I didn’t know about the Gibson “smell” until the last few years, about 15 years after I bought mine. Got it at a store, and had to buy a Gibson case, and I don’t recall it having a smell that wasn’t evaporating solvent/plasticizers. If it didn’t get the vanilla treatment it has definitely faded; case smells like exactly what it’s made of, plus dust, and a little bit of mildew from my basement
I’ll also note as a Gibson fan myself. All Gibson guitars are made by machine to the rough shape and then gone over again by hand for final sanding, painting etc. so not every guitar is exactly the same even if they’re the same year and model. Some necks feel slightly different and some finishes are darker/ lighter than others so my recommendation is if you’re on the hunt for a Gibson guitar my advice would be to see it in person if possible. I didn’t know my slash November les Paul was a dark brown around the edges instead of black like a tobacco burst, however some do come in black and others are so light they look almost like a regular sunburst
I always wanted a Gibson M-III. I played one back in the day at the old Pied Piper in the Kanawha Mall in Charleston and loved everything about it. It’s the superStrat the world slept on.
Early Norlin era into the 70s, even with serial numbers, can be tricky to date due to inconsistent serial number format So features and pot codes work better to figure out the date The serial numbers are also the same as earlier ones (pre Norlin)
I thought Heritage (mostly original Gibson employees) kept a lot of the original equipment when they bought the old Kalamazoo factory? Either way, Heritage makes them like they used to back in the day.
Gibson moved from Kalamazoo as a cost cutting procedure. They weren't manufacturing enough guitars to keep the plant busy. Heritage has never had close to the same market share as Gibson. They would have had no use for ALL the machines. Some were sold off. I imagine that Gibson took others. I've seen in Gibson Factory vids where the machines that laminate the ES guitars and some other pieces of equipment are the original ones from the 50s.
Thank you for the 7 Things that not only did I not know, but would never have taken the time to research. If not for you, I still wouldn't know. Thank you and great video, Robert. Please keep them coming.
I don’t think so, man. Times were tough for Gibson at the time they left Kalamazoo. They wouldn’t have just abandoned all of their expensive machinery and donated it their laid-off employees to start a new guitar company, especially since the new factory in Nashville was only equipped to produce one model of guitar at that time.
Great stuff, Robert! Regarding the Gibson case smell - sometime around I think 2016 I bought a used 2013 Gibson Les Paul 50s Tribute from Guitar Center, and it came with a Gibson hard case. When I got it home and opened the case, it did indeed have a very pleasant aroma. I don't know if the 2013 tribute series came with hard cases or if the original owner bought one separately, but it did have the wonderful aroma. Side note - I paid $499 for it, it has P90s, and it's one of my favorite guitars. Sounds killer.
Hi Robert, great video as always! However, from other accounts I have read about why a gold finish was specified for the tops of the early Les Pauls, it was because Les Paul himself wanted that, actually to make it appear "high class". I'm not discounting Ted McCarty's statement at all, just that there may have been multiple observations about the same topic.
@Craig Lovelace Close. You’re thinking of what is now known as their TV Yellow finish, and I think it was only on the cheaper Les Paul Specials and Juniors.
Well I feel like a dummy! My SG special is my first and currently only nitro guitar and that was the smell I thought I was smelling. Had a lot of different brands but tend to be a Gretsch and Martin guy. The SG has got me fiending for a couple more! Definitely P90 Gold top and really want a double cut junior, possibly a Beato but not sure how I feel about the 1/4” thinner body. Love myself a heavy guitar.
Do they make them like they used to? Thankfully not, when you consider the Norlin era crap :D HAHA But yes, like most manufacturers, Gibson's quality control of late is better than it has been for decades. I'm not sure about them using the same equipment as originally though? I mean, the Heritage guys bought that equipment in Kalamazoo in 1985.
A few people have mentioned that now, and I’m suddenly not able to verify one way or the other. My info came direct from a Gibson Product Specialist a few years back, but I guess now I’m not so sure. LOL
@@RobertWJackson Maybe you can get together with somebody from Heritage? That would be real interesting (to me anyway). Gibson recently settled their legal beef with Heritage, so folks should be more able to talk about things.
I have owned 30 guitars over the last 2.5 years. I went on a deep dive search for what fit for me. I keep coming back to Gibson, and the Custom Shop guitars are worth every single penny. At the moment, I've got what I think will be my final 5 guitar line up. 4 of the 5 are Gibson. 2 LPs, 1 SG, 1 Explorer, and 1 PRS McCarty 594 (core). I got rid of all the rest. I went on a similar rabbit hole with amps. I've settled on the Marshall JCM800 2203x, Marshall 1959 Hand wire (1968 Plexi Super Lead reissue), and I can do anything else I want with the Quad Cortex. I also kept a DSL100HR, very under-rated and under priced tube amp in my opinion.
