Big tip Tim. Make sure that battery box is well ventilated, as vehicles get very hot. I keep my windows slightly open also. If you haven't got a quality bctobc charger, hook a redarc 1250d to your set up. That battery will be charged in no time.
Gday mate, I should have mentioned it in the video. But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it. Plus i have the app to monitor all the battery read outs, including temp. It doesnt seem to get about 24-25 degrees. I have a 40amp Redarc changer installed. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Thanks Tim, I have just had a slimline Hardkorr 100a Lithium battery installed hard up against the cage in my rear cargo hold, with the BMS behind the passenger back seat secured to the rear frame frame of my Australian made drawer system (2010 made - pre Chinese imported). Extremely neat and did not miss a beat on my last trip to NSW/QLD & back - highly recommend
It kinda makes sense when you have a look inside one. There's quite a bit of free space, and manufacturers just add ill fitting foam inserts here and there to fill the voids. Gravity is your friend when upright, not so much in other orientations.
Myself like many others thought the same as you did. I put my lithium battery in 2 days ago and am fortunate to have the room to have it upright which is what I did. Good to see the manufacturer honoured the warranty as its big bucks and a long term investment. I’d imagine things should be ok now for you🤞
Yeah mate, interesting what I found out about how to mount the battery. But other manufacturers might say it’s ok to mount on the side. They are big bucks and need looking after. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Actually Tim I googled my manufacturers book of do’s and don’ts after watching your clip and they say it’s ok to mount them in any position but upside down. Without brand naming, my battery came from Perth and they have great reviews. So good luck once again.
Good tip Tim let's hope it reaches a lot of people. I have never heard of mounting batteries in any other orientation than upright. It must be one of those interwebs thingys. There is more to the guts of a battery than meets the eye.
Absolutely mate. So many people think that Lithium batteries in the 4wd can be mounted in any configuration, as i sure did. Until i read the manual. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Tim, thanks for clarifying the situation. I wasn't aware of lithium orientation being similar to AGM, where any orientation is accepted as okay. I just set about mounting all my Itech units in an upright position as I always did with AGM also, as any other orientation just seemed obscure to myself, seemed just wrong to me even when accepted by industry as the standard. Hope sincerely your issues are resolved as a result of orientation change. Regards, Wealie
Thanks for sharing Tim. It's good to know that not all lithium 12V batteries can be mounted in any which way. I thought they can. As so far, all the 12V Lithium batteries I've come across to date have listed this (being able to mount it vertically or horizontally) as one of their features. This is a good reminder that it pays to spend a few minutes reading the user manual, or even better, thoroughly read the spec sheet prior to purchase.
No worries mate. But, spot on, it pays to check. If the lithium battery you get says you can mount in any configuration, then you will be covered if a warranty claim is needed down the track. Cheers Tim
Hi Tim interesting video. I’m not sure if l have been fortunate, l have a 54 amp itechworld lithium battery under the bonnet for nearly 3 years. Minimal loss of charge, handled hot Perth summers and plenty of desert travel. My starting battery’s is Century lead acid. Good luck with your improved setup.
Bloody good choice, I have 3 x Itech 54 amp batteries - 162 amp hour mounted under the rear right window in my troll, opposite side to Tim. (4 of em would have blocked access to jack storage and tail light globe replacement access, as I'm running European rear qtr panel lights) Batteries have been extremely good thus far, unfortunately my Redarc BCDC25D has it's issues occasionally not delivering full omph. Looking at replacing it with Itech unit. I have gone one step further utilising Itechs lithium cranking winching battery as starter battery obviously under bonnet, so impressed by Itech gear thus far.
@@ianweal3081 Glad to hear someone else is doing well with the same battery. As for starter battery, l might go for iTechworld lithium starting battery, when my lead acid gives up.
@@ianweal3081 Far out, great setup you have mate. Plus the batteries are mounted on the same shelf but opposite sides. Ive got a 40amp Redarc changer also hooked up. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures yep, mine are on opposite side to yours, mounted on a sliding enclosed rack. Unplug three Anderson plugs, lower rear passenger seat back, undo two bolts, slide all three batteries forward and service via passenger door, so friggin ideal.
Great info mate a lot out there would have done exactly the same due to the misconception that Lithium batteries and not reading the owners manual can be mounted in any orientation such as the AGM's. My son has an iTechworld 100 slimline they are bloody huge. What's on the list in the high country for the rest of 24. Oh and by the way thanks for the Murray river vid will check it out in the near future.
Gday Frank, Thanks mate. Yeah, it’s been an eye opening from what so many people think about how a lithium battery can be mounted. It was a shock to me when I found out what I did. High country trip is planned over Easter. Can’t wait mate. Thanks for your feedback mate. Cheers Tim.
Thanks for this new info Tim. I'm guessing that another reason not to have it lying flat on the floor of the vehicle would be as a safeguard against ingress off water during or after a river crossing. Cheers from Melbourne, but happily set up camping next to Cann River at present.
G'Day Tim, great episode and good information for all those hoping to run lithium to check with the manufactures specifications. Out of interest, what was the factor that resulted in the determination that the side mounted format was the sole issue for these batteries failing? Further, can I ask how those batteries failed? Were they dropping cells, loosing capacity, BMS failure? Theoretically side mounting (or any mounting) of a lithium battery really shouldn't affect the performance of longevity simply based on the nature of their construction. Will be interesting to hear how you get on with this new setup. All the best, Nathan.
G'day Nathan, As i mentioned in the video about those two batteries failing. Whether it was from lying on their sides caused them to fail, who knows. All i know from what i could see on my app, that they wouldn't charge back to 100%. They both performed as they should for the first few months, and over time i noticed what was going on. Reason for that, i don't know. The main point for this video was bringing to attention about how a lithium battery can be mounted. As i for one, along with many people think you can mount them in any configuration you want. Clearly you cant. It pays to check. Only that i read the manual, that third battery would still be mounted under the false floor. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures Cheers Tim, sure is interesting and you have definitely broadened the exposure in this instance. All the best with the new setup and here's hoping that these batteries go the distance 💪
I'm glad you got your battery issues taken care of. A great tip I can think of is to carry a charging cable for the battery in case it needs charged but the alternator isn't charging it for aome reason. You never know what's going to fail on a vehicle next. Cheers, Colton
In the auto industry the 2 main configurations were vertical or flat so we called them toast or bread configurations. The cells are set up for their specific config.
My understanding is they are only supposed to be mounted upright for the safety vents in case the poo hits the fan. I've had mine on its side for 3 1/2 years and it still holds 92% charge. And I live in the Pilbara where cabin temp for half the year is 70+
A couple of things: 1. The one in the correct orientation has no ventilation, heat may cause it to fail. 2. Why don’t you have an LED voltage readout. which are less than $5 on Ali Ex, on each battery? You can have it on the dash or where it can be easily seen, then you get a bit of warning of undercharge. I have never heard of anyone keeping a battery of any sort on its side.
Gday mate So many people have mentioned the ventilation in the battery box. I must do a quick short video on that. I didn’t mention it in the video. The box has two 40mm wide slots , the full length of the box cut in it. I have the app on my phone so I can see what the battery is doing all the time. Thanks for your feedback Cheers Tim
Hi Tim, thanks for the info. I did not know, either about orientation. Curious to know why the orientation matters. The failure you mention sounds like a fault with the charging of the batteries to me. I'd be getting someone to have a look at the loaded output of the charger. Does it over voltage, have spikes in the power delivery etc.
