I love that even when Piper is overwhelmed she leverages the "No Thank You, Mother". She knows that she doesn't have to escalate to be heard. And woweee Mama D the bouncer!
"This may be part of the problem. You wound when you are feeling wounded." Those words were perfect. And also her calmness while Barb lost it was evidence of some serious self control
@OldBiddy88 she reminds me a lot of my Autistic family member so I wouldn't be surprised (I'm also autistic, but on a different part of the spectrum. I was just as blunt as Piper but used more words)
The fact that Barb writes "you are a part of me" in the card to Piper reminds me SO MUCH of my grandmother. She was always desperate to be the matriarch, with the entire family revolving around her - but she saw all of us kids as nothing more than extensions of her. We were there to give her attention and something to brag about, and that was it. It's such a subtle line that says so much, well done Shawna
But. ... and it's a big but ... Piper would never see it. It's written to belittle and deride John and Shawna's efforts at containment of her actions. They'll read it. One of them will, so it's not to Piper, moreover she specifically directs it to 'Charlotte' the mythical grandchild in her mind. Internalising her pain but externalising it so everyone is guilted and shamed by it. This is A-grade manipulation by a coercive narcissist. And that's excellent script writing and story telling by Shawna the Mom. Applause not only for the acting but also for the direction and production.
It also feels like a throwback to Barb's statement to Jen that her ovaries and eggs grew when Jen was still in Barb's womb. Even though that's not the case for John, it still shows how weirdly possessive she feels towards her grandkids.
My dad’s mom would withhold presents from us in the hopes we’d ask him why they didn’t show up so he’d have to say she was mad at him. She’d try to hurt us in the hopes of hurting/controlling him. In reality we never noticed bc we had no relationship with her. But it still hurt him. She was horrible.
"The kids don't need to know you were here..." Dee Dee was both trying to protect the kids AND preserve Barb's chance of ever fixing things and Barb was too self-centered to see it.
Yes. And I get the feeling she was less protecting the kids and more protecting John. That was probably the first time a mother stood up for him, bless him. But how she's talking to Barb, it's so clear she's all but begging Barb to actually listen and learn. Beautifully done.
@CrazyMamaSHSYes and her response to her was so deeply empathetic and patient even when she lashed out, calmly but firmly pointing out the pattern was the kindest thing she possibly could've done for Barb in that moment, but she's just incapable of seeing it
@kristenwelker6493 honestly when I first watched it I was thinking their kids, like Shawna and John. But she could've meant the grandkids. Or even both tbh. The grandkids so they dont wonder what's going on maybe? And Shawna and John so that they aren't triggered again by her being there?
@kristenwelker6493 Usually when she says "the kids" she's talking about the next generation, not the grandkids. It also happened at Thanksgiving when she said "No Frank, Barb and the kids are talking cake. You and I are doing the dishes" I don't think we've seen her use a term to collectively talk about the grandkids, but when she says "the kids" she's always mostly referring to their children + partners
It hits me again and again how much Barb resents her situation. She resents John for being a hard first baby, she resents Frank for not stepping up, she resents Shawna for being an emotionally connected mother and she resents Dee for having a healthy outlook. She might not know it as resentment but it comes across as just resenting everyone.
@alissa6380yeah it looked like postpartum and as someone who had it with all 4 of my kids that ish is so hard now with people knowing about it.....I couldn't imagine how hard it would have been back then when "baby blues" was something people were told to just get over. I can see how it could lead to resentment. Of the kids, your partner and other mothers who seem happier and more connected or "better" moms to their kids.
I think considering all the dynamics, it wasn't a great decision to invite Frank. Even though he's not the narc, she can figure things out and knows when Piper's b-day is. When Frank is invited, that increases the risk of Barb finding out about the party.
I wish I could get my father to understand this, and his mother. I wish my parents understood boundaries. I wish I had a momma D, who was capable of articulating this so well. Glad they have a momma D!
I think once you become a parent its hard for people to remember you are just a person too and will make mistakes. But there are certainly things that should be way clearer to some parents not to burden their children with.
Mama Dee did not react to Barb's manipulative threat to k*ll herself. She also didn't mention it to anyone. She diffused the drama before it could start. This is the level-headed wisdom you need when dealing with a narcissist.
Hah, I'm so used to my narc father I didn't even blink at that. Yes, it's wild, and yes, it's traumatizing and a manipulation tactic. The first few times you hear it are always so shocking and triggering. But after you've heard it 20+ times from someone like my father it just kinda blends in with everything else, and you can see it for the empty threat that it is rather than an actual cry for help... I'm assuming this isn't Mama Dee's first rodeo, seeing how calm and collected she was in responding to that. She saw Barb flying off the handle from a mile away and was 100% ready to greyrock and act as the bouncer. Good on her for shielding John and Shawna from the abuse that Barb was trying to spew all over them.
john's realisation how damaged he actually is 💔 probably a starting point for healing. i love that he found a new friend who can really get it in dance mom. he needs some true ally. looking forward of the future meeting ups at dance class.
"you keep finding bugs my girl, I'll be right back" That part touched my heart, I always wanted my mother to prioritize my feelings before pretending in front of other people, damn, I'm like Piper
I was the weird kid but instead of understanding my mom would try to force me to be normal and interact with the rest of the kids. Wild how it’s MY birthday but everyone’s more worried about how I appear to others than if I’m actually enjoying my own celebration
@trelenh just because you have a kid doesnt mean you get to upset them for your feelings piper doesnt like lots of people she doesnt want the birthday song she won't die not having them if she was refusing all food or doing something harmful thats when parents need to overstep kids wants to ensure safety and well being
Another part showing her and John breaking the cycle. Barb would have coaxed Piper into saying she liked it or playing with it saying it would "make Grammy so happy" or "Grammy will be very hurt if you don't like the big beautiful gift she spent a lot of money on" I remember seeing this at Christmas and birthdays, I'd be told off if I was gifted something and like clothes and would thank them saying I'd need to change the size. I'd say it for the benefit of the person giving the gift, to reassure them I liked it and I'd not be able to wear it immediately but I would once I got the right size. This would be followed by a telling off saying I should have just thanked them and not said anything else. But I always thought it showed more respect both ways to communicate why I couldn't wear the item immediately.
@sbg2520 She didn't just want the party to end, she needed it to end. She was overstimulated and overwhelmed. That could have ended up with Piper having a meltdown or panic attack on her birthday. They were honoring her sensory needs. I don't know if you've ever been in a situation where you were overstimulated and close to melting down yet you couldn't leave, but trust me, it is a miserable experience.
@sbg2520 This internet skit isn't about those fictional children. This internet skit is about one fictional child: Piper and the McAllister family. Also, if they're at the party, they probably care about Piper and care about her feelings and needs because they're her friends. Even 3 year-olds can have compassion and empathy for a friend. And if they were overstimulated and overwhelmed, it ws the perfect out for them. At the end of the day, they did get to play, got a cupcake and a party favor. Things don't always go to plan.
i think the party being called off in the end is a great example of how John and Shawna are breaking the cycle. i could see a mother like Barb being angry with Piper for not liking the big extravagant party and calling her ungreatful and oh what a waste of money, but Shawna sees Piper is upset and overwhelmed and puts Pipers feeling first ✨AND APOLOGIZES✨
On my niece 3rd birthday a lot of gifts didn't get opened on her party because it s just to much for her. And I love my sister and our family for not pushing it. Now she loves opening them ( 7 years). Its the same with hugs they don't have too.
I can see that's how I would have reacted - to a lesser extent than Barb, but very much wanting to put the group's enjoyment first and the need to 'save face'. Something to reflect and work on in myself.
This is how my big brother helped heal me from my mom. In moments where she would have been angry and hurtful, he was comforting and kind and helpful. I pray my son feels as safe with me when hes grown as i feel with my brother
So green hair mom validated John and made him feel seen. It’s what a no contact kid needs when they are brainwashed to think they are the problem. Going no contact goes against all our programming it’s HARD. And because he felt like he did the right thing he had the energy to chat with Shawna. Connection is so important.
@khills well he was projecting his feelings onto her at the time because he was going through a lot. He just needed a reason to snap at Shawna because he couldn’t explain his pain. I don’t really think it was jealousy towards them. I think he was just angry.
"You are a part of me" sums up the whole problem. Barb isn't able to see other humans as entities separate from her. No, Piper isn't "A part of you". She can be a big part of your LIFE, but that's not the same thing. Ultimately she is an individual creature removed from your existence by two generations. Barb's refusal to understand this is part of the issue. It's why she attempts to claim ownership over things she has no right to. She has no identity, because she's been taught that your entire existence as a person revolves around your family. She probably has no idea who she is. She's made her entire existence revolve around her role in the family (unfortunately common for women), and she can't cope with the realisation that no one else in her life does that. Because SHE sacrificed who she was, everyone else should have to as well.
Spot on. Barb went through serious postpartum depression and had no support. Which manifested in her resenting everyone around her while also completely loosing herself. To her she’s given the family her all, so the least they could do is cater to her feelings. Not realizing that though what was done to her was unfair, her children and grandchildren aren’t responsible for any of it.
“Family is important” would be a nice sentiment if what Barb meant was “You are important to me,” but what she means is “I should be important to you.”
That whole letter was so on point by Shawna. Every single phrase is perfect. There isn't a sliver of thought, affection or desire for connection with Piper. It's just, her needs, her wants, and what she thinks she is owed.
Listen I know you're a PHENOMENAL actor, but how the hell do you make Piper crying so believable?? I already forget these aren't separate people, BUT THE FACT THAT I FEEL LIKE I'M LOOKING AT A CRYING 3-YEAR-OLD!?!?!??!?! Every detail is so accurate, down to the pouty lip and even the way the tears finally burst out. You might be a magician, and you deserve all the recognition and more.
No what got me is HOWWWW in the hell does she manage to make Barb's facial expressions seem like those of a bitter wrinkly old woman?! LOOKING LIKE JUST AN ADULT WOMAN! XD pure, RAW talent
she studied acting + the meisner acting technique for many years, under a direct student of Sanford Meisner himself! but being a wizard is a close second reason for her talent
4:14 the parallel of Dee calling him a "good sport" when he communicated he didn't like the nickname while Barb would insist its affectionate and call him ungrateful.
Except didnt she call him that at the end anyway? I thought it was strange of her to say it again since she’s so good at listening to boundaries usually
@louis_kat I interpreted it as it coming naturally from her. Like the first time was for the sake of a nickname, but this time it was her thinking of him as a son
John also said ‘we’ll find it’ meaning he’s not really used to it coming from a genuine place, but he’ll try to assimilate. Mama Dee did say ‘it doesn’t have to stick’ if it makes him feel uncomfortable. I think she’s gentley trying to heal the trauma responses Barb has instilled in him. John only knows parental affection as manipulation tactics so of course he’s going to be stand off-ish. I think mama Dee moving in will really help in John’s development, and possibly even help with his relationships with his own parents too. And hopefully the store clerk and Lauren will help with Barb’s selfishness. Eh we’ll have to see what Shawna has in store, I foresee a lot of dramas happening. Especially with the green hair dance mom, who seems to have similar circumstances as John.
@louis_kat no? She called him “John honey, my favorite boy” and by the end she just calls him “my boy” noting that he finds the first one too much. While it taken him aback because he’s not used to loving nicknames, I think it just hits him that Dee is actually respecting his boundaries by not being too much with the nickname as per his request.
I wanted it to end with Piper and Frank catching starbugs, because that would be so sweet, instead, I get to go talk to my therapist about how glazing over the harmful dynamics instead of addressing them is such an ingrained part of the people pleasing that I didn't even notice the instinct real time in the emotional sandbox you've created and allowed us to play in..... o.O that is some damn work you put into this. Bravo!!!
Amen to the sandbox. My personal growth, therapy and getting to "see" how harmful a Barb can be validates. When I try to explain my experiences to someone it sounds so trite , self centered, yada yada all those deep planted messages . . . Thank you for this rather painful series.
Frank is trying in earnest to do the right thing, but 40 years of doing the wrong thing has put John in a place where it’s gonna be more complicated than that 💔
I completely agree. I was nodding along with John and then I remembered the painting Frank created and kept hoping that he’d at least get to see Pipes and give it to her. I can see Frank growing in the future and being there for his son and family. Breaks my heart for John and Frank.
@tiedcherrystems well, I don't think he's doing the right thing. He is being avoidant and pretty much abandoning his son on a tough day. He is also not holding his wife accountable or setting boundaries, so yeah, that someone is being passive doesn't mean they are doing good
Yessss. You almost forget that Frank was complacent in all of the abuse because hes quiet and isnt the one doing the screaming, and being reminded of it kinda hurt cause id grown to like Frank. But John was 100% in the right with everything he said. I hope they actually get to have that talk, at least Frank seems ready to listen.
@AcashaGibsonI’m pretty sure Charlotte is Piper’s middle name that Barb prefers. We see her do it with Chickie as well in a way calling her the name that she would’ve preferred they name her.
I hope so too... It seems like she has a difficulty understanding the severity of the situation cause she has a healthy relationship with her mom. Also her being pregnant right now can make her more sensitive and in her feelings. But this is NO reason to disrespect your husband's boundary.
I am sure others have made the observation, but I love the comparison of mothers in this video. A child is injured and his mom takes him home for him to feel better. Another mom sees her child overwhelmed and cancels the birthday party. But one mom sees her child hurt, and demands that he makes her feel better. These are silly sketch videos, but have so much emotional depth and warmth to them. In a way, it is teaching me to be a better friend and loving mother, in time. Thanks, Shawna!
Mama Dee extends her maternal love and affection to those who aren't her own Mo (Green Hair), as seen in another video, consoles her child's anxieties and teaches her to take risks. Also affirms someone she didn’t like, because he needed that
Oh my gosh... I didn't even think about it like that but yeah. In the context of all that gentle love, Barb's behavior is like a slap in the face. Poor John... Back to the mantra: Barb isn't real so she can't hurt you 😂
Even the happily child-free friend who lives a very different life was all about doing what Shawna and Piper needed, no hesitation, no further instructions needed.
"You self righteous haughty cow!"😭😭 That was vile. Seriously though I love how these archetypal characters help us reflect on our own dynamics with other people. Also poor gramps :(
I love that Dee read the behavior instead of feeding into it too! Shows a level of stability that Barb is surely jealous of and sent her off the cliff 😂
And dee dee has done nothing to barb except ro just exist. In fact shes been the most caring and understanding. But as she said Barb has to lash out. Her name is very fitting 😂😂
DeeDee gave Barb the exact right energy. Firm and calm, without anger. While Barb was escalating, trying to get a reaction, DeeDee starved her of what she was after. DeeDee is not just a good mom, or mil, or grandmother, she's a good person all around. Barb may never realize it, but DeeDee was trying to help her.