Wouldn't have been hard for Fender to figure out what woods they were made of. All they needed to do was buy one and disassemble it. Worst-case scenario, cut it in half. If I remember correctly, they originally wanted an all maple body, but it was too heavy, so they kept the maple as a cap for a lighter, mahogany body.
Maple is generally cheaper than Mahogany. That would have been the real reason for making it all maple. They have to use separate tops/caps because of how the neck pocket is designed.
So ... Like. #6. They were thinking of making the Les Paul. Like Les Paul made "the Log" . Full size only with a 4×4 through it. So. If they made the whole damn thing solid mahogany?!??! Ouch.. my shoulder hurts just thinking of it.....
I own a couple of Gibsons all low hanging fruit like a Les Paul studio and a T series SG in that heritage cherry. Even with the guitars being made in America you are still paying the bulk of the premium on just the access to the name. But the way my brain works is if I can buy a bunch of Epiphones for the price of one Les Paul standard that’s exactly what I’m gonna do😊
I have a love-hate relationship with Gibson. It has nothng to do with the politics of the company or the whole lawyer guitar thing. It's simply that I've found their quality too inconsistent. Are they overpriced? Not if they can sell at those prices. That's the way the market works. But, yeah, I'd love to be able to buy some of their models a lot cheaper. I'd also like to buy a Ferrari for $40 bucks, but that's not reality. I think some of the Epiphone models are a great value. I love the double P90 LP Special and the single P90 LP Jr and may get one or the other. In fact, I think a lot of Epiphones I've tried are as good or better in quality than the American made Gibsons I've owned. One of my big issues with Gibson is their pickups. When they're great nobody can touch them. This is the company that pioneered the PAF and soap bar. When they suck it's a terrible disappointment. I had a great experience with the pups in my old Explorer (Except for the noise. I was going to get them potted.) The pups in my LP Studio were terrible. Not noisy but very weak and toneless. I went down a pickup rabbit hole and never found the right set with that ax and traded it to a friend for a Yamaha SBG 200 which worked better for me. Great stock pups too. I think Gibson winds up in a difficult spot because they are damned if they do and damned if they don't when it comes to innovation. If they fix something the purists come down hard on them. If they keep things "pure" then everybody else comes down on them.
Hi Robert. Love your channel. When it comes to Gibson guitars I do love them and the history behind them. That being said I have played a few of the recent offerings and some were very good and some had much left to be desired. The prices are getting nuts on some of these models. With a good amount of duds that leave the USA line at the prices they’re asking I can totally see why they’re turning off a lot of people. I say if you want to get a Gibson go for one on the used market because you’ll save a little bit of money that way. Be sure to try it before you buy if you can.
@@RobertWJackson Maybe I should have said you should always try multiple guitars before you decide on one. I guess if you want to buy and return hoping that the next one is the right one, that's fine. But it just doesn't seem to be a very effective way to select the right guitar for you.
For somebody who returns everything, it’s NOT the way to go. But for somebody like me who does their research and is capable of doing my own setup work and can work out most of the quirks of a new guitar, it’s very convenient.
Ricky, that would be interesting. I have an early Schecter PT Saturn made when they were in Dallas, probably built '87 or so, bought in '90. Kind of an early Super Tele with humbuckers and a trem. They weren't terribly expensive for the time but not cheap, and some thought they were just nice but overpriced shop-built kits, of which many came out very nice. I think I got one of those, it's Imperial White that has aged a little yellowish, with black binding, trim and hardware, if you remember those. Company has had a crazy history since. Really just a brand now of Shibuya's 'World Music' and first cousins to ESP/Ltd., which is not bad. Glad to have an old original Schecter, it still plays and looks great.
Gibson is somewhat unforgiving with their electric guitar history. Fender has the advantage of it spawned from the workshop of one man: Leo. Wanna know how that came about? Ask Leo. Gibson is a corporate entity going quite a long way back. Ted McCarthy comes up quite a lot, but he built nothing with his own hands. Much of what comes from Gibson is, and always has been, compartmentalized. It takes a team of trained professionals to find the teams of trained professionals who built the guitars at Gibson. Fender grew into that, but the design work was always on Leo's bench.
