I'm an orthopaedic surgeon. If I don't know something I either learn it (as I have with lifting weights and strength training) or tell the patient "I don't know, that is not an area in which I have expertise or interest" (such as when I get asked about cardio, yoga, pilates, etc). I am saddened by the fact that there is enough of the contrary happening to necessitate such a post.
Hi folks, I'm a doctor for orthopedic surgery in germany and do weight lifting and I am in charge for a number of professional basketball teams here in germany. I do know a lot of both sides but have to agree that a lot of my fellows here in germany don't know anything about strength and weight lifting and nutrition with the exception of a rare number of orthopedic surgeons.
Dr. Helmut Queckenstedt hello doctor Queckenstedt. I would argue that it's the job of orthopedic surgeons to know about the subject. But others are not. Maybe family medicine as a branch, but radiologists, internals, gynecologists and pediatricians don't need to. It would be a good thing to know, but it's not a must
Degenerative changes are not an indication for surgery. Spinal canal stenosis and nerve root compression, CAN be. Majority of patients with degenerative changes do not have the latter.
Yeah, the simple solution is to for one of the panelists to repeat the question for the mic, but that's not always practical when the question is long.
So, some docs do offer advice that is not informed at all. And exercise and nutrition are one of those areas that nearly all docs are undereducated in. But's it not entirely our fault. Research in these areas has been woefully inadequate too, so there's less relative "evidence" for them to base their recommendations on as well. Docs should be comfortable saying I don't know - if they're not, they're doing their patients a true disservice, and it can be harmful, absolutely. I can understand the frustration that Rip has, and that we all have on this subject - it's totally justified. But don't oversimplify with counterarguments like "docs can only help with acute conditions, can't do anything with chronic illness, and the pharma/insurance complex make all decision making, etc." because that just plain ain't right. It's wrong. I'm just grateful that there's resources like this and a lot of the other awesome youtube content out there that provides great educational value on exercise, and the value that weight training provides. It's continuing to transform my life (as a patient too, I had a cervical fusion and stayed away from weight lifting for some time, and was only introduced to real functional exercises recently unfortunately!).
It's good to have a doctor around when you need stitching up or if you swallowed something nasty and you need to be cut open to remove it. Otherwise, they aren't much use. They can read those X rays. Might be useful to see where the scissors are, even though sometimes they leave scissors behind in you, hahah. In truth, some are downright asinine. One told me never to run again, because I developed some tendonitis from running. This was years and years ago. They couldn't even figure out it was tendonitis. No, I was to stop running and never to run again. Heck, I must admit I got fed up with running anyway years ago and I think I just did it because I thought it was healthy. After all, I saw all these fit people running, I mean people I thought were fit and healthy. I have totally changed my view on things. Now I see those runners for the emaciated weaklings they are. Most are banged up and have bad posture and bad technique. Well, okay, horrible technique. A physio told me years ago to strengthen my body by doing strength training. He advised leg press and leg extensions, but also planks. I did so, for a while. It actually did help me somewhat, but was boring. Then I found weight training with barbells. Holy mother of Jesus. I'm of the opinion strength training and lessons about posture should be given in schools worldwide. They would be helluva more useful than the propaganda about history and economics, if they teach the full squat of course and other goodies.
I had been to the doctors for pain many times, and they never diagnosed my LLD. They're always happy to prescribe an anti-depressant if you seem down about it though -_- The problem is that they get paid just for 'seeing' you. The very business model they operate under is dishonest. They're not competent because their business model doesn't require them to be. In 2018, even the weather man gets it right most of the time, but not doctors. Only a handful are worth even half of what they make.
It blew my mind when Obama mandated that we pay into that scam of an industry. I'm proud to say I suffered boycotting it, keeping my income under 10,000$, never giving the insurance companies a dime, nor paying a fine. What a violation of property rights, to tell people how to spend their own money.
the way he talks about back surgery, makes it look like doctors aren't aware of these statistics. as a medstudent i attended lots of clinics, not once did the doctor NOT mention the risks, not once did the doctor not say that statistics indicate that surgery for X has this much chance of working. i want to see mr.rippletits in a clinic, and then see how many patients will get out convinced of tdoing starting strength as a solution for their pain. EDIT: we were also told how poor the relationship between imaging and symptoms is, he acts as if he made a breakthrough with that thought. and i live in Jordan, nowhere fancy.
Bashing physicians is a great way to get them to listen to you! You truly are a genius Rip! Wow! And what a great leader of a movement, lead with verbal abuse! No wonder you didn't go to medical school, you are way too smart!
If you think physicians are offended by people not being polite then there is no hope for you. They treat one another like garbage and everyone else worse. They aren’t going to be insulted by someone questioning them.