I think it's another good example of Barb's projection. She doesn't even know Piper well enough to get a gift that she would like. She sees Piper as her role, "granddaughter," rather than Piper, a complex 3 year old with hyperfixations on justice, Star bugs, and penguins. Barb's gift contrasts greatly with Frank's which demonstrates a deeper understanding of Piper.
The interaction between Mama D and Barb had me crying. That really hits close to home. The mother you have and the mother you wish you had. The narcissism is spot on ❤
I started crying when the green haired dance mom told John he did good and basically cried through the rest of the video. I’ve had almost exactly the same conversation with my dad that John and frank had
@loriannebaumgartner5386 YES!! And especially after saying it at the beginning of the party and John “not liking it,” then her saying it again because she knew he needed to hear it 😭😭😭
It's probably a temporary move in for like the first couple months.Maybe so that way they can adjust to having 3 babies instead of 2 like they say it takes a village.She probably owns her own house.People who own their own houses can dip out if they need 24 a couple monthssbg2520
@blu- exactly, my baby girl is 1,5yo and my mom lives with us, taking care of her when I go to work. She does have her own home and husband but that’s the life.
I need a backstory for Mama Dee too please! I feel like she's really been there as well, but she took the opposite route of Barb and it turned her into someone more relatable and understanding. Like maybe she went to therapy and it turned out well for her.
I had an abusive parent and I was a cycle breaker so for me it was “I want better for you” but for other who also had an abusive parent it’s “I had it bad so everyone should feel bad”. It really is a lot of work to undo generational damage and trauma.
Yup. That's what I thought. I'm Mama D, and while I treat everyone including my children with respect... it's taken YEARS to respond to people like Barb, with that level of grace. That was the hardest part.
I could see that. I broke the cycle with my kids and I couldn't have asked God for a better more loving, caring, emotionally available, understanding father. We have been so blessed to break the abuse cycle for both of us and the divorce cycle. We are the only ones on either side still married after 20 years...and I will not sit here and say it's been all rainbows.. it's taken so much self reflection, so much work to be communicative, understanding and patient with each other, and the storms we've weathered together any one of them would have been a legitimate reason to split (addiction struggles, infidelity, both of us knowing we wanted to have our kids know nothing of abuse, neglect or manipulation but having to learn to end those cycles with each other and communicate) but we both know that it takes wanting to show up for one another and a deep love. I love DeeDee and sometimes think that she must have a hell of a story to tell. She so well adjusted it's almost intentional and I know first hand when you don't want to hurt anymore, you learn to accept and forgive and you show up everyday never wanting the people in your life to ever feel the hurt you have, it makes you not just hyper aware but it makes you willingly and lovingly show up for those around you and become intentionally well adjusted.
@jamierodriguez8218 😭😭😭😭😭 Having a caring partner willing to learn and grow with you is really such a gamer-changer when it comes to breaking cycles. We put so much blame on the moms and forget that dads are a huge part of the dynamic too for better or worse. Frank is a decent guy, but John is correct: a lot of dysfunction in the family is his fault too.
seconded!! we definitely need DeeDee’s backstory because I need to know how that wonderful woman came to be. I also wanna know about Shawna’s family history and how it came to be that DeeDee seems to be single, whether by becoming a widow or through some sort of relationship ending. I think learning that DeeDee comes from an equally traumatized background as Barb and yet continues to choose kindness would make for an even more major juxtaposition between the two grandmas we know (DeeDee) and hate (Barb)
Here's my theory on why Frank acts how he does with defending Barb: he feels guilty. He feels guilty for abandoning her, for being a bad husband and father, and he feels responsible for the way Barb is now. That leads him to defend Barb, even at the detriment of his kids. What he needs to do is get into therapy to work on that guilt. Sticking up for Barb is only going to further the hurt his son feels, and it's also not going to help Barb ever see how she's truly been acting. And maybe if he makes changes, real changes, she will start seeking out those changes too. As much fun as it is to hate on Barb, I'd honestly love nothing more than to see her grow into the kind of parent that John and Jen deserve.
re: Frank - YESSSS!!!! It's especially fresh as Barb has spent some recent time reminding him it's all his fault (not giving himself the grace that he didn't know any better either) re: Barb - While Jennifer and John deserve a better mother, a legit narcissist is VERY unlikely to recognize their behavior and change, it's a part of that specific personality disorder and it's very sad. Most of the time it comes from trauma but it's still one of the hardest to treat.
I agree. When Frank says, "go ahead and blame me," I think he really feels like she should, like that's his penance for not being able to help her in the way Barb needed or wanted. But I don't think he could have helped her, what she needed was more than what he could realistically provide. She still needs professional help, and so does Frank...and John, and Jen, and probably the poor cashier at the store after she finds out how she contributed to this toxic situation. 😅
Agree but that is going to take a whole lotta work and patience to wait for them to be comfortable seeing her again, fully trust that she has changed and let her completely in again.
I agree on why Frank may feel he should defend Barb but ironically by defending Barb especially when she just hurt his son, he is doing the same thing that made Barb who she is, just like her dad left her to be abused by her mom. It would be really great for Barb to get the help she needs and be a better person but I find it really hard to understand how he could defend her when she just hurt his own son.
I think it's also the fact that he knew her before. On the video of young Barb we see the hurt that leads her to be what she is now, and Frank also saw that. I'm guessing John was too little to remember anything but a mom that is so narcissistic, but I'm guessing Frank reminisces on past Barb and he feels guilty for that change
Mama D coming in clutch!!! I was anxiously awaiting this to drop. I felt so bad for Piper being overwhelmed by the party but yay for Shawna for the immediate response and shutdown! I also loved the fact that Piper wanted nothing to do with the barbie dreamhouse.
I also loved the subtle nod to Teeny being an incredible aunt despite not liking children or kid-related things. Did she hate the party? Absolutely. Was she ten toes down for her niece’s comfort? *ABSOLUTELY*
@krystaljohnson3978they give you a regular receipt even if you don’t get a gift receipt so all Barb needs to do is return it. But it’s a gift and it’s pipers to do with as she pleases. Making a bug hotel could be fun. Or giving it to green haired girls daughter is also an option.
I love how you depicted Piper so much. I had a LOT of sensory issues growing up but was never seen or understood as neurodivergent, which caused me to be forced to do a lot of things I didn’t want to (eating/drinking when I was full or didn’t like something, hug people to say goodbye, be around people when it was too loud, being punished for even trying to push back on any of these things, etc). I wish more than anything that growing up my “no” was respected, and it is something I cherish more than anything in my adulthood; I do not keep people around if they cannot respect my “no”
MaMa Dee's composure and grace while under verbal attack yet still protecting her extended family from Barb's venom by refusing to allow her to barge into the house under any circumstance was a thing of beauty. She maintained reason, calm, voice control, empathy and understanding all without giving an inch. Wait til Barb finds out MaMa Dee isn't there just for the party as a guest but she's moved in, at least for a while.
@lola_love444omg i forgot she doesnt know that yet! That might be what really breaks her. Its going to make her realize how much she’s missing out on by being such a nasty person and not addressing her inner issues. At least we can hope.
I can just see that exchange next time Barb comes knocking and Mama Dee answers the door: "Oh! Why are _you_ here?" "Question is, Barb, why are _you_ here?"
I freaking LOVE. How Shawna and John have the willingness to change things when it doesn't suit Piper. She's a sweet little weirdo and I love that they don't force her to be happy or grateful for things she is genuinely not happy or grateful for. No singing, less people, movie time, may you get me cake please. From one weird little kid to another, Happy Birthday Piper!
So much to unpack here. My favorite part was DeeDee being that unmovable force between John and Barb!!! That was beyond satisfying, and I’m glad none of the kids knew she had shown up. They don’t need to be confused about the issues the grown ups are trying to work out. Piper is really proving to know exactly what she wants and I love it 😂
Also johns "i think I'm pretty damaged" is so on point. He absolutely need therapeutic support, and it should be Frank who pushes him that way. Frank needs to open up, be vulnerable and let his kid actually see him for once. Shawna sees more of Frank than anyone else, but only cos of art class, she was able to meet him in his comfort zone, but he needs to take some emtional risks and be vulnerable cor his childrens sake.
praying for a day john comes to shaunas painting classes and gets to see another side of his dad and they could talk it out a bit not just magically fix it but to just reach some kind of ground. Crying about the firefly painting he made for her and if she ever got it ;;;
I agree. He had an opportunity to tell John that he had tried to talk to Barb about apologizing and she blew him off. He needs to be more vocal and vulnerable about how he is trying to be an ally.
Fr John should go to an art class with his dad one time he needs to meet him where Frank is at. Frank needs to inform John of what happened but not back Barbs words and actions
@roses.6600Frank reminds me in many ways like my Dad. He's damned no matter how you slice it. My dad would go to the coffee shop to get away from my mother. But it left us children at the end of her wrath and anger regarding her husband not being there to "help" her. The fights were legendary. I cannot begin to say how many years my mother would tell us, "Do not celebrate my anniversary to that man. That was the worst day of my life, marrying him. I would have been (insert career goal, here), if he hadn't begged me to marry him!" One day I said, "So, you're saying that you wished we (4 children) wouldn't have been born?" "I was on the Pill when I conceived you!" By the way, she'd later state, "Why, I would NEVER say such a thing!" to others when I told them what she'd said. Only three years ago did she finally admit she told me she was on the pill when she conceived me. *sigh* Then there was the time she flagged down my ex-husband down the street from where he picked up our son for visitation, laden with presents.
I have so much to discuss!! 1. There still seems to be some kind of tension between Ty and Shawna, and this is quite obvious when Shawna jumps to ask Ty to leave at the end of the party. It also looks like since Ty is going through marriage problems, he may either be trying to have Shawna as an emotional support friend (someone who he can share his troubles with and relax a bit) or something more. In my opinion, it seems like he does indeed have some kind of feelings for Shawna, whether he’s aware of it are not. 2. I love that green haired mom said what she did to John. From Shawna unintentionally empathising with Barb (almost answering the phone) and Frank defending her, he really needed to hear that. I’m sure it would be comforting to know that he’s not alone in this, especially when the people around him seem to have pretty good relationships with their parents (mostly Shawna). 3. Barb writing a long letter to piper gave me so much rage. The entire letter was about her and her feelings, about her ‘status as a grandmother’ and about how SHE can’t see piper right now. Hell, she didn’t even wish piper a happy birthday IN HER BIRTHDAY LETTER. I don’t have much experience with narcissists but it baffles and fascinates me how un-self aware they can be. If I had a drink for every time barb said ‘I’ in the letter, I’d be an alcoholic. Also not to mention that SHES LITERALLY THREE!! 4. I also love the overarching storyline of John and Shawna trying to compensate for the way max’s party lead to them overlooking that piper does not like overly crowded gatherings. It’s a nice touch to show how they tried so hard that they forgot to consider who the party was for and what she would’ve wanted. I might add a few more things as I find them haha, so please excuse me!
When she was writing that letter, I was enraged for a vast majority of it until I thought, "Wait. Piper is THREE! She's not gonna be able to read this, and the parents are just gonna throw it out once they realize where it was going!" I eased up significantly at that realization, because Shawna and John would NEVER let Piper (or Max) be exposed to that level of toxicity. Then I remembered it was a skit and... This woman is SO GOOD!! 😭😭 👏🏿
@MomjeansMoxiethat’s a good point! I hadn’t considered that. I still think there’s something weird going on with Ty at least, especially with the looks he was giving her during the changing scene(and overall vibe). I look forward to where this goes though! I literally can’t tell haha
So nervous that Ty is going to 'lean' rather too much on Shawna with his 'I'm not flirting' flirting bc of his own marriage issues. I also... don't fully trust the green-haired mum. I feel like John treated Frank badly, but then we don't have as much info about his toxicity in the family in the past. So maybe John's justified? Not sure. It broke my heart. Lastly, why do the characters not say 'Her name is PIPER!'
sbg2520 She has very different reactions to Barb and Dee Dee. Piper will talk to her Mama Dee like she does her parents, but barely even responds to Barb. Most likely due to Barb always calling her the wrong name and forcing things on her she doesn't like. The barbie present being a prime example.
sbg2520 I don't know where you got that idea from, but they have never needed Piper's validation. That's not even what I was saying. Just that she already doesn't seem to like Barb, and wouldn't care if Barb was there or not
My husband went NC with his mom. After his dad randomly "dropped by" several times (we lived 100 miles one way away) to tell my husband how hurt his mom was and tried to excuse her awful behavior, he ended up going NC with his dad too. Everyone warned husband he'd feel guilty if he didn't forgive her because "you only get one mom." My MIL passed away. The only guilt my husband felt was that he didn't feel more sad. His therapist explained it: he'd already grieved the loss of his mother 18 years ago when he went NC after years of emotional abuse.
I don’t know if this will help him or not, but if you think it would you can let him know he’s by far not the only person to experience guilt over not missing someone more, and not even just because a relationship was toxic. Personal story as explanation for that, skip if you’re uninterested/feeling I’m drawing attention away from original point: My grandma was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s 7-ish years before she passed, during the last 2 or so my emotional connection to her ended because she stopped being my grandma, and *man* did I feel guilty about that and man did I feel bad about how my reaction to learning she died was basically “oh, ok”. Relationships and emotions, like many things, are not as clean cut and simple as humans try to pretend they are. Some of us hold as tighten as possible to any semblance of a connection until one party actually dies, and some of us experience the death long before anyone mentions a pine box.
Same boat as your hubby but with my grandmother. When I was informed of her passing, I cried because I wasn’t there to support my mother; I already grieved over a decade beforehand. I was NC for ten years while she was in a nursing home and LC (practical reasons prevented full NC) for five years before that. Some people tried to excuse her actions and guilt me about it because she was experiencing decline from early dementia. The dementia didn’t cause her to become abusive. It just exaggerated her existing behavior to the point that I couldn’t emotionally sweep it under the rug anymore.
That's exactly it! I felt bad when my brother died, for the circumstances and his family. But for me, I knew my life wouldn't be any different because I felt like I lost him years ago.
Shawna, I just have to say that, as a writer, I have to compliment you on your storyline, your dialogue, the flow... it's all very cohesive and spot-on. I am so impressed with your structuring of the story. Then acting it all out yourself? You are very, very talented. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Shawna’s response to Piper feeling overwhelmed genuinely caught me off guard in a good way. The option to have people be asked to leave when the birthday kid isn’t feeling it was unheard of in my family lol, they’re more from the “grin and bear it” school of thought so that reaction shook me lmao. Like huh THAT’S ALLOWED?? Also tysm for this series, I’m hooked on it and it’s genuinely so nice to see these family struggles represented in media!
