video. I cleaned my elctrostatic filters every fall but last year I could not get rid of constant sparking. The filters are all sparkling clean. Maybe I should out adifferant filter in.
So after watching this video, its doesnt matter, IMO, whether its a electrostatic air filter or a media pleated filter, BOTH need to have REGULAR MAINTENANCE done on them. I had media filters and I changed them every 90 days, no issues except can be expensive. I currently use a K&N HVAC washable filter again I maintain it every 90 days, its not like a normal K&N for your car that you spray with oil it's just a media filter that you wash have to buy their cleaner and wash and dry before reuse, pain the the butt, I am not happy with the K&N mainly because it doesn't get sprayed with an oil maybe if it had the oil I would be happier but I've noticed more dust in my home since switching. SO since I do maintain my system on a regular basis and I do not want to pay ridiculous prices I will be upgrading to a electrostatic filter by WINGMAN1 which you don't wash but replace the media and the media is way cheaper but it will take more time then a pull out and push in a new media filter. Hands down if you suffer from allergies a HEPA filter is definitely your best bet but Again it MUST be maintained (changed) at least every 90 days. So again it just depends if you don't mind doing some maintenance that would take an hour and your somewhat mechanically inclined I would say go with the electrostatic but if you have a allergies or a busy lifestyle, like lot of us have, and or your not that mechanically inclined, or simply you just want a pull out and push in (and you pay for the convenience) then go with the HEPA pleated media filter. I am not disagreeing with what he said, I just think no matter which one you have or choose you still have to perform REGULAR MAINTENANCE ON THE SYSTEM, Goes back to the old saying ...pay me now or pay me later. The only comment I don't agree with is when he stated, "Should you sell people something that will be rendered useless" he answered "yes" well if that's the case then take all the filters out of all the big box stores because guess what they are rendered useless that's what they are designed to do! They have to be maintained (changed). I understand what he is saying for the average busy homeowner they just didn't know or was just too busy to care about their HVAC filter , I just would have been a little more careful making an absolute comment saying you shouldn't sell someone a product if it can be rendered useless. If you want to do it the proper way measure the pressure differential between the inlet side of the air filter and the outlet side of the air filter, then you'll know when exactly to change your filter but most homeowners don't care or want to spend the money to do it that way but even the way I just explained THEY HAVE TO BE MAINTAINED! So again no matter which one you decide on or currently have find out the maintenance schedule from the manf and try to stick with it, put a reminder in you electronic thermostat some of them have reminders that you can set the frequency of filter maintenance, put it in your google home or set a reminder in you iphone or hell go the old fashion way and put it on your calendar, or even write on "born on date" (when you installed it) and a "next change out date" (next date you need t change it out) with the size of the filter(so you know which size to get so your not taking it apart and seeing what size it is and putting back together then taking it back apart again to install ) and slap a sticker on the outside of the HVAC right on the front of the HVAC unit where it will remind you about it. Again IT NEEDS REGULAR MAINT. Just retired from working as a master electrician and HVAC specialist with my own company of 50 years. Now my son took over. Hope this helps. If i haven't stated it yet, "YOU NEED TO PREFORM REGULAR MAINTENANCE ON YOUR HVAC SYSTEM" Please don't make me say it again :)
Bought a new Trane heat pump system in 2006 with a Trane Clean Effects electronic filter. Maintained it quarterly and replaced the guts around 2013 to refresh it. It worked well all these years but noticed "stuff" getting by and into the coil again last year. Just replaced this week with a new PMAC. I'm hoping it works better and makes maintenance easier for me - especially during the winter when it was always a little more difficult to clean the Trane system as our outside water hose was winterized. One thing that our installer pointed out when he installed the PMAC is that it's flowing more CFM through our system than the Clean Effects allowed. We can feel that difference on our 2nd floor too.
I found twice a year worked well for cleaning, once each before either the cooling or heating seasons. Environments do differ, I'm in the Mid-Atlantic and dust levels are relatively low.
@@Sasha299md Also mid-Atlantic, and we're on our 3rd PMAC filter since October. But it works like a dream. We do have a household of 6 with pets, so...
@@wcraft The recent smoke from Canada's wildfires is what got me online. Wanted to see how well my current system Emerson/White Rodger electronic filter is protecting and whether to supplement with say either a HEPA or say a box fan fitted with pleated MERV 13 filters ala the Corsi-Rosenthal Box fans which were popular for Covid. So looking to improve the ultra-fine particulate material. Unfortunately they're predicting this won't be the only occurrence this year for us.