Let me guess, more doctor bashing. Yet, SS routinely seeks and utilizes medical doctors for both marketing, reputation, and knowledge purposes. I guess doctors do know a damn thing about training and nutrition! ;)
I don't know if it's meme-based medicine, a need to always have an answer when a patient asks, or ego that says they MUST know regardless of actual knowledge that causes this. The medical profession overall is wonderful at dealing with trauma and medication-based solutions, and god-fucking-awful at dealing with chronic conditions - including aging - that aren't readily routed around with a pill or injection. There are a phenomenal number of doctors who have little knowledge of either weight training or nutrition and yet authoritatively opine to their patients complete nonsense on both topics rather than using that magical phrase "I don't know."
Microbiologist/Immunologist. I routinely outpace my doctor's knowledge on these topics on both the foundation aspects of the fields as well as the latest research. Shes not a bad doctor, but shes a generalist. What we need to stop doing as a culture is putting MDs/DOs on some sort of unassailable pedestal and they in turn, need to stop giving advice when its outside their field of specialty or at least say "I'm not sure, let me get back to you".
Jelanen But you know more, right? Nutrition isn't your field either. Smarter people than occupational medicine go into optometry. Smarter people than optometrists go into podiatry. Smarter people than podiatrists go into dentistry, smarter people than dentists go into medicine. On average. Anyone with a biology degree can become a microbiologist. In my school, biology was one of the easiest majors. They couldn't pass a chemistry, physics, or math class to save their life. Less than 10% of pre-meds make it to medical school, even though they try really hard. The majority of pre-meds? Biology majors! These facts are speaking in general. The exceptions only prove the rule. A smarter person with a higher IQ is more likely to assimilate knowledge outside of their field. Nutrition is different from immunology, just as its different from pediatrics.
Jelanen Biologists such as yourself are about as common as degenerative changes! lol. Less than 1/5 (1/10 in some school) of biology pre-meds, had what it takes to make it to medical school. There are a lot of bitter optometrists, physical therapists, and biologists making $50K a year running around. Have some humility. On average, the average pre-med bio major who barely had a 3.0 GPA who couldn't make the cut, probably cannot critically read an academic journal to draw any credible conclusions about nutrition.
I'm an orthopaedic surgeon. If I don't know something I either learn it (as I have with lifting weights and strength training) or tell the patient "I don't know, that is not an area in which I have expertise or interest" (such as when I get asked about cardio, yoga, pilates, etc). I am saddened by the fact that there is enough of the contrary happening to necessitate such a post.
Hi folks, I'm a doctor for orthopedic surgery in germany and do weight lifting and I am in charge for a number of professional basketball teams here in germany. I do know a lot of both sides but have to agree that a lot of my fellows here in germany don't know anything about strength and weight lifting and nutrition with the exception of a rare number of orthopedic surgeons.
Dr. Helmut Queckenstedt hello doctor Queckenstedt.
I would argue that it's the job of orthopedic surgeons to know about the subject. But others are not.
Maybe family medicine as a branch, but radiologists, internals, gynecologists and pediatricians don't need to. It would be a good thing to know, but it's not a must
VERY hard to decipher the poor audio quality of this . Please provide microphones for speakers!!
Degenerative changes are not an indication for surgery. Spinal canal stenosis and nerve root compression, CAN be. Majority of patients with degenerative changes do not have the latter.
Audio mixing much better on this one. Though the questions are still difficult to hear.
Yeah, the simple solution is to for one of the panelists to repeat the question for the mic, but that's not always practical when the question is long.
So, some docs do offer advice that is not informed at all. And exercise and nutrition are one of those areas that nearly all docs are undereducated in. But's it not entirely our fault. Research in these areas has been woefully inadequate too, so there's less relative "evidence" for them to base their recommendations on as well. Docs should be comfortable saying I don't know - if they're not, they're doing their patients a true disservice, and it can be harmful, absolutely. I can understand the frustration that Rip has, and that we all have on this subject - it's totally justified. But don't oversimplify with counterarguments like "docs can only help with acute conditions, can't do anything with chronic illness, and the pharma/insurance complex make all decision making, etc." because that just plain ain't right. It's wrong. I'm just grateful that there's resources like this and a lot of the other awesome youtube content out there that provides great educational value on exercise, and the value that weight training provides. It's continuing to transform my life (as a patient too, I had a cervical fusion and stayed away from weight lifting for some time, and was only introduced to real functional exercises recently unfortunately!).
It's good to have a doctor around when you need stitching up or if you swallowed something nasty and you need to be cut open to remove it. Otherwise, they aren't much use. They can read those X rays. Might be useful to see where the scissors are, even though sometimes they leave scissors behind in you, hahah.
In truth, some are downright asinine. One told me never to run again, because I developed some tendonitis from running. This was years and years ago. They couldn't even figure out it was tendonitis. No, I was to stop running and never to run again. Heck, I must admit I got fed up with running anyway years ago and I think I just did it because I thought it was healthy. After all, I saw all these fit people running, I mean people I thought were fit and healthy. I have totally changed my view on things. Now I see those runners for the emaciated weaklings they are. Most are banged up and have bad posture and bad technique. Well, okay, horrible technique.