Well, to ask a lot of guests to leave a party thst they may have just arrived to is pretty rude. I would just move Piper to a quieter spot watching Bugs Life and letting her eat the cake shes fixated on away ftom the guests. For at least a little while longer.
Same here, but honestly I wouldn't be able to ask people to leave as they just came in. I would at least let them be dance for an hour or 2 and have an intimate birthday with my kids.
I felt this way, I was that kid who was overwhelmed but had to power through. It's not really just a family thing but in our culture, guests are taken care of as if they too are family (I'm Filipino) so the kid would be removed from the scene to calm down and the party continues regardless if the birthday girl/boy is present or not. I actually had a knee jerk reaction to the scene, like isn't that rude? Would people talk? I'm learning so much from these videos, I don't even plan to have kids and I'm still young but this just showed me that really boundaries are fine, it doesn't matter if it's a crowd of people, it's alright to prioritize ones emotions especially if its kids who have it harder during crowds. I'm so glad I found Shawna's channel, she's literally the best T~T
I think it was so Piper would see it and ask what it said, and John or Shawna would have to read it in front of the kids. Of course, they'd never do that, they'd probably check the content first and tell her it's nothing or invent something. I can totally see my mom doing something like that with my niece
The "call it even?" part was so subtle and true. Yes, I got the idea from friends, but there have definitely been times where my husband and I were both just a mess and "call it even" was the right way to close it out. Like, sometimes we just do and say stupid things to each other, and it's not always deep, so being able to call it even and close it out is very healthy.
yeesss. sometimes it's just time to stop milking the conflict, admit that you both messed up and just call it even. no one is perfect, especially when emotions are involved.
Heeey, my husband and I had one of those the other day! I think it's really good to do the 'call it even' thing. Then, you can both hug about it later. After things cool down my husband and I always talk about it - and it really helps. Not holding things against each other is a really healthy relationship dynamic. Awesome to hear you have such a great thing, OP! I hope you both have a wonderful and long-lasting marriage. May your love be big, beautiful, and always around you.
my husband & i do the same . a lot of our arguments are just misunderstandings (we are both autistic & have a lot of trauma) & at some point we both realize that we've both already made our points and it isn't going anywhere because there wasn't a real problem to begin with . only we call it "this isnt even anything, let's just dump it" à la tim robinson in itysl LOL . (our joint hyperfixation)
Yeah but he was still pretty riled up and then lashed out on Frank (which yes frank needs to stop enabling barb etc.) but I adored the call it even but he didn’t move past it and even brought it up afterwards. John seriously is letting the anger fester and consume 😢
This was a hard one. I had a grandma like barb (and thankfully one like mama Dee,) and it’s hard. You see how they treat your parents, and you see how much they wound and hurt. And if you don’t give what the grandparent wants from you - they lash out at you too. It’s hard, and John is hurting a lot, but cutting Barb out is best for him, his wife, and his children in the long run.
“I didn’t end it all….FOR HIM! And thy is is how he repays me?” I know a mother who went through that experience during a very hard time in her life, but her view of it is thanking her adult children for being her reason to keep going. Probably part of why her children talk to her pretty much every day…
I have this. My fist son passed away, I named my second child Faith because I was ready to end it, and she was the reason I decided to stay. She could never be a burden, only a blessing. A motivation to live. And as unfair as it is, I needed her (emotionally) much more than she needed me. It's my job and honor to be here for her in every possible way. As an adult, she's begun to understand, and someday as a mother, I hope she'll see it even more clearly.
Barbs final line of "I guess I'll just kill myself" really struck home and I'm glad John or Shawna weren't the ones to hear it. Growing up my mother would say that all the time whenever we expressed that something she did or said hurt us or just as a way to win arguments. My younger brother and I recently brought it up to our mother and she had no recollection of ever saying it. Mind you, this was a line she'd use in *every* argument, no matter how big or small. So it doesn't surprise me that someone like Barb would say it as well. I'm just surprised she hasn't said it sooner
Yeah my mom has pulled the “you make me want to kill myself” and “guess I’ll just leave you alone forever” cards before. It is in my opinion one of if not the worst thing you can say to your child. It’s so exhausting trying to explain how they are hurting you and just have them shut you down by scaring you like that.
My mom a few years ago used that line “I wish I were dead” or something of that nature- in front of my sonwhen I was not present smh. He came back to me crying, I was furious! All this because she didn’t get greeted with a hug like she wanted by her grandkids when she came to my hotel room (we were on a trip together) and I was havinv a rough time with my kids at that moment. Needless to say I later blew up on her, not a very proud moment for me but at my young age of 45, I’m slowly realizing how self-centered & selfish my mom can be. She’s a sweet lady but wants everyone to think of her. She has gotten a bit better.
@MotherOfChows my mom always said and still says that line “I guess I’m just the worst mother in the world”… But she did also threaten the same as Barb at least one time I can remember vividly.
Im #8 of 10 kids. My oldest brother #2 got into an accident where he almost died. No one could find his POA and so our mother took charge denying his good friends to see him. We had a family meeting and went off on her. My dad (theyre divorced and were at the time) went off on her saying his siblings did the same to him when his father died. We got emotional, told her that she cant do that to people and told her how she's been emotionally damaging to her 6 daughters. Her response: "I would NEVER do that to anyone" "I dont know what youre talkint about"... ours: "mom you've literally done that to every single daughter". She told me id be on the street with no help from her or family if i didnt do what she wanted. Said duck that and left the state and moved on with my life. She's better now but still manipulative and she's met my small kids but i wont live where she can damage them too
I want John to get therapy. Like actually see a therapist. He needs it and it would help him a lot. To have a place he can confide everything he feels without any expectations or guilt. It would be hard for him, but I think it genuinely would be really healthy for him in the long run.
The overreaction to shawnas moment is very telling. I think they have done amazingly to this point, but i think maybe couples councelling might be an easier start for them both and it might get John conforitable with the idea of therapy in general. He seems to have an attitude of "deal with it yourself" but i think we all know that that only goes so far.
That simple, natural “of course my boy” was so subtle but exactly what John needed at that moment. He needed to feel the natural, gentle care of a mother. This is fantastic writing and im so in love with this channel for the storylines and mannerisms she applies to every single character. Even down to little Piper. Great job!
You cannot imagine what a heartfelt, healing balm it is for a daughter-in-law or son-in-law to get to have that kind of relationship, with their in-laws, when their family of origin was a mess.
@ladylilac4363absolutely. We have a long way to go, but the bridges my husband burned with his family are made up for in the strong connection that he has with mine. We may never see that side again, but he has a full cup of love and acceptance (has started referring to my parents as Mom and Dad instead of YOUR Mom and Dad.♡)
@louis_kat When I first read your comment, my immediate reaction was to argue semantics between Deedee calling John "my favorite boy" vs. "my boy," and while I do still think it's a little semantic, I think there's something to be said for it all the same. I also think it's context-dependent, and let's not forget that Deedee said, "We'll find it" (it being their "groove" or dynamic or what-have-you, now that she's moving in with them full-time). John understandably has conflicted feelings about his mother and probably motherhood in general. In a normal, still kinda new environment (with the prospect of Deedee being there full-time), when Deedee calls him "my favorite boy," it doesn't quite land right, because he still has his guard up somewhat and maybe because it feels a little recycled and kitchy since "my favorite girl" has always applied to Shawna. When she calls him "my boy," it's right after that blow-up with his own mother and father, as well as evidence in the form of the Dreamhouse that Barb really doesn't care about his boundaries-- in short, it's when John is feeling raw and needs that motherly comfort. Basically, I think boiling it down to "she called him this when he asked her not to" misses some of the underlying nuance of the situation and discounts the earlier agreement that Deedee and John had come to that they would find footing with their new dynamic.
So lovely to see the portrayal of Piper a quirky kid, who’s NOs and boundaries aren’t mocked or stepped over by her family, I see much of my child self in her character but unfortunately my boundaries were treated as jokes. I know it’s not the main focus of this but I just had to say it’s very moving and touching.
Frank has been an enabler and I understand John’s hurt when Frank tries to smooth things over for Barb. The pattern has been either Frank shuts down when Barb gets nasty or he tries to defend her in the aftermath. Frank tries to be peacemaker but that role ends up perpetuating the problem with Barb. He shows he understands that Barb hurts people and he’s tried speaking to Barb. Still he should not defend her to John. Because John doesn’t need Frank piling on pressure even if it’s subtle when Barb is actively trying to force her presence on them.
Thank you for this! I was so confused about John's reaction to Frank. I knew there were some deep seated wounds there but couldn't put my finger on it. This explanation helps :)
he knows shawna asked him before what happens if he notices her bany bump and am pretty sure there's a tiktok of them talking about how his dad never showed his hoppies in their home @lize2413
My grandmother used to write preachy/judgey letters to everyone in the family, and one by one they all asked her to stop, except for me. As the youngest grandchild I could barely read her handwriting so instead of being upset by the content I just enjoyed trying to decipher what the hell they even said. I can totally see Piper being similarly immune even if she could read.
@Herslowambitionsexactly. I was popping in here to say that. I grew up with a Barb in my life and seeing the letters that were intended to be read to the children by the adult was so nauseatingly on point.
I personally love the differences between Barb and Frank's reaction to being turned away at the door. Frank didn't push or throw a fit, he left the door open for conversation, and went his way. I'm so encouraged that he respected John enough to go home. And I do hope Piper gets her starbug painting someday. ❤ EDIT: Rewatched and y'all are right - everyone but the kids knew Grandpa was coming. Which makes Frank's actions even more indicative of personal growth imo.
Frank’s guilt is skewing things (not saying he didn’t do well here, he did, but you can see Barb’s ways have gotten him twisted around in his own head)- if only John could see the way he talks at painting class!
Cause Frank realizes that he has had a big part to play in the way things have become. He avoids issues, avoided helping Barb when she needed and avoided helping his kids when Barb grew angry and resentful over the years.
John invited Frank. He was aware Frank was coming as me mentions it at the beginning in the skit. But that said I do think Frank showed a lot of grace when it came to being kicked out. If anything he messed up bringing up Barb he should have just handed John the painting and left. Unfortunately he does have experience knowing that once someone starts lashing out it’s best to just get out of the line of fire until they calm down.
Toddler/young child changing their mind about the theme of the party on the day of after all the work the parents put in is peak toddler mentality. Also, halloween costumes. I laughed way harder than I should have at that part... 😅
No seriously! It’s happened to me EVERY YEAR 😂. Kids in double digits, you’d think by now they’d have learned that we can’t change themes the day of! 😂
Yup my 2 year old had an entire meltdown about putting on the bumble bee costume she insisted on getting for Halloween and ended up wearing a carebear onesie
Shawna and pipers relationship reminds me of me and my moms. My mom is a very extroverted loud person, but is also very compassionate, i was her little extremely introverted neurodivergent daughter with sensory issues. She didnt always get it right or understand why i needed the things that i needed, but she always listened and never made me feel bad for saying no or telling her i didnt like certain things. Watching piper and shawna interact in this series, and pipers very clear "nos" being listened and respected gives me a lot of nostalgia. While also making me reflect as an adult how lucky and rare that is
I KNEW Piper would say, "No thank you," to the Barbie Dream House! This is a perfect representation of what it's like to have a narcissistic parent with and enabler spouse. The narcissist cannot wrap their brains around anyone else's thoughts or feelings, possessing zero empathy, and they literally believe they can do no wrong. And the enabler spends years allowing the abuse to continue as they "keep the peace" by making everyone sacrifice their well-being just to keep the narcissist from throwing another epic tantrum. This is why John is so mad at his dad. His dad obviously didn't protect John as a child from his mom. I would LOVE to see content of what that household was like when John and Jen were little....all the way through high school leading into college.
Go mama D!! It’s no wonder she has been the one to receive the invite to stay and has the best parental relationship with her children. She knows what each of her kids and grandkids need, is emotionally and physically available, and is also able to validate the feelings of each person, Without heaping pressure and her own opinions on others. The differences between the two grandmothers are extensive, and I’m so glad she’ll be moving in! Hopefully she’ll be able to help them all heal a bit. I also love that Shawna and John understand and act on Piper‘s feelings, and they just get it. They comfort her, meet her needs and try to create the best dynamic they can.
I need him to have that conversation with Frank. That doesn't mean letting Barb back in but having all the information may help John heal. I think Frank wants to be open and honest
I agree. I think John could have still allowed Frank to see his granddaughter and give her a present. It’s like he got angry at Frank because of the actions of his mother.
John said he’s angry at Frank because of Frank’s reaction to Barb’s behavior. If someone slaps you in the face and someone else does nothing to defend you that someone else has also shown they’re not safe to be around.
@taleyag8800 no, he got angry at Frank because Frank started defending Barb and making excuses for her behaviour. Frank has been doing it all John's life apparently. he was avoiding conflict at all costs, even if it means shutting down the victim
@polina-rs4lr When Frank heard that John just spoke to his mother, Frank immediately asked if he was okay, and when John said no, he immediately then said he’d say hi, give the present and leave. John then said, no GO HOME. John was angry right after the phone call, I understand, but he didn’t get angry AFTER John picked up for Barbara. He even asked what Frank was doing there even tho he was invited. And I don’t think Frank was defending Barbara’s actions, I think he was trying to be a middle man and remind John that Barbara is a human and hurt as well (hurt people hurt people). Not in a way to say “you need to forgive your mother” or “cut her some slack” but more along the lines of “there are reasons why your mother is the way she is”. And I don’t get why John thinks it’s selfish of Frank to show up. I think he said that out of anger.
To be that person, anyone else notice how Shawna interrupted Ty when he offered to shut down the party for then get Teeny to do it? And then she wanted Ty to leave afterwards. Also, I wonder if the green haired mom will become John’s version of Ty.
This series has helped me realize I’m like the adult “Max/Piper” of my family. I’ve never had much of a relationship with my grandparents because of how they treated their children and sons/daughters-in-laws. Growing up, grandma has always tried to kinda guilt trip me by telling me how she is sad we don’t talk/see each other (because my parents don’t invite her over a lot), but this show has helped me realize that our distanced relationship is not really the result of my actions- it’s the result of her treatment towards her kids before I was even born. And even if I’ve only experienced little bits and pieces of her toxic treatment towards me, it’s okay if I still take the stories my parents and aunts and uncles have told me of her behavior, and the knowledge of how they tried to protect me from her, and use that information to continue to keep the space between us. Thanks for this series- it’s really been therapeutic and has given me a better way to analyze my own family dynamics.