G'day mate, Apparently its to do with the battery management system. BMS Both of the failed batteries operated as they should for the first few months, with full charge going into the batteries no worries. After a few months, they slowly got worse. To the point where they were useless for camping. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Gday mate, I should have mentioned it in the video. But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
As stated always check the tech documents for your battery. There certainly are a few brands out there that can be installed in any orientation for example some of the drypower products. But there are many rhat orientation cannot be altered.
I've just travelled across Australia with my 200ah enerdrive lithium battery, just behind the front seat but standing up i n my patrol. Would have to be 1 of my favourite mods. Never got below 70% didn't even need my solar panel I hauled along. I could of done it with 100ah. Not to mention the 60kg weight loss from agm.
Hi Tom I recently saw someone mount their slimline lithium in tge cavity behind the rear seat in their GQ Patrol. You might be able to attach it to your cargo barrier.
Gday mate, I dont have the room for that battery to mount to my cargo barrier without using space i have set for another of my camping gear. So, im happy where it's now mounted. Cheers Tim
Nice bit of info there Tim ! Thanks as a lithium battery is on my wish list for the Ranger , now i have my spot marked out ready to go . Cheers mate, hope you are well. 🤠👌
Hi Tim, sounds like it could the the weight of the battery on top of the BMS circuit board that’s sitting at the bottom and over time vibration etc damage a component or wiring connection. Another possibility is if charging directly from the alternator and not via a DC-DC lithium charger this could also create problems. Thanks for the videos, cheers from Bribie Island Q.
Great informative clip mate... and well done on not brand bashing the battery itself for not being able to be on its side etc (like a lot of other channels most likely will/would) and in essence... owning up to having it installed the wrong way... even if by mistake. Nice work mate! Legend!
Thanks mate. This video wasnt about battery brands and i was never going to mention the battery brands. The point of the video is not about brands its about doing your own research on how the battery can be mounted. Cheers Tim
Hearin ya Tim I had two dodgy Enerdrive batteries but they came to the party through warranty no problems but yeh if this one goes might just go a cheapie
One of by-products of electricity is heat. Heat must been taken care of/dissipated. Thermal failure of products is not rocket science. I see it all the time, people mounting batteries and chargers in enclosed metal ute boxes or back of the wagon carpeted timber enclosures with next to no, if any, "good" ventilation. Not only will it be so inefficient, it can lead to failure and worse. Good on you for acting on and doing something about it Tim. Cheers mate.
Thanks mate. The box the battery is mounted in has two 40mm wide slots the full length of the box. I’ll cut the carpet away from those slots if it’s needed. Cheers Tim
Would be getting the DCDC checked is working correctly and you have it programmed correctly. Out of interest do you try and get your Li battery back to 100% Soc every day?
I haven't read all comments but Lithium battery are better charged with a dc to dc charger with Lithium battery profile for recharging versus alternator charging profile as far as I am able to ascertain. AGM are still the go in my books, no chance of thermal runaway either with AGM.
I’m tipping there us mate. I’m not fussed what other manufacturers are recommending. The point is, the battery I have says you can’t. I’m going with that. If your lithium battery manufacturer says you can mount it in any configuration, then that’s fine. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures yes I agree.. Mine is in a stainless case with replaceable cells if one goes down. You don't have to trash the lot.its mounted upright..
Good one Tim. I’ve had an itechworld under bonnet for several years without a drama. And one of their lithium start batteries too. So much for the doomsday guys who say you can’t do that. Everything you buy these days has potential to bugger up. 😊
Hi Tim. Thx for posting. Some great info. Has me thinking how those ultra-slim lithiums perform as there are plenty of people mounting them flat under false floors in the rear of wagons. Seems to me the quality of the lithium battery and its internals goes a long way in determining if it performs long term - all hit and miss really. Always enjoy your uploads. Cheers
The cells can be mounted in any orientation but my guess is it comes down to how secure everything is mounted/attached etc internally that would be the limiting factor. There’s no reason it couldn’t be manufactured to go on their side unless it’s a restriction due to heat dissipation.
Might be a brand issue more so than an orientation issue. Not all batteries are the same I guess as mine definitely can be in any orientation & has been laying on its side under my false floor for over 4yrs with zero issues. It’s a 200ah slimline.
Yep, some can lay day and clearly as I found out some can’t. That’s the whole point of this video, not the failed batteries. I like some many people though a lithium battery could be mounted in any orientation. Clearly you can’t. Cheers Tim
Very informative mate. Always enjoy your videos. How are the duratrac RT tyres going? I'll be giving them a go on a 79 series soon, mainly VHC offroading, nothing extreme though. Will you be discussing them in future videos? Thanks and keep up the great content.
Gday mate Thanks mate, I’m glad to hear you found the video helpful. The new Duratracs mate are going great. They’ve just had their 10,000k rotation. I’ll be doing a review video on them. If you get a set, I’ve no doubt you’ll be very happy with them. Thanks again mate Cheers Tim.
Sounds good. Being a new model, very limited information out there. I know the old ones were good but I've pretty much stuck with maxxis and bfg over the years. Thought I'd try something else. Looking forward to it.
Hi there Tim, sad news about the batteries, it’s even sadder news about the amount of lithium batteries catching on fire in skateboards, various vehicles and a bus recently in London. And apparently the fire cannot be put out even by the Fire brigade. They reportedly even continue to burn under water.
LFP (4wd) are different to Lithium Ion ( cordless tools, lap tops ) or Lithium polymer ( remote control aircraft and trucks) There is a clip somewhere on RUclips showing how difficult it is to get a LFP to ignite.
OMG, this car is NOT A SKATE BOARD. Why do people bring up this crap, total different situation, totally different battery. Do you have a mobile phone, a laptop, do you fly on a plane, all have Lithium batteries. By the way, there is far more ICE fires than EV's.
@@commonsense-grs all this is about is like most people and I’m one of them. Sometimes you can’t mount a lithium battery anyway you want. That’s all this point is about.
I must do a short video on the battery box. I didnt mention in the video, but there's two 40mm slots the full length of the box face cut into it for added air flow. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
I’m not getting into brands mate. It’s all about check how you can mount your lithium battery to suit manufacturing specifications. It’s a 100amp hour battery. Cheers Tim.
Hey mate, what is the DC charger your using to regulate the charge from your vehicle battery to the lithuim? That is probably more to do with the said issue rather than how your situating your battery as there are no liquids etc in either your Lifpo or the bms that governs it.
Yeah, but wh? It would of been good of the manufacturer to explain why. The company that I purchased our lithium from 3 years ago stated that it can be mounthed in any orientation. So its been mounted flat all that time with no ssues
Thats all fine if the battery manufacturer that you have states they can be mounted in any configuration, you'll at least be covered if it fails. I believe the issues are around the BMS failing. Cheers Tim
Well for starters - I’ve mentioned these points a number of times in other videos. It’s charged via a solar panel Anderson plug at the back There’s is two ventilation slots in the front of the box you can’t see behind the carpet Slim line is obvious for space saving as mentioned in the video mate. Where it was mounted in the first place. Cheers Tim
Moral of this story is that not all lithium batteries are the same and it is important to read, and follow, the documentation that is provided with the battery you purchase.
Ive recently upgraded to Lithium. According to the manufacturer itnis meant roncharge at 14.7v, float at 13.6v but Im finding it wont charge higher than 13.6v and normally aits at 13.2v. I have a Ctek D250SE and 110w Solar, with ny old AGM it would charge at 14.7v no worries, this has only changed since installing the Lithium.