Not familiar with the Trane EV's but sounds more like a faulty install though not sure what "stuff" it was allowing to pass through, fine dust? I must say though I'm not a fan of how many installations are done, just adequate EV units with sharp airflow angles which harms both airflow and even distribution of air across the filter. Also what's with relying on the rather miser pre-filters that come with EV's. This applies generally to any filtering system used, like it's an after thought and it's just a must have. I'm a firm believer in using two types of filtering, first an upgraded pre-filer that's changed more frequently and use the EV for what it does best, the fine particles. Currently I use a 1 inch housing which accommodates a thin pleated MERV 6-11 filter and an equivalent to the pre-filter to capture the bigger particles. Now when cleaning the EV cells I find they're less dirty and the lower rated easily found MERV filter gets changed as you do, every 3 months.
Really the filter is more about cleaning the air for people and if it's doing that well it's also keeping the equipment cleaner. I know HVAC techs will agree, to do that well it means good airflow which is why I prefer the multiple filter system. I picked up an inexpensive anemometer to measure airflow ($25-50), it's useful both to judge how airflow is performing with various filters as well as troubleshoot/balance airflow to different rooms or parts of a house.
It's sad but many homes even today are built with substandard duct systems or compromises to save costs. It's a good idea for any homeowner to do an audit of their homes ventilation system, start with floorplan add individual room sq. footage, inventory each supply and return vent, and note both sun and exposure to the outside (windows/doors). There's little reason why there's any temperature difference beyond a couple of degrees for any living space other than cost savings or poor design. Sorry for the rant...
When cared for properly, they work great. We take care of quite a few multimillion dolllar homes with EACs and they get cleaned every 6 months
Just wondering , you talking about electro satic filters but title say electronic filter. Are we talking about the same thing. I was look,ing for info on the Elctro Static ones and the ones I have come across do not plug in
What is the highest MERV rating you suggest for media filter 20x25x4 and do you recommend one with a carbon or no?
If it's 4 inches thick like you say, you can probably handle as high of a merv rating as you want. Usually 11 or 12 is as high as you want to go though for general home purposes.
I finally realized that’s what the computer looking thing was on the side of the furnace. Going to clean it and hopefully it’ll work considering the amount of dust in my home hell it could be what’s causing it depending on how dirty it is beyond the vents.
Can you clean an electrostatic filter in a car cabin filter ? Or just replaced? Awesome video ! Thanks
Ok, but do they change their filters
I guess I am not the typical homeowner. I installed and maintain my electronic air filter. Most homeowners probably barely even change the regular filters regularly.
I install the 4 inch thick media filters on all new systems. They blower motor stays very clean, even after 10 to 15 years.
but somwtimes would that cause too much static pressure?
4” filters have more surface area vs. 1” filters with less static pressure.
Photocatalytic is uvc plus water vapor . So next to a humidifier makes sense with shielding for the plastic frame . Like 1/100th of rgf probably
The ones I like are the super filters they have on the Lowes checkout counter for 20 bucks. They block up so fast and they smoke that constant torque ECM . People buy them LOL
What if you do regularly maintain the the filter units?
I would like an answer too. If you regularly maintain the filters, are the the best or one of the best air filtration options?
@@timdemming6352 we decided to move forward with electronic air filters for each of our HVAC units. I am an air/water snob so I will be replacing them as often as recommended or needed-every 3 to 4 months. I would still love his opinion on the best alternatives and his thoughts on electronic air filters if they are properly maintained.
Maybe the third time is the charm, what are your thoughts on these filters if they are properly maintained? Appreciate your insight, as someone that stays on top of these things I was curious in your answer before buying one. Thanks in advance!
Seems like as one in the HVAC business, you might have a bias towards equipment which carries a recurring sale item (i.e., replaceable HEPA filters).
We install Aprilaire filters. The media can be bought on Amazon. Funny how even trying to help people, I get accused of being biased
Your title states Electronic like in the Honeywell F300 model......electrostatic to me are the one inch filters that have a couple or several layers of material in them where they generate a stat electricity when the air flow passes over them. Sorry, just my mindset. Great videos for contractors and homeowners Joshua.
Yeah. The video’s points could be made about electronic and electrostatic filters
I lived in a house with an electronic electrostatic air filter and I would wash it in the dishwasher. The inside of the dishwasher went to a gray color immediately and never recovered. It does work, but there is something to be said for disposable filters.