A physio told me years ago to strengthen my body by doing strength training. He advised leg press and leg extensions, but also planks. I did so, for a while. It actually did help me somewhat, but was boring. Then I found weight training with barbells. Holy mother of Jesus.
I'm of the opinion strength training and lessons about posture should be given in schools worldwide. They would be helluva more useful than the propaganda about history and economics, if they teach the full squat of course and other goodies.
last time i was this early i was squaatin whit my chin up!
Cool shoutout to JBP.😎 Reynolds is awesome.
I think now Reynolds cleans his room 5 times a day, 3 days per week. :))
Andrei Ionescu 3*5, nice.
What camera was used here?
I wonder if the Engineers from Prometheus liked the book Sapiens.
{Mandatory sycophantic in- joke comment}
a podcast with Jordan Peterson would make for a good drift out your lane topic.
I had been to the doctors for pain many times, and they never diagnosed my LLD. They're always happy to prescribe an anti-depressant if you seem down about it though -_-
The problem is that they get paid just for 'seeing' you. The very business model they operate under is dishonest. They're not competent because their business model doesn't require them to be. In 2018, even the weather man gets it right most of the time, but not doctors. Only a handful are worth even half of what they make.
It blew my mind when Obama mandated that we pay into that scam of an industry. I'm proud to say I suffered boycotting it, keeping my income under 10,000$, never giving the insurance companies a dime, nor paying a fine.
What a violation of property rights, to tell people how to spend their own money.
the way he talks about back surgery, makes it look like doctors aren't aware of these statistics.
as a medstudent i attended lots of clinics, not once did the doctor NOT mention the risks, not once did the doctor not say that statistics indicate that surgery for X has this much chance of working.
i want to see mr.rippletits in a clinic, and then see how many patients will get out convinced of tdoing starting strength as a solution for their pain.
EDIT: we were also told how poor the relationship between imaging and symptoms is, he acts as if he made a breakthrough with that thought.
and i live in Jordan, nowhere fancy.
J H thanks for confirming my observations
I remember being in a spinal surgery clinic in 1st yr of med school, not once was surgery suggested by the neurosurgeon.
Ahmed Umar thanks for confirming :)
cool story mate, u got any evidence?
+1
Bashing physicians is a great way to get them to listen to you! You truly are a genius Rip! Wow! And what a great leader of a movement, lead with verbal abuse! No wonder you didn't go to medical school, you are way too smart!
No argument to be found.
Any evidence based discipline should be able to handle criticism.
S M Any individual seeking to make meaningful change should know the difference between constructive criticism and whining
If you think physicians are offended by people not being polite then there is no hope for you. They treat one another like garbage and everyone else worse. They aren’t going to be insulted by someone questioning them.
>Rip Identifies a problem.
>Wow what an asshole for identifying a problem oh my GAWD LAWD JESUS.
That's you.
Let me guess, more doctor bashing. Yet, SS routinely seeks and utilizes medical doctors for both marketing, reputation, and knowledge purposes. I guess doctors do know a damn thing about training and nutrition! ;)
I don't know if it's meme-based medicine, a need to always have an answer when a patient asks, or ego that says they MUST know regardless of actual knowledge that causes this.
The medical profession overall is wonderful at dealing with trauma and medication-based solutions, and god-fucking-awful at dealing with chronic conditions - including aging - that aren't readily routed around with a pill or injection.
There are a phenomenal number of doctors who have little knowledge of either weight training or nutrition and yet authoritatively opine to their patients complete nonsense on both topics rather than using that magical phrase "I don't know."
Sully, Austin, Jordan, & John are the exception, not the rule
Microbiologist/Immunologist. I routinely outpace my doctor's knowledge on these topics on both the foundation aspects of the fields as well as the latest research. Shes not a bad doctor, but shes a generalist. What we need to stop doing as a culture is putting MDs/DOs on some sort of unassailable pedestal and they in turn, need to stop giving advice when its outside their field of specialty or at least say "I'm not sure, let me get back to you".
Jelanen But you know more, right? Nutrition isn't your field either. Smarter people than occupational medicine go into optometry. Smarter people than optometrists go into podiatry. Smarter people than podiatrists go into dentistry, smarter people than dentists go into medicine. On average. Anyone with a biology degree can become a microbiologist. In my school, biology was one of the easiest majors. They couldn't pass a chemistry, physics, or math class to save their life.
Less than 10% of pre-meds make it to medical school, even though they try really hard. The majority of pre-meds? Biology majors!
These facts are speaking in general. The exceptions only prove the rule. A smarter person with a higher IQ is more likely to assimilate knowledge outside of their field. Nutrition is different from immunology, just as its different from pediatrics.
Jelanen Biologists such as yourself are about as common as degenerative changes! lol. Less than 1/5 (1/10 in some school) of biology pre-meds, had what it takes to make it to medical school. There are a lot of bitter optometrists, physical therapists, and biologists making $50K a year running around. Have some humility. On average, the average pre-med bio major who barely had a 3.0 GPA who couldn't make the cut, probably cannot critically read an academic journal to draw any credible conclusions about nutrition.