So many good things about this video. I know that it was hard watching John let loose on Shawna, and then Frank. The thing that will save John is his ability to see when he is acting from his hurt. He came right out and said he is damaged. I see John realizing he needs therapy. I think Frank is just starting to realize how much damage he caused with his hands off approach. That talk with John will be hard as hell, but I think Frank will be willing to work for a relationship with his son. I love that a whole group of grown ups fully embraces and loves Piper just as she is. I think Mama Dee is going to be the person who steps in to give them all enough space to start tackling the difficult stuff. She is the perfect combination of Care Bear and Mama Bear. They shouldn't throw away that unhinged letter Barb wrote. It will save John a lot of time in his first therapy session.
Also is it mean I want him to send a copy to his dad and sister? Like listen next time you wanna talk about how mom had it rough or whatever - this is what she sent my Three Year Old because she couldn’t come to her birthday party. But that’s probably the petty person in me that loves drama
@nerdontangents as someone who is having to have radical acceptance I need to be honest and open about everything that I was forced to choose, and why I was forced to choose it. it makes absolute sense to me that he would send those to his father and his sister at the very least because they need to have something to wake them up. too many people in my life are still acting like I should just shut up and put my nose down and Soldier on like nothing's ever happened to me
No, I thought it was satisfying watching John unload on Frank. It was BEYOND overdue and someone needed to finally call Frank out on his avoidant, selfish behavior. Unloading on Shawna was less fair. Shawna never answered the phone, she consulted her own mother before attempting any action one way or the other.
I love how Piper gets her own agency in boundaries at her birthday party. She gets to express how she feels in the adults in her life pay attention and adjust where appropriate.
The way piper can enforce her boundaries at three is proof of how good parents John and shawna are. Pipers boundaries are listened to and respected and is why she feels comfortable setting them when she feels uncomfortable ❤️ literally healing my inner child
@nerdontangents I felt it was a good sign that he was willing to have that hard conversation with John later. Barb would never. Frank has a lot of issues and I feel much of the defending he does of Barb comes from a place of guilt for not being there for her after John was born. Therapy would do them all some good.
@nerdontangents Did you catch what John said about “at least you’re not screaming at anyone”? That makes me think that Frank would lose it on the family so that Barb could calm down, meeting fire with fire. 💔
@moxiegraphix oh I agree Frank needs to talk to someone about that. I personally want to headcanon he’s already gone. But it could be possible he still needs to fine tune his approach. Cuz plateauing is a thing and if just went in to address his marital problems without addressing the kids he could still be stuck on “I need to atone for not being the husband I should have been.” But hasn’t quiet figured out that doesn’t help him become the father he wants to be.
Oooh is that a supportive friendship I see potentially happening with green-haired mom (Mo)? I can see she finally might have seen him in a light of "overwhelmed parent" - she can now start the process of humanizing him, instead of judging the first impression she got.
Agreed! She made a lot of assumptions about him when she first met him. Now she knows they have things in common - eccentric, bug-loving children and estranged parents. It would be great for John to have someone who fully understands his position. Shawna tries, but she’s almost empathetic to a fault and still sympathizes with Barb. It would be great for John to have a friend who gets the feeling of having to hold that no-contact line with an abusive parent.
@moanka.00John does not need to be friends with another woman. It’s not appropriate and starts people down a road of emotional betrayal of their spouse.
@lilmissNancyPantsparenst are allowed to have friends of the opposite gender. Not every parent is gonna cheat on their spouse just bc they know someone of the opposite gender
@lilmissNancyPantsThat's a really unhealthy viewpoint. People are allowed to have friends, regardless of their respective genders. There is nothing inappropriate about a man and a woman being friends. The insistence that men and women can't have friendships without it leading to emotional betrayal of their spouses because of the assumption of some kind of attraction is really weird. By that logic, can a bisexual person have no relationship with anyone outside of their spouse? Can lesbians only be friends with men and gay men only with women? It's complete nonsense. Don't project your insecurities onto other people.
@lilmissNancyPantsThe idea that men and women can’t be friends is so regressive it’s embarrassing that anyone still thinks like that. Grow up, we’re not in preschool anymore and no one is going to get cooties from being near someone of the opposite gender.
@kayleighbrown459but instead of looking at the point and realizing she has made her love a dangerous weapon, she’s just out there waving it around at anyone…daring them to mess with her. She’ll be in deeper trouble soon.
This series is beyond cathartic. I was a Piper. My grandmother was very mistreated in her youth and, I’m guessing as a coping mechanism, became a massive narcissist and perpetual victim by the time my mom was a teen. As by the time I came around, she was Barb. And even with some of the “exaggerated” aspects, my grandmother had said every single one of barbs lines at some point. She never liked my partner when I became an adult and I was finally the first one to completely cut her off when she tried to cause legal problems for him and almost cost me my children in the crossfire. I cut her off and after years were finally healing from what she did. But after I cut her off, she turned into this version of Barb. “You can’t keep my from my grandchildren.” 100% I absolutely can. They are my kids. And once I cut her off, it was like the glass shattered for a lot of the rest of the family. One by one, other people did the same because they saw how she acted and talked about me after, and how she was going to insane extremes to violate my boundary.
Barb’s note to Piper is killing me bc there’s no way a three year old would be able to read all that 🤣 Edit: I know the note was really for John and Shawna. I just thought it was funny how evident it was, because no way Piper could actually read it. It’s a detail that shows exactly how inconsiderate Barb is and how little she’s ACTUALLY thinking about her grandchild. But everyone’s replies have been super insightful!
while barb's behaviour across this vid is completely and utterly out of line, i'm worried abt her, bc it feels like her threats aren't completely baseless anymore. she's only moving deeper into her destructive behaviour, and the more people call her out on it, the more worrying her behaviour gets
Barb is deep down still dealing with major postpartum depression. She felt so alone and lost after having John and just never recovered. Now she’s full of resentment and also desperate to not feel alone. Which she handles by constantly trying to make herself the center of attention. But she doesn’t realize she’s just making things worse for herself because she’s only making herself more lonely.
I just wanna say thank you Shawna - Piper reminds me of me when I was a little girl with undiagnosed autism. I only did what I was interested in, spoke my feelings bluntly, and HATED parties - every birthday party ended with me in tears. I won't say that I was unsupported - my Mum didn't understand exactly how I felt but she did her best to respect it - but it's still so incredibly validating to see Piper's family accept her exactly as she is and not force her into situations she's uncomfortable with. Thank you so much ❤
This is exactly what I would have needed at this age. Not my mother physically dragging me out of the house to be with the other kids. And when I was a depressed teenager not her holding it over my head like it was my fault
Entertainment
I love that even when Piper is overwhelmed she leverages the "No Thank You, Mother". She knows that she doesn't have to escalate to be heard.
And woweee Mama D the bouncer!
"This may be part of the problem. You wound when you are feeling wounded." Those words were perfect. And also her calmness while Barb lost it was evidence of some serious self control
I love Mama Dee!!!
The fact that she would not be bullied and did not let Barb in the house…
What a legend she is
Momma Dee is a better person than I am😂
Better than me too. I would have caught charges @jessicacupo4133
Hurt people tend to hurt people.
That Piper can state her need "No singing please" without fear or worry is amazing.
I wonder if Piper is some kind of neurodivergent.
@OldBiddy88 she reminds me a lot of my Autistic family member so I wouldn't be surprised (I'm also autistic, but on a different part of the spectrum. I was just as blunt as Piper but used more words)
@OldBiddy88 Wow I never actually considered that but it makes sense
@OldBiddy88 As an autistic person, I am 100% certain that she is
I wish I had that much confidence as a little kid
The fact that Barb writes "you are a part of me" in the card to Piper reminds me SO MUCH of my grandmother. She was always desperate to be the matriarch, with the entire family revolving around her - but she saw all of us kids as nothing more than extensions of her. We were there to give her attention and something to brag about, and that was it. It's such a subtle line that says so much, well done Shawna
I hated that line, but only because it was used accurately according to her character and it stung.
But. ... and it's a big but ... Piper would never see it. It's written to belittle and deride John and Shawna's efforts at containment of her actions. They'll read it. One of them will, so it's not to Piper, moreover she specifically directs it to 'Charlotte' the mythical grandchild in her mind. Internalising her pain but externalising it so everyone is guilted and shamed by it. This is A-grade manipulation by a coercive narcissist. And that's excellent script writing and story telling by Shawna the Mom. Applause not only for the acting but also for the direction and production.
When did Shawna tell Ty about #3?
It also feels like a throwback to Barb's statement to Jen that her ovaries and eggs grew when Jen was still in Barb's womb. Even though that's not the case for John, it still shows how weirdly possessive she feels towards her grandkids.
Classic narcissism, overly attached emotions and everyone is an extension/reflection of them. No one exists except as part of their world.
The audacity of Barb to write a manipulative letter TO A CHILD to villainize her father is unhinged
A 3-year-old who can't even read the card, no less. She knew who she was actually writing that letter out to.
And not even call her by her given name to boot.
Right?! Her face when she said Jon's name is everything you needed to see.
My dad’s mom would withhold presents from us in the hopes we’d ask him why they didn’t show up so he’d have to say she was mad at him. She’d try to hurt us in the hopes of hurting/controlling him. In reality we never noticed bc we had no relationship with her. But it still hurt him. She was horrible.
On the plus side, piper is 3. I doubt she could read all of that
"The kids don't need to know you were here..."
Dee Dee was both trying to protect the kids AND preserve Barb's chance of ever fixing things and Barb was too self-centered to see it.
Yes. And I get the feeling she was less protecting the kids and more protecting John. That was probably the first time a mother stood up for him, bless him.
But how she's talking to Barb, it's so clear she's all but begging Barb to actually listen and learn. Beautifully done.
I wonder which kids she was referring to? The kids or the grandkids
@CrazyMamaSHSYes and her response to her was so deeply empathetic and patient even when she lashed out, calmly but firmly pointing out the pattern was the kindest thing she possibly could've done for Barb in that moment, but she's just incapable of seeing it
@kristenwelker6493 honestly when I first watched it I was thinking their kids, like Shawna and John. But she could've meant the grandkids. Or even both tbh. The grandkids so they dont wonder what's going on maybe? And Shawna and John so that they aren't triggered again by her being there?
@kristenwelker6493 Usually when she says "the kids" she's talking about the next generation, not the grandkids. It also happened at Thanksgiving when she said "No Frank, Barb and the kids are talking cake. You and I are doing the dishes"
I don't think we've seen her use a term to collectively talk about the grandkids, but when she says "the kids" she's always mostly referring to their children + partners
It hits me again and again how much Barb resents her situation. She resents John for being a hard first baby, she resents Frank for not stepping up, she resents Shawna for being an emotionally connected mother and she resents Dee for having a healthy outlook. She might not know it as resentment but it comes across as just resenting everyone.
I also feel as if she thinks she is owed a lot from John because he was a hard baby. :/
@King-bw8miI'm not even sure John was a hard baby (compared to other babies), I think she just had a hard experience dealing with him alone
@alissa6380yeah it looked like postpartum and as someone who had it with all 4 of my kids that ish is so hard now with people knowing about it.....I couldn't imagine how hard it would have been back then when "baby blues" was something people were told to just get over. I can see how it could lead to resentment. Of the kids, your partner and other mothers who seem happier and more connected or "better" moms to their kids.
@alissa6380 right, she also clearly had mental health issues that went untreated that would make any first baby hard to deal with :(
@King-bw8misometimes when your post partum hits that hard your dream is a do-over. You have to let it go though since time machines don’t exist.
HOLY SHIT John called out Frank. AMAZING.
And Frank agrees to have a convo! Even more amazing
I think considering all the dynamics, it wasn't a great decision to invite Frank. Even though he's not the narc, she can figure things out and knows when Piper's b-day is. When Frank is invited, that increases the risk of Barb finding out about the party.
Im glad Frank actually has some understanding and common sense unlike Barb.
I think John needs to back off Frank a bit. Shawna doesn’t resent Frank, probably because she knows what it’s like to love a damaged person.
ITS NOT OUR KIDS JOB TO MAKE US FEEL BETTER ABOUT OURSEEEEEEELVES
THIS IS MY FAVORITE SONG
This is so true-something I have to keep close to my heart for my own kiddos’ sake.
I wish I could get my father to understand this, and his mother. I wish my parents understood boundaries. I wish I had a momma D, who was capable of articulating this so well. Glad they have a momma D!
Preach, Mama Dee, preach!
@alisonagasending ❤️🩹🙏🫂
I think once you become a parent its hard for people to remember you are just a person too and will make mistakes. But there are certainly things that should be way clearer to some parents not to burden their children with.
“This may be part of the problem, Barb”
Mama D is who I hope to be to my adult children. DAMN she shut Barb down real quick
SAME. 😭 She treats her children and grandchildren with respect and dignity.
@crazylegger she even treats Barb with compassion and respect while saying what needs said
She did, but I'm annoyed that she didn't say anything about not calling Piper by the right name. That shit really irks me!
@s.bibula7585 Don't forget Francis. Chickie and Piper are in the same boat.
@s.bibula7585 I think she was choosing her battles. And in that moment, Barb wasn't going to hear her no matter what she said.
Mama Dee did not react to Barb's manipulative threat to k*ll herself. She also didn't mention it to anyone. She diffused the drama before it could start. This is the level-headed wisdom you need when dealing with a narcissist.
I feel like she may reach out to Frank about it. Yes, she knows it’s manipulation but she is a compassionate person and likely to be concerned
Mama Dee handled that masterfully
@jessicacupo4133 but would Frank take it seriously? I mean Barb has threatened with su|c|de many times before
@SalomeLópez8203Exactly. He won't, and he shouldn't. Narcissists don't off themselves. It's strictly for dramatic effect.
Hah, I'm so used to my narc father I didn't even blink at that. Yes, it's wild, and yes, it's traumatizing and a manipulation tactic. The first few times you hear it are always so shocking and triggering.
But after you've heard it 20+ times from someone like my father it just kinda blends in with everything else, and you can see it for the empty threat that it is rather than an actual cry for help...
I'm assuming this isn't Mama Dee's first rodeo, seeing how calm and collected she was in responding to that. She saw Barb flying off the handle from a mile away and was 100% ready to greyrock and act as the bouncer. Good on her for shielding John and Shawna from the abuse that Barb was trying to spew all over them.
john's realisation how damaged he actually is 💔 probably a starting point for healing.
i love that he found a new friend who can really get it in dance mom. he needs some true ally. looking forward of the future meeting ups at dance class.
"you keep finding bugs my girl, I'll be right back" That part touched my heart, I always wanted my mother to prioritize my feelings before pretending in front of other people, damn, I'm like Piper
Oo, I get that pretending part. My whole childhood was how it looked not how it was that mattered to my mother.