I was told mate, it's to do with the battery management system. BMS Im not saying all lithium batteries must be mounted up right. Just check with your battery manufacturer. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Just depends on how they are put together. Most will have the bms sitting on top of the cells, so if things become lose, damage can happen. If you pull a few apart, some even have things just held in place with tape.
G'day mate, I didnt mention in the video. But, the front has wide slots in the timber to allow air flow. Plus i have the app for all of the read outs and its not getting over 25 degrees where i have it now. It was getting hotter than that where it was mounted. Cheers Tim
I was wondering the same thing myself. A vent might be a good idea. Though LI PO4 battery is not as susceptible to catching fire as a old LI battery was from my understanding but better to be safe.
@@Philipk65 I didnt mention mate. But the face of the box has wide slots cut in it behind the carpet for air flow. Plus i have the app with all of the battery read outs and temp is one i can clearly see. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
While im driving its charged from the alternator. As how much dual battery setup has always been setup. While at camp, i plug a solar panel straight into the battery. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures fo you separate your battery chemistry? Do you have a charger with lithium profile to balance the cells? From sounds of it it's your setup more than the way you mount them .
The first two weren’t mounted incorrectly mate. They were mounted as per manufacturer specifications. That’s why they were both replaced under warranty as I mentioned. Cheers Tim
Gday mate, I should have mentioned it in the video. But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
Most LiFePO⁴ (Lithium Iron Phosphate) batteries don't care what orientation they are in, right side up, layed down, upside down. They aren't filled with liquid. Even most AGMs are ok with any orientation. I've run two Full River AGMs flat on their sides for the past four or five years. (Probably due for a Lithium upgrade!) You've obviously found the exemption that proves the rule!
So many think they can be mounted in any configuration. I was one of them. After what i found out from my battery manufacturer, it clearly says you cant. So, all im now saying is, check with your own battery manufacturer. If they say it can be mount any any format, well go with it. For me, i wasnt leaving on its side when manuafacturer says you cant. Cheers Tim
Hi Tim, I’m a bit confused by this, what brand is your Lithium battery? If it’s a quality brand they will have used LiFePO4 cells to construct the battery, which are the safest cells you can use, particularly for a 4x4 battery, any LiFePO4 Lithium can most definitely be mounted in any position at all, it makes no difference to the batteries performance at all. 🤔
G'day mate, im not getting to brands. But they have all been from the top brands. I only picked it up in the manual, so thats what i have to go by. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventuresCheers Tim, thanks for the reply, yeah fair enough if you don’t wanna mention the brand, but I’d be a bit concerned with that if I was you, there’s definitely something not quite right there, do some research into into my first comment and you’ll understand where I’m coming from. Anyway, love your content mate, keep it coming mate 👍
Orientation has nothing to do with performance. I've cut LiFePO4 battery's apart that have cells held in place with sticky tape. I wouldn't want to put such batteries on their side!
I think lithiums do not need to be stored in a sealed box, just need to be sealed from the habitable area (ie, to prevent the egress of gases into the living space). That's the standard, but obviously no-one is going to care in a private build.
Hay Timbo, sorry you found out the hard way mate.. but also you should be aware that lithium has already been superseded by nitrogen and in development is the 100% safe hydrogen. Appreciate your content keep you the great work
I partially agree with you however I dont thing lithium has been superseded just yet. These new battery technologies are being developed predominantly for the push towards electric vehicles and the reduction of the reliance of fossil fuels. These technologies are still a while away from being commercially available. The current choice of SLA, AGM and Lithium is what we need to work with for our camping and off grid needs. We all know that a quality lithium battery is expensive and if keeping them upright will extend their usable lifetime, i think its worth the effort.
My understanding is that lithium batteries are solid state. It should not matter which way they are placed??? Maybe it was lack of ventilation from the previous location? I genuinely dont know, I still run an old school AGM battery and admit I am not across the new tech. Love to hear peoples thoughts.
That was always my understanding mate. But when my manufacturer manual says otherwise. I have no choice but to go by that. Other lithium battery manufacturers might say it’s ok to mount in any orientation, that’s fine if they say that and go with that. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
When you see the poor internal construction of a lot of the lithium batteries on the market where they’re only held together with foam, tape and tie strap it’s no wonder the manufacturer doesn’t recommend side mounting.
I’m not mentioning brands mate. It’s not about brands. This video is purely about checking if you can lay your lithium battery on its side before having it fitted. As so many think you can. Clearly you can’t as I found out. Cheers Tim.
Interesting, after reading all the comments no one else has made the same mistake and had failed lithium’s I have 3 all mounted upright, one under bonnet, one in battery box for portable power and one in the back running 2 fridge’s The under bonnet failed after 6 mths replace under warranty
They also don't like cold or heat. You have the new one in a box covered in carpet. How people install their batteries is up to them but personally I wouldn't even trust a Lithium battery. I'll probably get nasty comments now but, that's the way it is.
Totally understand your comment mate. They recently have proved if they go bad they go bad in a big way. Plus the bloody expense to purchase and set up. 🍺
You wont get nasty comments mate. Im not happy to have gone through what i have. Got me thinking thats for sure. I should have mentioned it in the video. But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it. Cheers Tim
Kings do a 60AH lithium which only weights like 8kg for a few hundred. its a good way to test if lithium is good for your set up. And surprisingly Kings ones arent THAT bad.
Tim when l wanted to install my 96l coolman fridge l had to look at either going down the track of a dc to dc charger, which meant installing a 3rd battery etc or go completely independent of car charging to complete solar charging only. I chose to go Solar and run fridge from an ecoflow power source. These units believe it or not have 6 slimline lithium batteries and must remain upright with a cross flow of air readily available to the vents on the unit! I was very sceptical that this would the best option for me, but in all honesty l have ben impressed. The power from this set up keeps my fridge going for well over 7 days without even starting up my vehicle, longer camp times are achieved so long as l have sun to charge from the 415w solar panel into the ecoflow unit! Just waiting now for the whole unit to burn my vehicle to the ground, so far so good! Hope it stays that way!
@@Lee-astrololee great feedback. I hope it doesn’t burn to the ground. The front face of the box has large slots cut in it , that I didn’t mention in the video. So far so good Cheers Tim
The problem with lithium batteries is that people want them but don’t want to pay for a quality one , if you want a quality one in Australia buy , fusion , revolution or enerdrive .
Everyone falls for technology spiel. You gotta have this or your a pov. Gel and car batteries work fine, way cheaper. But if you are one of those people who need a coffee machine then you need at least a charging system with a "flux capacitor" and a small nuclear reactor. Or you may need led light Bars to illuminate your campsite so that your night vision is zero until morning. Or crank up the generator! Everyone loves that at night! Ah the serenity!
Not worth the risk for me. 2x bond ultimates with just on 10yrs use and 3xsolar panels do the job easily. Got enough puffy lipo rc car and drone packs laying around now to worry about self combusting!
I watched another RUclipsr who switched to Lithium and he was checking his for loss of capacity over time. Not good news and I believe he went back to AGM. I have to change the cranking battery in my 4wd and I'm going with a HD 4wd version from Century. The factory one lasted for over 6 years so here's hoping the better one will last. I think mine sits around and doesn't get used enough. Hope you have better luck with this one mate.