I didn't get the uv resistant one . I want reactivity to degrade formaldehyde
I do own one with a premesh filter then the actual cartridge followed by charcoal filter....it does actual work very well...im up on the maintenance... i wash the cartridge in dish soap in bathtub and its BLACK!... lil bit of love goes long way....im a heavy truck mechanic and i more than understand what preventative maintenance means..... my unit is 30 years old and still works correctly
Thanks for the video. Love the company name!
I’ve always recommended pulling out the guts and putting in a basic 4” merv 8.
I have a 3” MERV 10 24x24” at home.
I changed my customers to that and added a. Electronic air scrubber
Today I have my vents clean for the first time, since I own the house. I already have a electronics filter, the technician told me I should replace it with regular filters. I do keep my clean. He told me it does not keep allergies, dust particles and other things clean.
Probably wanted the electronic filter for themselves, they do great with fine particles including smoke and viruses.
Although i get the point. Most people have maintenance contracts on their HVAC/AC systems and that mels it maintainable by default. Those who dont either clean/replace or don't. Takes away tha validity on the lack of maintenance really. I have one two years now. At $40-$60 a filter for my system its already paid itself. My crazy allergies had been almost gone. I put it on the dishwasher every 3 months and done deal. With a smart thermostat to make sure im reminded to do so. All together we at the House could definitely see the difference with allergies and saving on the long term.
Thank you, I was gonna buy a E S filter today but needed to do research first compared to 3 month filters
Glad I could help!
Im really struggled with the perfect iaq solution for ocd sake . Addressing formaldehyde, viruses, and pm2.5 . I came up with large negative ion generators 500 million plus in the living space , positive ion plates by the return and electrostatic insert in the ductwork upstream from a uv light ( ghetto photocatalytic) additional hepa and carbon room filters . Still outdoor air is better. Keep working on it
Maybe some ventilation?
@@NewHVACGuide not for nuclear biological war fought over energy. But yes obviously its all positive pressure
I use large magnets to impove to uvc all around to ductwork in the line of site
I would argue they need weekly maintenance to keep up with the pollen and small particles they are said to capture
You gotta take into consideration that the people who clean their filters don't call you because they fix issues themselves.
You're talking about electrostatic filters. What about electronic filters? Perhaps a video that also addressing the differences.
You're right! They do suck! My house came with one of these and it got wer at some point and stopped working! It was that way when we bought the house! Now it's busted and I worry about the air being filtered correctly. At one point I was qouted $700 which I'm sure is much more post covid. I don't recommend for this reason.
Turn it off. And just find a merv filter that fits. No need to stress.
All it takes is one look at a coil behind an electronic air filter and good quality 4" filter. The difference is amazing.
As a commercial HVAC service technician... You're neglecting to mention the negative affects high merv rated filters have on your blower motor. You should also mention electric air filter/ scrubber that run on 24v are essentially useless and the biggest scam to residential customers. They need to be 120v. Electromagnetic filters and UV filters that run on 120v are super effective, if maintained, but I don't have to deal with the lack of maintenance as a commercial tech our clients are scheduled for quarterly maintenance.
Agree 100%
You are talking about electrostatic filters, which is not the same thing as electronic filters, which is mentioned in the title of this video. Therefore, the message in the title can be misleading. Electronic filters use electrical power to charge the media, which creates dust "magnet".
My guy comes by and does the cleaning with my annual maintenance package.
The right analogy would be to not even use MERV filters at all as you'll have to do maintenance and have to throw expensive filters out? I had electronic filters but I still put fiberglass filters ahead to get rid of large dust particles as I think the electrostatic can best handle small particles. After many years, I stop using it as It didn't seem to be doing much as I don't hear anymore zapping noise and read that it create excess ozone that is bad for health and environment.
Electrostatic filters and electronic filters are 2 completely different types of filtration systems. The terms are NOT interchangeable.
Yeah this guy is talking about electrostatic filter, not electronic filters which I'm interested in. Total waste of time.