I was the weird kid but instead of understanding my mom would try to force me to be normal and interact with the rest of the kids. Wild how it’s MY birthday but everyone’s more worried about how I appear to others than if I’m actually enjoying my own celebration
Same. I identify with Piper so much. I cackled when she said no singing mother. That's so me.
Mexican Parents could never
And the way Shawna called Piper "my girl" the same way Mama Dee calls her "my girl" 😭
Piper is SO POLITE while enforcing her boundaries.
that's her mom and dad....
because she realizes she doesn’t have to raise her voice to be heard. she’s surrounded by people who listen the first time
@trelenh just because you have a kid doesnt mean you get to upset them for your feelings piper doesnt like lots of people she doesnt want the birthday song she won't die not having them if she was refusing all food or doing something harmful thats when parents need to overstep kids wants to ensure safety and well being
And the way her parents respect them!!! Opposite of Barb!
@trelenhwut?
I love that Shawna neutrally asked, "What do you think?" Of the gift and didn't tell her where it came from.
Missed that one- yes, absolutely!
She is an absolute masterpiece she's wonderful xxxxx
Another part showing her and John breaking the cycle. Barb would have coaxed Piper into saying she liked it or playing with it saying it would "make Grammy so happy" or "Grammy will be very hurt if you don't like the big beautiful gift she spent a lot of money on"
I remember seeing this at Christmas and birthdays, I'd be told off if I was gifted something and like clothes and would thank them saying I'd need to change the size. I'd say it for the benefit of the person giving the gift, to reassure them I liked it and I'd not be able to wear it immediately but I would once I got the right size. This would be followed by a telling off saying I should have just thanked them and not said anything else. But I always thought it showed more respect both ways to communicate why I couldn't wear the item immediately.
@sbg2520 She didn't just want the party to end, she needed it to end. She was overstimulated and overwhelmed. That could have ended up with Piper having a meltdown or panic attack on her birthday. They were honoring her sensory needs.
I don't know if you've ever been in a situation where you were overstimulated and close to melting down yet you couldn't leave, but trust me, it is a miserable experience.
@sbg2520 This internet skit isn't about those fictional children. This internet skit is about one fictional child: Piper and the McAllister family.
Also, if they're at the party, they probably care about Piper and care about her feelings and needs because they're her friends. Even 3 year-olds can have compassion and empathy for a friend.
And if they were overstimulated and overwhelmed, it ws the perfect out for them. At the end of the day, they did get to play, got a cupcake and a party favor. Things don't always go to plan.
The way Mama D just went with it when Teeny took control and told her what to do. I love her so much, it's so cathartic to see her.
i think the party being called off in the end is a great example of how John and Shawna are breaking the cycle. i could see a mother like Barb being angry with Piper for not liking the big extravagant party and calling her ungreatful and oh what a waste of money, but Shawna sees Piper is upset and overwhelmed and puts Pipers feeling first ✨AND APOLOGIZES✨
That's my parents (granted they are Mexican and grew up poor)
it strikes me more as a reaction Barbs mother would have, that would be learned behaviour for barb.
On my niece 3rd birthday a lot of gifts didn't get opened on her party because it s just to much for her. And I love my sister and our family for not pushing it.
Now she loves opening them ( 7 years). Its the same with hugs they don't have too.
I can see that's how I would have reacted - to a lesser extent than Barb, but very much wanting to put the group's enjoyment first and the need to 'save face'. Something to reflect and work on in myself.
This is how my big brother helped heal me from my mom. In moments where she would have been angry and hurtful, he was comforting and kind and helpful. I pray my son feels as safe with me when hes grown as i feel with my brother
My grandmother who was fairly Barb-esque got me a Barbie dream house for Christmas one year. My parents let me trade it for a microscope.
Great parents! Am happy you were so fortunate 😌
What kind of microscope???
Probably not an electron ...@hannahdavis6311
Omg? Are you Piper?😂
Now ✨ this ✨ is icing on the cake 😂
So green hair mom validated John and made him feel seen. It’s what a no contact kid needs when they are brainwashed to think they are the problem. Going no contact goes against all our programming it’s HARD. And because he felt like he did the right thing he had the energy to chat with Shawna. Connection is so important.
I mean, that’s great. But it still makes me upset, the way he treated Ty and Shawna.
I hope she and John + Shawna become friends and she can like help him in a way Shawna cant
Going no contact saves our me tal well being and allows us to heal from the years os psychological damage.
@khills well he was projecting his feelings onto her at the time because he was going through a lot. He just needed a reason to snap at Shawna because he couldn’t explain his pain. I don’t really think it was jealousy towards them. I think he was just angry.
@khills Yeah, maybe Mo can be the friend that is tough on him but supportive
"You are a part of me" sums up the whole problem. Barb isn't able to see other humans as entities separate from her. No, Piper isn't "A part of you". She can be a big part of your LIFE, but that's not the same thing. Ultimately she is an individual creature removed from your existence by two generations. Barb's refusal to understand this is part of the issue. It's why she attempts to claim ownership over things she has no right to. She has no identity, because she's been taught that your entire existence as a person revolves around your family. She probably has no idea who she is. She's made her entire existence revolve around her role in the family (unfortunately common for women), and she can't cope with the realisation that no one else in her life does that. Because SHE sacrificed who she was, everyone else should have to as well.
Spot on. Barb went through serious postpartum depression and had no support. Which manifested in her resenting everyone around her while also completely loosing herself. To her she’s given the family her all, so the least they could do is cater to her feelings. Not realizing that though what was done to her was unfair, her children and grandchildren aren’t responsible for any of it.
I like to think Jen will buck that expectation
“Family is important” would be a nice sentiment if what Barb meant was “You are important to me,” but what she means is “I should be important to you.”
That is such a great way to put it!!!
Amen.
Well said
That whole letter was so on point by Shawna. Every single phrase is perfect. There isn't a sliver of thought, affection or desire for connection with Piper. It's just, her needs, her wants, and what she thinks she is owed.
THIS
Listen I know you're a PHENOMENAL actor, but how the hell do you make Piper crying so believable?? I already forget these aren't separate people, BUT THE FACT THAT I FEEL LIKE I'M LOOKING AT A CRYING 3-YEAR-OLD!?!?!??!?! Every detail is so accurate, down to the pouty lip and even the way the tears finally burst out. You might be a magician, and you deserve all the recognition and more.
Or how she makes herself older to portray Barb and Frank?!?! Like...HOW?!?!!
I was thinking the same with Barbs voice. She can be such a banshee and it is portrayed so well it is easy to forget they are the same person!
No what got me is HOWWWW in the hell does she manage to make Barb's facial expressions seem like those of a bitter wrinkly old woman?! LOOKING LIKE JUST AN ADULT WOMAN! XD pure, RAW talent
I think the hair plays a big part lol. Especially with movements the messy strands bouncing
she studied acting + the meisner acting technique for many years, under a direct student of Sanford Meisner himself! but being a wizard is a close second reason for her talent
4:14 the parallel of Dee calling him a "good sport" when he communicated he didn't like the nickname while Barb would insist its affectionate and call him ungrateful.
Except didnt she call him that at the end anyway? I thought it was strange of her to say it again since she’s so good at listening to boundaries usually
@louis_kat Good catch. Maybe she was still trying to find her bearings? It was not exactly the same as in the beginning. We'll see
@louis_kat I interpreted it as it coming naturally from her. Like the first time was for the sake of a nickname, but this time it was her thinking of him as a son
John also said ‘we’ll find it’ meaning he’s not really used to it coming from a genuine place, but he’ll try to assimilate. Mama Dee did say ‘it doesn’t have to stick’ if it makes him feel uncomfortable. I think she’s gentley trying to heal the trauma responses Barb has instilled in him. John only knows parental affection as manipulation tactics so of course he’s going to be stand off-ish. I think mama Dee moving in will really help in John’s development, and possibly even help with his relationships with his own parents too. And hopefully the store clerk and Lauren will help with Barb’s selfishness. Eh we’ll have to see what Shawna has in store, I foresee a lot of dramas happening. Especially with the green hair dance mom, who seems to have similar circumstances as John.
@louis_kat no? She called him “John honey, my favorite boy” and by the end she just calls him “my boy” noting that he finds the first one too much.
While it taken him aback because he’s not used to loving nicknames, I think it just hits him that Dee is actually respecting his boundaries by not being too much with the nickname as per his request.
I really appreciate that the barb confrontation was through Mama Dee and not John or Shawna. She handled that perfectly
I wanted it to end with Piper and Frank catching starbugs, because that would be so sweet, instead, I get to go talk to my therapist about how glazing over the harmful dynamics instead of addressing them is such an ingrained part of the people pleasing that I didn't even notice the instinct real time in the emotional sandbox you've created and allowed us to play in..... o.O that is some damn work you put into this. Bravo!!!
Wow, what an insight. Good work and thanks for sharing. ❤
oo delicious metaphor i love it, so accurate
Amen to the sandbox. My personal growth, therapy and getting to "see" how harmful a Barb can be validates. When I try to explain my experiences to someone it sounds so trite , self centered, yada yada all those deep planted messages . . .
Thank you for this rather painful series.
Oh God. I'm more damaged than I realised.
I also would have let Barb in since she's already there... to avoid a scene
That's actually, a really good point.. I'm gonna sit with that for a minute and probably talk with my therapist about it too 😅 thank you!
Johns anger at Frank is so reasonable and yet makes me so sad
Frank is trying in earnest to do the right thing, but 40 years of doing the wrong thing has put John in a place where it’s gonna be more complicated than that 💔
I completely agree. I was nodding along with John and then I remembered the painting Frank created and kept hoping that he’d at least get to see Pipes and give it to her. I can see Frank growing in the future and being there for his son and family. Breaks my heart for John and Frank.
@tiedcherrystems yet he still tries to defend Barb's behavior which minimizes John's hurt. Thats the problem.
@tiedcherrystems well, I don't think he's doing the right thing. He is being avoidant and pretty much abandoning his son on a tough day. He is also not holding his wife accountable or setting boundaries, so yeah, that someone is being passive doesn't mean they are doing good
Yessss. You almost forget that Frank was complacent in all of the abuse because hes quiet and isnt the one doing the screaming, and being reminded of it kinda hurt cause id grown to like Frank. But John was 100% in the right with everything he said. I hope they actually get to have that talk, at least Frank seems ready to listen.
Not Barb writing a card for "Charlotte".
AND I KNEW PIPER WOULDN'T LIKE THE DREAMHOUSE!!!
Charlotte would have loved it (Charlotte does not exist).
See I was confused I was like “who’s Charlotte? I thought her name was Piper”
@heidim7732is Charlotte the name Barb wanted for Piper? I think I missed something, but not sure how far back I’d have to go to find it.
@AcashaGibsonI’m pretty sure Charlotte is Piper’s middle name that Barb prefers. We see her do it with Chickie as well in a way calling her the name that she would’ve preferred they name her.
@ambermckeever7573 Charlotte is Piper's middle name. Its a lot like Chickie Blue and Barb calling her "Francis"
Piper expressed a boundary, and Shawna had everyone kicked out immediately. I hope she can do this for John one day.
I hope so too... It seems like she has a difficulty understanding the severity of the situation cause she has a healthy relationship with her mom. Also her being pregnant right now can make her more sensitive and in her feelings. But this is NO reason to disrespect your husband's boundary.
17:12 Teeny has been ready for this moment her entire life lol
😂😂😂🎉
The way I bust out laughing when that smile got on her face
😆😅😂🤣
@BlazexMadarao she was ecstatic!
She will protect little Piper to the ends of the earth ❤
I am sure others have made the observation, but I love the comparison of mothers in this video. A child is injured and his mom takes him home for him to feel better. Another mom sees her child overwhelmed and cancels the birthday party. But one mom sees her child hurt, and demands that he makes her feel better.
These are silly sketch videos, but have so much emotional depth and warmth to them. In a way, it is teaching me to be a better friend and loving mother, in time.
Thanks, Shawna!
Mama Dee extends her maternal love and affection to those who aren't her own
Mo (Green Hair), as seen in another video, consoles her child's anxieties and teaches her to take risks. Also affirms someone she didn’t like, because he needed that
Oh my gosh... I didn't even think about it like that but yeah. In the context of all that gentle love, Barb's behavior is like a slap in the face. Poor John...
Back to the mantra: Barb isn't real so she can't hurt you 😂
@gwendolen_the_first yes! And sadly for many of us, she is all too real. Just has a different name and or role/gender.
Even the happily child-free friend who lives a very different life was all about doing what Shawna and Piper needed, no hesitation, no further instructions needed.
i did not pick up on that, thank you for pointing it out
"You self righteous haughty cow!"😭😭
That was vile. Seriously though I love how these archetypal characters help us reflect on our own dynamics with other people. Also poor gramps :(
I mean she started calling her son a "b--" before John hung up on her. Barb's really digging a hole for herself all the deeper.
I love that Dee read the behavior instead of feeding into it too! Shows a level of stability that Barb is surely jealous of and sent her off the cliff 😂
Nah. Screw Gramps at this point. Stop trying to defend your shitty wife to your neglected kid.
Oh no she didn’t! Oh yes she did!
And dee dee has done nothing to barb except ro just exist. In fact shes been the most caring and understanding. But as she said Barb has to lash out. Her name is very fitting 😂😂
Piper is literally my hero. I hope to manifest her “no singing, no people, cake only and also healing dinosaurs” energy
DeeDee gave Barb the exact right energy. Firm and calm, without anger. While Barb was escalating, trying to get a reaction, DeeDee starved her of what she was after. DeeDee is not just a good mom, or mil, or grandmother, she's a good person all around. Barb may never realize it, but DeeDee was trying to help her.
Barb is going to freak when the new baby comes and Mama Dee is always there to block her
And I love how calm and regulated Mama D was with Barb and gave no reaction even when Barb was boiling over.
Amen!
There is no physical way for someone to hate mama dee barb needs to take some notes
I was cheering Mama Dee! Yes, ma’am!
Piper rejecting the gift was literal icing on the cake 😂 absolutely needed this today, thank you!
Knew that was going to happen the moment Barb declined the gift receipt
I think it's another good example of Barb's projection. She doesn't even know Piper well enough to get a gift that she would like. She sees Piper as her role, "granddaughter," rather than Piper, a complex 3 year old with hyperfixations on justice, Star bugs, and penguins. Barb's gift contrasts greatly with Frank's which demonstrates a deeper understanding of Piper.
I love every Piper scene!
The interaction between Mama D and Barb had me crying. That really hits close to home. The mother you have and the mother you wish you had. The narcissism is spot on ❤
It does hurt. I am John. 🥲
Johns face when Deedee called him “my boy” after she clearly ran interference with Barb.