Completely different design goals. Leo was an engineer and built everything to be simple and effective first. Everything else was a secondary consideration. Gibson evolved from Banjos and mandolins to acoustic guitars to electrics. And Leo hasn't been with the company since ~1965 when CBS bought Fender. So whatever it used to be like with Leo, for better or worse, has zero to do with what it's like today.
Leo had a lot of input from employees and professional musicians (sometimes that was the same person)- not to take anything away from Leo. And Forrest White designed the second volume & tone idea on Jazzmasters
So all their machines are old as fuck, (I'm a machinist I know they wear down and become less accurate over time) and instead of passing the savings on to the customers, they charge a premium? Yeah, I'm liking em even less now.
If your machines are becoming less accurate over time maybe you, or your company, should maintain them better. And as far as charging a premium, the age of the machines has zero to do with that. It's all supply/demand and the market.
I think it’s safe to assume that they’re properly maintained. Sounds like your company’s might not be. Just like the products they build, factory machines need to be serviced and recalibrated from time to time.
But even Fender and Gibson aren't very similar in how they design and build guitars. Marketing is virtually the same. But that's to be expected with iconic brands.
I didn’t know about the Gibson “smell” until the last few years, about 15 years after I bought mine. Got it at a store, and had to buy a Gibson case, and I don’t recall it having a smell that wasn’t evaporating solvent/plasticizers. If it didn’t get the vanilla treatment it has definitely faded; case smells like exactly what it’s made of, plus dust, and a little bit of mildew from my basement
The vanilla scent is ,magical!!
I’ll also note as a Gibson fan myself. All Gibson guitars are made by machine to the rough shape and then gone over again by hand for final sanding, painting etc. so not every guitar is exactly the same even if they’re the same year and model. Some necks feel slightly different and some finishes are darker/ lighter than others so my recommendation is if you’re on the hunt for a Gibson guitar my advice would be to see it in person if possible. I didn’t know my slash November les Paul was a dark brown around the edges instead of black like a tobacco burst, however some do come in black and others are so light they look almost like a regular sunburst
I always wanted a Gibson M-III. I played one back in the day at the old Pied Piper in the Kanawha Mall in Charleston and loved everything about it. It’s the superStrat the world slept on.
Early Norlin era into the 70s, even with serial numbers, can be tricky to date due to inconsistent serial number format
So features and pot codes work better to figure out the date
The serial numbers are also the same as earlier ones (pre Norlin)
I thought Heritage (mostly original Gibson employees) kept a lot of the original equipment when they bought the old Kalamazoo factory? Either way, Heritage makes them like they used to back in the day.
Gibson moved from Kalamazoo as a cost cutting procedure. They weren't manufacturing enough guitars to keep the plant busy. Heritage has never had close to the same market share as Gibson. They would have had no use for ALL the machines. Some were sold off. I imagine that Gibson took others. I've seen in Gibson Factory vids where the machines that laminate the ES guitars and some other pieces of equipment are the original ones from the 50s.
Thanks Robert!!
i also was produced in 1952
great video Robert I hope all is well my friend
Thank you for the 7 Things that not only did I not know, but would never have taken the time to research. If not for you, I still wouldn't know. Thank you and great video, Robert. Please keep them coming.
Those machines were left behind in kalamazoo mich. Heritage guitars.
I don’t think so, man. Times were tough for Gibson at the time they left Kalamazoo. They wouldn’t have just abandoned all of their expensive machinery and donated it their laid-off employees to start a new guitar company, especially since the new factory in Nashville was only equipped to produce one model of guitar at that time.
Didn't learn a thing, cool T shirt! 👍🏻
Great stuff, Robert! Regarding the Gibson case smell - sometime around I think 2016 I bought a used 2013 Gibson Les Paul 50s Tribute from Guitar Center, and it came with a Gibson hard case. When I got it home and opened the case, it did indeed have a very pleasant aroma. I don't know if the 2013 tribute series came with hard cases or if the original owner bought one separately, but it did have the wonderful aroma. Side note - I paid $499 for it, it has P90s, and it's one of my favorite guitars. Sounds killer.
Cool, great info I learned some things.
Hi Robert, great video as always! However, from other accounts I have read about why a gold finish was specified for the tops of the early Les Pauls, it was because Les Paul himself wanted that, actually to make it appear "high class". I'm not discounting Ted McCarty's statement at all, just that there may have been multiple observations about the same topic.
I always heard that he thought it was the finish that would look best on TV, while the black finish was to look classy.
@Craig Lovelace Close. You’re thinking of what is now known as their TV Yellow finish, and I think it was only on the cheaper Les Paul Specials and Juniors.