Im allergic i tried every home depot filters then i fined out about washable electrostatic filter after one week of use i noticed that im stopped sneezing and coughing ,even my family started noticing that im filling much better so I will disagree with his judgement, and of course you have to clean it periodically no big deal
If your serious about clean air, for allergies etc electrostatic are the best Merv13 filters clog and pressure drop is harmful to your HVAC. Electrostatic don't do that. I recommend a low Merv filter so if you don't clean often you are at least not clogging the Evaporator
I just went ahead and bought a bunch of tio2 , powder coated / sealed my front door motorcycle helmet garbage cans cell phone ebike and work van . Now i am the air filter
The electronic air filters with the disposable media are by far, IMHO, the best IAQ product there is. It offers better filtration than Aprilaire 4 inch MERV 11 units, but without the added static pressure.
Remember, these ECM blowers can't take the beating the PSC one's could. Once that static pressure hits and exceeds .8, these ECMs start burning out. With electronic air filters, this isnt an issue
Nanoparticles and photocatalysis make environmental remediation possible. Hesitant on the indoor light activated stuff uv in the ducts is enoughalready . But they could powder whole buildings to fight pollution
Electrostatic filters are a godsend for people who suffer from seasonal allergies. Passive filters don't even come close. Moreover, electrostatic filters will begin to arc and make snapping noises when the cells are dirty, an easy reminder to clean the filter that no passive filters can provide.
I would say there useless, I think educating people about them is the key. I have one and didn’t know it.
Reason I’m here.
If you don’t hear the snaps and crackle it’s not working…. They’re definitely not usually clean enough to work
Snaps and crackles are startling! 😂
If the person who doesn't take care of their electrostatic filter is magically going to take care of another type of filter? How does that logic work?
If a Chevy Tahoe owner has never changed their oil, will switching them a GMC suburban change their list of responsibilities so they consistently change their oil?
If a person with a blue toothbrush doesn't brush their teeth will they brush their teeth daily if you switch it to a red toothbrush?
I would think the person who didn't brush their teeth would soon forget their toothbrush was now red, if they ever noticed. You know because the long history of not caring, or wanting to brush their teeth.
I always find it fascinating when people find a way to blame human choices on inanimate objects. Like blaming a woman's outfit for her getting graped. It's not the grapers fault. Blaming theft on an unlocked door, the thief didn't have a choice. Or blaming firearms for people dying. Firearms are dangerous & evil, it was an innocent victim that shot the person who died.
Well it’s cheaper in the long run to get one that you can clean. Instead of having to go to Home Depot every few months.
They pump out tons of ozone too - not good for air quality
Just as useless as not changing clogged media with high SP.
Electronic Air Filters are great when you can find parts for them. Carrier is a bunch of scam artists. I can't find an Ionizer Wire for a 31KAV012 to save my life. Maybe there's a generic 16 5/8" out there somewhere. I'll have to check Bryant or something.
Ouch. I hope you get a solution to that
Cleaning pre-filter and cells twice a year is fine but yes many homeowners are intimidated and fail to do so. I used to clean by soaking and giving a good rinse but drying was so slow. Best method for the cells, use the dishwasher.
Mine is now over almost 30 years old and only problem encountered was a failed power supply about 15 years ago. Was obvious, the light was unlit.
No maintenance equals failure......period
People don't change regular filters
the plated ones are absolute junk, as soon as a fine film accumulates on the cells, the dust just passes through. would need a merv 6+ filter upstream to get the bulk of the dust for them to stay effective - and then, just for the tiny particles that don't cause problems for hvac equipment anyhow.
furnace filter there to keep furnace clean, does little to nothing for iaq.
It's really a matter of degree though the EV plates do become less effective the more particles build up. Basically the inverse of the merv filters which continue blocking as airflow drops lowering air changes.
You're absolutely correct, the solution is to use a filter with midrange merv rating upstream which also benefits by having a course pre-filter (screen) to catch the largest junk like hair, bugs, etc. Use all to maximize filtering, minimize costs, and effort while maintaining better filtering and airflow.
@@Sasha299md If you're dedicated to cleaning the cells monthly with harsh chemicals and changing the pre-filter at the same time, and want to remove tiny particles and pay to run the fan continuously - it can be worth it. For the masses a merv 8 to 12 media filter that only needs to be changed every 12 months is the best option.
@@Jon-hx7pe Sure if you neglect the fact that not everyone is like you. What makes you think a fan needs to run continuously, are you leaving your windows open or have an incredibly drafty house? Honestly a merv 8 to 12 filter after 3-6 months will begin to restrict airflow. So if you wonder why your AC is running so long and upset your electric bill is so high you might think about changing that filter.
Personally I clean the cells twice a year and are thinking of upgrading my merv pre-filter so they only need once a year. It's not about what only needs to be done but people's long term health and comfort especially those with allergies and other ailments.