I tell you want mate. When i had to get a third one installed after only 11 months, i was fair dinkum over it. Ive now invested too much into this, so i will stay with it. But, i could see why you would change back to the good ol faithful AGM. Mine should be all good now. Thanks mate. Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures Yeah I only have the cranking battery and I wasn't wanting to spend that much for Lithium but certainly if you were putting in multiple batteries it is a big decision for sure. I sometimes wonder how long those all in one solar generator things last as they can be very expensive to buy as well. I think I shall stick with my very simple setup.
I'm guessing your original battery was a FB branded unit from Japan. For some reason they last a long long time, guarantee you new one won't last as long. I got ripped off by the Nissan dealer I purchased the Patrol from, they swiped my FB battery and substituted it was a Century. Didn't get 2 years out of it, buggers. (Staffer wanted a good battery). I've now converted to a lithium starter battery, so much omph on start up mechanical team thought my compression was stuffed, lol, I had them going.
@@ianweal3081 Yeah it's in a Mitsi. and the dealer offered to replace it, at a cost obviously. They replaced our Hyundai battery after quite a few years and it was still cranking fine. I was thinking that the HD battery would be tougher off road and a family member has had the same one for a few years now. Not sold on Lithium yet tbh.
Im not going into brands mate. Its not about brands, its about what we all think that lithuim batteries can be mounted any way you want. So do your own homework about the battery you want. As i found out you cant. Cheers Tim
Well what can I say... we live in a one way world. People once said marriage was great, NBN was fantastic, GST will solve the countries economic woes, and the banks are there to help. But just like Lithium no one is willing to stand up and say, you know what, this stuff is expensive crap.
I’ve not flogged anyone of on this point. I’m no expert on car electrics and or lithium batteries. I’ve never said I am. But I like so many people think that lithium batteries can be mounted in any configuration. Hence why the third battery was mounted under my false floor on its side. Then I find out the battery I have must be mounted upright. The one and only point of this video is pointing out you can’t. So, check with the lithium battery manufacturer on the battery you have, and if they say you can mounted any way you like. Then go for it. Cheers Tim
![My 4WD ESSENTIAL Spares - [ What I Take ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7InFSlxoNfk/mqdefault.jpg)
![My 4WD ESSENTIAL Spares - [ What I Take ]](/img/tr.png)
Big tip Tim. Make sure that battery box is well ventilated, as vehicles get very hot. I keep my windows slightly open also. If you haven't got a quality bctobc charger, hook a redarc 1250d to your set up. That battery will be charged in no time.
Gday mate,
I should have mentioned it in the video.
But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it.
Plus i have the app to monitor all the battery read outs, including temp. It doesnt seem to get about 24-25 degrees.
I have a 40amp Redarc changer installed.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Thanks Tim, I have just had a slimline Hardkorr 100a Lithium battery installed hard up against the cage in my rear cargo hold, with the BMS behind the passenger back seat secured to the rear frame frame of my Australian made drawer system (2010 made - pre Chinese imported). Extremely neat and did not miss a beat on my last trip to NSW/QLD & back - highly recommend
That’s the go mate.
It appears that mounting them upright is the go.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
It kinda makes sense when you have a look inside one. There's quite a bit of free space, and manufacturers just add ill fitting foam inserts here and there to fill the voids. Gravity is your friend when upright, not so much in other orientations.
Interesting feedback mate.
Thanks for that.
I’m very happy how mine is now mounted.
Cheers Tim
Myself like many others thought the same as you did. I put my lithium battery in 2 days ago and am fortunate to have the room to have it upright which is what I did. Good to see the manufacturer honoured the warranty as its big bucks and a long term investment. I’d imagine things should be ok now for you🤞
Yeah mate, interesting what I found out about how to mount the battery.
But other manufacturers might say it’s ok to mount on the side.
They are big bucks and need looking after.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Actually Tim I googled my manufacturers book of do’s and don’ts after watching your clip and they say it’s ok to mount them in any position but upside down. Without brand naming, my battery came from Perth and they have great reviews. So good luck once again.
Good tip Tim let's hope it reaches a lot of people. I have never heard of mounting batteries in any other orientation than upright. It must be one of those interwebs thingys. There is more to the guts of a battery than meets the eye.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Great information, alot of people wouldn't even think to read the manufacturers instructions. Cant wait to see you back out on the tracks.
Absolutely mate.
So many people think that Lithium batteries in the 4wd can be mounted in any configuration, as i sure did.
Until i read the manual.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Tim, thanks for clarifying the situation.
I wasn't aware of lithium orientation being similar to AGM, where any orientation is accepted as okay.
I just set about mounting all my Itech units in an upright position as I always did with AGM also, as any other orientation just seemed obscure to myself, seemed just wrong to me even when accepted by industry as the standard.
Hope sincerely your issues are resolved as a result of orientation change.
Regards, Wealie
No worries mate.
I agree with your way of thinking.
Just mount them upright and you shouldnt go wrong.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Thanks for sharing Tim. It's good to know that not all lithium 12V batteries can be mounted in any which way. I thought they can. As so far, all the 12V Lithium batteries I've come across to date have listed this (being able to mount it vertically or horizontally) as one of their features. This is a good reminder that it pays to spend a few minutes reading the user manual, or even better, thoroughly read the spec sheet prior to purchase.
No worries mate.
But, spot on, it pays to check.
If the lithium battery you get says you can mount in any configuration, then you will be covered if a warranty claim is needed down the track.
Cheers Tim
Thanks for sharing Tim. Good advice and a reminder to not assume ... Cheers
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Hi Tim interesting video. I’m not sure if l have been fortunate, l have a 54 amp itechworld lithium battery under the bonnet for nearly 3 years.
Minimal loss of charge, handled hot Perth summers and plenty of desert travel.
My starting battery’s is Century lead acid.
Good luck with your improved setup.
Good you have had a good run with your mate. I hope i now get the same good run.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Bloody good choice, I have 3 x Itech 54 amp batteries - 162 amp hour mounted under the rear right window in my troll, opposite side to Tim.
(4 of em would have blocked access to jack storage and tail light globe replacement access, as I'm running European rear qtr panel lights)
Batteries have been extremely good thus far, unfortunately my Redarc BCDC25D has it's issues occasionally not delivering full omph. Looking at replacing it with Itech unit.
I have gone one step further utilising Itechs lithium cranking winching battery as starter battery obviously under bonnet, so impressed by Itech gear thus far.
@@ianweal3081 Glad to hear someone else is doing well with the same battery. As for starter battery, l might go for iTechworld lithium starting battery, when my lead acid gives up.
@@ianweal3081 Far out, great setup you have mate.
Plus the batteries are mounted on the same shelf but opposite sides.
Ive got a 40amp Redarc changer also hooked up.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures yep, mine are on opposite side to yours, mounted on a sliding enclosed rack.
Unplug three Anderson plugs, lower rear passenger seat back, undo two bolts, slide all three batteries forward and service via passenger door, so friggin ideal.
Great info mate a lot out there would have done exactly the same due to the misconception that Lithium batteries and not reading the owners manual can be mounted in any orientation such as the AGM's. My son has an iTechworld 100 slimline they are bloody huge.
What's on the list in the high country for the rest of 24. Oh and by the way thanks for the Murray river vid will check it out in the near future.
Gday Frank,
Thanks mate.
Yeah, it’s been an eye opening from what so many people think about how a lithium battery can be mounted.
It was a shock to me when I found out what I did.
High country trip is planned over Easter.
Can’t wait mate.
Thanks for your feedback mate.
Cheers Tim.
Thanks for this new info Tim.