I started crying when the green haired dance mom told John he did good and basically cried through the rest of the video. I’ve had almost exactly the same conversation with my dad that John and frank had
@loriannebaumgartner5386
YES!! And especially after saying it at the beginning of the party and John “not liking it,” then her saying it again because she knew he needed to hear it 😭😭😭
I am John too.
Dude, Barb is going to FREAK when she finds out dee dee is moving in to help with the third baby, she also has no idea bout 😂
It's probably a temporary move in for like the first couple months.Maybe so that way they can adjust to having 3 babies instead of 2 like they say it takes a village.She probably owns her own house.People who own their own houses can dip out if they need 24 a couple monthssbg2520
sbg2520 Then she probably moves out. It's not uncommon at least where I'm from for grandmas to move in for a bit to help while mom just gave birth
Hahaha have you seen the newest video
@blu- exactly, my baby girl is 1,5yo and my mom lives with us, taking care of her when I go to work. She does have her own home and husband but that’s the life.
I need a backstory for Mama Dee too please! I feel like she's really been there as well, but she took the opposite route of Barb and it turned her into someone more relatable and understanding. Like maybe she went to therapy and it turned out well for her.
I had an abusive parent and I was a cycle breaker so for me it was “I want better for you” but for other who also had an abusive parent it’s “I had it bad so everyone should feel bad”. It really is a lot of work to undo generational damage and trauma.
Yup. That's what I thought. I'm Mama D, and while I treat everyone including my children with respect... it's taken YEARS to respond to people like Barb, with that level of grace. That was the hardest part.
I could see that. I broke the cycle with my kids and I couldn't have asked God for a better more loving, caring, emotionally available, understanding father. We have been so blessed to break the abuse cycle for both of us and the divorce cycle. We are the only ones on either side still married after 20 years...and I will not sit here and say it's been all rainbows.. it's taken so much self reflection, so much work to be communicative, understanding and patient with each other, and the storms we've weathered together any one of them would have been a legitimate reason to split (addiction struggles, infidelity, both of us knowing we wanted to have our kids know nothing of abuse, neglect or manipulation but having to learn to end those cycles with each other and communicate) but we both know that it takes wanting to show up for one another and a deep love. I love DeeDee and sometimes think that she must have a hell of a story to tell. She so well adjusted it's almost intentional and I know first hand when you don't want to hurt anymore, you learn to accept and forgive and you show up everyday never wanting the people in your life to ever feel the hurt you have, it makes you not just hyper aware but it makes you willingly and lovingly show up for those around you and become intentionally well adjusted.
@jamierodriguez8218 😭😭😭😭😭 Having a caring partner willing to learn and grow with you is really such a gamer-changer when it comes to breaking cycles. We put so much blame on the moms and forget that dads are a huge part of the dynamic too for better or worse. Frank is a decent guy, but John is correct: a lot of dysfunction in the family is his fault too.
seconded!! we definitely need DeeDee’s backstory because I need to know how that wonderful woman came to be. I also wanna know about Shawna’s family history and how it came to be that DeeDee seems to be single, whether by becoming a widow or through some sort of relationship ending. I think learning that DeeDee comes from an equally traumatized background as Barb and yet continues to choose kindness would make for an even more major juxtaposition between the two grandmas we know (DeeDee) and hate (Barb)
Here's my theory on why Frank acts how he does with defending Barb: he feels guilty. He feels guilty for abandoning her, for being a bad husband and father, and he feels responsible for the way Barb is now. That leads him to defend Barb, even at the detriment of his kids. What he needs to do is get into therapy to work on that guilt. Sticking up for Barb is only going to further the hurt his son feels, and it's also not going to help Barb ever see how she's truly been acting. And maybe if he makes changes, real changes, she will start seeking out those changes too.
As much fun as it is to hate on Barb, I'd honestly love nothing more than to see her grow into the kind of parent that John and Jen deserve.
re: Frank - YESSSS!!!! It's especially fresh as Barb has spent some recent time reminding him it's all his fault (not giving himself the grace that he didn't know any better either)
re: Barb - While Jennifer and John deserve a better mother, a legit narcissist is VERY unlikely to recognize their behavior and change, it's a part of that specific personality disorder and it's very sad. Most of the time it comes from trauma but it's still one of the hardest to treat.
I agree. When Frank says, "go ahead and blame me," I think he really feels like she should, like that's his penance for not being able to help her in the way Barb needed or wanted. But I don't think he could have helped her, what she needed was more than what he could realistically provide. She still needs professional help, and so does Frank...and John, and Jen, and probably the poor cashier at the store after she finds out how she contributed to this toxic situation. 😅
Agree but that is going to take a whole lotta work and patience to wait for them to be comfortable seeing her again, fully trust that she has changed and let her completely in again.
I agree on why Frank may feel he should defend Barb but ironically by defending Barb especially when she just hurt his son, he is doing the same thing that made Barb who she is, just like her dad left her to be abused by her mom. It would be really great for Barb to get the help she needs and be a better person but I find it really hard to understand how he could defend her when she just hurt his own son.
I think it's also the fact that he knew her before. On the video of young Barb we see the hurt that leads her to be what she is now, and Frank also saw that. I'm guessing John was too little to remember anything but a mom that is so narcissistic, but I'm guessing Frank reminisces on past Barb and he feels guilty for that change
Mama D coming in clutch!!! I was anxiously awaiting this to drop. I felt so bad for Piper being overwhelmed by the party but yay for Shawna for the immediate response and shutdown! I also loved the fact that Piper wanted nothing to do with the barbie dreamhouse.
I also loved the subtle nod to Teeny being an incredible aunt despite not liking children or kid-related things. Did she hate the party? Absolutely. Was she ten toes down for her niece’s comfort? *ABSOLUTELY*
And don't forget Barb never got a gift receipt because of course, who wouldn't want a Barbie dream house 😅😂
@tiedcherrystems This is me for my friends. I'm ride or die for those kids even though I have no desire to have any.
@krystaljohnson3978they give you a regular receipt even if you don’t get a gift receipt so all Barb needs to do is return it.
But it’s a gift and it’s pipers to do with as she pleases. Making a bug hotel could be fun. Or giving it to green haired girls daughter is also an option.
I bet she gives it to jen.For chickie, or she likes to call her francis@krystaljohnson3978
I love how you depicted Piper so much. I had a LOT of sensory issues growing up but was never seen or understood as neurodivergent, which caused me to be forced to do a lot of things I didn’t want to (eating/drinking when I was full or didn’t like something, hug people to say goodbye, be around people when it was too loud, being punished for even trying to push back on any of these things, etc). I wish more than anything that growing up my “no” was respected, and it is something I cherish more than anything in my adulthood; I do not keep people around if they cannot respect my “no”
too the inner child in us that are still healing.
MaMa Dee's composure and grace while under verbal attack yet still protecting her extended family from Barb's venom by refusing to allow her to barge into the house under any circumstance was a thing of beauty. She maintained reason, calm, voice control, empathy and understanding all without giving an inch. Wait til Barb finds out MaMa Dee isn't there just for the party as a guest but she's moved in, at least for a while.
Wait to she finds out WHY. Frank and Barb still don't know Shawna is pregnant
@lola_love444omg i forgot she doesnt know that yet! That might be what really breaks her. Its going to make her realize how much she’s missing out on by being such a nasty person and not addressing her inner issues. At least we can hope.
I can just see that exchange next time Barb comes knocking and Mama Dee answers the door:
"Oh! Why are _you_ here?"
"Question is, Barb, why are _you_ here?"
@lola_love444 I thought Frank knew? The last art class? I'm second-guessing myself now
@maggpiprime954 Yeah Frank knows...
I freaking LOVE. How Shawna and John have the willingness to change things when it doesn't suit Piper. She's a sweet little weirdo and I love that they don't force her to be happy or grateful for things she is genuinely not happy or grateful for. No singing, less people, movie time, may you get me cake please. From one weird little kid to another, Happy Birthday Piper!
So much to unpack here. My favorite part was DeeDee being that unmovable force between John and Barb!!! That was beyond satisfying, and I’m glad none of the kids knew she had shown up. They don’t need to be confused about the issues the grown ups are trying to work out. Piper is really proving to know exactly what she wants and I love it 😂
Have I watched the shorts? Yes. Will I watch the entire video again? OF COURSE! ITS SHAWNA!
It seemed like there were extra scenes in between shorts that I've seen, am I tripping or did I miss something
@micky_knucklesyou are not tripping
@micky_knuckles not tripping ! these long form videos always include extras :)
@micky_knuckles i think youtube shorts have limited lenght compared to tiktok so some bits get cut off here (iirc)
Samsies
Also johns "i think I'm pretty damaged" is so on point. He absolutely need therapeutic support, and it should be Frank who pushes him that way. Frank needs to open up, be vulnerable and let his kid actually see him for once. Shawna sees more of Frank than anyone else, but only cos of art class, she was able to meet him in his comfort zone, but he needs to take some emtional risks and be vulnerable cor his childrens sake.
praying for a day john comes to shaunas painting classes and gets to see another side of his dad and they could talk it out a bit not just magically fix it but to just reach some kind of ground. Crying about the firefly painting he made for her and if she ever got it ;;;
@ButterflyTema I love that.
I agree. He had an opportunity to tell John that he had tried to talk to Barb about apologizing and she blew him off.
He needs to be more vocal and vulnerable about how he is trying to be an ally.
Fr John should go to an art class with his dad one time he needs to meet him where Frank is at. Frank needs to inform John of what happened but not back Barbs words and actions
@roses.6600Frank reminds me in many ways like my Dad. He's damned no matter how you slice it. My dad would go to the coffee shop to get away from my mother. But it left us children at the end of her wrath and anger regarding her husband not being there to "help" her. The fights were legendary. I cannot begin to say how many years my mother would tell us, "Do not celebrate my anniversary to that man. That was the worst day of my life, marrying him. I would have been (insert career goal, here), if he hadn't begged me to marry him!"
One day I said, "So, you're saying that you wished we (4 children) wouldn't have been born?"
"I was on the Pill when I conceived you!"
By the way, she'd later state, "Why, I would NEVER say such a thing!" to others when I told them what she'd said. Only three years ago did she finally admit she told me she was on the pill when she conceived me.
*sigh*
Then there was the time she flagged down my ex-husband down the street from where he picked up our son for visitation, laden with presents.
IVE NEVER BEEN MORE READY
Same here
Aaaaaaaaaaa!
"its not our children's jobs to make us feel better"
Oh man.
OH MAN. ❤
I have so much to discuss!!
1. There still seems to be some kind of tension between Ty and Shawna, and this is quite obvious when Shawna jumps to ask Ty to leave at the end of the party. It also looks like since Ty is going through marriage problems, he may either be trying to have Shawna as an emotional support friend (someone who he can share his troubles with and relax a bit) or something more. In my opinion, it seems like he does indeed have some kind of feelings for Shawna, whether he’s aware of it are not.
2. I love that green haired mom said what she did to John. From Shawna unintentionally empathising with Barb (almost answering the phone) and Frank defending her, he really needed to hear that. I’m sure it would be comforting to know that he’s not alone in this, especially when the people around him seem to have pretty good relationships with their parents (mostly Shawna).
3. Barb writing a long letter to piper gave me so much rage. The entire letter was about her and her feelings, about her ‘status as a grandmother’ and about how SHE can’t see piper right now. Hell, she didn’t even wish piper a happy birthday IN HER BIRTHDAY LETTER. I don’t have much experience with narcissists but it baffles and fascinates me how un-self aware they can be. If I had a drink for every time barb said ‘I’ in the letter, I’d be an alcoholic. Also not to mention that SHES LITERALLY THREE!!
4. I also love the overarching storyline of John and Shawna trying to compensate for the way max’s party lead to them overlooking that piper does not like overly crowded gatherings. It’s a nice touch to show how they tried so hard that they forgot to consider who the party was for and what she would’ve wanted.
I might add a few more things as I find them haha, so please excuse me!
When she was writing that letter, I was enraged for a vast majority of it until I thought, "Wait. Piper is THREE! She's not gonna be able to read this, and the parents are just gonna throw it out once they realize where it was going!" I eased up significantly at that realization, because Shawna and John would NEVER let Piper (or Max) be exposed to that level of toxicity. Then I remembered it was a skit and... This woman is SO GOOD!! 😭😭 👏🏿
I think that its all of the newborn baby stuff that got Shawna overwhelmed. Not Ty himself. She may be freaking out about doing it all over again.
@MomjeansMoxiethat’s a good point! I hadn’t considered that. I still think there’s something weird going on with Ty at least, especially with the looks he was giving her during the changing scene(and overall vibe). I look forward to where this goes though! I literally can’t tell haha
So nervous that Ty is going to 'lean' rather too much on Shawna with his 'I'm not flirting' flirting bc of his own marriage issues. I also... don't fully trust the green-haired mum. I feel like John treated Frank badly, but then we don't have as much info about his toxicity in the family in the past. So maybe John's justified? Not sure. It broke my heart. Lastly, why do the characters not say 'Her name is PIPER!'
Mo (Green Hair Lady) has the energy John needed for Barb, not Shawna
21:29 "of course, my boy" 😭💜
“Egg is here?😃” bro that part got me she’s so funny😭
That’s the next thing I really want to see: Seanna and John visiting JJ, Egg, and Chickie Blue with their kids.
@andreanewell628 me too. I feel like Jen could really use some support from Shawna right now and the whole thing could be so funny and cute.
And having the small family party Piper wanted 🧡
You know, the funny thing is, I think Piper wouldn't even care about seeing Barb again. She always seemed like she never cared to see her grandma
sbg2520 She has very different reactions to Barb and Dee Dee. Piper will talk to her Mama Dee like she does her parents, but barely even responds to Barb. Most likely due to Barb always calling her the wrong name and forcing things on her she doesn't like. The barbie present being a prime example.
sbg2520 I don't know where you got that idea from, but they have never needed Piper's validation. That's not even what I was saying. Just that she already doesn't seem to like Barb, and wouldn't care if Barb was there or not
My husband went NC with his mom. After his dad randomly "dropped by" several times (we lived 100 miles one way away) to tell my husband how hurt his mom was and tried to excuse her awful behavior, he ended up going NC with his dad too. Everyone warned husband he'd feel guilty if he didn't forgive her because "you only get one mom." My MIL passed away. The only guilt my husband felt was that he didn't feel more sad. His therapist explained it: he'd already grieved the loss of his mother 18 years ago when he went NC after years of emotional abuse.
This! I stillove my dad and will be sad when he dies, but I will not be guilty about keeping a boundary that protects my peace.