@@Sasha299md In order for an air filter to improve iaq enough to justify it, the fan needs to be running all the time - not air being filtered otherwise. The air filter is there to keep the equipment and supply ducts clean. A basic merv 8 does that fine.
4 to 5" thick media filters have a lot of surface area and can last 1+ year no problem. This is what makes them good because homeowners don't remember to change filters. 1" is more like 1 to 3 months.
EAC cells need to be cleaned monthly, they become ineffective, all it takes is a fine coating of dust on the plates. By the time you hear it clicking all the time, it's months after it should have been cleaned.
Had a eac and it was the worst filter I've ever experienced despite monthly cleanings, actually. It was working properly - it's just a crappy type of filter. From my small sample, furnaces with the EAC have the dirtiest blower assemblies, fiberglass is in the middle and the ones with basic merv 6 to 8 filters the cleanest.
They may work well in the lab when spotless but not the real world.
They've fallen out of favor.
@@Jon-hx7pe
Nonsense you think buildings can't retain conditioned air, do you run your own AC continuously!
If the electronic filter you had failed was likely either undersized, poorly installed/cleaned or flat out defective. They shouldn't click unless the pre-screen is damaged or not cleaned and dried properly. Personally if I waited until mine clicked I'd likely be cleaning less twice a year!
Modern systems are designed for human health and comfort just as clean equipment is needed to assure so. Hell why bother with an upgraded filtering system when the equipment has proven to last despite the use of those "crappy type filters." As the OP mentioned as have others here it's mostly the lack of maintenance that kills systems.
"4 to 5" thick media filters have a lot of surface area and can last 1+ year no problem."
Oh, so similar to the electronic filter's 6 inch plates. Or for that matter simply a larger but thinner and less expensive merv filter. At least we agree, more sq. inches is better in a filter.
Sorry but I'll stick with research and testing by the same folks who brought us these systems. I'll trust their and my own personal experience before your anecdotal claims.
It’s a 75 dollar spiff they need it
Bad argument. The same for all filters if we do not taking care or replace it.
I clean mine every 3 months.
Is it dirty when you clean it? Or do you just clean it as a precaution?
I agree. I clean mine once a quarter or 6 mo.
Most ppl don't clean them however that says nothing of their performance. Media are much easier to maintain and cost way less.
What I'm noticing is everyone wants the UV which doesn't do anything for particulates. And if I had to guess, electronic air filters are a good halfway measure instead of going True HEPA, which would change the characteristic you need from your air handler / motor, duct static pressure, etc.
If you web search for 'electrostatic filter', most hits are for passive media filters that claim to carry some sort of passive charge.
To that 'people don't clean them ' argument about *electronic * (active) filters, the same can be said for media filters. Bummer that
misleading info was used to generate views...
Incorrect. Not replacing media filters will eventually lead to an airflow issue so bad the system will malfunction. Not cleaning electronic filter cells will simply lead to a useless device never affecting airflow. Your comment is the bummer 🙂
They’re pretty much useless now they’re just SmokeEaters
This is a silly argument imo, because someone who's never cleaning probably isn't swapping out their dirty paper filters either.. either way low/no maintenance is gonna break something eventually.
The difference is some filters don’t affect air flow when they are dirty.
So about the eyebrows man. Did you get drunk pass out and your buddy shaved them
Maybe your title should be "maintenance is required" or " you can't fix stupid"
haha. Perhaps
Very poor reasoning. How many furnaces have you seen with 'regular' filters that have not been replaced? Live most! They get clogged and the furnace is struggling to even move air. Those filters are worse than useless because when they get clogged they damage the furnace. At least an unmaintained electrostatic filter won't kill the furnace.
That’s a good point. I think the overall thought here is the false sense of security in getting clean here when the filter is not maintained.
So you have no actual opinion of the filter, just a bad opinion of the people who use them. Doesn't make sense. Your paper filters are worthless too if no one ever changes them. So paper is also useless. Listen to what you are saying....and high merv can be detrimental to a heating/cooling system.
I installed an electronic air cleaner in my last house and I loved it! It had the two power cells and then it also had a backup filter behind the cells. People are just lazy, ignorant, or BOTH...I cleaned mine ever 3 mos. and I kept a log on the HVAC unit to track it. It's not difficult, people, you just gotta get up off your lazy asses and DO IT. The returns are more than worth the effort!