Great video Robert it was quite interesting🎸🎸🎸
Thanks Robert, as always great info.
Good video, I found it interesting the smell of the case is vanilla. My 50's standard still has that aroma three years later.
Well I feel like a dummy! My SG special is my first and currently only nitro guitar and that was the smell I thought I was smelling. Had a lot of different brands but tend to be a Gretsch and Martin guy. The SG has got me fiending for a couple more! Definitely P90 Gold top and really want a double cut junior, possibly a Beato but not sure how I feel about the 1/4” thinner body. Love myself a heavy guitar.
Great video Robert, I hope a lot of people learned something they didn’t know, it’s always a pleasure watching your videos.
Do they make them like they used to? Thankfully not, when you consider the Norlin era crap :D HAHA But yes, like most manufacturers, Gibson's quality control of late is better than it has been for decades. I'm not sure about them using the same equipment as originally though? I mean, the Heritage guys bought that equipment in Kalamazoo in 1985.
A few people have mentioned that now, and I’m suddenly not able to verify one way or the other. My info came direct from a Gibson Product Specialist a few years back, but I guess now I’m not so sure. LOL
@@RobertWJackson Maybe you can get together with somebody from Heritage? That would be real interesting (to me anyway). Gibson recently settled their legal beef with Heritage, so folks should be more able to talk about things.
I have owned 30 guitars over the last 2.5 years. I went on a deep dive search for what fit for me. I keep coming back to Gibson, and the Custom Shop guitars are worth every single penny. At the moment, I've got what I think will be my final 5 guitar line up. 4 of the 5 are Gibson. 2 LPs, 1 SG, 1 Explorer, and 1 PRS McCarty 594 (core). I got rid of all the rest. I went on a similar rabbit hole with amps. I've settled on the Marshall JCM800 2203x, Marshall 1959 Hand wire (1968 Plexi Super Lead reissue), and I can do anything else I want with the Quad Cortex. I also kept a DSL100HR, very under-rated and under priced tube amp in my opinion.
@KetoSoldier...you my friend have impeccable taste! I'm a collector and my greatest pieces are Gibson CS...
Wouldn't have been hard for Fender to figure out what woods they were made of. All they needed to do was buy one and disassemble it. Worst-case scenario, cut it in half. If I remember correctly, they originally wanted an all maple body, but it was too heavy, so they kept the maple as a cap for a lighter, mahogany body.
Maple is generally cheaper than Mahogany. That would have been the real reason for making it all maple. They have to use separate tops/caps because of how the neck pocket is designed.
Yes, but that was not a very common practice back in the early-mid 1950’s.
So ... Like. #6. They were thinking of making the Les Paul. Like Les Paul made "the Log" . Full size only with a 4×4 through it. So. If they made the whole damn thing solid mahogany?!??! Ouch.. my shoulder hurts just thinking of it.....
#6 OMG a huge heavy les Paul. And people complain about the weight of today's Les Paul's lol
Today’s snowflakes would LOSE. THEIR. MINDS if Ted McCarty had decided to stick with Plan A. LOL
If they hadn't cut the body down, the guitars would almost be as heavy as the first Peavey guitars. 😅
Yep, ALMOST! 🤣🤣🤣
I own a couple of Gibsons all low hanging fruit like a Les Paul studio and a T series SG in that heritage cherry. Even with the guitars being made in America you are still paying the bulk of the premium on just the access to the name. But the way my brain works is if I can buy a bunch of Epiphones for the price of one
Les Paul standard that’s exactly what I’m gonna do😊
What American guitars are significantly cheaper?
The truth is Gibson is priced pretty competitively with other big American brands.
Quantity before quality! 🤣🤣🤣
I have a love-hate relationship with Gibson. It has nothng to do with the politics of the company or the whole lawyer guitar thing. It's simply that I've found their quality too inconsistent. Are they overpriced? Not if they can sell at those prices. That's the way the market works. But, yeah, I'd love to be able to buy some of their models a lot cheaper. I'd also like to buy a Ferrari for $40 bucks, but that's not reality. I think some of the Epiphone models are a great value. I love the double P90 LP Special and the single P90 LP Jr and may get one or the other. In fact, I think a lot of Epiphones I've tried are as good or better in quality than the American made Gibsons I've owned. One of my big issues with Gibson is their pickups. When they're great nobody can touch them. This is the company that pioneered the PAF and soap bar. When they suck it's a terrible disappointment. I had a great experience with the pups in my old Explorer (Except for the noise. I was going to get them potted.) The pups in my LP Studio were terrible. Not noisy but very weak and toneless. I went down a pickup rabbit hole and never found the right set with that ax and traded it to a friend for a Yamaha SBG 200 which worked better for me. Great stock pups too. I think Gibson winds up in a difficult spot because they are damned if they do and damned if they don't when it comes to innovation. If they fix something the purists come down hard on them. If they keep things "pure" then everybody else comes down on them.