@kristinwest2179thank you. You perfectly articulated where I am at with my dad when I could not articulate it for myself. ❤❤
I don’t know if this will help him or not, but if you think it would you can let him know he’s by far not the only person to experience guilt over not missing someone more, and not even just because a relationship was toxic.
Personal story as explanation for that, skip if you’re uninterested/feeling I’m drawing attention away from original point:
My grandma was diagnosed with Alzheimer’s 7-ish years before she passed, during the last 2 or so my emotional connection to her ended because she stopped being my grandma, and *man* did I feel guilty about that and man did I feel bad about how my reaction to learning she died was basically “oh, ok”. Relationships and emotions, like many things, are not as clean cut and simple as humans try to pretend they are. Some of us hold as tighten as possible to any semblance of a connection until one party actually dies, and some of us experience the death long before anyone mentions a pine box.
Same boat as your hubby but with my grandmother. When I was informed of her passing, I cried because I wasn’t there to support my mother; I already grieved over a decade beforehand. I was NC for ten years while she was in a nursing home and LC (practical reasons prevented full NC) for five years before that. Some people tried to excuse her actions and guilt me about it because she was experiencing decline from early dementia. The dementia didn’t cause her to become abusive. It just exaggerated her existing behavior to the point that I couldn’t emotionally sweep it under the rug anymore.
That's exactly it! I felt bad when my brother died, for the circumstances and his family. But for me, I knew my life wouldn't be any different because I felt like I lost him years ago.
Shawna, I just have to say that, as a writer, I have to compliment you on your storyline, your dialogue, the flow... it's all very cohesive and spot-on. I am so impressed with your structuring of the story. Then acting it all out yourself? You are very, very talented. 👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
I was wondering if Frank's star bug painting would come into play.....can you imagine if Barb knew Piper loved it & not "Charlotte's" Barbie gifts.
The last few frames of Piper throwing her head at a cupcake was a perfect way to end things.
Shawna’s response to Piper feeling overwhelmed genuinely caught me off guard in a good way. The option to have people be asked to leave when the birthday kid isn’t feeling it was unheard of in my family lol, they’re more from the “grin and bear it” school of thought so that reaction shook me lmao. Like huh THAT’S ALLOWED?? Also tysm for this series, I’m hooked on it and it’s genuinely so nice to see these family struggles represented in media!
Well, to ask a lot of guests to leave a party thst they may have just arrived to is pretty rude.
I would just move Piper to a quieter spot watching Bugs Life and letting her eat the cake shes fixated on away ftom the guests.
For at least a little while longer.
Same here, but honestly I wouldn't be able to ask people to leave as they just came in. I would at least let them be dance for an hour or 2 and have an intimate birthday with my kids.
It literally made me cry and I was like WHY AM I LEAKING
@1tommyday oh yeah, letting everyone stay is a totally fair option too of course! Just really surprised me they went a different route.
I felt this way, I was that kid who was overwhelmed but had to power through. It's not really just a family thing but in our culture, guests are taken care of as if they too are family (I'm Filipino) so the kid would be removed from the scene to calm down and the party continues regardless if the birthday girl/boy is present or not.
I actually had a knee jerk reaction to the scene, like isn't that rude? Would people talk? I'm learning so much from these videos, I don't even plan to have kids and I'm still young but this just showed me that really boundaries are fine, it doesn't matter if it's a crowd of people, it's alright to prioritize ones emotions especially if its kids who have it harder during crowds.
I'm so glad I found Shawna's channel, she's literally the best T~T
Barb writing a manifesto in a birthday card to a three year old is so on brand
A manifest 😂😂😂 I can't. But you're right.
I think it was so Piper would see it and ask what it said, and John or Shawna would have to read it in front of the kids. Of course, they'd never do that, they'd probably check the content first and tell her it's nothing or invent something.
I can totally see my mom doing something like that with my niece
God THIS
I somehow missed that part?? How??
It’s in the full movie of the birthday party not the shorts 😊@meredithbroadwell4194it’s in the
The "call it even?" part was so subtle and true. Yes, I got the idea from friends, but there have definitely been times where my husband and I were both just a mess and "call it even" was the right way to close it out. Like, sometimes we just do and say stupid things to each other, and it's not always deep, so being able to call it even and close it out is very healthy.
yeesss. sometimes it's just time to stop milking the conflict, admit that you both messed up and just call it even. no one is perfect, especially when emotions are involved.
Heeey, my husband and I had one of those the other day! I think it's really good to do the 'call it even' thing. Then, you can both hug about it later. After things cool down my husband and I always talk about it - and it really helps. Not holding things against each other is a really healthy relationship dynamic. Awesome to hear you have such a great thing, OP! I hope you both have a wonderful and long-lasting marriage. May your love be big, beautiful, and always around you.
Yeah, but then towards the end, he brought it up again to teeny, which honestly makes me feel icky.
my husband & i do the same . a lot of our arguments are just misunderstandings (we are both autistic & have a lot of trauma) & at some point we both realize that we've both already made our points and it isn't going anywhere because there wasn't a real problem to begin with . only we call it "this isnt even anything, let's just dump it" à la tim robinson in itysl LOL . (our joint hyperfixation)
Yeah but he was still pretty riled up and then lashed out on Frank (which yes frank needs to stop enabling barb etc.) but I adored the call it even but he didn’t move past it and even brought it up afterwards. John seriously is letting the anger fester and consume 😢
This was a hard one. I had a grandma like barb (and thankfully one like mama Dee,) and it’s hard. You see how they treat your parents, and you see how much they wound and hurt. And if you don’t give what the grandparent wants from you - they lash out at you too. It’s hard, and John is hurting a lot, but cutting Barb out is best for him, his wife, and his children in the long run.
“I didn’t end it all….FOR HIM! And thy is is how he repays me?”
I know a mother who went through that experience during a very hard time in her life, but her view of it is thanking her adult children for being her reason to keep going.
Probably part of why her children talk to her pretty much every day…
It’s helpful, when you’re NC, if those letters show up before the kids can really read.
I have this. My fist son passed away, I named my second child Faith because I was ready to end it, and she was the reason I decided to stay. She could never be a burden, only a blessing. A motivation to live. And as unfair as it is, I needed her (emotionally) much more than she needed me. It's my job and honor to be here for her in every possible way. As an adult, she's begun to understand, and someday as a mother, I hope she'll see it even more clearly.
Barbs final line of "I guess I'll just kill myself" really struck home and I'm glad John or Shawna weren't the ones to hear it. Growing up my mother would say that all the time whenever we expressed that something she did or said hurt us or just as a way to win arguments. My younger brother and I recently brought it up to our mother and she had no recollection of ever saying it. Mind you, this was a line she'd use in *every* argument, no matter how big or small. So it doesn't surprise me that someone like Barb would say it as well. I'm just surprised she hasn't said it sooner
My mother wasn't/isn't that extreme but she pulls the "well I guess I'm just the worst mother in the world!"
Yeah my mom has pulled the “you make me want to kill myself” and “guess I’ll just leave you alone forever” cards before. It is in my opinion one of if not the worst thing you can say to your child. It’s so exhausting trying to explain how they are hurting you and just have them shut you down by scaring you like that.
My mom a few years ago used that line “I wish I were dead” or something of that nature- in front of my sonwhen I was not present smh. He came back to me crying, I was furious! All this because she didn’t get greeted with a hug like she wanted by her grandkids when she came to my hotel room (we were on a trip together) and I was havinv a rough time with my kids at that moment. Needless to say I later blew up on her, not a very proud moment for me but at my young age of 45, I’m slowly realizing how self-centered & selfish my mom can be. She’s a sweet lady but wants everyone to think of her. She has gotten a bit better.
@MotherOfChows my mom always said and still says that line “I guess I’m just the worst mother in the world”… But she did also threaten the same as Barb at least one time I can remember vividly.
Im #8 of 10 kids. My oldest brother #2 got into an accident where he almost died. No one could find his POA and so our mother took charge denying his good friends to see him. We had a family meeting and went off on her. My dad (theyre divorced and were at the time) went off on her saying his siblings did the same to him when his father died. We got emotional, told her that she cant do that to people and told her how she's been emotionally damaging to her 6 daughters. Her response: "I would NEVER do that to anyone" "I dont know what youre talkint about"... ours: "mom you've literally done that to every single daughter". She told me id be on the street with no help from her or family if i didnt do what she wanted. Said duck that and left the state and moved on with my life. She's better now but still manipulative and she's met my small kids but i wont live where she can damage them too
I want John to get therapy. Like actually see a therapist. He needs it and it would help him a lot. To have a place he can confide everything he feels without any expectations or guilt. It would be hard for him, but I think it genuinely would be really healthy for him in the long run.
Yes. Also for Jen and Frank. Shawna and John.
@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254yeah. I just think Jon’s in most immediate need for it while probably also being more open to it than Jen or Frank
Maybe Green hair mom can help push him in that direction? She sounds like she's been down a similar road.
@katrijndekeersmaecker1904 Might give him a recommendation
The overreaction to shawnas moment is very telling. I think they have done amazingly to this point, but i think maybe couples councelling might be an easier start for them both and it might get John conforitable with the idea of therapy in general. He seems to have an attitude of "deal with it yourself" but i think we all know that that only goes so far.
Barb writing that birthday letter to a 3 year old is INSANE!!!
Shawna I am so invested in this story🤗🤗 keep it up!
That simple, natural “of course my boy” was so subtle but exactly what John needed at that moment. He needed to feel the natural, gentle care of a mother.
This is fantastic writing and im so in love with this channel for the storylines and mannerisms she applies to every single character. Even down to little Piper. Great job!
Shawna is such a good actress.
You cannot imagine what a heartfelt, healing balm it is for a daughter-in-law or son-in-law to get to have that kind of relationship, with their in-laws, when their family of origin was a mess.
@ladylilac4363absolutely. We have a long way to go, but the bridges my husband burned with his family are made up for in the strong connection that he has with mine. We may never see that side again, but he has a full cup of love and acceptance (has started referring to my parents as Mom and Dad instead of YOUR Mom and Dad.♡)
Why is everyone ignoring that he asked her not to call him that and she did anyway???
@louis_kat When I first read your comment, my immediate reaction was to argue semantics between Deedee calling John "my favorite boy" vs. "my boy," and while I do still think it's a little semantic, I think there's something to be said for it all the same. I also think it's context-dependent, and let's not forget that Deedee said, "We'll find it" (it being their "groove" or dynamic or what-have-you, now that she's moving in with them full-time). John understandably has conflicted feelings about his mother and probably motherhood in general. In a normal, still kinda new environment (with the prospect of Deedee being there full-time), when Deedee calls him "my favorite boy," it doesn't quite land right, because he still has his guard up somewhat and maybe because it feels a little recycled and kitchy since "my favorite girl" has always applied to Shawna. When she calls him "my boy," it's right after that blow-up with his own mother and father, as well as evidence in the form of the Dreamhouse that Barb really doesn't care about his boundaries-- in short, it's when John is feeling raw and needs that motherly comfort. Basically, I think boiling it down to "she called him this when he asked her not to" misses some of the underlying nuance of the situation and discounts the earlier agreement that Deedee and John had come to that they would find footing with their new dynamic.
„You attempt to wound when you are feeling wounded“ oh my god how I love this woman. This was a masterpiece.
So lovely to see the portrayal of Piper a quirky kid, who’s NOs and boundaries aren’t mocked or stepped over by her family, I see much of my child self in her character but unfortunately my boundaries were treated as jokes. I know it’s not the main focus of this but I just had to say it’s very moving and touching.
Its insane how barb gives all the grandchildren the names she wants, their real names giving by their parents not ever crossing her mind.
Because she’s desperate for control. She thinks she’s owed that.
Frank has been an enabler and I understand John’s hurt when Frank tries to smooth things over for Barb. The pattern has been either Frank shuts down when Barb gets nasty or he tries to defend her in the aftermath. Frank tries to be peacemaker but that role ends up perpetuating the problem with Barb. He shows he understands that Barb hurts people and he’s tried speaking to Barb. Still he should not defend her to John. Because John doesn’t need Frank piling on pressure even if it’s subtle when Barb is actively trying to force her presence on them.
Am I the only one that thought it was a problem that he was invited and John lost it on him just for showing up.... when he was invited...
Thank you for this! I was so confused about John's reaction to Frank. I knew there were some deep seated wounds there but couldn't put my finger on it. This explanation helps :)
I wonder how John will react when he finds out Shawna and Frank have been in art class together
@lize2413 He knws already. Shawna told him after her first art class that he's apparently been going for a while.
he knows shawna asked him before what happens if he notices her bany bump and am pretty sure there's a tiktok of them talking about how his dad never showed his hoppies in their home @lize2413
11:18 I said "eww eww eww" like a dozen times now while Barb is writing her message - uhm Piper can't read, right?
that letter was definitely more for herself than it really was for Piper
And the FACE Barb made when talking about John...*shudders*
My grandmother used to write preachy/judgey letters to everyone in the family, and one by one they all asked her to stop, except for me. As the youngest grandchild I could barely read her handwriting so instead of being upset by the content I just enjoyed trying to decipher what the hell they even said. I can totally see Piper being similarly immune even if she could read.
100% that was meant for JOHN to read 😖
@Herslowambitionsexactly. I was popping in here to say that. I grew up with a Barb in my life and seeing the letters that were intended to be read to the children by the adult was so nauseatingly on point.
MAMA SHAWNA HAS BLESSED OUR MORNINGS ❤❤❤❤ have a great day everybody
Watching this after the Dee and Barb smackdown hits different.
I personally love the differences between Barb and Frank's reaction to being turned away at the door. Frank didn't push or throw a fit, he left the door open for conversation, and went his way. I'm so encouraged that he respected John enough to go home. And I do hope Piper gets her starbug painting someday. ❤
EDIT: Rewatched and y'all are right - everyone but the kids knew Grandpa was coming. Which makes Frank's actions even more indicative of personal growth imo.
This ....what you said!!!
YES!! And he also accepted that it may be past the point of no return.
Frank’s guilt is skewing things (not saying he didn’t do well here, he did, but you can see Barb’s ways have gotten him twisted around in his own head)- if only John could see the way he talks at painting class!
Cause Frank realizes that he has had a big part to play in the way things have become. He avoids issues, avoided helping Barb when she needed and avoided helping his kids when Barb grew angry and resentful over the years.
John invited Frank. He was aware Frank was coming as me mentions it at the beginning in the skit. But that said I do think Frank showed a lot of grace when it came to being kicked out. If anything he messed up bringing up Barb he should have just handed John the painting and left. Unfortunately he does have experience knowing that once someone starts lashing out it’s best to just get out of the line of fire until they calm down.