I'm guessing that another reason not to have it lying flat on the floor of the vehicle would be as a safeguard against ingress off water during or after a river crossing.
Cheers from Melbourne, but happily set up camping next to Cann River at present.
Yeah spot on mate.
It’s in a good spot now mounted in the back of the Patrol.
You have a great trip
Cheers Tim
Very interesting. Glad you got your first two covered by warranty
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
G'Day Tim, great episode and good information for all those hoping to run lithium to check with the manufactures specifications.
Out of interest, what was the factor that resulted in the determination that the side mounted format was the sole issue for these batteries failing? Further, can I ask how those batteries failed? Were they dropping cells, loosing capacity, BMS failure?
Theoretically side mounting (or any mounting) of a lithium battery really shouldn't affect the performance of longevity simply based on the nature of their construction. Will be interesting to hear how you get on with this new setup.
All the best, Nathan.
G'day Nathan,
As i mentioned in the video about those two batteries failing. Whether it was from lying on their sides caused them to fail, who knows.
All i know from what i could see on my app, that they wouldn't charge back to 100%.
They both performed as they should for the first few months, and over time i noticed what was going on.
Reason for that, i don't know.
The main point for this video was bringing to attention about how a lithium battery can be mounted.
As i for one, along with many people think you can mount them in any configuration you want.
Clearly you cant. It pays to check.
Only that i read the manual, that third battery would still be mounted under the false floor.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures Cheers Tim, sure is interesting and you have definitely broadened the exposure in this instance.
All the best with the new setup and here's hoping that these batteries go the distance 💪
@@XploringOz thanks mate. Hoping for long, trouble free battery running now.
I'm glad you got your battery issues taken care of. A great tip I can think of is to carry a charging cable for the battery in case it needs charged but the alternator isn't charging it for aome reason. You never know what's going to fail on a vehicle next.
Cheers,
Colton
Good point mate. But i can charge the lithium battery from my solar panel as well.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures That's true, but those can fail too.
@@ColtonRMagby Thats right mate. They can fail also.
In the auto industry the 2 main configurations were vertical or flat so we called them toast or bread configurations. The cells are set up for their specific config.
My understanding is they are only supposed to be mounted upright for the safety vents in case the poo hits the fan. I've had mine on its side for 3 1/2 years and it still holds 92% charge. And I live in the Pilbara where cabin temp for half the year is 70+
I didn’t mention in the video. There’s two 40mm wide slots cut the full length of the face of the box.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Lovely Ep and Tips, Our 2 x 140amp Lithiums are 16 months old and still going well.
Thanks mate.
I should be off and running now to having a great run from my battery like you have.
Cheers Tim
Yes you be right now Love your channel. @@timbates4wdadventures
@@craigtomkinson2837 thanks mate.
A couple of things: 1. The one in the correct orientation has no ventilation, heat may cause it to fail. 2. Why don’t you have an LED voltage readout. which are less than $5 on Ali Ex, on each battery? You can have it on the dash or where it can be easily seen, then you get a bit of warning of undercharge.
I have never heard of anyone keeping a battery of any sort on its side.
Gday mate
So many people have mentioned the ventilation in the battery box.
I must do a quick short video on that.
I didn’t mention it in the video.
The box has two 40mm wide slots , the full length of the box cut in it.
I have the app on my phone so I can see what the battery is doing all the time.
Thanks for your feedback
Cheers Tim
Hi Tim, thanks for the info. I did not know, either about orientation. Curious to know why the orientation matters. The failure you mention sounds like a fault with the charging of the batteries to me. I'd be getting someone to have a look at the loaded output of the charger. Does it over voltage, have spikes in the power delivery etc.
G'day mate,
Apparently its to do with the battery management system. BMS
Both of the failed batteries operated as they should for the first few months, with full charge going into the batteries no worries.
After a few months, they slowly got worse.
To the point where they were useless for camping.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Aren't you going to stick around Mallacoota? 😆
Only up for the weekend
Cheers Tim
Hopefully it'll be right now Tim. Wil it have enough air ventilation in the box not to heat up. Thanks for the info.
Gday mate,
I should have mentioned it in the video.
But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
As stated always check the tech documents for your battery. There certainly are a few brands out there that can be installed in any orientation for example some of the drypower products. But there are many rhat orientation cannot be altered.
Correct mate.
Pays to check before mounting the battery.
Cheers Tim
I've just travelled across Australia with my 200ah enerdrive lithium battery, just behind the front seat but standing up i n my patrol. Would have to be 1 of my favourite mods. Never got below 70% didn't even need my solar panel I hauled along. I could of done it with 100ah. Not to mention the 60kg weight loss from agm.
Great feedback mate from
The trip you’ve done and no issues.
Mine is a 100ah
Cheers Tim
Hi Tom
I recently saw someone mount their slimline lithium in tge cavity behind the rear seat in their GQ Patrol. You might be able to attach it to your cargo barrier.
Gday mate,
I dont have the room for that battery to mount to my cargo barrier without using space i have set for another of my camping gear.
So, im happy where it's now mounted.
Cheers Tim
Nice bit of info there Tim ! Thanks as a lithium battery is on my wish list for the Ranger , now i have my spot marked out ready to go .
Cheers mate, hope you are well.
🤠👌
Thanks mate.
Glad you found the video helpful.
Cheers Tim
Hi Tim, sounds like it could the the weight of the battery on top of the BMS circuit board that’s sitting at the bottom and over time vibration etc damage a component or wiring connection. Another possibility is if charging directly from the alternator and not via a DC-DC lithium charger this could also create problems. Thanks for the videos, cheers from Bribie Island Q.
That’s what I’ve been told also mate about the BMS.
It does run through a 40amp dcdc charger.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Great informative clip mate... and well done on not brand bashing the battery itself for not being able to be on its side etc (like a lot of other channels most likely will/would) and in essence... owning up to having it installed the wrong way... even if by mistake. Nice work mate! Legend!
Thanks mate.
This video wasnt about battery brands and i was never going to mention the battery brands.
The point of the video is not about brands its about doing your own research on how the battery can be mounted.
Cheers Tim
Hearin ya Tim I had two dodgy Enerdrive batteries but they came to the party through warranty no problems but yeh if this one goes might just go a cheapie
Good yours were replaced under warranty mate.
They are a big investment.
Cheers Tim
One of by-products of electricity is heat. Heat must been taken care of/dissipated. Thermal failure of products is not rocket science.
I see it all the time, people mounting batteries and chargers in enclosed metal ute boxes or back of the wagon carpeted timber enclosures with next to no, if any, "good" ventilation. Not only will it be so inefficient, it can lead to failure and worse. Good on you for acting on and doing something about it Tim.
Cheers mate.
Thanks mate.
The box the battery is mounted in has two 40mm wide slots the full length of the box.
I’ll cut the carpet away from those slots if it’s needed.
Cheers Tim
Would be getting the DCDC checked is working correctly and you have it programmed correctly.
Out of interest do you try and get your Li battery back to 100% Soc every day?
I would tip the Radarc 40amp changer is working fine.
I drive the car pretty much ever day, so it’s going fully recharge each day.
Cheers Tim
I haven't read all comments but Lithium battery are better charged with a dc to dc charger with Lithium battery profile for recharging versus alternator charging profile as far as I am able to ascertain. AGM are still the go in my books, no chance of thermal runaway either with AGM.
I do have it running through a 40amp Redarc charger.
Cheers Tim.