Hi Robert. Love your channel. When it comes to Gibson guitars I do love them and the history behind them. That being said I have played a few of the recent offerings and some were very good and some had much left to be desired. The prices are getting nuts on some of these models. With a good amount of duds that leave the USA line at the prices they’re asking I can totally see why they’re turning off a lot of people. I say if you want to get a Gibson go for one on the used market because you’ll save a little bit of money that way. Be sure to try it before you buy if you can.
You should always try any guitar before you buy it. Especially if it's an expensive one.
Nah. It’s so easy to return a guitar these days. I’m not afraid to buy a guitar before I play it at all. Never have been.
@@RobertWJackson Maybe I should have said you should always try multiple guitars before you decide on one. I guess if you want to buy and return hoping that the next one is the right one, that's fine. But it just doesn't seem to be a very effective way to select the right guitar for you.
For somebody who returns everything, it’s NOT the way to go. But for somebody like me who does their research and is capable of doing my own setup work and can work out most of the quirks of a new guitar, it’s very convenient.
Robert you should do a video of How Schecter guitars got started I hope you will consider doing it.
Ricky, that would be interesting. I have an early Schecter PT Saturn made when they were in Dallas, probably built '87 or so, bought in '90. Kind of an early Super Tele with humbuckers and a trem. They weren't terribly expensive for the time but not cheap, and some thought they were just nice but overpriced shop-built kits, of which many came out very nice. I think I got one of those, it's Imperial White that has aged a little yellowish, with black binding, trim and hardware, if you remember those. Company has had a crazy history since. Really just a brand now of Shibuya's 'World Music' and first cousins to ESP/Ltd., which is not bad. Glad to have an old original Schecter, it still plays and looks great.
I might do that. Schecter is kind of interesting because they actually started out as a parts company back in the 80’s.
Gibson gets way too much hate from the trolls!The same people that bitch about the price don’t say a word about PRS or Strats .
What don't you make 10 on your amp louder? ...Because it goes to 14!🤣
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I don't like talking about guitars. I just like playing guitars.
Why aren’t you playing your guitar then, instead of a keyboard?
@@honkytonkinson9787 I can talk about guitars a lot. But playing guitars is what I rather do. I practice everyday.
Gibson is somewhat unforgiving with their electric guitar history. Fender has the advantage of it spawned from the workshop of one man: Leo. Wanna know how that came about? Ask Leo.
Gibson is a corporate entity going quite a long way back. Ted McCarthy comes up quite a lot, but he built nothing with his own hands. Much of what comes from Gibson is, and always has been, compartmentalized. It takes a team of trained professionals to find the teams of trained professionals who built the guitars at Gibson. Fender grew into that, but the design work was always on Leo's bench.
Completely different design goals. Leo was an engineer and built everything to be simple and effective first. Everything else was a secondary consideration. Gibson evolved from Banjos and mandolins to acoustic guitars to electrics.
And Leo hasn't been with the company since ~1965 when CBS bought Fender. So whatever it used to be like with Leo, for better or worse, has zero to do with what it's like today.
Leo had a lot of input from employees and professional musicians (sometimes that was the same person)- not to take anything away from Leo.
And Forrest White designed the second volume & tone idea on Jazzmasters
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So all their machines are old as fuck, (I'm a machinist I know they wear down and become less accurate over time) and instead of passing the savings on to the customers, they charge a premium? Yeah, I'm liking em even less now.
If your machines are becoming less accurate over time maybe you, or your company, should maintain them better. And as far as charging a premium, the age of the machines has zero to do with that. It's all supply/demand and the market.
I think it’s safe to assume that they’re properly maintained. Sounds like your company’s might not be. Just like the products they build, factory machines need to be serviced and recalibrated from time to time.
Gibson: a long, proud tradition of producing overpriced crap.
What American made guitars do you think are better value?
Intonation and keeping your gibsons in. Tune is almost impossible...... You forgot those two.
#butthurt
Gibson and Fender are both "just another guitar builder" in 2023. Building guitars is not rocket science,
But even Fender and Gibson aren't very similar in how they design and build guitars. Marketing is virtually the same. But that's to be expected with iconic brands.