Wow. That was intense. For Barb to have the audacity to show up even though John warned her not to and to verbally attack Mama D. That was low, Barb.
Right?! Mama Dee is an absolute beast for standing her ground!
@meggoldnight she's lucky Teeny wasn't the one to answer the door or she would have gotten a taste of her own medicine
I wonder if Barb and Frank had an explosive fight at home afterwards, or if it was icy silence for two days.
Right?!? And the threat to off herself is just the miserable cherry on top. No one deserves to be spoken to like that 😡
Audacity is Barb's superpower.
Toddler/young child changing their mind about the theme of the party on the day of after all the work the parents put in is peak toddler mentality. Also, halloween costumes. I laughed way harder than I should have at that part... 😅
Imagine if I told my parents with their scarcity trauma
But she didn’t change her mind. She wanted a party themed with the princess from a bugs life.
@danagoings I think John and Shawna didn't realize that and it felt early on like she changed her mind.
No seriously! It’s happened to me EVERY YEAR 😂. Kids in double digits, you’d think by now they’d have learned that we can’t change themes the day of! 😂
Yup my 2 year old had an entire meltdown about putting on the bumble bee costume she insisted on getting for Halloween and ended up wearing a carebear onesie
Shawna and pipers relationship reminds me of me and my moms. My mom is a very extroverted loud person, but is also very compassionate, i was her little extremely introverted neurodivergent daughter with sensory issues. She didnt always get it right or understand why i needed the things that i needed, but she always listened and never made me feel bad for saying no or telling her i didnt like certain things.
Watching piper and shawna interact in this series, and pipers very clear "nos" being listened and respected gives me a lot of nostalgia. While also making me reflect as an adult how lucky and rare that is
I KNEW Piper would say, "No thank you," to the Barbie Dream House!
This is a perfect representation of what it's like to have a narcissistic parent with and enabler spouse. The narcissist cannot wrap their brains around anyone else's thoughts or feelings, possessing zero empathy, and they literally believe they can do no wrong. And the enabler spends years allowing the abuse to continue as they "keep the peace" by making everyone sacrifice their well-being just to keep the narcissist from throwing another epic tantrum.
This is why John is so mad at his dad. His dad obviously didn't protect John as a child from his mom.
I would LOVE to see content of what that household was like when John and Jen were little....all the way through high school leading into college.
Omg yessss i need more flashbacks
Young Jen and John
Go mama D!! It’s no wonder she has been the one to receive the invite to stay and has the best parental relationship with her children. She knows what each of her kids and grandkids need, is emotionally and physically available, and is also able to validate the feelings of each person, Without heaping pressure and her own opinions on others. The differences between the two grandmothers are extensive, and I’m so glad she’ll be moving in! Hopefully she’ll be able to help them all heal a bit. I also love that Shawna and John understand and act on Piper‘s feelings, and they just get it. They comfort her, meet her needs and try to create the best dynamic they can.
Barb is going to HIT. THE. ROOF. when she learns about the new baby and Mama D moving in.
Yeah, my parents were not like this
Omg Barb is going to EXPLODE when she finds out Mana D is moving in with them.
The CHOMP at the end....❤😂 just a starbug and her cake 🎂
Momma Dee is SO SPOT ON
I need him to have that conversation with Frank. That doesn't mean letting Barb back in but having all the information may help John heal. I think Frank wants to be open and honest
I agree. I think John could have still allowed Frank to see his granddaughter and give her a present. It’s like he got angry at Frank because of the actions of his mother.
John said he’s angry at Frank because of Frank’s reaction to Barb’s behavior. If someone slaps you in the face and someone else does nothing to defend you that someone else has also shown they’re not safe to be around.
I loved that Frank said he would have that conversation but not at Piper's birthday party.
@taleyag8800 no, he got angry at Frank because Frank started defending Barb and making excuses for her behaviour. Frank has been doing it all John's life apparently. he was avoiding conflict at all costs, even if it means shutting down the victim
@polina-rs4lr When Frank heard that John just spoke to his mother, Frank immediately asked if he was okay, and when John said no, he immediately then said he’d say hi, give the present and leave. John then said, no GO HOME. John was angry right after the phone call, I understand, but he didn’t get angry AFTER John picked up for Barbara. He even asked what Frank was doing there even tho he was invited. And I don’t think Frank was defending Barbara’s actions, I think he was trying to be a middle man and remind John that Barbara is a human and hurt as well (hurt people hurt people). Not in a way to say “you need to forgive your mother” or “cut her some slack” but more along the lines of “there are reasons why your mother is the way she is”.
And I don’t get why John thinks it’s selfish of Frank to show up. I think he said that out of anger.
John said “congratulations, which hole?!” Lmaooooo I fucking died. That’s literally the funniest shit I’ve ever seen 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I almost had to pause at that to collect myself. 🤣
i don't get it. Could you please explain?
I also don't get it... I am guessing sexaversary? If that's a thing 😅
THANK YOU SHAWNA IVE BEEN CHECKING YOUR PAGES DAILY IM SO EXCITED THANK YOU FOR CREATING
To be that person, anyone else notice how Shawna interrupted Ty when he offered to shut down the party for then get Teeny to do it? And then she wanted Ty to leave afterwards. Also, I wonder if the green haired mom will become John’s version of Ty.
I think it’s cause she knows he’s tired. And knows he’ll push himself further then he should to be a good friend.
This series has helped me realize I’m like the adult “Max/Piper” of my family. I’ve never had much of a relationship with my grandparents because of how they treated their children and sons/daughters-in-laws. Growing up, grandma has always tried to kinda guilt trip me by telling me how she is sad we don’t talk/see each other (because my parents don’t invite her over a lot), but this show has helped me realize that our distanced relationship is not really the result of my actions- it’s the result of her treatment towards her kids before I was even born. And even if I’ve only experienced little bits and pieces of her toxic treatment towards me, it’s okay if I still take the stories my parents and aunts and uncles have told me of her behavior, and the knowledge of how they tried to protect me from her, and use that information to continue to keep the space between us. Thanks for this series- it’s really been therapeutic and has given me a better way to analyze my own family dynamics.
So many good things about this video. I know that it was hard watching John let loose on Shawna, and then Frank. The thing that will save John is his ability to see when he is acting from his hurt. He came right out and said he is damaged. I see John realizing he needs therapy. I think Frank is just starting to realize how much damage he caused with his hands off approach. That talk with John will be hard as hell, but I think Frank will be willing to work for a relationship with his son.
I love that a whole group of grown ups fully embraces and loves Piper just as she is.
I think Mama Dee is going to be the person who steps in to give them all enough space to start tackling the difficult stuff. She is the perfect combination of Care Bear and Mama Bear.
They shouldn't throw away that unhinged letter Barb wrote. It will save John a lot of time in his first therapy session.
And documentation for the police
Also is it mean I want him to send a copy to his dad and sister? Like listen next time you wanna talk about how mom had it rough or whatever - this is what she sent my Three Year Old because she couldn’t come to her birthday party. But that’s probably the petty person in me that loves drama
Omg I couldn’t agree more with this!!
@nerdontangents as someone who is having to have radical acceptance I need to be honest and open about everything that I was forced to choose, and why I was forced to choose it. it makes absolute sense to me that he would send those to his father and his sister at the very least because they need to have something to wake them up. too many people in my life are still acting like I should just shut up and put my nose down and Soldier on like nothing's ever happened to me
No, I thought it was satisfying watching John unload on Frank. It was BEYOND overdue and someone needed to finally call Frank out on his avoidant, selfish behavior.
Unloading on Shawna was less fair. Shawna never answered the phone, she consulted her own mother before attempting any action one way or the other.
I love how Piper gets her own agency in boundaries at her birthday party. She gets to express how she feels in the adults in her life pay attention and adjust where appropriate.
The way piper can enforce her boundaries at three is proof of how good parents John and shawna are. Pipers boundaries are listened to and respected and is why she feels comfortable setting them when she feels uncomfortable ❤️ literally healing my inner child
STOP EVERYONEEEE MY SHOW IS ONNN 0:13
The way I ran over here from Facebook. 😂
😂😂@Stepherz2178
Frank finding out what he subconsciously already knew; John needs more than just a “love you, Pally” 💔
And ya know I have faith that unlike his wife he’s going to actually take that as incentive to do better. Not just with John but Jen as well.
@nerdontangents I felt it was a good sign that he was willing to have that hard conversation with John later. Barb would never. Frank has a lot of issues and I feel much of the defending he does of Barb comes from a place of guilt for not being there for her after John was born. Therapy would do them all some good.
@nerdontangents
Did you catch what John said about “at least you’re not screaming at anyone”? That makes me think that Frank would lose it on the family so that Barb could calm down, meeting fire with fire. 💔
@tiedcherrystems I actually took it more sarcastically. Like well you didn’t scream like mom so I guess you want a blue ribbon.
@moxiegraphix oh I agree Frank needs to talk to someone about that. I personally want to headcanon he’s already gone. But it could be possible he still needs to fine tune his approach. Cuz plateauing is a thing and if just went in to address his marital problems without addressing the kids he could still be stuck on “I need to atone for not being the husband I should have been.” But hasn’t quiet figured out that doesn’t help him become the father he wants to be.
Oooh is that a supportive friendship I see potentially happening with green-haired mom (Mo)? I can see she finally might have seen him in a light of "overwhelmed parent" - she can now start the process of humanizing him, instead of judging the first impression she got.
Agreed! She made a lot of assumptions about him when she first met him. Now she knows they have things in common - eccentric, bug-loving children and estranged parents. It would be great for John to have someone who fully understands his position. Shawna tries, but she’s almost empathetic to a fault and still sympathizes with Barb. It would be great for John to have a friend who gets the feeling of having to hold that no-contact line with an abusive parent.
@moanka.00John does not need to be friends with another woman. It’s not appropriate and starts people down a road of emotional betrayal of their spouse.
@lilmissNancyPantsparenst are allowed to have friends of the opposite gender. Not every parent is gonna cheat on their spouse just bc they know someone of the opposite gender
@lilmissNancyPantsThat's a really unhealthy viewpoint. People are allowed to have friends, regardless of their respective genders. There is nothing inappropriate about a man and a woman being friends. The insistence that men and women can't have friendships without it leading to emotional betrayal of their spouses because of the assumption of some kind of attraction is really weird. By that logic, can a bisexual person have no relationship with anyone outside of their spouse? Can lesbians only be friends with men and gay men only with women? It's complete nonsense. Don't project your insecurities onto other people.
@lilmissNancyPantsThe idea that men and women can’t be friends is so regressive it’s embarrassing that anyone still thinks like that. Grow up, we’re not in preschool anymore and no one is going to get cooties from being near someone of the opposite gender.
I love how Piper speaks without contractions.
14:30 „I‘ve been there, it‘s rough“ OMG IS JOHN GETTING SOMEONE HE CAN BOND OVER THIS WITH?!? The turn of events, I‘m about to cry
Frank: leave it, Barb.
Barb: No, Frank. I’m not like you.
Ouch. That gotta hurt.
Frank doesn’t act enough (he knows and he’s trying), but Barb is out here OVERDOING it to her detriment.
She gotta point, tho.
@kayleighbrown459but instead of looking at the point and realizing she has made her love a dangerous weapon, she’s just out there waving it around at anyone…daring them to mess with her. She’ll be in deeper trouble soon.
This series is beyond cathartic. I was a Piper. My grandmother was very mistreated in her youth and, I’m guessing as a coping mechanism, became a massive narcissist and perpetual victim by the time my mom was a teen. As by the time I came around, she was Barb. And even with some of the “exaggerated” aspects, my grandmother had said every single one of barbs lines at some point. She never liked my partner when I became an adult and I was finally the first one to completely cut her off when she tried to cause legal problems for him and almost cost me my children in the crossfire. I cut her off and after years were finally healing from what she did. But after I cut her off, she turned into this version of Barb. “You can’t keep my from my grandchildren.” 100% I absolutely can. They are my kids. And once I cut her off, it was like the glass shattered for a lot of the rest of the family. One by one, other people did the same because they saw how she acted and talked about me after, and how she was going to insane extremes to violate my boundary.
I admire your shiny spine! Good for you for leading by example. 🎉🙏🏻👍
I love how Barb wrote an elaborate birthday card to a three-year-old who can't read 🤣
Barb’s note to Piper is killing me bc there’s no way a three year old would be able to read all that 🤣
Edit: I know the note was really for John and Shawna. I just thought it was funny how evident it was, because no way Piper could actually read it. It’s a detail that shows exactly how inconsiderate Barb is and how little she’s ACTUALLY thinking about her grandchild. But everyone’s replies have been super insightful!
We all know who Barb is writing to (John) and for (herself). Manipulation at its best and worst. 🥴 Have a fabulous day!
And I don't think she even wished Piper Happy Birthday.
@c113rn Barb is the type of person that now I'm going to have to rewatch this to see if she actually did instead of saying, "Oh, she must have."
And the change from "sweet and hurting Grammie" to psycho "No More WIRE HANGERS" Grammie is Oscar Worthy!
I thought the same thing, barb is so selfabsorbed that she didn't realize she was pretending to write to piper lol
"no singing mother, no singing." Is still me at 38 years old. Some of us never grow out if that.
14:24 Yay! John finally bonding with green-haired mom!
while barb's behaviour across this vid is completely and utterly out of line, i'm worried abt her, bc it feels like her threats aren't completely baseless anymore. she's only moving deeper into her destructive behaviour, and the more people call her out on it, the more worrying her behaviour gets
Barb is deep down still dealing with major postpartum depression. She felt so alone and lost after having John and just never recovered. Now she’s full of resentment and also desperate to not feel alone. Which she handles by constantly trying to make herself the center of attention. But she doesn’t realize she’s just making things worse for herself because she’s only making herself more lonely.
I just wanna say thank you Shawna - Piper reminds me of me when I was a little girl with undiagnosed autism. I only did what I was interested in, spoke my feelings bluntly, and HATED parties - every birthday party ended with me in tears. I won't say that I was unsupported - my Mum didn't understand exactly how I felt but she did her best to respect it - but it's still so incredibly validating to see Piper's family accept her exactly as she is and not force her into situations she's uncomfortable with. Thank you so much ❤
Same here, I love this little girl so much. It is healing to see her live authentically. 🥰
Yes!! The entire time I was watching I kept thinking that piper reminds me of my autistic 3 year old so much!
This is exactly what I would have needed at this age. Not my mother physically dragging me out of the house to be with the other kids. And when I was a depressed teenager not her holding it over my head like it was my fault
I was thinking the same thing! God bless Teeny and Shawna for being great advocates.
Yeah, the more I see of Piper, the more I relate to her and think she’s likely autistic.