Perfect timing ❤ I'm right in the process of figuring out where to mount my lithium battery.
Tops stuff mate.
Just check what your manufacturer says and you should be ok.
Cheers Tim
Tim I googled it and lots company's say they can go any way. I just don't see why not as there is no fluid in them. I'm stumped
I’m tipping there us mate.
I’m not fussed what other manufacturers are recommending.
The point is, the battery I have says you can’t.
I’m going with that.
If your lithium battery manufacturer says you can mount it in any configuration, then that’s fine.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures yes I agree.. Mine is in a stainless case with replaceable cells if one goes down. You don't have to trash the lot.its mounted upright..
Good one Tim. I’ve had an itechworld under bonnet for several years without a drama. And one of their lithium start batteries too. So much for the doomsday guys who say you can’t do that. Everything you buy these days has potential to bugger up. 😊
Spot on mate.
Great feedback.
Cheers Tim
Hi Tim. Thx for posting. Some great info. Has me thinking how those ultra-slim lithiums perform as there are plenty of people mounting them flat under false floors in the rear of wagons. Seems to me the quality of the lithium battery and its internals goes a long way in determining if it performs long term - all hit and miss really.
Always enjoy your uploads.
Cheers
Yeah the slim lines are very handy for mounting in tight spots, thats why i got one.
Thanks heaps mate.
Cheers Tim
What brand and style hat do you wear? I love it and would like to get one for myself.
Love your honesty Mate and a great source of info as usual. Well done
Thanks mate.
Just worth asking the question before having the battery mounted.
Cheers Tim
Gday Tim. Good to see you.
Yes. Keep simple upright and use common sense. Cannot go wrong
Thanks mate.
Keep it simple is the go and read what the manual says.
Cheers Tim
The cells can be mounted in any orientation but my guess is it comes down to how secure everything is mounted/attached etc internally that would be the limiting factor. There’s no reason it couldn’t be manufactured to go on their side unless it’s a restriction due to heat dissipation.
Might be a brand issue more so than an orientation issue. Not all batteries are the same I guess as mine definitely can be in any orientation & has been laying on its side under my false floor for over 4yrs with zero issues. It’s a 200ah slimline.
Yep, some can lay day and clearly as I found out some can’t.
That’s the whole point of this video, not the failed batteries.
I like some many people though a lithium battery could be mounted in any orientation.
Clearly you can’t.
Cheers Tim
Very informative mate. Always enjoy your videos. How are the duratrac RT tyres going? I'll be giving them a go on a 79 series soon, mainly VHC offroading, nothing extreme though. Will you be discussing them in future videos? Thanks and keep up the great content.
Gday mate
Thanks mate, I’m glad to hear you found the video helpful.
The new Duratracs mate are going great.
They’ve just had their 10,000k rotation.
I’ll be doing a review video on them.
If you get a set, I’ve no doubt you’ll be very happy with them.
Thanks again mate
Cheers Tim.
Sounds good. Being a new model, very limited information out there. I know the old ones were good but I've pretty much stuck with maxxis and bfg over the years. Thought I'd try something else. Looking forward to it.
@@corty1975 yeah mate, they’ll be worth trying.
Cheers Tim
Hi there Tim, sad news about the batteries, it’s even sadder news about the amount of lithium batteries catching on fire in skateboards, various vehicles and a bus recently in London. And apparently the fire cannot be put out even by the Fire brigade. They reportedly even continue to burn under water.
Yeah mate, i have heard all about those issues. We have simular lithuim fires going on here in Australia.
Hoping mine is sorted now.
Cheers Tim
LFP (4wd) are different to Lithium Ion ( cordless tools, lap tops ) or Lithium polymer ( remote control aircraft and trucks)
There is a clip somewhere on RUclips showing how difficult it is to get a LFP to ignite.
@@greggilmour3482 Im not sure mate. Im only going on what my manufacturer booklet says.
Cheers Tim
OMG, this car is NOT A SKATE BOARD. Why do people bring up this crap, total different situation, totally different battery. Do you have a mobile phone, a laptop, do you fly on a plane, all have Lithium batteries. By the way, there is far more ICE fires than EV's.
@@commonsense-grs all this is about is like most people and I’m one of them.
Sometimes you can’t mount a lithium battery anyway you want.
That’s all this point is about.
Well bugger me I haven't had no issue at all now I'm going to change where it's located asap. Cheers for the tips on that wouldn't even known that.
So many dont mate.
But if your battery manufactor says it's ok to mount in any format, then you should be ok.
But, do check mate.
Cheers Tim
Tim add a fan to the box air flow is a must all is needed is a computer fan
I must do a short video on the battery box.
I didnt mention in the video, but there's two 40mm slots the full length of the box face cut into it for added air flow.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
What a nightmare! Yes I believed that they could be mounted in any orientation. Mine are upright.
It was mate.
Yep, i was one that thought that also.
Now im happy its mounted as specified.
Cheers Tim
Thanks for the heads up mate
Tbh I thought you can mount them any orientation..well good to know now I had the cheap kings running 2 years now
Yeah mate, i was one of those for sure thinking that.
Pays to ask the battery manufacturer what the recommend.
Cheers Tim
Hey mate , no more instragram or facebook? Saw you on the western highway last week towards melbourne. Hope your well 👍
Gday mate
Yeah mate, I was over that side on a tyre film shoot.
All going well here thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Thanks Tim, what new brand lithium battery are you running and amps, cheers
I’m not getting into brands mate.
It’s all about check how you can mount your lithium battery to suit manufacturing specifications.
It’s a 100amp hour battery.
Cheers Tim.
Hey mate, what is the DC charger your using to regulate the charge from your vehicle battery to the lithuim? That is probably more to do with the said issue rather than how your situating your battery as there are no liquids etc in either your Lifpo or the bms that governs it.
G'day mate,
Im running a 40amp Redarc charger.
Should be more than big enough for what im running i would think.
Cheers Tim
Yeah, but wh?
It would of been good of the manufacturer to explain why. The company that I purchased our lithium from 3 years ago stated that it can be mounthed in any orientation. So its been mounted flat all that time with no ssues
Thats all fine if the battery manufacturer that you have states they can be mounted in any configuration, you'll at least be covered if it fails.
I believe the issues are around the BMS failing.
Cheers Tim
Did you consider a removable battery-box setup? Lots of manufacturers getting them out on the market now.
Nah, mate, i havent even thought about the boxes you mention.
Cheers Tim
Not mentioned How are you charging it? Why is there no ventilation as they get hot charging. Why slimline in the first place?
Well for starters -
I’ve mentioned these points a number of times in other videos.
It’s charged via a solar panel Anderson plug at the back
There’s is two ventilation slots in the front of the box you can’t see behind the carpet
Slim line is obvious for space saving as mentioned in the video mate. Where it was mounted in the first place.
Cheers Tim
Moral of this story is that not all lithium batteries are the same and it is important to read, and follow, the documentation that is provided with the battery you purchase.
Spot on mate.
They clearly aren’t all the same.
Cheers Tim
I would imagine it really depends on what type of battery it is, circular 18650 cells, spot welded together, pouch cells or prismatic.
Spot on mate.
Just pays to check.
Cheers Tim
So what have you now got stored in the footwell where you had the lithium batteries?
Nothing at this stage mate.
Not much space under that floor.
Cheers Tim
Ive recently upgraded to Lithium. According to the manufacturer itnis meant roncharge at 14.7v, float at 13.6v but Im finding it wont charge higher than 13.6v and normally aits at 13.2v. I have a Ctek D250SE and 110w Solar, with ny old AGM it would charge at 14.7v no worries, this has only changed since installing the Lithium.
Ahh righto mate.
Interesting figures you have mentioned.
Thanks for that.
Cheers Tim
You'd think that the manufacturers would clearly label the battery in regards to its installation orientation???
Good point mate.
I’ve not seen one e yet that has markings on it saying how it must be mounted.
Cheers Tim
Interesting. I checked with a couple of different brands and all say you can mount in any orientation. So definitely brand related.
Yeah mate, it will be brand related for sure.
This is just about getting people to check before you mount it.
Cheers Tim
Lifepo4 Batteries with battery cells can be orientated in any direction (including upside down). Pouch cell based lifepo4 batteries must be upright
@@JasondenHollander-qj5hp thanks for your feedback mate.
Cheers Tim
I've run an Enerdrive lifepo4 lithium battery 24/7/365 since 2020 with zero dramas (installed upright)
Thats how mine is now mate and hoping i now have a good run like you have.
Cheers Tim
I wonder why you can't lie them down? It should make any difference as they're solid state. (No liquids or moving parts) but great info as usual. :)
I was told mate, it's to do with the battery management system. BMS
Im not saying all lithium batteries must be mounted up right.
Just check with your battery manufacturer.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
Just depends on how they are put together. Most will have the bms sitting on top of the cells, so if things become lose, damage can happen. If you pull a few apart, some even have things just held in place with tape.
@@MrFastFarmer Thats correct mate. where the BMS is mounted. They can be the issue.
Cheers Tim
Just one question Tim, will it get too hot in the box while it’s charging
G'day mate,
I didnt mention in the video.
But, the front has wide slots in the timber to allow air flow.
Plus i have the app for all of the read outs and its not getting over 25 degrees where i have it now.
It was getting hotter than that where it was mounted.
Cheers Tim
Yeah I was wondering that.
I was wondering the same thing myself. A vent might be a good idea. Though LI PO4 battery is not as susceptible to catching fire as a old LI battery was from my understanding but better to be safe.
@@oldbloke204 Cool mate.
Glad you found this video helpful
Cheers Tim
@@Philipk65 I didnt mention mate. But the face of the box has wide slots cut in it behind the carpet for air flow.
Plus i have the app with all of the battery read outs and temp is one i can clearly see.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
I've had mine lying down for 3 year no issues. i noted you said you charge yours from the alternator to me that suggests directly....
While im driving its charged from the alternator. As how much dual battery setup has always been setup.
While at camp, i plug a solar panel straight into the battery.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures fo you separate your battery chemistry? Do you have a charger with lithium profile to balance the cells?
From sounds of it it's your setup more than the way you mount them .
How'd you get warranty if you mounted incorrectly?
The first two weren’t mounted incorrectly mate.
They were mounted as per manufacturer specifications.
That’s why they were both replaced under warranty as I mentioned.
Cheers Tim
THANK YOU FOR VIDEO
SHOULD AIR MOVING AROUND TO KEEP COOL AS BUILD HEART ALL TYPE BATTLIES BE USED
battery brand? and brand you now have?
Tim as suggestion that little battery box requires vents, battery will perform better 🙂
Gday mate,
I should have mentioned it in the video.
But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures That's good mate, all the best with the new setup. Happy travels.
What brand were the first 2?🇦🇺🦘👍
Most LiFePO⁴ (Lithium Iron Phosphate) batteries don't care what orientation they are in, right side up, layed down, upside down. They aren't filled with liquid.
Even most AGMs are ok with any orientation. I've run two Full River AGMs flat on their sides for the past four or five years. (Probably due for a Lithium upgrade!)
You've obviously found the exemption that proves the rule!
So many think they can be mounted in any configuration.
I was one of them.
After what i found out from my battery manufacturer, it clearly says you cant.
So, all im now saying is, check with your own battery manufacturer.
If they say it can be mount any any format, well go with it.
For me, i wasnt leaving on its side when manuafacturer says you cant.
Cheers Tim
Hi Tim, I’m a bit confused by this, what brand is your Lithium battery? If it’s a quality brand they will have used LiFePO4 cells to construct the battery, which are the safest cells you can use, particularly for a 4x4 battery, any LiFePO4 Lithium can most definitely be mounted in any position at all, it makes no difference to the batteries performance at all. 🤔
G'day mate, im not getting to brands. But they have all been from the top brands.
I only picked it up in the manual, so thats what i have to go by.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventuresCheers Tim, thanks for the reply, yeah fair enough if you don’t wanna mention the brand, but I’d be a bit concerned with that if I was you, there’s definitely something not quite right there, do some research into into my first comment and you’ll understand where I’m coming from. Anyway, love your content mate, keep it coming mate 👍
@@greghammond7956 Thats a lot mate, i'll look into a bit from the first post. Thanks mate.
@@timbates4wdadventures Cheers mate 👍
Orientation has nothing to do with performance. I've cut LiFePO4 battery's apart that have cells held in place with sticky tape. I wouldn't want to put such batteries on their side!
What brand was the original 2 that failed Tim?
Great vid mate and tip top information.
Thanks again for another great vid !
Cheers 😎👍
No worries mate.
Thanks for that.
Cheers Tim
Also new standards on lithium batteries in caravans, need sealed box, you can store your asbestos in there too.
I think lithiums do not need to be stored in a sealed box, just need to be sealed from the habitable area (ie, to prevent the egress of gases into the living space). That's the standard, but obviously no-one is going to care in a private build.
Nice one mate, I’m planning on moving over to them in the next couple of months.. saves me making the same mistake, thanks..
Cool mate, just check what you battery manufacturer says and go with that.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures will do, cheers mate
That's interesting Timbo n thanks for the info, glad its sorted now.
Thanks mate.
Should be sorted now.
Cheers Tim
Thanks Tim for the info 👍
No worries mate.
Cheers Tim
Hay Timbo, sorry you found out the hard way mate.. but also you should be aware that lithium has already been superseded by nitrogen and in development is the 100% safe hydrogen.
Appreciate your content keep you the great work
Superseded? That would mean they would be available for purchase. Can you provide a link to where to buy one?
I partially agree with you however I dont thing lithium has been superseded just yet. These new battery technologies are being developed predominantly for the push towards electric vehicles and the reduction of the reliance of fossil fuels. These technologies are still a while away from being commercially available. The current choice of SLA, AGM and Lithium is what we need to work with for our camping and off grid needs. We all know that a quality lithium battery is expensive and if keeping them upright will extend their usable lifetime, i think its worth the effort.
I have lithium batteries in many devices that are mobile, I imagine the issue with this would be the cell and battery management system contacts.
Yeah, i believe its with the BMS not liking to be mounted on the side.
Just pays to check.
Cheers Tim
My understanding is that lithium batteries are solid state. It should not matter which way they are placed??? Maybe it was lack of ventilation from the previous location?
I genuinely dont know, I still run an old school AGM battery and admit I am not across the new tech. Love to hear peoples thoughts.
That was always my understanding mate.
But when my manufacturer manual says otherwise.
I have no choice but to go by that.
Other lithium battery manufacturers might say it’s ok to mount in any orientation, that’s fine if they say that and go with that.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
When you see the poor internal construction of a lot of the lithium batteries on the market where they’re only held together with foam, tape and tie strap it’s no wonder the manufacturer doesn’t recommend side mounting.
Yeah right mate.
I’ve not seen inside one.
Cheers Tim
What brand of battery did you run ?
I’m not mentioning brands mate.
It’s not about brands.
This video is purely about checking if you can lay your lithium battery on its side before having it fitted. As so many think you can.
Clearly you can’t as I found out.
Cheers Tim.
@@timbates4wdadventures Thanks Tim and I understand. I was wondering if they were Australian made or imports
@@waylandforge8704 I couldn’t even tell you where they were made mate.
They should mark it on the battery with arrows to stop this happening. Oh wait that would require the consumer to spend less on replacements
That would be a handy idea mate.
Cheers Tim
Hey Tim, Is their a reason you did not fit it under the bonnet?
90%+ Lithiums cant take the Engine heat.They are finally making some engine heat resistant lithiums but they are expensive $$$$
I mentioned that in the first video mate.
But it didn’t go under the bonnet from advice about the heat from the ending.
Cheers Tim.
I have a 2011 patrol mate ive been running lithium for the past 18 months its going fine@@timbates4wdadventures
Interesting, after reading all the comments no one else has made the same mistake and had failed lithium’s
I have 3 all mounted upright, one under bonnet, one in battery box for portable power and one in the back running 2 fridge’s
The under bonnet failed after 6 mths replace under warranty
A lot of batteries going to run your camping setup.
Good that the failed battery was replaced uner warranty.
Cheers Tim
why dont you make camping videos anymore ?
I will mate.
Just getting going again for the new year.
Cheers Tim
They also don't like cold or heat. You have the new one in a box covered in carpet. How people install their batteries is up to them but personally I wouldn't even trust a Lithium battery. I'll probably get nasty comments now but, that's the way it is.
Totally understand your comment mate. They recently have proved if they go bad they go bad in a big way. Plus the bloody expense to purchase and set up. 🍺
You wont get nasty comments mate.
Im not happy to have gone through what i have.
Got me thinking thats for sure.
I should have mentioned it in the video.
But the front face of that box, has two large lots cut in it with the cover over it.
Cheers Tim
Kings do a 60AH lithium which only weights like 8kg for a few hundred. its a good way to test if lithium is good for your set up. And surprisingly Kings ones arent THAT bad.
Tim when l wanted to install my 96l coolman fridge l had to look at either going down the track of a dc to dc charger, which meant installing a 3rd battery etc or go completely independent of car charging to complete solar charging only. I chose to go Solar and run fridge from an ecoflow power source. These units believe it or not have 6 slimline lithium batteries and must remain upright with a cross flow of air readily available to the vents on the unit! I was very sceptical that this would the best option for me, but in all honesty l have ben impressed. The power from this set up keeps my fridge going for well over 7 days without even starting up my vehicle, longer camp times are achieved so long as l have sun to charge from the 415w solar panel into the ecoflow unit! Just waiting now for the whole unit to burn my vehicle to the ground, so far so good! Hope it stays that way!
@@Lee-astrololee great feedback.
I hope it doesn’t burn to the ground.
The front face of the box has large slots cut in it , that I didn’t mention in the video.
So far so good
Cheers Tim
The problem with lithium batteries is that people want them but don’t want to pay for a quality one , if you want a quality one in Australia buy , fusion , revolution or enerdrive .
Thats the go mate.
Cheers Tim
Everyone falls for technology spiel. You gotta have this or your a pov. Gel and car batteries work fine, way cheaper. But if you are one of those people who need a coffee machine then you need at least a charging system with a "flux capacitor" and a small nuclear reactor. Or you may need led light Bars to illuminate your campsite so that your night vision is zero until morning. Or crank up the generator! Everyone loves that at night! Ah the serenity!
Not worth the risk for me. 2x bond ultimates with just on 10yrs use and 3xsolar panels do the job easily. Got enough puffy lipo rc car and drone packs laying around now to worry about self combusting!
No mate.
It’s so not worth the risk.
Cheers Tim.
@@timbates4wdadventures good luck with your setup tim. I hope its safe and successful.
@@malky525 thanks mate.
I watched another RUclipsr who switched to Lithium and he was checking his for loss of capacity over time.
Not good news and I believe he went back to AGM.
I have to change the cranking battery in my 4wd and I'm going with a HD 4wd version from Century.
The factory one lasted for over 6 years so here's hoping the better one will last.
I think mine sits around and doesn't get used enough.
Hope you have better luck with this one mate.
I tell you want mate.
When i had to get a third one installed after only 11 months, i was fair dinkum over it.
Ive now invested too much into this, so i will stay with it.
But, i could see why you would change back to the good ol faithful AGM.
Mine should be all good now.
Thanks mate.
Cheers Tim
@@timbates4wdadventures Yeah I only have the cranking battery and I wasn't wanting to spend that much for Lithium but certainly if you were putting in multiple batteries it is a big decision for sure.
I sometimes wonder how long those all in one solar generator things last as they can be very expensive to buy as well.
I think I shall stick with my very simple setup.
I'm guessing your original battery was a FB branded unit from Japan.
For some reason they last a long long time, guarantee you new one won't last as long.
I got ripped off by the Nissan dealer I purchased the Patrol from, they swiped my FB battery and substituted it was a Century. Didn't get 2 years out of it, buggers. (Staffer wanted a good battery).
I've now converted to a lithium starter battery, so much omph on start up mechanical team thought my compression was stuffed, lol, I had them going.
@@ianweal3081 Yeah it's in a Mitsi. and the dealer offered to replace it, at a cost obviously.
They replaced our Hyundai battery after quite a few years and it was still cranking fine.
I was thinking that the HD battery would be tougher off road and a family member has had the same one for a few years now.
Not sold on Lithium yet tbh.
Temperature is important
Sorry mate. Bad choices have it's consequences.
Hey TIm,
What brand lithium did you have that failed?
Thanks
Im not going into brands mate.
Its not about brands, its about what we all think that lithuim batteries can be mounted any way you want. So do your own homework about the battery you want.
As i found out you cant.
Cheers Tim
Battery orientation is a weasel-out clause for the manufacturer to avoid honouring warranty. Or their mechanical pack construction is sub-par.
Yeah mate, i was surprised when i read what i did in the manual.
Cheers Tim
Well what can I say... we live in a one way world. People once said marriage was great, NBN was fantastic, GST will solve the countries economic woes, and the banks are there to help. But just like Lithium no one is willing to stand up and say, you know what, this stuff is expensive crap.
Some good points mate.
Cheers Tim
I’m old school I’ll stick with gel u just can’t trust them
Could be a good move mate.
Cheers Tim
and yet agm will last years and years- not burn your car to the ground, and are super reliable--- the ONLY advantage of lithium is weight
You bought the wrong type not all can be. You flogged off the people that tried to point this out... not all are the same type of cells
I’ve not flogged anyone of on this point.
I’m no expert on car electrics and or lithium batteries.
I’ve never said I am.
But I like so many people think that lithium batteries can be mounted in any configuration.
Hence why the third battery was mounted under my false floor on its side.
Then I find out the battery I have must be mounted upright.
The one and only point of this video is pointing out you can’t.
So, check with the lithium battery manufacturer on the battery you have, and if they say you can mounted any way you like.
Then go for it.
Cheers Tim
@timbates4wdadventures your famous on FB groups of 12v for deleting all the comments that said you did it wrong and was wrong battery to lay down...
Hi Tim, am I able to contact you on Facebook? I have a few questions regarding a trip going through the VHC
Thanks
Yes mate.
Cheers Tim